Is it worth it? - Linux PowerPC in 2022 on a Power Mac G5

[@2009svr]

I really love your work on PowerPC, very informative and I appreciate the technical details, which go back since your earlier work of PowerPC Sunset series! It would be really useful if you could do a little tutorial detailing: - which distro are you using (preferably with downloadable links); - the supplemental steps one needs to follow to get the distro installed (since the default installation is problematic); - which drivers are currently usable to get GPU acceleration (again, links would be highly appreciated); - whether a xorg.conf file is needed and if so, which are the recommended parameters for the supported Apple GPU cards on late 2005 PowerMacs, since this is one of them you are using (Nvidia 6600/Quadro or ATi X1900). Thank you for your contribution to the PowerPC community!

[@Shiunbird]

Hi 2009svr, I'm glad you enjoy my content. You may be in for a treat. I am not going to do a step-by-step tutorial with links for two key reasons: 1. Links go obsolete fast. 2. Overall steps may change. HOWEVER I'm planning a series to cover alternatives to the mainstream OS and distros, from a perspective of usability, privacy and stability, x86 and non-x86. To support this work, I am developing a scoring system to rank operating systems. I'll not make a full step by step tutorial but, as part of the reviews, I will cover the key installation steps. Linux is complicated. Each PowerPC distro I've tested breaks in a different way. But I plan to cover the general knowledge that can get you through any hurdles with PPC Linux: basic open firmware wizardry, getting grub manually installed and calling your kernel directly from the open firmware prompt if required. Stay tuned. =)

[@dr.shuppet5452]

Very interesting information, I almost forgot the earlier PowerMac G5 models had AGP, all I saw in videos was PCI-e, it makes complete sense though, the first PowerMac G5 was in 2003 if I remember correctly, which is around the same time as HP zx6000, which also has AGP.

[@Shiunbird]

Yup. Only the latest G5 is PCIe. Now, cool thing though - I tried Adelie Linux and there are no graphics corruption on the older nvidias. It's an incredibly smooth and light distro. However, there are not many pre-built packages and I didn't manage to get a build environment ready on it. The documentation is pretty scarce.

[@yomurita]

Feels like GPU acceleration is broken. Is the renderer llvmpipe? If so, the (already weak) G5 is doing the GPU's work on rendering interfaces, which goes as well as you might imagine, like what happens when you drag windows. Honestly getting GPU acceleration out of a NV 6600 might be more pain than it's worth, but I'm not aware if any card you can put on the G5 has proper support on Linux.

[@Shiunbird]

I think it's more due to lack of support to big endian. This GPU should be enough to render a window as texture and drag its contents around. TenFourFox runs ok even in new web pages, plus this desktop environment is not the best. Most probably the browser is doing software render. There are some AMDs that I could test, but then the computer wouldn't run Mac OS. I am now daily driving a SGI workstation and will get back to the G5 later, running this time FreeBSD on PPC. So far, though, the bad internet performance makes it a good candidate for a daily driver. I can still check the internet for references, but I am not tempted by it.

[@yomurita]

@@Shiunbird What is the output of glxinfo -B?

[@Shiunbird]

@@yomurita [shiunbird@g5 ~]$ glxinfo -B name of display: :0.0 display: :0 screen: 0 direct rendering: Yes Extended renderer info (GLX_MESA_query_renderer): Vendor: nouveau (0x10de) Device: NV43 (0x142) Version: 22.2.4 Accelerated: yes Video memory: 114MB Unified memory: no Preferred profile: compat (0x2) Max core profile version: 0.0 Max compat profile version: 2.1 Max GLES1 profile version: 1.1 Max GLES[23] profile version: 2.0 OpenGL vendor string: nouveau OpenGL renderer string: NV43 OpenGL version string: 2.1 Mesa 22.2.4 OpenGL shading language version string: 1.20 OpenGL ES profile version string: OpenGL ES 2.0 Mesa 22.2.4 OpenGL ES profile shading language version string: OpenGL ES GLSL ES 1.0.16

[@yomurita]

@@Shiunbird Then yeah, it should be doing GPU rendering... I'm glad NV43 just works now, at least.

[@Shiunbird]

@@yomurita Besides the browser being color shifted, all good - I could perhaps recompile the browser (I've heard of a fix) - everything else works fine.

[@leftforsunday]

I’m purchasing an iMac G4 really soon. Would this work? Also, not sure you’d know but would there be any ide’s? Using the most beautiful machine ever to learn programming would be amazing.

[@leftforsunday]

Sorry if this is a dumb question, It’s alright if it’s low performance.

[@Shiunbird]

Should work. I’d say it goes like Debian > Void > Adelie in terms of available pre-built applications and Adelie > Void > Debian in terms of stability, at least with nvidia. If you find a good ide let me know. I’m interested but didn’t look too much.

[@leftforsunday]

@@Shiunbird that’s great news! i didn’t wanna use adelie because i love debian :) been having lots of fun with power pc and almost got some things in tiger working but not quite. i could have used xcode with lua and love2d(a really old version) but macport tried installing forever with no success and homebrew won’t even install. i’m hoping i’ll have more luck with linux, i plan on booting off this really pretty firewire hard drive i have. thanks for the response and i’ll keep you updated if you find it interesting lol. thought of make some videos because i’ve been having so much fun.

[@Shiunbird]

@@leftforsunday keep all posted and have fun!!

[@archlinuxrussian]

I'm actually trying to (seller is being bad at communicating) purchase a PowerMac G5 2.3 DC :) I already bought a 2.5GHz DP that I'm going to try replacing the LCS with an air cooling system, but I'm not sure how that'll go. The seller said it was running Red Hat for his daughter when I bought it :)

[@Shiunbird]

I’d think twice before going this way. Check IBMs papers on the 970FX and MP. Two things I wanted to try: Replace my 2.0DC with a cpu taken from a quad. Get a quad and make it quad 2.0DC and see if I could roll without the LCS. Nothing could justify buying a quad now, since I’ve had one in the past. IBMs original MP tech information only covers the 970MP up to 2Ghz but based on the TDP progressions, I suspect that a quad generates 3x-4x more heat than a single CPU 2.0DC. With your 2.5DP, I’m afraid you would end up with a very loud machine. :(

[@archlinuxrussian]

@@Shiunbird Probably :/ and the chassis is/was spotless too! I thought of swapping chassis w/ the 2.3GHz DC (I got it!) but the rear IO is different. Sadness.

[@Shiunbird]

@@archlinuxrussian that’s true. The PCIe models have different IO shield :(

[@archlinuxrussian]

@@Shiunbird Still, it was 30$, and the prior owner took excellent care. Just need to find something to do with it. And, if I understood your first comment, it seems that switching the cooler from liquid to air would be a bad decision eh? Too much heat to dissipate?

[@Shiunbird]

@@archlinuxrussian it’s probably doable… but I think you would end up with a very loud computer. For example, my 2.0DC never revvs the fans up whereas my quad would spin them up very often. Maybe try refurbishing the LCS. tenfourfox blog has a good guide.

[@amdintelxsniperx]

you can now install modern video cards like quadro p4000 in linux and with the pcie you can use amd or nvidia actually

[@Shiunbird]

There are endianness issues. I have a Quadro P1000. The screen is totally distorted once you load a desktop environment, and the text console has a blue background. I'm actually in touch with someone from the nouveau team to see if we can sort it out.

[@amdintelxsniperx]

@@Shiunbird I'm going to do some more with my hd 6970 and 5770 GPUs since they have native support

[@amdintelxsniperx]

Will be testing fienix os with a 6970 and 5770 since big endiun natively supports them

[@Shiunbird]

@@amdintelxsniperx Let know how it goes.

[@amdintelxsniperx]

@@Shiunbird the 6970 has full 3d acceleration but 2d is hit an miss

[@amdintelxsniperx]

Pcie x1900xt

[@Shiunbird]

How's it powered?

[@amdintelxsniperx]

@@Shiunbird the g5 has a mini pcie connection on the logic board close to the speaker / fan assumbly you can get a mini 6 pin pcie to 6 pin or 8 pin regular