Chinese JIAN Review - Is it a RAPIER? Scarlet Sunrise from LK Chen

[@revmarcell6449]

Chinese swords are under appreciated. Your presentation is very interesting.

[@MusMasi]

im sure they are appreciated by about a 1/4 of the worlds population.

[@appa609]

@@MusMasi Surprisingly not. I went to Longquan, one of the ancient centers of Chinese sword production, and half the stuff they were selling was Japanese reproductions.

[@Jim58223]

@@appa609 Made in Japan stuff being sold in China or reproductions of Japanese stuff made in China?

[@ELY3358]

I have a theory....and of course could be wrong. But I bet a large majority see them as fragile as their idea of a sword is based on entertainment and in which most see parries and heavy blade contact. No way to prove it of course, as you would have to survey many people who own swords on what drove them to choose those to verify this.

[@revmarcell6449]

LY Espa I agree.. Their quality and balance is equal to or superior to the much praised Japanese Katana.

[@GregTom2]

The main reason why rapiers were only invented in the very late middle ages in europe is the quality of available steel. Until the discovery of the blast furnace (just before the industrial era) which could make pig iron with high carbon, european steel had to be made with the cementation process: you start with a low carbon wrought iron bar, and you put it in coal for a long time to absorb some carbon through the cementation process. This created a very heterogenous steel, with a brittle exterior and a soft core, and it could only support a certain length before it would be at high risk of failing. (You could also stack cemented steel ingots into a crucible and weld them together, then stretch them which made more homogenous bands of hard steel in the iron in the Damascus steel process but that tech was not available everywhere). In china, the blast furnace had been discovered since ancient times, so they could start with a high density pig iron ingot, then temper it in oxygen for days until the carbon density was just right, in a process basically equivalent to our modern industrial processes. They had better access to "springy steel" which would return to its original shape after being bent, instead of snapping or staying bent. Basically, the rapier is the peak design for an civilian unarmored dueling weapon, and different civilization's time required to discover it is dependent on the quality of available materials.

[@JanetStarChild]

Damn, that was a good read. I love these nuggets of fascinating information! I wish these would get more attention than all the "durr-hurr joking" meme crap I see littered below these HEMA videos.

[@LARGO125]

Good points, but your not quite right about "spring steel" and other types such as bloom steel. Spring steel does in fact return to shape to an extent, but, as Schola pointed out in his Katana video, spring steel actually has a higher chance of failure and snapping than other types of softer steel due to the energy it absorbs, maintains, and suddenly releases. And the fact that it's often the same hardness throughout the blade just exacerbates that problem. Additionally, as mentioned, swords made in those days didn't have the purity of modern steel, and spring steel with impurities are even more likely to fail. As an offroad driving enthusiast I can vouch for that with all the suspension springs I've seen snapped due to substandard steel used in the construction.

[@affalee8216]

In truth, the iron ore quality in Europe is Appreciably Superior to those found in China. Its just China devised the Blast Furnace way ahead in time. At Peak Smithing level, not sure any of those these days, the level of skill and attenuity, is way way higher than those of typical Blacksmiths. They were practically tracking, ameliorating and melding particles into a Whole. A Work of Art. Priceless. And Very Functional.

[@tedarcher9120]

@@LARGO125 chinese steel from roman times is comparable to british in the 18th century

[@PlectrumMcPick]

I was wondering! Thank you for this info.

[@laperrablanca1]

You have such an impressive knowledge of swordsmanship that enables you to handle and understand swords from a different culture than yours. I enjoy very much watching your videos. Thank you!

[@valandil7454]

Skallagrim and his mate Swordsage went over the differences between that type of Jian and a swept hilt rapier and came to an interesting conclusion The name we give to sword types is down to how we use them not exactly how they're built, Swordsage made a point of the fact that in Chinese Wushu you don't thrust the same way which is why the weight wasn't any closer to the hand They're both "rapiers" but from completely different times and parts of the world and made to compliment 2 different fighting styles. I'm trained with rapiers and have handled a Jian like that and can honestly say he was 100% right, they're nothing alike

[@Arctrooper2091]

Yeah, that video was really informative. Seeing someone actually know how to use the Jian the way it was intended really shows how while the Jian serves much the same purpose as western swords like a rapier, there's some important differences that makes it so you can't really call them the same type of weapon.

[@zhaozilong99]

So the issue is that it would definitely be a cutting sword. In traditional Chinese swordsmanship, we cut and slice with it. I suppose with a sword like this we would say its not ideal for "hacking". For cutting with a jian like this as well as most Ming and Qing jian the techniques would include: quick flick cut, sliding forward or flick pulling cuts, downward pulling slices across the muscle between the neck or shoulder, upward pulling slices under the armpit and inner arms, as well as the inner thighs and the crotch (mind you that is assumming certain types of pants and a short tunic). I think you should do water bottles but also consider some sort of cuts through clothing and gambeson, and maybe fruit

[@zhaozilong99]

Which Jin Dynasty are you referring to? If you are referring to the one that followed the Three Kingdoms, then we know enough about Han and Three Kingdoms period warfare and jian construction to determine the usage of battlefield and non-battlefield swords to judge such things.

[@kenjitakashima1041]

My guess before watching the video: "It depends on what you think a rapier is"

[@sunnyboy6251]

And context

[@ELY3358]

11:05 is where you at. 😆🤣🤣

[@laughingdaffodils5450]

Yeah. It's really not a rapier at all, because that's one of the specifically European swords, but they're similar in ways. Straight, double-edged, good for poking, can slash ok too. I think the smallsword is a closer parallel, but also look at the other southeast asian swords of somewhat similar type. The lack of any significant hand-guard on all of them is down to being daily carry items in a warm climate, in typically quite lightweight clothing. A hand-guard would have been a constant chafing annoyance, and the best sword is the one that you actually have on you when you need it.

[@Mr.Ekshin]

@@laughingdaffodils5450 - Pull a pocket knife on someone in a dark parking lot, and it can be quite rapy. But as for this one being rapier than other blades, I don't see it.

[@Gr3nadgr3gory]

I belive the definition of rapier requires a handguard.

[@borenave]

As Matt mentioned, jian was mostly used by a wealthy aristocrats/officers, who at the time were well trained in martial arts. Proper jian technique required a lot of training and was mainly used for cutting tendons, ligaments and arteries with a surgical precision. A Dao (saber) on the other hand could be more easily used by not so skilled soldiers for cutting heads :) So the proper cutting targets for jian would be small branches and tree leaves.

[@tl8211]

I think I remember pictures of Chinese courtiers carrying their scabbarded swords in their hand, which would lend credit to the idea of the scabbard as a weapon.

[@RJLbwb]

Use the scabbard to parry with?

[@tl8211]

@@RJLbwb Yes.

[@jaketheasianguy3307]

There's also a few techniques from European and Japanese swordmanship that used the scabbard as a weapon. But indeed that's not as common as Chinese Jian

[@RealZeratul]

It's also one of the more plausible (and my favorite) explanations for the Chinese "sword fingers", i.e., for holding the unused hand's index and middle finger strongly extended and the other finger tips together; it's a symbol for the scabbard, and with that its poking and even blocking techniques in many forms make sense.

[@boloisdaman]

@@RealZeratul That makes sense. Hold the fingers alongside the scabbard to get less fingers cut off. Like how they block in fma.

[@Matt_The_Hugenot]

Cutting suggestion: tip cutting against cloth and a flesh analogue. If some Bronze Age swords can be called rapiers then these jian can be classified as rapiers too.

[@muhamadsayyidabidin3906]

I strongly agree with you. If that tapering bronze rapier could be classified as rapier, this slender sword could also be classified as such.

[@louisvictor3473]

As a primary high class civilian sword, that sword makes so much sense in its time in history. Imagine how good the smiths who could make such a narrow blade in the 5th center were for their time, how much prestige the thing would have had and how much a wealth signifier it would be in its time. Sounds like that sword was literally a piece of steel jewellery when it was first "popularised" (relatively, if any joe could afford it it wouldnt be a status symbol).

[@dongf2618]

There is a paper that estimated a Jian cost about soldiers a month of salary in the Han dynasty. Also, based on the military document at a garrison many soldiers owned private swords.

[@stephenshw2262]

Officers carry jians to war, namely to kill deserting soldiers. Having said that, the jian is The Gentleman of Weapons thus its use and associated martial arts are meant for the upper 1%

[@dongf2618]

@@stephenshw2262 that is not true. For the officers, the number of Jian and Dao are actually similar according to a paper. Also, in the government documents, a lot of soldiers have both a government bestowed sword and their personal sword. A lot of civilians bought their own swords to a point that a government official used a crime as an excuse to stop the personal carry of swords by the civilians, but this met strong opposition from other officials, citing that civilians need martial prowess as well, so in the end, he had to give up the proposal.

[@nikhilsinha7730]

@@dongf2618 they were THAT expensive?

[@dongf2618]

@@nikhilsinha7730 swords are made by forging yes they r expensive thing, but not expensive to a point that it is primarily high class weapon

[@ShaunCKennedyAuthor]

When I was teaching Kung Fu, the style that I learned had weapons forms that came from the Chinese Opera. That meant they looked cool but they weren't overly effective. Then I started learning Capoferro fencing through the SCA. I noticed that plate 7 lined up nicely with plate 17, 8 with 18, etc. So I created a two person form based on the plates using my Praying Mantis footwork and his techniques using a jain for the sword. I then made modifications using the dao and cutting moves instead of the thrust centric moves. That went well, so I did the same for a bo staff (gun in Chinese, but when I say I did it for a gun everyone gets the wrong idea for some reason.) That went well, so my next attempt was with a spear, and that was a total failure.

[@affalee8216]

Yeah Spear is king of battlefield. The slicing and penetrating, is done towards the tip. So wielding spear, is like enabling that end of the rod to perform those movements you're accustomned to. Interesting application of centrifugal principles for that. Takes lot of time, but fun. Wushu has alot of techniques based on Spear application.

[@strydyrhellzrydyr1345]

So wait... What do u mean by gun... I don't understand

[@ShaunCKennedyAuthor]

@@strydyrhellzrydyr1345 This video will explain. (Read the description as well.) kzbin.info/www/bejne/hGXTc3eOprN6edE

[@charless3108]

@@strydyrhellzrydyr1345 spear sounds like gun in Chinese

[@Intranetusa]

Great video. I love your reviews of these underrated and lesser known ancient sword reproductions from LK Chen.

[@426mak]

This kind of sword shows the confidence the Chinese had in their metal to make such a thin blade without fear of it breaking.

[@Mr.Ekshin]

Sure, but it doesn't look any rapier than any other blade. Heck, a pocket knife can be quite rapy when pulled in a dark parking lot.

[@426mak]

@@DaDunge Are you talking about Chinese technology in general? If so it was quite common for things to be lost between dynasties, but the beginning of the Ming Dynasty was still quite advance, for example see Zheng He's treasure fleet. The nautical technology was at least on par with any other civilization.

[@426mak]

@@DaDunge The Treasure Fleet had both the compass and compartments, technology no other civilizations had at the time. But European naval dominance did not happen until the late Ming Dynasty which was after a century of decline. If we compare them at Zheng He's time then Chinese technology was slightly ahead.

[@426mak]

@@DaDunge So you agree that China was advanced and had comparable technology to most of their contemporary civilizations in the early Ming Dynasty, thus disproving your original statement of regression after the Song. I had never argued China was the most advanced society, but that up until the late Ming Dynasty it was still comparable with any other society at the time.

[@426mak]

@@DaDunge So now you are saying China was the most advanced?

[@nate665]

I’m going to have to join Matt’s patreon so he can afford some heat in his garage.

[@jimmyw7530]

LK Chen will send him one for free soon. 28 min video to follow.

[@jay_chang]

Funny how the rapier is called "西洋剑" or basically translate to " western jian" As when rapier first appeared the jian of the period is predominantly narrow blade civilian weapon. One of the thing is the hilt and accessories is the social status. Jade fitting ( looking at the green destiny sword from "crouching tiger hidden dragon") Is an exclusive for imperial family, so in the 2010 three kingdom drama Cao Cao can be seen using a Hand period jian with jade fitting ( an act of audacity/ rebellion against the regime) kzbin.info/www/bejne/hZO8gWSgia9sg68 Then bronze / gold is a status of officials, government officials or dukes with titles Can use the fittings. Engraving and interlaced with silver, pearl or gemstone and more elaborate decoration Is for showing off wealth. Since jian is a upper social class weapon, these two is the most common fittings. The jian scabbard is often used as a blunt impact weapon ( pommel strike and scabbard strike) before it is drawn, or the scabbard being a tool to constrict an attacker without killing them.

[@JanetStarChild]

Excellent post and fascinating information! Deserves more attention.

[@husariatowarzysz4924]

It would be really cool if you could cover Sogdian and Sassanid swords sometime

[@possumsam2189]

You will need people sending him either antiques or 1:1 reproductions of said swords.

[@husariatowarzysz4924]

@@possumsam2189 Yeah sadly there's no off the shelf Sassanid Persian or Sogdian swords for sale anywhere that I'm aware of and it would have to be a fully custom commission. Swords of Northshire can custom make pretty much any sword so they would be a good place to get it from.

[@possumsam2189]

@@husariatowarzysz4924 For smiths to make the piece as it was intended they will need an Original or an antique as a point of reference (Balance, handling, steel etc.). Otherwise, you get something that isn't historically accurate or the smith's interpretation/rough approximation of a 'Sassanid/Sogdian' blade and that would be far from ideal.

[@husariatowarzysz4924]

@@possumsam2189 Oh I see, there's some really nice Sassanid swords in the Met Museum but I think for Sogdian swords we only have fragments of hilts and blades and we don't have any mostly intact antique blades so we would have to go mostly off iconography.

[@BLT_Plays]

I would be interested to see how well a blade like that can cut through different types of cloth.

[@morriganmhor5078]

In fact, in Middle Europe, the sword terminology distinguishes between rapier (civilian weapon, often longer and more thrusting-oriented) and kord - military weapon, a bit shorter, sturdier, and more balanced for both cut and thrust.

[@tobyjaya]

Re: testing: I think using your "normal" tests would still be quite informative, as it would serve as sort of a "base case" that could be used to compare the Scarlet Sunrise's cutting performance against the other swords that have been subjected to a similar test (e.g. the other LKs). Also would LOVE to see a review of the Flying Phoenix :)

[@ElDrHouse2010]

a blade this long in the Classical Age is a great feat.

[@benjaminstevens4468]

I want an LK Chen, Magnificent Chu Jian, with a “saber hilt,” maybe a 3 bar or something of the like, put onto it, that would be just wonderful.

[@jintsuubest9331]

Clothing. If this is a civiliance self defense weapon, how about we try it with clothing and see how survivable people can be?

[@bentrieschmann]

I agree!

[@blackpowderkun]

What, like what silat or arnis do with a sarong.

[@johnevans5472]

seconded

[@OnlyKaerius]

Rough heavy cloth maybe? See if it can handle burlap/hessian?

[@unboeing]

Maybe they were holding it closer to the end of the hilt? It may provide more protection to the hand as the hand is farther away from the guard. It might also feel more like a rapier in the hand, with the mass distributed a bit differently than when held at the guard. Hopefully Matt can try it out and tell us.

[@BCSchmerker]

+scholagladiatoria *The Sun Empire used the 剑 Jian as a court sword from the Tang Dynasty;* the Jian served as a prototype for the 剑 Turugi in Japan. Pattern forge-welded for depthwise strength, the Jian appears better suited for cutting than thrusting due to the broadhead point.

[@Dvergenlied]

I’d really like to see comparative testing of the jian and rapiers in how cutting and thrusting attacks were affected by representative civilian clothing v exposed flesh.

[@RighteousBeardArts]

Thank you for further exploring and sharing your thoughts about Chinese swords, Matt. And yes, if you watch a lot of more classic tv/movie choreography of Chinese swordplay, including the 2002 Zhang Yimou film "Hero", the scabbard is most certainly often used as a parrying tool or as a bludgeoning weapon.

[@mytotim8978]

Well, the jian is a cut and thrust sword which prefer the cut. The rapier is a thrust sword which some can cut. The jian was a battlefield sword, but not the type of jian you show. The dao, or chinese saber, was the battlefield sword for the poor which in time replace the jian as battlefield weapon. The classic battlefield jian is more like an european arming sword.

[@Trollvolk]

I am curious how it might perform agains a tatamimatt with a wig. Or some sort of cloth attached to the Target. Hair can be quiet sturdy and redirect a smaller blade. Just my guess.

[@bernardweaver2416]

The jian is an amazing sword. See if you can find some information on a movement called stirring , basically rotating the handle to create various cones in the air. It's quite fun as you stir your arm and blade around your opponents to find your line to cut or thrust.

[@sethdusith6093]

The same "moving the handle behind the point" is done in Chinese swordsmanship too. It's just that since there is a different COP and POB, the center of rotation is in a much different position, giving some slight variation

[@michaelpayne9710]

Thrusting at a piece of ballistics gel with fabric over it, to simulate a person in clothing. Also, I'd love to see a review of that rapier you showed, or something similar.

[@NapoleonGelignite]

Ballistic gel cuts much more easily then muscle. It has been tuned to simulate the temporary wound channel caused by projectiles. Tatami mats with bamboo are much closer to muscle and bone.

[@JanetStarChild]

I believe Matt has already reviewed that rapier. Search his video catalog; it's there.

[@KF1]

it was cool to see how much fun you had playing with the scabbard at the end

[@anthonnygeoffrey7071]

About using the scabbard in a fight: That's something you often see in chinese dramas/tv shows. I don't know if it represent real historical techniques but as you said, it would make sense.

[@aRtFuLThinG]

It does, from what I see of the contemporary version of traditional chinese martial arts. A lot of things are used as defensive weapons in traditioanl chinese martial arts. Some of the more known example are fans with steel frames in it. In traditional chinese martial arts they even have treatises to teach you how to defend against weapons with a wooden chair.

[@batto736]

@@aRtFuLThinG evidence that bar fights got pretty intense in ancient China

[@Intranetusa]

13:35 - Similar to unscrewing the pommel, the removeable hilts are so you can throw it at your enemies to end them rightly.

[@keepermovin5906]

Ah that’s a common misconception you see throwing a basket hilt is known as the French toss and is considered a different school of fighting entirely like Kong fu vs taekwondo it’s a sort of regional variation that get confused a lot

[@pierredussf]

You should check out Tai Chi Jian videos. There are both Yang (more point) and Chen styles (more cutting). I seem to recall that LK Chen made a very good video but haven't found it as write this.

[@BrentODell]

Matt is really having a good time with the jian/scabbard weapon set :)

[@DSlyde]

Id be very interested in a comparison between historical and modern sword material science. Obviously a practical medieval sword is going to be stronger and more durable than a cheap wall hanger you get at a flea market. But how expensive do you have to go before you're above medieval average? Where does the best craftsmans steel place?

[@romanista77]

It would be interesting to see it cut in comparison to a Sabre and or Longsword. With some type of consistent substance (ballistics gel, clay, etc..)

[@SuperOtter13]

Would love to see the jian cut silk. Or a pork shoulder for thrusting test. Thanks Matt for sharing this with us. Always great content. Greatly appreciate the time you spend putting all this together. Cheers!

[@jacobwilson6018]

I’ve always been curious about using a scabbard as an off hand weapon, it’s always seemed plausible especially in Asian swords that tend to be tucked into a belt rather than clipped on

[@macacofrito]

Matt, in your experience or research have you ever seen someone use a jian or dao in some kind of combat? like kendo or hema but in chinese martial arts context? There´s any practice like that today?

[@thescholar-general5975]

There is, but not much on youtube. Check out scott rodell for more info. Eventually I will make some sparring vids once things are not as restricted

[@wor575]

check out Swordsage A friend of Skallagrim. Skal goes to him whenever Chinese swords are involved

[@bockskarr6626]

Love your channel, Matt, absolutely love it!!!

[@Sifuben]

Thank you Matt!!!! I've been saying this about Jian scabbards for years, because it's the only way a lot of offhand motions in Kung Fu forms make any sense. However people aren't very receptive to the idea

[@JohnFleshman]

Very nice lookin sword and lots of cool info as usual. Thanks for all the cool videos.

[@EVENINGWOLF666]

There is a long history of using the scabbard of such Chinese swords as a parrying weapon. It helps to preserve the edge and is a perfectly serviceable substitute if one does not have a shield, although that particular style of sword wasn't normally used with a shield, that was more often the Dao, or Chinese sabre. When I think of a comparison between the Jian and the Rapier, I usually think of it in terms of usage. Both are quick, nimble blades, mostly used for thrusting, but capable of delivering nasty cuts if necessary. Both are very elegant weapons relying more on speed and agility than brute strength. I would really like to see an honest comparison of the two fighting styles of the weapons focusing on their similarities and even some demonstrations of the Jian against the Rapier that would showcase those similarities, as well as show their differences. Perhaps some light sparring just to demonstrate those facets of each weapon.

[@blakexu4943]

Thrust testing on pork shoulder or the like of course.

[@Riceball01]

I was going to suggest something similar, a nice slab of meat would make for a great test target. I'd also test it on a tire, or at least a piece of a tire, some leather and/or raw hide. Then for a bit of abusive testing, try thrusting it against a section of mail.

[@blakexu4943]

@@Riceball01 I suppose he cld add a gambeson on top if he felt like it.

[@InSanic13]

@@Riceball01 I second the mail testing.

[@tl8211]

With some clothes on top.

[@InSanic13]

@@tl8211 Oh, good point! He could test how well it cuts through clothing.

[@RallycrossGT]

Jian is a high class weapon. they took thousands of hours to master and were much more expensive to craft compared to Dao (Chinese Saber) or other weapons. I've been practising Taijiquan for 5~6 years and the Jian for about half of that. it is not a chopping weapon and not necessarily piercing either. the sharpest part of the jian is the top third, which is used for small cuts, more like tapping. this is a precision weapon, not for swinging wildly. I don't know much about rapiers but what you show at 10:00 about keeping the point still and moving the rest of the body is one of the exercises we practice a lot as well.

[@stevenkobb156]

Beautiful sword and scabbard. I'd like to see how it cuts compared with a rapier. Perhaps you could test it against padding like a gambeson, tatami mats, etc. Also, did you see Metatron sword fighting on PS2 using VR and his actual body to fight? Matt, I'd love to see you do that, and/or a demonstration of fighting styles using different sword types.

[@LeonM4c]

Great video as always Matt

[@torreyjones9324]

Especially watching the end of the video regarding the scabbard...sword canes. They dont HAVE to have so spindly a blade. You could easily have a sword cane with a one inch to even close to two inch wide blade. Really think we need to make these much more common in the modern day using jian blades as inspiration.

[@viridisxiv766]

i really like the point you made about the scabbard at the end. it would be great to see a practical reconstruction of how a duel wouldve looked with these. it imagine it wouldve been very very fast even by duelling standards.

[@jandisueiras4790]

Nice vídeo! You mencioned the Destreza in one moment. A video about Verdadera Destreza will be wonder! 😉

[@arnaghadofgemmera5277]

Really looking forward to some test cutting footage of this sword!

[@TheZerech]

Early Bronze Age Aegean/Italian swords can get quite long, I've heard them called rapiers on occasion, based on length. It's harder to get an example of course, but bronze age swords are quite interesting in their own right and oddly enough get shorter over time. There's some interesting stuff to talk about.

[@Robert399]

(Hand protection aside), does it handle appropriately for Western rapier techniques or do you really have to use the intended forearm/elbow (I'm not sure exactly) pivoting techniques?

[@wor575]

doesn't appear so. He did say the point of balance is much further down the blade away from the hand

[@MartinGreywolf]

Rapier techniques rely on the complex hilts rapiers have so much you'd just get your hand or forearm stabbed/cut if you tried it. Even some Lichtenauerish binding actions don't work on account of small crossguard.

[@Robert399]

@@MartinGreywolf I know. I'm not asking would it be good; I'm asking could you do it, or does the differing balance force you to use it differently?

[@StryderK]

@@Robert399 Check out the video where Skallagrim and Swordsage elaborated in detail on this point.

[@Robert399]

@@StryderK Thanks

[@kazikek2674]

Clearly, higher-class gentlemen worldwide had some sort of view on cool stabs being more gentlemanly than cool slashes.

[@appa609]

This thing is pretty evenly balanced. I wouldn't say it's any more thrust centric than an arming sword.

[@Robert399]

@@appa609 No, it's much lighter and longer than most arming swords.

[@AURORA08A]

possibly ths has something to do with historically endemic hypogamy. The gentleman being accustomed to his tool finding abundant opprtunties for penetration, where the commoner was mostly resigned to using it mainly for going for a slash.

[@Robert399]

@Nob the Knave Yeah but you're comparing particularly large arming swords to a pretty standard jian. It's like saying "this woman is bigger than this man so men aren't bigger than women on average".

[@appa609]

@@Robert399 But it doesn't feel thrustier

[@DH-bc8ck]

This is an excellent video, thank you. One example (in literature at least) of "gentleman" carrying the jian into battlefield. In Romance of the Three Kingdom, Liu Bei's weapon is jian. in contrast with his two more fighting inclined oath-brothers: Guan Yu (who wields something akin to a glaive) and Zhang Fei (who wields something like a lance / spear). With the exception of a few early battles, Liu Bei is almost never portrayed as a fighter / duelist, but mostly as a commander / leader. So that sort of matches your concept here of a gentleman / officer carrying jian.

[@jessupshutt3557]

Scholagladiatoria, can u (or anyone who knows) please tell me where u and Lucy bought that Mary Rose Backsword as I am hoping to buy one myself sometime in the future when I get the chance!!!

[@VeridianHerald]

For testing the point and edge of jian for thrusts and strikes (light cuts, possibly even draw cuts, but not cleaving or hewing cuts) I usually suggest textile; durable silk (costly but somewhat accurate to the time/place of use) or linen pulled somewhat taunt. For how well it would work against exposed targets... I am loath to suggest this because it wastes good food... a hamhock or pork shoulder. Simply put, the meat of a pig is not terribly dissimilar from the meat of a human, and works well for demonstrating efficacity of a weapon. For a bonus round, drape the silk or linen over the swine flesh, that will do as good a job as any option in simulating it's combative purpose. Oh, and by the way, thank you. Your reviews were highly ranked amongst those that helped me decide on acquiring an LK Chen blade. A decision I shall never regret.

[@bradleycollins6467]

In Jow Gar (and Shaolin) Kung Fu, the use of a Jian is one of the basic 12 forms. If you observe the form you notice that it is predominantly a point weapon and if handled correctly there is no need for an extensive hand guard. Interestingly, the preferred weapon is the curved broadsword or Doa.

[@tykykable]

Jianerals and jiantlemen is all I could think about on rewatch

[@leroy4320]

I love that you thought about using the scabbard as a supplement to the jian, it's a really interesting set. I just wonder what the jian would look like in fencing paired with the proper techniques, as all I've been able to find are people using the jian in a similar way to a rapier.

[@choymatthew48]

I'd love to see some destructive testing and simulation of edge on edge contact. Something like Matthew Jensen's reviews of katanas so you can really get a sense of the construction and what the blade can handle

[@cjm8943]

Thick winter clothing placed on a lump of material of roughly human tissue-like consistency should be a versatile and informative medium for thrusting tests. IIRC you once made a video about winter warfare and how thick sturdy clothes invalidate most sword cuts, forcing sword users to rely mostly on thrusts. I'd personally really love such a test done with a variety of different swords - it's a shame that thrusting capabilities are very rarely tested and showcased. I think that most swords (without rounded points) should be able to punch through that medium with sufficient force, so repeating the test with increasing amount of power behind the thrust could allow to rank the different swords relative to each other.

[@jamesreese208]

Well presenter, I would point out that your best cut with a Jian must be done with a smooth draw motion as you swing. I would love to see you cut on a ballistic dummy with that. Would there be any benefit to a mono steel rather than pattern welded?

[@SedDelMar]

For that sword, I would like to see a thrust and withdrawal on a free standing tatami roll. I thought this would be a good test of my technique.

[@elcroquetero9850]

Hi Matt!! Could you please cut several types of fabric, from more thin clothing-like to more thick gambeson-type? It will be intersting to compare how thinner and thicker swords deal cutting through them

[@anthonyclark9159]

I've always loved the look of these swords, very elegant.

[@shovellord1117]

Hey Matt do you think you could make a video comparing Chinese polearms to other nations? Guan-Dao vs Battleaxe, Ji vs Halberd, etc.

[@Robert399]

I'd love to see that

[@ThirdLawPair]

Are the removable handles there to make it easier to salvage components of the sword in the case that the blade breaks?

[@mallardtheduck406]

That is a gorgeous Jian Matt, however, my heart is set on L.K. Chen's "white arc" model...it is so unique looking yet simple.

[@shubbagin49]

Very interesting Matt, I knock about with a Tinker's hand and a half, my lads love cutting with katanas, never fenced. Fell in love with this blade, maybe just I got old enough?

[@stanlim9182]

I really love your contents. Subscribed

[@joegillian314]

To have a hilt that can easily be removed makes sense, because you're supposed to remove the hilt when you sharpen the sword (for a katana, at least). Never thought about it before, actually, but it makes perfect sense.

[@jiaweizhang4166]

I am not necessarily a Chinese history buff but I had the impression of Chinese gentlemen (often called the Mandarins) fighting with bows and arrows.

[@VideoMask93]

Even an archer needs a close range defence option.

[@Riceball01]

Matt was referring to Chinese gentlemen carrying these swords as part of their every day dress and not necessarily what they'd take to war. But, he does also say that there's nothing to suggest that some wouldn't have taken one of these swords to war. But you are correct that a sword wouldn't have been their primary weapon. Swords were very seldomly anybody's primary weapon.

[@jiaweizhang4166]

@@VideoMask93 Of course. It's just often got omitted from scripts. Perhaps recorders thought they were insignificant and didn't bother to write down.

[@jessicamowry1372]

You often see the use of the scabbard in Chinese martial arts forms and kung fu movies and demonstrations. Growing up it often felt like there was more techniques for Chinese weapons than european weapons. Now I know that is often not the case but it seemed that way based on what you could find when I was growing up back in the day.

[@NeriKafkafi]

For some years I've been disappointed that HEMA practitioners rarely do thrust tests like they do cut tests. One problem is that thrusting is so much more efficient. So in a way you could say there's no point (arrgh, I didn't mean to write that...) testing it. Any sword would thrust well enough, and better thrusters are just an overkill. And over-penetration. The answer to that might be testing against some simulation of armour or heavy cloth. It doesn't have to be realistic, like water bottles aren't realistic. It has to be cheap and easy to standardize. And preferably look cool...

[@Tommiart]

One of my favourite Japanese Anime: Bleach showed one of the characters using his katana and saya in a dual wielding manner (he pulls a trick by swapping the two behind his back to wringfoot the opponent- silly fun, but maybe with an historical precedent)

[@Ehuatl]

I'd still like you to see trying to cut wood with it, just to see if it defies your expectations. :)

[@torreyjones4421]

I'm just saying, with the right modifications that jian would make an amazing sword cane. I hate that most sword canes are only ever shown as spindly little steel twigs when you could very reasonably make some fairly beastly blades into reasonable walking sticks.

[@brianfuller7691]

Your knowledge of both swords and swordmanship is impressive. You are spot on that the jian occupied the same place as the rapier in the Chinese sword universe.. It was definitely the Gentlemen's Sword.

[@Michael-yf1wo]

As a fan of LK Chen's products, I appreciate your perspective, so thank you for evaluating them. On a different subject, after seeing an antique yataghan on Mandarin Mansion with a Chinese fangshi hilt, I had in mind to get a yataghan. TBH, I don't want an antique because, ahem... ghosts or bad karma. Would you know if there are any quality reproduction yataghans out there? Baltimore Knife/Sword offers a yataghan, but to my eye and compared to antiques it appears grossly exaggerated fantasy sword. Thank you and cheers! www.kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=BKS20A019&name=BKS++Yataghan+%2D+28%27%27+Blade

[@andreweden9405]

I really wish LK would do an interpretation of the famous Sword of Goujian! Looking at its proportions, it looks like it would be a much better cutter than any of the very narrow-bladed Jian that he's made so far.

[@danielflynn9141]

For testing, would you consider focusing on the thrust and test how effective it is as penetrating through different layers? Some suggested materials include cloth, rawhide leather, etc...

[@samchafin4623]

The sound that made when it got put back in the scabbard was so tasty!

[@vumanhtung]

I really like the idea of using scabbard as a mace.

[@Crimzs]

I think it would be cool if you did a panel of swords and various tests to compare this sword with. A rapier, a small sword( or something similar), and a jian would be good I think.

[@kaliguyver7924]

Great Explanation!!!

[@christianflor1394]

I feel like there should be a distinction between cutting and chopping. Do you really ever cut bone?

[@dogman9291]

Yes, but you don't cut through it; slices can be seen on some preserved medieval skulls and the like, but they don't actually go through the bone, making words like "chopping" inappropriate for what they are. Definitely a distinction, though, you're right!

[@The_Gallowglass]

I really need a pillow sword now. SHANK!

[@giantlobsterboy644]

I prefer a nice pillow pistol.

[@cwmyr]

Bed staff all the way

[@fbi3078]

@@giantlobsterboy644 why not have both it’s always good to go to sleep with a gun and a sword

[@Cloudfencer]

Have you seen LK Chen’s German Saxony Rapier? Looks very interesting

[@bensul9979]

matt, now that you mentioned rapiers, when are you going to review the fight scenes in Alatriste? :( you said it in a video like 3 years ago ajajajaja

[@brianwatson4119]

In the jian techniques I learned, the techniques are a bit cruel. Your targets are the fingers, the tendons, and the blood vessels. Not too much slashing, but lots of thrusting and slicing. They're not sturdy like dao. They're for disabling the enemy before killing him. I think of it as combat whittling.

[@Dexamus1]

What kind of coat is that, and where did you get it??

[@benjaminodonnell258]

Nice field jacket, btw!

[@TrosskAskali]

I would like to see test cutting of its own scabbard to see how well it would hold up and maybe thrusting against a modern hema jacket just to see how stab proof they actually are.

[@falsebeliever8079]

I want you to test the blade on rapscallions or maybe a cad.

[@andersbenke3596]

To what extent, if any, can we simulate historical sword's quality or lack thereof? How much data - in the shape of analyzed extant swords or battlefield reports - is there to work with?

[@seandahl8441]

Try cutting and thrusting simulations of lower end/foot soldier armors like a gambeson, lynothorax type material, soft and hardened leather

[@kevinrobinson5654]

Physics and chemistry are the same in the Orient and the the Occident. No surprise that our weapons mirror themselves, even if the technology evolved independently.