Basics for New Players - Subtlety Rogue - Maximize Damage, Gearing, Openers & Mindset [PvP] [WoD]

[@Moonlight_Gamer]

Your guides are very high quality and explained nicely :)

[@LvladenPvP]

Sativ im wondering if you have ever tried the new way to play sub as a bleed class. It is completely different than this style. My friend Jax (r1) rogue says its far better than the old style of play which is this version. It involves stacking multi strike as much as possible and applying every bleed in a rogues toolkit including hemorrhage and the kidney shot talent bleed. You also want mark of thr shatterhand and you can apply 7 total bleeds to the target and your multistrikes from backstabbing and ambush advance your bleed ticks making you do so much more damage. He also uses venom zest. I've seen him destroy literally every class. Just wanted to hear your thoughts. Not saying this guide is wrong! Just maybe there is a new completely different way to play sub now that works too

[@Diavolo222]

Would like to hear Sativ's opinion on this aswell. Maybe even a short vid trying it out for us?

[@fupaflal]

Im interested in watching something like this! Does your friend have a youtube or anything I can check out? Also how does Ambush and backstab advance your bleed ticks? Is it a skill I don't get it,. Nvm he mentioned it in the video

[@SusejFTW]

Lvladen PvP we didnt even have shattered hand on betaI do run Internal bleeding talent as Subtltey and I think i even said venom rush is best in serious pvp xD

[@SusejFTW]

Lvladen PvP You guys should just watch the stream if you want to see how I'm playing Subtlety currently. Very bleed centric.

[@SusejFTW]

the thing is DFA can bug out and VR is more consistent./ But lately I've been using DFA for more... unique gameplay like immining hoj

[@trinesnaxh]

Great work as always, I highly appreciate this guide since I boosted a lvl 90 rogue and I had no idea about rogues. Now ima pro :P thx

[@ryanwars1789]

VERY good guide sativ, been playing combat and managed to reach a 1900 mmr but I think learning sub can help me push past that. Seems legit and has strong DFA. Nice vid can't wait for more guides!

[@aleksanderkelairam4011]

Your videos are the best! So glad u got a sponsor so u can keep up the good work withouth worrying to much about money. Is there an advanced sub rogue guide planned in the future? Thanks again for your time and effort! :)

[@G0053-e3r]

What addon is that that tracks the spells you used?

[@danieltsmoke]

Great stuff as always. When you're 500k subs I'll be all hipster about being subbed at

[@CWSLawn_and_Garden]

so when exactly do you use death from above?

[@Landroiel]

So when is a good time to use Death From Above? I always feel so awkward when I use that ability.

[@DiNozzo431]

This is golden man, thank you for this!

[@lordzlomek]

Hey Sativ! Great guide. Any chance you'll be uploading a comprehensive gearing, enchanting and stat priority guide for all three specs since we're kinda stuck with blue gear till Dec 2nd. I was wondering why a lot of people are choosing blue gear with no set bonus over the normal one. Secondary stats?

[@Tkyotripz]

Can you do the same video with the focus on assassination spec?

[@leoplu2414]

very nice video, but pls tell which addon let you see the stuneffect (or for example iceblock) on the enemy portrait?? thx a lot and great job!

[@SusejFTW]

[6.0] Addons for PvP Awareness - [Warlords of Draenor] [Sativ] [1080p]

[@leoplu2414]

merci

[@EvilEvil66]

Good info. Thanks. Please make more once Season starts!

[@caiohenrique6176]

O melhor conteúdo para iniciantes, pena que não entendo muita coisa kjkjkjkj.

[@SorrowHead]

Good video as always,i have a question regarding hemorrhage thou.Is opening with cheap shot->rupture better than cheap shot->hemorrhage?Please explain,never seen openers like that. O:

[@SusejFTW]

im almost sure i explain to people not to use hemo atm. Cheap shot rupture -> Damage -> Kidney Shot.

[@SorrowHead]

SusejFTW Alright,thanks man.

[@LuckHappens1]

dude, you fixed me! thank u so much!

[@prosnipertage]

Hey sativ, im not sure how to go about gearing my rogue, what pieces should I be looking for ? and which pieces should I be using for my set bonus ? Also which pieces for trinkets etc ? Thanks man ! Always looking forward to your videos

[@iamdreamer914]

Sativ, I see you were experimenting with both sets for gear. The first stat priority or the second one. Which one did you go with in the end ? or are you still experimenting ? or using both. Thank you in advanced.

[@xchosen0nex]

Hi Sativ, First off thanks for the vids! Rlly helpfull. When i check your amory i see your stat priority has changed allot vs this video ? Seems more like Multistrike > crit > Mastery > Haste > Versatility Also, Armory says 2x sword ? :D Can you make a comment on this please? Thanks!

[@Syfiewow]

if he has 2 swords then that is not his sub build, you cant even use some of the sub abilities without a dagger, probably a combat build.

[@therealjonaswp602]

Really love your vids mate. I was wondering - what macro's do you use? I can't seem to find any info around it. :)

[@Zomgitsgeorge]

[@vandamwtc]

Hey Sativ, have your Sub stat priorities changed since the new season started?

[@nobziewow7619]

What add-on do you use for your action bars? I used to have it, but I had to wipe my computer : / Forgot the name for it

[@TaskMasterMLG]

Hey Susej! could you do one of these for the assassination spec? :)

[@DGP24]

dude . nice video i`m just starting a rogue managed to make it 100 in 3 days ( no hairlooms no potions ) and i was wondering 1. whats the macro that makes your skills show up there 2. better with close range camera or long range camera 3.if i wanna focus on an ambush ambush dfa build should i gor for the 5 yd range+ glyph . if yes which should i replace . Hope you read this .

[@Remsaa]

I read on AJ that doing a Hemo instead of a Rupture during the opener can apply Sang Veins and give a combo point instead of using it to use in the opener, thoughts on this? I have been using an opener for damage that is premed + SnD, feint (in stealth) cheap shot, Hemo, ambush, versa trinket, evis, MfD, DfA, BS, BS. How bad is that compared to your suggested opener?

[@bromar95d45]

1:06 what is the background song called

[@immie1709]

Hi Susjej, can you tell me with Combat is viable in PvP?! Thanks!

[@rochechong9722]

What will be the best rotation for shadow reflection? for bosses i mean

[@ognyanmalinov4739]

Hey, Susej should I use Haste/Mastery items instead of Crit /Multistrike since you value haste the least but in the Haste/Mastery items there is no crit?

[@GuthDzn]

Hi nice videos watched them all! I have a couple questions and struggles :/ I struggle with dealing damage as a rogue, it may sounds weird. Are there any tips or video's that I can watch to get better? thanks anyway

[@hzozuppu0pu]

the question is if its worth having glyph of hemo veins?i know rupture does ok damage but it doesnt do damage like eviscerate

[@Zomgitsgeorge]

Oh one question, do you use hemo at all? other than when it is absolutely impossible to get behind the target? is it worth it to put hemo for the sinister calling perk?

[@Shadowhazze]

Do the weapon enchants stack? or does 1 just refresh the other quicker.

[@Firecloud20]

so tell me this is sub a better choice then mutilate rogue in all ways? or is mutilate rogue still good aswell?

[@edladd212]

Considering we get an extra 5% multistrike as Sub - it seems like a waste that its one of the lowest priority stats. Do you think blizz will fix this? Or is this just a PVP peculiarity and ms is fine in PVE?

[@mag1da]

Hey sativ So i have been doing some research but im having a hard time figuring out what lvl 100 talent is the best for Sub rogues Atm. is it DfA or VR?

[@DonPatch97]

Which set of gear do you think is better now that it's a few weeks into the season?

[@joshsnyder683]

Another great one... Thanks Sativ

[@Danpet1234]

I'm playing a rogue but my damage is shit. I barely crit 30k with Eviscerate.

[@ZaaaaaM7]

What are the daggers at 1:50?

[@abc1150z]

So what is the best stats for sub rogue for now ? mastery, crit or multistrike?

[@mxrto5348]

which set is better for PVP i didnt understand , mastery 70 % or 50% mastery ?? good guide btw its really helping!

[@perkan8290]

Hey there Sativ! Which spec are you having the most fun with right now? and why? :)

[@Chris-bw7eb]

what xmog/illusion/enchants are those? xF

[@iCutWaffles]

I have the same stats and don't hit anywhere near 50k-100k like you do in this video, could you explain me what's wrong?

[@shenriu6818]

Could you possibly do a guide like this but for assassination?

[@brandonstaab6480]

***** So I'm buying my enchants early before the season starts, only problem is the weapon enchant is 17k+ on my server. There an alternative that could get me by until the prices drop? (Not enchanting anything until I start getting the glad pieces when S1 starts)

[@TheSmithtr86]

Should do a vid on where to get the new pvp gear, and which gear to get first ^-^

[@Nickolov707]

You should add the latest rocket from Draenor Engineering, use for everyone lvl 91 or up with no engy skill require, does 59k damage, useful for PvP BG and Ashran PvP. Also the Shieldtonic Shield from engy, use for everyone lvl 91 or up with no engy skill require. Can absorb a lot of damage. the Goblin Glide Kit(faster than a ground mount), it's like the tinker on cloak glide but less cool down, once use so grab a lot. Lvl 91 or up with no engy require. Also grab Swapblaster (Bind on Use) no engy skill require. I think its anyone lvl 1 or above. Forever use, 10 sec cooldown, must be out of combat. can help swap yourself with a Ally FlagCarrier or you're the flag carrier and swap with someone to get closer to the objective, or escape quick, works how high sky the person is, but out of combat. I think it's a 2 sec channel. Maybe a personal Hologram for a small decoy, fade but may trick thinking it is a cloak rogue detected, it follows emotes like dance for fun. Same as always, but it will break stealth. With Subterfuge, goblin glide kit won't break stealth, so maybe a far down forward quick boost to chase someone down hill. Like I mentioned, faster than a ground mount speed %100. But it will break stealth with the other 2 tier 1 talents selected.

[@Nickolov707]

Other than a great chase down with goblin glider kit but a great escape, if you jump off a cliff like Lumber Mill in Arathi Basin, activate the glider to escape out fast and free, you can activate stealth without breaking the glider, same as vanishing and Cloak of Shadows to remove dots.

[@jaegerly]

What is your take on daggers vs swords for sub?

[@Hardivh]

Do you think a Rogue is playable with 170~180ms latency? I'm from Brazil and there's not way to have much less latency than that (buying a tunneling service makes it like 150ms)

[@treepizzle]

Super helpful to this noobie. Thanks!

[@NaranyaR]

I have read up on some pve forums (I know I'm a baddy but some of my friends only like pve) and I know just for damage, their saying Agility>Mastery=Multi-strike>Crit=Vers>haste. This seems close to what we want in pvp. Thoughts?

[@SerenDipityDoDahDay]

Hey sativ U have answered my question here and that is cool.It was about the mastery or crit choice.I added a enchant to the cloak right with 100mastery.Got a better cloak that didnt have the 100mastery and when I took the enchanted cloak off to use the other I loose a 6-7%mastery and the crit from rings I remove both take away the same thing and loose only2%.It is harder to get higher crit rate.So goin for the crit will take a shit load to get this up there.Thnks for info, will take advantage of the mastery.

[@cyntiaxpvp8517]

If you are soloing or doing random bgs do you go with Internal bleeding or prey? Tyty keep up the gr8 work m8! :)

[@Diavolo222]

I would say Prey is better cause in your teammates can help out a lot more with that 10% dmg and u want to kill people fast in BGs not dot them up and have a 5 minute man fight. If you are playing 2s/3s with a Warlock for example, internal bleeding would be better.

[@cyntiaxpvp8517]

Aight ty m8 :)

[@SusejFTW]

Cyntiax PvP I like Internal Bleeding Better

[@cyntiaxpvp8517]

hmm :D which 1 lel? :p

[@reyflp]

what % of mastery should i have? cuz i think im way over it xD when i enter a pvp situation i have 105 % mastery and thats without my weapons enchants being active

[@TheDeadking05]

where did you get those daggers?

so feint doesnt affect versatility anymore

[@Beaunage]

Do you play on Bleeding Hollow?

[@taurenwarrior1]

I didn't see you use feint that often when is the best time to use it?

[@xXRiZzO]

If you're tracking the enemy's CDs and see their stun off CD, then more than likely they're gonna stun you right when your stun breaks, so pre feint. Also stacks with nerve strike, so use it when the stun falls off to avoid blowing cds early.

[@TheDAZ1001]

Another fantasic guide :)

[@tomh6671]

Does internal bleeding apply to sinister calling's multistrike effect?

[@SusejFTW]

i do not believe so i have been trying this and havent got it to advance the bleed.

[@vortraz2054]

I haven't read other comments so if u know by now bear with me but u said "rogues" get the find weakness debuff later in the video not just THIS rogue or sub rogue as if u meant it was core. Of course I'm sure u know that its not core but I'm double checking that u know the phrasing in the vid Also u might have realized it or been told by now but its a sub rogue guide and u said we get extra rupture ticks when we use sinister strike, but we get hemo instead. U might have meant hemo but I'm curious if we get that effect upon hemo uses as well. In which case it could be a bit bigger dps than people are counting at times. Personally (using subterfuge) id prefer to open with cheap shot- garrote and use a glyph for both. That way u get vein denier outright and don't have to pop your combo points for an early rupture because I'm pretty sure I read somewhere the total damage of rupture was changed to slightly scale with points as well as duration. It was a sub thing I belive. Don't quote me on that iv not tested it. And yes I'm aware u want full uptime on rupture anyway for the damage as well but as an opener I really like stacking cheap shot and garrote it gives me another option for those combo points and I can still get my vein damage stacked up with find weakness and the opener bonus. It also stacks a silence just after the stun which can stop some stun breaks as well hopefully.. the only thing I haven't checked is the energy cost on this. Personally I don't think I want glyph of blind if i need them stunned that badly I'll use kidney shot or something I feel there's much more valueable options there but its your setup so by all means

[@simonsmith8945]

you literally have no idea if you think replacing the blind glyph is viable

[@StoicSunderer]

2 questions : Why not use the Glyph of Hemorrhaging Veins over cheap shot and why do you Rupture with 2 combo points rather than start with Garrote?

[@Diavolo222]

Because Rupture does some serious dmg now and it's wise to always keep it on so no point in that glyph. Also the cheap shot and garrote glyph are basically mandatory because they are way better than Veins which is just a lazy quality of life improvement ( should be baseline but w/e ). Also you dont start with garrote on all classes, just on casters.

[@xXRiZzO]

Diavolo222 Blind/Energy is mandatory for good openers.. Garrote can be switched out with what you like depending on the comp you're facing and the comp you're in. With no healer I usually use Energy/Blind/Recup.. That 1% increase in healing helps more than people think. With healer, I run Energy/Blind/Garrote. Hemo glyph is a waste.. You use rupture with only 2 cps to fit your burst in the stun window. If stun breaks they can cc you to stop dmg or pop defensives to mitigate your burst.

[@ОляНагорнова-ч4х]

What's addon you use?

[@biffabacon8860]

love it, sativ. thanks!

[@abiiqu]

Hey can u upload ur Interface ui on wow Interface? I love ur ui or can u send Me ur ui? (Wtf/interface) folder? Thanks

[@Mortenen]

How are you in full epic gear already??

[@Kalron9]

Do you do PvE? Just out of curiosity lol I enjoy PvP much more than PvE as a rogue.

[@Sjildur]

What is that addon called you use for you spells and and action bars?

[@SusejFTW]

***** TrufiGCD for spell use - PowerInterface for bars.

[@Dailythenics]

Anyone knows the name of the purple enchant

[@thedraftdunker8127]

What enchants do he use?

[@scdph6251]

Ok, this guide say that only you will be a good rogue (and increase your damage) if u have full arenas set. GG blizzy

[@scrice9081]

ty for tips mr.Sativ !

[@DeweqVD]

Hello! Im just started sub and watching your guides but i cant get the dmg out :(

[@Jergybeef]

Do I always have to start in Stealth for Master of Subtlety buff to maximize my dance dmg?

[@timoow690]

why wouldnt you open from stealth as a sub rogue? xD

[@Jergybeef]

when youre infight and the first opener didn´t quite work

[@MrMadFrosty]

Im new to WoW, Does Feral do more burst damage then rouge?

[@SusejFTW]

depends. rogues can burst as hard and more often but ferals opener is insane an they stay consistent for a long time w/ heart of the wild keeping them offensive.

[@serhatuz6373]

Is it worth using SD while subterfuge is active just to reduce the energy cost of ambush?

[@SusejFTW]

yes if you're opening with dance it is.

[@serhatuz6373]

SusejFTW all right I figured, cheers!

[@boiiimadking1264]

so that migth by a stupid question but is swordhemo spam viable ?

[@SusejFTW]

Jellal Fernandes no

[@boiiimadking1264]

k thanks ^^ btw your vids are awesome

[@Zatiih]

So whats the point of subterfuge on your rotation where you use rupture after cheapshot. Does it mean subterfuge is only useful for garrote+cheapshot on mages? cuz if thats the case i think shadow focus is better

[@shieldcrit]

The main point of subterfurge is to able to use the cheap shot after your stealth is broken, not ambush. If you go for focus and ignore it you will lose your upper hand as opening with a disabler and it is a big deal. And also the reason he is not using ambush after cheap shot because of GCD, if you put ambush to the second place, your target will most likely get out of your stun before you put your 5 point combo.

[@Floofermancer]

Shadow focus will only be better for PvE. Subterfuge has way too much versatility in PvP to be topped. You can use it to garrote stun mages, or stun one person then garrote open on a healer. It can even be used to save your opener in situations where you got pulled unexpectedly (I.E. that random lucky flare / death and decay). You get pulled from stealth but can still secure your opening stun / garrote on your target.

[@Syfiewow]

its 3 sec, if you cheap rupture that is only 2, you have one more second to hit something unless you are slow.

[@Kronx1970]

Does Sub suck now? Because Im new to rogues... pretty much full 620 pvp gear and I barely scratch anyone.

[@xXRiZzO]

You need the mastery enchants to see more dmg, but you can still pump out decent damage with full blues if you know what you're doing. Just practice on different situations.. Sub can be complicated so people lose themselves on "omg, he messed up my rotation, let me run away so I can stealth" instead of "Bitch, you want some?!" and setting up burst out of stealth.

[@DaPlayerzPt]

Pls tell me the name of your weapons

[@ReaperGaming17]

TYVM for this video

[@mcstar24]

Sativ do you do any kind of lessons in game or anything? I am seriously struggling as rogue. I re rolled and even after watching all of your videos and many many hours of practice I am struggling.

[@SusejFTW]

Cory Goben What did you have in mind. People have paid me for lessons before.

[@ZachyyPr0]

SusejFTW What kind of prices for lessons? I'm also having a tough time. Serious inquiry.

[@travisrogers6507]

3:14 "combo pioints" Fkn blizz m8

[@vincenttranchida6938]

which enchants are you using?

[@SusejFTW]

Vincent Tranchida Bleeding Hollow x2

[@Nickolov707]

I can't sap a rogue first,u spam Tab+sap and they always get me first

[@xOverLordJaredx]

Hi sativ, i love your work. You are so helpful and are fun. I love my class rouge but i wasent doing damage so i found you on youtube. I follow you rotation and stuff from your guides and i havent been doing a thing to clases then they squash me like a bug. I think i might be doing somthing wrong. I usually main sub and switch out to assas every now and then and i duel spec combat.

[@coffeebot7016]

Why is Cloak and Dagger not viable?

[@APlainSandwich]

+Moonglare 友人 I was thinking that I like the passive spell.

[@vilestine]

"Find Weakness" itself doesn't exist anymore, the debuff is in cs, ambush and garrote :P

[@NaranyaR]

Yes but the effect is still "Find weakness" when it appears on your target as a debuff or if you track it with Tellmewhen an addon.

[@SusejFTW]

Robert Wood yes

[@Thr333Dogg]

Great video

[@sayronnew1559]

Awesome! Ty

[@archilgogava9141]

respect.

[@Toxyo]

great job

[@thebeast7453]

لايك لعيون ملك المجلس

[@Nickolov707]

Hey Sativ? Can we do Arenas together?

[@craigeboy70]

awesome vid.

[@Nickolov707]

I'm still doing small damage with this build