Taijiquan - From form to fighting

[@kingofaikido]

Thank you Lu. I learned a lot from your explanation. Taiji is subtle, wonderful, simple, and powerful. ;)

[@heikkipoussa2670]

Master Lü's TAIJI EASTER CAMP 2019 will be held again in Kisakallio Finland. 4 days of training internal taiji, welcome! www.baji.info/en/event/paasiaisleiri-taijin-5-askelta-19-4-22-4-2019/

[@deadlypalms]

Like it. You can see the connection with Aikido in terms of demonstration/softness/unbalancing too..

[@KingoftheJiangl]

All internal is connected

[@akirahojo2]

Very hard to find a good Taiji teacher, let alone one who can communicate in English without the senior students (mis)translating.

[@ChristianoSts]

if I was younger and living in Europe, would like to learn with Lü Baochun.

[@isaactalley2819]

This is something that I want to learn. It's a lot like the form of Aikido that I practice.

[@nyhyl]

I highly recommend starting Taijiquan. Aikido doesn't teach internal strength since it lacks the trainings methodology. I used to Aikido tooand was blown away by the training methods of Taijiquan, it's far more developed and sophisticated. However Aikido could be vitalized when accompanied by Taijiquan.

[@spirgtudsrubec7776]

@@nyhyl Its never the Art, its always the Teacher or the Student or both, their knowledge their perspective, their motivation etc. Whether the Art is internal or external, powerful Chi can be developed, by the individual and only by the individual if they want it enough.

[@baldieman64]

"Its never the Art" It's been 25 years since the first UFC proved beyond any doubt that it is the art. Every UFC since has proved the same thing. The same training methodologies keep on coming together to create fighters that can win in gladiatorial combat. BJJ, Greco-Roman wresting, Western boxing and Muay-Thai continue to dominate with similar skillsets and training methodologies from SAMBO and Sanda filling in for athletes from Russia and China. All of these systems have common themes: No forms. Training against resisting opponents. No Chi, Ki, Qi or similar magical woo. Training for real street fights requires a different skill set and training methodology to ringsports but many of the same truths apply. There is no magic. Violence is ugly and stressful and there are no magical shortcuts.

[@spirgtudsrubec7776]

@@baldieman64 you seem to think this answers all questions, a large percentage of martial arts practitioners never took part in a UFC event, and many martial arts practitioners never will, because most likely they have no interest and have enough to do to practice their own chosen art. Genuine practitioners do not judge each other to see who is best, they practice for the love of their chosen art or mixed arts, for whatever reason they choose to be appropriate for their needs. Some feel the need to prove themselves to others, that they are better, others like to make lots of money from their art, while more just have a love of competition, and there are also those who like the competition to be a personal one, and again there are those who treat their art as a life long journey. I am sure there are many other reasons also. I say life is too short live and let live, learn as much as you can and do your best to be the best you can be in whatever practice you aspire to. We are here to do the best we can. Life can be humbling, a loose ego is not our friend. Those systems that resemble the practice used in the UFC will no doubt be drawn to those systems such as the UFC, because it works for them, and it may also be financially viable for them, others may try out the sport to see what its like or what they can get from it, while others try it out to test themselves etc. i don,t see what any of this proves.

[@baldieman64]

There are a thousand valid reasons for training and they include cultural appreciation, historical re-enactment, self expression, self perfection, social interaction, maintenance of health and mobility etc - and all of these are perfectly valid reasons for practice. The single binding thread though is the word MARTIAL. By any reasonable definition, a martial art must have combative application or else it's just dancing or yoga. The rubber hits the road hear though because this video purports to relate to "fighting". There are two places to test "fighting" applications: In a spontaneous street fight with no rules or in a ring.

[@Ir0nRon1n]

These applications are very similar to kata bunkai in karate. This makes me very interested in learning taiji and bajiquan.

[@kwantumd]

Did you ever pick up any of these?

[@stillnessinmovement]

nice fa, and relaxed and balanced teacher. nice.

[@peterjeck2684]

Nice you one of the real 1%

[@salvatoreplacidoplumari3840]

I see similarities with Okinawan Gōjū-Ryū, likewise the Kata Tensho at 2:45.....

[@thanhmala3805]

i love taichi

[@taichigoodness1798]

This is not Tai Chi, why are people like you so naive?

[@shujiling213]

Nice style

[@ryudragon8477]

同じ単鞭でも、使い方が色々ありますね！驚くような使い方にかっての武術家の戦闘力に驚きです！

[@jahvauntaecolbert9926]

Yeah I'm going to start back going again next month

[@JimmySlacksack]

nice editing and music selection.

[@stefanschleps8758]

Very, very good. Thank you very much. I have much to learn. After fortyfive years I am always a student. Laoshr 60 Ching Yi Kung Fu Association Greeting from Vienna.

[@joshpickles9022]

Good work. Good Tai Ji. Good demonstration. Good explanation. Most importantly no students jumping on command! Keep up the good work :-)

[@TaijiquanGaoshou]

His students Do jump. Have you watched the whole clip ?

[@raherql]

4:10

[@indusgaunus8062]

@@TaijiquanGaoshou they don´t. you can see a mile away the skill of this sifu. i mean, taiji skill is difficult to see for those who don´t practice it, but your user name indicates you do...

[@TaijiquanGaoshou]

@@indusgaunus8062 Yes they do. What happens is, they give force for their teacher to play with, but once they feel teacher's force come back to them, they just switch off their rooting and let teacher's force lift their bodies off the floor. It is a pre-conditioned response. That's why teacher's techniques often work only on their students. Old Taiji game. I had been playing it myself for decades before I felt I need to stop deceiving myself and my training partners.

[@TaijiwayNet]

very nice work but pushing and pulling is not fighting nobody fights like that

[@giambertotaiani8317]

Peace and Love 😁😁😁

[@thetaichistudionz]

Hi, who was your teacher and what style? I like your friendly attitude.

[@perrypelican9476]

The most difficult thing for me is to relax enough to control inner energy. I need tips

[@athenry]

You'd only get about 2 bucks, though.

[@Hermit-Crab]

I could not understand what he said at all....how did those people understand him?

[@taijispirit1]

great teacher, correct teaching

[@maximecarlos8229]

Taichi is best

[@Hermit-Crab]

The video title says Taijiquan...but they are all wearing t-shirts that say Baji....

[@Jon-ov4nc]

Most taiji instructors usually teach other styles as well. In this case it's baji, when I was at uni the taiji guys all learned choy li fut first and foremost, and currently my instructor teaches xing yi and bagua in addition to taiji.

[@LifeForceChannel]

Xing yi + bagua = taiji (basically)

[@Jon-ov4nc]

What do you mean? Are you saying that taiji was created from a combination of bagua and xing yi. As far as I'm aware there is no evidence for direct combination to directly create taiji, what relates them is that the styles were primarily practiced by taoists and are based on taoist philosophy. Yang Luchan learnt taiji from the Chen family in the mid 1800s and became a chief military instructor in 1852, and Dong Haichuan founded bagua after studying many martial arts on his travels during the same time period around 1853. So this suggests taiji quan went mainstream before bagua zhang (which were distinct tailor made versions for each of Dong's students)

[@LifeForceChannel]

Not at all. I'm not saying that. what I mean is (btw it is not I who said this) rather some taiji masters said. 'real Masters - not watered down ones) xing yi hands "upper body" + bagua footwork , equates to Taiji overall.

[@dayman161172]

Life Force every martial art is the same on high level. Bagua xingyi taiji etc work on same principle. If You develope the right body for it there is no destinction anymore

[@yeukchow]

umm...I have no doubt Master Lv has true skills in martial arts, but his ability to explain it in english is honestly quite lacking to say the least. It would be better for the students and the instruction overall if they could find a good translator for Master Lv.

[@mintyfresh5000]

I respectfully disagree: talking is overrated, just train and feel.

[@miikawikberg5627]

yeukchow His English is actually very good, considering he spoke no English 13 years ago. Master Lu has found several good ways of conveying the teachings, with body language, metaphors and other ways. There are no direct English translations for most of this stuff. Finding a translator for this kind of things is impossible, you need someone with master Lus experience and level so he knows what he is talking about and then finding expressions in english to convey this. It can't be done. Feeling and learning it with your whole heart is the only way. For people who want stay on the intellectual level, not the practical, i suggest finding other teachers who writes books.

[@samsun01]

"Kung Fu", the two chinese words basically mean "capability through practice and effort". I agree with firstgenfighter. practice first. practice at least for a few months. everyday. while you train, you got to feel it for yourself. you won't feel it at first. it'll take a few months to get that feeling. but once you do...that's when you've put in the practice and effort (baby steps). THEN AND ONLY THEN should you go find a capable master to refine and correct your 'rawness'. lather, rinse, repeat. And please, for the love of Christ, don't stretch or do any of that sissy shit like physical conditioning at the dojo. you do that shit BEFORE you get to the dojo. the dojo is for 'real kung fu'. stretching you do at home son.

[@evarbano]

Por que cada uno de estos maestros usan a los mismos alumnos cuando hacen gala de su "super chi"? Estas exageraciones no ayudan a esparcir el arte y que se lo tome seriamente.

[@2ndviolin]

Insanely difficult to get right

[@greenmonk]

there are some good principles in this about feeling pressure from another person when grappling, but most of this is total bs.

[@lgonzagacs]

I was judo practitioner of kung fu and tai chi chuan, but still have not seen any practitioner of any martial art winning a practitioner of Brazilian jiu-jitsu (bjj). Show me these techniques winning one black band Grace family, for example, and I will be your greatest popularizer.

[@lingan228]

tai chi is not for serious fight on battle. it is for help ppl get more health. make your blood flow really good. if you wanna learn some fight skills, you have to learn bjj or muytai. but your body ganna be ruin on muytai. my grand mom have cancer, but after learn taichi , she lives 20 years longer. if you wanna fight just buy a gun you dont need learn mma if you wanna live longer learn chinese kungfu. kung fu in china means spend time.

[@MartialArtsTutorialsFighttips]

Luiz Gonzaga luis hermano..what do you want to see?

[@amartailor8350]

I came to say that Kimura wrecked Helio, and I'm a BJJ guy. Sakuraba was a catch wrestler. Josh Barnett beat a high-level BJJ guy at Metamoris, he's also a catch wrestler. Most high-level BJJ guys do a mix of styles. It's not really BJJ so much anymore as just grappling. Which I like.

[@tniiler]

Please see Cung Le's fight vs Frank Shamrock. Cung Le was team captain of the US Wushu team in 1997. Bottom line - it's not the style so much as how you train.

[@jayme420]

BJJ Is good for competition but in the real world it is rarely 1 on 1 take the opponent to the ground and another will stomp on your head

[@lUCCAS77100]

Que video foda

[@Atomic419]

If only there was ONE SINGLE example of Tai chi chuan being used effectively in an actual fight. All we need is ONE example, and yet even one example is too much to ask it seems. Oh well. At least we have movies, novels, and comic books 🤷‍♂️

[@perrypelican9476]

Ten minutes of throwing people. Why? It only takes 1 or 2 times to get the point. I am tired of people talking in riddles. Get to the point and talk about why being able to throw people is good for fighting? How to deal with a fighter coming at you punching and kicking. Throwing the guy might not. Enough because he wont wait for the contact. And keep recoiling and striking. The throwing using qi loojs good and says that the guy has internal power but not that he is a kung fu master. You need a lot more.

[@perrypelican9476]

How many times does he have to throw people for us to get the point? I am tired of those videos. This guy has great internal power from excellent training. I think he should learn to speak english better instead of throwing so many people around. I dont understand most of what he says which is a pity because i am sure he has many very deep important messages. Why not show some teaching ideas instead. Ok we see the guy is good, but it only takes 30 seconds, so why over and over? Take more time for teaching the basics. Or is it only about setting up a reputation fir some financial gain? I dont blame anyone wanting to monetize their talents, but enough is enough.

[@daldude178]

These people couldn´t fight an angry gerbil. Beautiful art. And interesting drills that _could_ be applied to fighting if tried. But no connection whatsoever to "fighting" is shown here. The problem is when the drill becomes the illusion of fighting. The same happens in chi sao in wing-tsun. It´s only a drill. A very good drill, but only a drill. You can be a chi-sao master and be beat up by the angry grandpa from around the corner. Too many traditional martial arts have lost the connection to the application. They are lost in kata and drills.

[@paavohietanen7502]

"Beautiful art. And interesting drills that could be applied to fighting if tried." This part is true. "But no connection whatsoever to "fighting" is shown here." I guess this is a question of terminology, but aren't you contradicting your own statement? "...that could be applied to fighting", isn't this a connection to fighting? "These people couldn´t fight an angry gerbil." This is mundane clumsy rhetoric without any base on rationality. How can you deduce from this video that none of these people would kick your ass? Because they are smiling? Or because this particular drill just magically took away all the other fighting experience/practice they could have?

[@paavohietanen7502]

Or are you simply angry/frustrated that the term "fighting" which is used here didn't show any actual fighting, just drills for fighting?

[@daldude178]

Simple. When quoting me the second time you conveniently forgot the essential part: "that could be applied to fighting IF TRIED". But they don´t. But this is implied in the title: "From form to fighting". However, they only show form and only do form. No application in fighting shown whatsoever. If the video were titled "Taijiquan - Form", I would never have commented. And btw, if you really believe anyone in this vid could kick anybody ass, then - sorry to say - you are deluded. You can clearly see that these people have only done form in their training, and only form.

[@paavohietanen7502]

No it's not simple. Again - and be reaaally perceptive now - rationality. You are assuming that this is what these people do everyday. Your argument is "because they don't show it in this video, it doesn't happen", but you do realize the irrational expectation of this sentence, yes? But yes, I guess you are frustrated about the topic of the video. Fair enough. You are right; No actual fighting is shown, the theme of this video is more about explaining the steps for Taiji practitioners to take so that they CAN approach the real fighting practices. Push hands is, after all, like you said, like chisao. It is a bridge to fighting but it's not fighting itself (although if you look further there ARE some fighting applications shown too!). The topic could be worded better, true. I'll try to change the description so that people understand what we actually want to communicate with this video. On the other topic, I have seen some of these people "kick ass". Teacher here is known in martial arts circles for travelling around China, fighting and challenging people. In the end, he ended up training special police of Beijing as well as being the official "doorman" of Feng Zhiqiang. This means that he accepted the fighting challenges issued to school. Let me explain a bit more. He is not only a "Taiji guy", but comes from a Bajiquan background, which I practice now. Taiji is something he specialized on in his older years (he is 61 now). We do practice full contact sparring under his tutelage. I've practiced MMA, sanda, done lessons with boxing coaches, kickboxing coaches, and sparred with many disciplines, national level kickboxers, amateur thaiboxers, mma fighters etc. But none of them have stroke me with a punch or other hit, stronger than the teacher here. Or thrown me around when I try to grapple with them in a same manner. And I have seen him fighting for real. If I'm deluded then I'm being deluded by a hell a lot of pain. But convincing aside, I do understand where you are coming from. There is a lot of delusion in TCMA. When I MYSELF watch TCMA videos I have to admit that I am often skeptical because I've practiced with lot of them too. This video is not one of those I would use to argument legitimacy. Cannot do nothing if you stick to your belief that it's delusion 'round here but I merely ask you for a benefit of a doubt. Also, I'd like to invite you to visit one of our international seminars or lessons in Finland. No aggressiveness here, you can come to visit us from a perspective of your choice. But it sounds like you know something already and you are not stupid. So if you are honestly interested IF there COULD be something in TCMA, then please come to practice with us. We can explain our approach. If you get something out of it we are happy, if you don't need it then it's OK.

[@daldude178]

thanks for the explanation. Like I said I was set off by the discrepancy between what is shown and what the title made me expect. And what I have seen in countless TMA videos before. I too have been crosstraining my whole martial arts career (MMA, kickboxing, JuJutsu, Karate, WingTsun, Ninjutsu...) and one common denominator of all was that drills (be it in MMA or a TMA) are just a preparation for application, but are absolutely not enough. And yes, you are right, I become emotional if I see these kind of videos that claim fighting applications when none are shown _especially_ because I believe that TMAs, and here especially internal chinese arts, have something to offer when it comes to fighting. "We" just have to train it, research it and try to find the best applications (and get rid of the clutter, because _there is_ lots of clutter in TMAs.) If you have full contact experience then you know this. How the "ideal" stances become notions of the stances, how big movements become small ones, how some things were for example made for fighting in armor are not applicable to today´s world. I would love to see a video where you show something about this topic. What are the things in Taijiquan that work "outside of the system"? How to do you approach the integration of Taijiquan and Baijiquan traditional forms into sparring? Because often TMAs lose their traditional techniques and don´t apply anything of it in sparring. As I know that there is something in TCMA, since I train WingTsun, I´d be interested in that perspective (and I always wanted to visit Finland). So don´t be suprised if I do show up one day. :-)

[@Mrkalm007]

LOL

[@hsienjungchung2031]

it will not work against mma. boxing or Muai Thai. sorry to tell you this. But it is the truth.

[@ChristianoSts]

Only MMA athletes care about this, sorry to tell you this, but it's the truth. People who learn CMA don't give a f* to MMA because they have solid systems to learn and practice for their entire lives.

[@taichigoodness1798]

Total BS!