Super Rare Fiber-Optic Displays

[@EEVblog]

Awesome display! Thanks Matt!

[@flapjack9495]

I read this in your voice, for the record.

[@roberttalada5196]

Indeed, and thank you Fran!

[@101stsurvivor]

@aaaaa Matt is the name of the person who sent the gear in

[@tamarabrugara]

@aaaaa frans deadname isn't your business nor would a comment adressing her that way be the top comment.

[@101stsurvivor]

@@tamarabrugara Well said

[@gunnarpoe929]

I had a 68 corvette that used fiber optic cables running from the headlights and brake lights to the cabin of the car just below the shifter. The idea was to let you know if a bulb was faulty. Gives a touch of credence to the proposed theory that captured tech was introduced to industry but it took decades to understand its value in high speed information transfer.

[@ericpaul4575]

Chevy did that again on some Cadillacs except the indicators were on a little pod on each side of the front fender. Easy to see when driving.

[@svgalib]

my 69' firebird had a similar fiber optic cable running to the gear shift!

[@Dudeitsmeee]

I love this funky old display tech you tear apart Fran. Nixies, flip displays.. LEDs, incandescent, fiber.. between you and Alec's Technology Connections I love this funky old stuff explained and opened up.

[@JessHull]

I love this. Its like total Classic FranLab. Showing use the inner workings of a rare and barely known about display. So good I love it so much. I really do.

[@AppliedCryogenics]

Well said!

[@andyphilpotts4636]

Retired engineer here, love your channel, especially the retro stuff like these displays. It reminds of all the gear I used to mess with back in the day when it was "new", thanks for keeping the flame alive

[@Lumibear.]

Wow, and you could swap the LEDs for different colours, or even colour phasing LEDs, the longer the segment is on the more it would change colours. Imagine the fabulous clock!

[@KanalFrump]

it would be fun to find a way to recreate this as a hobby-scale production targeting use with modern LEDs.

[@inse001]

Might be fun but also blasphemy

[@69dblcab]

Another great display. You are a blessed person to have the access and intelligence to make them operate properly. The support information of who, how and when they were made and when available what projects the displays would or were used. Thanks to Matt for Frans goodies. Should be a great year.

[@MrDeelightful]

Wow, this is such a clever design. I can see it being difficult to scale production on but what a smart way of using the materials.

[@DisorderedArray]

I have some plastic fibre optic cable, LEDs and a 3D printer. Now I really want to make something like these things because it's such a neat idea!

[@randycarter2001]

The jig/mold would hold the fibers in position. Then the resin was pored in. Then the block was machined and polished to the final dimensions. The fibers were probably like 2" long to start with. The 'fibers' aren't glass but clear plastic light pipes.

[@richardbrobeck2384]

Wow how cool are those displays and thanks Matt for the wonderful donations !

[@ElectricGears]

I think it's feasible the production was almost completely automated. It would require the individual fibers to be a bit flexible. I would have two metal face plates, one face having holes in the 7 segment pattern. The other plate would have the larger holes matching the position of the LEDs. There would be 29 reals of fibers that can feed in from the front plate. I would have two forming blocks in the middle of the digits and guide plates that come in from the sides and top/bottom. They would form tunnels to guide the individual fibers into bundles that come out the back plate. The trick is that I would separate the two plate by a few inches. This would allow the outer guide plates to be retracted, then the inner guide blocks to be removed by flexing the fibers out of the way. Then you bring the front and back plates together and hold them in a fixture and inject the resin. Slice off the fibers and grind the front and back plates flat.

[@SeanBZA]

Probably made as multiple units, then a single shot injection of what is likely thermosetting resin, probably phenolic resin powder and filler, that was compressed into the die cavity. End of cycle just release the die, and have all sit loose, then cut the fibres off, and slip in another forming tool, that has channels that guide the fibres into the right holes on the led side, and a clamp that holds them while the forming tools are removed, and the die assembled around, then the powder is filled in and compressed to complete them. You definitely had a lot of machining on them, the front face and the back are definitely finished off on a surface grinder and a polisher, to get that perfect edge and clean fibres, and the sides likely as well, then at the rear those alignment holes are drilled by probably a burr. you lose a bit of fibre every cycle to wastage, but glass fibres are pretty cheap, and flexible as well, as after all it comes on rolls from Dow Corning, and likely was pre coated with a plastic layer that promoted bonding to the phenolic resin, and lubricated the processing.

[@timwilliscroft9615]

@@SeanBZA Might be Plastic Optical Fiber (POF). POF's been around a while.

[@paulstubbs7678]

@@timwilliscroft9615 Most definitely, considering the size of the fibers. Actually, of all the odd displays out there, this would be the easiest to reproduce at home.

[@stevewalston7089]

These would be quite fun to replicate!

[@thedave7760]

@@timwilliscroft9615 Same as in Toslink cable, it's basically fishing line, super cheep.

[@mre9593]

imagine making the led module with RGB LED's ! it could start out with red then go green, then rainbow.. it would definitely draw attention!

[@markwerley6965]

I wonder how the fiber optics were clamped during the casting of the block. I'm thinking the mold had holes that allowed the fibers to pass through, then once cast the fibers were cut and machined down flush with the block face. Any sign of tooling/polishing marks on the block's faces?

[@1944GPW]

I think the same too. The block could be replicated with 3D printing in black a hollow shell, along with a front and rear printed jig. The fibres then threaded through, black epoxy poured in then remove the jigs and trim the faces and polish.

[@captainboing]

very nice. displays like this - including the dot matrix 5x7 with built in decoder - have always held a special place in my heart... cheers

[@thephrase22]

I hoped you would place the cast block on top of the working display, so you could see the 7 light pipe circles lit up

[@mwendell]

But they wouldn't light up properly, as the italicization of the digit would prevent alignment.

[@sjm4306]

Those are beautiful! Love these vintage seven segment displays.

[@jeffreybarton1297]

Amazing that the manufacturer put such work and care into making that optical fibre section.

[@SaccoBelmonte]

Would be awesome to see an X ray of that fiber optic module.

[@rickyrico80]

It never seizes to amaze me that you know all this awesome ancient tech, let alone acquiring and getting it running. You have a lot of connections!

[@eltronics]

And I've been told Christmas was over... Those were neat displays. I had never seen this type before, and I learned and used electronics in the 70's. Another manufacturing marvel.

[@bagger35e]

That light pipe assembly in resin must have had some sort of jig to help assemble before the resin was poured. I wonder how "hands on" that process was... and I wonder if the face was resurfaced in a near final step of manufactured.

[@FranLab]

Definitely machined after casting and tumbled - and definitely very hands-on process.

[@stargazer279]

oh wooww, it is the first time i am seeing such fiber optic display. This is so cool. thanks for posting

[@sal.m2A]

Love it!! Blue led would make it awesome!

[@richard7crowley]

Thank you so much, Fran and Matt. I love your reviews of all those rare/obscure display technology.

[@wdavem]

YES these videos are so good!! I am all but certain I've seen this kind of display before, red and another one in light bulb colored dots! Some big machine I used to see regularly as a kid long ago... it's really bugging me. Wasn't the mini red displays on the ancient xerox flash bulb copiers... It might have been on some expensive custom vision therapy machine or something like that. I remember how some of those dots looked brighter then others and I figured out it might be fiber-optic. Haven't remembered that in a WHILE! Thanks!

[@TokyoScarab]

The ingenuity and appearance of these vintage displays never fails to both impress and inspire me! :D

[@MrPhil1969]

Really neat number display. Could you shine a light though the back of each bundle? I'd love to see which segments are bundles of 3-4-and 5 fibers. Can't wait to see what else is in the haul.

[@TheErador]

Sweet display. Cheers both!

[@paulstubbs7678]

Try replacing those old LED's with modern high intensity LED. And I'll have to disagree about your comment about the front being the most expensive, I'd say, as it is military, the associated paperwork would be the costliest part.

[@simonmikkelsen]

Thanks for letting us peak at this with you.

[@VideyoJunkei]

Hey! Fran, I have an idea...replace the LED's in 1 module with today's super-bright ones. I'd like to see how bright the final output is with them-and you can set the color you want! (I like white leds)

[@BRUXXUS]

Absolutely incredible and beautiful displays. Wow!

[@-jeff-]

DOD salvage desposal auctions. Wonderful way to get amazing stuff. I've been to so many and pick up everything from an Oscope to a cargo parachutes I made intp camping tents.

[@davestorm6718]

It would be cool to see those displays with blue LEDs (since they were unavailable in the 1970s although RCA invented one in 1972, the project was scrapped before something marketable was available). I remember, as a kid tinkering with electronics (1975), I had a grand idea to make a flat screen tv with LEDs, but, to my disappointment, I had to be told by an old guy at Radio Shack that they did not exist!

[@unklStewy]

Am I the only one who wanted to see the LED's work8ng without the fiber optic cap. I would like to see each LED illuminated for each digit to understand the fiber routing.

[@marcseclecticstuff9497]

IIRC, Tektronix 576 curve tracers used fiber-optic displays next to the CRT to display voltage and current settings.

[@phildem414]

Interesting and legible concept, very soft and nice glow

[@KeritechElectronics]

Loveliness increases, it will never pass into nothingness! Nerdy reference too. Lovely display unit indeed, and wonderful build quality, what is there not to swoon over with its conformal coating and all that stuff? Absolutely Fran-tastic! The fiber setup is the most interesting and mysterious part, but that may be reverse-engineered as for which LED goes to which segment. Oh, and you could even put the fiber optic assembly over a custom-made RGB LED assembly with dimensions matching the original one, and have the new display do any color you want! Ha. Oh, and I like your jacket :)

[@lordmuntague]

RGB version - you beat me to it! 😀

[@KeritechElectronics]

@@lordmuntague ha! Great minds think alike.

[@W1RMD]

Fran you are the true master of displays! I LOVE the bcd display you made! That project is now on my to do list. Thanks for sharing. On a separate note, If you find and post anything from the show "Marlo and The Magic Movie Machine" on here that would be great. Last I checked, there isn't a whole lot of footage of this show readily available. My oscilloscope obsession started there. Along with the idea of a secret lab hidden behind a book shelf!

[@technophile01]

hi. it would have been interesting to show the LEDs that light up by removing the cover with the optical fibers

[@BretFrohwein]

It's amazing how much time and effort was put in to these displays back in the day. I can't imagine how much something like that would cost to make in this day and age.

[@realcygnus]

Nifty ! I had some of those WAY back in the day but I have no idea what ever happened to them as well as so much other stuff I used to have. I imagine most of it just got tossed as junk while downsizing & moving so many times. Never even thinking of how rare they might become someday. I often dream about all of "my stuff"(old parts & unique tools & such) that I've had throughout my life, either losing them or like finally finding some long lost thing or things. 🤪

[@boscorner]

Yeees this is the good stuff! Theres just somethin about these old displays that I adore

[@AlForte13]

Man I love that ADI - I used to do Avionics Instrumentation in the Air Force and although that one was newer it brings back memories.

[@richfiles]

I've got a pair of ADIs. One is from the mid 1970s, and came from an Israeli F-4 Phantom flight trainer. The other, I'm unsure of it's age or origin, but it looks newer, though still fully electromechanical. I'm trying to build an instrument panel that will drive it, among other instruments, to interface with Kerbal Space Program.

[@AlForte13]

@@richfiles would love to see it. Onward to conquering space.

[@richfiles]

@@AlForte13 I have a build thread on the Kerbal Space Program forums. A quick search for Kerbal Instrument Panel Apollo Themed Hardware Controller ought to find the thread.

[@jeffburrell7648]

FranLab and FranBox. My mind went wild thinking of the FranCave with everything labeled ala the BatCave.

[@DavidLindes]

I'd love to see you pass a small light over the front of that display while recording video of the back of it... Or even to just light up one LED at a time and show the front (or whatever other hybrid on the theme.) Fun! I kinda want to hand-build one of these sometime, just for fun. But yeah, trying to do mass production? Seems like a nightmare!

[@ericfielding2540]

I don’t think I ever saw one of those in operation, but I might have. Neat to see how it works inside. Now we are even getting away from the basic 7-segment displays because planar displays are so cheap.

[@hpux735]

What an absolutely beautiful object

[@gumulf]

Fantastic! This will be a really interesting year.

[@gregoryzloch9106]

Very cool tech you dug up there Fran. Thanks for sharing. Btw, could you please do a follow up video to show the individual LEDs light up with their weird patterns (without the light pipe casting). Love you Fran. Thanks.

[@rickharold7884]

V nice I’ve used light pipes before with LEDs. Very cool and a lot of work. Fun video.

[@aleksandersuur9475]

As for production, it might not be all so bad. You would of course need a mold of come sort for it. I imagine the workflow something like: 1) insert fibers into bottom part of the mold that is holding them in 8. figure and fixes them in place somehow 2) divide them into bundles by which led they need to go. 3) pull the bundles through top part of the mold that holds them in figure of LEDs 4) close the mold, fill with resin, cure, take it apart 5) cut the ends off with excess fiber and mold lines, give it a good sanding Of course, that's a lot of manual work and everything, but as far as vintage electronics go, that's not so bad.

[@feynthefallen]

When I saw the title, I was quite stumped as to what I would see. Very cool device showcasing the creative solutions of the past.

[@xConundrumx]

Seems like something you could remake quite easy ... Use some fiber cable and two 3d printed frames to keep the fiber strands in place (one for the segment side near the front, one for the bundle side in the back). Then resin-cast the whole thing in a silicon resin mold (including the frames that keep the strands where they need to be). Finish up the front and back with some appropriate sand paper after it sets and done.

[@KingKong-mp6gj]

My old washing machine uses this for displaying the cycle's remaining time. It's pretty hard to read nowadays because carbon dust from the motor brushes somehow found it's way inside the phenolic block.

[@ScottGrammer]

03:51 Love the woodgrain Archer project box! I never could afford those for my projects back in the day.

[@1944GPW]

It would look even more 70s if the front labels were done with an old Dymo :)

[@jctoad]

I tried to cover the bare aluminum one with woodgrain contact paper. It didn't look too good.

[@inse001]

@@1944GPW absolutely 👍 and at least one of them having fallen off :-)

[@1944GPW]

@@inse001 indeed, with dust and carpet fibres adhered to the glue residue enough for the letters to be read :)

[@lordmuntague]

Good grief! Seriously cool Fran, absolutely love it. 👍

[@derekchristenson5711]

Very cool! I like how those look. Also, coincidentally, I was ordering some 74LS47's while watching this, hehe.

[@Rokreder]

I have a bunch of the incandescent version laying around which I removed from an old avionics module (Panavia Tornado). I'll send you some! Are there other segment modules you are looking for?

[@Totalinternalreflection]

Thank you Matt

[@gcewing]

Looking forward to the 8-ball video! I've long been curious about how those things worked.

[@69dblcab]

YEAH Binaview!! Such cool tech. Have a great day Fran.

[@sleepib]

I don't think the fiber optics were threaded individually, if you look at the back you can see a circular boundary around each cluster. I think what's going on is that they cast a back piece that looked like a bunch of oddly shaped funnels, with the fibers being cast into the front 8 shape. When you push them together the fibers follow the funnel to the hole in the back piece. So it's more operations, but it's not necessarily a painstakingly manual process.

[@markusallport1276]

My dad had a couple of the modules you have from Bell Labs from years ago, but he gave them away when he moved back to Michigan. I have seen fiber optic matrix displays, but they are quite costly. I wish I still had those things.

[@Mockingbird650]

Brainstorm is absolutely one of my "top ten" favorite movies. Right along there with Altered States.

[@Clark-Mills]

3:36 The rubber mat is more likely a "light sponge" to reduce bleed between LEDs. Great goodie boxes - much fun ahead! :)

[@Clark-Mills]

And a special "Thanks!" to Matt Wietlispach; very kind and wise placement for us all!

[@stevem.1853]

Used to have hundreds of these type Displays on old equipment at work. Unfortunately I was not involved in the decommissioning and scrapping of the equipment or I would have harvested a bunch of them. They were the older style incandescent type. The display panel also had some 7 segment displays but I think that they wanted larger numerals. I don't know how many different sizes of LED 7 segment displays were available in the mid 70s. I believe the tiny bulbs ran on 5Vdc....

[@micahnightwolf]

Manufacturing those would be actually quite easy if you use a jig to hold the fibers in place. You can thread them into the jig by hand or automatically, then dunk the whole thing in resin and then cut out the part that matters and rinse and repeat.

[@CARLiCON]

Very interesting approach, so it's 28 dots total for the digit (not including the decimal) but basically still made up of 7 segments (2) 5-dot, (3) 4-dot, & (2) 3-dot. So compared to typical 7S LED display, some numbers look small, & other appear larger with descenders...wonder why they did it this way, just to make it unique font? or is it because it evolved pre-LED?

[@Adamisgood24]

Very impressive display!!

[@luizmarxsenjr]

Very interesting device, I saw many kinds of seven segment displays but nothing like this, congrats... The SN5446/47 ICs were intended originally to drive numitrons directly, I bet that this was a Texas Instruments answer to the RCA CD2501 ICs...

[@bitume]

Thank you so much for this!

[@loqAtMefi]

Project idea: Rare display sampler clock. Each digit is a different kind of display technology.

[@FranLab]

Result - The ugliest and rarest clock on the planet.

[@davepost7675]

I wonder why they would make such a display at that time. It seems other technology would be cheaper. Was this some sort of replacement part for much older equipment I wonder.

[@larry785]

It makes it easy to change the color of the leds!

[@richfiles]

Just eying the 8-ball you took out of the box, that looks like a 2-axis model, one that shows pitch and roll. I believe yaw would be shown on a separate heading indicator, at least on many commercial craft. I have a pair of 3-axis ADIs. One was from an Israeli F-4 Phantom flight trainer, and is dated 1975. The other, I'm unsure of it's age or origin, but it looks newer, though it's still fully electromechanical. I'm trying to build an instrument panel to interface with Kerbal Space Program. I'm working on a synchro emulator to drive it. I also would love to have seen the segment patterns created with the unique 3, 4, and 5 fiber bundles.

[@paulfasolo8552]

I saw these back in the last century!

[@christopherrasmussen8718]

Cadillac had fiber optic cables running from each light in the car to a small display on the dash. My 67 had it

[@Spookyhoobster]

5:32 - How did they make those traces? I know it's all hand done, but that's the first time I've seen traces like that. It's very interesting look, got a very 70's retro style to it lol.

[@dentakuweb]

Did 7 segment displays like we know today, with the LEDs directly in each segment, already exist back when those were around? Those tiny bubble displays have been around for a long time but obviously they weren't very bright, or big or as good looking. I'm assuming the original version of those fiber optic displays used tiny incandescent bulbs but was otherwise the same.

[@bitrage.]

I think they casted them then drilled holes for numbers, put fibers in and then filled in rest of the hole space with more resin.

[@sinephase]

Wow, nice, Matt! :O

[@tekvax01]

Anyone else notice the "Research for a Better Tomorrow" Brainstorm logo sticker on the box?? Awesome!!

[@FranLab]

How many people are going to make this comment without watching 1:55 into the video?

[@S-CB-SL-Animations]

Where did you get those fiber optic numbers from?

[@aquatrax123]

Those are amazing!

[@ChipGuy]

This would look beautiful with the candy green 520nm LEDs I guess. I am a big fan of those.

[@sausage5849]

That's a nice display!

[@teejayy2130]

FranVault it's ace, love this🥰

[@utp216]

Always such cool stuff!!

[@yorgle]

I dig the Brainstorm stickers!

[@renaissanceman5847]

cool!... so technically, you can use the Fiber portion to recreate another 4bit to 7 seg but with different (and brighter) colored LEDs like, Blue or white... maybe even go with a Hex code output!

[@McTroyd]

Really cool. How would the incandescent lights have fared brightness-wise compared to the LEDs? At 5V probably not favorably, I'd wager, but IIRC from your other videos they usually used 12 or 24 volts with those...?

[@eDoc2020]

Probably comparable brightness, just more power consumption.

[@scaredyfish]

I would love to see light shined through each individually just to see which leds light up which dots

[@FranLab]

Each cluster = 1 segment - as seen when held next to the bezel.

[@ElectricPoliville]

Been looking for those do you have a part number for the fiber part. Need some.

[@MartysRandomStuff]

If that is resin just the curing time would be cost prohibitive these days, let alone what I would assume was very hands on setting of the fiber optics in the mold. Today if a part like that takes longer than a few seconds to make it doesn't get made. That method is still the go to way to do lighting for tiny windows or tiny lights on control panels of model star ships.

[@paulhiggins8774]

Great little devices

[@luckysevens.AltRock8]

Hi Fran great video. that must be plastic fiber optics used in the display, communication fiber is 0.50 micron lazor speed for multi mode and 0.09 for single mode.

[@TooSlowTube]

Fran might be interested in this research to reverse hearing loss: "The biotechnology company Frequency Therapeutics is seeking to reverse hearing loss - not with hearing aids or implants, but with a new kind of regenerative therapy. The company uses small molecules to program progenitor cells, a descendant of stem cells in the inner ear, to create the tiny hair cells that allow us to hear" - Reversing hearing loss with regenerative therapy MIT spinout Frequency Therapeutics’ drug candidate stimulates the growth of hair cells in the inner ear. Zach Winn | MIT News Office Publication Date: March 29, 2022

[@yash1152]

7:03 > _"thats cast around those [optic] fibres"_ ohhhwwww. ohw, thats what the title means. took me so long. nice.