BELT SANDER BAN - Why? Where? ...and what to use instead.

[@StumpyNubs]

▼ READ THIS CAREFULLY: ▼ Click here ( shop.isotunes.com/stumpy-20 ) to Get 20% off these ISOtunes models: - Link Aware - Air Defender - Link 2.0 - Pro 2.0 *OR select ANY model they sell and get 50% off a SECOND set when you put both in your cart!* ★THIS VIDEO WAS MADE POSSIBLE BY★ ISOtunes is a small, family company in Indiana that makes Bluetooth hearing protection for the shop, yard and everywhere else. (Support a small business and save 10% when you use this link, or the discount code: STUMPY) shop.isotunes.com/stumpy #ISOtunes #ISOtunesSport @isotunes @isotunessport *My Table Saw and Bandsaw are AWSOME! Check them out at Harvey Woodworking Machinery:* www.harveywoodworking.com/ *My hand tool collection includes premium tools from Bridge City Tool Works:* bridgecitytools.com/ *Please help support us by using the link above for a quick look around!* (If you use one of these affiliate links, we may receive a small commission) *Some other useful links:* -Check out our project plans: stumpynubs.com/product-category/plans/ -Instagram: instagram.com/stumpynubs/ -Twitter: twitter.com/StumpyNubs ★SOME OF MY FAVORITE INEXPENSIVE TOOLS★ - #ISOtunes Hearing Protection (Save 10%): shop.isotunes.com/stumpy -BOW Featherboards: amzn.to/430ldhv -123 Blocks: lddy.no/vpij -Mechanical Pencils: amzn.to/2PA7bwK -Lumber pencil: amzn.to/2QtwZjv -Pocket Measuring Tape: amzn.to/2kNTlI9 -Nut/Bolt/Screw Gauge: amzn.to/2CuvxSK -Self-Centering Bits: amzn.to/2xs71UW -Steel Ruler: lddy.no/10mv7 -Center-Finding Ruler: lddy.no/10nak -Bit & Blade Cleaner: amzn.to/2TfvEOI -Narex Chisels: lddy.no/sqm3 -Mini Pull Saw: amzn.to/2UEHBz6 -Shinwa Rulers: lddy.no/zl13 (If you use one of the affiliate links above, we may receive a small commission)

[@liquidrockaquatics3900]

When I used the link for isotunes, it gave me a 404 not found on the page that popped up. I clicked the top “click here”

[@StumpyNubs]

@@liquidrockaquatics3900 It works when I click it. Maybe try again.

[@liquidrockaquatics3900]

@@StumpyNubs crazy. It worked the second time. I’ve been using a set of Walker quad BT when I’ve been in the shop and mowing, but I noticed when I turn my head, they break away from my ear just a little bit. I thought I might isotunes. My neighbors are both older and they are both going to give hearing protection a shot while mowing now as they have seen me doing it and one of them likes listening to podcasts. Good habits CAN catch on

[@scottmaclean1455]

interesting tip but dont see how would help on end grain still better off with belt sander for that?

[@StumpyNubs]

@@scottmaclean1455 I am not sure how much end grain you are talking about. But sure, I would want to avoid planing a lot of it. If I was to make some end grain cutting boards, for example, I would set up a router jig for flattening them.

[@000gjb]

I used to have the same opinion about Belt Sanders, making the same mistake by holding the Belt Sander on the same spot and digging into the timber. I watched a friend of mine who is a panel beater, probably known as an Auto Body repair man in the US, laminate a bench top from strips of timber and mounted it on the cabinet base. He levelled the top using a Belt Sander guiding the tool diagonally in two directions across the benchtop and finishing with an orbital sander. I ran my hand over the finished bench top, level perfect. It's not the tool, it's the expertise of the person that makes the difference.

[@TheVinnythestick]

You actually have the nerve to say that stumpy nubs isn't an expert on belt sanders... No doubt he has a much more precise definition of perfectly level than you. He wasn't simply saying "belt sanders don't work" he was also saying they're super dusty, loud, and need sandpaper replacement.

[@brucea550]

Exactly! The builder of million dollar homes, who taught me most of what I know about wood, constantly repeated that correct USE is 90% of a tool’s value.

[@johnpusch1376]

100% I like this guy but he's talking nonsense on this one

[@louisvictor3473]

Sure, you can git gud and use a belt sander on furniture making, but for most fine wood working projects it is an unnecessary hassle and project ruining risk. Obviously if you're doing large pieces that almost go from furniture making to carpentry, things are different and not what the video is talking about. There is a reason he is showing and talking about things like panels, not a slab tabletop.

[@brucea550]

@@louisvictor3473 Except he doesn’t differentiate. I would not take issue if he specifically discussed HIS shop and his type of production. But he says YOUR shop too, having no idea who’s out here watching. So if your shop makes slab tabletops, is that little gouge plane really going to replace a belt sander? If I make a basic work bench, a belt sander is far and away the best tool for quickly dressing plywood edges or softening sharp corners.

[@blackcamel1872]

Sounds good for the video, but having made a career as a carpenter I can tell you a belt sander is invaluable.

[@brucea550]

Same. His idea will work in some situations, but others there’s no substitute for a belt sander.

[@nosferatuzodd6427]

I agree with you. I wouldn’t want the plane for scribing laminate countertops to walls. Block plane at most for installing red cedar shakes and weaving corners but even there you could use a trim router. Belt sander for the win.

[@hoagietime1]

Yup I belt sander is definitely an important tool in finish carpentry

[@serdarbas8016]

Seriously dude, no belt sanders? Goodluck shaping keel with a planer..

[@KristopherChambers]

Invaluable is right. This video is woodworking youtube in a nutshell. If you look at all these types of videos in aggregate it makes you wonder if they aren't all in on some nefarious conspiracy to throw everyone else off their game. Don't use a belt sander, be extremely afraid of the tablesaw at all times, buy only extremely expensive tools, use only the most elaborate jig possible, cover everything with epoxy, and on and on. All things I'd tell someone if I wanted them to fail at it ;~)

[@Squat5000]

Belt Sanders are extremely helpful for a whole house of tasks

[@NeverTakeNoCut-offs]

*host

[@hariman7727]

@@NeverTakeNoCut-offs There's a 50/50 chance "house" was a deliberate pun.

[@petercharles6462]

In a shop, I completely agree with you. On a renovation job site you are dealing with knocking plaster and paint off trim to reuse it, nail heads, lack of a good work surface, and a host of other issues that make a belt sander a good friend in the field.

[@Idiomatick]

Hand planing an old wood floor filled with nails sounds like actual torture.

[@l.clevelandmajor9931]

If you can hold the belt sander steady, and keep the piece you're working on from moving, I could see how a belt sander might work for that, but as a renovator, I know at least two or three better ways to achieve the same results. Just one slight wrong move can ruin your work with such an unruly power tool.

[@lym3204]

Good for rough carpentry.

[@MarcusRefusius]

I’m a retired Garbageman. Over the years I’ve collected Boxes of old Bench Planes. And I’m finally up to the point in retirement that I’m restoring them. VERY Gratifying to take ol’ Rusty and transform it back into the fine tool it was intended to be. ESPECIALLY when it yields that first ribbon of Wood. Knowing it was destined for a recycler or worse the Landfill. Of course now I have a Till to build. Cheers. Love the Videos.

[@lint2023]

I'm a bit jealous. Enjoy.

[@gloriousapplebees]

Very jealous! I've had my eyes peeled the last year and haven't found a single plane to be restored around me. I'd really love to give that a try before getting one of the several hundred dollar ones

[@MarcusRefusius]

@@lint2023 Yeah, us Garbagemen are the envy of the World……On the upside I worked in Sequoia and Kings Canyon National Parks all summer. I got paid in Sunrises largely. Cheers

[@jerbear7952]

​@@MarcusRefusius I don't envy you but I do respect the heck out of you. Thanks for doing it.

[@salty-nick]

Make some plane restoration videos!

[@ekimzitro]

Started woodworking at 5 years of age in my father's cabinet shop...gained knowledge from many master joiners he employed...most important lesson learned is that it's not the tool that counts...it is more the person using it...

[@ChimeraActual]

It's both, of course. A crappy tool will make you hate your work.

[@Norm475]

So true, I am 82 and when I was a young lad my grandfather would make me various toys out of wood. He made me a wagon, wheelbarrow, small trucks, etc. I don't believe he had a power tool to his name, and his craftsmanship was better than mine with all of my power tools. He was also a harness maker, an artist, and an all-around great guy.

[@ChimeraActual]

But you won't find any masters using crappy tools. If your chisel is made from soft steel you won't be able to match the quality that you could with the correct hardness steel. Excellent results come from both mastery and good tools.

[@ekimzitro]

@@ChimeraActual A real master can make soft steel hard...the inexperienced make good steel soft

[@nedlooby7419]

They can pry mine away from my cold dead hands

[@singingbowels]

Another belt sander tragedy?

[@swamijie]

"I will yank the cord and throw both it and you out the back door..." Joke's on you, Stumpy: my belt sander is cordless!

[@jeremygibbens7392]

Cordless belt sanders are game changers!

[@swamijie]

@@jeremygibbens7392 facts!

[@mzimmerman12]

Which one do you use? In the market myself. Really just for scribing countertops or filler strips.

[@swamijie]

@mzimmerman12 sorry for the late reply. I just use a cordless Kobalt that was on sale from Lowe's. It's been good for my use case & came with a 4AH battery at the time. I just use it to sand & get an initial smoothing/remove splinters (like 80 or 100 grit) on really long boards and surfaces like bench tops. Definitely do be careful with lower grits; I've gouged out two bench tops & a post in the beginning because I wasn't paying attention and pressed down a little too hard. Hope this helps!

[@mzimmerman12]

@@swamijie thanks. I'm just looking for something in my current battery platform (Makita or Bosch) just something to grind on fillers or counter tops to fit the walls. I may have to bite the bullet and get a 3rd platform.

[@torque9889]

I absolutely love belt sanders, I can plane and have a decent orbital sander. Some times you’ve just got to take a large amount of wood off quickly without using a plane. But I don’t use plywood or manmade woods so maybe I find them more useful.

[@raystarky3896]

YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY! CORRECT! I took your video into the GARBABE CAN! I have used BELT SANDERS for at least 40+yrs and they have ALL done great work on flat boards or walls and was complamented many realtors in and of houses!

[@anthonyhitchings1051]

Stumpy is wrong on this one. A belt sander has its uses, just not on cabinetry.

[@StumpyNubs]

Since this is a woodworking channel, speaking about banning it in my woodworking/cabinetry shop, I think you must know I am not speaking for every industry...

[@levoniust]

Not too dismiss Stumpy's reply. But I'm currently in the process of refinishing my porch and the belt sander is significantly faster than my random orbital sander and there are far too many screws potentially popping up in my opinion to use a jack plane.

[@johngrant5749]

Sorry but a plane can’t ‘cut’ it for me when I’m shaping MDF or chip board sheets for studio mixer desks.

[@cryptsub]

I had to Bondo a hole in a door where a dog door used to be, and a power sander was invaluable for smoothing it out before painting. but that might not be woodworking...

[@rlsbluedevil2016]

There’s another alternative that wasn’t mentioned. A geared random orbital sander is nearly as aggressive as a belt sander, but usually has a regular random orbital mode as well. The Festool Rotex is probably the most popular option, but triton, Bosch and other companies make excellent versions that are nearly as inexpensive as a belt sander, but far more versatile

[@JamesBondDZero7Mi6]

They may not be the best tool for the woodshop but they sure come in handy when remodelling old homes with wood floors. They are also great for leveling subflooring. A word of warning; Don't purchase a bunch of belts for your inventory. The glue/tape will degrade and you'll end up with lots of straight 6" strips of sandpaper.

[@leoveroude4492]

Great comment! Try applying 2" Tuck Tape over the glue joint when the old belt is still"new".😃 (The back side, yes😅)

[@jeremygibbens7392]

Never had that happen, and I have belts many years old. You must be using really cheap belts!

[@JamesBondDZero7Mi6]

@@jeremygibbens7392 Klingspor. What kind do you have?

[@JamesBondDZero7Mi6]

@@jeremygibbens7392 Klingspor. What kind do you have?

[@jeremygibbens7392]

@@JamesBondDZero7Mi6 I've used Klingspor and others. Never seen one come apart.

[@liquidrockaquatics3900]

I use a belt sander on occasion, but it is usually clamped in a vise to make it stationary

[@RobMoreland]

Same. I clamp mine outside in my jawhorse. No cleanup needed there. Most recent use was to quickly remove poly finish from oak cabinet doors that I'd broken down into flat stock for picture frames. I could have used a jointer or planer but didn't want to do that to my blades.

[@kadmow]

@@RobMoreland : ) - great for profiling and beveling an old plane iron, ha ha...

[@fishhuntadventure]

@@kadmow…that has happened:)

[@kindywoodandiron1756]

I use my belt sander all the time. I grew up using one before there ever was an orbital sander.

[@fishersofevidence8771]

I can't agree with you about this. You've identified a small minority of the applications of a belt sander, where a plane would be better. And those are applications where I wouldn't use one, because they're noisy, dusty and slow. But a plane won't do what they're really for. Like surfaces with multiple pieces of wood of different grain orientation, with gaps between them, which a plane would split on the edges. Or surfaces with materials that would blunt a plane, like inlaid brass, nails in a floor, or inlaid marble or other masonry or cement products, or wood surfaces with difficult grain or multiple knots. You even use a linisher, which is a belt sander, in shaping your piece of wood in this video. You're making a straw man argument against a tool that is the only one that will do what it's designed to do.

[@spenceralridge4958]

I agree. I try to avoid it, but there are a few applications for belt sanders. I just used one over the weekend to even out some applied wainscoting, which is the exact situation you described - multiple pieces of wood with differing grain orientations. The key is to use it sparingly and only so far as needed to bring the surfaces into a common plane (no pun intended). The wall was pretty out of whack, which created the misalignment. Of course, if I had been less lazy I would have used dowels or biscuits to align the pieces before attaching the assembly to the wall….😂

[@fishersofevidence8771]

@@spenceralridge4958 I'm lazy too, bot those who are not never get the job done!

[@MarcosElMalo2]

Agreed. It’s good for material removal in a variety of situations, especially when the piece is supposed to be non-flat. My belt sander also came with clamping brackets for mounting upside down on the bench. The other things belt sanders can do that a hand plane can’t is race. Your only limit is the length of your extension cord.

[@fishersofevidence8771]

@@MarcosElMalo2 I had not heard of belt sander racing but have watched a couple of videos. Marvellous!

[@ericschulze5641]

Where do you get those bench stones

[@GabrielHarper]

I’ve had a belt sander for about 15 years and used it on maybe five projects. It’s an awesome tool when you need it. It’s certainly very easy to destroy your work and commands some respect. This past winter I shaped the end of four oversized through tenons on a workbench I made and it was the best tool I had for the job. After a few test pieces I was comfortable with the process and extremely happy with how it turned out. Planing, chiseling, or filing a curved, beveled end grain on big Doug fir stretchers would have been a nightmare, it just loves to splinter.

[@fluxx1]

Nothing beats a good scrub plane. Just a joy to work with. Quiet and doesn't leave a mess. And you can use any plane you have, no matter how messed up. I use an old Soviet beater plane without any built in adjustments (no lateral nor depth adjuster) and a chipped mouth and it works marvelously. I rarely even sharpen it. I'm gonna dedicate my other planes for rough work with smaller camber.

[@paristo]

Just couple days ago needed to build a complete outdoor box. Used nothing else than a belt sander at the speeds 1, 3 and 9. One and same 80 grid belt on it. Easily glued twisted boards together and sanded all effortlessly to flat. Made good smooth rounded edges, corners and all with the machine. All the dowels easily cut to length and then sanded flat to surface with belt sander. Then as well made the slatted walls, 4 mm thick ones cut from 38x20 mm with circular saw, and planed smooth and equal with belt sander. Belt sanders are great for a normal woodworking, as long you remeber that what directions you should not move it, and what speed you need to use. It is totally true that you can very easily ruin your surface with one single wrong direction movement or at wrong speed. But when you see it in hands of experienced users, you know it is one of those tools that requires a mastery to really understand how to handle that beast. And I am far from such level skills. But I would not give up my beltsanders. And for rough wood removal with the hand planers... Those are joke sizes... Look at the wooden ones, that are even made to build large barrels or log houses walls. We are talking 1000 mm long ones with huge blades, that you can easily move to use ridiculous amount of wood and plane things at all kind forms, straight, curved, cornered etc. Those small hand planes are nothing for that purpose. Just get the proper tool for the task, and leave small hand planers like those for the small wood working to do finishing. The belt sander is like a chainsaw. Most people see it just to cut trees and do some rough forresting etc. But when you see a master using the chainsaw to do scuplting, to carve poles and everything like hot knife in the soft butter... It changes opinion what you can do with chainsaw. And same is with beltsanders, most people have never seen what can be done with it, and use it wrong as they think it wrong.

[@billmactiernan6304]

Au Contraire Mr. Nubs. I use a belt sander to surface boards for fine furniture all the time. You just have to know how to use it. First, I use a big one, 4X24, Porter Cable, 120 grit, because it has a large platen and really good dust collection. The secret is, that you never stop it on the board or change direction while it is touching the surface of the board. This means that you put it down and pick it up at each end of every stroke. It's much like painting the surface of the board with the sander. (Finish the surface by hand sanding with 150, 180, and 220 grit.) Now, it does take some strength because you're constantly picking up a heavy machine, but in sum total, electric power is removing a layer of wood rather than muscle power. The second advantage, and this is the big one, is that belt sanders don't "tear out". Take a beautiful plank of walnut or mahogany with wavy grain and its risky business to go at it with even the sharpest plane.

[@ExtrovertedCenobite]

Two years ago, I promised my wife I would stain a dining room table. After failing to achieve the results I wanted, I was frustrated and my wife wasn't too pleased as it took a long time to keep redoing the job without satisfactory results. I watched a video on staining from this channel and followed the advice given and we are proud to have that table as the centerpiece of our home. THANK YOU!

[@DessieTots]

A lot of amateur woodworkers just don’t have the life expectancy to become talented carpenters, they just want to make stuff using wood. Speaking for myself I will use electric tools if they give me more accurate and reliable results over hand tools. However I still use hand tools.

[@RhynoD2]

Same. I'm slowly learning the hand tools, but I'm more interested in having a great finished product than I am in the process of making it. I like knowing how to use the hand tools (that I do know), but if a power tool gives me an equally good result, or even good enough, I'll go for that.

[@5280Woodworking]

I build fine furniture and really just don’t see a huge need for hand planes. Block planes are somewhat useful, but not necessary. But hey, I’d never buy a computer in favor of building one, so we’re all narcissists in our own way :)

[@CCRoselle]

It is the caulk and paint that makes you the carpenter you ain't!

[@MrSharper802]

Use both. It is easier and safer to use hand tools on rough lumber.

[@Fix-things-for-life]

In the late 1950s my dad built his own table, saw with a motor and spindle and worm gear in crank he repurposed from something else. The top was hard oak tongue, and groove flooring. I grew up using that and it worked perfectly. That’s how I was taught we made our own machinery with repurposed motors from other things. Grinder , bandsaw, etc. etc. powered from repurposed motors. I guess we had a lot of stuff laying around in the backstreet of Detroit and those days

[@RadioactiveLobster]

We use our belt sander mainly to sharpen lawnmower blades and quickly blunt the edges on basic shop projects built out of junk lumber.

[@tonyn3123]

I agree with your video comments. After watching some videos several years ago, I learned how to properly tune and sharpen a plane. I started with my cheap Craftsman block plane and was amazed at the difference with proper tuning. I display it proudly on my tool board and reach for it often. My 3 grandsons listened to my comments about block planes and began one-by-one buying their own at yard sales and I refurbished each and re-gifted them back to my grandsons. They have all been won over. I have several #4's and #5's purchased from yard sales for a song and they are on my to-do list. I hope everyone believes your comments after trying to use a hand plane that is dull and not tuned well. That was me several years ago.

[@rickcimino5483]

it's kinda hilarious that you used a belt sander to make a radius on the little piece of wood. (albeit, a sideways one that's mounted like a bench tool)

[@StumpyNubs]

You thought I was talking about stationary sanders that use a belt and not handheld belt sanders, which I held up for the camera to show what I was talking about?

[@brandonleonard6987]

Haha, I was going to say the same thing. I thought it was funny. I get the point I just wanted to give Stumpy a hard time, lol.

[@davidbastow5629]

I agree it was irrelevant, but in the split second moment, it felt like irony, and it gave me a chuckle too :)

[@davidbastow5629]

(I doubt any of us thought it detracted from your point. It was just funny.)

[@jimichan7649]

My 4 x 36 stationary belt sander has been one of the most used tools in my shop.

[@timrodeghier5948]

I’ve been woodworking for over 45 years. Early on I wanted to use hand planes and bought some new and found some used. Now I never touch them except for a small low angle block plane. Electric tools do everything I need quicker and easier. My belt sander is used every day.

[@ondskabenselv]

I like my battery powered planer for those tasks, but this is definitely an interesting idea

[@jimweisgram9185]

I think James has another video about using an electric hand operator planer. Some years back. I have a no 5 Stanley set up as James describes and I use it on wood, not MDF. It is very useful. I wish James's video suggests which angle to set the grinder up to. I always grind at 25° and hone at 30° but in this application you might consider honing 35° to get there faster.

[@glasslinger]

I had a 1/4 inch to take off of a door threshold. To use a planer I would have had to remove the 80 year old threshold that was built into the door jam. Make a few minute job take all day, plus screw up the door jam creating even more work. My belt sander with an 80 grit belt took the excess off in less than 5 minutes, and did the removal to within an eighth inch of the jam. There are some things a belt sander is ideal for! Another job was a door that was hitting on one side. Less than one minute with the sander fixed it, IN PLACE!

[@lym3204]

An electric hand planer would have been easier.

[@cornelmasson4610]

My belt sander is permanently mounted in a jig for shaping purposes.

[@rickybaker42]

Yep!! Handy as hell

[@howardhardy1992]

Gotta strongly disagree with you on this one. Belt sanders are great tools if, and it's a big if, you have learned how to use one and only use for the tasks it was designed for. I also use a scrub plane and they are also great tools. Not only does using a belt sander require skill but it often requires quite a bit o strength to hold it in the correct position and apply just the right amount of force. I have often used them when installing laminate countertops to fit against a wall. You just scribe a line and then etch the line so you have a firm point to sand to. The belt sander works great to remove the material up to the line. The etched line is easy to see and also easy to see when you get to it. You are sanding the laminate as well as a couple layers of particle board. Wouldnt work with a scrub plane. It's also easy to take a little more off of the substrate than the laminate if you can hold the belt sander in the correct position. I dont know of another tool that would easily do this job. It is also very easy to screw things up if you dont have the skills required to use a belt sander this way.

[@JackFelker]

I have a couple belt sanders and they can not only save time but also be the best tool for the job.

[@joemcgraw6288]

You deserve a ton more subscriptions, James. I always look forward to your videos. Keep them coming. I've learned a lot from you.

[@fredmercury1314]

If you want to remove 50 years of paint layers from a long piece of wood, belt sander is your friend.

[@tonyg9511]

Depends on the paint, most paints will clog belts up in no time flat. Try a heat gun and scraper, much quicker and a whole lot less mess.

[@nathaniels9141]

No, you should use some type of solvent and a "wood" scraper. You used to be able to find the really nice heavy duty husky ones at Home Depot. They don't sell them any more though.

[@joshwand]

Odds are one of those paint layers will be lead-based, and a dusty sander is the worst possible tool. Use an IR heater and a scraper, or a chemical stripper, and take all appropriate precautions.

[@espressomatic]

Most pieces of such wood aren't worth my time. Especially if I'm on the job. Then it goes in the bin and customer pays for new. Less time and less $$

[@Forrest-Jackson]

Especially lead paint.

[@treblemaker]

I love my 4" Makita belt sander. It's amazing and the vast majority of dust is captured in its little bag. I use it outside to sand decks. It's the fastest way to flatten that many deck boards. Right tool for the job.

[@atrumphasmatis6719]

“Don’t test me like grandma did” 😂😂😂😂😂

[@collectpanda3350]

That floored me

[@slavkochepasov8134]

Show must go on! :)

[@Clark42EoC]

Great line

[@bradquinn2859]

So where is grandma now?

Belt sanders are good if you use it properly for what is intended for.. No other sander will sand lengthwise along the grain. Orbital, oscillating and other sanders can scratch across the grain. Your plane will hog off material true, but a belt sander is for finishing work not for hogging. My father was a carpenter by trade and he got me working in the shop at age 5. I'm soon to be 77 years old so I've been woodworking for a very long time.

[@tinkerer4]

Wow, that was a really dramatic setup in order to tell us about a scrub plane without ever calling it a scrub plane. All your points are valid though. This is way better than a belt sander. Might want to also mention that sometimes the mouth needs to be opened up a little with a file.

[@StumpyNubs]

Not all cambered planes are properly called "scrub planes." Frankly, any plane iron can be sharpened that way. But traditionally, a scrub plane was short in length with a narrow sole, wide mouth and few frills. The Stanley #40 was their version of a "scrub plane". Their #5 (which I am holding in this video) was a "Jack plane" even though the irons were often sharpened to a radius. I suppose you can call any plane a "scrub" if that is what you use it for. (And many wood-bodied smoothing planes were turned into scrubs when the soles wore down and the mouths opened too far for fine work). But I would make a distinction, if only by name, between a cambered Jack and a Scrub.

[@arnoldkotlyarevsky383]

More of a fore plane than a scrub plane. Proper scrub planes are narrow and have thick irons with much more aggressively curved cambers.

[@AyresHaxton]

The woodworking equivalent of those recipes where the writer tells you their life story before telling you how to actually cook the food. It feels like trolling when it takes you 4 and a half minutes and an ad before you admit you’re just talking about scrub planes. Sorry, “cambered planes.”

[@markr5787]

All typical plane irons with the exception of jointers are cambered. Smoothing planes often receive a roughly 12” radius curve (easily seen are the scallops left behind by smoothers on antiques when viewed in raking light), jacks and fores (5 & 6) get about an 8” radius curve. Scrubs (40) can be as low as a 4” radius. In fact, all of those planes have to have a cambered iron because otherwise one corner of the iron will dig into the work and leave a track of torn up wood fibers.

[@StumpyNubs]

@@markr5787 - Yes, any plane can have a cambered iron. But there is a difference between the camber and it's function that I am talking about in this video and the very, very slight radius put on the edge of a smoothing plane, which is not typically created by grinding the iron as shown, but by merely pressing down on the corners of the iron as you hone it on a flat stone.

[@ThePapa1947]

Years ago as a wood patternmaker I did that to one of my spokeshaves and one of my block planes. Works great!

[@kevinroberts9814]

Nice video. After many years, I've become a big fan of my belt sander, mostly for flattening glued up panels. That said, in my experience, the 3 x 18 belt sanders which seem to be the most commonly sold are complete garbage. There's just not enough surface on the platen to hold the tool steady and flat while you work. Since I switched to a 4 x 24, however, I've had excellent results. I know, this thing is a beast, but with high quality belts and good dust collection, it's a breeze to use. By the way, I noticed you used a belt sander to make your sharpening template!

[@61rampy65]

I love your sense of humor! I've always wanted a belt sander, but I don't do enough woodworking to justify buying one. And the only plane I have is a little tiny one, 3.5" x 1.25". I just used it to shave off a high spot on some 1/2" plywood.

[@JohnClark-tt2bl]

As a hobbyist that has to find time when I can, I just don't have the time to learn to use and maintain hand planes. Maybe one day when I have more time.

[@callmetatersalad132]

Really the setup is all that takes time, maintaining isnt too bad. If you see em cheap at yard sales id say grab one for when you wanna mess with it.

[@tombiggs4687]

Yeah I felt the same way when I was in my early 30s. I had my hands full with my fixer-upper house, and I needed to get things done quickly. Once I tamed the house, and started to do a little more hobby woodworking, I began to appreciate hand tools for the reduced dust & noise. And, I also started to appreciate the old craft ways. I was fortunate that my brother lived near a used tool shop and I could pick up great quality pre-war handtools affordably when I visited him. Don't get me wrong, I use power tools when and where I can - love my table saw and sanders and I recently upgraded to a good router. But there is simple joy in using handplanes and Japanese pull saws.

[@jeffpetrimoulx6806]

Scrub plane

[@RocketPipeTV]

1:13 I learned it the hard way in middle school (45 years ago) in my woodworking class. I was sanding the top of a large tabletop and got distracted for a moment and stayed in the same spot for 20-30 seconds. That spot is a couple of mm lower than the rest of the tabletop.

[@SamGutermuth]

I had a belt sander and got rid of it when all I did was cabinets for all the same reasons. During our house renovation, there have been a few times the belt sander has saved the day. There’s a few tools I have in my shop that are not shop tools even though they could be used: belt sander, angle grinder and large hammer drill. Construction tools have their place but rarely is it with delicate projects.

[@Mike-sy6oy]

Good way to put it into words.. belt sander isn't a fine/finishing tool. It's a construction tool. At least as far as I'm concerned

[@TimberworksTables]

Awesome timing! I accidentally taught myself this a couple of days ago when a table glue up wasn't as flat as I had hoped. After hitting it with the belt sander and getting nowhere, I broke out my old Millers Falls #5 and had it flat in a few minutes. It'll be my method moving forward!

[@coffeeismygod]

I’m a professional installer. Interior trim and cabinets. I use various hand planes all the time. Properly sharpened and maintained, they are often faster, always quieter, and usually easier to use than a powered equivalent. Bonus: satisfying to use, and the cleanup is easier too.

[@commonsense5105]

I'd like to see how well a hand plane works installing a formica countertop, when you cope it to match a wall profile.

[@13thworker45]

I remember my dads cabinet shop. He built a stand for the belt sander and used it for edges. When they were built my older brother sanded all the faces with the old skill locomotive 4”. We all have our preferences and it’s time for that cold one! Thank You

[@skippylippy547]

Wonderful video James. I loved it. You are so correct! Years ago I purchase a #5 Stanley plane for $2.50 at a garage sale. I sharpened the blade with a camber and used it to flatten boards. It works beautifully. Later I purchased a new replacement blade and used that to give silky smooth results on those flattened boards. I threw out my belt sander and never missed it.

[@rickwhite3112]

If you buy a quality belt sander with the adjustable skirt frame attachment you will never sand through a veneer skin. I have a six year old Festool BS-105 with a micro up/down depth adjustment knob on the frame. The sander is evenly raised or lowered inside the frame (riding on brush bristles) on the bottom of the frame suspending the sander over the wood surface to be sanded. This allows you to just kiss the high spots until the entire wood surface is even and flat. You have total control making it a joy to use especially with the vac hose attached. In the last few years other manufacturers have copied the Festool skirt attachment for their brand of belt sander. I’m surprised that James didn’t suggest using a flat cabinet scraper with two handles along with the modified hand plane useage. .

[@vandyFixer]

Perfect timing for me as I am just about to turn a Stanley 4 1/2 into a scrub plane, thanks James....So i used this method and it worked pretty well, especially when I used my belt sander to round off the end of my pattern for the camber.😂

[@guzzirob]

Worst shop accident I ever had. Took a belt sander, turned it upside down and clamped it in a wood vise. Stupid, Stupid, Stupid. I can almost see Stumpy shaking his head as he reads this. Caught my palm between the sanding belt and the housing. Ouch! I still have the somewhat faded oblong scar to this day. That was 50 years ago and haven't had an accident since. (Knock on wood) I did learn a valuable lesson to always pay attention and use every tool for its intended purpose. I'm more of a random orbital sander type of guy.

[@kadmow]

- wiping shavings off a power plane has a worse result... (Instinctive for some hand-tool trained workers). - I still get anxious every time Stumpy and similar "you tube presenters" - deliberately triggering every traditional hand tool using "expert" (drips under pressure) - places planes, irons active, flat on the bench (there is a well for that, Nubbs. lol..

[@jayadinash9102]

My boss once got his finger stuck in a belt sander and he lost the last segment of his finger.

[@jeremygibbens7392]

That's how you get stumpy nubs! It's not the tool, it's how you use it!

[@maalberico]

Totally agree with this, amateur woodworker, timber framer and hobby sawmiller. Ive tried everything to get my rough cut timbers/boards out of warp…power planers, timber planer, flattening jigs of all sorts. Quickest way I found is to use a roughing plane on the high spots till the reference face is flat enough to run true through a machine. A little candle wax or oil on the sole of the plane will make for less effort.

[@Cecil_X]

@5:29, "And that is just scratching the surface." Nice pun

[@lhpl]

Excellent pun. Just plane funny.

[@glashoppah]

The best woodworker I've ever met uses them, but he does stuff with them that I wouldn't have thought possible.

[@Hunter-vl6ft]

Use mine almost everyday. It does things so quick and simple.

[@sanseijedi]

Early on got a belt sander & not knowing what I didn't know, screwed up a door. Still use it, but mostly upside down as a vertical sander. It's hard for me to get rid of tools.

[@rossmcleod7983]

Upside down clamped in a vise, it’s awful handy. Grandma’s are overrated too.

[@BvictoryforChrist]

@@rossmcleod7983I literally don’t talk to mine, she’s bat shit crazy.

[@Beakerbite]

@@sanseijedi It's a very budget way to get a vertical/horizontal sander. It's all I've ever used my belt sander for.

[@natebascue3381]

I needed this 11 hours ago when I ruined a project with...a belt sander. Thanks for the hope of how to avoid that mistake again.

[@michaelhutin5451]

Sorry Stumpy, I have many sanders, including a belt sander. This is a great idea though.

[@StumpyNubs]

Why are you sorry?

[@michaelhutin5451]

@@StumpyNubs I'm British, we're always sorry.

[@JonathanDuddy-oq6nv]

​@@StumpyNubs I'm also a brit and also own a belt sander....... I'm sorry

[@pitsnipe5559]

“Never apologize, it’s a sign of weakness.” John Wayne, She Wore a Yellow Ribbon.

[@gabbor2904]

@@pitsnipe5559 Sorry, I didn't see that movie 🙃

[@AB-nu5we]

Excellent video James. I got rid of my belt sander for the reasons you state, almost 10 years ago. I use a fore plane with a seriously curved camber, followed by a jack plane. Process is so fast, you can accidentally go too far if you're not careful. Nicely done tip. Also, remind viewers that 'flat' and 'smooth' are two different things when prepping a board for say, using a planer to make both sides parallel. All you need is flat. Once the rough side is made parallel, you can make the original 'flat' side smooth with the planer too.

[@JoeSchonbok]

Hey Stumpy, thanks! I've had a spare #5 plane for years during which time I've often thought of turning it into a scrub plane. Watching you do it right in front of my eyes was just what I needed to finally do it. I agree it's a great alternative to a belt sander.

[@ThekiBoran]

When I was an apprentice I made a walnut and maple chess board. After glue up I had to flatten it, and I did, perfectly, with a....belt sander. One pass against the grain, one pass diagonally, one pass diagonally the opposite way then finish with a pass with the grain then repeat, repeat, repeat. Being older and wiser I now hook up my belt sander to a vacuum. It keeps things cleaner and the tool cooler. I have one of those Porter Cable armadillo sanders, they run hot, the vacuum keeps it cooler.

[@stan5513]

I did this on my Shelton jack plane many decades ago and made a jig to sharpen it to a fare-thee-well on Japanese water stones. I marveled at the damage co-workers did with belt sanders and power planes. Don't get me started...

[@notverygoodguy]

"Don't test me like grandma did" 🤣🤣

[@JustSayN2O]

I love my belt sander. It has served me well for many projects. The key to happiness here is the attachment of a vacuum hose. But if someone can direct me to a factory-made cambered iron, I will buy one, and a hand plane. I don't have the necessary tools to make my own.

[@BobBob-eh5sb]

I can’t disagree. If I use my belt sander, it’s outside anymore. Even with a vacuum attached, it’s worse than any other tool for dust. But it works nicely with rough wood slabs. At this moment I’m watching the part starting with the wobbly workbench and I’ll say you have caught my interest.

[@randywallis-vd2ez]

My dad had one in the 50s it was still around in the 70s. One of the ways he used it was when my mother’s back was hurting he would fold up a towel put it on her back then use the sander as a vibrator. It worked great.

[@j.ashbolt6688]

If I had to agree with you, we would both be wrong.

[@StumpyNubs]

Well, you don't have to agree with me, so...

[@brusharp]

A slight variation: Once I saw an old painting of workers finishing a wood strip floor using scrapers, (pre-electric tools). I tried it with an old paint scraper; making it sharp and giving it a camber like you did. Now I use it all the time when I need to even up stiles and rails on cabinet doors. Much easier than fussing with a plane and less destructive than a belt sander.

[@durangodave]

would be halarious if someone bought him a belt sander for the holidays 🤣😂🤣

[@sundancer014]

I was on the verge of buying a thicknesser last week when I changed my mind and decided to revisit the use of a plane.It's about 50 years since I last used one successfully, so I dug out 2 old planes and they are sitting on the end of my workbench waiting to be sharpened.Thank you so much for your timely advice which will be put into practice later today. 😊

[@kenburnette1121]

Did this with an old wooden yard sale plane. Works great. Thanks for all the great info!

[@garydargan6]

I've only used a belt sander on some old solid timber benchtops. They were out of an old chemistry lab and were coated with a resistant epoxy paint. After 3 days of applying a particularly nasty stripper which was burning me through multiple layers of gloves I still hadn't stripped off all the epoxy. I resorted to a few hours with a belt sander. Removed the last of the epoxy apart from some that infiltrated small cracks. I cleaned up with an orbital sander and fine hand sanding. I wasn't too fussy about getting it perfect. The timber had a few divots from years of use which I filled in with wood filler and sawdust from the sanding. it was also stained here and there where chemicals had penetrated the epoxy. Left all that in. I call it history which adds character to the product. Four coats of polyurethane later and I have a beautiful right angled bench against two walls of my study. Now if I could just get the junk cleared off it to use it properly. I do use a hand plane but mainly for fine tuning widths of timber parts.

[@emcarpenter5206]

I swear by a 4x24 belt sander for many tasks when it comes to cabinet making and installs but I will agree this is a better option for some tasks you showed like flattening a large surface. For things like that I do usually rough with a plane first before finishing up with sanders but I've never seen this cambered plane blade before, I'll have to give that a try next time I'm using a plane for that purpose. I learned to use a belt sander in high school, then in my first job at a cabinet shop quickly found out I had no idea how to use them properly. Just like hand planes, a belt sander has it's own set of nuanced skills to use it well without destroying your work. I'm not much good with planes beyond roughing but thanks to my time in that shop I'm very handy at belt sanding.

[@d1gardner]

Another great and wise video! I used to have a decent workshop.....I never found a good use for my belt sander when making anything. However, I also volunteer with Habitat for Humanity. Occasionally, we do rehab work on very dilapidated homes and my belt sander has been very useful. Example: tearing up rotting and bad sheets of plywood or OSB on floors and repacing them. Usually floors are not level and new sheets we lay down will often have bad joints leaving some edges "proud" of adjacent sheets by as much as an inch. Belt sanders help quickly level bad joints in those situations. During the rehab process, it is usually too expensive and time consuming to attempt to level floor joists. We work with very limited funding to manage the repairs to at least make homes habitable.

[@farmterminator4777]

Stumpy has just discovered the beauty of a scrub plane. Id advise going for a heavier camber on the iron and try a wooden bodied one too, im not a hundred percent sure on why, but they seem to be easier to push across the wood

[@StumpyNubs]

I've been making scrub plane videos for years...

[@grilsegrils9330]

I have never seen a cbn grinding wheel before. Thanks for the tip. Looks awesome in your video

[@mikegrier2829]

I bought a belt sander 35+ years ago. I rarely used it, but I did have a need for it last year. I needed to smooth the rough side of some cedar planks for an outdoor project. It worked great. If I had a planer I’d have tried that first, but I don’t have one. I can’t imagine using the belt sander on furniture or cabinetry, but it has its uses.

[@patri0t1776]

At first I didn't know you were gonna say a plane. I thought you had some weird technique in mind! But once you showed the plane I KNEW right away what you were going to show next. I made plenty of period authentic harvest tables with that tool. Completely hand crafted. Unbelievabley the table top still ends up very stable for glasses, candle holders and such. Nice video.

[@rodmills4071]

I worked as a shop fitter in the 80s. We built bank counters out of reclaimed 35mm, partical board partition wall panels. Belt sanders were instrumental in flushing joins before laminating ... they have their uses.. like any tool..

[@mark3863]

I love my Makita belt sander. I’ve had it for many years now and can’t do without its versatility and reliability. The bigger the job the happier it is.

[@afpitbull60]

I just purchased the Link Aware headphones. Your 20% discount code saved me $31.99. Thanks!

[@kchaney56]

I have wanted to get rid of my belt sander for soo long and now I can. Thank you for sharing.

[@warrenwerks]

Oh man this is a touchy topic! I know woodworkers who won’t touch them, and other high end fine furniture makers who use them every day. I don’t use mine regularly but for coping a base cabinet or an end panel to the floor or a belt sander works very well for me. For sanding glue ups I rarely use mine but everyone is different. I think I may add a camber plane to my line up as well

[@StumpyNubs]

Yes, a lot of folks are losing their minds over someone having a different opinion about belt sanders!

[@TheBrianhj]

@@StumpyNubs Yeah, I wasn't aware there is a religion based on the belt sander until youtube suggested this video to me. I'm still trying to figure out what it is exactly that triggers people like this because you only see this on certain channels/videos. Weird.

[@murphymmc]

A scrub plane, that's what it's called, James. Original scrub planes didn't have the side shifting levers. I turned a #5 very old Stanley into a scrub plane. I won't be getting rid of my belt sander, I built a stand for it and use it as a verical belt grinder/sander, It never touches a flat surface on a board for all the reasons you noted.

[@StumpyNubs]

Not all cambered planes are properly called "scrub planes." Frankly, any plane iron can be sharpened that way. But traditionally, a scrub plane was short in length with a narrow sole, wide mouth and few frills. The Stanley #40 was their version of a "scrub plane". Their #5 (which I am holding in this video) was a "Jack plane" even though the irons were often sharpened to a radius. I suppose you can call any plane a "scrub" if that is what you use it for. (And many wood-bodied smoothing planes were turned into scrubs when the soles wore down and the mouths opened too far for fine work). But I would make a distinction, if only by name, between a cambered Jack and a Scrub

[@sandmandave2008]

I was lucky and found a buyer for my Porter Cable belt sander when I sold off a lot of stuff before my big move. In all honesty, I hadn't used it for many years before I sold it for the exact reasons you stated. I have a plane that will fit the bill perfectly because my jointer is only 8 inches and it's time consuming to set up the CNC for something that could be knocked off with that plane. Thanks for a great video.

[@morninboy]

I have a Porter Cable 4'' X 24'' belt sander. I think I might have bought one of the last ones in existance. It is not manufactured any more and I contacted tool stores all over North America five years ago before finding one close to where we live. Best belt sander ever. Solid wood cabinetry and stairs is my speciality. Twenty four inch wide panels are dampened to raise the grain after the planer then gone over with 150 grit on that beautiful belt sander. Used it every day for the last three weeks.

[@chrisgraham2904]

Belt sanders today certainly aren't what they used to be. I bought a economical 4 X 24 Black & Decker belt sander in the late 60's. It was a tank. The only plastic on it was a portion of the outer case. The tool was a workhorse in my arsenal until the early 2,000's when it finally ended it's life. I searched the marketplace for a replacement and found nothing comparable. I finally learned of an early 4 X 24 heavy duty belt sander made by RIDGID that had been discontinued just two years earlier. I searched the used market and found a brand new unit, in the box, on Kijiji. The seller had received the tool as a Christmas gift, but never used it and never opened the box. I had to drive 80 miles each way to obtain it, but so happy that I did. Still using it frequently today and hoping it will outlive me. The sanding function of the tool is wonderful, but the manufacturer had discontinued to model because the design of its' dust collection bag had issues. That's of little issue for me, since I often use the tool outdoors, or I connect the dust port to my ShopVac when using it in the shop, which it then performs very well.

[@aubreyleonae4108]

You're a god send. I needed a belt sander but I hate them. I've got several old planes. Saved me a bunch of grief and $$ ❤❤❤

[@Psywar30]

Holy crap! Thank you for this video. I got into woodworking a few years ago now and I inherited my grandfather's tools. One of the hand planes I was given had this curve on the blade and I couldn't figure out why it was not straight across. I thought it was super weird and was never able to ask him, but now I know why. 😊

[@mikelastname]

Love my belt sander, but this opens up a nice array of techniques for reusing warped boards and large surfaces - a long plane will likely give a better flat surface than a belt sander half the length. Thanks for sharing - another useful Stumpy tip to take to my workshop.

[@axs62]

The cambered plane is great. A belt sander is not a terrible tool for many of us out in the field, it has its place.

[@Kaptain13Gonzo]

OK. I gave you a fair hearing. makes sense, I think i've even seen these before. I have aa as 'yet to be restored' Stanley #5 so I'll give it a go. Can't hurt it. But I'm keeping the belt sander. It still has its uses.

[@balisticsquirel]

My belt sander has custom convex platerns; belts for aluminum, belts for steel, gets into concave spaces with the roller, , etc. So 1) your point is a good one re the scrub plane. 2) thank you for dropping prices and making a whole lot more 2nd hand belt sanders available.

[@Fix-things-for-life]

I think grinding a radius edge on the plane cutting iron is a good idea and something I’m going to try. I could see how you could still use a belt sander to finish off sometimes, but the idea definitely lessons the sawdust flying.

[@wornoutwrench8128]

Funny you should put this up when you did. I built a bench top to put in my kitchen in a totally useless bay window nook. House will go up for sale in a year or two so didn't want anything too fancy. When I glued it up, it warped. I got out my belt sander and it was knocking it down but taking forever. I should mention that I'm pretty much starting out with wood as a hobby so mistakes will be made and I'm missing some tooling. Since the belt sander was taking to long I dug out my old yard sale plane. Spent some time cleaning the rust off and getting the blade sharp. And then I went at it. I have to say it was a good work out but very satisfying, but it still took some time. Your modification would have saved me hours, now I will be on the look out for a few more planes and will do this to it. Now for the best part. When I got it close with the plane I though i would be smart and take the last part down with the belt sander. Got about 10 minuets in and I let the smoke out of the sander. Haven't gotten around to replacing it yet and now I'm not sure if I will.

[@chuckkish3290]

I have an old wooden plane from my great grandfather with blade just like you describe. My father always called it a ‘“scrub” plane. Works just as you describe.

[@StumpyNubs]

Scrub planes work on the same principal.

[@tomhollins9266]

All right let me set you straight. I'm a highly experienced woodworker, been doing it for at least 12 minutes. LOL Even though I like the idea of having a tool like that to help me remove wood with little muss. I would probably mess up the tool itself. Time is also why I grab power tools: No time to make these great secondary tools that do a better job. Love watching your vids.

[@puzzlefactorysoundstudios]

@5:30 "And that's just scratching the surface." 😂😂😂

[@rickybaker42]

I get what you’re saying, and I actually like your idea. There’s plenty of times I’d rather have a modified hand plane on hand than make a dusty mess. But there’s a ton of uses for a belt sander that just couldn’t be replaced by a plane.

[@MrSharper802]

Excellent video! Excellent sharpening technique. This is the basis of coarse medium fine woodworking. You use a jack plane with a cambered blade to get roughly flat and to rough thickness. From there you can go to machines to get flat, parallel, and square. Or you can continue to use another plane to do the work of machines. Finally the last step is to get to a fine finish with a smoothing plane, a random orbit sander, and/or a scraper.

[@jimimmler9110]

I just finished belt sanding the hardwood floors of an entire room thru 3 grits. It worked excellent.

[@StumpyNubs]

I am specifically talking about tasks that are done inside a woodworking shop. I am not saying no trade finds them useful.

[@Big_Un]

"Don't test me like Grandma did!" I laughed so hard I had to watch the video twice!! LOL

[@grimbles39]

This guy stops his videos before the 10 minute mark. Respect.