Sonic Riders - When Mechanics Inhibit Learning

[@Anna_Rae]

This was actually a childhood game I played a ton. I loved sonic growing up and put in a ton of time to learn stuff. I didn’t have anyone to play with, but I enjoyed it a lot as a kid.

[@UltimateTS64]

Yeah same here

[@telosnyx5193]

Same

[@DOOMZEDAY]

LMFAO WHITCHO LONELY ASS Jk I was lucky to have brothers who played with me

[@dev5655]

I'm glad I'm not the only one that wasted my childhood loving this game

[@johnx140]

Me too dude :D

[@wingedmirage4226]

This is what happens when everyone says “Stop with the obsessive hand-holding tutorials and let me figure it out myself!” While I agree a lot of games do too much tutorial for simple things (like newer Pokémon games), if a game has complex or unusual mechanics it NEEDS to explain them.

[@samz8691]

Not really, there are games that give you tutorial pop-ups on how to use basic mechanics even near the end of the game.I'd say it depends on the actual mechanics, Riders was even before the tutorial craze If I remember.

[@MechMK1]

A good tutorial is one that the player doesn't even notice. Portal is a great example, as it rarely ever tells you what to do but gradually introduces you to new concepts. Sonic Riders doesn't do that, and instead throws everything at you at once.

[@Jojotheprocrastinator]

The game does explain most mechanics aside the stats and how to get higher shortcuts. The tutorial you do have to find yourself, but I swear there was a tutorial in this game. To get the high shortcuts on flat ramps you have to charge your jump and do a front flip, on the backward ramps you have to do a backflip. Idk I became a master at this game no problem at all. At my young age when this game came out the only thing I didn't know how to do was grind and that's because I didn't watch tutorials and those do tell you how to grind.

[@SimpleAmadeus]

There's a big difference between forcing a player to sit through long tedious sections with forced inputs or giving them unintuitive inputs while telling them nothing at all.

[@bramt2000]

I agree. Pokemon games these days just take you by the hand and lead you through game. Makes me miss games like sonic riders where you just go in and figure stuff out as you play.

[@rexdawn7]

Pains me whenever people shout hate at this game, it was really fun for me because I actually had a brother who learned it with me.

[@Gillian_FFXIV]

Exactly the same for me. My bro & I learned this game together & it was an absolute BLAST. One of my favorite Sonic games even still to this day.

[@raiverns9620]

this is probably one of the top 5 sonic games of the 2000's its such a shame people hate on it

[@dylancross1039]

@@raiverns9620 Shame people have opinions right?

[@GuessWhatHappened1]

Same with my brother, but I personally never seen anyone complain about this game. Only sonic free riders 😂

[@RamielEdits]

I have a brother who teaches me

[@Duke091]

Even though I personally didn't find the game confusing, I do agree that it's really bad at teaching. In fact, my best friend and I bought this on day 1, and I had to teach him about the mechanics. For example, dunno how many people actually know this, but on the trick ramps, you can actually affect your trajectory by holding either down or up on the control stick while pressing A. Doing this will allow you to access certain shortcuts (the rainbow at the end of Splash Canyon, or the shorter automatic rail at the end of Metal City). It's something that rewards players for learning the layouts of the levels similar to Sonic tradition, but since the game fails to teach that, it's something that a large number of players will never learn about. Aside from that, this video was a treat to see. I love the Riders series (with this being my favorite of the trilogy), and it honestly made me smile to hear someone talk about the game with a similar passion that I share. Great work my friend.

[@noralr]

Duke wait there is three??? I only know and have 2

[@gabriellevy6655]

@@noralr Sonic Riders, Sonic Free Riders, Sonic Zero Gravity

[@noralr]

@@gabriellevy6655 thanks So there is Something called Free riders 🤔😈

[@RenShinomiya121]

@@noralr you don't need to play free riders

[@noralr]

@@RenShinomiya121 not gonna, i have the other 2 and just riders is my favorit 😻

[@greenknight9000]

Honestly, Super Sonic is a *_wonderful_* character to practise with, he can utilise all three types (Speed, Fly, and Power) and also tests your speed and memorisation by the classic Ring Drain mechanic, it's the ultimate practise tool!

[@quasar4780]

Honestly, they should have used it for a tutorial level since he's the easiest of the bunch to learn. Then in the story mode, he could have lost the chaoss emerals and the player would have to gather them back (to fight the final boss or something). That would have been a more appealing plot.

[@angel_of_rust]

you have to unlock him through the mission mode which requires a very high skill understanding.

[@lucywucyyy]

this game had a bangin sound track, i still love egg factory

[@donovanlucas3679]

antsolja Yeah, it had some pretty great music. My personal favorite track was the theme from SEGA Carnival/ SEGA Illusions (Pretty fun map, too)

[@MarcoPolo-hz1qy]

Mine is sand ruins

[@RaymanM2]

Best soundtracks for me were Egg Factory and Sand Ruins

[@m6kteatube]

green cave still ballin

[@Moonboy65]

Metal City, Sand Ruins and Babylon Garden are bangers

[@Hynotama]

Knuckles: Yeah, but what is Eggman really after? Sonic: Aw, it can’t be anything too important. When Knuckle is more intelligent than Sonic... when SEGA tries to convince us that Knuckles is a moron with a rock for brains.

[@Blueflag04]

Me - Sonic , i want to strangle but you dont have neck

[@kaexewires7531]

**COUGH COUGH** BOOM KNUCKLES (please insert a guy coughing image)

[@crimsonflame2k]

When putting it in D&D terms, I see it as Knuckles supposed to be having an Intelligence of 13 at the very least and a Wisdom of 8 or so. Well informed of certain things, such as lore on ancient ruins and treasure and being able to read ancient text (as Adventure 2 and Zero Gravity can attest to), but being a stubborn and gullible fool for the most part.

[@autobotstarscream765]

@@Blueflag04 They present Knuckles as stupid for regularly siding with Eggman and attacking Sonic and Tails, especially Sonic. But maybe Knuckles wanting to punch Sonic is understandable after all?

[@mandalorianhunter1]

@Tha Realest But piccolo is smart and wise, he also hardly betrays anyone.

[@ShadowHwkX7]

As someone who has poured hours into it and has unlocked all gears, characters and Super Sonic, my recommendation is to get the game. Sure the game is like a brick wall you need to climb, but once you know how to climb the wall with no effort at all, it becomes very fun.

[@thelordofeternalfireandhis4033]

ShadowHwkX7 I too have gotten to that point...twice i think

[@thelordofeternalfireandhis4033]

Yeah Chaos Emerald is extremely satisfying to play with, it’s op as heck, but it’s still a challenge because you have to get all the coins

[@GrandLufaine]

Agreed.

[@GuessWhatHappened1]

I unlocked everything except super sonic

[@IosLocarth]

I only learned about backflips and frontflips affecting jump height when I watched a speedrun from AGDQ

[@archieakira4237]

Same man I'm 21 and I bought this game when i was 7 this is a damn shame honestly.

[@prayingkitten8199]

Archie Akira I suppose I got lucky :)

[@kylecampbell565]

16:20 If you thought beating the mission mode to unlock the Sega characters were bad to unlock E-10000G you need to play 10 hours (tedious but reasonable) and to Unlock E-10000R you need 50 HOURS OF PLAY

[@ThatguycalledJoe]

Better leave it on overnight. Like, three to four times.

[@gaminwithwilson2437]

I actually have over 75 hours played on Sonic riders rn, but that's because me and my brothers are hella competitive

[@CiromBreeze]

... That explains why they were the only characters I ever unlocked.

[@roguepoison]

Unlocking characters by spending hours in a game is bad to unlock? I think that's the easiest kind of unlocks though, especially if you like playing the game.

[@patrick-cw5px]

i never realized it you unlock them that way, i remember i did 2nd profile so that i would grind all of the characters again but when i did 100% the game E-10000R was never unlocked i thought it was a glitch/bug.

[@UltimateTS64]

I love this game too, I don't really know how I figured out everything, but once you get it it's really fun.

[@cherrybansx7398]

yh i was thinking too how the heck did the preteen me figure these out?

[@UltimateTS64]

@@cherrybansx7398 Yeah I know, I was like 9 when I played this game and I figured everything out somehow 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@cherrybansx7398]

@@UltimateTS64 doing some research ...apparently there was quite alot of things i didnt discover back then

[@UltimateTS64]

@@cherrybansx7398 well same like being able to change your jump trajectory by leaning forwardor back off a jump, but we both understood enough of the mechanics to not feel confused by what was happening. I k

[@odst72397]

"The game's controls are just fine. The actual problem is the lack of teaching tools on how how to perform specific tasks." Tekken series: "I'm about to end this guy's whole career."

[@jiroren3747]

some people will never understand the struggle of learning Tekken haha

[@jjgarcia156]

@@jiroren3747 wait why? I always just button mash with orange-haired kicky guy who's name is something like Hywroang and is too difficult for me to pronounce. Or I button mash with Yoshimitsu, Samus' scarier-looking brother, and do either cool-ass moves or just move like an idiot and never do anything at all

[@jiroren3747]

You're not learning the game's fundamentals that way

[@jjgarcia156]

@@jiroren3747 what are they? Button mashing is all I know

[@jiroren3747]

Punishment Frame data Korean backdash Spacing Whiff punishment Knowing frame data means you should know: -what punisher you should use -when your turn ends -when you can continue pressure If you button mash a good player will counter hit you with a faster move because you are usually at minus frames if you just randomly throw out moves

[@haydenz0]

There are a few errors in this video. For example, you can grind on a rail by pressing A while you're above it (which makes that second rail in metal city very easy). Secondly, the "stats" listed on the character select menu don't actually mean anything. Rather there's a top speed difference, camera height (Ulala mostly), and boost duration stat that you can see with closer analysis. There's also a ton of things this video misses out on. Green Cave skip, Red Canyon Skip, Pause buffing skips, standard trick patterns (Up, Side, Side, Side gives an X rank trick with the easiest pattern, note that you should do the same side for each side flip), Gear tierlist (Super Sonic sucks, High Booster is OP, Darkness is the standard that works everywhere), 100 Ring Box, MAX Air Box, and probably a few more things. Feel free to join the Sonic Riders discord ( discord.gg/bzTkHNj ). We're working on a competitive build for Dolphin netplay, texture mods through Dolphin's custom texture loading, optimizing how we play, figuring out the game's code, and a few more things.

[@violetgenesis]

i might join!

[@marmar3530]

What is this secret world I've discovered

[@Robbie_Haruna]

I noticed he didn't mention the Rail grinding requiring pressing a button when above it (which is another problem since it works differently than every other Sonic Game with rails.) But why would he mention skips and exploits like that? This video isn't talking about that.

[@cherrybansx7398]

@@marmar3530 i was just looking for a new hobby too

[@jonathanwilson1539]

I see you noted the OP needs of High Booster (try it on Miles 😁). Super Sonic definitely needed a buff. Did you try Light board Cream? 🤔 Also, would you agree that learning to drift an boost is better than using the accelerator pads and gimmick/shortcut paths? This is what me an my younger bro found.

[@DIASTCartoons]

I enjoyed playing Sonic Riders too. I do agree that it is a game that you need to dedicate a lot of practice to fully enjoy. Also, playing as the other Sega characters by completing the mission mode is totally worth it. Aiai became my main when my brother unlocked him.

[@LiamTriforce]

that mode is mind-numbingly boring so i'll pass. as much as i love aiai i also like enjoying my video games soooooo ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@flyinurfries3000]

This is going to sound sad, but I loved this game so much as a kid I put in over 200+ hours into it. I still play it to this day. I love how different it feels compared to so many other racing games.

[@gamelegendalpha1737]

Don't be ashamed man. It's a good game. I played the hell out of it as a kid and I still go back to play it every now and then. Some of friends brought the game to the campus and I blew through the story mode for them in less than 20 minutes. I still have fun trying to master the game.

[@selassieaspen9940]

How is it sad? People put 1000 hours and then some into games.

[@CornCarson]

Yikes

[@kevin13cabello]

@@gamelegendalpha1737 I don't remember how long ago it was since I last played sonic riders when I still had my ps2 but a few months ago I decided to try playing it again on an emulator and it surprised me how much I still remembered and the muscle memory kick in again. I remember it took me awhile trying to beat the story for the first time but when I replayed the game it only took me less than an hour to beat both stories.

[@sucraloss]

There are two groups of people regarding this game: - People who learned the controls. - and people who hate the game. I can't blame the people who didn't learn it though, the controls are really hard to learn, especially for a kid when the only help you get is a short video in the game that sort of tells you what to do. Once you do learn it though it's such a fun game.

[@uberlord983]

To this day, my most memorable moment with this game, even after 100%ing it, is the time I accidentally discovered how to unlock E-1000G & R. One day, god knows how many years ago, I was sitting in the living room, playing Sonic Riders, when my mom springs a surprise trip to the aquarium on me. Excited, I had rushed to get ready to go so badly that I had forgot to turn the Wii(this was near the mid-end of the Wii era) off. So when I get home, realize what I did, I thought nothing of it, & continued playing, & advancing a whopping 1 dialogue box before receiving the message "You have unlocked E-10000G!" 8:48 The most tangible reasoning I can come up with in terms of that is that air blows off of the ice differently than normal terrain, causing the board to "slip". Then again, the same question can be asked for off-road. 10:56 Well, there is a How To Play video in the Settings, but who goes straight to Settings when first playing a game? 13:13 But Smash Bros has done the same thing for 20 years running now, & it's one of THE most popular games to this day right now, & its not simple to learn. At all.

[@TaskMaster5]

Smash is super simple to learn. Those little intro videos tell you everything you need to know to play the game...at it's most basic, fundamental level. That info is all any group of kids or new players need to know to understand how the game works and to have fun playing it. All the 'high level tech' that comes later is borderline of no use to people just playing to play and learning or even wanting to look into mechanics further really only matters to those seeking to ace their friends or possibly become competitive players. Smash is super easy to pick up and play. It's difficult to master.

[@Ocarinist_Drew]

Ok, I played the HELL out of this game as a kid, and I had NO IDEA half these mechanics existed.

[@ahroranova]

Me either tbh

[@Ocarinist_Drew]

@Gonna cry? I mean, it kinda is? Most games have seemless, built-in tutorials. They teach the player how to play by putting them in low-stakes situations where the player can't help but figure out the mechanics. I couldn't even tell you where Sonic Riders' tutorial is. Is it burried deep in a menu somewhere? Haven't played the game in years and don't remember ever seeing a tutorial as a kid. Don't get me wrong, this game is great and I love it. It just doesn't do a great job teaching the player how to play, compared to most other modern games.

[@Ocarinist_Drew]

@Gonna cry? It's not about being "forced" into a tutorial. Well designed games have tutorials that you don't even notice are tutorials. There are so many videos explaining the genius design of SMB world 1-1 for example, and how it is designed in such a way that the player naturally learns the mechanics of the game. That's the thing about video games. If designed well, they can teach the player without the aid of an instruction manual. Obviously the more complex a game is, the more mechanics it has, the harder it is to do that though. Sonic Riders is a good example of that. It has a lot of mechanics and a lot of depth, so the best they could do was put a tutorial in the menu somewhere I guess.

[@turboshell]

@@Ocarinist_Drew they put the tutorial under theater in extras for some reason, i didn't notice it until after i had beaten the hero story. It would've made more sense to show you the video when you first start the game

[@asylumrain]

@Do what you need to with her,then broom her fast. this game doesn’t have a tutorial

[@IndieLambda]

I think that another side issue is that people expected it to be Sonic's Mario Kart, when it's a bit more like an AG Racer (like Z-Zero) to me than a propper Kart Racer, I miss both Sonic Riders and F-Zero, now we have Sonic Racing, and well, I'm already playing Mario Kart.

[@alcheowl]

I would 110% LOVE if Sega were to ever do a definitive edition or smthn of this game. I loved the gameplay as a kid and even now, though even on an emulator I find the tracks to be really muddy in design, metal city is a great example of this. the repeating patterns and constant lines attract your eye to the track, sure, but then you aren't taking in the turbulence, the flight ramps, or what's coming up as far as turns go. at least that's my experience. making it so you don't ping pong off of walls would also be a great improvement. this game has such great gameplay and has my favorite sonic design and art style all around. ik its probably never gonna happen but I'm still holding onto the hope that a riders definitive would release one day

[@JXDemon21]

I always did love this game and it's sequel Zero Gravity but I can agree that it's learning curve is way to high for new players hell it still took me a while to get used to the mechanics after picking it up and playing it. Years later though I still love this game everytime I pop it in same for it's sequel Zero Gravity even though that game tried streamlining mechanics and changing things for better or for worse depending on one's opinions. Personally both Riders and Zero Gravity are good games if you're willing to put up with the mechanics that aren't properly explained or shown to the player unless given a lot of practice which then is where the Rider Series is at it's best. Minus Free Riders cause that was unfortunately released on the Kinect and killed the series for good...

[@pyrrhickong]

MY GIRL ULALA IS IN THIS GAME?! AND I NEVER KNEW?! WHERE IS MY COPY COLLECTING DUST, I NEED TO FREE HER. It's kind of amazing seeing this game played on such a high level. It reminds me a lot of Tony Hawk, which also doesn't teach you directly, but uses level geometry to guide you and has openness to guide the player's hand, whereas the 'race' aspect of Riders kinda kills the idea of experimentation dead.Still, with how many games (fighting games, the Souls series, etc.) require such deep levels of repetition in order to master them, it's kinda surprising how thick Sonic Riders' wall to entry is. But now I wanna replay it. Damn you. Good vid.

[@lupinsredjacket3191]

pyrrhickong Pretty sure that Jet the Hawk was a play on Tony Hawk with the whole boarding concept and the fact that he's a...well, boarding hawk. 😂

[@theamazingmoist1586]

That editing was CLEAN! The video’s okay too I guess... This definitely seems like a tragic story for a game so rich and intricate. Hard to believe this game lagged behind even with that issue though. This honestly looks super fun and I could see myself getting my friends together to play it since we would all suck at it equally. Great video regardless. G o o d J o b.

[@FiltiarnYT]

Tournament edition exists for Sonic Riders. It's a super dedicated community.

[@ashleydavis8044]

“Sonic Colors was the only good Wonder Woman movie.” 😭

[@deanmoriarty6015]

this game is definitely very fun and could’ve been an amazing racing franchise if treated properly but i love how much charm it has. the stylistic choices and aesthetics are great. don’t even get me started on that intro cutscene 😍

[@Manavine]

Kingdom Hearts actually has a better end quote: One who knows nothing can understand nothing.

[@iamnihon3427]

But I can understand nothing

[@andreoskisgoda]

Thats lack of curiosity

[@Sorrelhas]

"When I first saw this prompt, I thought I needed to flick the stick up and down repeatedly to keep afloat" Oh God, the nostalgia

[@Zman7981]

I've been playing riders on and off for years and I didn't even know you could brake out of turbulence! I thought you could only get out by going fast enough through it via doing tricks and gaining speed through the turbulence.

[@astralm8072]

I vaguely remember the lack of replayable single player stages before clearing the first story mode being part of the problem. You get to Babylon Garden, but there's no way to replay the earlier levels, practicing some of those mechanics and just getting more varied experience, without restarting the game.

[@bunnybreaker]

I loved this game when it came out. Those stats though, and you're right about the lack of newbie help.

[@zydian_]

As a ps2 collector this game looked cool, bought it couple years ago. Started on a desert map. First corner and I couldnt make it. 30+ atempts later i put it on my closet... Ill give it an extra shot bcs it genuinely looks fun and i love games that offer a good amount of game tech.

[@bijuutamer729]

Watching this made me realize how amazing it was I took the time to grasp every concept this game. Wasn’t Super Sonic ass? It ate rings too quickly.

[@jonathanwilson1539]

He's pretty good if you practice with him..but it's something crazy to get use to..Mastering Hoverboard (Flying Nimbus) is way much of a more impossible and suck ass task.

[@kevin13cabello]

@@jonathanwilson1539 Mastering that board is the only thing I didn't bother to try doing lol

[@jonathanwilson1539]

@@kevin13cabello 🤣 I tried...let's just say it's not for the impatient.

[@FelineBlue]

i bought and played this game for the first time in 2020. it got me absolutely hooked even all these years later, once i figured out how to play it! i agree the lack of communication is the main flaw, i distinctly remember opening the first level and immediately going "whats going on? what the hell am i soing?". but i persevered and found the tutorial video and figured out a lot of other stuff through trial and error and played this game so much i got blisters on my thumb. it's incredibly rewarding and i wish i had a way to play it with other people

[@ThePlasticBowl]

The tricks system felt so fun and innovating to me at the time, they really ruined it in the second game

[@A.R.T.4]

I could literally not agree anymore. The botched the trick system. In fact, ZG took away a lot of freedom from the first game. Tricks were determined by when you hit the jump button instead of mix and matching with the joystick, and you couldn’t even boost whenever you wanted. Rails and flight rings weren’t shortcuts either, they followed the track and even slowed you down in some cases

[@AegixDrakan]

@@A.R.T.4 Yeah. ZG had more fun level design in general, and the gravity shenanigans could be REAL fun....But the unfortunate ruining of tricks, the removal of the air meter, the fact boosting was only ever useful on ONE designated part of the track (outside of a few unintended tricky places)....They unfortunately brought the game down. :(

[@magikalguru2515]

Zero gravity was my shit idk what's wrong with y'all

[@AegixDrakan]

@@magikalguru2515 I may have complained, but I still totally loved the game nonetheless. :P

[@ThePlasticBowl]

Magikal Guru it felt too slow and automated compared to the original

[@DesignFrameCaseStudies]

I remember playing this and the sequel as a kid. One of the only good racing games out there. Thank you for spreading the Sonic Riders message!

[@megasoniczxx]

Yeah, I remember as a kid being really confused as to why everyone hated this game (I remember the G4 review in specific when one of the notable complaints was how useless and unintuitive the air mechanic was while I thought I just sat there wondering what was wrong with it?) but now I can understand why. Like, I didn't even figure out you could get out of turbulence until a couple of years after I initially got the game and I don't even remember how I learned the mechanics of how the jumps work. I guess this is why whenever an unorthodox racing game comes out, unless it's mario kart it can be a hard sell to a lot of people since mario is simple and literally anybody can pick it up and have fun no matter what experience they have while games like these require a lot more skill and understanding of the mechanics to avoid frustration.

[@broccolinyu911]

I remember when I first got this game as a kid. I sucked ass at the first level and quit. came back a few years later, determined to complete it. Slowly I got better and now I love it. But yeah, the story was lost potential to not only teach the player about mechanics, but also just introduce us more to the newcomers. I loved Jet and co. they were lost potential in and of themselves

[@lucywucyyy]

idk how i managed to complete this game as a kid, i remember watching the tutorial video and not taking in anything, i really enjoyed the game anyway tho

[@Zarmakai]

Even in the beggining, there's a part before the goal, the ramp part, where you need to do it perfect for getting on the top and not use the "elevator". I never knew how to get there

[@tornadix99]

YES! YES! i agree with this 100%. Its frustrating when you say to your friends: "hey, this game is good, give it a try" And they reply. Its too complicated, its trash." Its not, it just has a very hard learning curve because its not conveyed to the player. Finding people who actually knew how to play this game is almost impossible outside of internet, since those who have just gave up on playing, their minds filled with the idea that Sonic riders is not good. Even if i get someone to play, they aren't good enough to compete with me, since they don't have the amount of practice that i do. However, once its learned, is really fun... This game = frustration.

[@MrZorro-if5jw]

No lie I would love to play with you lol. Got me thinking how this would work out if this was an online multiplayer. It'll probably be a huge mess being honest but it still sounds fun af.

[@rhondahoward8025]

12:28 _I can't tell you how many fucking times I got caught in someone's turbulence when trying to go on a rail._ *Ditto.* God, that was always so frustrating, especially in Sand Ruins. Holy shit, that would mess me up so many times, and into many death pits I would fall once I got out of it!

[@rhondahoward8025]

@Marco Zepeda Yeah I know that now. The game never explains how to exit turbulence.

[@alastor5918]

Game was one of the first I ever played. Still have a f*cking blast crushing robots into dust boosting into them.

[@LLotad]

on the pc version being confused is even worst, theres no controller icons or anything during gameplay, theres no "b button to boost" theres the drift icon but theres no stick and brake button that shows up.

[@CherikoSol]

This is why I loved the original so much, there was so much hidden in its mechanics but it is really bad at explaining. I only learned because I played it a ton as a kid

[@Azazreal]

Never got to touch this as a kid and it seems like something that would rock with a remaster and online multiplayer

[@cheesy124entertainment7]

Liam, I really loved on how you went in depth of Sonic Riders with the controls, characters, and other features added in the game. The biggest problem I had in particular while playing it were the unlocking of the secret characters (E1000G and E1000R) and purchasing gears from the shop and Mission Mode. In my experience of seeing and playing this, I thought that this Sonic game would suck in terms of the control structure. But after watching the trailers and seeing the commercials of it on TV, this game was fucking amazing! I remember telling my brother about it after seeing the commerical and he too was hyped up about the game. That was until we went straight to the game's website and saw the features of what Sonic Riders has in store for the players. All in all, Sonic Riders is such an amazing game IMO, but Zero Gravity is better in terms of story, but not with game play. The game play in Zero Gravity is mediocre in comparison to the first game where Riders relied on using air and Zero Gravity relied on using gravity. But Free Riders was the absolute WORST game in the trilogy where you had to use the fucking Xbox 360 Kinect motion controls to control your characters.

[@TheWax70]

Didn't know about the ability to tornado other racers. Or the ability to break out of a other racer's turbulence. Anyways good job on the vid!

[@SSJ22Terris]

Hard agree! Though I actually did come to appreciate the game more through the mission mode, since I had to get a lot sharper to complete it. (Though I don't think I ever actually finished it.

[@SquirtlePWN]

I miss Sonic riders. I wouldn't be upset if they gave it a reboot with online.

[@coopersd100]

"Games shouldn't be a project for the consumer, they should be fun. They should be pick up and play." Don't ever let this guy near a fighting game.

[@ShockwaveITB]

Fighting games should be pick up and play, however they should take practice and skill to master.

[@QwixLF]

And people wonder why fighting game circles are so insular. A reasonable floor, but a high ceiling is the ideal.

[@SahilSharma-ld4dg]

You have awakened the nostalgia in me that has been put away for years. I'm going to get another copy of this and start playing again.

[@HellothisisRev]

Timestamp - 16:53 to 17:08 Most of you going through the comments lately have noticed this video is suddenly gaining traffic again. Some of you will also have noticed a few mentioning a net-play mod hosted online for everyone to join and participate in. It's not a joke folks, it's real. discord.gg/vB7RrDf - The Sonic Riders Competitive Discord Server We've modified the game a lot, and made it even better. Get in here already!

[@jonathanwilson1539]

😁 what's needed?! Me and my bro would love to try that out..we competed and still do from time to time on Sonic Riders mad crazy.

[@HellothisisRev]

@@jonathanwilson1539 you just need a decent laptop and an internet connetion. Join the server for more info

[@PSPMan]

Hey man, great video! I'm popping in cause my Analytics told me that your video has been suggesting my How to Play Sonic Riders video. I've been aware of your video's existence (thought the title was excellent personally) for some time, but never watched it till now because I wanted to focus on my video first, and then naturally forgot. I agree with so much of whats been said. Personally i found the tutorial/manual for this game horrible at actually teaching you how to play, and as a kid I only learned thanks to a guide on GameFAQs. That's why my video exists And my idea going into making it was I was going to fill a gap in the community since so many people don't understand how to play this game and there isn't an easily accessible resource that teaches them. The only thing I disagree with you on is Mission Mode's significance. Yes a lot of the content is samey, but I looked at it as giving you more practice, and Once you understand the mechanics I actually suggested it to people as a way to hone their skills. Later missions (mainly jet's set) start to shake things up a bit, but I understand why the repetition could turn someone off. I actually didn't know that Dash was acceleration, I also thought it affected your boost (and I think I even said so in my video lmao) idk why it's labeled that way. It's funny you bring up online play because there's actually a fan community dedicated for that sole purpose. They found my video shortly after uploading and invited me to their Discord server. They've not only got a network mod for the game but a rebalancing one as well. I don't play with them but it's been crazy seeing how much effort they've put into it, just last month they released a massive update. Anyways, that's about it. If you want links to anything I mentioned let me know. I don't want to put it in the initial comment because I'm afraid that KZbin will hide it automatically. Again, great video!

[@LAZY-RUBY]

Sonic Riders is legitimately one of my favorite games and I never did understand why it was so slept on, but the lack of explanation about the mechanics makes a lotta sense. Shame SEGA decided to dumb everything down for the sequel instead of just building upon it and making a proper tutorial.

[@Amsel_616]

The worse part is that the ZG tutorial is great.

[@OtakuNewsSource]

It's honestly quite bizarre to me to see that people actually had problems playing and understanding Sonic Riders. I think this is a very well-made video that highlight key issues the game has, but when I was a kid and got the game when it came out, I didn't have much problems at all understanding it. Certain things about it just seemed a bit obvious to me. Like, okay, at see characters backing up at the start of the race and running towards the gate, so I automatically assumed it's to get out there quickly. There's your first ramp in Metal City, so there's a possibility you can jump on it, and the A button (Gamecube controller) is normally used for jumping in video games. There's cars and they hurt me (playing as Sonic), so I'll try not to get hit by them again. And there's a rail coming up, so I probably can grind it like I can in Sonic Adventure 2: Battle. That's just all the opening stuff of the level, and it all clicked with me. Definitely feel that early on something telling you to drift where the rail is at SHOULD be there, but...trial and error as you play through Metal City. With that out of the way, I honestly find Sonic Riders to be one of the best racing games I've ever had the pleasure of growing up with and playing. It's exhilarating fun when you master the game. I thought that Sonic & All-Stars Racing Transformed was my favorite Sonic racer, but thinking about Riders again lately has made me start to feel that maybe Riders is my favorite Sonic racer. It has a unique style and identity that sadly was never captured again with its sequels or other future racing games...

[@danielsurvivor1372]

16:58 This statement didn't age well, THERE IS NOW *OFFICIAL SONIC RIDERS COMPETITIVE SCENE! WOHOOOOOOOO!* So I guess in the end, you were right, you were the first person to give this game a chance in a competitive sense, and you were right in the end

[@okeenowhite8272]

I really loved this game i started off bad at first but I eventually was determine to learn how to play the game

[@PSYCH0WARRI0R]

This is literally the only game where I can wholeheartedly say I can win Everytime in it

[@ChibiSilex]

Something I didn't see noted: If you press L+R you drop a tornado at the cost of some air. It's like spending some gas for a mine. However, if you do this while on turbulence, it will automatically break you out of it. It's great for when someone swerves in front of you, and starts pulling you in a way you don't want to go.

[@lupinsredjacket3191]

Fun Fact: The studio that animated the Sonic Riders opening is the same studio that animated the hit anime Attack on Titan.

[@PrimeKingSage]

I had loved playing Sonic Riders so much, when I was a teen. I wish that I still have it. Great review

[@MastaGambit]

"Game's shouldn't be a project" Sounds like you hate MMOs then haha

[@MrCurryCH]

just because a game doesnt necessarily spoonfeed every single little fuckin thing to the player, does NOT mean the game is automatically bad. i think most people are just lazy.

[@jetster4117]

@@MrCurryCH if a complicated game doesnt teach you shit, people arent gonna like it. If it does, people will. Explain your mechanics, its not hard

[@schmoopDJ]

this games music and character select screen is so nostalgic god damn

[@theemeraldknight5434]

I used to always play this game I was a pro lmao also first

[@MajoradeMayhem]

So in summary: tutorials are IMPORTANT, game devs!

[@Szuszuro]

I love this game. Me and my brother used to play it all the time like crazy. We learned everything all by ourselves and as english isn't our native language we couldn't even undestand the tutorial. Eventually we managed to master everything and had plenty of fun with it on all of the modes (Battle Mode isn't that bad, it just takes time to get what's going on). I 100% completed this game a several times, actually. Even enjoyed doing missions, though they are in fact repetitive. Nice video!

[@reborn9488]

It would be cool if they make a multiplayer remake out of these games

[@datdamnmegabusta5604]

I'm over a year late, but this is the only racing game I've ever cared about, and so I feel obligated to say thank you. Thank you for this fair critique of a very underrated gem. I'm one of the rare ones, I guess, that had very little difficulty learning SR's learning curve. It's true that once all of its in and outs are understood, it is a profoundly kinetic and engaging racer. I remember the days of Jet on Faster, and Sonic on Fastest... One day, I'll emulate!

[@maboi0007]

What's really funny is that, in French : Dash is translated into acceleration. But limit and power remain the same. Lol

[@dragonbornexpress5650]

The localization team must have been on some serious drugs for that.

[@GeorgeMartinus]

Agree, I loved this game and had completed 100% to get Super Sonic. For racing game, the gameplay was so innovative at the time. The start countdown is my most favourite part, the implement is so great and unique. Even until now I cannot find any other racing games with that kind of electric start point. Yes, you are right. It lacks of graspable how-to play mechanical. I even learned that shortcut skills (rail, fly, knock) after playing it more than 1 month. But I did like it because the excitement of finding something new after playing the game in such long duration. My passion to this game challenged me to beat it completely. So after beat story mode, I proceed to do other modes, like: purchasing all rides and characters, and of course unlock the Super Sonic! Truthfully, it was extremely boring to beat all those mission modes. Some of them were really difficult, especially the level which we have to reach certain high scores that can only be achieved by performing XX jumps. Imagine how many restarts that I needed to complete that levels.. Haha

[@Keyguin]

This was my favorite racing game when it came out. But I had no idea how to grind rails or get to higher places from jumps. That was the only thing keeping me from unlocking Super Sonic, I held off grind missions for months.

[@MajoradeMayhem]

>Sonic gives Robotnik a Chaos Emerald and they say Knuckles is the dumb one

[@WelshMC]

I actually went back to playing sonic riders recently, there’s a hidden mechanic on some jump ramps that lead to shortcuts, if you hold up on ramps without curves then you travel further and land on far away platforms (e.g Splash Canyon) but if you hold back on ramps curving upwards, you can land on higher platforms (e.g metropolise)

[@Noxedwin]

As someone who has a video on their channel of a 99-Lap run on SEGA Carnival, I adore this game. It's a pleasure to control if you're good at it. Maintaining flow feels great, the story is exactly what it needs to be (that is, a level of "hell yeah, this is so stupid, I love it" we don't see again until _Sonic Forces,_ bless it), the music is awesome. But _damn,_ it is inpenetrable to people who don't have a guide or a natural intuition. Then _Zero Gravity_ came out, and it was little more than more of the same. Then _Free Riders_ came out, and we don't talk about that one. Back to the story, though, everyone is idiotic or unappealing, as that's the only way the story doesn't get resolved in five seconds. They gave Tails a level of autism that doesn't get rivalled until _Sonic Boom,_ *Knuckles* (the one infamous for being tricked every other game, to the point where his _Boom_ incarnation tried to put a screaming baby in a food-blender because he doesn't understand syntax) is the voice of reason, the Rogues are all terrible, and the fact that Eggman (a notable *actual war-criminal)* is allowed to start a Grand Prix association without being raided by GUN beggars belief. Sonic's entire reason for existing is "I'm the fastest thing on two legs, but that guy says I'm not the fastest on not-two-legs. I'll make him eat those words.". But you don't play a racing game for the story. This isn't _Forza._ It's not _Need for Speed._ It's furries on magic snowboards. If you're looking for water, don't search the desert.

[@BrookieSmallz]

I loved this game. Yeah I had to learn a lot on my own and I would look up how to unlock all the extra characters after I beat the game. Really wish it had a remaster or that the sequels were good.

[@UltimegaSeven]

Possibly the only racing game i know that had extreme levels of depth. I LOVE that you can travel all over maps in different ways. Amd the fact that you can be stylish and get speed for it is such a cool thing to do

[@SkateTroe]

I remember struggling so much with this game back in high school. Just getting past the first race of the story mode took me for freakin' ever!!

[@professionaldonutmaker9489]

Back when I was just a little kid, this was my favorite game aside from watching my father play Pikmin. Hell, I played this game so much the disc literally became unloadable, crashing every single time I tried. I'd start it up, listen to the music, and then it would freeze or say disc unreadable. Ah,,, I miss those days

[@maskofice9432]

Another mechanic that I remember from playing it that took way too much experimentation to figure out was that the type of flip you do in tricks can determine whether you get to the alternate route. If I remember correctly, back flips gain you height and front flips gain you distance, so if there's an alternate path that's high up after a trick like at the end of Metal City, you need to back flip, but for the trick at the beginning of metal city, you want to front flip.

[@honeycombavenue1715]

I never learned how to use the flight type. Even with the tutorials and internet. They are the hardest to learn so I avoided them if I wasn’t doing free play. Also, battle mode was FUN! Not by yourself though.

[@Nova-Solaris]

11:50 Thought the exact same. Never got what was I supposed to do with flight characters in this parts. :/

[@64b4bx]

Somehow I understood this game more as a kid than when I tried going back to it when I was 17 or 18. I remember breezing through the story and competing against my best friend, yet when I came back to it I struggled to go anywhere in the story. I think the farthest I got was the Tails vs Wave section. This is still a great childhood classic to me and this video has helped me ACTUALLY understand the mechanics and goals of the game a lot more and has me excited to revisit it again at 19.

[@orchid9]

I loved that game back in the day. It's so complex and mixes a ton of fun mechanics into solid gameplay loop that's never feels repetitive. But man playing it after all those years, it's so hard to learn what the hell am I supposed to be doing even when I loosely remember how to play. I still remember how I explained mechanics to friends for solid hour, but it was well worth it - once you learn the basics it's a smooth sailing from there. We played for weeks in split screen every day, it's so much fun in multiplayer.

[@CanalDoTakato]

There is actually a competitive scene for this game. They use a patched game cube version, that is modified to be more balanced, and play using Dolphin's netplay. They do tournaments and everything. Pretty nice stuff.

[@crimsonshadow1140]

when you think about it, the air mechanic in sonic riders is very F-Zero inspired in a way, minus the natural air consumption and there’s no permadeath. The air meter allows you to boost and perform offensive moves but use too much of it and you will be put at a temporary disadvantage

[@JhysenTheAsian]

Man when i tell you the nostalgia hit me HARD with this...

[@CarlolucaS]

I played this game as a child for probably 200 hours. It was the game that I played the most on PS2. I unlocked everything without understanding a single thing because everything was in English and I hadn't learned Eglish, yet. I can still remember that the railing-thing was the worst part of the game because I could never figure out how to get on them consistently. The fact that I still remember a flaw in the game and everything you showed in the video seemed not only familiar but instantly recognizable is definitely a testament that this game deserved better.

[@DaSuperGamer]

One of my favorite childhood games, right here! Great job, Liam! :D Now if you'll excuse me, I need to play this game again. It's been too long.

[@jonathanlgill]

I agree. Sega did a commendable job making a stylish, fast, and mechanically complex racing game. The trick system off of jumps turns into am exhilarating game of chicken with the floor, and the multiple functions that air provides mean that racing along a track is always an engaged, involved affair. The branching routes for the 3 character types are handled surprisingly well. There's plenty of replay value. And while I wish gear was cheaper, it's a fun bonus to experiment with.

[@MrMuggles]

It's 2020, and I've just learned that Sonic Riders had a tutorial video! Seriously though, while it may have been a little obtuse at first with the lack of instruction, it really didn't take long to figure it out, but apparently it took just a bit *too* long for most people to stick with it. It's a real pity, because it was one of my favourite games on my GameCube growing up. (Side note, I actually quite enjoyed doing the mission modes myself!)

[@TigerWolf111]

Loved this game as a kiddo, same with my brother, we even unlocked everything in the game... even though I only ever picked Sonic and he'd pick Shadow and the same 2 Extreme Gears over and over again. Also loved the character designs and the art especially, I've always hoped it would make a return someday. I even have the opening song on my phone. I loved this game and everything about it... it's just a shame I'll never get the chance to play it again.

[@PankaikeAussieShep]

i love this game so much! i played it all the time when i was a kid and you're absolutely right, the lack of communication in this really hampered my enjoyment as a youngin but coming back i see the genius in its design!

[@LambdaBelmont]

There actually is a competitive scene out there for this game, even a mod for the Gamecube version to balance out the gears, add new music, and clean up the textures. It's called Sonic Riders: Tournament Edition if you're ever curious.

[@dragonspear570]

I remember the times back in 2011 when I didn’t have any nextgen consoles and just my sister’s pink PS2 Slim; I’d spend entire days grinding out Time Trial mode to get rings to buy new boards. My God that was so much fun.

[@Wreviews]

I would actually love to hear your take on the sequel. I remember it also being incredibly hard to grasp at first, but it did have a online multiplayer, multiple storylines and some new mechanics.

[@Yous0147]

This game was one of my favourite games to play and replay as a kid. Thank you for reminding me of this gem, it honestly didn't deserve the lukewarm reception, and I agree, had it had online multiplayer it would likely have been a stable series today. Such an awesome game! I just can't fathom how much rich content is packed in it both mechanically and otherwise.

[@kremitthetaco8725]

I first played this game at a friend of my brothers house and he was kind enough to let me borrow it but as the little shit I was I never made it past the babylon race. Later I bought the game for myself and eventually made it past. I love this game, I wish they made a new Riders for the Switch and when I saw cover art for Sonic Rider Velocity my heart suddenly heated up a litte. I was super disappointed to find out this was just a fanmade piece and there are still no plans for a new Sonic Riders. I've never unlocked all characters and I never even knew of the SEGA crossover tracks until now. If my PS2 was still working I'd instantly go back to unlock all those things. I miss this game a lot.

[@prayingkitten8199]

Kremit The Taco I would have given you my copy, but I remembered I owned a ps2 slim ;-;

[@samgarrison1996]

This was one of my favorite games as a kid, I played it all the time and I didnt know half of these mechanics even existed lol! great vid!

[@reagan602]

I actually adored this game as a kid, my friends and I would play it so often. I remember it being very difficult at first and the feeling of reaching those high points after a huge jump was the best. For a long while I forgot this existed! I’m gonna bust out the ol Xbox this Sunday and check it out again after all these years! Great nostalgia and awesome video! Update: opened my save file and I have around 129 hours on this bad boi