Who is THE 5TH CHAOS GOD? | Warhammer 40K Lore

[@SandmanofTerra]

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[@JoshuaKevinPerry]

​@@illcomplywithguncontrolone6149Nope. Sounds made up, but keep going with that creativity. It sounds like you have a good story building.

[@SOLH-vq3lh]

Fantastic video brother, thank you! Solo - Sweden

[@miniwargaming]

Thank you for your fantastic production!

[@fightforaglobalfirstamendm5617]

I think the Emperor wasn't created by the shamans, like Cawl did with others, they bound their souls to the Emperor to be able to influence and steer him because as humans they couldn't. Creating what the Emperor is today, a multi souled being. The Shard is the original Emperor and what remains is the compilation of multiple souls including Malcador and all those who sacrificed, unwittingly causing madness to him because all of the souls and their personalities are fracturing him and drove him insane. Malcador obviously knew that's what could happen but he only did it once and likely hoped that he would only need to do it once to revive him, he didn't anticipate they continue too do it if it failed.

[@happyrogue5790]

If the emperor had to rid himself of compassion love and loyalty to fight horus does this not imply he does have love for his sons and did not view his sons as tools or at the very least did not view all of them as tools?

[@SandmanofTerra]

Malcador talks about this, he is very convinced that the Emperor originally planned for them to be tools, but grew to love them

[@temmy9]

I hold to the lore that the Emperor is a composite entity, and at times the various personalities come to the fore. Some of those personalities saw them as tools, some loved them as sons. @@SandmanofTerra

[@davoid1792]

@@SandmanofTerraafter all, the emperor is only human

[@Scottoest]

Malcador on the Throne in the book actually says that Big E 100% viewed the primarchs as tools and sacrificial pawns, originally. They were intended to basically be beasts of burden for his great work - part of his own power he could project outward to build the Imperium and sacrifice for him if need be. However, Malcador is also pretty convinced that Big E came to see them as more than that over time, though he never confirms this was DEFINITIVELY the case.

[@happyrogue5790]

​@@Scottoest but with him casting off these emotions to fight horus would it not imply that he does view them as son then?

[@TheRemembrancer]

“I was never a Son of Horus. I was and remain a Luna Wolf” Thank you for allowing me to voice Loken Brother!

[@SandmanofTerra]

Thank you mate!

[@Matt-md5yt]

yo, glad you did a thing with the Sandman

[@Dr.Gainzzz]

Seriously, The Luna Wolves are easily my favorite 30k chapter in the setting. That color scheme, banner, and badge. Complete S Tier.

[@NickC84]

Really though, as bad as 30k and 40k are... The one dude who really got screwed over was Loken. Dude lost EVERYTHING and I mean EVERYTHING. All his brothers, His Primarch, His friends. Legions turning on Legions, His own legion turning traitor to the Emperor. He saw it all play out first hand. His entire world got flipped on him. I haven't read the Siege of Terra books but I do remember reading somewhere that after he's pulled out of the rubble after however many years he's kind of "not all there" in a way. I mean hell, That makes perfect sense. Think of everything the dudes seen?

[@JKS_Crafting]

​@@NickC84 the last and final book of the siege of Terra will be an interesting read. Have you read it already? If not I recommend it

[@LegoM12]

Man when malcador said “yeah that bit of soul that the emperor amputated from himself is gonna grow on its own in the warp, kinda like a …. STAR CHILD” I was like dayumm

[@maltheri9833]

The Emperor is clearly a god that wants to be a man. Who tf cuts off a part of theeir emotions and creates a being of pure light and goodness by accident

[@LegoM12]

@@maltheri9833 Truuu maybe that’s why he said “not yet” to cypher, maybe he plans to be reunited with that part of himself.

[@AveSicarius]

​@@maltheri9833 I'm pretty sure the intended narrative is that the Emperor was originally a man who didn't want to be seen as a god. I mean, we've seen what Shard's can become, the Emperor's was just infused with much more energy and contained all His positive emotions like Hope and Love, because He intentionally excised it meanwhile most Shard's fractured through extreme trauma. The Emperor wasn't that powerful before His "Death", and even after it, He could hardly be called a God, more like a conduit for the Psychic Energies of Mankind, a god-like being surely, but no more a God than the Chaos Pantheon.

[@kevinduggan201]

I think we can unpick what is going on with the emperor if we look at what has happened with him in the 40k timeline. We know he is becoming more active and was strong enough to burn nurlges garden. It's also suggested the is or is still becoming a god. With that in mind I think severing himself from his emotions helps him to achieve apotheosis whithout falling victim to the dark king prophesy. Basically since the warp and the gods are manifestations of raw emotion, by severing that connection within himself he is no longer subject to the co conditions of the chaos gods, that being strength through mortal emotions. I think he is becoming a god of either logic and order, or just one of raw psychic might, perhaps the feeding of psychers into the astronomicon is not fuling it at all but rather feeding the emperor's power and apotheosis, in the same way the gods feed off Raw emotion he is feeding off the psychic potential, or like he did in his own birth, he is merging all psychers with himself and making an engorged Uber emperor, he could actually become humanity in the distant future when we become a fully psychic race. Kind of like the nids with the emperor being diffused through all of them or we all merge with him and we become the emperor incarnate as a race......very deep I know

[@FragbiteOeXistenz]

​@@LegoM12That could be since he grows in warp power as we speak.

[@Ghastly_Grinner]

The Emperor is definitely going end up being to be a full fledged warp god but NOT a Chaos god Chaos is a flavor of warp entity. Its like how the Eldar gods aren't Chaos gods nor are Gork and Mork. On top of all that the emperor being too stubborn to accept his divinity and costing Man to lose 10k years of our existence to his stubbornness is about the most 40k thing GW will have done in quite some time

[@maltheri9833]

Im glad now its debunked that he wants to be a god. Him stopping Cipher in the 42nd millenium and rescinding in the 30th shows that being a warp entity is something he absolutely refuses to do. He doesnt wsnt to destroy humanity in exchange for power or ascension. Hed rather suffer the same pain as Malcador and worse for 12k years and more

[@Troupe_Master]

COPE

[@AveSicarius]

How did the Emperor cost them anything by denying Divinity? He was never a God, not then, not now, and while He could have become something like one, it literally would have destroyed Mankind to do so. Before Molech He wasn't even that powerful, more relative to beings like Eldrad, after it He still wasn't anything compared to the Chaos "God's", as has been shown, but should also have been expected (if He was a godlike entity before that He would have just directly opposed the Chaos Gods like He has done in recent lore by burning Nurgle's Garden). The thing is that there are no God's in 40K, there are entities with god-like power, but ALL of them were in some way created by the Mortal Races through their own actions, not the other way around. If the Emperor had accepted what He eventually discarded, the entirety of Mankind would have suffered to birth yet another hyperdimensional parasite that simply existed to mimic and consume sentience at a fundamental level. The Emperor would have the benefit of perhaps still being sentient due to His origin as a biological being instead of a purely metaphysical one, but He might also very well have ended up a slave to His own being like the Chaos God's are (they are fundamentally incapable of putting their own interests aside momentarily to achieve more, they are defined by the fact that they mimic sentient beings and feed off of their emotions, and want to feed even if it kills them). The Emperor knew better than anyone that He was no God, and denying that had nothing to do with His downfall, and that of the Imperium. That was actually all about His inability to show some basic humanity towards His Son's despite loving them. That itself was a product of the power He held and the conditions He instituted upon Himself. Accepting being the figurehead of a Galaxy spanning religion wouldn't make that better lol. I also don't think He's going to be a God in the end, that's not the plan everyone is striving for, if anything He might simply have accumulated enough power to somehow enact a plan to either sever Himself and the Entities of Chaos from the Materium, or to somehow destroy them all and return the Warp to a less tumultuous state.

[@AveSicarius]

Also the Eldar God's and Gork and Mork were basically Warp Based Weapon's Platforms built by the Old One's, they just got called "God's" by the Aeldari and Krok/Orkz. They aren't anymore a God than the C'Tan.

[@RichardStrong86]

@@Troupe_Master Chaos is a subset of the warp, which itself is an infinite dimension that encompasses the entire universe and all other realities. It's just a really shitty neighbourhood that loves harassing the milkyway galaxy.

[@RJM1319]

Big E getting caught in a catch 22. Lose to Horus and humanity falls, or take the power himself and humanity falls.

[@robertwilkins3167]

Guilliman's encounter with the Emperor after his return leaves him apparently doubting just who and what his father is. If a Primarch doesn't know what the Emperor has become then that's a cause for concern.

[@lightborn9071]

He was pretty... split at that moment. He reappears later with much more of his sanity.

[@JohnDoe-rp7mf]

I think what I appreciate the most is how assertive you sound when speaking about the lore. It’s not so much casual discussion as other lore channels. You sound like a passionate scholar who could never be wrong.

[@SandmanofTerra]

I honestly lost my shit with this book. It is so much fun

[@dronel1637]

@@SandmanofTerra THEN TELL THE TITRLE FFS

[@troyglossop1113]

i think he is talking about The End and the Death: Volume II by Dan Abnett@@dronel1637

[@TheWizrD_Ali]

Ollanius might return in 40k with what has occurred, maybe with some time dilation or not. But I believe him and the others being back in top condition might herald their involvement in the plan, not just the tread

[@SandmanofTerra]

That would be awesome, the Emperor does say that he has a place for Oll in his new Imperium

[@Lost7one]

Would be so cool!

[@vampurhntrd]

Ollanius has lived up to his sainthood beyond what I imagined with his actions. I would love if he somehow was able to continue his story. Given the way 40k works he is too good to live…

[@tuff9486]

Ollanius bringing back the Catheric faith

[@kony12356]

@@tuff9486 ollanius when coming to the imperium with a catheric army: who is ready for the 10th crusade the take back the holy land... I mean fight the devil... eh i mean chaos and tyranids. inquisition: heritic ? the lion and guiliman : oh why the hell not can't be worse than the imperium in his current state

[@danpsyker6122]

I didn't hear Sanguinius say his final Black rage words either. (The "Why Horus, why have you done this!!" etc etc that Blood Angels say when they've been overwhelmed by the black rage) So I wonder if it is in fact the Emperor that shouts those final words in a psychic scream. Causing the blood angels to have the Black rage curse/flaw. Or will Sanguinius rise up from the dead/near death in a black rage himself, screaming those words to help defeat Horus in the final battle.

[@endymionmikel4022]

Vampires often dont undergo their tranformations untill they both ingest human blood and die their first death

[@Lost7one]

yeah I think he will rise again when Emp and Horus make battle

[@DillsyYourDaddy67]

See I always loved the theory that Horus was just a pawn and the real place of chaos was to turn Sanguinius. Horus was the favoured son, but Horus himself even admitted that Sanguinius was literally perfect and carried all aspects of the emperor to the point you would believe he was his natural born son. I thought it would have been an awesome twist if Sanguinius in his attempt to kill Horus, succumbed to the red thirst and in killing him he felt to chaos

[@kinguchiha6212]

I’ve only just recently got into 40k like a year and half ago and my goodness I wish I had always known about it cuz I can’t consume enough 40k lore, if I knew ppl who played the table top I’d definitely get into that too!!

[@oliverwolf7262]

Same here

[@redluke8119]

Same but like 8 years ago for me and Ive been hooked ever since I got into it just before the lore started moving forward in 8th edition before 8th came out

[@reinmarren9959]

Since Rylanor's last stand I have wanted to see the Thousand Sons assist the Imperium in some way. If The Dark King is fated then now would be a great time for Tzeentch to throw Magnus and his legion against him to help change the fate of the Imperium. GW still has their setting, and we get new lore!

[@disgruntledtoons]

In my headcannon the fifth Chaos God is already there. It's the accumulated fear experienced by all living creatures. Its latent power is far greater than all of the known Ruinous Powers put together, but because it's literally afraid of everything it keeps to itself in the deepest part of the Warp and spawns no daemons of its own. However, it is too afraid of the other Ruinous Power to even fight back when they steal power from it, and thus each of them is in a large way an aspect of this fifth god, in that each is in some way a response to fear: Khorne represents rage against the danger, Tzeentch represents the urge to control, Slaanesh is the wish to forget via pleasure, and Nurgle sorrow.

[@Jirodyne]

There is probably a 6th and 7th as well. Korne is Wrath, rage incarnate. Slaanesh is Lust, addiction to whatever gives them the most pleasure. Tzeetch is Greed, wanting everything, be it knowledge, experience, or change. He is a very greedy god, trying to control Fate and all connected to it. Nurgle is Sloth, slow, unmoving, uninterested in anything, lazy, slacking, with little effort put into anything. Fear God would be Envy, so afraid of everything, that it envy's everyone and their power to not be afraid, but is too afraid to act and not be afraid, so it envies them all. There would still need to be a Gluttony and Pride. The Emperor would certainly fit for Pride. Pride in himself, in his race, in his powers, and in his beliefs. He is so very full of pride, and pretty much is the most prideful character to exist in 40k, the leader of mankind, making his sons after himself, making himself the leader, giving himself all the power, and so on. Even after 'Death', he is so prideful, that he only grants powers to those who worship him more deeply than anyone else does. The only thing left is Gluttony. And there are no beings that represent that, right? .... Right? WRONG! I propose, the Hive Mind, the Tyranids, their ruler/leader, who has a MASSIVE presence in the Warp is the 7th God, God of Gluttony, the Great Devourer, he who wants to consume and eat all. Be that mortal or god, corruption or not, material or warp. He hungers, and everything else is food for is insatiable hunger.

[@ohamatchhams]

I really wonder if Ynnead's full resurrection can happens by churning to drench the rituals of awakening through overwhelming raw powers of The Warp at the cost of altering Ynnead's consciousness and habits, I think 40K's Warp and the proporsal of Deep Warp can crushes the status quo of both "Great Game" and the eventual release of C'tan and Materium/Realspace's powers, even to bring the powerplay against Tyranids Hivemind, although the limitations of Tabletop settings have prevent the powerscaling to get beyond the ties of Warhammer 40K's balances Also if Vashtorr and even the sleeping Void Dragon can bridged into the completion of Dark King's presence, it could really warp the entire Sol System and alter how Astronomicon goes, with either enhancing Imperium Cult's powers at the cost of The Warp are sending Imperium citizens into frenzy and force-ascending it's citizens to become Warp entities aligned to Imperial Creed (at least depending on each planets' collective beliefs to formed its own anti-Chaos Egregores), or to shut down Terra's astronomicon and just bringing the good ol' resets which starves Chaos but destabilises Imperium to breakdown into pocket of much smaller interstellar empires of different human factions There's a looot of precedence of complications yet also interesting world-shaking scenarios if The Dark King's prophecy can be tied to the existing actors that currently winning their goals by sacrificing different world systems in current 40K lore, but I don't know if the the writers would do such degrees of world-shaking scales on both political to existential level (and I'm talking about In-settings' Imperium politics and inter-sector/segmentum relations, not real life politics at all of course lol) The Metaphysics of Warhammer 40K can even go further if they read the Cosmology of Buddhist Samsara, Judaism's Kabbalah and other systems altogether, ironically the only franchises outside of not just 40K and Western medias, but even in Eastern medias to go that far is games produced by Mihoyo (no I'm not kidding), although it would take coordination and management of writers into competent 10 years-long planning, it would be interesting if the White Scars will formed it's own demigod with dominion over White-Scars-run sectors to have somekind of Chinese Religions' Pantheons of Confucian-Taoist-Buddhist inspirations which might have relations to T'au's own auxiliary deity to combat Chaos and Tyranids' influences), or The Tallarn, Vostroyan, Maccabian Jannisaries, Krieg's corp and other Imperial planets, systems and segmentums have Imperial Cult-based warp entities subservient to Emperor's own central direction to form it's own Anti-Chaos counter of Imperial Daemons too with some caveats of grimdark akin to mass-brainwashing, similar amount of sacrifical souls to every summons or laid somekind of Warp-alteration to the terrains of realspace/Materium's planets which makes logistics of Imperium problematic and dangerous unless if they have Psykers' specialised to help them, it could fulfil the prophecies of Imperium's humans ascending to become psychic race all while leading to the actual "End Times", at the tangible physical and mental costs of both external factions and internal's structures of Imperium's foundations

[@jonharrison9222]

Less is more.

[@amanofnoreputation2164]

Erebus must have made a truely egregious comma splice to provoke John Grammaticus to stab him in the ear.

[@eichler721]

Best book in the Heresy and Seige series so far. Amazing job Dan Abnett and the story just kept me going to finish it in 2 days.

[@michasalamon8315]

Honestly, I am more hyped for Abaddon vs Valdor in the next story. Constantine missed that fight, so something had to happen to make Valdor. Dark King will return, its confirmed now, the only question is who it is gonna be this time. Either Emperor again, or Abaddon the Warmaster. Eitherway. We have Justaerian Terminators led by Abaddon vs 34 Custodian companions led by Valdor. Shit is gonna go down.

[@danpsyker6122]

Abaddon should have his shit kicked in if it was just an even fight, him vs Valdor. Valdors and his custodians are gonna have to be properly nerfed for Abaddon to stand a chance.

[@michasalamon8315]

@@danpsyker6122 dunno. They are on Vengful spirit that is almost inside the warp now. Valdor started with an entire company of custodians, what could be anything from 50 to 100 custodians and is now down to 34 companions. Abaddon Just got back aboard with all terminators sons of Horus and word Bearers he could pull and there is endless stream of demons attacking Valdor and few hundred Space marines who went insane after seeing Horus divine form. I will be square with you. Valdor will survive this, we know because he met Russ at Terra shortly after the siege ended. Every other custodian. I dont think so.

[@colonelsanders1349]

Valdor by every margin should beat Abaddon. I can see his 34 Custodians going down in a blaze of glory against the hundreds upon hundreds of Chaos Marines that are attacking them.

[@willwright1643]

Remember in First Heretic…the Custodes were supposedly able to cut through Astartes like butter like they were genetically programmed how to exterminate them. Which makes sense if you remember Mt Ararat.

[@Alaztor878]

Maybe the "Terminus Decree" is meant for the return of the Prophecy.

[@sabalmal1288]

Isnt the Emperor also described as a dark king in the Lion son of the forest, right before Lion gets the shield he sees the figure that is to be the emperor? Thanks for the video loved the clarification of what happened, I just finished reading it but your explanation filled out the whole picture. Cheers!

[@RichardStrong86]

A frail king on a lake surrounded by circling predatory creatures. The idea of predators circling him in the warp is similiar to how Lhaerial described it in Beast Arises: Throneworld. "The Great Powers circled this place like razorshark waiting out the death throes of a void-whale."

[@darksider2903]

Thank god that happened, I'm so glad. I was tired of the way people and stories made sanguinius OP than the rest of the primarchs. Finally all that weird fan made stuffs that sangy defeated horus has ended. Horus was literally like a god with 4 primordial chaos gods fuelling him power, he was that powerful as he supposed to be to fight against the emperor 😅

[@kinguchiha6212]

Especially since Sangy found demon Angron hell even before Angron he was dive bombing traitor forces left right and center. As much as I fw Sangy he can’t step to a Horus hyper juiced on the Chaos Koolaid

[@bluskyy84]

Horus still had to use his super chaos juice to beat Sangy even after he'd been fighting for weeks straight. Thats enough for me.

[@lewishorsman2219]

@@bluskyy84 exactly brother. One on one, no hax? Sanguinius fucks everyone up. He fights greater daemons by the dozen. Rips apart daemon Prince Angron & holds the eternity gate by himself. Guy is literally the greatest primarch ever.

[@MrFredstt]

Sangy still showed he was the best of the primarchs. After weeks of fighting nonstop and killing Angron and hundreds of Daemons he still whoops Horus' ass when he powers down to fight at his normal level. It's only when he's about to be killed that he uses his chaos hacks

[@Emperors_Deathangel]

The evershining glory of Sanguinius will always be with us.

[@sparking023]

Hmm, so the Emperor severing a part of his soul explains both the Scar Child and the fact Guilleman barely recognized him when he went to see Big E on Terra. There was literally a part of him missing, and considering he now has godlike powers, probably amped by all the worship and psyker diet, it seems Emps is one technicality or a key event from becoming a full warp entity for Humanity

[@bapponohacko502]

So, what you're saying that bit in TTS where tzeentch talks with Nurgle about how the emperor pokes some his eyes and how it was part of his plan to make the emperor of mankind ascend as the new chaos god was actually true?

[@harhar9867]

Malal is the only 5th chaos God I acknowledge

[@InhalingWeasel]

You talk some serious heresy for someone in bolter range.

[@VendreadMike95]

​@@InhalingWeasel👍🏽

[@MD-nv7jx]

Omg, I've been waiting for this bro!. Thanks and keep up thr legendary work!!.

[@kaiser97]

your voice and choice of topics are very fast making you my favorite 40k lore channel.

[@makisroditis7206]

now imagine big e becoming a god without sacrificing half humanity and be like like to other chaos gods " i am simply build better "

[@Adi-ft1ww]

I stumbled upon your channel, and I'm glad I did. You earned a sub from this video alone. I love the editing and voiceover! It fits the grimdark aesthetic nicely! Please keep doing what you’re doing; I hope to see more of your content!

[@SandmanofTerra]

Awesome, thank you!

[@jojothehamster]

Kinda feels like the star child is the Ynnead to the dark king.

[@xSuperiorManx]

Did not expect Miniwargaming to advertise on YT, nice. :)

[@endymionmikel4022]

No wonder Constantines city is called the city on the edge of pandemonium if it sits in the inevitable city in the oblivion scar made by the emperors temporary divinity

[@NeutralGuyDoubleZero]

To me, this basically confirms Emporers death and ascension into a warp deity in the near future for 40ks narrative

[@almor2445]

I think it's most accurate to describe The Emperor as the God of Tyrannical Order. He's the opposite of Chaos but is (in many ways) just as bad.

[@crapparc]

In Magic the Gathering there are several characters who are technically lawful good, but tyrannical in their approach so they are still evil. I suppose The Emperor might fit that same bill.

[@abdullahalghamdi664]

Lol 😂 I can hear someone in the background yelling Griffith! 💀

[@afrojunior5281]

Holy shit, I've come across the 'my name is byf' of the warhammer world

[@jakenicol4012]

Will Abbadon have a go at ascending to the dark king? His new rules are a bit OP.

[@o.w.n.1327]

they really did pull a ancient gods part 2 on us with the end and the death volume 2. With all of us thinking Dark King was gonna be Horus not the Emperor.

[@maanavallampallam4864]

Great video. I’m completely new to your channel and goddamn do u have a great narration voice

[@SandmanofTerra]

Thanks so much man! Glad you enjoyed it

[@rayvnstevens]

Your voice and cadence, energy, etc make for an interesting listen.

[@BipolarExprezz]

Dumping more dirt on Malal's grave I see lmao

[@felwinterslie5902]

I was scared to death you'd say Slaanesh would approve of your sponsor and say "Thank you Adam and Eve for the sponsor"

[@UnholyWrath3277]

My personal view of the emperor is that he was humanities innate fear of the dark or metaphorically the unknown. Hence the constant shining golden light. Hes all of humanities belief that a god out there will come to save them from what they fear making him of course the anathema of chaos and their desire to corrupt him and allow him to slaanesh 2.0 or if that failed (which it did) either destroy him or better yet keep him imprisoned on the throne. Much like slaanesh was born from all the eldars negative emotions building over time the emperor was created from a mix of humanity as a wholes fear and desire/belief they would be protected/saved. The shaman ritual simply combined the warp entity that represented that to a human form that could contain its strength due to the sacrifice. Thats my headcanon at least.

[@paulleader4]

I binged the book on the day it came out lol so much to ask and talk about!!

[@SandmanofTerra]

Me too man! It was a biggun. lots to discuss in the coming weeks

[@paulleader4]

@@SandmanofTerra so much to unpack its crazy, abadons confused "what" when erebus was talking about the emperor/star had me giggling

[@dronel1637]

WHICH BOOK PLKEASE ANSWER IM LOSING MY MIND

[@paulleader4]

@@dronel1637 the end and the death 1 and 2, second came out on 5th November

[@blacklighthologram5339]

Ngl when I first got into WarHammer40k I had this idea that the Emperor was in fact the Outsider reborn: and it’s moments like this that make me think I was into something.

[@andrew3203]

The Outsider C'tan is fine and dandy in his Dyson sphere that the Tyranids avoid like an irradiated lump of boiling plutonium.

[@chickenmonger123]

Yeah. It’s compelling. I knew it was a supported interpretation that the Emperor was edging on Chaos Apotheosis. Maybe now more than ever. His flesh is almost gone.

[@TheShortYautja]

Maybe Horus was supposed to be the dark king the chaos gods knew if it wasn’t Horus it was the emperor and for the first time tzeench fucked up

[@jasoncrowell8863]

Anything that involves Erebus getting stabbed is a good book, because...fuck Erebus.

[@mrfawkes9110]

I've never been of the impression that the Emperor was anything other than the Chaos God of humanity.

[@darrianweathington1923]

man I miss Loken

[@GummeeHater01]

He gave up his compassion? That's like me giving up all my mansions. Hes such a chad he actually got away with paying nothing

[@Lightblessins]

so the chaos gods did what they did in order to have the big e in the warp as a new play mate for their great game? how cute.

[@INSANE40K]

So the Emperor is doing the "Griffith" ? 😂

[@TyLord3]

pretty clean connection to the inevitable city and the king in yellows city of dust huh?

[@ronanHanni]

All Primarchs will return and have to work together at least the loyalist ones, maybe some traitor to. To stop the dark King and fragment him across the galaxy through space and time this also could lead to a shard of the dark king/emperor to return to his birth moment.

[@MrSamurai137]

Love is complicated, so is royalty. Is it not more important that the emperor has and may still be tainted by chaos!

[@ClubQRoundDeux]

I've bought the audio book already. Is it worth listening to after this video or should I come back after?

[@SandmanofTerra]

Its a long book, plent of more things covered in the story!

[@GetgreeD]

If you count in Mala(e)l, than we have 6 Gods! Mork & Gork excluded for Reasons...

[@WilliamDeemer]

Thanks!

[@SandmanofTerra]

Legend!

[@WilliamDeemer]

@@SandmanofTerra I feel the same way about you my friend. You do a great amount of work and I appreciate you. Thank you so much.

[@fredthemithrilogre]

So instead of the return of the Emperor like a shining sun, we'll get the Dark King with the power of a black hole?

[@Gyrannon]

You say the Chaos Gods want this. Based on EVERYTHING we've seen, read, and heard about involving the Big 4 Chaos Gods, they WOULDN'T want this. They war with each other FFS more often than they do with the Imperium. As soon as the Horus Heresy ended, they immediately dissolved their alliance and went straight back to fighting each other. And given the level of arrogance with the Emperor, I really don't see him listening to anyone, MAYBE Malcador, but certainly not a soldier. And lets be real here, the "truth" is that people suspect but have no proof, which seriously is nothing new. At the very least, this feels like more Word Bearers' Propaganda, not "truth".

[@Subject_Keter]

I think it would be interesting given how warped touch Terra becomes, it turns the whole narrative into a mental war between the Emperor forces and the Traitors. Their malice warps people and events to be parodies of themselves. Lik3 a scene in a movie where a guy is running away from a monster but the monster changes the script so the guy runs into the monster.

[@maltheri9833]

Theyd win by corruptinf him which is also the ultimate victory for Chaos. Even if he kills Horus hed be destroying humanity with his birth. Thatd leave humanity broken and doomed and thats the ultimate lsst laugh against the bane of their existence. Its why they mourned when he gave up godhood but then said "Well guess he'll die and we'll get hell on earth instead. Fair trade"

[@Gyrannon]

@@maltheri9833 corruption in the context of chaos is to their benefit; serving them. How does him becoming a god, on equal footing as them, benefit them? Its like saying that making the Joker just as resourceful and intelligent as Batman would be benefit to Batman.

[@brorjace08]

​@@GyrannonBecause him becoming a God means humanity dies, and the warp consumes all the material universe, dont you get it?

[@Gyrannon]

@@brorjace08 And they lose a huge chunk of power in the process, exactly what the Cabal tried to do to defeat Chaos. Humanity is not the universe. Humanity is easy to manipulate and use as batteries.

[@tommyshowgun]

I'm confused on how the emperor teleports to Horus's ship, then ends up in the City of Inevitable to become the dark king iirc? Similar to how Rogal Dorn got teleported to a desert?

[@SandmanofTerra]

Well the solar system is sinking into the warp because of so much corruption and the inevitable city bridges the warp and reality. In truth, it's all magic and warp stuff

[@tommyshowgun]

@@SandmanofTerra makes perfect sense 😅 didn’t expect a reply. Thank you, been indulging myself into the 40k lore through your channel.

[@the_lomax]

You know I always thought thats why Malcador saved the emps life he has to stay alive so he doesn't die to be reborn as the Dark King. They cannot allow the emperor to die because if he does he will be reborn. Kind of a rock and hard place situation. The other Chaos gods wanted Horus to kill the Emp because they know the prophecy as well.

[@arcdecibel9986]

How did I not know of this book? Obviously, the Administratum has made some grievous error and shall be punished for withholding sacred knowledge from the Mechanicus.

[@BringDHouseDown]

What if the 5th chaos god is the God Emperor, his subjects are humanity capable of both good and evil, duality, chaos, but living together in the same medium. This is a thought I had long ago.

[@benjaminstorace6699]

Danny boy still trying to keep up the grim dark, even as GW's model releases keeps kicking that in the teeth.

[@thomaskunz3089]

doesnt it also look like he is doing the same thing as belakor?, like, now, he sits at a throne, getting pumped with power.... i surely hope so ngl, cus then humanity will start expanding again.

[@CheetahCrusader]

He is Prometheus, the one who stole the gods fire.

[@guilherme5094]

So the big E is a good guy?

[@jgg6932]

Yes clearly

[@ghostytigger6383]

no

[@jgg6932]

@@ghostytigger6383 how? He had to give up his emotions to even fight his son.. This was also the reason he was so cold to guiliman and called him a "tool" because he shed his humanity to try and save humanity still he's suffered on the throne for 10 thousand years idk what else a guy's gotta do to be considered good? 😂

[@DubberssMcgee]

There are no "good guys" in this setting. The emperor is a gigantic tyranical despot. Literally everything stated in the lore you need to view with a heavy dose of scepticism because twisting of the truth and propaganda is extremely common. @@jgg6932

[@JoshuaKevinPerry]

​@@DubberssMcgeeYes, Inquisitor, this comment here

[@thatoneguy7765]

"John Gramacatis does stab Erebus in the ear with some Eldar shears. That's not really relevant to this story, I just really liked it." We all did.

[@doragonzx]

Malal *see the title* : wait What?

[@TheNecromorphkiller]

Inquisitor grendyl is a malice cultist, malice is the dark king, malice, malcador, open ur eyes

[@cmbaz1140]

The emperor being the "dark king " makes sense... and he will surely destroy the current "system"...

[@GuitarsRockForever]

Then consider GW introduced the nids and how strong & absolutely impossible huge in size they are, none of these will matter, the nids will clear all but the necron.

[@Drizzt1Fan]

So they ret conned it again…?

[@Subject_Keter]

Oh boy, I woke up from a nap, listened to this video and i think i got hit by like 20 dice from thr sheer wtf the story took. Like wtf.

[@DISTurbedwaffle918]

Oh cool, Alfabusa was right about the Star Child thing. Big E castrated himself

[@freekill1018]

How TF is the emperor the dark king !? What is about to happen to him !? Humanity may be screwed!

[@nobilisvaga5267]

Well as we now know the drekari are trying to clone the god emperor and with how the clone process works, when the god emperor dies the new dark eldari king......is born.

[@goldendoomslayer6301]

Or we could get that soul shard of his compassion and give humanity a fighting chance

[@jmaccsarmiesofArda]

You mean Malal right?

[@josemariaseloterio9743]

So the theory that if the emperor removed from the golden throne he'll become a chaos god confirmed?

[@Ricardo_thecounsel]

In the warp, The Dark King is already present. He just has been born yet.

[@christopherperry6962]

Heresy!

[@markmooney9416]

Personally, the new additions to Imperium lore 8th edition onwards aren't for me. They've driven me to Chaos, let the galaxy BURN!

[@SandmanofTerra]

Can't argue with that! Youve clearly felt your calling

[@dro6554]

Hold on, I’m confused. If the Emperor excised his compassion why does he hesitate in the pivotal moment to kill Horus which leads to him being injured and thus permanently on the Golden Throne? Is this a retcon?

[@alannaramone3821]

Just found you yesterday Mate! Love your videos! You,Luetin,and Weshammer are the kings of youtube 40k! Much love from VANCOUVER BC CANADA 🇨🇦! Warhammer is just better when read by the British!!!

[@Jeylo.399-in7yf]

Wow

[@SandmanofTerra]

IT IS VERY VERY WOW

[@ImBarryScottCSS]

​@@SandmanofTerraBig wow much 😳

[@richardmcgowan1651]

I mean the Emperor already has "demons" under his control in 40k. Legion of the Damned and the saints. So GW is going to fill in the blanks. The only thing hold the Emperor from becoming a full on god is the golden throne. When it goes big E will be a full god of the Immaterium.

[@Lost7one]

they are not demons, where did you read that?

[@andrew3203]

@@Lost7one , they are not daemons (certainly not Chaos daemons), but they are the same in most ways. Even the Sisters of Battle gain an aspect of the Warp madness exhibited by various Chaos cults, which is called Faith. Two of the Primarchs (Ferrus Manus and Sanguinius) make an appearance as angels made of light, the Sanguinor more often than the other, Manus the Angel only seen during the War in the Webway. Leman Russ is rumoured to roam the Warp as a giant wolf that hunts daemons, while Corvus Corax also roams the Warp as a giant bat. (maybe a shadow raven?)

[@CrowbornChaos]

What if the Emperor didn't become a god? Like, based on what we know, Big E is a perpetual kept in a undying state, (Where literally dying would restore him, if the Empire knew better) But we also know that Worship of something can create a God. So what if the God Emperor and Big E, are in fact, not the same person? We know the gods reflect what the worshippers believe, which is why the God Emperor of Mankind always seems to be Contradictory. What if the Man has been replaced by a God without anyone being aware? And we know the Emperor hates religion. So i ask agian, What if the Emperor didn't become a god? And what sits on the throne is just facsimile created by the worship of mankind? Lorgar's True Sin?

[@CrowbornChaos]

@The_Real_Oppai_Sama Well this theory posits the idea that there is no transformation. That he is instead being Overshadowed, or Replaced. And is unrelated to Dark King theory.

[@AGILaboratory]

What is the name of this book?

[@SandmanofTerra]

The end and the death volume 2

[@AGILaboratory]

@@SandmanofTerra cool, thanks.

[@TheNecromorphkiller]

Better be a damn good reason the dark king isn't the emperor lol

[@darkomaver]

How weird for Games Workshop to write a moment where a character chooses to not exterminate his own race during an apotheosis to godhood and for that to read as the most human thing the emperor has ever done … 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@omega-xk4gj]

Funny huh? As much as Atheist and As much as I hate the Concept of Religion, sometimes Faith in something greater, and Hope that it's Benevolent is the only thing Keeping Humanity together

[@son_of_the_heavymetal1142]

So the "current" situation of the setting is the plan of the chaos god to exploit the dark king backfiring or going wrong with the God Emperor

[@jerkfacefuckasaurusrex328]

Impossible. The Emprah disolved Horus' soul entirely.

[@alannaramone3821]

So how in the fuck can they time travel now? I mean I know the emperor and his forsight can peer back and forth thru the past and the future. That however isn't the same thing as a couple space marines time traveling. So there a few Primes back now!? The golden thrown is failing? Is the emperor finally coming back? He's a feckin perpetual! He has to come back? Right? God I can't begin to tell you of much the emperor,the imperium and the mechanicus feckin fascinates me!!!! Am I to understand the current yr in 40k is 42nd millennium? I get paid in the morning I'll be joining for sure. Goddamn I can't get enough warhammer. I wish I could afford to play still. I enjoy 40k in books,video games,codexs and KZbin. My comic book business and my bands take up the majority of my income. It was those or still play table top 40k,mech warrior and magic cards I sold everything 20 yrs ago. I'm 39 now.

[@SandmanofTerra]

They have very special knife that should allow them to do it, and then some Eldar gimmics

[@SN00PICUS]

"Better to fight and die as men, than become demons ourselves." Says the epitome of human badassery. 🦅

[@ArnoldJudasRimmer..]

An absolutely epic line, from the most badass character save Saul Tarvitz, Nathaniel Garro and Siggy to ever grace the Imerium of Mankind. One that even convinced a power as ludicrous as Big Daddy E to heed such sage advice...

[@trynox4fun259]

Why not become demon and turn your new powers aganist Chaos itself? Become doomguy in hell like Khaldor Draigo.

[@hawk458]

@@trynox4fun259 fail

[@DarkTider]

The emperor agreeing made me so proud of him, as a grey knight player.

[@Upsilon1984]

Well the Big E might be a god in 40k now, but not the Dark King the chaos gods were hoping for.

[@pureraven101]

Isn't there a reference to a potential 5th Chaos God known as Malice? Now that is the king we deserve!

[@Troupe_Master]

COPE

[@Battlenude]

DOPE

[@sagittariusa9012]

​@@pureraven101The Sons of Malice got mentioned in Gothic Armada 2, which is a official licensed wh40k game.

[@Xynth25]

​@@pureraven101That's super old lore that got caught up in litigation between GW and the guy who supposedly created Malus. Officially Malus isn't a thing in 40k, though the Sons of Malice are still a Chaos warband.

[@ChumphammerDale]

So back when I worked in GW in 1998, I remember chatting to Andy and he told me that the plan always was that the Emperoror was a 5th Chaos god, Order. As Chaos cannot survive without Order and the other way around. So you can have a very weakened chaos, which happens with the rise of the emperor. As he becomes more powerful and start dominating the stars, Chaos grows to counter him. So now we are in the flipp, where chaos is more powerful which means order will rise again to counter that in an ouroboros

[@tacovanpeski4591]

There must be a balance

[@dorianleakey]

Well, back then it may have been closer to its Moorcockian roots, but how a chaos god can be order leaves me questioning this, it doesnt entirely make sense to me

[@WhatswithWatt]

I mean technically him being a god in the warp doesn't make him chaos. So maybe better to say warp god?

[@ExGemini]

@@dorianleakeyPotato Tomato - Warp God is the term I think that should be used now days.

[@sharpasacueball]

Is chaos strong though? When was the last time chaos even made a dent in the imperium's forces (not even mentioning failbaddon the armless)?

[@thewerdna]

I am so excited. Next book the Emperor will finally say the line! "You did it, you defeated me Horus Lupercal. You really are the Warhammer Forty-thousand"

[@Someone-hd2vu]

That's the moment Walter Lupercal became Horusberg. Bravo Vince.

[@lumburgapalooza]

The real Warhammer was the friends we killed along the way.

[@Zuemmel]

Abbadon going to face Valdor? That sounds like he's really trying his luck

[@SandmanofTerra]

Yeah I don't rate Abaddon's chances here 😂

[@stinkfist911]

Abby is going to get his heretical cheeks clapped if he does.

[@g.sergiusfidenas6650]

Then in 40K the King in Yellow goes: "Time for round 2, bitch" on him

[@maltheri9833]

​@@SandmanofTerraHes gonna need a Deus Ex Machina to survive that one

[@OrkOfOhio]

Man’s really just wanted to die.

[@MrAnthraxes]

Video about the 5th Chaos God; Malal: "Finally my time has come!" It's the Emperor; Malal: "FOILED AGAIN!"