SLIP TEST - Mazda CX-5 2.5 i-ACTIV AWD vs Subaru Forester 2.0 CVT S-AWD -

[@UnobtaniumsQuickReviews]

I have owned two CX5's, now (2015 and 2019), and have been very pleased with them in all driving conditions except glare ice, and I don't expect anything will do well on a road I literally could not stand on without sliding. What impresses me most about my current CX5 is the yaw stability. I can be going down an icy hill and stab the brakes and it will still manage the ABS in such a way that I can steer around the corner on that hill. Absolutely unthinkable in previous generation vehicles like when I was growing up. I learned to drive in a cars without ABS. Subaru Forester XT had my attention for a while, but poor long-term reliability and the fact that they discontinued it pushed me to the CX5 turbo in 2019.

[@davidcarter4247]

In my country it is easy to work out which car is better off-road. The Forester comes with a full-size spare tyre. The CX-5 has a space saver. A real spare tyre also allows you to get home on a weekend when you are 250km away and there are no tyre repair shops. That is normal in my country. The Forester usually comes out on top in road tests when rollers in a suburban car park are swapped for real world off-road conditions. Despite having 4WD/AWD, some cars are never meant to leave the city.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Everything's correct but roller tests doesn't check offroad capabilities. They are closer to icy or snowy conditions - these may happen in the centre of the city. Spare tyre - that's just a part of a business, nothing more. Good reason to get some more money from the customer.

[@malandvulamachawe6323]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Subaru is always on top when it comes to value for money.

[@ikusha84]

Good performance from Mazda. It's strange that switching the traction control off decreases reaction time

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

There is offroad mode hidden under TCS OFF button, that's why it decreases reaction time. Other version do not have TCS OFF button any more but offroad button in the same place.

[@TheMpamMpam]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers is it from 2019 and newer?

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@TheMpamMpam I don't know the details, it is different in Europe, Japan and US...

[@valdius85]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers That's true about the "off-road" mode. It's already available in the USA and Japan, but then the EU gets the older versions.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@valdius85 I wonder if it ever offcially comes to Europe...

[@samin2173]

A solid result from both when it comes to 4wd systems. In actual offroad situation the ground clearance as well as the lack of grip of tires will quickly become the weakest link. Personally from these two, I would go with the Subaru.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Correct. By the way - how is your coffee?

[@samin2173]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Got the mug 25 mins ago, now taking the first sip!

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@samin2173 Great, so we are waiting for the mug photo in Finland! ;)

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@samin2173 Still waiting for the mug photo!

[@samin2173]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Been waiting for special circumstances, gonna head out to summer house for the weekend, try to capture a nice pic from there!

[@veselingramatikov]

In terms of finding traction still - 1. Land Rover`s 2. Jeep`s 3. Subaru .So far Mazda did pretty good job here. Most brands doing pretty well these days. Also it`s worth mentioned that in terms of off-roading Subaru has class leading ground clearance in this segment. Maybe only European Dacia Duster get`s there in terms of ground clearance and approaching angles.

[@seanmcpherson7962]

Jeep? Depends on which 4wd system you get. 4hey have quite abfew and some quite frankly aren't very good at all.

[@veselingramatikov]

@@seanmcpherson7962 i think any brand depends what you get... :)

[@haroldbeauchamp3770]

Except that Subaru reliability is quite shit. Cvt transmissions and burning oil prevent me from ever owning another Subaru

[@no1lineman]

@@haroldbeauchamp3770 C.R. No.1

[@OutdoorFun01]

I love you Subaru. Getting my new 2021 Subaru Crosstrek Outdoor (Canadian version) tomorrow. Woohoo! 2.5 boxer engine in it! 🥰

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Bring it for the test 😉

[@OutdoorFun01]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers I live in Canada. Come with your rollers 😁

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@OutdoorFun01 I can try to come on rollers 😉

[@OutdoorFun01]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Excellent! Will be waiting! 🙆‍♂️

[@emanuelcrespo5786]

Went to the engineering test class with Mazda when I worked with them. They blew Subaru out the water with their AWD. Snow test and inclines etc. they don’t advertise it enough. They don’t advertise anything enough. Industries best kept secret.

[@NoFear4XJs]

Hey do you know anything about the new 2023 iactive AWD system? I have 2023 mazda 3 hatchback turbo AWD and can't find the meat and bones details. Specifically about independent control of each individual rear tire... Cheers

[@441meatloaf]

rofl keep selling that crap. Mazda awd introduces torque steer

[@brytonmunro5270]

@@NoFear4XJsI think you’re referring to the torque vectoring control Mazda has connected to the entire traction control system. That allows it to individually brake each wheel as necessary to rotate power.

[@Okebejoey]

Are you high right now?!

[@valentinisko5647]

Спасибо Вам за проделанную работу!Сколько смотрю, а подписчики всё не прибавляются. На бросайте это дело) П.с.: подписчики, пожалуйста, хоть кто-то, предоставьте на тест Акуру или Хонду с SH-awd годов 06-07😢

[@Buc_Stops_Here]

We own a 2013 Subaru Legacy 3.6 and a 2023 Mazda Cx-5 AWD. We live on a mountain where we need AWD as it snows in the winter and with a 15% climb for about 600 feet to our house, you don't get home with snow tires and FWD or RWD. However with good tires both cars are good enough to get home. The Subaru is marginally better in the snow, but the Mazda is acceptable. The biggest problem with both cars is the factory equipped tires when you buy the car are terrible and you get no traction at all in the snow. We learned with the Subaru when we bought it to replace the tires with at least Michelin CrossClimate or Goodyear Weatheready tires rated for snow (all weather tires, not all season) which get us home in the winter quite well.

[@oandgw]

Wow, Mazda surprised me big time, I'm guessing it's using a Haldex system? It's definitely more than any CX-5 owner is going to need which is fantastic.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

It's not haldex, it's ITCC from JTEKT.

[@oandgw]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers huh, I’ve never heard of this but reading up on it, it seems to be quite popular. How does it compare to Haldex?

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@oandgw It's a clutch-pack, sending power to the rear, just like haldex. The difference is that it is electro-magnetic, while haldex is electro-hydraulic.

[@СветланаЛюшняк]

Now more and more modern crossovers are equipped with AWD or 4WD.But 95% of them could survive only a few minutes of skidding.Then AWD clutch get overheated and you remained with front wheel drive big useless crossover somewhere in a dirt,snow or icy ditch...Believe me I have enough experience with different type of AWD.But one day I've bought Subaru.I think finally I have found what I really need regarding AWD. Channel is really interesting 👍

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Thanks. Subaru awd clutch indeed is more resistant to overheating due to being in the same oil as transmission. However overheating matter is usually programmed - that's self protection function, there is no real overheat but calculated/predicted overheat. Other trick is that fast awd systems are opening or releasing the clutch everytime it possible, for fraction of the seconds (like throttle step back, torque decrease etc.) so there is much lower risk of overheating.

[@romankartsev220]

I agree I owned 4 subarus and I drive through foot of snow non stop and never had a problem with my Forester. Not sure about Mazda awd yet. In pouring rain Subaru and also handles well and prevents hydroplane.

[@antonfloor344]

That Mazda with TCS off😱👍🏼👍🏼

[@godgirlsguitars]

I like how you put tape on the wheels so we can see how many rotations it takes to get the car off the rollers. Can you test a 2020 Toyota Camry AWD? I bought one and I want to see if I made a decent choice or not. I have a feeling it won't pass the 3 roller test.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Is that a hybrid or gasoline version? I am not sure if AWD version is available in my country, besides I don't think that Toyota will share the car for the tests, probably I would have to find some private user.

[@sebastianbrzostowski439]

As we see at the video with black Forester '17, Subaru has better results (last test) when the gas is not push so much as at this video 🙂👍 The same i saw in deep sand when i drove mine from '14 👍

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Black Forester was XT, that may influence the test, I suppose they may have different CVT (standard vs high torque).

[@sebastianbrzostowski439]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers I know (TR690 vs TR580) but there is different only with the "teeth" on chain, gears basket before puleys, (on P and N CVT is "turn off") valve case (TR690 bottom - TR580 top) Everything behind CVT is the same. AWD works in the same ways on both. And "high torque" is only slang. Of course...chain is stronger in TR690, it is obvious 🙂👌 In fact TR690 is old one (gen. I) , TR580 is the newer (gen II) and has more upgrades campere to TR690. I have TR580 and less gas take the same results in off road as black one '17 Forester 👍 Now Subaru using TR580 in new hybrids and preperd also gen. III for new 2.4 engines. Twój kanał tak się rozwinął, że nie wiem już po jakiemu pisać 🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭😆😆😆😆 Tak trzymaj !!!!! ☺️☺️☺️☺️

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@sebastianbrzostowski439 Thanks for detailed info. The point is that calculations are based on torque balance. Turbocharged XT (or diesels) with high torque CVT are able to create the torque at lower rpm and wheel speeds thus the brake intervention may appear at low engine and wheels rpm. That difference was visible on the tests of two Outbacks (although final result was the same). Thanks, we may use English so more people can understand the discussion :) PS. Are you working for Subaru or just an owner of the car? :)

[@sebastianbrzostowski439]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Just owner 🤭 One old Forester turbo 2004 and N/A 2014 About Outbacks..... it depends also of the CVT oil condition. Mine was burnt after 80 000 km (5 years) in car without driving trailer or some touhg off road 🤷🏻‍♂️ However.... i hope that CVT gen III will be better and each of next gen in the future will show better performance...or meaby Subaru starts finaly using, on rest of their cars E-CVT from Toyota as in new XV Hybrid Plugin... 🤷🏻‍♂️ No chain - no discussion We will see, but personally im super happy of driving with chain CVT. Im love it that smoothness of drive as elcectric 🤩 And yes....i had the opportunity to ride a Tesla so i know what im talking about 😆 Just acceleration (om*g 😬😬😬😬😬😬😬😬) was different 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭 🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@sebastianbrzostowski439 Did you ever try the app called Active OBD for Subaru? :)

[@NoFear4XJs]

Thank you ! Are you guys able to test the new 2023 mazda 3 hatchback AWD turbo ? It has the new upgraded iactive AWD apparently it can control torque output to the rear independent of the front I'm still unsure if it controls each tire separately....? Hard to find soild details even the manufacturer is not giving up the details....

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Unfortunately turbo version is not available in our country. Maybe we'll find NA version but it's also rare with AWD. But you can check our test of CX-30, it has basically the same awd system. There's nothing fancy about it, just the software update. Car is fwd based, rear axle is powered by electromagnetic coupling (ITCC by JTEKT), front and rear of diffs are open, so the only control between left and right wheels is via brakes intervention.

[@damienb7539]

Hi, what about Mazda cx7?

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

We didn't test it yet...

[@Daily_Life_81]

Looks like the subaru had more gas applied. The subaru always lurched forward hard vs the mazda not quite so much.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Throttle is regulated by the systems.

[@Daily_Life_81]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers pretty crappy on Subaru's then I'd say. Not so smooth at all.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@Daily_Life_81 I don't see any drama here. However XT was indeed smoother, probably it doesn't need as much rpm as this one to create enough torque.

[@dakotamorgan6594]

@@Daily_Life_81 subarus throttle mapping on this gen forester and on the 2013-2014 outback was very aggressive. It was like the gas pedal was a light switch lol

[@Largeone1968]

I see more and more cars getting perfect results. Do you think that the manufacturers have been shamed by your videos and are now stepping their game up! 😂

[@samin2173]

I have been thinking the same, and hopefully it is so!!!

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

I don't think so although one of them was pushing me to remove the video...

[@valdius85]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers hahaha. That's great news. Means the channel is taken seriously. :)

[@jerryl6634]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers it means success of your chanel is undisputable! Congratulations! Keep doing please.

[@saylsalcan2610]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers 😀 whıch one ?

[@pitersanok5179]

Zastanawiam się, czy salon Mazdy udostępniając CX-5 na test miał świadomość, że zostanie ona zestawiona z ikonicznie postrzeganym Foresterem? Bo jeśli tak, to naprawdę świadczyć to może o tym, że Mazda odrobiła lekcję w zakresie trakcji w CX-5 i przestała mieć kompleksy nawet w stosunku do Subaru, wystawiając auto na wspólny test. Nie ukrywam, że jestem pozytywnie zaskoczony tym jak radzi sobie obecnie CX-5 w stosunku do wersji sprzed kilku lat. Pozdro!

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Odpowiadając na pytanie - nie, salon nie wiedział, z czym zostanie zestawiona CX-5. Zanim salon udostępnił samochód, musiał otrzymać zgodę centrali, Ci z kolei postawili jeden warunek - test musi być przeprowadzony tak samo, jak w przypadku innych samochodów (czyli sucho, równa nawierzchnia etc.).

[@fixanddrive]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Salony innych marek też muszą mieć zgodę centrali? Spotkałeś się z czymś takim wcześniej?

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@fixanddrive Nie przypominam sobie takiej sytuacji, aczkolwiek nie mam pewności, jak było z Toyotą.

[@gheorgheirinelgulai8581]

Great Awd sistem. What do you think, Subaru symetrical Awd is better than Mazda's?

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

There is a lot of types of Subaru symmetrical awd systems, so you have to precise which one 🙂

[@gheorgheirinelgulai8581]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers this type of Awd with "x - mode"

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@gheorgheirinelgulai8581 These systems are similar, both are shifting power from front to back via multiplate clutch-pack. For day-to-day driving both will do very good, for tough conditions or offroad Subaru awd system will do better. On the other hand it suffers from CVT while Mazda uses classic hydraulic AT.

[@valdius85]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers 2020 Mazda CX-5 Vs 2020 Forester with dual more XMode - the one installed in the the Gen. Which one of these is "better"? Don't worry, I will not regret buying a Forester even if it has a worse AWD. AWD wasn't the main factor :) BTW: my brother's in law CX-8 is a great car so I like both brands.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@valdius85 Dual X-Mode is actually a marketing trick, you can get the same results in previous version by X-Mode and VDC buttons :) Anyway , I think Subaru is more capable in demanding conditions, Mazda awd system is rather for better handling, cornering, not traction itself. By the way - did yiu try to connect Active OBD for Subaru and check what S-AWD system is really doing?

[@adventureforesterblog]

Any plans to test the e-Boxer Forester?

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

We wish but it is hard to find one...

[@Driftuner]

Wow, mazda really impressed. Did you try starting out in 2nd gear? For some reason mazdas awd seem to grip even better when starting on 2nd gear

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Yes, we tried - no difference in this case.

[@emanuelefossati3812]

Hi, do you know if the new e-boxer Forester has the same AWD sistem shown in this older model like the one in the video? I like the RAV4 hybrid, too but the system is not acceptable as I see in your videos. Shame on new Forester it doesn't have a spare tire and tiny 48 liter tank. What do you do if you broke a tyre on a off-road Street km's away from asphalt, in the Alps ? Normal repair kit is not enough sometimes and there is not road assistance coming to you. From a car with 22cm of ground clearance I expect a sufficient spare tyre. On the other hand hybrid RAV4 costs much more than the hybrid Subaru on used market (2019-2020) and I'm not sure the highway fuel consumption is so good for those hybrid Toyotas (battery charge will end soon or late). I'm reading in comments that Subaru seems not to have good long term reliability. Do you have some fresh reliability Info on both Subaru forester and RAV4? If you are out of warranty and want to keep the car as I usually do for years, if the hybrid Toyota sistem breaks down and you don't want to spend money to repair the hybrid part on a old car you only use the petrol motor and probably someone ECU computer expert can disable the non-working electric part , but in the case of RAV4 you will have only a front wheel drive care because of back traction is only electric. With Subaru the same reasoning is better because it has a real AWD also if the electric traction is "not working". I don't know if I explained my thoughts in a good way. A last questions, do you know the typical consumption of the RAV4 hybrid at 130-140kmh? And the Subaru? I know it's a lot of text, if you don't answer I will not be offended :)

[@emanuelefossati3812]

P.s. on "diariomotor" channel there is an interesting off road test with eboxer. It has poor results in a lot of videos . Idem on channel "suv battle". (I don't own those channels, no marketing here). I didn't expect those poor performance from Forester. It seem to be CVT 's fault in torque delivery under pressure, something like a sort of protection. From what I understand

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@emanuelefossati3812 I will answer your after weekend, I don't know yet if I know the answers 🙂

[@emanuelefossati3812]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers thank you

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@emanuelefossati3812 So far I can only say that awd system in e-boxer is the same, it only has additional electric engine on the driveshaft to increase power/torque. The problem is - from what I noticed in tests of Subaru cars from last years - awd systems are not tuned as well for offroad (light) as some years ago. I don't know the reason for that. It looks that Subaru went into modes direction, that means that by default system is tuned for fuel economy. You need to use X-MODE etc. to make the system work. That wasn't needed in the past. CVT is another limitation but only for offroad conditions. Normally, on snow roads etc. there is no stress on it.

[@emanuelefossati3812]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Forester still seems quite interesting, for the money and what it offers. I like the idea of the electric motor filling the gap caused by a lack of turbo especially mid-low rpm. It can be a solution to give more reliability in long term (if hopefully the electric motor is stronger than a turbo compressor) and at the same time allowing for a little less fuel consumption, while satisfying motor-killing UE emission laws and homologations. In the videos named before, it seems a good AWD if climbing % is not too high and surface not too broken ( realistically those Suv, despite being quite capable in some cases, are not meant and designed for challenging off-road purposes. People must be more realistic in this way). My simple opinion. All in all, used market difference 2019-2020 model ad low Kms (

[@387carvalho]

I have noticed that the Mazda Driver was stearing side to side in some situations, I would be great to have a camera on the steering wheel.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Here is the explanation why drivers have to do that: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hWLQdqSvip5-etE

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@D F Symmetrical awd systems have the same problem. Basic structure may be symmetrical but weight distribution isn't.

[@387carvalho]

Yes o fully aware of it it's due to the diferent shaft leght, but intentional done can easy the test for the Vehicle.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@387carvalho There is major steering input needed to make the test easier, not slight like 1-2 degrees.

[@thejoseandresshow]

Test the SH Forester please!

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Waiting for the volunteer :)

[@atracin]

Any chances of testing a third gen Forester? I'm curious to see how a standard pre-Xmode Subaru would handle the rollers. I know you have done another older one, but iirc that was an XT

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Still waiting for some volunteers...

[@joshuachristiansen2626]

3rd gen like 05-09? Its a subaru itll plow through everything you throw at it except for the 2 wheels on one side being on rollers. Subaru didnt figure out how to shift torque side to side like that until like 2012 ish

[@atracin]

@@joshuachristiansen2626 09-13 is 3rd gen

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@@joshuachristiansen2626 2nd generation (02-08) with VDC could already shift side to side, here it is: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fpKxlGCHhcSIirc kzbin.info/www/bejne/npmlfWShgaiBb7s

[@joshuachristiansen2626]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers do you know what year subarus with manual transmissions could side shift? Or if they still cant to this day?

[@maghnaurs2686]

mazda 👍

[@kuhnniks87]

I see that the cx5 in on somewhat of a small incline and the Subaru is on a small decline when doing these tests. Also that the driver for Subaru when on 3 wheel slip, pounded the gas from the start as they did not for the Mazda. Just strange

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

That's just an illusion, we always choose flat area. When it comes to wheels speed - computer takes control.

[@yigitkoc445]

👌

[@jonwill2429]

Please if u see this comment can u do Audi Quattro all version

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Here is the playlist with tests of many Quattro systems: kzbin.info/aero/PL_d2bK7PR7yxEPh44cSr0T-ptQ1lyaafX

[@edu.g6082]

If manufacturers are complaining then it's time German cars with reputable names such as Mercedes Benz be compared to subaru and prove there worth. Perhaps you could give this a shot. Please widen your scope of research not just roller testing, may be you could try hill climb with snow for both the subaru, BMW X3, Benz ML, and any other German car.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

If I only could find some snow...

[@edu.g6082]

@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Perhaps mud would be a good substitute, and compare subarus to German machines.

[@dimitu_]

I'd like to see the test going backwards. Mazda CX family was always bad in that matter

[@ivanpetrov7996]

Please, someone help with SH-AWD, Honda or Acura!!! I will send you a picture of my hot wife 🙈🙈🙈

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Here's SH-AWD : kzbin.info/www/bejne/pKTQoWeEe6ihY80

[@osal4323]

Your test will be better placing rollers up hill...

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Not necessarily 🙂 kzbin.info/www/bejne/hXOWZIZvn8qAeLs

[@sanOkification]

Opel antara please!!!!))))

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Waiting for the volunteers 🙂

[@NYANPASS-CHEN]

I was wondering how will my Touareg do on this test😂

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Come and we will check it 😉

[@DrKnowsMore]

VW system outperforms both of these and does better, oddly enough, than Audi, which I think is the worst of the 4. Interesting. I will say this though. Without knowing about tires, these comparisons aren't completely objective. Ideally you would have the same brand/model of tire on all of these vehicles.

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

It depends which system of VW you consider. Majority of them are haldex, so there's nothing unique in them, especially when compared to Subaru. Tiguan couldn't even pass the last test. Tires - they have completely no influence on this test.

[@alexanderkorpach8286]

I expected worse results for Mazda, but it turned out not so bad :)

[@haroldbeauchamp3770]

I expected worse results for Subaru and the horrible cvt transmission

[@alexanderkorpach8286]

@@haroldbeauchamp3770 good joke, might be popular among VAG lovers)

[@haroldbeauchamp3770]

@@alexanderkorpach8286 as a former Subaru owner, I can confirm this is no joke.

[@alexanderkorpach8286]

@@haroldbeauchamp3770 perhaps, you got "special edition" with Jatco and 2WD ;)

[@haroldbeauchamp3770]

@@alexanderkorpach8286 nope. 2014 Forester with Jatco cvt. Burned oil and cvt failed under warranty

[@jameshenderson2659]

to bad thats not a 19 Subaru Forester

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Actually it is from 2019 but previous generation model.

[@romankartsev220]

Rollers test is not the best. These two cars performed the same looking at the video, it does not show which awn is better.

[@sylenzyostampa]

In real world Mazda is sucks off road

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

Did you try any version with Offroad Traction Assist function?

[@ryantogo8359]

Op is a little kid who has never even driven a car. Disregard

[@4x4.tests.on.rollers]

@ryantogo8359 If you're talking about me then you missed. I'm driving for almost 30 years, including 27 years with 4x4/AWD. That's longer than you're on this world.