Sennheiser HD 650, HD 600, and HD 580 Review - Time-tested Reference Standards

Previous HD 600 Review: • Sennheiser HD 600 Revi...
HD 600 EQ:
Preamp: -10.0 dB
20 Hz, +9.5 dB, Q 0.8
40 Hz, +1.5 dB, Q 0.8
3500 Hz, -3.0 dB, Q 2.0
10000 Hz, -3.0 dB, Q 3.0
14000 Hz, +0.5 dB, Q 2.0
HD 650 EQ:
Preamp: -7.5 dB
20 Hz, +6.5 dB Q 0.8
40 Hz, +1.5 dB Q 0.8
3500 Hz, -2.0 dB Q 2.0
10000 Hz, -3.0 dB Q 3.0
14000 Hz, +0.5 dB Q 2.0
Follow me on Twitter to know when I'm uploading, what's coming next, and to just generally get in touch. / metal571

[@metal571]

Only thing I forgot is to talk about the sound change due to the pads. The pads tend to wear out in about a year if you are using these daily, and as I said they cost around $50 which is on the pricey side. You'll want to replace them when they go flat because this softens the highs to a noticeable degree and it sounds like they lose some detail. I recently replaced the pads on my 600 and the treble opened up and became noticeably more detailed. Also I know someone is going to ask about the monitors I'm wearing. That's the DT770 Pro 80 ohm.

[@RojasTKD7]

Woo hoo! Got some 770/80 again. Yes, I did notice. I miss mine.

[@HarshKumar-ts9mu]

metal571 Hi buddy. I have to say that now you are my fav. reviewer. Till now, Lachlan was my fav. But now he is second n you are first. Your reviews are so much detailed, so much simple n sober. No rubbish intro or music. Just plain n simple "REVIEW". Outstanding work. Keep it up. Now my question...The Beyers you were wearing, I guess you have sold earlier. Have you bought them again for reviewing or for what? I am asking because I am a huge fan of beyers. Please tell me more about the 80ohms.

[@metal571]

Harsh Kumar the 80 ohms I used to own and another 80 ohm pair I've heard that were both used had the same signature I described in my review of those. Much less treble. However the new one I'm wearing here sounds more like the 32 and 250 ohm models and has the full Beyer treble like a DT990. Not recommended.

[@JohnSmith-oe4bw]

If there is one thing you gotta give it to with the 770 (at least the one I have), is that if there is ANY distortion or clipping in the audio source, you'll def hear it! - I haven't heard the difference between the different ohm versions. I have the GC branded DT770 STUDIO, 80 ohms, and it's pretty colored, with scooped mids, and a hot top end. But you get fast detail retrieval, and I love the sig.

[@metal571]

John Smith yeah I can see for analytical listening how they'd be useful. Kinda the same thing that the HD 800 is accomplishing with its strong treble region but lightning quick transient response.

[@fuzzybaffy]

"Am I Zeos today? All I care about right now is the wires, apparently." - I LMAO'ed at that comment.

[@barrybrennan2135]

I own both the 600's and the 650's. I've spent considerable time working and listening to both models. In summary, I think they are best described as a headphone coming in two flavours - neutral (600's) and w/ mid bass emphasis (650's). However, two other notable characteristics stand out for me. The first notable difference is soundstage - the 650 is more diffuse. Presentation is somewhat airier and wider sounding. The 600 seems offers more precision in its placement, albeit is more closed-in sounding. Also, the sum whole of listening to the 650 is a more sonorous, warm, euphonic experience. Ultimately, it comes down to matter of personal taste and perhaps usage intentions. Personally, the 650 fits the bill better for me - less fatiguing over long periods, still reference quality enough if one is mindful of its slightly warm presentation. Also, for pure listening enjoyment, it takes itself out of the equation more readily - which is what really great speakers/headphones should do. In many ways, the best praise one can afford a reference speaker or headphone is that it's unremarkable. Also, when one reads enough reviews and testimonies of headphones/ speakers, one quickly finds out that any given headphone or speaker can run the gamut of superlatives. One person's warm is another's dark and veiled. The K701 is etched for one and detailed for another. The 600 is neutral for one and utterly boring for another. Many come to this tier of headphone quality without really knowing their preferred signature/presentation. Get out and listen if you can. There's no right or wrong ultimately - only what suits your ears.

[@metal571]

+Barry Brennan that's right, I listen to all kinds of stuff and I still settle on these because they are so unremarkable. Nowadays I really think boring is actually an ideal sound signature

[@followumesh]

I have owned 518 for a while. It's on the warmer side, though it's not quite defined as these. Of these two, I was looking for a sound signature similar to 518. I bought 600. I'm discovering that it's more subdued about reverbs and a bit harsh on mid-highs (perhaps my ears are less tolerant). May be I should go for 650.

[@metal571]

The 650s would be a little closer but they still have slightly forward mids

[@followumesh]

Your analysis is spot on. I finally bought 650 and wow. They are definitely my type. I also ordered Fiio Q1 amp, but didn't notice any difference, my laptop can drive them well.

[@metal571]

followumesh1 it's not so much that they need power to sound good but that they will get loud enough with amplification. Some amps may improve them slightly overall. Next step is trying EqualizerAPO and Peace with the 650s and applying my EQ if you want to restore some of the missing sub bass

[@AlexRowe]

"Am I Zeos today?" Hahaha that was good. Great review!

[@jonathanr2830]

You said it best! My thoughts exactly!

[@brf1009]

I like your non biased reviews, never change that.

[@metal571]

Yeah I ripped on the Amiron and the 1770 because that's exactly what I thought about them. Both of those were review units sent for free. Send me crap, you'll get a crap review. Otherwise this would be a useless channel

[@metal571]

Even though the 1770s don't have as hot of treble as the 770s the amount of grain is hideous for 3x the price. Beyer hasn't made a headphone I actually like yet... even my new DT770 80 ohm has crazy DT990 esque treble. Some people are telling me to try the DT150 and also the DT250 seems to be very different and more neutral.

[@brf1009]

How about the T1 2nd gen?

[@metal571]

Haven't heard those yet but from what I've read it's not significantly improved over the first gen. Honestly if I was using EQ with the original T1 back when I reviewed it it might not have been intolerable. But I still think there was some grain there along with the treble peak. The HD 800 doesn't have that issue post-eq

[@brf1009]

Probably your ears just adapted to the hot treble levels which I wouldn't consider a good thing(?.

[@SaltedSlug85]

I bought the HD600 10 years ago. One suggestion I read on a forum back then, was to buy the headband cushion made for the beyer's. The 770, 880, etc use the same headband cushion. Just pop the clips, take off the HD600 headband, pop the clips back on, then wrap the Beyer headband pad over the HD600's and button it. It fits pretty tight.. perfect honestly. I've used these headphones every day for a decade, and I just now decided to refresh my beyer headband pad on my HD600's. They held up so well, i'm not sure I even need too. They are still comfortable. I also notice it preserved the finish on the top of the hd600's over these years.

[@metal571]

+SaltedSlug the only thing I'd say is that you definitely need to replace the earpads about once a year or more if they are a daily use headphone. It gets flattened and the sound gets a lot darker, interestingly. Never heard that about the headband - sounds like it would work really well.

[@SaltedSlug85]

metal571 I don't even remember how the stock headband feels because it's been 10 years but I remember being very happy with the swap. In 10 years of everyday use I've replaced the ear pads twice.

[@headphonefanboy623-4]

Excellent comparison. I have these three headphones and pretty much agree with your assessment. If you like the 650, you'll like the Momentum 2.0 over ear, it sounds just like a portable 650 would if the 650 was portable. It is a bit more forward in the mid range than the 650, so you'll have to pull it back a couple of dB more than the 650 EQ, but otherwise, very similar

[@metal571]

+Headphonefanboy623 - I demoed those briefly and was really impressed with the neutrality. They're coming up soon in a series of 3 reviews thanks to a Lumoid order I placed some weeks ago that is finally shipping

[@sunnypatri]

I own HD 6xx since last 3 years and it got damaged due to heavy usage, considering some many great reviews available online I ordered both HD 600 and HD 660s from Amazon to try. I thought whichever I like I'll keep. After trying over the last 2-3 weeks on daily basis on a varities of songs (English - my collection, Indian- Bollywood music, KZbin videos, movies etc.) that I listen - it was very clear none of these are as good as HD 6xx for my liking and I returned both HD 650 and HD 660s. My honest take is that HD 600 very crisp, clear and snappy as so many KZbinrs mention but bass is clearly missing and not immersive across most tracks as the HD 6xx. 600 is fatiguing as well, I got ear pain when used for more than 1 hr with some volume while HD 6xx I have slept entire night over so many days with 6xx on my head, it is that comfortable and got damaged due to that :) HD 660s I did not understand what was that (worst amongst these 3 while costing highest) - did not like sound signature, neither crisp as 600 nor immersive as 6xx. I am neither an audiophile nor some speciliast to recommend others - just a listener who enjoys varities of songs and HD 6xx's sound signature is mesmerising and outstanding product. I will re-order when the current one fails completely.

[@metal571]

In the end I also ended up keeping a 650 which is the same headphone as the 6XX

[@WJL91]

Thank you, I was so torn before slightly leaning to the 600, your video made that decision so easy, 600 it is! About to buy. Thank you

[@metal571]

Hopefully you enjoy

[@WJL91]

metal571 thank you, now ordered ❤️

[@ColossalKiwi]

Another wonderful review/comparison, Metal!

[@DICARLOPRODUCTIONS]

I had an endorsement deal with Sennheiser, and they gave me a lot of equipment for free. The HD-580, and HD-25 headphones were part of that equipment, along with some great microphones. I was told that they brought out the HD-600´s mainly for cosmetic reasons to have a more modern look. I still think the HD-580´s sound more true than the 600´s, or 650´s.

[@NealBrewer]

The 580's were pinnacle, leave no doubt, but good luck finding a pair. HD 650 is the next best.

[@cavemanmasters]

HD650's retain their tone better when plugging into different headphone amplifiers, whereas the HD600's are more sensitive to variances in amplifier topology. Hope this helps!

[@zerooneonetwothree1872]

Thats a trait of colourations or as people who like certain colourations say *character* Which doesnt tell much about other qualities, still...

[@geniekoko]

Great great review. Im using the HD650s with PS Audio DLiii DAC/ Burson Soloist MK1. For the money -hard to beat imo!

[@RojasTKD7]

The HD 600 are very nice and the mids are FANTASTIC! My issue was the slight bass hump fallowed be the complete lack of extension. I really like my sub bass and didn't enjoy that aspect. One day I get a new pair and pare it with a tube AMP and see what all the talk is about.

[@metal571]

+RojasTKD7 you could try my EQ as well. It's pretty overly aggressive and attempts to restore as much sub bass as possible. They respond okay, but once you start trying to hear below 40 Hz it becomes a little messy. But it helps.

[@JohnSmith-oe4bw]

Another great video. Thanks, 571. I have the 580's, and a producer friend had the 580's & 595's back around 10 years ago. I was gifted the 580's, but wish I had the 595's. The 580's were/are too slow for me, and the strong mid emphasis isn't my thing. I loved the 595's, and wish I had those. I picked up the 598's thinking that they would be an upgrade or similar to the 595's for music monitoring, but I found them unsatisfactory for music, and better for general multimedia (movies etc.). I always thought about getting the 600 or 650, but from what Ive always understood, the 580's are VERY close to the 600's. So, they'd all basically have a sound that I wouldn't prefer. Man, I wish I had a pair of 595's these days. I remember them being fast, and having more treble presense/clarity. Very good and plesant for rock/metal music (for Senmnheiser anyway!).

[@metal571]

+John Smith yeah I owned a 555 modded to a 595 and the mids were nailed perfectly on that one. I wish they didn't make it brighter on the 598 series which has even more midrange than the 600 or 650. The 595 rolls off even more on the bass than the 598 though if remember right but it was a lot less fatiguing.

[@RogerPack]

link to "conclusion" or what not welcome in description. (for followers it's 14:00). Also a "winner"? Couldn't find a 580 on ebay anymore, and other prices a bit out of date. Also you can get the hd 6xx for $200 :)

[@casualmime2792]

Awesome as always man

[@JioFreedOfOphan]

When I first received my 600's it wasn't but two weeks after using the stock cable that I said to he'll with it and ordered the 650 cable. Best $24 I ever spent.

[@JioFreedOfOphan]

@Immortal It's a better cable in general. The connectors are larger so you don't have to grasp at the puny stock ones. The cord itself is also thicker as well, so more durable. My amp comes with a standard 1/4 inch jack so the need for a 3.5mm connector is moot. As far as any changes in sound are concerned, I didn't hear any substantial difference.

[@kentxx12]

Just love this show :)

[@DamnWow]

This is the only no nonsense review I'v been able to find. New sub for sure

[@KimJongUnTheOneAndOnly]

Mate your videos are a joy to watch!

[@y34r]

I own HD600,650.700. for my taste,i still value 600 the most. 600s has the best mid of all three. the warmth, not as dark as 650, just right.

[@parallelBug]

In question of sound that means dark?

[@Berettadv]

I wondered that too for a while so here is my explanation. Dark means generally bassy. It can lead to the quality of the sound is not quite as clear (when distributing instruments or voices in your head) due to the "boominess" of the low end. However, it can also mean that things sound more natural in certain circumstances. Just remember that natural does not mean neutral.

[@solderbuddy]

I use the HD650 running through a little dot mk3 tube amp and a topping dac and they sound wonderful for Jazz and music that doesn't need to focus heavy on bass.

[@geof98]

Nice video. I love the 650 but havent tried the others.

[@atalkspodcasting]

Hey man! Sup! Don’t know if u remember me but I definitely do! I was thinking to buy the 650s & who knows I might have even ordered one, but I really wanted to hear what you had to say about them, and since I managed to grab them for 290, I think i won’t lose much! Thanks for your videos, I wish you continued reviewing more stuff! Cheers!

[@SiddharthNilakantan]

well done! Looking forward to my HD6xx now!

[@gm3451]

Me too ! Does yours ship in July as well ?

[@dnalekaw4699]

Same, although mine ships in March.

[@SiddharthNilakantan]

Mine is estimated to ship in late March

[@orbea1951]

Great review. I listened again to Tyll's review of the same three headphones to compare, and your review is better, although the conclusions are remarkably similar. That was of course before he discovered "the world best headphones" .. yeah. I bought HD600 three years ago, loved them. After a couple of months of listening to HD600 I auditioned HD650 in a store and I felt like having hot flashes, which would not be unusual at my age. But after buying HD800S I did not see any reason to keep HD600, exchanged them for HE500. But for anyone starting in the hobby HD600 is just must have.

[@metal571]

+orbea1951 I still have my HD 600 because so far it is overall the best headphone I've found in its price range. It is, and will for some time be, the absolute standard to which I compare all other open back headphones under 400 dollars.

[@markkirschenmann3925]

Thank you for your very thoughtful review. I'm a longtime user and fan of my HD 580s, but they're getting on about 20 years old. I'm wondering if anyone here has a preference--600, 650 or 660--for analytical listening. I'm looking to use them for tracking, mixing and mastering. If the cost differences between them isn't an issue...

[@metal571]

They're pretty much the same sound profile with minor differences so not really any reason to switch if you like yours

[@taiefmiah]

don't go for a 650 OEM cable. VE has 650 quarter inch and xlr cables for $20 each

[@loen6478]

Who is VE?

[@coffee-vz1nr]

@@loen6478 venture electronic. Search for veclan cables.

[@godders7594]

Another excellent review

[@bigyeetus2866]

Jesus christ do we have the same ears? That upper mids EQ worked wonders for the 650, was wondering why some songs have a "harsh" and "screechy" quality because their treble is so relaxed.

[@metal571]

Yep lol

[@davejonze]

Great Review! I have the 600&598 they're such a great duo for listening. I find myself grabbing the 598 for amped music and the 600 for my tube amp @6db

[@manueljenkin95]

You dont find the hd598 grainy in low treble and lacking in low bass thump (Midbass is pretty strong though)? The low treble grain is bugging me with fast paced alt.rock and those stuff.

[@davejonze]

I really haven't found any negatives about the 598, the low frequencies can be taxing after a while. I use them with a e17k with 5th gen iPod with lod listening to all types of genres of music mostly metal though. Sound stage is very impressive and they're a fun/quick pair of headphones for the 💰

[@metal571]

Indeed the 598 has grain throughout and is hugely missing the sub bass region. But that's compared to the HD 600 which isn't too fair a comparison. For 150 the 598 is still a solid value and it can be equalized to a good degree to partially fix some of its issues.

[@manueljenkin95]

metal571 can you share your equalization present (yes I know how to eq) for hd598 and Amping requirements for the equalization? I don't have a dedicated amp and just power them by my surface book, in general I use them at 65% to 85% volume. I indeed love them for chillstep/classic rock and other stuff and I surprisingly found their bass enough for my needs (it never kicks, slams or thumps though but it is warm enough) but for any aggressive or fast music I found them too grainy and also their imaging isn't the best around (I wish for better transitions from left to right sound in certain music and also especially the prescence of a better center channel would be welcome).

[@metal571]

The soundstage is actually slightly wider than the 600. Also I did put an EQ for the modded 558 in the description of my 558 598 Cs and 600 comparison video. But you will probably need additional power if your volume is already that high to be able to boost the bass enough.

[@jeroenfigee]

Found one for 125! That is a HD 580 :-) It sounds great and it is really 1:1 with my 2031a's Really glad I bought these cans. Thank you for making this video, it definitely helped with deciding this purchase. :-)

[@gokussj9080]

I bought hd599 on Amazon for like 110$

[@andrewcole7149]

@@gokussj9080 599 is a lower line than the 580>600>650 line. Still good phones though.

[@gokussj9080]

@@andrewcole7149 I doubt it's lower than the 580's

[@ralphfurley123]

Great review!!! I’m just getting into hi-fi headphones and this video gave a great deal of info that will help guide me to my first headphones!!! Thanks for sharing your thoughts!!! Just subscribed!!! ☮️🖖🏽

[@jeffreylin6714]

Hey man, just wanted to compliment you for including EQ settings in the description of all your reviews. They're a great help to those of us who love to use EQ! I wanted to ask: how much can you increase the bass on the HD650 before the total harmonic distortion starts to become a problem? Do you feel it starts to get out of control with the settings you provided? Or to your ears, is the distortion not that bad using +6.5 dB Q 0.8 @ 20Hz and +1.5dB Q 0.8 @ 40Hz? Thanks again for making these awesome reviews!

[@metal571]

Thanks, and honestly I'd say it's more to do with what volume you're listening at, as that's what ultimately causes THD to become apparent. If you're listening quieter then sub bass boosts won't bleed as much as a louder listener, where you'll start to hear the bass bleed way sooner. I wish it was that simple, but the answer is...it depends.

[@noth606]

I found a HD580 for 50eur, and ordered HD650 earcup pads, HD600 headband pad and HD650 cable for them. The new stuff cost a fair bit more than the headphones themselves but I have wanted something really good for years so I guess it's worth it.

[@metal571]

That's a really good approach. Some people actually prefer the 580 over the 600 and 650 now

[@noth606]

metal571 thanks for replying, it seems many swap the grills as well but I think I want to try the originals first and I couldn’t find the HD600 grills in stock anywhere. The pads on my HD580 are just flat and the foam part inner is missing, the cable works but it doesn’t seem very sturdy and some say there is some improvement in the sound with the newer cable type, that’s why I ended up ordering all that stuff in one go. They are otherwise in good condition and sound good and very detailed. But why would people prefer the HD580 over the HD600? I thought they are quite similar?

[@metal571]

Some people have reported their 580 had no midbass hump at all unlike 600, but also has less shouty mids like the 650 at the same time. Some kind of utopia for ultra elite audiophile Sennheiser fans or something. Cable won't do anything different but stock 580 cable is built very poorly so I'd recommend the 650 cable at least. New pads are an absolute must. Old pads significantly change the sound, make it much warmer when they are flat.

[@thetruth34o9]

My HD6xx's sound amazing with your 650 EQ. Fuck. Edit: Just like my DT1990s do with your EQ, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised. Favorite audio reviewer on youtube, keep it up man.

[@motap001]

Good 😊 job as usual.

[@BradSevy7]

"Am I Zeos today?" Hahaha!

[@TheIgnoramus]

Just bought my first 650 pair, havnt splurged in a decade. Going to pair with SonarWorks and see if that sub bass ends up being a mess or using them as is.

[@jcrazyblue4u]

Love your unbiased review.. quick question could you give any recommendations for dac/ amp combos for these? What about dap/portable amp combos?

[@metal571]

+jcrazyblue4u honestly not big on amps. I just use a Modi 1 and Magni 2.

[@proffessasvids]

I'm pretty sure the hd580 precision has the oldest drivers onboard. The hd580 jubilee were the prototype 600's effectively. The 580 jubilee had the same drivers in them as the 600. Xx

[@metal571]

And Grell recently confirmed at a CanJam lecture that there were multiple acoustic dampening materials used, the first batch of 580 using a black one and made in Germany from 93-95

[@proffessasvids]

@@metal571 yeah man. Secret sauce xx

[@proffessasvids]

I'll have to check my brothers 580's. They're in need of a re-pad and a deep clean. Xx

[@kentxx12]

I love your slapp at you mic whit your fingers,and my super deep sub get my whole apartment to rumbel like it is a earthquake,now is all my fine glass shattered and many of my fine art objects destroyed....But Wow that bass in that mic.....

[@metal571]

I'm glad

[@usp40guy5]

great perspective on the HD650. If I could improve on thing it would be the way it resolves detail in upper mid (>3K), not make it brighter, just more transparent and quicker.

[@metal571]

+USP40guy I sort of found that the upper mids sound grainier than they actually are because they are a bit more forward than perhaps they should be. So after some equalization they are smooth and detail is easier to hear. Just my experience

[@usp40guy5]

what some people call the veil, seem to me to be a lack of 3-10K transparency, speed, and sparkle that would make this more realistic to the original recording. I am using the OPPO BDP-105 built-in headphone amp, which just is pure gain straight from the DAC - nothing artificial added. I've never had the HD600 so I can't compare bass end. I agree with you that it tries to extend the bass region so it doesn't sound as lacking as say the Grado 325e does. I'm satisfied with the HD650 and it's ability to sound musical and the soundstaging and imaging more than make up for the small deficiencies it has (what system doesn't have compromises right?). But the comfort has been a work in progress with the out-of-the-box clamping force.

[@metal571]

+USP40guy yeah you can leave it over a stack of books if you want to stretch it out. My HD 600 stretched just from wearing it so much but the process can be accelerated. Just be careful not to stretch too far as the headband plastic is known to crack

[@raaph]

THANK YOU FOR THIS VIDEO

[@ExtremelyTastyBread]

Ordered a magni+modi stack and the 6XX, which I've been told is a reskinned 650. Looking forward to it, but there's been tons of threads of folks who don't like the 6XX for some reason. Perhaps if I don't like them I might return and try the 600? We'll see

[@rickymolina7390]

Thank you for your videos. I just picked up a pair of Sennheiser HD650s and I'm not happy about the high mids and the high end. I appreciate the soundstaging very much but I find them to be a bit "veiled." The high end of the gtr picks across steel strings ain't coming through for some reason. I'm a composer/songwriter and I just need a fairly neutral pair of open-backs for my demos and was wondering if you could steer me in the right direction. My budget is currently up to $450 (closer to $400 preferably). Seems as though the Senn HD 700 is getting mixed to favorable reviews, and I like what I'm hearing about the Shure SRH 1840s and the Grado PS 1000es. Would you or someone reading this with some experience with some of the cans I just mentioned be able to make any recommendations? Thanks so much.

[@metal571]

HD 700 is terrible. Huge 7k peak. 1840 has massive harmonic distortion. Grados also are very poor on a technical level. I'm not sure where you are reading all of these reviews but you've found the right channel for unbiased reviews now. If you want something brighter than the 650 but not excessive and with very good timbre in the mids then you want a DT880 instead.

[@vikewave]

Lower 3,5 kHz if electric guitars sound too harsh👍

[@zerooneonetwothree1872]

The 580 was $350 in 1993 and $380 in 1994 $380 in 1994 is worth $714.88 today D: The fact you can get them used for 100$, like i did on local ad is nuts, but new hd58x for $190 right now is great for beginner studio mixing

[@robertcuthill8484]

I should have paid way more attention to your review. I got the 650's yesterday and Yes the highs are "darker" as you said. I'm really disappointed. The cymbals are missing the clean tick when the stick hits the brass (Leonid and Friends- Chicago cover band) and acoustic guitar is missing the brightness of the pick crossing the strings as can be heard in (Seal's- Crazy (acoustic). In my cheepo JVC's it sounds like the guitar is actually being played live in front of me. In the 650's that live presents is lacking. According to your review it sounds like I should of went with the 600's. Are they quite a bit brighter? That's definitely what I'm missing. I'm going to try to return these 650's. Thanks Rob

[@metal571]

+robert cuthill definitely the 600 has a much more present air region. So does the 660S. Told ya :P

[@robertcuthill8484]

Thanks I'm going to try for an exchange. Your review is spot on!

[@nykzolot]

Hey man, thanks for the great review! Your reviews are always very analytical and definitely one of my favorites. What do you consider to be a worthy upgrade option to replace HD 650 within 500k USD price range and with more or less similar sound signature?

[@metal571]

Noticeable upgrades to the 650 IMO come at or around the $1000+ mark. I would stick with it, unless you are looking for more of a sidegrade or something with a different signature. TH-X00 comes to mind

[@nykzolot]

What about cans like AKG 712? Can those be compared to HD 650? Also, can we expect Beyer DT 1990 review? Hopefully those are at least decent, some folks praised them quite highly.

[@metal571]

Yeah 712 is very good, I have one now for review and that is coming soon. I have a bunch of exciting stuff from Lumoid I'm doing first like the Audeze LCD-3, Momentum M2, and Audeze SINE before I will get a chance to review the 1990. But I'd stay away from the Tesla drivers in general. The 712 is still on the brighter side but it has the same seductive mids of the other AKGs and more filled in and very fast bass. Once you pull the treble down and keep the unique mids it's an awesome flavor can. I wouldn't even wait for my review of the 712. If I were you, I'd just buy one on Amazon and give it a shot

[@Justfillintheblank]

500K USD? I think you could buy every headphone in existence with that sort of money.

[@harvdaguy]

I think 650 has a tad wider soundstage, but very close to 600. 580 slightly smaller. And I think you should change your amps for those albeit Schitt basic not bad...

[@simonjensen5175]

Hey metal571. Found your channel recently, and you are a brilliant reviewer, with a style i enjoy and to the point. I wanted to ask about the 650's if you reccomended to have an amp with them, or directly to audio interface, or directly to a device? I dont own an amp, but i saw a good deal for 650's, thanks!

[@dannybos7024]

Get an amp, only then they'll sound their best.

[@jimguo7633]

07:00 sound

[@bulcano1000]

have you thought about reviewing bookshelf speakers? and other audio components

[@metal571]

I don't have as much experience and no room treatments for speakers. Amps I'm not good at telling apart yet either.

[@alrasekhoon1]

Hi metal571. Is it worth it to own them all 3 hd600, hd650 and hd660's. I have the hd600 but thinking about buying the rest of the 6 line, greetz from holland !

[@MrMakatech]

Question about EQ, I'm a newbie in this area (hifi headphones, dac/amps etc). What's the reason lowering preamp so much in your HD650 presets? Is it to increase headroom, prevent peaking and avoiding distortion while boosting? Your presets sound great by the way, I have been trying this setting and the one from your github section. Installing Equalizer APO & Peace today, working fine. I find Peace more user friendly comparing to REW. One issue though: When setting up Tidal in exclusive mode and forced volume for rending MQA/master files then my Equalizer APO & Peace settings won't work (because of exclusive mode). ;-) It works through Roon but I assume they have a different implementation (EQ integrated in their software).

[@metal571]

It's to prevent compression. I use boosts in my EQs, so you have to compensate with negative preamp. Look at the resulting graph in Peace with the preamp added. Nothing should go above the 0 dB line. And yeah EqualizerAPO only works on the windows audio stack. It won't work with ASIO or WASAPI. But yes the settings should be exactly the same manually entered into Roon or JRiver

[@MrMakatech]

@@metal571 Ah, the "Add pre amplifying" box in the graph window, very useful, I see it now. Preventing compression, ok and distortion is a consequence of compression I assume? Looks like headroom in the amp is even more important when doing some serious EQing, at least when boosting and lowering the preamp value.

[@metal571]

Indeed that is true, you cannot make an amp provide more power than it can provide. It can only give you so much bass so effectively you have to reduce other frequencies relative to the bass and turn it up in order to create a bass boost for example

[@brydon10]

HD 650 treble is a bit too dark for me but I want to give it another try, some more time to get used to it.

[@vm6038]

I highly recommend giving Beyerdynamic DT150 a try if you haven't heard them yet. I've owned and auditioned lots of headphones over the years and, overall, DT150 is likely the best sounding closed back headphone I've heard so far, but not just for a closed back - it is also, in my opinion, fully competitive with the HD6** in sound quality. The DT150 is a total opposite of the DT770/880/990 line in sound signature - there's much more midrange and a lot less treble presence on the DT150. Actually, I find DT150 slightly laid back in the highs, which is certainly very unusual for a Beyer headphone. I am definitely not a fan of the modern DT7/8/900 line due to their V-shaped sound, but love DT150. I do own both HD600 (the latest, sliver screen version) and DT150. The Senns sound more analytical, more airy and neutral. The Beyers sound closer to HD650 - more musical/fun to my ears with some mid bass emphasis and slightly softer highs. In terms of sound quality though, it's a close call, but I think DT150 actually sounds cleaner with even less grain than the already almost grain-free HD600... I am using a Fiio X5 and Objective 2 amp as my main source BTW.

[@metal571]

Tyll has said some very good stuff about the DT150 as well so this wouldn't surprise me. Thanks for the reminder

[@vm6038]

I am also a fan of Innerfidelity. :) Love Tyll's reviews. I am hoping he'll eventually review the DT150 and that it will be a positive review. This headphone is highly underrated IMO in the audiophile community and no average consumer would ever buy one due to its looks. lol Unfortunately, it appears that Beyer has quality control issues with the DT150. I've read several reports of units having audible channel imbalance. So beware of that.

[@CT37BN]

Am I Zeos today?.. Hah ha ha.. tops! Honestly bought HD650 cables for my HD600 immediately because I felt the crap cables on the HD600 would break both the headphone housing or the cable would just snap plus the fact they are infuriatingly hard to pull/push in their connectors. You think the HD650 is more comparable to Audio Technica R70x ( than with HD600 ) since they have more bass?

[@metal571]

Yeah I'd say so. But the R70x just isn't as clean and realistic sounding. I reviewed those previously and basically said the same thing

[@akshaylaxmipathi2932]

Good to see you back at reviewing quality headphones dude :) I see that you've changed your EQ settings for the HD 600 Would it be good for the HD 598 as well?

[@metal571]

+Akshay Laxmipathi the 558 settings I posted in the 598 Cs 558 600 group review video will work better. They aren't quite the same

[@akshaylaxmipathi2932]

Thanks a bunch man :)

[@charliebrown3082]

I looked at tylls measurements and explanation of the se-a1000, and he said they should be "shrill" and "bassless". I love these headphones they are bassy and sometimes, downright muffled, the absolute last thing the se-a1000s are are "shrill". He should have accually listened to them. they are fun, fun, fun but you might find they are loose in the bass and lacking detail but I don't have you're expertise.

[@metal571]

+charlie brown yeah that looks way harsh at 4k and has no sub bass at all. Rarely do the measurements lie, especially when they are that far off.

[@charliebrown3082]

metal571 the measurements are that far off. zeos review is quite accurate.

[@newsigmundfreud3023]

For this clear review and comparison. What would you say about the Beyerdynamic DT 1990 Pro (compared to the Sennheiser HD650) ??

[@bobcorn69]

Just ordered my 600 for 170... I think I could have offered 140 and the seller would still have taken it.

[@1dir951]

Looking at the online available frequency response graphs I question headphone reviews comparing sound quality. The individual frequency response curves vary so much that all sound quality descriptions can only be taken as "Purely" subjective and reviewer personal preference based. I haven't seen any headphone reviews where all headphones were calibrated for +/- 1 db of flat. So, any opinion is a purely subjective indication of personal preferences and would be invalid for any kind of neutral and unbiased recommendation.

[@rabantao36]

Can you make a review of the new HD660S? Great review btw!

[@metal571]

+Romuluos Abantao it's the next one coming up

[@turbomustang84]

Actually the 580 jubilee had the 600 metal grill which predates the 600s by a couple year's

[@metal571]

I know that, so must have made a dumb error if I said something different

[@TrainSimTube]

How does the 650 compare to a DT770 pro you're wearing?

[@Little_Bitz]

In a word..or a few... they do not.

[@turbomustang84]

I had the 600s and hated them then I heard the 650s and sold the 600s and now have ordered 650s . But not everyones hearing is the same . I'm amazed some prefer the 600s the lack of Bass really bothered me with the 600

[@brettdillon9554]

I have a Sennheiser momentum wireless black headphones and I got a geiger and an EMF detector and a radio frequency detector and I realized that there's more radiation coming out of my headphones than there is coming out of my microwave and my TV and all of my routers in my house.

[@hereticyes1380]

Got hd580 for 120$, waiting for them now :3

[@pbneeks]

Metal571 I went with your recommendation and got the hd650 and i absolutely love them! But as you know this hobby can get someone addicting and I really wanted to hear the sound signature of the HD600 cause mostly everyone prefers them to the hd650. And have to say this is too close to call for my ears. They are both excellent, I guess it may depend on what music your listening to. Do you think its worth it to keep both or do you think if I EQ the 650 I will be able to replicate the sound of the 600? What are your thoughts? And also what do you use to EQ? Do you have a program or an actual physical setup?

[@metal571]

They are very similar but the 650 has superior bass extension that can be equalized better. See my EqualizerAPO video for how I equalize

[@msd5808]

Would like to know why headphone pads cost so much. I would think they are the price of a pair of socks.

[@combojohn7953]

Great review! I want to find the best headphone for vocals, mids. What do you think? Which is the best? Hd650, Lcd2/3 fazor, prefazor, Monolith 1060c open mod, Argon mk3? Do you have any suggestion? Please?🙂

[@metal571]

I use the LCD2F personally to this day, with EQ

[@combojohn7953]

@@metal571 Thank you!🤗

[@Ilost11]

It's funny that you didn't find the darker HD650 to be inferior to the HD600 given that you're generally a fan of a couple treble heavier headphones. I personally found the difference between the HD600 and HD650 night and day so much so that I immediately sold my HD650s when I heard it and traded them for HD600s. The mid-bass hump makes the headphone sound bloated and slow while the recessed treble seems to remove detail.

[@metal571]

+Jeclub Bob like I said in the review some people can totally interpret it that way. In the end I actually am selling off my 650s since the 600 after the pad change has so much more clarity to the highs as you probably also experienced. But I can see a lot of people liking the 650s since they are easier to listen to in some respects and have better bass extension, midbass hump notwithstanding.

[@alexejnemov]

Wonder how hes going to feel about the 560S...

[@rickymolina7390]

Thank you for your reply. OK, based on your review (and Josh Valour's) then it looks like i'll have to stretch a little and get the BeyerDynamic DT1990. Can I use my Apollo Twin interface to power them? As far as the other reviews for the other headphones mentioned, they were from DMS, The Nitpicker, Mitch Michele and 1 Review A Day just so you know.

[@metal571]

The DT880 is actually quite a bit less grainy in the treble than the 1990 but the bass extension isn't nearly as good. But apparently only ishca and I believe that. Both headphones are much brighter than the Sennheisers. Interfaces don't often give useful specifications on power output in mW for a given impedance load so I can't tell you at all if it'll be able to power any of these

[@rickymolina7390]

@@metal571 Thank you again for your help. FYI, I'm giving you a thumbs up in my upcoming KZbin video which talks about my hunt for a quality open-back pair of headphones for my home recording studio and how we have to be careful who we get info from about audiophile products.

[@metal571]

Seriously true. There are way too many audiophile "lifestyle" sites and basic tech sites that don't tell you anything about the sound or just give things positive reviews because they are expensive.

[@arefinkhandaker4370]

listening to this review in my sennheiser hd 650

[@metal571]

still have mine

[@Justfillintheblank]

@@metal571 Still replying to comments 4 years later! Legend.

[@joshski85]

So, if I was to get the DT770 for rock/metal and the 650's for everything else as my music taste goes from Enya to Strapping Young Lad, I would be covered? I have the 558's but they don't do it for me besides singer song writer stuff.

[@MrJhuang999]

What do you think of the HD58X? And in comparison to these?

[@samperez8924]

Hello there metal571! would you recommend the hd580 for around 160-180$ if you could find one? the HD58x and 6xx would be around 230 or more (total cost after Shipping/Tax) what would you say? Cheers!

[@TomasLomba]

Is the 30 dollar difference found nowadays between the 600 and 650 worth it? (HD600 goes for $290 and the HD650 for $320)

[@cruzzeaudiochanel2581]

Hi...please make a review about Monoprice Monolith M560, I really want to know your opinion...

[@ledalius]

Thanks for your videos! I play guitar on Line 6 Helix LT Guitar Multi-effects Processor with headphones. The output has 12 Ohm impedance and as manual says: "provides plenty of gain for high impedance headphones". Do you think it will run HD 600 with 300 Ohm properly?

[@metal571]

+Dalius Ališauskas no way to tell without real specs like actual power output given a certain impedance load. That's what actual headphone amps give you in their specs

[@jeffg2866]

+metal571 thanks for the review. HD 600 is $286 and 650 is $306 on Amazon. Is this a fair price point for these headphones?

[@metal571]

+Jeff G extremely

[@Xyrium]

I don't own any Senn's, but can't they (if they haven't) simply add a locking tab on the connectors so that way you can pull them out with less force, but simply requires you to push on the tab so that way inadvertant dislodging doesn't happen?

[@metal571]

I agree, I don't really understand why Senn hasn't changed that. They're still using the same housing design essentially since the mid 90s

[@TheMelonvilleFlyingCircus]

Tell me if I'm wrong, but isn't there a presumption that the song mixers produce consistently perfect mixes but you may be blaming the headphones rather than the mixer in the studio who mixes to his own taste?

[@metal571]

This is actually called the circle of confusion and it's part of the reason people have different tastes. Mixing in a studio sometimes has absolutely no goal to target audiophile quality end user equipment and sometimes it does.

[@jakev1341]

Not sure if you still view comments on old videos, How would you compare the HD 650 to the headset you were wearing in the video? The DT 770, correct?

[@metal571]

Not even related

[@DeathN0cturnal]

really also depends on the dac/amp you drive them with

[@grady7443]

Hi, I'm new to this so bare with me please. I listen to rock most of the time. Ozzie (no more tears), Led Zepplin, Aqualung, ect. I have pretty much narrowed my choice down to Senns 6oo, 650 or the BeyerDynamics 880pro. Have not heard any of them. What would be your recommendation? #1 pick, #2, pick as well. Thankyou in advance.

[@charlesjacques750]

grady jr consider the Fidelio X2's too as they are much easier to drive and guaranteed to be as good if not better in reviews.

[@metal571]

Grain-fi

[@williamtael8379]

I'm watching a lot of videos comparing 650 and 600, but I always come out even more confused than before. I have a HD58X and I love it in every way, but I'm curious about which one of those two (650 and 600) would be best for me as an upgrade. I like present but not too loud mids (so I can hear calm vocals like the singer was singing right on my ear, I know... that sounds gay as fuck, but no homo), bright but not piercing highs (like those moments on some Judas Priest songs where the guitars scream in high pitch), rolling/vibrating lows (that deep vibrating bass string that makes you feel the metal) and a wide soundstage that can make me feel like I'm on a show on a big warehouse with sound dampening walls.

[@mjscpr]

What did you decide on? Are you happy with your decision?

[@williamtael8379]

​@@mjscpr Money is very tight right now on Brazil and it seems that it's not worth it to buy a very expensive headphone (more than 3000 Reals in a country that minimum wage is about a thousand Reals) and then have to buy a very expensive DAC and AMP (a thousand Reals each). I rather buy two Yamaha HS8 monitors, which are WAY better than most headphones.

[@mjscpr]

@@williamtael8379 Interesting. I do have two HS8s, but my room treatment is lacking. Thus I prefer headphones. But you sure have a point.

[@williamtael8379]

​@@mjscpr Hey, that's awesome! Do you think I should really get the HS8s? Do they have that level of detail that everybody expects from something premium? Do they have scary-like loud volume to make me jump when playing a game like Dying Light 1 and epicness for when playing TES Oblivion soundtracks? Do you think there's a way to pair them with a Klipsch 12" sub-woofer? Would it sound cinema like?

[@mjscpr]

@@williamtael8379 I can't really answer your questions, sadly. The sound is really nice even at low volumes. I bought the large HS8 because I didn't want a sub woofer. My issue is, I use them to judge for example interview audio and since my room isn't treated well enough I sometimes can't tell if an issue is in my room or the recording. So to me they were an investment for the future, when I move to a different office with improved acoustics. To listen to music on (in my case rap, jazz) they are really, really nice. But as often described, they are also very neutral, so for entertainment there may be better speaker out there.

[@Yu-ej1cy]

I have been a fan of you youtube channel since I watched your AKG K240 DF review. Do you still own the HD 580 in the review and if so, would you be willing to sell it?

[@metal571]

The 580 was never mine. I use a 650 right now and don't plan to sell it

[@Yu-ej1cy]

@@metal571 Thanks for the quick reply. I was looking at ebay for quite sometime and failed to find one with a good price. Hope you can overcome the hiatus and continue with the youtube reviews.

[@metal571]

Yeah they've become rarer and more expensive having been out of production for something like 2 decades now

[@richardpenrose1968]

How do you find the sound stage and sound leakage of the HD650 compares to the Beyer DT880 pro?

[@MrGreaseweasel]

Hi. Could you help me? I´m trying to find good over-ear headphones. I listen mostly metal music pretty loud. I´ve tried Sennheiser hd 600 and 660s and don´t like the mids either (too forward and shouty). Also tried Audio technicas ath- m40x and m50x (I prefer open back) and the cups was too small for my ears. Also tried beyerdynamics dt 770 880 990, they were too bright and harsh on the treble. i have and old amp sony str-d515 Tone controls BASS; ±8 dB at 100 Hz TREBLE; ±8 dB at 10 kHz and LOW BOOST+10 dB at 70 Hz. Could you suggest any headphones let´s say under 600€? I currently have Philips fidelio x2´s, I like the bass and the mids (not forward), but the treble is too sibilance and not very detailed. I used to have cheap Philips SHP-895 which i liked the most so far.

[@charlesjacques750]

Ok so let's throw in the easier to drive Fidelio X2's, consider the Mass Drop HD 6XX ($199) would you still prefer the HD 600? Would EQ or a more powerful digital Shiit Jotunheim or Dark Voice tube amp matter to your pic?

[@metal571]

+Charles Jacques still would take the 6XX

[@charlesjacques750]

metal571 Thanks! I just ordered the HD 6XX to add to the X2 and my vintage ('73) Koss Pro 4AA. Should I get a top digital amp before going to a tube? Any suggestions for a high end quality amp?

[@deadandburied7626]

600 good for intimate experience and female vocalists.

[@medwatt]

Did you get a new camera or you adjusted the lightning somehow (I don't see any yellow tinge) ?

[@metal571]

Added more lighting overhead recently which allowed elimination of the background lamp as well that was disgustingly blowing out highlights. There's still a washing out that occurs with my current video editing software and capture, which will be fixed in the next review. Also these are not uploaded in a KZbin friendly format which I am fixing with new video editing software so processing will take less time and the video quality will be closer to what comes out of the C920.

[@chipsaunders154]

Hi metal. I hate to admit I don't know a lot about headphones. I have a vintage Koss Pro 4aaa set and I just purchased some Sony 7506s but as "clean " sounding as they both appear, neither give me the soundstage or imaging I'd hope to hear especially when compared to good speakers. Am I expecting too much from them...or from any phone? And as much as I looked for it, I didn't hear you say much about the imaging and soundstage of the Senn 650 in this review, though your other review focusing only on the Senn 600 made it sound like you preferred the 600 over the 650. And how would you compare the Beyer DT770s to either of the Senns? Thanks for any help you can provide.

[@metal571]

+Chip Saunders that's because those headphones you own actually don't have very good soundstage width. The 600 and 650 are very similar in soundstage, more 3 blob feeling in imaging and not a ton of width. But it's there. The DT880 have the most balanced soundstage combining good width with good imaging. The K702 which is the third major player here has awesome width but not very good imaging. The 770s have both good width and imaging like the 880 since it's basically the same driver. They're very v shaped though.

[@chipsaunders154]

Wow, that was a quick response, metal571. Thanks. But I'm still stumped as to which phone would suit me best. I have a vintage high wattage receiver and an equalizer. I would use the phones only for music.....from rock to country, blues and classical. So which of these phones would you choose for musical quality, soundstage, and imaging in their price range? Do you have an A,B, and C choice?

[@metal571]

That's a tough question. The DT880 600 ohm is the most detailed, but it has a sibilant edge to it so may be a little sterile sounding with some brighter recordings. It has extremely good detail retrieval, even moreso than the HD 650 which is usually my recommendation for most genres and most people. The 650 does not quite possess the same speed but it does have an extremely flat sound with just a slight midrange bump and the sub bass is somewhat rolled off. It's so hard for me to recommend just one, especially if you have an equalizer to play with. If you have the cash I'd buy a K702, DT880 600 ohm premium, AND an HD 650, then return the two you don't like as much

[@7stringguitarplayer]

@metal571 can you eq a 6xx to sound just like the 600?

[@ΗΗΗΗΗΗ0000]

Hey Metal If you are still reading youtube comments I’m quite new to the game and Would love to hear your thoughts on HD650 vs Dt1990 Pro which one you like more?

[@metal571]

Can't stand the very aggressively sibilant DT 1990, and still own a 650 for myself

[@ΗΗΗΗΗΗ0000]

@@metal571 Hey thanks for the reply man , just watched your 660s review 3 times in a row and still cant decide which one should I go with 650 or 660s for audio editing would love to know your thoughts thanks

[@metal571]

@@ΗΗΗΗΗΗ0000 if you have an amp, 650, otherwise 660S is more likely to get loud enough without one. Sundara is better than both imo but also requires an amp