Star Trek - Journey To Babel - visual effects comparison

[@dancastro6873]

I have been a fan of the classic series since I was 4 years old and will always be. I proudly own all 3 seasons

[@brianrogers7360]

I love how the new cgi brings it all to life. The original was constrained by budget and the special effects of the day. These look so good

[@williamhaynes4800]

I love how Kirk was able to use the "play dead and draw them in" ploy in all 3 seasons.

[@mosespray4510]

What has always really bugged me about "Journey to Babel" was the way the rubber masks hung off the faces of Tellarites. I would have put the whole CGI budget into fixing that.

[@eltorpedo67]

This is a good example of where the CGI really added something to the show. The phaser fire tracking the alien ship was neat, as was the ship breaking apart. The shuttle landing sequence and the redesigned shuttle bay interior were very nicely done as well.

[@X2FileWrightonite]

Agree

[@neohumanist8181]

I much prefer the more limited detail of the original, the sort of mysteriousness one would expect from combat at an extreme distance.

[@Slitheringpeanut]

Fun fact, the main reason they never show the left side of the original ship was because that's where the models screw holes were visible.

[@scotpens]

Actually it's where the thick electrical cables were attached to power the lighting effects in the engine nacelle domes. Also, the left side of the model was never intended to be filmed and was left unfinished.

[@Slitheringpeanut]

@@scotpens Not so much unfinished, but where as we both pointed out it's where the attachments and screw holes are. :)

[@MrMarkysandy]

I do like the modern CGI effects. I think Enterprise should be a portrayed as a more nimble ship. That being said, I grew up watching the original. Nothing beats watching the original model pass by the screen. Thanks for putting in the last scene with Mccoy breaking the 4th wall.

[@Lumibear.]

During the alien buffet scene I’ve always been too mesmerised by the brightly coloured food to look at anything else, but for the first time ever I finally looked at the background extras, and my word they’re all, erm, interesting, aren’t they? I particularly like the geezer with pigtails and the purple disco queen. Lovely.

[@mem1701movies]

I guess the food is apples with blue food coloring, watermelon and cantaloupe.

[@scotpens]

I'm rather fond of the two dwarfs with copper-colored skin and fezzes.

[@RealmMan]

The spinney alien ship aft section was a nice touch

[@josephkwiatkowski886]

That first enhanced special effects scene with the shuttlecraft approaching the Enterprise from aft, and on final approach, would have been even better if they had showed the shuttle hangar doors opening to receive the shuttlecraft.

[@dancastro6873]

RIP Mark Lenard, Miss Jayne Wyatt, Leonard Nimoy and De Kelly

[@robgyanisu312]

Ya forgot Grace Lee Whitney, James Doohan, Majel Barrett-Roddenberry et sl. . .

[@dancastro6873]

@@robgyanisu312 Indeed. But they will forever be in my heart

[@andreabindolini7452]

For some reason, some crucial shots (the torpedo volley and the explosion of the enemy ship) are more satisfying in the original version.

[@TharnUsagi47]

Because they're done better. The self-destruct is real explosive powder filmed against black, there's nothing fake about it. And the torpedoes: first simply aren't red, they aren't energy blobs, & they don't come out of the phaser ring, those are immutable facts. This clearly shows in HD with no ambiguity, total lies. Those are all false.

[@ecclestonsangel]

One of the biggest reasons I like the newer effects is because, in the original shots, it looks like the Enterrise is incapable of doing anything more than moving in a straight line, which obviously can't be true. Like any kind of an airship, it has the ability to bank left or bank right, nose up or nose down, and whoever the pilot(or, in this case, helmsman) is, has the ability to change angle of attack for ascent or descent. I'm also glad that the color of the Enterprise is ship's grey, instead of that bilious green color. That's what color ships are supposed to be, and planes are too, before they're painted with the livery of their airline. I also like the fact that in the updated version, you can actually see the Orion scout ship, instead of just a bright, blurry blob. I always thought that was kinda dopey. Well, rendered, TrekkieChannel!

[@neohumanist8181]

But it would not be like an airship because the Enterprise is in space, which has no air, and thus does not lend itself itself to the curving maneuvers you describe, which are aerodynamic maneuvers. In space movement is strictly in reaction to thrust and thus proceeds in a straight line.

[@hamhockbeans]

@@neohumanist8181 Impulse thrust is not just from behind the ship. In battle scene starships can move like large fighters in Star Trek. Also you say the original effects was better so does that mean the movies was wrong too. That enterprise maneuvered just like the CGI version and they was models. Star Trek 2,3 etc. If we want to talk about real space which the show and movies are not. How can we hear ship engine sounds in space. The point of the cgi is to make the original come close the the movie refit version in terms of look and movement.

[@betaneptune]

You can't bank in space. There's no air to "push against." It's not an "airship". It's a "spaceship". It's in space, not air. As for the appearance of the ships, in reality you wouldn't be able to see them at all. The only light is from distant stars. Yes, you can see an actual structure for the Orion ship, but why is it is spinning? Bad on both. They should have concentrated on fixing the really bad effects, like those in "Tomorrow Is Yesterday". In that one they're heading straight for the sun and instead you see no sun and moving stars, and they're in the solar system! In the remastered version you can see the sun, but it's yellow! The sun is white. Just check all the photos of it on the internet.

[@ecclestonsangel]

@@betaneptune well, if you're gonna nitpick, I'm gonna nitpick right back. A, I wrote that over a year ago, and had actually meant to say starship, but couldn't edit because then I'd lose Trekkie Channel's like. B, who's to say you can't bank in space, even if there isn't air. Just because there's a lack of one doesn't mean you can't do the other. We defy physics all the time. C, the Enterprise has viewscreens that enable them to see other ships close up, so of course they have the capability of seeing them in detail. Just because we don't have that....yet....doesn't mean we won't. And it exists in Star Trek in the 23rd century, so there! PS- our sun is classed as a YELLOW dwarf. That's where they're getting the yellow from, and yes, our sun does have a YELLOW glow to it. Google it. It's Astronomy 101.

[@betaneptune]

​@@ecclestonsangel A Crap. I somehow lost my new post mid-edit, too! Stupid YT. B To bank in space would take incredible amounts of energy. They do so far less often in the original than in the CGI. Why add violations of physical law where there wasn't before? There's already way too much stuff against the laws of physics in TOS and other sci-fi TV shows and movies. I could make a long list, but we're talking about the sun here. C I said I was fine with the detail on the Orion ship. It is its spinning I have a problem with. And I added, just for good measure, the fact that in deep space there is not enough light to see _any_ ships. The only light there is from distant stars. Hmmm. Makes cloaking devices kind of pointless. As for 23rd century, that's based on faulty logic using what many call a terrible episode: "Miri". It was _their_ 1960s that was 300 years ago, not ours. No excuse for faulty logic there. And in "Tomorrow is Yesterday" it is clearly 200 years ago. In the Trelane episode ("The Squire of Gothos") it's hundreds of years. If you're going to pick just one, at least do it without faulty logic. The sun is white: Project an image of it onto a piece of white cardboard using a telescope or even a pinhole camera. You will find it to be white. CAUTION: NEVER LOOK DIRECTLY AT THE SUN. (Yeah, when seen through thick clouds it may be okay. Sometimes at sunrise and sunset a quick glimpse may be okay.) Snow is white, not yellow. Google it? www.pennlive.com/nation-world/2020/05/sun-lockdown-is-a-solar-minimum-really-going-to-bring-famine-freezing-temps-and-droughts-to-earth.html Check the sun in google street view. It's white. In many other pictures on the internet it's white. From the wikipedia article on the sun: "The Sun is a G-type main-sequence star (G2V) based on its spectral class. As such, it is informally and not completely accurately referred to as a yellow dwarf (its light is closer to white than yellow)." I saw the eclipse of 2017. Right as it ended I saw the diamond ring effect, in which there was the purest, most beautiful white I had ever seen. WARNING: I turned my gaze away immediately, as it is dangerous to look directly at the sun. It was actually an accident that I saw it. Dangerous! You can get permanent retinal damage right at the center of your vision, which you can't look around. The sun is white at the zenith. When it gets low enough in the sky it's yellow, but that's due to Rayleigh scattering, which is the same thing that makes the sky blue. CAUTION: The astronomers say: NEVER LOOK DIRECTLY AT THE SUN. So your taking a chance of eclipse blindness if you do. kzbin.info/www/bejne/h4DEkoh-itN8sJI www.pennlive.com/nation-world/2020/05/sun-lockdown-is-a-solar-minimum-really-going-to-bring-famine-freezing-temps-and-droughts-to-earth.html This "yellow dwarf" bit is bit of a misnomer.

[@davidmoore570]

Our first TV was and Black and White made by HMV with Valve's in the back that used to glow. It had these slated doors that you closed at night!

[@photonicus]

It's subtle, but there seems to be more hangar space in the original than the cgi version..

[@JohnNelson75025]

Tough the remastered effects looked really good. I still missed the original effect of the main phasers firing. Something about the framing, actual filming model all lit up, and the drawn phaser effects looked far better than the remastered effects!

[@jtkirkfan2002]

+John Nelson There are a lot of shots that they could have simply recreated frame-by-frame. While many shots look "hoky" by today's standards, they did a marvelous job for 1966 to 1969 with the budget they had.

[@JohnNelson75025]

+Jim Schuck Just a bit of nostalgia, The remastered effects where quite well done. I really liked the "Wrecked" USS Constellation from "The Doomsday Machine". No way could a late 60's FX man could make that model look that "Wrecked!" as did the re-mastered edition!

[@jtkirkfan2002]

John Nelson I wasn't trying to imply that they weren't well done, although some of their first attempts looked a little "cartoon" at times. I was just saying that a lot of shots they changed for change's sake and could have simply recreated them.

[@JoeSiegler]

+Jim Schuck If you watch enough of these things in a row, you'll find out how often they really re-used footage. Presumably because they didn't have the cash and time to do something different. I can't say I blame them - there's only so many times you can watch the standard ship orbit before you go "uh, something else, please". One of my favorite improved ones was "Tomorrow is Yesterday".

[@afrose71]

The CGI isn't bad, but I'll take the originals I grew up with.

[@kingsman8475]

I will take both.

[@douggraham5082]

What is that smudge/shadow over the shuttlecrat in the hangar deck at 1:57? It is very conspicuous? Trying to hide something?

[@DaveMiller2]

For the most part I prefer the original. There is this idea that just because something is new it is therefore better. That isn't always the case.

[@ZooxMaze]

I concur... ;))

[@Frankie2012channel]

I disagree. You can own and get both versions. I prefer the new CGI versions. Some of the 'recycled' effects of the old show were so tired looking.

[@TharnUsagi47]

It's not even in the running for better if they just do it wrong. The impulse engines are never unlit. Torpedoes are never red, they aren't energy pulses, they don't come from the phaser ring. All these FX suffer from the problem of weightlessness of early CG without modern animation tools that allow objects to react as if they have mass, it's just a completely unnatural line hand-drawn by the animator being followed, the animation (not models, the actual movement) is about a decade behind it's time (being 2004-ish) presumably because of the budget given.

[@Sennmut]

Look at the guy in the corridor behind McCoy @ :40. That looks like an Archer-era uniform.

[@StarWarriorCentral]

I could have sworn there was some version out there where the final phaser shot with the original effects was purple instead of blue.

[@lynnpoint6395]

This is from Memory Alpha, the Star Trek Wiki: "The completed episode was very well-liked by NBC. The network urged the production staff to finish post-production of "Journey to Babel" quickly, so that it could be scheduled for the earliest possible airdate. As a result, the visual effect shots of the Orion scoutship were not ready when the trailer for the episode was assembled, hence the trailer features a different (much more primitive) effect depicting the vessel. For the same reason, the Enterprise fires purple phasers in the trailer, while phasers are blue in color in the episode itself."

[@AndrewChapman]

1:46 What exactly was the point of changing that? The original looked fine to me. They did the same thing again in "The Immunity Syndrome".

[@TrekkieChannel]

I think continuity? They changed the area above the hangar in all of the shots from the above, so I "guess" they wanted to change it also in these scenes? But honestly, this is the type of changes I would never notice unless I was doing a side by side comparison

[@AndrewChapman]

@@TrekkieChannel True.

[@thomashill6347]

I like many space scenes and the ship looks brighter BUT SOME of the old angles look better and IF REMASTERED with those angles it would have been nice

[@psammiad]

Many of the effects are better, but I prefer the clean lines of the original Enterprise physical model, the new one is too grey.

[@RaynorBear]

... I will always prefer the original phaser firing scene... a very iconic FX shot!!!

[@photonicus]

Yes, the original phaser beams had a slight "pulsing" effect suggesting great raw power. The cgi phaser beams are just "kinda there"...

[@putinscat1208]

At @6:30, I like how the other ships just breaks up..

[@TrekkieChannel]

Yes, it looks neat.

[@clubchampion]

New are mostly good but I prefer the original effect that begins at 4:50

[@gukonni]

I know they work real hard to do the CGI, but I honestly want to see the original just to see what they did back then, before CGI. But I'll say I watched several remastered TOS episodes and it was still fun to watch them. I just want the originals too, so you know...

[@TrekkieChannel]

So the solution is simple - buy the Blu-rays :)

[@markam67]

Yes I like having both versions. Hate to re-buy the whole series as I already have them all on DVD. I think the reality is that I have the unaltered and I can watch the altered on Netflix.

[@TrekkieChannel]

If you are a "purist" you might be interested to know that the DVD versions are slightly different than the Blu-ray "original" versions. But the changes are so insignificant that "normal" people wouldn't notice :)

[@markam67]

+TrekkieChannel cool to know thanks

[@TrekkieChannel]

This is what I was talking about if you haven't seen it yet : kzbin.info/www/bejne/gHqxiKaXgJWEg5om55s

[@michaelvincent4280]

It bothers me when the new fans comment on how nice the effects were way back then, very modern. Sadly they are missing out on the original experience we all had back then; all this done practical and on a ridiculous low budget. That would help them understand why we became fans ourselves. I have the entire series original prints on Laserdisc.

[@psulux]

Some of the original shots do really stand up. I even prefer the original ship But Those bongo drums in the title theme do my head in. Someone put them in afterwards

[@brucedavis3816]

Glad to see Mr. Montgomery recovered from the beating he took from Decker!!!! Although Montgomery let him off the hook cut he didn't want to get court married

[@lajya01]

Those CGI hangar animations are still as cringe. At least the Orion ship looks like a ship now.

[@cbj407]

Except for the explosion of the Orion ship at the end, I preferred the original. It seemed less gussied up, as in real life.

[@thatoneveryfunnychannel2482]

I like almost all of the CGI effects (I'd always take the originals but they were a nice change), but 0:56 just looks like plastic... Kinda awful.

[@alexpalmer9101]

Thanks for posting the comparisons. It's cool to see them scene-by-scene. Question, though: What did you mean by "Different hangar framing"? I'm looking, but I don't see any difference. Unless I'm just blind...

[@alexpalmer9101]

Nevermind, I see it now, right above the doors. Very subtle...

[@TrekkieChannel]

Check 1:45 the top of the frame. It's clearly different, I think it's the new added area from which they oversee the shuttles? When I did this video I had no clue what that was

[@jtkirkfan2002]

It's the "observation deck" as seen in "Conscience of the King". I remember hearing someone from CBS Digital, or maybe Mike Okuda, say they added it since Kirk and Lenore were obviously inside it but the physical model of the hangar never showed it. You can also see the port deck at 0:58.

[@stevewilsonsr.3794]

To boldly go where Norman [Space p ) has gone..._...

[@chrisThurt4269]

So a few of the scenes didn't appear to have any cig or special effects i could see. a few were not exactly the same scene..idk what the use of that is. At any rate I like the original. If I want to see newer CGI I can watch newer Star Trek.

[@JoeSiegler]

At the risk of being unoriginal.. 1:18 to 1:26.. The Walking Dead.

[@robgyanisu312]

Joe Siegler You forget: the Engineering Department also wears red. . .

[@OriasX]

Wat

[@christophertomasello1227]

Why can't they do this with the original Outer Limits from 1963?

[@shakycameratheater]

Can we buy the originals on CD, or are we stuck with the Re-Mastered episodes?

[@kozodoev]

I don't know about "cd" but on blu-ray there are both versions.

[@Rosiebeatle]

I grew up with the old one...I much prefer the new one

[@seaninness334]

I'm not wild about the hangar bay cgi. It makes it seem more cramped a space and also doesn't match the reverse shot from the corridor.

[@ti994apc]

4:48 I like the original better with the ship turning.

[@j-marie4006]

The effects are more advanced but I still like the original. The cheaper effects are all part of TOS experience.

[@thebacons5943]

The hanger bay is much worse in the cgi version, wow. Overall I thought the cgi was tastefully done but I wish the original versions were available on Netflix for wide audiences as well

[@PokemonBoy-de4jd]

Thankfully the blu ray has both the enhanced version and the original version.

[@thebacons5943]

@@PokemonBoy-de4jd exactly! Unlike the Star Wars changes smh

[@TharnUsagi47]

Wow, this is a travesty. Changing the torpedo color is straight up lying, they were always yellow, there's no reason to change them to the movie color, that's a totally different era. Movie & TNG were red, that changed to yellow/orange later. Showing them coming from the phaser array ring in crisp HD is lying, in the original it just wasn't too clear. The torpedo tubes are right above the ring, there're plenty of schematics. Making them look like blobs of energy emitted instead of objects coming out of tubes is completely wrong. I always hated how the new shuttle landing looked so bumpy, jerking everyone around for no reason, the original model FX were flawless in this case, now I can see they showed a much better view of the bay, & the CG isn't well textured to look real. It's also much darker than the lighting is supposed to be in there. As with all the CG Enterprise, they inexplicably decided to change the impulse engine color to red which it absolutely was not - yellow/white, always - and have the impulse engines shut down most of the time, something no Star Trek ship has ever done, only when the Enterprise-D lost power completely. Take your pick, Ent-D, Defiant, Voyager - impulse engines are always lit, including at warp. Why would the fusion reactors be shut down just because you're in warp? That's the backup that's always there. Plus you have to actually push in a direction going into warp, you don't start from a dead stop. The ship model they came up with based on a spinning starburst is really good, one of the best to come out of this. But the hit on it doesn't even show any explosion, not consistent with later FX at all, & even the original shows some hit flash on it. Then the main self-destruct flash explosion is replaced for no good reason, it's not as bright and just looks like primitive weightless early CG like all the ship movements in these. I can ignore these just fine, but since this is the only version offered on streaming, kids are coming along all the time thinking this is the real thing.

[@jerobriggs6861]

I prefer the new

[@lutello3012]

Great, they Lucasd it.

[@TerranGuy93]

Nah, Lucas tries to keep the originals locked up. These are available alongside the remasters on disc.

[@CptBlackbeardlives]

Original is still the best by😊 far.

[@LanceHall]

All this proves is that the original effects were fine and the new effects are just as lame but in a different way. There was absolutely no need to change them. The only thing they needed to do was cleanup the worst effects.

[@JoeyJoJoJoestarJuniorShabadoo]

I thought the remaster was okay when it came out but the problem is now they already look dated. So you might as well stick with the old 60's dated effects than the 2009 dated effects, which look like a cheap video game these days.

[@brucedavis3816]

Oops martialed.

[@joshfreedman9695]

The original ship has a better look. The CGI that they did use for those are just too cartoonish

[@mem1701movies]

The CGI is absolutely atrocious. They don’t even bother matching the shuttlecraft and hangar to the full size set like the model did. Horrendous.

[@jaymike3302]

Totally unnecessary changes.

[@ZooxMaze]

I'm sorry - but, the original white Enterprise along withe the abundant bright stars and simple bold colours of the planets, etc., etc. are easier to digest than all the articulated, and enhanced details which are supposed to be more aesthetically pleasing. I find the newer 'improved' versions to be more distracting, actually - without actually adding any nourishing substance to the original series. Espeically, the views (colour, angles, speed) of the Enterprise itself. When the updated Enterprise comes on the screen - I feel no sense of awe or wonder, at all. As a matter of fact, it's so mediocre that I find it completely UN-inspiring. No sense of hero or 'Ta-Da' moments which the original series offered. (By, 'hero' I refer to the feeling of... "Oh, wow !! Look... there's the Enterprise !! Coming to find new adventures in the universe... on a mssion... full of my favourite characters... heros and real human beings whom are already relatable and inspiring just the way they are) ! @%*

[@kevinlambert2756]

New effects suck....🤮