Spring '22 regular season wrap-up / Which player deserves MVP? - Best Damn League Show S1E8

[@atraxia661]

I like how they make Thorin's cam looks like a stop motion animation from 90s and DOM's cam looks like Skype call from 2008. so nostalgic

[@corpse6193]

BDS have Crownshot in academy, there's no way they don't swap him and xMatty, right? If Agresivoo is any good, might swap him and Adam as well. Imo NuclearInt is serviceable and if you swap Crownshot in, you probably want to play LIMIT

[@Rzibii]

Agresivoo is actually pretty good (I know, as a Pole, I am nationality biased, but well). He seems like a guy that should have already a split or two in LEC, plus he actually played a whole year with cinkrof in Devils.One. So, sub in Crownshot, get yourself a strong ERL midlaner, and you end up with a strong team. Maybe not a top4, but who knows.

[@slendian]

@@Rzibii i think at this point you need to sub out adam to win more games. He ran down leads pretty hard and solo lost too many games

[@LordKeram]

I would completely agree with you for the first half of the split, but in the second xMatty looked pretty good. It's just that BDS's solo lanes can't play the game. The weirdest part is if you are kind of branding yourself as the French team, then why not just get Saken+Cabo from KCorp? At that point you just KCorp from last year and to me that is a good thing. Otherwise if you want to minmax it, it's actually completely fine to get Agresivoo+Crownie, but imo you still need a change in the midlane and that one is hard, cuz I don't see many people getting on the level of the top 5 in LEC.

[@samueltunnicliffe7012]

@@Rzibii I like the idea of an IRL midlaner - pretty sure you mean ERLs but I enjoy the idea of a non IRL mid

[@Rzibii]

@@samueltunnicliffe7012 Jesus, autocorrect went bonobo here xD

[@alexanderschwarz242]

another thing about upset: he hasn't died in the first 14 minutes of a game the entire split, he has the best laning stats of any ADC and has not messed up hard enough to die in lane once

[@ryanv8783]

Ya his average deaths per game is .6 that's actually crazy with a 16 kda

[@joaomiguel178]

elyoya and kaiser to vitality would be chefs kiss

[@skaddyvenom7613]

Chapeus bas IWD. Great explanation of how much Jankos does do for his team, but in quiet/nonflashy fashion.

[@Repl1ka404]

26:30 Forg1ven Tribute of the week

[@effIron]

Does this show have a podcast version? Or is it KZbin only?

[@Jakob_1010]

Afaik it’s just on KZbin, but I‘d also love it on spotify

[@alienobserver7220]

Thanks for the podcast gentlemen.

[@Hades_GOUD]

Thorin describing TSM banter as kicking a corpse made me cackle way harder then it should have. Feel kinda bad now

[@Nordickaiser]

Every player is saying G2 are beasts I'm scrims and that they would do better in bo5, so i wonder if maybe were underselling them a bit. But based on split results i do think thorin and dom have come up with right conclusions and that it's up to the teams to prove their mettle

[@waooo]

thorin in 10 fps and dom is in 144p

[@happycorgi8328]

Why is Dom's picture so blurry

[@vanidar21]

I agree on that Mac point (keeping Reeker). But we have to remember that they pretty uncerimoniously cut Orome and got Armut after they got stomped by him at Worlds.

[@broefkip]

Yea but Orome did get 2 splits (spring and Summer) and we don't know how it works with team dynamic and scrims. Maybe Reeker shows a lot of promise in team discussions or practice that we don't get to see and Orome didn't show similar potential you know. I do think you have a good point there, but biggest thing I would take away from it is that if Reeker is indeed not up to what MAD wants they won't be scared to swap him.

[@connoryouknowwhat4537]

nice show, always enjoy you two shooting the shit.

[@seanheselden9922]

Vander for Labrov

[@AdmiralMug]

Was saying this. Why is Vander in LFL right now?

[@ReaverMoggy]

Perkz on his phone, begging c9 for Zven

[@TheDarkKnightEE]

if mad lions need a humanoid/nisqy like player why not if ur gonna double down with reeker, why not hire nisqy as a positional coach to develop reeker

[@OMAR-vk9pi]

Ls called vitality flopping and got flamed 😂

[@mr.spooderman4912]

rekkles has stopped playing over passively for what 4 years now or something...

[@andreykovachev7002]

In my opinion, if MSF plays through bot against Rogue they have a chance at winning.

[@broefkip]

I am very interested in how this would work. Doesn't Mersa just get supp gapped?

[@Orimedis]

nice

[@husseinpoliphilo]

Vander to vitality when ?

[@hourlysword3568]

Vitality Vander does have a nice ring to it

[@alexs.9903]

Hyli for MVP. Straight facts.

[@triplea3005]

I am predicting Fnc 1-3 G2 no reason just copium

[@ryanv8783]

Bold take msf beat rogue 3-1

[@oscarxue1643]

just fking import Shenyi to vitality.

[@user-px6sx3xf3k]

Vitality looks like LEC C9, right now.

[@snizzy69]

What?

[@Whyisthatlamptalking]

What? This makes no sense....

[@noobgun12]

Fnc will choke not this split maybe but next split they will i can feel it already

[@LordKeram]

On the Misfits discussion. If you look at their games it gets even worse. They beat all the "weak" teams 2-0 except for one SK int game. So now you have the "strong" teams. Well they lost 0-2 to VIT a team that is already struggling hard. And then they went 1-1 vs FNC, ROG and G2. Great right? No! They beat Rogue on the week they tried something completely new that did not work at all and went 0-2... Then they beat G2 in the literal biggest comeback of like all time. Then they play FNC, are getting absolutely shit stomped for 25 minutes, pause the game for 20 minutes. Have time to untilt, reset, get a coffee, think of a way to win the game and get ready. Fnatic meanwhile have to sit in a game they had already won waiting for someone on the other team to resolve their minor issue. All this to say, there is literally not a single game against a top 5 team Misfits won that does not have an asterisk next to it.

[@fraolfeye5302]

I'm just impressed by vetheo. I don't think msf as a team has a chance to beat anyone in bo5 except for maybe xl and vit anyways.

[@Symbol96]

cope

[@jiloujensen2498]

I don't agree with the msf vs rge game. It was way more standard than the real for fun game they had vs Astralis. Just look at the comps. It was probably their cleanest win of all this split btw. Apart from that yeah you are right, they're merely above XL's lvl and its mainly thanks to VTO. Then for the Fnc pause, just look at Neon interview post game, he explained it and it's hella legit especially knowing FNC recent history... Then again, let's try to count here. You say "not a single win vs top 5" and you mention 4 teams. Does that make MSF 5th or 6th?

[@LordKeram]

@@jiloujensen2498 Rewatched the game. It was hard won in draft and still looked pretty close based on some outplays from Rogue in the midgame. If you can't tell the draft is a fuckin huge gap, you shouldn't comment.

[@jiloujensen2498]

@@LordKeram A draft gap isn't the same kind of asterisk as the yuumi comebacks and stuff but yeah, the agression you show is helping conveying your point. Right insecure mindset. You just had a valid point and did everything you could to make all games fit this narrative while it was not fully accurate.

[@marusis4453]

This thumbnail describes this show perfectly

[@Pigraider268]

Haha :D

[@awareclueless]

Thorin with another banging joke and Dom just going oh no Thorin what have you said today.

[@spartanvinc]

Dom is such a massive BB apologist. I know you're friends with him but relax... yes hes top 3 in LEC this split but you can still say hes losing lanes even when he gets counterpick and rescources every game.

[@jay6065]

Trueee

[@aryapalla2491]

He literally did say that tho, he said that BB inted multiple times

[@jourdansarpy4935]

Vetheo is doing in LEC what Bjergsen was doing on TSM in season 5 when Bjergsen was considered the best player in all of the west.

[@gomjabbar6246]

If an adc stomps early game every few games, then their support is amazing. If an adc stomps every early game, then their wave management has to be impeccable as well.

[@FMD-FullMetalDragon]

Malrang deserves consideration for MVP. Rogue lives or dies by this guy. Their 4 losses come from Malrang completely shitting the bed and 14 wins when Malrang can pop off and can play the game how he wants.

[@jourdansarpy4935]

But they do die by him. Misfits doesn't die by Vetheo. They die by the bad players.

[@RomnysGonzalez]

VIT SUPERTEAM. Ego team, no brain

[@alexandrosdjordjevic8115]

To add on the Trymbi level 1 on topside, he also knew the matchup with ali and knew that even if he did go topside level 1, G2 couldn't do anything cross map because ali level 1 is kinda useless

[@marrek6312]

BB was not superahead against XL, he was 20 cs down in a ranged vs melee matchup at 15 minutes. If XLs Mid/Support does not int 7 kills to Caps Gwen 1v9.

[@nubbinthemonkey]

Is this show on the Summoning Insight Twitch channel or Doms?

[@stefankatsarov5806]

I think they dont do it on twitch, but just record it on their own.

[@a1lo1rixrix]

@@stefankatsarov5806 Thorin doesnt do twitch stuff in general I think. The entire "I dont care about every plebs opinion on my takes" would probably be fcking unwatchable with hundreds of trolls trying to get a reaction from him I assume.

[@KamiDaito]

They record it offline

[@stefankatsarov5806]

@@a1lo1rixrix he does sumoning insight, by the numbers and the crackdown on twitch.

[@vschen3429]

Yeah there shouldnt be a discussion if Upset is the best adc, its just a fact.

[@RApollos107]

32:58 The one thing that I would say is, yeah Rogue picked Misfits because on paper, it’s the matchup that pretty much everyone will say “yeah no way Misfits wins this series”. But at the same time before the Spring Split started, no one really sat there thinking Misfits was gonna go into the playoffs as the 3rd seed. It’s easy to say Misfits feel like the odd team out in the Winners Bracket, but that might also make them the worst opponent for Rogue because for Rogue you have to still play them, you can’t just show up to the series and think job done “ez gg”. Because as we’ve seen from Misfits, the last thing you should do against this team is let your guard down thinking they’re dead and buried.

[@broefkip]

Something that is very interesting to me and I hope especially Dom can give his opinion on cause he is a Jungler, is the all pro for Junglers and specifically who doesn't make the cut. I been seeing some of the discussiong and for me the biggest surprise is that personally I don't think that Elyoya or Selfmade should be even considered. Now clearly I am not good or knowledgeable about the game which is why I am very curious what IWD thinks about it. Cause if you think about it, who was really worse than them? I would say something like 1. Malrang 2. Jankos 3. Razork/Cinkrof 4. Razork/Cinkrof 5. Markoon 6. Selfmade/Elyoya/Shlatan With how int some of the games of Selfmade and Elyoya have been I would be thinking about wether or not they are better than Shlatan... And this is such a drop off compared to how good these guys are supposes to be...

[@jiloujensen2498]

Even in France and french shows, people are calling for BDS to change players. This roster was mainly built to appeal for a french fanbase with either french players or players who are popular in France. It's time for everyone to stop the marketing experiment and put some sense in that roster because loosing and not trying hard in scrim as a rookie doesn't get you fans. They were by far the worst team in the end.

[@joseandrade917]

Watching this a couple of days after. But I would say people don't take upset as the best adc on lec because he failed on last worlds. It doesn't really matter that it was private case or not, he failed when it mattered so at least on my side I am just waiting to see if this year he'll have what it takes.

[@Ahmed.Hadjou]

1:10:03 it's true, most pentakills dont mean anything, usually it's a fed ADC and they just clean up the fight

[@nosuitsgiven]

Obvious MVP is Upset’s wife because Bwipo’s girlfriend is in NA.

[@danielshamlian2800]

I think Elyoya has a similar mindset to Mac-there will likely be internal pressure to make this roster work as-is.

[@NoobChalanda]

off course thooorin doesn't like war as a metric when rogers wasn't the highest therefor didn't deserve mvp

[@simons4809]

Personally i think nisqy would be awesome in MAD. But prob not gonna happend

[@hazelord358]

vit will win playoffs and msi aswell mark my words

[@shulginmingus1083]

for reference, Neon has 49 deaths to Upset's 11. Upset has 2.5 percent less damage percentage, 3 less total kills, and 1 percent higher kill participation. Definitely interesting comparison!

[@riseagainstthemachine6079]

But don't they play different roles? Like Upset is super ressource heavy, while Neon takes the spot of a 2nd carry, no?

[@ShandyCB]

But I’m misfits they just funnel as much into vetheo, neon does it more on his own

[@humanoid8344]

@@riseagainstthemachine6079 No

[@albinnordstrom2641]

@@riseagainstthemachine6079 they've a .4% of shared gold difference.. thats not really a significant difference

[@anuhasjayawardana8981]

But every fnatic member peels for upset. Misfits peel for vetheo

[@ilovetheatf]

KZbin is being fucky with the notifications boys

[@GabeHernandezz]

The intro is classic Thorin

[@jimmytheanimator8644]

What an outro

[@TheDynastyHunter]

Isnt jizzuke or nemesis options for MAD as well?

[@noobgun12]

Didnt nemesis burn every bridge to lec

[@terryd3113]

I looked up the stats Dom talked about and Upset is actually in the second half of ADCs for DPM while being the second in resources got and by far the best in KDA. So... couldnt he maybe do better than that for being the unquestionable best, as most people think?

[@slendian]

Part of the problem is wunder, humanoid and razork are carry players and they just end up clapping people too fast for DPM to be high or hyli finds a pick side with wunder or humanoid then its a 4v5 and no teamfight happens

[@Zwijger]

@@slendian Wunder has played a lot of low damage champs.

[@tompossessed1729]

Upset played jihin a fuck load so not really on a individual level and check the champ pools of every other adc who btw played jinx far more then upset 3 games on her by comparison resulting in higher dpm .

[@macoveisilviu1607]

Intro song? It's dope AF

[@arvindjv2625]

If you're talking about the countdown music, it's KZbin premiere countdown music

[@JanAlleman1]

Selfmade is the dumbest kind of pro player who mostly plays on feeling and even picks champions on feelings. He can't plan anything 1 minute ahead successfully. And the biggest problem is because he doesn't use logic he can't synergize with Perkz who plays mostly on logic.

[@ssenkrad67]

I mean if you think that 1 watch the games, 2 watch vit voice comms if the games are not telling enough for you and 3....if i say the 3rd one my comment will get deleted so

[@Wizardi1111]

@@ssenkrad67 Oh yeah, Selfmade talking to himself about what his ideal jungle pathing would be before the game really shows how smart he is...

[@adtoxic3344]

Great that you know him personally. Are you perkz?

[@oldmanpippo]

Guilhotto has had 2 playoffs appearances in eu,and in 1 of them he had arguably the 2nd best roster in europe,and gtot embarrased.... Dont paint it like guilhotto is a god while he was a mediocre coach at best

[@AdmiralMug]

I highly suggest you watch some of his interviews, he has an advanced view on player interaction and game state.

[@oldmanpippo]

@@AdmiralMug other coaches do too tho,and it's a shame they are following narratives they try to establish while mocking others who establish other narratives

[@AdmiralMug]

@@oldmanpippo ofc Guilhotto is not a god coach or wtv but Team Liquid obviously hired him for a reason. As to Mephisto, it is kind of odd that Dom and Thorin are making coaching comments when no one knows the team environment/structure. However, I do agree with the conjecture that coaches should have a "superstar" presence on a "superstar" team.

[@AdmiralMug]

@@oldmanpippo I believe Vitality also even tried to replace him with Caedrel before the split even started. I wouldn't be surprised if Mephisto is out before the season ends.

[@oldmanpippo]

@@AdmiralMug ofc I am not claiming that mephisto is a good coach either This is where I believe eSports (or at least the west) should follow traditional sports,where the coach (or manager,depends the region and the sport) isnt an advisor,but the boss...some western teams,or rather coaches,do exude it (for example,yamato or youngbuck), but the rest,especially when a superstar is in the team (let alone 3 hotheads like alphari,selfmade and perkz),the coach is usually a mere puppet,something to show off

[@Jaime_Protein_Cannister]

best league show lol Thorin spouting nonsense half the time , BB carrying most of the games Thorin "i think he's a bit shit" XD shees jesus and I'm no G2 fan

[@EpicVideoMaster11]

Thank you

[@bossanova8856]

As per usual, MAD's section is about three times longer than rogue's. Some things never change

[@Nickich]

Was an LEC fan, judging by this split, the league has fallen off really hard, to the point where last place NA (TSM) would probably qualify for playoffs in LEC with ease. Hope LEC wakes up and sorts it out because it used to be entertaining.

[@jazeroliversy673]

Ru might not look great, but really? TSM? That’s kinda delusional.

[@adtoxic3344]

You cant judge EU strength when EU has only been playing against EU.

[@lerooyjenkins7763]

Na dog 🤣🤣🤣🤣💀💀💀😂🤣🤣😂🤣

[@modai7452]

Just another day of nickich spitting facts

[@idontreallycaretbh]

lol