PRO PLAYERS AVOIDING CHAMPIONS QUEUE ? 🤨 (Podcast #5)

[@SupermanSajam]

Wait until Malphite has the Sheeva stomp in Project L

[@FullOfPixels]

The LCS crowd chanting in the background while talking about the Smith’s “entanglement” is the best.

[@cyb0nics]

When you play fighting games you have to change your mentality from "playing to win" to "playing to learn and improve." It's a very slowburn process but definitely worth it when you winning. It feels so damn good. Another benefit from learning fighting games is the fighting game basics are easily translatable to almost every fighting game. Once you hardwire the basics to your brain and get that muscle memory, everything starts to click.

[@RomnysGonzalez]

In my opinion as part of the FGC. Everyone should try to play fighting game because they give you the mental fortitude, discipline,patience and remove the idea of your brain of putting the blame on everyone else beside yourself. A FGC player can't hide behind the excuses of a bad teammates, or things out of their controls, or bad coaching or bad draft or bad comms, or bad comps. In the FGC if you lose is because yourself. If you lose is because your lack of knowledge on the match up, the lack of understanding of your character power points and weaknesses. At lot of people quit fighting games not because they are hard, but because they can deal with the idea that they are weak,unprepared and are losing because themselves and nothing else. Nothing can prepare you mentally for a pro player better than playing fighting games.

[@degarri7995]

It’s always so weird when I hear someone saying inputs are hard, it’s hard to remember how hard it was to learn fighting games that I think some people forget not everyone has been playing fighting games forever.

[@karsonkammerzell6955]

That's what got me from Silver to Plat in League. I'm not good at League; if I was I'd be Challenger, lol. I need to isolate my performance and focus on that rather than focus on my teammates performance and the game's result.

[@MostUndignified]

literally the only correct mentality to FG's is "I'm garbage but it's called garbage can, not garbage cannot." You have to lose 1,000 times to learn how to win once.

[@rolling.reggie]

all these controversies but we can all agree that Sneaky's editor is GOATED

[@JemmC89]

14:24 DL - "You know he came out and said she emotionally manipulated him n shit. Just fucked up all round" Crowd - "Awwwww"

[@RandyPandy1]

Meteos argument applies for most or all competitive online games while working a 9-5 career. It’s becoming more fun to watch or do something else when time is more scarce…

[@myn0valife]

I agree with Meteos that playing a game you've never played before and losing over and over again sucks, and it does apply to Fighting Games, but I feel once you actually learn how to play a Fighting Game, losing stops feeling bad and it can even start to get fun/interesting even when you lose. Losing close matches feels fun to me, especially when I understand why I lost and learning from it and applying what I learned from the loss in the next match.

[@RomnysGonzalez]

The problem in that case is no the game, but the player himself for believing they gonna be beating someone who had been playing the game. THe mentality need to change from "Playing to win" to "Playing to learn match up". Something great about FGC is once you learn how they work you can translate your skill into whatever other fighting games with some adaptations

[@Youknow6969able]

The secret sauce for league. Was its easier barrier of entry compared to already established games like dota n HoN. For me league season 1. Felt like an aram version of dota. A lot less competitive(initially) and a lot more inclusive

[@tauffee00]

doublelift just sitting eating a cookie for the first 3 minutes was kinda funny

[@Rayvony_]

me doing a group project in uni

[@ericr.2440]

Topic for another pod: if everyone had to build a new team in na with themselves in it what players would they pick and why

[@Shytbyrd]

Literally best take on the Will Smith issue you can find. Meteos keeping it 100

[@saintsataniko2116]

Really? "It's not like he killed anyone" is the best take? The problem is that stand-up comedians face crowds with drunken fans throughout their careers and if someone is encouraged to just punch them for literally any joke they find offensive it creates a dangerous precedent. Imagine if an LCS player fucked up a play and and another player came out of the crowd and punched them then went back to their seat, and after the game they gave the same guy the MVP Award and a standing ovation. That's basically what happened.

[@MorrowProduction]

You must have missed the Flagrant 2 take :)

[@davros320]

really enjoy this podcast. would love to see more of these and have them be longer

[@jonathanlee3094]

13:52 GOT ME DYING. THIS EDITOR IS GOATED

[@jakemurray4346]

That's just Sneaky's sub sound, it's a Kaisa voice line (she counts her kills in-game) that says the amount of months they subbed for.

[@MrAlihassanein]

I think they don't understand what Papa is saying. He's not saying that CQ isn't better than Solo queue, he's saying there's other ways of practicing that aren't just playing full games. In most sports the last form of practice you resort to is full games, you usually do drills and controlled practice scenarios. The debate isn't CQ vs SQ, it's queued full matches vs alternative ways of practicing that League pros don't usually consider because the sport is so young and for a long time just grinding games was seen as the only means of practicing.

[@Omniphenom]

Sajam licking his lips to have another free talking points video

[@gunkshotpoison]

The amount of luck or variance in the game I think should be motivated by the end result you want. Chess minimizes luck and variance because it wants to be as fair as possible so, like they said, the better player always wins. If your end goal is not to create the most fair 1v1, then Smash with Items is the kind of fair, involved, variance element that you want.

[@gollowancompetitive751]

First of all, I love this. This trio. This casual "we talk everything" content. You guys constantly eating :D Really feels like sitting in a living room/discord with you guys just hanging out. More pl0x

[@sattikshyam4328]

I literally just paused the video and got a pack of choco-chip cookies after seeing DL munching on them.

[@agentcodybanx8909]

Be a leader not a follower

[@chnb517]

Chocolate chocolate chip

[@thekilla1234]

I can train football by eating pizzas and watching anime all day and still beat toddlers at the game. This makes my training method legit and you are not allowed to question it.

[@Troubled_double]

Will Smith literally got famous making fun of uncle Phil's baldness

[@EclipsaMyrtenaster]

I think you can punish Sheeva's air stomp by doing down2 (the uppercut move) but you need to do it at the right moment or you'll get hit by it but then again, most of the streamers who played MK11 in that tournament are probably just first timing it or don't have as much practice as some people to know that

[@TLKJS]

Just saying SF5 standard matchmaking is basically like Aram MMR, you can end up against pretty much anything until you play some ranked games.

[@jmoa5758]

Yesssss more of this

[@kami-oshi.kronii]

I dont know why it's so jarring to me, but we got the boys in their t-shirts, and then there's Leena rocking the high slit formal wear lol

[@MrDiegoc16]

Another banger from the trio

[@pr0thizzle]

Just me but lol has lots of similar concepts as fighting games. Spacing, poking, combos, mind games and zoning.

[@patrickdrynan7065]

I would love to get all my news and hot takes from these 3

[@Rogers808]

Sneaky on the truth bomb

[@Glasshammer_Matt]

Wild coming to this a year later and you find out that Will Smith and Jada hadnt been together since 2016

[@RomnysGonzalez]

In my opinion as part of the FGC. Everyone should try to play fighting game because they give you the mental fortitude, discipline,patience and remove the idea of your brain of putting the blame on everyone else beside yourself. Fighting games prepared you with the idea that not everything is gonna be as you expected or how you planned, but that won't matter because you're capable enough to adapt to it and get the best result out of it. A FGC player can't hide behind the excuses of a bad teammates, or things out of their controls, or bad coaching or bad draft or bad comms, or bad comps. In the FGC if you lose is because yourself. If you lose is because your lack of knowledge on the match up, the lack of understanding of your character power points and weaknesses. At lot of people quit fighting games not because they are hard, but because they can't deal with the idea that they are weak,unprepared and are losing because themselves and nothing else. Nothing can prepare you mentally for a pro player better than playing fighting games. Fighting game is a beautiful community, with a bunch of great people. Is wild,savage, but caring and lovely. The FGC is full of storylines, fun moments and just enjoyment. MEEEN I LOVE FIGHTING GAMES !. Funny enough. KOF15 is actually sooo easy compared to the old KOF. The things that makes King of Fighters hard for newer entry places is because the legacy skills translate the harder on this game next to probably Tekken.

[@MrGetownedLP]

More podcast content with the best League trio let's goooo PogU

[@stephanlinska6584]

For the longest time NA pros have been complaining about their subpar practice environment (and perhaps justifiably so) . Now they are the only ones given the actual dream tool to improve, and a good third of players elect to just not really make use of it. I get that players should be able to do with their free time as they see fit. But do not tell me to expect greatness out of a region with that amount of resources giving that little of a shit. "Winning culture" can be toxic as hell in esports, but pull that shit on an eastern team and watch your ass get cut mid season every damn time. At some point you should elect to either just make your own league an actually desirable product, or buckle the fuck down and compete using the HUGE FUCKING BOON you have just been granted with champions queue. Improving an actual LCS product can be very attractive to an audience, even if they don't have to constantly hope for international success. If it fucking works for EU regional leagues you can do it, given the huge organisations already in the league.

[@Shytbyrd]

16:33 they encompass For Honor completely with the if you can’t counter the spam then get good

[@jxstified7558]

I think his take is fine in the sense that if they dont want to play CQ and are still performing really well why should they receive hate for it when they are playing well. I think that's what he meant maybe I inferred what I was thinking about the situation.

[@Eccentrec]

Comparing the issues of pro play and champions queue to the issues of soloque players is a joke of a comparison. At that point, it isnt even the same game.

[@illyabohatkov4080]

Wow i had no idea that MK11 bit had happened at all, to be fair that move is broken in the sense that the way of dodging it is so different from everything else in the game, of course just like every other cheesy move in MK11(and theres a lot of them, maybe too many) once you figure out how to avoid it it actually becomes an advantage, theres nothing more satisfying than shitting on a guy who reached some decent rank by essentially cheesing, and doesnt know how to do anything else

[@RomnysGonzalez]

Happened on Injustice 2 with Deathstroke and if i remember correctly happened in Injustice 1 with one character i can remember. As a whole NRS always have the track record of creating disgusting spammy character who force people to learn the matchup, adapt and evolve. MKX with Eeron Black spacing,zoning and neutral control

[@Janluvspeep]

Turns his wife said “ i am women who doesn’t need protecting” a few days ago she is so weird why would you ever say that after your husband nearly ruined his career for you

[@RomnysGonzalez]

DL is 100% correct !. IF the move is working you MUST keep doing it till the opponent learn,adapt and evolve past it. Is literally the 1st teach pro players tell you. As my boy Justin Wong said "Why should i chance my strategic against someone?. If the move work. Why stop?. HE GONNA LEARN. He gonna to THINK and find a solution. Learn the match up and adapt !"

[@Stedman75]

8:44 he did murder someone on stage, his own career bro lol..

[@Rayvony_]

was waiting for meteos/sneaky to comment at 4:03

[@MostUndignified]

About what? What happened?

[@Walterthefriendly]

It's more about freedom of speech. Is he setting a precedent of accepting assault against comedians?

[@qwerrewq1834]

Can I ask why Bjergsen himself has only played 7? No flame but why is no one bringing up him having so little games? Does he have a lot of other responsibilities that someone like CoreJJ don't have?

[@Jmasterz2]

Meteos is actually my favorite person. but I wont watch his stream because I have to watch the most popular streamers so I only watch Doublelift and QT

[@xthaking]

Hes my fav outta the 3 but he needs dl and sneaky around to bounce funny jokes off of them. When i watch him by himself hes mostly chill

[@tylercmorley]

Someone should plot the regression of tenure and CQ games played. At first glance, it looks like a strong negative relationship

[@metalheadofmordor9169]

A lot of people dont play multiplayer/online games pvp just because it sucks to rely on other people, who will fuck up and waste your time 9/10 times anyways. Fuck it.

[@wytaurius1850]

Does Meteos upload content?

[@hshjth139]

Triple monkey pod lets go

[@wh1t5on]

Bruh get a fight pad or arcade stick killing me with the keyboard inputs in KoF

[@wh1t5on]

Also Meteos' point is kind of fair about working 9-5 then playing a fighting game but I do it every day and I'm ass at fighting games

[@Blaze-kf3ds]

i use to play this fighting game now i just vs bots or friends on it and sometimes the for fun modes in matchmaking

[@ChuckCannon]

I like fighting games, I can beat most of my friends button mashing :)

[@nobodywashere3123]

Fighting games r just a diff mindset. These games r super similar to like actual combat sports. U dont have any built in ways to really know what to do. If u wanna know how to combo u need to learn what ur buttons do and when/where to press them. U dont lvl up ur charector to DP,U, the player lvl up by getting better at doing z motions. I agree 100% that fighting games r a diff mentality all on its own. But to get into them requires u actually practice and give a shit like if u were bad at league and wanted to be a pro. But thats just to learn the game

[@nobodywashere3123]

Like. It takes hours to learn matchups and it requires that fighters mentality of staying calm and staying in the fray. Ur gonna get ur ass beat till u learn to stop getting stomped as hard. And if u dont like the feeling of learning thru experience, ya this shit is annoying. Why play fighters if u like combos when u can play DMC, if u like fast reation based games u can just pick fps, if u like more action based combat their r tons of action mmos these days woth amazing but also simpler to exicute battle mechanics

[@sotothecreator]

Best of 3s instead 1 and dones problem solved

[@nemexsp]

Why are you playing KOF on keyboard?

[@RomnysGonzalez]

Nothing wrong with it. You can play fighting games with a Controller, with a ball stick, with a bat stick,Hitbox. Using your keyboard is like playing with a Hitbox pretty much. Heck you can even use a Steering Wheel like Initial T did playing Guilty Gear. Whatever works the best for you is the correct answer

[@TWISTEDGiraff3]

Papasmithys takes is not good. So he is saying other players should mimic danny and fudge's practice styles because they are top tier players. I feel like part of why they (and other pros) may not play CQ though is because they don't want to give info to other teams on champs they are practicing or on their strats, etc. If that's the case, then Danny and Fudge wouldn't want totell pros on other teams how to practice. And also, the whole point of CQ is to improve the region because when you improve the region everyone gets better. Like how can papasmithy say that the way players practiced before CQ is good when time after time imports come to NA and flounder?

[@awung11]

He didn't say that everyone should mimic them. He's just pushing back on the Reddit threads flaming Danny and Fudge for not playing CQ.

[@TWISTEDGiraff3]

@@awung11 He literally says: "Fudge and Danny are two of the best players in their roles in NA. We should be learning what they do to become as good as they are so quickly, not demanding that they conform to a new system..." Seems to me he is implying people should learn what they're doing in order to imitate/mimic it.

[@awung11]

@@TWISTEDGiraff3 learning about someone's routine doesn't mean you need to completely mimic it. Kobe woke up at 4am to practice. It's informative to learn how he was successful but that doesn't mean EVERYONE should mimic it. You could also add whatever someone does on top of your routine (i.e. 1v1s AND champions queue)

[@santyagobustamante7369]

The thing is most of these pros that play very little to literally no CQ at all also play not that much soloq either, so wtf are they doing then? They are playing 5 games of scrims per day, 5 days a week and then 2-3 soloq or CQ games per day, so like 7 games a day? Thats fucking nothing for a proplayer

[@anniekujo]

16:19 haha true

[@AtheneH8er]

They had an open marriage...

[@TheBeefPudding]

Will Smith tried to be polyamorous with some dancer and Halle Berry FYI

[@aruanmello9320]

lets go golden guardians!

[@jasonyang5296]

LONGERRR

[@JemmC89]

Can you guys please play Dragonball FighterZ and get DatoDoya or MoldyBagel to show them how the Auto-Combo's work and that they can actually learn how to play DBFZ pretty easily. #WhoHurtYouMeteos

[@saintsataniko2116]

This discussion alone ended up being more entertaining than the 100T vs C9 series. That said, Meteos and DL have spent their careers being verbal bullies so it's always bizarre to hear them talking with such a total lack of self-awareness.

[@AJ-HawksToxicFinger]

The Will Smith incident can be summed up this way: Will Smith = Hollywood and Chris Rock = normal people. That is exactly how most of the people in Hollywood feel about the 'fans' and normies, that's why they gave him a standing ovation.

[@trickstergod9179]

Chris Rock has been in a ton of movies though, so it's weird that he still wouldn't be considered part of that crowd.

[@AJ-HawksToxicFinger]

@@trickstergod9179 he makes fun of them every time he hosts....they do not like him (or most comedians). After all, it's not like anyone around them dares makes fun of them or calls them out.

[@trickstergod9179]

@@AJ-HawksToxicFinger So he's only considered part of the "In" group if he doesn't make fun of anyone else in the group. Yeah, basically makes sense.

[@xgamer560]

The fighting game takes are a little weird

[@adriandurlej9266]

love it

[@LinkTheTiger]

PapaSmithy's take is like telling people they can't criticize an NFL player's training regimen because they don't play in the NFL.. like no, even a silver player can see that they're wasting an opportunity that literally hit them over the head. "We should be striving to learn how they got so good so quickly".. what? Then why aren't they winning tournaments? Like aren't they not playing solo queue either? What's their "training regimen"? Go into the practice tool and slap some dummies? Stomp edaters in aram? Our region is just consistently memed on for being trash and they won't even take an opportunity to improve despite it being right in front of them. Frankly their teams should drop them and find literally any academy player willing to put in the time and effort to play champions queue so that our region can actually improve.

[@awung11]

Your take doesn't make any sense. Solo queue/champions queue is like pickup basketball. There are plenty of other ways to practice other than PvP. No NFL player goes from practice and then plays another 6 hours of football with pads and plays, which is basically what solo queue is. Pickup football doesn't even exist. Doing cardio, weights, and drills are more like 1v1s and practice tool vs dummies than solo queue games. If there were academy players that could actually compete with Fudge and Danny, then the academy point would be more relevant, but they're still performing on stage.

[@LinkTheTiger]

@@awung11 You're taking the equivalence too far to the point where it's false. My entire point on that was simply that you do not have to be a professional player to recognize what is or is not good practice. Working out keeps you in shape which is ideal for any physical activity, but hitting dummies in the practice range doesn't do anything outside of maybe learning a new character or looking at how bullshit certain hitboxes are. Football and basketball are a lot more linear in that nothing really changes. Sure you can have different and unique plays, but league is constantly getting "balancing" changes and new characters and each matchup against each character is completely different. Some contracts for certain teams even have solo queue mandates. Besides all that you have 3 ex-pros sitting in front of you who did not get the chance to have champions queue while they were competing telling you that they are hard trolling for not taking advantage of it. They're "performing" in like ~4th place in the worst major region in the world that constantly gets memed on every year. While they are admittedly better 99% of solo queue players they aren't even the best of the worst and won't even commit time into the singular best resource they have to change that.

[@awung11]

@@LinkTheTiger You talk about false equivalence then make the same mistake yourself. Either "you do not have to be a professional player to recognize what is or is not good practice" in which case it doesn't matter what 3 ex-pros think. Or it does matter, in which case, the current GM of one of the top teams should have equal or greater insight on what good practice is than 3 ex-pros. Besides (ex)-pros always think that their methods were better even when it's been proven otherwise. Like people thought the Warriors were dumb for taking so many threes until they won doing that. Or people saying the Air Raid can't win championships before Mahomes won. What worked in the past for Doublelift, Sneaky, and Meteos might not necessarily be the best method now.

[@LinkTheTiger]

@@awung11 it matters in the sense that as ex pros they wish that they had such a tool which has nothing to do with whether or not you need to be an ex pro to recognize what is good practice. It really does not matter who said it because we are without fail the worst major region. TSM 0/6 and 100 thieves major let down last year says hello. Koreans live and die by the mantra that practice makes perfect. You can basically always find a new vod of their best players playing in solo queue. Guess what region is generally considered the best? Korea. So I'm not really sure where this has been "disproven", this seems to be some fallacy you made up.

[@awung11]

@@LinkTheTiger agree to disagree. 100T "major letdown" = 3-3 and taking a game off the eventual world champion "Best major region" = 1 tournament win since 2018

[@th3summoner]

Am I the only one who agrees with PapaSmithy? If they are week by week the top of their roles, they are obviously doing something right. Saying CQ should make you a better player so it does is dumb as fuck. Jojo plays the shit out of CQ and honestly I put fudge over Jojo now when I didn't during lockin. Stop trying to force players into what YOU SUBJECTIVLY think is better practice.

[@tghywa1226]

This is a horrible mentality. If you think you have nothing else to learn from something and that you are already at the top and there is nowhere to go, then you have peaked and people will start to surpass you. When did playing just to win become more important than playing to be the best version of yourself? Just because somebody is perceived to be the best of their role does not mean that they have learned all they need to and should just stop. Also id say that Jojo currently is doing a much better job than Fudge as EG have actually looked like they should be in the past few weeks and on another day probably could have beaten TL in the playoffs match. C9 have looked incredibly lost.

[@orionburch5860]

PapaSmithy had a great take and I 100% agree. I think Sneaky did not charitably represent his take at all here.

[@th3summoner]

@@tghywa1226 Jojo is not the entire team just like C9 is not the entire team. Jojo made way more mistakes than fudge made in the games this weekend what? I 1000% agree C9 as a whole looks like dogshit and EG looked much better for games 1-4 but that has nothing to do with both players. Jojo only looked good for his akali lucian games and shit himself the other 3, while fudge looked solid even though the drafts they had were garbage.

[@awung11]

@@tghywa1226 and danny didnt play solo queue but outperforms Jojo in the late game

[@robrever]

Don't you guys all live in LA? Virtual podcasts are trash, why not just meet up and sit around a table?

[@highrise3924]

Dude, Chris Rock deserved it for joking about Jada's alopecia. Will Smith could've handled it differently for sure but Chris Rock had it coming.

[@Jack-yu4vq]

This whole video demonstrates why na is so garbage, the mentality they display in this is insane to me

[@gc6599]

Explain

[@Lablancchatheseventh]

Thanks jack very cool

[@Jack-yu4vq]

@@gc6599 I agree with papa smithy saying that players like fudge and especially Danny, since he’s been performing so well, shouldn’t be criticized for not playing champs q. I think if they believe they get better playing another way, they should do that. Like fudge for example, since he joined c9 3 years ago, he’s been spamming 1v1s with his counter part, starting with licorice and now with copy. You can obviously see how well this has worked for fudge, and he shouldn’t be shamed for doing it his way. As for champs q itself, I don’t think it’s na saving grace like they make it seem, but I could be completely wrong. They just make it seem like it’s the fault of players not playing champs q that the league is not getting better, but why should some players sacrifice what they think makes them better for other players to get better. And this is my problem with na, the players are all about themselves, they get champs q, which is already better than solo q, but these 3 still complain it’s not good enough because of other people. No one has any actual fixes for anything, but rather they just say “this works and everyone should do it because that’s what we want”

[@Jack-yu4vq]

@@Lablancchatheseventh you’re welcome

[@Jack-yu4vq]

@@gc6599 tldr; basically it seems like na players blame each other for not getting better instead of looking inward and finding what makes themselves better