Shin Megami Tensei 5 | True Ending Discussion

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Do you think SMT V is a direct sequel to Nocturne?

[@sethh259]

No

[@obi-wankenobi4337]

Yes

[@goingalloutcuz]

yes it is the true ending of smt5 all but comfirms that lucifer was successful in kiilling the creator god

[@Benjamin-ml7sv]

No, it wouldn't even make sense story-wise.

[@obi-wankenobi4337]

@@Benjamin-ml7sv how does it not? It actually makes a lot of sense story wise. God is killed by Lucifer The mention of the conception 18 years ago The mention that the archangels served Baal

[@VenraeLOL]

So below is my thoughts - I could be wrong SMT 5 is definitely a sequel to SMT3N. Talking with various NPCs, they mention the events of the conception and the battle of Reasons from Nocturne. As far as the timeline, the fake Tokyo was created by the creator before being attacked. It was Lucifer and the Demi Fiend killing the creator that caused the fake Tokyo to fade away. As far as Lucifer's plan, I don't think it was anything nebulous - he genuinely wanted to break the Mandala Cycle. Keep in mind that in Christian belief, Lucifer was an archangel of God before he challenged God and fell. Atlas gives this a nod through the design of Lucifer's true form (its more along the design of the angels in the game).

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Great points laid out here. I really love that you point out how Lucifer’s true form is shown at the end. Makes a lot of sense, thanks for sharing!

[@M.G.F427]

What are the dialogues that mention the battle of reasons?

[@matmil5]

Persona 5 is referenced in SMT V and there we see satanael, whose in game description is satan before he fell, so... That theme is possibly reptoduced here

[@azureaether1661]

Oh its absolutely a Nocturne sequel. Theres so many hints its impossible to deny. People who start with V arent really alienated but if youve played Nocturne you'll notice it easily Also with the Goko creation thing- I believe hes referring to the actual throne of creation with previous creator gods like Baal before YHVH took the throne, which is separate to the Conception cycles in Nocturne.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

That’s a great point on Goko. Thanks for sharing!

[@LegoSensei]

I kinda hope we get a smt5 apocalypse that makes this game a direct sequel to 3 and fixes the characters and overall story

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Samehere, would be freaking incredible.

[@generalmclovin7104]

I think it would be cool if it added a a demon assassin ranking side quest. The quest consisting of you fighting 10 assassins to prove to the strongest. The assassins would be a mixture of humans and demons, with the final assassin being Travis touchdown from No More Heroes.

[@rouge-ish324]

A hilarious headcanon I thought up was that SMT5 true ending leads to another Persona game

[@theickystickie]

Oh buddy do I have some news for you lol

[@sunambassador]

vengeance

[@SEGAblocks]

I love how deep the backstory is! Even though there’s such a motley assortment of characters and baddies, the demons are pretty accurate and true to real life lore! Just incredible! This is a lot darker that some may think. I love it!

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

It's really wild man and definitely a departure from the norm in JRPGs. I'm a big fan!

[@Darklink205]

I was looking for something that discusses the endings rather than just how to get them. My thoughts on the “true” ending tho. It does seem vicious in a sense. But on the other hand. Contextually it feels more tired. Yakumo is an unrepentant demon hater. But he’s also resigned himself to dying in the process. We have no idea why exactly he thinks that, but he does. Best guess is that he assumes succeeding is impossible but living in a world of constant recreation and destruction to be a plaything of “higher beings” isn’t his bag. I don’t think the demons died actually died. I think they just can’t access that world. We know there’s a multiverse deal going on in SMT, and my theory is separating that world from the mandala system just locks them out of it. Not kills them. Otherwise I don’t think Nuwa would be willing to help him. Best reasoning is that she loves humanity and sees the way that demons and gods cause humanity to suffer or give up hope to put faith in things they feel are above them. It’s probably why she likes yakumo, as far as the game is concerned he is the most human human to human in the human world and she respects and even loves that and wants that to be a viable option for everyone. Not just everyone who happens to have the will to fight gods and demons. As for the actual ending itself. I think it has an interesting caveat. You save everyone, you bring the world back without any gods or demons to fight over it. You even recreate yourself untouched by the trauma of what was literally a child thrust into a war for the sake of creation itself. The new you gets to go to school hang out with friends and live their life. But you don’t. The you that recreated the world still exists. And I think that’s what Lucifer’s warning is about. The cycle will stay broken and the demons and gods will not be present in the world. But only if the trauma filled god you can stay out of their own life. Seems like the flashbacks imply that all of that is still there in god you. And if you ever “replace” new you, then a god would be “present” on the world of humans and wire the world back into the mandala starting the war over again. Basically you built a world where every human got to live freely. The cost being your own freedom to live as a human in the process. So it makes sense it’s a sequel to 3. It mirrors the sacrifice of the true ending in 3, giving up your humanity entirely to achieve a specific impossible goal.

[@mauritao]

I like to beilieve Demi-fiend showed to nahobino as a way to tell him he's not alone...ofen in smt when the great will is defeated the winner gets its power and knowlege , and since demi-fiend was created to beat the great will of his universe he would have become a true god reflected by his golden coloured eyes, as a natural god as all nahobinos his eyes are golden as well ... now getting to the point, the lucifers version of smt3 couldnt beat the great will by himself and assuming that he died in the battle(matters not cuz DF won) demifiend would be again walking in the amala network ,until he finds some1 walking in a path similar to his and after testing his will trhu the menoras challenge he knew nahobino would end up like him , a lonely god and as we can see in the true ending there are 2 mc's , 1 that will live a live in this new world without demons and the one who became a god watching from the bench...but one important things is ... he dont need to be alone cuz DF is also there... another evidence to that is that nahobino never killed demifiend and as pixie said ...we will be waiting here...that explains why demifiend never went full on the battle, it was a test , and we dont need to theorize about his capability of just killing nahobino because in the battle itself he offenly kills eiter nahobino or his partners with caotic will and even all of them with the gaia rage at any given point, also even right after the battle demifiend stay there ON HIS FEET meaning that the whole battle wasnt enough to bring him to his knees ... conclusion : all demifiend wanted was to support a fellow mesiah!

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Love this take, thanks for sharing. Demi fiend is so hardcore. It is hilarious he just barely breaks a sweat in the fight.

[@zeldagamlink2855]

It is no longer the great will but the descendant of Mardok: Bull God. Demi-Fiend never beat Great Will but Kagutsuhi. At the time people said that Kagutsuhi and Yhvh were a part of Great Will but obviously not because when you play Smt 5 and especially Smt 5 vengeance which repairs the lore caused by bad translations because yes the original game was poorly translated. We realize that neither Yhvh, nor the order of the seraphim which is strangely dissociated from Yhvh. Whereas normally according to the divine writings (Torrah, Bible, Koran) they were created by the creator. But hey it's the random inspirations of Smt. In short, all this to say that no entity in this game knows The Great Will who is the true creator in this game or the true God. No one can beat him because he is the creator of the Megaten multiverse. No creator = No multiverse = No life = No SMT/Persona. Find out

[@mauritao]

@@zeldagamlink2855 in smt last bible thegreatwill was defeated and replaced … also kagutsuchi mentions the great will…yhwh is not the great will hes just another version of kagutsuchi . I get it that vengeance helps its lore a lot and I personally love it, but smt lore go way beyond what vengeance can offer

[@zeldagamlink2855]

@@mauritao You are wrong because Last Bible 1st is a spin off and you know the reputation of spin offs regarding the canonicity of the series. The great will cannot be defeated by anyone it is the creator of the multiverses of all things. A concept that we know well in various monotheistic beliefs. No metaphysics representation just an infinite mind, we cannot associate it, no thing can equal it, no thing can define it. Among other things, the true conception of what GOD is. SMT just made a separatist vision inspired by Gnosticism which was brought by the Templars and who were deposed, beaten and fired by Jesus (Peace be upon him). In short, a very wrong vision, you will understand. The fact remains that among all the blasphemous things we saw on SMT (representation, demonization of Yhvh) they preserved the true creator. What they call The Axiom and I invite you to do some research, you will see that it is not possible to defeat it because it has no metaphysical form just a large cluster of light (infinite I imagine) endowed of course with infinite consciousness. Finally you talked about SMT last bible. So you need to know that “The great reason” and “universal will” or also called “unconscious universal”. In addition, this character explains that he is happy to have beaten someone like you but he does not die. I do not believe that it is part of the consciousness of "Great reason" just like Yhvh yet in religious writings Yhvh is a name given to CREATORS. One thing is certain SMT is very difficult to understand SMT 5 OG had made big translation errors with "The great reason" they corrected with vengeance but it's always complicated to understand after a first reading. In addition there are inconsistent elements for example we know that the game follows SMT 3 everything agrees 18 or 19 (I don't know) years after conception, the fall in time of Yhvh. They put Satan we don't even know why no line of dialogue. In short, it's very complicated

[@mauritao]

@@zeldagamlink2855 it's ratter simple...all universes exist's in the amala, the great will oversees it and it was defeated(maybe replaced) by the last bible dudes ... why to complicate a given awnser?

[@vitordaniel714]

I like to think about it the multiversal way, like, they take place on two separate Universes (that probably were once the same) that have alternate timelines of one another. In SMT3 Nocturne, Lucifer could not consume God's knowledge because of the Demi Fiend's existence, but in SMTV he did and that's when things get separated following each an isolated timeline. There are demons that have knowledge about what happened but none of them talk about the Demi-Fiend (if i remember well, not counting the DLC). Together with all that, the concept of the Nahobino and the Demi-Fiend being both creatures born from the fusion of humans with demons is the final conection. At the end it goes like this: SMT3 Nocturne: The timeline is the same, Demi-Fiend suddenly exists, Lucifer's plan goes downhill from there because the Demi-Fiend got too strong. SMTV: The timeline is the same, Lucifer probably knows about the risk of fusing a human with a demon, no Demi-Fiend, Lucifer did what he wanted, Lucifer gets depressed, Bethel creates an artificial "Demi-Fiend" called Proto-Fiend, the Proto-Fiend and the protagonist fuse to become the Nahobino, Lucifer begs for the Nahobino to kill him. I also like to think that SMT Strange Journey and SMT 4 take place on Universes that share alternate timelines of one another, with God in SMT 4 not being dead and deciding to bomb the entire world instead of letting the Schwarzwelt take place, the demonicas exist and the counter-demon force is basically the Schwarzwelt Joint Project to combat the demons.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I gotta admit this is a fantastic theory about what takes place as well. Really detailed and would be cool to get an official canon order of events. But I guess that'd remove any mystery around it. Thanks for sharing!

[@pigcatapult]

The SMT multiverse is a very emphasis-on-the-multi multiverse, imo. Lots of things between different games are "similar, but a little to the left" from each other. I think the world from SMT3N is basically dead, and SMTV is taking place in a different SMT world that uses Da'at and the Throne of Creation instead of a Vortex World and Kagutsuchi. Same Lucifer and Demi-fiend, but they're world-hopping

[@bloopertanooki415]

I personally think that IV and apocalypse happen in a timeline where Lucifer and Demi Fiend fail at killing God. And V in a timeline where they succeed.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

This is an awesome line of thinking. Really fascinating, thanks for sharing!

[@kwadarth]

Doesn't make that much sense since the conception already happened and all humans in tokyo were turned into mere souls as you can see in Nocturne. Also remember that god's punishment in IV has no corelation with the conception and it was at least stopped from exterminating tokyo thanks to the sacrifice of a guy in the counter-demon force which then reincarnated as flynn. In IV you can also see an alternate timeline in which tokyo was never salvaged and turned into a nuclear wasteland with humanity at the border of demise. Nocturne may be corelated to V in some way but it definitively isn't related to IV or IV Apocalypse.

[@M.G.F427]

I don't agree with the true ending, betray your allies and taking such extremist choice maybe worked but at what cost? Your friends (demons) died only because they were not human I don't think that makes the mc better than YHVH, at least in the normal neutral you don't kill all demons, instead mankind is together to fight the agents of chaos, the only bad thing that I find about these ending is the fact that there"ll be casualties.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Such a good point I don’t hear anyone talk about. It feels cold and vicious.

[@justabearbrowsingyoutube4968]

Never considered that, because at the true ending the Nahobino lives, and he only removed Demons from the world, not the universe. Who’s to say he can’t bring them back, or it could be they’re of another part of the universe now. That’s the great thing of how open-ended it is, we will never know what comes next, or aspects that were left out.

[@ixzaluoh8997]

@@justabearbrowsingyoutube4968 or could be like strange journey demons in the moon but not on earth

[@rouge-ish324]

What if instead of deleting all demons, it just separated them from humans, kinda like how in Persona they live on as parts of people

[@goldensycamore2097]

Something I never really see anybody mention online are the references of Baal being the previous creator. It is mentioned in the quest where you get the fusion unlock for Baal. This made me really think that Smt V is set in the Law ending of Smt 3 because there’s a quest towards the end of Ueno where you fight Gabriel, Uriel, and Raphael. The area where you fight them is literally the exact same area where you fight them in Smt 3.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

This is a brilliant point. Definitely something to think about. Thanks for pointing that out.

[@goldensycamore2097]

@@HallowedBeThyGame You’re welcome!

[@nachot6592]

It is. I played nocturne just before 5 and Lucifer himself explains how are many universes having their own creation cycle while using a picture similar to the background are the ending of 5. The voice actor for Lucifer is the same for both and the fiends in 5 basically keep confirming it throughout the game.

[@K_MO_13]

You have one of the best KZbin channel names! Well done

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Haha thanks!

[@vshojoiscringeasf.gooutand997]

Black Frost from the sidequest in V is the same Frost from Nocturne. That should help determining if this is a sequal.

[@darkhorse744]

Except that Block Frost is Hee-ho kun, who originated in SMT IF, so he's already been travelling the multiverse.

[@Xx_HD_xX]

They say in the story that the world ended 18 years ago from the time the game took place. What year was that? 2003. When did SMT3 come out & take place? 2003. Also Amaterasu even referred to it as the conception. So yeah, there's definitely a connection to SMT3 & it's pretty solid. My theory is that it takes place after the Freedom ending. The post apocalypse you run around in is the same one demifiend was running around in. As for why demifiend is still around, either he's from a different universe or he is from the same one as you but kept his memories & abilities & maybe became the true demon anyways based on what Lucifer said about "fighting your true adversary" in the freedom ending of smt3.

[@raikaria3090]

In 3; they were following YHVH's "reboot" system via Kagestushi basically. In VI, True Demon happens, with the "reboot" failed, then Lucifer+Demi Fiend kill YHVH [Demi-Fiend probobly died doing so; since he's DLC only and such] and the throne is now vacant; allowing Nahobino to appear again and YHVH's position to be usurped; instead of merely a reason being needed.

[@jackour8167]

"Demi-fiend probably died because he's DLC" Wtf kinda logic is that ☠️

[@raikaria3090]

@@jackour8167 Demi-Fiend only exists in some sort of special side thing, and isn't still around by Lucifer's side influencing the world. The only explanation of DF's absence, if 5 is a sequel to 3; is that he died.

[@jackour8167]

@@raikaria3090 That's still dumb and doesn't translate into what you're saying at all

[@ophidianmind333]

I do think SMT V is a direct sequel to Nocturne and I have a bit of a different take on it. Here is a comment I had left on another video regarding the Chaos ending of SMT V: "This is the only ending in the game that I like. The conflict that comes immediately is not something that will necessarily go on for eternity. The world created in this ending is one where the potential for things to get better exists, but it is up to those participating in it to make that potential manifest. Under God's world of an imposed artificial order, that order came at the price of the potential for growth for humans, demons, and gods. While the birth of the world of potential may seem messy, it also provides the opportunity for all beings to grow and become something better if they can find a way to reduce that conflict and learn to live with each other. Even if that chance isn't the greatest while gods are in conflict with one another, it is at least possible in this world while it was impossible within God's world. That potential all depends on whether gods, demons, and humans are willing to grow up. If they don't, then they don't deserve the potential that is possible for them to have. Why I think this is better than the "true neutral" ending is that this ending provides the opportunity for gods to be reunited with their Knowledge and that provides them with the resources to potentially have the perspective to guide humans and demons toward growth. Humans alone lack that information on the nature of reality and their growth would be much more slow as a result. This of course then puts the burden of the actualization of that potential upon the gods. If the Nahobino found a way to end the Mandala System, then that would at least reduce the incentive in one way in which gods compete with one another for power. Should the gods that desire progress unite against those who want to act like barbarian warlords, then the possibility for reaching that potential will greatly increase. They should ideally also learn what not to do from God's example and realize imposing an artificial order for the sake of order will also remove the potential for growth for all things and will require authoritarianism to uphold that order. So even if the chances for true growth seem small, at least they are a possibility in this ending. It would likely take a great deal of time for things to get better, but at least it remains as a possibility. After all, it was partially through the huge blow to the infrastructure upholding the order of the Middle Ages caused by the Black Plague that allowed for the innovations of the Renaissance to be possible and the process of revolution generally comes in the form of struggle. As Nietzsche said in Thus Spoke Zarathustra 'I say unto you: one must still have chaos in oneself to be able to give birth to a dancing star. I say unto you: you still have chaos in yourselves.' Lucifer seemed to understand this very well."

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

This is an extremely brilliant and eye opening look at the Chaos ending in SMT V. Genuinely a lot to think over and process here and I really thank you for sharing it. I'm gonna make my next play through of SMT V a chaos run again and look at it through this lens. Thanks a ton for sharing!

[@ophidianmind333]

@@HallowedBeThyGame I thought the hidden ending was one of the most bleak endings in the game. It involves the Nahobino essentially betraying his allies and committing genocide for a cause that will only delay the inevitable conflict that is to come and it will leave humans in a state of being ignorant of the nature of reality and weak with the inability to survive the conflict when it comes. Lucifer wanted to create a world of potential where all beings had the opportunity to grow and thrive. Because he was a demon and not a Nahobino, he couldn't create this world and instead he chose to sacrifice himself so his successor could do so. The Chaos ending is the start upon that path and it is unfortunate that it will not likely be considered a canon ending. In every other ending, the Nahobino makes a huge mistake that will not end well out of ignorance of the true nature of reality.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I had honestly never seen it that way but it makes a whole lot of sense. You have some fantastic and very valid points here. It really shows y our mastery of SMT V in particular!

[@epic_sans8229]

No. Nahobino’s so called friends are the ones who resorted to violence when they became a nahobino themselves in the Empyrean, what happens to them is basic consequence. The “genocide” nahobino does is actually severing the influence of all demons from the world and people’s lives. Since demons are manifestations of the thing they represent, they disappear because their role in the the world is gone; According to Yakamo, people shouldn’t allow their life to be dictated by demons. Thus, Nahobino gives humanity a second chance in living and controlling their own lives.

[@ophidianmind333]

@@epic_sans8229 Demons are a part of nature in SMT, killing them is genocide. The Nahobino makes a giant mistake because demons and gods from other worlds will inevitably discover his world and they won't be prepared to handle the situation and won't have any demons or gods who could assist them should these other demons and gods have imperialistic ambitions. He leaves an entire world weak and defenseless so those who live there will inevitably be slaughtered. Those are the basic consequences of his actions. Trying to make a world that is not in harmony with nature itself is doomed to fail, that was the same mistake that God made.

[@RpgBlasterRpg]

We need a sequel we did not even got to see SMT 4A Satan design in 3D

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

A sequel would rock so hard

[@danieldelarosatinal1813]

I don't think so, because on smt 3 they even explain there many multiple universe of different conception . Doesn't. Really connect but other earth in universe are going through the end of the world and chaos and. Law are fighting over it

[@dragonmaster613]

What does it for me is what Lucifer said in SMT3 and how that is shown when Aogami is first encountered to be what has occurred. Definitely going with Demi isn't from the same "universe" as Naho, but is prior to at the same time.

[@millsxi]

Yeah it’s totally a sequel to SMT3 but I can see a SMT 5 expansion like SMT 4 apocalypse happening since that’s how these games are nowadays and that could link everything more or debunk everything. Time will tell.

[@muthesquirrel]

I'd say it's all but confirmed it's a sequel to SMT3's True Demon ending. Although that doesn't make that ending more canon than the others. SMT games point out a few times that all possible choices are canon, and it all just happens over and over and over.... hence why there are so many creator gods. YHVH has been in charge for a while though. The only game that offered a real end to that was SMTIV's white ending, where you delete the whole universe. :p As for the Goko, he isn't talking abou the event 20 years ago, he's saying he has been waiting for a new creator since YHVH seized the throne and cast down the other gods. It all ties into his identity as Amitabha.

[@eddibonoit]

I think you are right cuz you even fight demi-fiend as a full demon

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Ok cool, didn’t know if anyone else thot the same 🤘

[@eddibonoit]

@@HallowedBeThyGame a good video idea would if the demi-fiend is a nahobino or maybe the caos hero from smt1.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

@@eddibonoit dang that’d be perfect. I’m hoping it we get more dlc or a part 2 from 5 it could expand on ideas like that.

[@souldragon9130]

Uhhh to be honest, im not too sure that TDE is the 'True Ending' as you put it.

[@texben123]

This is just my take on the SMT timeline / Multiverse: SMT1 (S1): SMT universe SMT Nine(S1) Which is in a virtual world, in the middle of the timeline.??? SMT 2(S1) pretty much to Messiah the new one, saves the entire world and earth gets blown up. SMT 3 :nocturne(S2) Law ending: leads to the persona series.(P1) persona universe. The neutral ending: could we to SMT 5??? The chaos ending: could also lead to SMT 5??? Strange journey(S3) which could be a prequel for, SMT 4 SMT 4 (S3)pretty much save Tokyo. SMT4: apocalypse(S4) an alternate timeline, which might have a connection to the chaos ending. Which happened during, SMT 4. SMT 5(S2) could be 20 years in the future, after the chaos ending or neutral ending???🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔 SMT 5 : vengeance (S5) an alternate timeline, that might lead to the chaos ending. (and this is just a theory)

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Really well thought out theory, ty for sharing

[@trashboat2990]

I think it's a spiritual successor to Nocturne but the fact that in the base story not one person mentions the conception or Kagutsuchi just can't make it a proper sequel in my eyes. Like if it was a proper squeal you think someone would've mentioned Kagutsuchi by name or hell even mentioned the guy who killed him.

[@LorenzoGMP]

The Conception is mentioned by the Prime Minister though.

[@jackour8167]

The conception IS mentioned

[@Benjamin-ml7sv]

The reason they remade SMT III was probably that it is the most famous SMT game. Demi-Fiend was seen in many other games that are completely isolated from SMT III, like DDS or Imagine. And the other worlds and recreation are not proof at all, it's a reoccurring theme in almost every single game, in SMT IV(A) this process is called "The Axiom", in SMT III It's called "The great will" it's basically the same just with a different name.

[@killgronia5815]

I loved 5 but I just did care for the characters like I did for 3 and 4. I tried hard to like them lol.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Yeah I loved their character designs, they just didn't click with me like 4 did. But yeah I love 5

[@bikit1316]

agree with the argument that smt 5 is the best turn-based balance alongside smt 4 apocalypses and persona 4. even thou persona 5 has more interesting mechanics but the balancing is sucks there

[@coatguy2990]

So this video was less of a true ending discussion and more of a "Is SMT 5 a sequel to SMT 3 video" but I'm still gonna say my opinion on the "true ending" of SMT 5. The true ending of SMT 5 is hot garbage. Nothing more than a dumpster fire. I spent the entire game gathering demons, talking to them, fusing them, in rare cases such as Amanozako even became friends with them. They try to help you achieve your goals without getting something out of it in return really. They just stick around, get your help and you get theirs. As a SMT fan I absolutely love demons, the fact you can read up on their lore, put them in your party, customize their skills and make them perfect weapons for any upcoming area or even boss fight, so of course I spent a lot of time with them. How the f*ck did, whoever wrote the (admittedly garbage) story think, that erasing all the demons from existence was a good idea? This isn't only bull sh*t from a meta-perspective as in, I as a player who loves the SMT series wouldn't want to essentially kill every demon, but it's even dumb from the MC's perspective. Again, you are killing 99% of the friends you made along the way. Actually you kill 100% if you don't count the monk in, and who knows if he even survived your purge. The ending is just really, really bad. If SMT VI ever sees the light of day, this ending won't be talked about, since SMT NEEDS demons, that's what makes the entire game what it is (and the alignment system, which was also absolutely butchered in SMT V). If the Nahobino ever gets into another game like the Demi-Fiend does, he better be coming all alone since in his canon ending he killed everything but himself. So the ending is bad lore wise, feels bad as well, and most likely will never matter in any SMT game to come. At least Demi-fiends true ending makes some goddamn sense. SMT 5's ending doesnt. It's not good, it's not well thought out, it's not some clever play around a metaphor and it ultimately makes all your achievements feel pointless since nothing you gained still exists anymore. Weird ending. Really weird.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I'm always confused by comments that genuinely want to say something insightful, but start right out of the gate with a thinly veiled insult.

[@impireon]

Bro nocturne ends with god dying and SMT V starts with god dying. It's easy.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Bruh

[@RedBeardRetroTech]

Lmfao the way you said "young man" was weak

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I felt your typing lacked power as well.

[@RedBeardRetroTech]

@@HallowedBeThyGame weak means funny in my area, I was laughing

[@nicholuswilliams6443]

Ok SMT V SMT iii That both

[@SuperRedarmy123]

feel good ps4 smt v no need dlc for demi fiend plus join your party :D

[@Bucketboy09]

#HBTG1K

[@sabersensi]

#HBTG1K