Star Wars: The Big Problem with the Naboo Starfighter - Spacedock Short

I break down my main issue with the design of the Nubian N1.
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Battlezone II Music by Carey Chico
Sci-Tech Intro Features Animated Elements by SKIBBZ.
Spacedock does not hold ownership of the copyrighted materiel (Footage, Stills etc) taken from the various works of fiction covered in this series, and uses them within the boundaries of Fair Use for the purpose of Analysis, Discussion and Review. Produced by Daniel Orrett. Owner/Executive Producer at Spacedock.

[@Spacedock]

In this instance, spinning is far from a good trick. :P Head over to www.twitch.tv/spacedockhq to subscribe to our streaming channel. We'll be starting a playthru of Mass Effect 2 tomorrow (02/12/17) at 18:00 GMT.

[@michaellewis1545]

Spacedock quick question if you redesign the N1 how would you do it? I would make into a V shape and put a thruster under the tail spin. To deal with the issue you raised.

[@CybershamanX]

heheheh Date translation for Americans: 12/02/17. ;) :P Thank you so much, Spacedock team for all of your hard work supplying we nerds with the brain juice we crave! I think I might just have to pop in and watch a bit of your ME2 playthrough! Peace and fly safe! ;) :)

[@spencersettle9695]

Reminds me of the scene from Rogue Squadron when Corran Horn's X-wing took an Ion cannon shot from an interdictor. half his engines went out, and e ended up in a spin just as you described.

[@mettek88]

This is the solution: starwars.wikia.com/wiki/N-X_Police_Cruiser

[@jonuiuc1]

wouldn't a spin only occur if drag from the mass to one side of the engine was an issue? how much drag of this type can there really be in space? I mean the engines maneuver from vectored thrust. you'd think a computer would be able to correct for that fairly quickly. the mass of the body to one side can't be that great in a starfighter of this size, at least not in comparison to the power of the engine. just my two cents.

[@Codex_of_Wisdom]

I think Naboo's designs get a bit of a pass for being mostly ceremonial, though. Kind of like if you were to criticize the tall hats of British guards (or the bright red coats.)

[@samuelemmert5136]

Tell that to the french pre-WWI.

[@patrick8116]

CodexofWisdom The bright colors were intended to differentiate forces in the black powder era when hiding a gunshot was nearly impossible.

[@Stego1819]

Whats the problem with the design? It has two engines far apart from each other so it can turn quickly. It is aerodynamik. The pilot can actually see the battlefield unlike the Tie Fighter and the turrets are close together so they will hit the same target.

[@captin3149]

It's roughly equivalent to taking a police car into a tank battle.....

[@andreslinares6429]

@@Stego1819 I forgot the need for aerodynamics in the vacuum of space

[@dreammirrorbrony1240]

I thought for sure you were going to say that the biggest problem this craft faces is that it has no security features to keep an 8 year old child from stealing it and taking a joyride in it.

[@15oClock]

Dreammirror Brony It does have security features to keep out 8 year olds. It's just that Anakin was nine and a half. An oversight, I'm sure.

[@dustykuczynski8838]

our own fighters have no security in the actual fighter either

[@Janoha17]

Artoo was probably the one who took off the safeties so he could get into the battle.

[@nnelg8139]

Military vehicles don't have that kind of "safety" because the fifteen seconds it takes a pilot to unlock them could be the difference between life and death.

[@kantyran6449]

Nnelg nah I don't think so. When do jets have to start unplanned in the matter of seconds anyway nowadays

[@Skringly]

I know spinning is a good trick, but this is just ridiculous.

[@brackonstudios]

"Jam-akin Skywalker" :P

[@lewisirwin5363]

"Ana-spin" Skywalker

[@jackharpe3rd233]

At it sound better than barrel rolling which is stupid Akula.

[@Cailus3542]

Ya know, it just struck me that the Nubian reminds me a little of early propeller monoplane fighters in its overall shape and gun placement. I’m even getting vague vibes of Spitfire sexiness. Huh. I suppose it would make sense if the Nubian is designed for both air and space superiority, unlike the X-Wing and TIE, which are primary space snubfighters.

[@gokbay3057]

Cailus Griffin gun placement really reminds me of ww2/ww1 fighters too

[@dylanwight5764]

The symmetry is more than just coincidental. Both the N-1 and the Spitfire were hand-crafted and designed for sheer agility over protection, thus they fulfill the same niches role. Moreover, Lucas was directly inspired by the Battle of Britain for his Naboo space-fight scenes, so the N-1 really is the Spitfire of the Star Wars universe, or at least the Hurricane.

[@legobro66]

Also the designers of this and other ships from the prequels were directly inspired by World War Two aircraft.

[@travcollier]

Not just the designs. Star Wars (the original movie) is basically a mashup of a samurai movie and some WWII fighter movies. Some scenes, notably the attack on the Death Star, are pretty close to shot-for-shot in places.

[@sheilaolfieway1885]

The x-wing is built for atmospheric flight thus it's wing like s-foils but the shields also help a lot with aerodynamics. The Tie fighter on the other hand was designs speciallycal to be a space fighter and a cheaply produced one at that no sheilds little armor and horrible view via those huge solar panels the Interceptor model fixed some of these short comings....

[@lamb-mz2sd]

Talking about magic dampeners. I remember reading the manga Knights of Sidonia, their mothership had to do a quick dodge in order to deviate from a collision course, and lots of people just died because of this maneuver. I wish there are more sci-fi like this, where big ships are slow because they have to be; if they turn too fast it cause structural damage and kill part of the crew.

[@failandia]

ever heard of The Expanse? :D

[@thefirstprimariscatosicari6870]

lamb4902 But then it's not enough futuristic.

[@patrick8116]

Starship Operaters Planettes 2 of my favorite animes

[@ironteacup2569]

This was one of the best parts of that show/manga

[@kenetickups6146]

This info makes me want to check that out

[@clouless7032]

Nice take on this ship and I have to say, you did "put the right spin on it"

[@jeffanderson8165]

Punny...

[@Gogglesofkrome]

that's a cool trick

[@MaskedCorpse]

The idea that the naboonesians or whatever- were equipped only with aging, shine-polished parade-fighters could have been done in an interesting way- I wish that had been the angle of that movie. Sort of the two jedi having to kick-start a ragtag resistance movement to slowly beat back the robot hordes, Molotov and sabotage-style. And these old ships, piloted bravely could still turn the tide against insurmountable odds. Sort of to make a statement that a droid-fighter cant beat the instinct of a living pilot perhaps.

[@MaskedCorpse]

Well i don't feel like the original trilogy really delved into the nitty gritty of how a paramilitary rebellion functions. If we saw how that sort of thing gets undertaken and grows, the skills and methods being learned by common people- that might actually compliment the original series.

[@legobro66]

Sounds a lot like some of the plot points of battlestar galactica

[@madisonatteberry9720]

'turning the pilot into jam' That is one of the greatest lines ever.

[@ryancraig210]

I thought they made a point to say in ep1 that the Naboo military was ceremonial from the beginning

[@SgtShakenBake]

Big ludicrously powerful engines? Does that mean it can go...LUDICROUS SPEED?!

[@Jacobhull04]

MY BRAINS ARE GOING INTO MY FEET!!!!!

[@Muledragon]

Would you be willing to do a review of the Terran Battlecruiser from Starcraft universe?

[@Melancholiccube]

Muledragon yyeess! Love the Terran Battlecruiser!

[@stephens7136]

Yes please!

[@frostryu]

Which model?

[@sheilaolfieway1885]

@@frostryu they all look vaguely the same so.

[@nightcoredimensions1416]

Or the ship has an automatic system where when the ship detects engine damage on one engine it can throttle the thrust to make it comparable to the damaged engine. Or completely shut it down depending on the extent of the damage.

[@janwitkowsky8787]

You should read up on the Legends book, X-Wing Rogue Squadron. A character there, Corran Horn, actually experiences the off-center engine-thrust differentials. The book also goes into explaining, not exactly how inertial dampeners work, but how they are used. (Where they, in the X-wing can dial the amount of dampening it will do for the pilot, in which many pilots keep it less that 100% to have a feel of the forces from hard flying). It was near a planet called Talasea. Regardless, the N-1 Starfighter does have some glaring issues, with it's design, regarding the engine size and placement.

[@alexernst9448]

One thing I love about the Expanse is the lack of "dampeners". If you deccelerate too fast, you will turn to paste. In fact, the show has precedent for it.

[@benjaminstorace6699]

Counterpoint on engine placement: By having the engines away from the cockpit they're less likely to take the cockpit with them should they explode. Also "inertial dampeners" are in general poorly defined as to how they work, they could potentially even compensate for only having one engine out to one side.

[@GAdmThrawn]

This flaw was shown in TPM when we saw one of the fighters leaving the hangar get shot and go into a tailspin before crashing.

[@goldenboi7685]

In a SW book I have somewhere it says that damage to either engine will put it into an uncontrollable roll. I believe they mean a spin about the spacecraft's longitudinal axis. Remember in Ep1 when the AAT hit one leaving the hangar? Barrell rolled all the way to the scene of the flaming grease spot. N1 has ALWAYS been tops. I remember the good ol days of Rogue Squadron all the way back on N64🖤🖤🖤🖤🖤 and later the Gamecube. That thing had a knack for intercepting Interceptors lol

[@duragdan2000]

Even WW II fighters had a setting were you could adjust the wing mounted weapons to focus on a certain point. If you liked to engage enemy fighters closely, you set it to say 200 m, if you liked sniping, set it to 500 m and so on.

[@McFlingleson]

On the point about gun placement, even as a little kid I always thought the X-Wing was a crappy ship because the weapons are mounted way out on the end of long-ass wings so that if the ship is pointed straight at a target that's smaller than the wingspan then every shot will miss.

[@kompav5621]

1:05 "powerful enough to keep the pilot from turning into Jam" - I lost it, lmfao

[@dakariszulu]

Always thought they looked like the Me 262, maybe they aren't designed as a tight cqe fighter but a strafing ship, kind of a swoop and boom effect similar to the Me 109s. line up, hit speed, kill a target burn out and repeat.

[@tmojizhou3179]

I'm with you the nabu fighters and nabu ship designs in general are my favorite

[@leifjohnson7781]

Perhaps late to the party here, but I'll throw in a quick plug for a cool science thing the N-1 got sorta right: the engines use an aerospike nozzle, which, if we were to imagine it following any of the same rules as a rocket, would greatly improve the performance at low altitudes. Given that Naboo was presented as an insular community, it might be a very logical design choice for them to focus on atmospheric performance, where the vehicle would probably spend most of its time.

[@blastech4095]

01:54 Gun placement. In Star Wars, the laser guns on starfighters can fire just ever so slightly off axis (even TIE's). This is how they can get away with having guns so far spaced apart and yet the shots will still converge on a target regardless of range. They appear to do so even without gimbals (see cross sections). You see this when Darth Vader is shooting down X wings in the Death Star run (his angle of fire rotates independently of the TIE fighter).

[@blastech4095]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aIileGWof796jZo

[@stonerleprechaun1402]

ant remember what 1 but in the X-wing series this happened too corran horn after he got partialy hit with an ion cannon and it shut down all engins on one side and he got mashed to the opisite side of the cockpit until he could force a manual retart to shut down the remaining engins so yes the inertial compensators will keep the ship in one piece as long as the are still running that is :) otherwise great vid man keep up the great work lovin them!!!

[@drknights]

sorry I have to say this since you mentioned fighter goes at a ludicrous speed...."Prepare for Ludicrous Speed" *GASP*

[@26th_Primarch]

The out of control spin is referenced in the ep1 visual dictionary

[@comradejos1899]

"space magic inertial dampers" lol

[@otsoga0105]

I don’t care if its bad, just love how it looks😁

[@tsubaki4106]

I have to admit, I never even considered this issue. My main problem with the design is the astromech placement. It prevents the canopy from extending all the way to the rear, making visibility impossible in that direction. That said, I guess the problem could be mitigated by sensors, and having the droid at the back makes it a lot harder to hit than if it was somewhere in the front or on the side.

[@BigEvan96]

I love the Naboo starfighter.

[@yeenmachine206]

Naboo N-1 is my favorite fighter, and I have to agree with your assessment

[@tatianejansen2564]

Actualy there is an gravitational mecanism that when one engine fails the other still mainten the like real world airplanes when one propeler fails the other keeps up the straight line

[@Synapticsnap]

You answered your own question with the N1's and that is they are meant for Ceremonial use and were only used in that particular Emergency. It was a all or nothing moment so having a Ceremonial Ship with fighting capabilities over nothing at all; well, I'd risk it too :)

[@jervishorton7372]

NABOO FIGGIT SPINNER

[@buttercup9709]

Another point about the engine placement is that they're far from the centre of mass, which means that there's a lot of leverage from them. Having two presumably reasonably weighty pieces of kit on the end of two long levers is going to drastically affect roll rate, both in space and atmosphere. Seeing as roll rate is one of the marks of a good fighter, not the best design point from a practical standpoint. However, I do agree with you on the looks of the craft (apart from the astromech socket, which just ruins the profile of the ship aesthetically for me)

[@ectogambit]

so ludicrous speed it is

[@christerry6244]

Would be awesome to see a venator cruiser carrier vs a imperial star destroyer

[@morgality]

I think spread engines are a positive attribute. By using differental thrust quick turns may be made increasing the ships ability to turn quickly.

[@damianbrynn8372]

Whatever systems that steer the ship would likely be utilized in correcting a single engine failure. Also, a similar argument could be made against the Twilight. It has a very far reaching gun mount, but is a craft that Anakin and Ahsoka have used often, and in atmosphere as well. That gun wing is an easy target, and produces drag. But if a separate system is responsible for turning and for (in relation to a source of gravity) ascent and descent, it would be the same system to eliminate the drag of the gun wing. Such compensation would help with a single engine failure on the N-1, as well as a reduction in thrust.

[@CABOOSEBOB]

I’ll try spinning, that’s a good trick!

[@DarkElfLover]

Space dock would a for lack of better term flying wing (basically a ship designed like a B-2) be a viable fighter design?

[@stuartwoods8213]

3750g is about 20 percent of the 40,000g produced by present day artillery guns. The acceleration would tear the N1 apart unless the inertial dampening system were able to provide a massive counter force on the rest of the fighter. This would mean that the engines would be accelerating themselves, while the inertial dampening field accelerated the rest of the N1. This would mean that the inertial dampeners would be so powerful that there would be no need to include conventional engines at all. If the space combat depicted on screen in Star Wars featured these kinds of acceleration, then it would appear as if all of the fighters had hyperdrives. They would accelerate and decelerate so fast that it would look as though they had just entered or dropped out of hyperspace. While they wouldn't actually be travelling faster than light, they would be able to reach relativistic speeds so quickly that a casual observer would be fooled.

[@lefr33man]

1:00 that's a good trick, though.

[@Spaceman404.]

Add some hard-points , elevators, ailerons, and a tail, it could be a somewhat effective atmospheric fighter similar to modern fighters like the SU-35 and F/A-22 Raptor.

[@Dead0Bone0Brook]

Space magic, I love it. ^w^

[@shaggycan]

In the Star Wars universe starships use something called an 'etheric rudder' to turn. Basically each of those engines is plugged into another dimension that anchors it. Kind imagine all ships in SW are floating in water and use an invisible rudder system. That is why you don't see small thrusters on SW ships that they use to make fine maneuvers. Its all a combination between Main engine, etheric rudder and repulsorlifts.

[@stephenbond1990]

I'd like to hear your opinion on the Nubian NX police cruiser from the battle for Naboo game, its supposed to be used as an N-1 training ship but its design is different in certain aspects.

[@Vnx]

The exposed engines aren't any worse than on the Lockheed P-38 Lightning. That craft shares the same concentrated gun layout in the craft's nose as well.

[@jhoover8734]

I may be wrong here but I'm not sure this would happen if one engine failed. It seems like this would happen to an aircraft but because of the drag from the side that had the failure. Since there is no atmospheric drag in space, wouldn't the ship just continue moving forward?

[@N00KIExM0NSTER]

They should have put the engines under the craft like the Mig-9. Engines further from the central axis will also have a negative effect on roll rates.

[@astrum097]

What if you made a video about exceptionally good ship designs? That would be pretty dank my dood

[@shadowzone2588]

I think theirs a death animation in battlefront 2 ea while flying on of these where you go into a flat spin

[@Christopher0184]

2:01 - 2:13, many, many, many pilots from the Second World War, if they were still alive, would probably like to have a few words with you, Daniel.

[@TheDeathduet]

Hey Dan can the N-1 even land on its own?? Does it have landing struts?

[@Kythonagh]

@Spacedock Heya, I love your work and was wondering if you'd like to do an episode on the Anubis from The Expanse, seeing that you covered the Donnager and Tachi. ^_^

[@andarus2798]

Do this with the bombers of Episode eight PLEASE. The design flaws are ludicrous.

[@HeadlessChickenTO]

Naboo fighters, pleasing to the eye till you have to fly one.

[@arifaakter4032]

I use to thought that naboo starfighter was a somehow a half jet plane 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@seen203]

Why would this happen? The applied force is still in the same direction and there is no counter force to the opposite nacelle since they are in space.

[@AlexSDU]

Spacedock, any plan on making video about spacecraft/ship from Wing Commander(game & movie)?

[@Spacedock]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/bH2zoYpqZcZnbpo

[@AlexSDU]

Thanks.

[@alexernst9448]

Maybe they have safety sensors installed that automatically cut out the other engine if one is damaged. That's what I would do.

[@gnexjeff]

Perhaps the remaining engine is designed to automatically cut off to a safe level should the opposite one suddenly stop (working or existing).

[@timsimenc]

Would this problem not also affect the Starfury from Babylon 5?

[@giantatom]

Subscribed.

[@theincognitoburrito7967]

Mando fixed this problem by adding a third engine to the middle right under the cockpit, if one engine on either side were to fail it can be shut off and the middle thruster could be used by itself just till the broken one could be fixed

[@gerdesilets]

it is primary an atmospheric fighter for defense with space fight capability in atmosphere the lost of one motor is less dangerous

[@zacharymarshall163]

Would the craft be put into a spin? Sure that happens to a boat and airplanes... but that's because of the resistant forces of water and air... but would that happen in space?

[@Exilon0193]

Honestly, the N1 is my favourite ship design from star wars.

[@AluVixapede]

Perhaps there's software; or maybe even dumb mechanical interlocks that, as soon as one engine encounters trouble, both shut off? That said, using a differential throttle (software controlled or mechanically governed), one could probably achieve some insane turn rates too.

[@dreadnought-ai]

It would help, but Considering the thrust they are supposedly meant to output, a delay of even a fraction of a second would still cause some serious spinning.

[@HammaneggsAirborne]

It is the big problem, but then again it was the same issue on early variants of the SR-71 IRL>

[@theultrararelennyface9565]

The biggest problem is that spinning is a good trick, but it cant spin fast enough.

[@MeowMeowMeowMeowMeowMeowMeowww]

I hope they atleast build in an instant emergency shutdown, if one of the engines gets destroyed.

[@bbaker4117]

I heard someone say spinning is a good trick.

[@ajzebadua]

It’s over g-force, inertial dampeners have the high ground! In all honesty, I know people love to hate on the prequels, but, I always thought the N1s were pretty. Much more than X-wings or TIEs, and it’s hard to hate a pretty ship.

[@ian8730]

when a twin engine craft loses power the loss of thrust plus the drag on the offending side is the reason for a spin not particularly the unbalanced thrust of the other side though this is a factor, it would not flat spin for two reasons in space there would be extremely little resistance on the side losing thrust so it would cause a wide oval spin seeing as a tight spin would require a push on one side and a drag on the other therefore the stabilizers this craft presumably has to maneuver would be able to keep the craft straight and the pilot could guide the ship home with one engine exactly how real pilots do with hulking unwieldy twin or quad engine airliners. the numbers are different but the concept is the same. there's many instances of single engine or even triple engine failure on airliners and they make it home if the pilots are skilled.

[@dezkeiz4946]

I like the design, but in the Starfighter game, I always had a bias towards the Havoc.

[@Tezunegari]

The loss of an engine for the Naboo fighter is only a problem in atmosphere. In space there is no air resistance that would cause the spinning.

[@blacklanner5795]

Why would it spin? There is no drag differential in space to cause a significant lever effect. To spin in space you need the thrust vector to have a different angle than your momentum. This fighter does not have a differential thrust vector between the engines. That would just be inefficient as normal operation would require 2 engines to cancel opposing forces.

[@AlexandroneF]

Actually, the ship wouldn’t spin. Some planes have more than one engine, but they don’t go spinning if one is damaged or turned off. Also, those pylons are wings to make this fighter be able to fly or soar in the atmosphere.

[@ig33ku]

Are you making a crap about my perfect X-Wing? The space sim X-Wing we were warning that close range with a perfect target lock our lasers will most likely fire past the cockpit and over the struts of the Tie panels. But then again no ship is space is going to fly perfectly straight and level to your's ;)

[@davidjames1068]

The big problem with the Naboo star fighter design, and many others in Star Wars, is the poor visibility of the pilot. He can't look down in any direction or rearward at all. Compare with the more sensible design of the B5 Starfury.

[@armycowboy4313]

Well for a fighter that wasn't really ment for heavy combat it handled its self pretty well.

[@GameArchiver]

It's worth the design flaw for the good looks.

[@danielcocker8113]

The N1 could have an auto shut off override in a linked electrical feedback circuit, once cut the second engine would loose power at the speed of light, effectively instantly. This would be simple enough with our technology let alone in the SW universe. Not arguing its a great design, just saying its not as critical as made out in the vid.

[@markhayes3523]

Do a vid like this on a 40k ship

[@kreigdernier9553]

Mmmm space jam

[@jacobkim3213]

Looks almost like a P-38 Lightning.

[@brianhead4720]

do the prowler from farscape.

[@manifestman132]

I like the look of this ship but it did always seem a bit fragile. So I would aagree as soon as one goes the craft might just bust apart. And though the engines are capable of reaching those speed does not mean they do push them to that far.

[@Khanclansith]

By that same reasoning shouldn't the Earth starfighters on babalon 5 get gigged as well?

[@TomaszDurlej]

No problems with seeing as dampeners can compensate lack of one engine.

[@Bramswarr]

spinning because of engine loss? take a look at the ship savage opress commandeered and tell me if you actually think the N1 will canonically have this problem.

[@BattlestarZenobia]

That acceleration is about 36km/s^2

[@skogstok]

Loosing an engine won't put it into spin unless you're inside the athmosphere. There is nothing in space that can push it to the side like for instance, air.

[@frogray7929]

Inertia is real.

[@WhyName]

Or, you know, they noticed this and the thing has a failsafe that shuts down both engines in case of failure.

[@rabbi_dragon_slayer]

There are no “g’s” in space so even if it was spinning, what’s it spinning with respect to? (The answer of course is nothing, as space time is nothing)

[@frogray7929]

g's are a measure of acceleration. Acceleration exists in space.

[@hoofonice]

Do not try to rationalize Star Wars, according to The Last Jedi you can breathe in space. I say no more.

[@dylanhultman3922]

hoofonice handwaved by the force protected leia.

[@dickiewongtk]

But it is beautiful.