1970 Can-Am series at Road Atlanta

[@rickintexas1584]

That was so cool. I can imagine my dad and his buddies in the stands. I love watching the spectators. I hope they all had good lives.

[@brandond5209]

Racing was so cool back then. The drivers had so much personality and the cars were so cool. My dad took my brother and I to Road Atlanta in the mid 70's through the early 90's. Good times.

[@PeterMayer]

This was my older brothers era

[@weaksignal8009]

Sideburns!

[@Gunbucket1964]

This was the best racing ever. Practically no rules on the build and fantastic road courses. They wouldn't allow this type of racing today.

[@coldlakealta4043]

I agree, Can Am was by far the best racing series ever including F1. My brother and I spent 3 summers chasing the series around the north-eastern US and Canada, with Mosport being our home track. We were McLaren people and loved the Bruce and Denny show. Monstrous engines in little cars with almost no rules and world-class drivers - a formula for greatness never to be repeated. My favourite cars were the various McLaren M8s.

[@knarf_on_a_bike]

Saw several CanAms in the early 70s at Mosport. Sitting at Moss corner, 25 big V8s thundering down the chute, coming into the hairpin, was an unbelievable feeling. What a great series this was!

[@brianpierce5652]

Was at this race as a 7 year old boy. We live close by and my dad was a local Jaycee who helped with traffic control. What a thrill to think back on this time in auto racing history. The track has changed a little over the years but is still a great place to watch Petit Lemans and other races

[@RickyJr46]

*A racing documentary par excellence.* 🏁

[@havefaith3213]

I am so glad I found this video. Brings me back, racing slot cars, dreaming of being a racer, making models, watching Jim McKay Wide World of Sports ,when I was a kid. Liked it much better back then. Wasn't on TV much like today. But bought all the magazines and I knew what was what more than today . Peter Remsen, Mark McDonough , Swede Savage, Jim Clark, and so many more. Never forgotten buy me, RIP.

[@havefaith3213]

@@Loulovesspeed thanks I should have reread it before I sent it.

[@Joop.23-2-63]

Also dreaming to become a racer in those days. Nowadays I am a racer, scale 1:32 however...... SLOT IT cars on a Scalextric track, www.slot.it/INGLESE/slotit_GB.php

[@scarbourgeoisie]

AFX slot cars FTW!

[@sherrysetliff2502]

Have Faith it was Peter revson

[@Yosemite-George-61]

..slot cars on wooden tracks, me too !

[@leefury7]

I was there. LOVED CanAm. Hall was always my favorite because of innovative ideas. Lot of fun driving up there every year, camping just outside of the track. Bratwurst and corn on the cob. And a 100 places to sit and watch the race. So many different sounding engines. Those were the daze.

[@randyholbrook9609]

Amazing footage. The crowds were huge and the cars were so awesome. Loved the RC car too. It's still great today but not like then.

[@miketarver4086]

I was there. I operated a wrecker with my Dad. Great time in my life.

[@gregbennett4254]

The best racing ever we will never see this again long live can am cars

[@gcmc2gcmc279]

Wow - what a great vid to come across. A real bonus at the end for me that I had no idea about. Tony Dean was a privateer English Porsche customer who bought season old 906 and 910etc porsches from the factory in the 60s. I didn't ever know he had a 908 or certainly that he'd had a Canam win. That's made my day. He was a genuine mad keen privateer (and I think a school teacher but I might be wrong about that because I'm getting on a bit) Bravo Tony - hope you're still with us !

[@BlueTrane2028]

Dean died on 17 January 2008 after a short illness.

[@sherrysetliff2502]

Wow, to see the old road Atlanta . When gravity cavity was in play.

[@archetypex65]

I was lucky enough to race there before they fucked gravity cavity with that Mickey Mouse. Chicane...🙄

[@bigbear5510]

@@archetypex65 How true! I never raced there but I did take the driving classes there & was even a allowed to do some hot laps in my "street car" with a full cage & a Porsche 944!

[@HertzBlut]

Best recommendation from KZbin in a very long time. Instantly subbed

[@44hawk28]

I still remember taking delivery of a couple of those cars for their owners. It was the first true race car I believe I had ever seen. It was the epitome of everything. And yet had no electronics to help you steer, no torque vectoring, no anti-lock brakes, just motor pedals and steering wheel and yet with a bit of aerodynamics was just an absolute monster on the race track.

[@russellhartwell5404]

,, ,, " SOMETHING, " LIKE, A, -- " SUPER, - MOD, " !!, "2," - DAY, !!,

[@herbertmace2456]

The first track event I ever attended - utterly awesome

[@donziperk]

I was about 10 years old when the Can Am series was in its hay day. The little bits of race footage that appeared on the Wide World Of Sports and articles in Road and Track magazine formed the bases of my love of sports car racing. Those cars seemed so foreign and exotic to a kid growing up in Vancouver Canada. Then my dad took me to Westwood race track just outside the city. It was designed by Sterling Moss in the late 50’s. Those 2 things set me down a course of road racing passion for cars and motorcycles that still burns hot in me today. Thanks for posting video I remember seeing it as kid. For those who like local club tracks search Westwood race track as there is a decent about of footage of both car and bikes at that track. The old Formula Atlantic and Trans Am series came there in 70s and early 80s.

[@andyharman3022]

Haven't they recently built a new track near Vancouver?

[@donziperk]

Andy Harman There is a rather dismal excuse of a track s at Mission Raceway. There are 2 private tracks one on Vancouver Island which is good and an excellent track called Area 27 about 5.5 hours east of Vancouver in Oliver in the Okanagan Valley. Both are members only or you can pay for some track time sessions. There are no race events at either track unfortunately but there is hope that perhaps Area 27 may host some events. Take a look at their website.

[@andyharman3022]

@@donziperk Yeah, Area 27 was the one I read about a few years ago. I think that Jacques Villeneuve helped design it.

[@donziperk]

Andy Harman Yes that’s correct and Trever Siebert put a lot of money in it. Its a fabulous layout in a beautiful setting. Theres lot of footage of cars on the track.

[@donziperk]

Andy Harman Thats correct its a fabulous track in a beautiful setting. There’s lot if videos on here from the track.

[@mb4lunch]

I watch this video every year or so.

[@jerrytee2688]

My favorite "road course" vehicles, big blocks, injector stacks and steamroller rubber. Fuck yeah!

[@multa765]

What a lovely film, calmly and informatively delivered by the commentator. So much better than the forced hysteria of modern commentry. I wish I had a barn in which I could find a Can-Am car, it was the best formula ever and no racing car is ever going to look or sound better again.

[@shanehenderson9935]

Bruce Mclaren and Denny Hulme. Two New Zealand legends.

Kiwis are Great! Coming from a Jingo American!

[@peterlafrenz5220]

Dont forget Chris Amon and John Britten.

[@15kr]

Dixon is pretty damn good too. Must be the loneliness of the place that drives these men.

[@TexasScout]

That’s an era when men were men, and cars were monsters.

[@normanmortensen2591]

Or when sex was safe and race cars where deadly :D

[@Hithere-ek4qt]

or when the news was true and you could trust the government(mostly)

[@Logan912]

Hi there Eh, given that was the height of the CIA’s black ops programs, Watergate, Vietnam War, and everything else, the government couldn’t really be trusted then either. Lol

[@andyharman3022]

@@Logan912 But at least they were on our side.

[@Okuni_]

an era where men were wife beaters and cars were lead puffing machines

[@timd4524]

Great video. I've got many of these cars for my 1/32 scale Carrera digital slot cars. Especially the Lola, Porsche, and McLaren. This was the greatest racing to watch as a kid.

[@ralphaverill2001]

Pace car driver Sir Stirling Moss died yesterday, Easter, 4/12/20, in London. RIP

[@chrismoody1342]

Ralph Averill this the first I’ve heard of this news. Condolences to friends, family, and fans of racing. Rest In Peace Sir Sterling Moss you will be remembered.

[@wolfgangmarkusgstrein8522]

Moss, what an idiot! This guy pretended to be the tough guy even with 80+ years old. The most overrated driver ever! He was always beaten by his teammates and is known as the eternal second. Camera hungry he was! Not more and no less. He immediately went close to the interviewees or, when he discovered a camera, positioned himself to be seen on TV. I don't want to apologize for my words because the truth is being spoken. How can such an idiot be considered a legend? Typical english overstatement!

[@ralphaverill2001]

@@wolfgangmarkusgstrein8522 In 1961 alone Moss had twenty wins (Wikipedia) including a few Grans Prix.

[@StuntpilootStef]

@@wolfgangmarkusgstrein8522 You're an absolute moron, you know that?

[@Ulrich_von_Jungingen]

@@wolfgangmarkusgstrein8522 True, Moss is complete failure compared with this shining internet hero of legend right here. How did you come to pass Sir Legend.....the only man who could pull the shining mouse from the plastic packet of destiny?

[@ljkoh20052000able]

Love the era love the cars and drivers even the way the commentator clearly speaks Those surely were the days

[@mickcoomer9714]

Forget these electric things. Give me V8 any day.

[@chejohnny3706]

thanks 4 posting. hadnt seen it. RIP Vic

[@cuddzilla]

A spectacular time in motorsports.

[@jfan4reva]

Love the random soundtrack - engines revving while the covers are still on the intake horns, etc. Lol!

[@kevinhuber8723]

Thanks so much for posting this, sorry it took so long to find it! Way cool!

[@johnparrish9215]

I loved Can-Am and Formula 5000, that was some great racing.

[@RobertKarlBerta]

That era of CAN AM racers was the best....loved going to Laguna Seca and seeing them. Lots of innovation....remembered Halls cars but also the Shadows with tiny tires and low low body...that didn't work but at least they tried. Later Shadows were better. And does anyone remember the car with 4 wheel drive run by 4 snow mobile engines....or the one running a blown drag boat engine? Being an ALFA fan I remember the smaller 2 liter engine ALFA ran also and did OK despite the huge hp difference. When the 917s showed up the competition was over but still loved seeing them all.

[@BennyCFD]

Hey, I live in Monterey and went to all the races from the late 60s and 70s and I never saw you there

[@montyreed333]

@Robert Berta Lexington, Ky was mentioned in this video. I live in Lexington and never heard of a Can Am race before. Going by your comment you are familiar with Can Am. Do you remember or have any information on a race in Lexington? I've done some research and no luck. Thanks for any reply.

[@SabreMetalPanzer]

Blown drag boat engine? That sounds like something I've heard in passing before, which was a later model McKee. I think it was the Mk10. Was this it? i.ytimg.com/vi/dXokCj2z-_E/maxresdefault.jpg

[@joec3292]

@@montyreed333 The narrator meant Lexington, Ohio, home of Mid Ohio, not Lexington KY. He was talking about the two races preceding Road Atlanta. According to this Wiki page they were at Mid Ohio and Road America. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1970_Can-Am_season

[@15kr]

@@SabreMetalPanzer Nice pic!

[@paul46722]

Great to see the newly built Road Atlanta with these beasts racing there. Great video!!

[@la53tj]

saw these guys at laguna seca that year...thx for posting

[@bigbear5510]

This footage is from the year I was born. I remember seeing the Can-Am car run & they are basically equal to the prototype cars of today, if not quicker. Been a big fan of Road Atlanta track since the early 80's. I was lucky enough to take the driving classes there when I was 16, amazing when you know the instructor& track owners. Gravity cavity was the best part of the track for me, what a feeling! It was one of the best places to watch the races from. Seen a lot of cars flip over coming down into the dip & then land on the up part of it. Does that car #21 say Paul Newman? I also met him out there quite a few times & a lot of the other drivers also. Very great memories of hanging out at the track as a teenager & I still continue to show up from time to time. But it's not the same experience, I really miss animal land. I did see a couple of the Can-Am cars for sale there about the late 90's early 2000, for like 150K, I think one was a McLaren but I'm not positive the other one was a Lola chassis. Thanks for sharing the footage, it was awesome.

[@maxjelley4055]

these guys are my heroes, so cool you got to meet them.

[@elmerfudd979]

Is that Linda Vaughn, "Miss Hurst", at 4:20? I saw Linda at the Winternationals drag race in Pomona back in the 70's.

[@llidkram]

Living in Indianapolis, my father and I would trek to Mid-Ohio for their Can-Am round. Amazing talent in the series, and just plain fun with the big-bore engines. I have a distinct memory of watching Francois Cervert crest a hill in a year-old McLaren. The winners I watched were Jackie Stewart, George Follmer, and Mark Donohue. Much of fields back then were made up of future HOF members.

[@henrymorgan3982]

Bruce McClaren. Legend.

[@bernard6788]

Its Mclaren btw

[@DM01710]

Thank you for the upload this is fantastic my type of video fantastic

[@jockellis]

Earlier that year at Sebring I’d seen one of the owners of the track, Earl Walker, and the Atlanta Regional regional executive looking worried and asked what was wrong. The hotel had not held their reservation. So I told them they could stay at my great aunt and uncle’s house in Avon Park. Earl was so charming at breakfast the next morning and was a hit with my great aunt. So come the Can Am I Get a press pass as sports editor of the Georgia State University Signal. But my gf and I get up there to find that the director of publications had written the track asking for a ticket for someone else and they gave him mine. So home we went without seeing the race.

[@rahkinrah1963]

We don't need no stinking yellow flags. Run out there and remove that bodywork! Saw ALL of these cars at Riverside that year. And years before. Thank you for this SVRA

[@henriks5008]

Just love those crazy chaparral 2j´s. The vacuum car.

[@bogthing1]

@4:20 I love racing!

[@mickeylanden8662]

Damn, the opening editing looks like something godard would make

[@alanlee8018]

Wow! Trivia time. At 3:48 Yarbrough's Ford G7A has an engine badged as a Mercury. Learn something every day!

[@moozepatt7525]

Weird, i saw that too and thought wtf?

[@andyharman3022]

Yeah, I wondered what that was.

[@hakapik683]

When race cars were actually LOUD and the race car drivers had BALLS.

[@truantray]

Revson's family owned Revlon cosmetics. George Eaton was from the family that ran the Eaton's retail empire in Canada.

[@vintageman91]

Mid 60s - late 80s was the best era in motorsport, No doubt.

[@tomt9543]

In ALL forms of motor sports! The trans am division with the mustangs, challengers, camaros etc., NHRA drag racing had the Pro Stocks (not like the abortions they call pro stock today!), and the circle track guys still ran Detroit cars! All of that is ancient history now! What a shame!

[@vintageman91]

@@tomt9543 Yes it is, plenty of cool classes like Can am, group 5 silhuettes, group B rally, group S rally prototypes , group 4 rally and racing, 60-80s f1 and 60s-70s Le mans prototypes.

[@vintageman91]

Just love to see wedgeshaped, overpowered racing cars from the 70s, the zepia tone in the camera and rough sound. I get a kick out of it!

[@TheQwaz]

More people need to see this if just for the overhead view showing 10a/10b weren't always there. Had to be a brave one to go all out through that dip then up and under the bridge. #largeattachments

[@mikenewgent2436]

Great racing. Where s. Pedro

[@CamelSmokes23]

What a time to be alive. The racers were men, the cars were awesome, the fans were the best. Now it's all about pleasing sponsors, letting computers do all the work, living in the gym while following a dietitians orders... Sure I appreciate the dedication, but there was something we lost along the way after it used to be more about having fun and relying on pure talent rather than forced gains through obsessive levels of work ethic and training.

[@rustyATV]

Just as I was thinking about how it looked like they had just built the track... 5:08 When did the MX track go in?

[@abelardoruiz5544]

Excelente recommendation from KZbin algorithmm......

[@m1t2a1]

My favourite race weekend at Mosport.

[@mikejohnson5900]

It's cool to see the old, unmolested Road Atlanta track with the CanAm beasts on it! Funny, wonder why they decided to include a number of weird sounds in this documentary.

[@Bmants]

Interesting history. Nice post

[@stewroo]

I feel like I'm watching Death Race 2000. What an incredible snapshot in time.

[@Loulovesspeed]

I wonder where he heard they were helicopter fans sucking this car to the pavement? They are cooling fans from an M-109 military vehicle. The engine that drives them is a 2 cylinder 45 hp Kohler snowmobile engine. It was one of the weak parts of the car as it had to run close to, if not full throttle, constantly while racing. It was a 2 stroke and its exhaust noise was more audible than the Chevy V8 drive engine! Very cool example of the ingenuity and creativeness of Jim Hall.

[@timd4524]

Kind of funny him commenting on that poor little Porsche. Seeing as how the Porsche actually ended up dominating in the 70's

[@GeneralLee1961.3]

The era of GIANTS ❤️🇺🇸❤️🇺🇸❤️🇺🇸❤️🇺🇸

[@MrShpaco]

I REALLY wish iRacing would bring CanAm racing to their service. What a thrill, even if it's digital, to be behind the wheel of one those monsters machines

[@gravmelly]

I wish i was alive during these times

[@chrisgray4651]

That was the time to be American, early 70's

[@timtravasos2742]

Wow. Great retro video.

[@alexshank1414]

Those must have been the days. Taking your muscle car to a Can-Am race. A series with little regulations, huge engines, huge power, huge noise, limitless innovations to be discovered, and unpredictability in mechanical or driver. Then it was gone. I was born in the wrong era.

[@Miklos82]

A very interesting video, but one error popped out in the intro. The race before Road Atlanta was @ Mid-Ohio, near Lexington, OHIO, not Lexington, Kentucky.

[@emrakultheaeonstorn7430]

The Whittington brothers haha

[@jmac1999]

The stats give me chills..."Weighs less than a Volkswagen"

[@spikey2740]

The announcer didn't tell the rest of it - 0 to 100 back to 0 in less than 10 seconds.

whiterthan hitler And aero, more so than f1 at the time

[@doogalloonni]

The only thing that's missing, is the sweet smell of 'Bean OIl"

[@beeemm2578]

Sickest cars ever raced

[@alexander1485]

can-am cars were pretty safe for being open to such rule interpretation

[@truantray]

Ask Bruce McLaren how safe they were.

[@zacht9447]

@@truantray These Crashes would have likely killed people in formula 1 cars and they got out without injury

[@Arnechk]

Racing equivalent of Woodstock.

[@zacht9447]

Man Can Am cars were MASSIVE compared to Le Mans prototype during the same time

[@mikecastellon4545]

Tony dean won in a 2.0 liter naturally aspirated engine....122 cubic inches ,no turbo, no blower.

[@brinx8634]

By this time Porsche 908/02 had a 3.0 liter engine making 350 hp. 183 cu. in. Still, a tough little buggy.

[@mikecastellon4545]

Brinx you sir are correct . 1968 was the last yr for the 2.2 liter. 69 saw the advent of the 3 liter engine , which to Europeans was an elephant engine, but the Americans considered it to be a hummingbird engine. But a win is a win and especially considering it was running in an unlimited class , no engine size restrictions . I was at this race and remember it as being the hottest day in my very long life.

[@brinx8634]

@@mikecastellon4545 Hey Mike, great to hear that you were there! I'm from the Can part of Can-Am :) 6 weeks earlier I was at the race in Edmonton, Alberta. I feel lucky to have seen Can-Am races there from 1968/73 plus Trans- Am and others. For $5 I could go to the rear of the garages in the pit area, where cars were being worked on and where I rubbed shoulders with some of the greats. FIVE BUCKS! I have a feeling you saw many races in your part of the country. Oh the time had when we were young men!

[@mikecastellon4545]

Brinx yep, great times indeed. In those days there were many things we didn’t know , but one thing we were sure of....we’d be young forever and the fun would never end.

[@ernestogasulla7763]

3 liter. That was a 908, not a 910.

[@mrivantchernegovski3869]

Bruce RIP ,Denney RIP Great Kiwi Drivers

[@rapidrrobert4333]

I saw them at Road america in Elkhart Lake Wisconsin. Monster motors in tiny cars.

[@15kr]

You still can see them there at the July vintage gathering. A handful run hard enough to shake the lovely Kettle Moraine scenery, knowing that big block V8s are plentiful in case they blow.

[@WernerGampert]

The. Canadian American Cup with race cars ,including bigblocks with a displacement of 427 to 530 ci. The sound of these cars is amazing The output. of these was betwenn

[@richardwilton722]

McLaren made it his business to design a winning car and run a winning team for this series. I believe the prize money was subsidising his F1operation. As the commentator says the power to weight ratio was massive. And it killed him.

[@beyond_the_infinite2098]

The McLarens weighed in at 1600 lbs with 700 hp yielding a weight to power ratio of 2.3 lbs/hp.

[@shadyindividual666]

was that intentional at 5:00 because if so that was a smooth ass transition

[@LarryTheTubaBoy]

3:00 Funny how everyone forgets about Lola... they built the "Ford" GT40. In case you were wondering how they had the wherewithal to hang with McLaren... Also good to see the Chaparral get a mention. They wrote a lot of rules about what you couldn't do to a car after Chaparral went out onto the cutting edge... that whole suction car gimmick made them write up the modern rule book on aerodynamics in motorsport.

[@tracylemme1375]

I do miss the CanAm series. I miss the sound of the big engines with big power and cars that had few regulations. I attended the Times Grand Prix in the 60s &70s. What an Event!! I understand the reasoning of all the regulations somewhat but they make racing boring.

[@Americathebeautiful49]

Yes and it was quite an evolution from the relatively low tech 60’s cars to see how they were modified in the 70’s but still mostly about power to weight with some crazy yet genius ideas coming from the likes of Jim Hall. Riverside was not the most beautiful track but it was fun and the only game in town for Southern California. It’s ironic that both Riverside and the original Ontario Motor Speedway home of the Questor Grand Prix were demolished and replaced with shopping malls.

[@Pulsonar]

Jim Halls Chapparal cars, look more otherworldly, crazy but ingenious with the passing years, but they earned respect and honourable mentions all over the world, even as the mighty Porsche 917 ushered in a new era, and the death knell for the legendary team Maclarens dominance in this series.

[@truantray]

Yeah but....they didn't win much. Even the vacuum car.

[@caribman10]

Hmmmm...how many Can-Am races did Chaparral cars win again, with all that ingenuity? Answer, not as many as they would have with, say, a manual transmission. Look at the DNF log for Chaparral cars from 1966 on and you'll see what I mean. Even Phil Hill said the same.

[@hjr2450]

Wow. Was that the first "fan car"?

[@faketaxidriver5651]

Had the Can-Am not disbanded until now, it would be crazier than F1

[@terryatpi]

Wow !

[@Fabrice1970]

Such a great era… girls were not obese as they are today

[@utingabernardo8205]

Porsche philosophy (even nowadays): Intelligent Performance !!!

[@etubrutus3501]

It would be awesome to have an unlimited series nowadays. Unfortunately there’s too many do-gooders now.

[@georgemallory797]

Nice! 4:20

[@Awefulhorse]

How do we shut down captions ?they are all wrong and are not grammatical correct.They dont work

[@asd36f]

An early 70's racing film without a funky soundtrack? :-)

[@weaksignal8009]

No bongo drums..hehe

[@BogattheMoon]

Georgia native Linda Vaughn 4:19

[@mercoid]

She made the most of what she had. It was widely appreciated by many.

[@SuperHoneyOil]

700hp except the famous porsche 917, with full turbo adjustable in cockpit, to a whooping 1500hp.

[@sourcetext]

They always asked Jim Hall to go out on the track first.......to vacuum clean the track 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@solunasunrise]

i just wonder , where superchargers forbidden ? or was there can am with them at some point ?

[@solunasunrise]

@ i suppose it wasn t really neccesary ... with such short straight aways and those old cars could ve not put over 1000 HP so easily to the ground ... and you don t want tire spin up until 4th gear... just having this thought right now

[@solunasunrise]

​@ was road america the same like now ? cause i race it in race room sometimes online... or maybe it was concern about fuel consumption , those giant race engines with 7 liters they suck up on their own already alot .... where do you stuff a giant tank for that ?

[@andrewrcmadwilkinson6999]

5.08 STIRLING MOSS IN A CAR WITH 2 GORGEOUS WOMEN WHAT A SURPRISE!

[@maxalfredjoelasemoule3993]

Good ole times of tight economy on one side and luxury on the other :) Even in 1970, F1 car could but show their butts to these nonetheless sublime machines (yes, you got it right, I'm european)

[@truantray]

Uh, no. These were much faster than F1.

[@caribman10]

Max Alfred, take a look at the 1967 World Sports Car Championship qualification record. The Chaparral 2F was THE fastest car at many of the tracks. Even more so at the fastest tracks, like Spa. It was a hardtop version of the 2E/2G. Get the message?

[@alistairbartlett6569]

I wonder if that car with the fans on the rear is where Gordon Murray got the idea for the Brabham BT46 fan car, which Niki Lauda used to win the 1978 swedish GP?

[@15kr]

yes, it was pulled after the win to avoid controversy as Ecclestone planned his ascent to the top of F1

[@maxrioux862]

Daaaaamn the size of that field