Heckling Etho while he Runs Deadly!

[@happycreeper9817]

Rusty is Etho’s emotional support animal.

[@bleachcraft8]

No Willy kill will ever surpass the level of absolute disrespect he gave to doc by climbing the waterfall

[@MisterLongShot_Official]

That's no lie. Totally sniped.

[@Ravenmadlunatic]

That was definitely personal for some reason

[@Artemis.94]

I seriously love that Etho enjoys interacting with you in his runs. It actually makes his runs more fun! I watch his phase compilations but your livestreams have a different energy because of the banters and the heckling. Ugh I wish Decked Out never ends 😂

[@yiklongtay6029]

That makes me happy as an audience member. Like the banter is way more entertaining for us. I think that when the warden was still scary, I wouldn't want to cut the tension. But now that they are all desensitized, I want the jabs between player and DM

[@SpookyCrown]

I love how ms.Tango just chooses whatever hat she wants Tango to wear for the stream whenever she walks by and pops it onto his head, and Tango just sighs silently but accepts it anyways...

[@copperbonsai]

Makes my day every time too!! Have you seen the beautiful crochet hats she's given him?

[@amdkillaplays]

Accepting the hats means he doesn't leave his streaming room with max clank 😂

[@ChauNyan]

I wonder if Gem would do the same thing to Etho if he started streaming.

[@daniel4647]

@@ChauNyan Lol, probably. He's never going to go on cam though, he's too committed to the mystery now.

[@fdagpigj]

@@ChauNyan is it canon that they're husband and wife or what lol

[@BlahCraft1]

I love Etho's "visiting Rusty" storyline of trying to figure out ways to free it.

[@CockatooDude]

"it", wow. The absolute disrespect...

[@saruwatarisa]

Whoever wins Decked Out must get a Rusty as part of the prize. If it's Etho noice, if it's not... Rusty heist? xD

[@Alice-not-Alice]

I really hope we get a full post mortem at the end of the season…especially if Etho’s in on the discussion. I could listen to you two talk game design for hours

[@gensanitygames]

I'm not surprised at all that Etho is okay with you talking during his runs. He's said before that he really likes collaborating and interacting with others in his videos.

[@Evie0h]

The more the merrier! And friends are fun :) listening to friends banter is even more fun

[@stopmotionbrickstudios4855]

First Etho Run! 1:08:00 Second Etho Run 1:30:20 Third Etho Run 2:02:53 Chains betray Etho to the pit (again) 2:25:38 First Gem Run! 3:09:26

[@rainbowwolfy297]

legend!!!

[@jodiescrivener8005]

Thank you !!! I fell asleep mid stream 😅

[@natestrechay8262]

Thanks!

[@Zach.O]

😒

[@knulllord654]

Did you not even bother to watch before typing or did you watch this on stream like me?

[@reeddraws]

I know there's a lot of jokes about DO3, but I still have a secret hope that one day, Tango approaches a DO3 with a small team like Etho and Bdubs to lighten the technical and building load. Plus, I would love hearing the design discussions

[@idontcare_wtf]

That will be nice indeed, but highly unlikely

[@alexanderkonczal3908]

the big problem is most of the people who could really help are people who would want most to run the dungeon, so tango wouldn't want to spoil them. he can get help with the cosmetic builds, but the redstone/functionality is the thing that takes the most time.

[@teainus3252]

I believe Tango has stated that he would not make Decked Out 3 unless he could use the Create mod. That would basically mean that either Hermitcraft would have to adopt the mod, which wouldn’t happen, or the hermits would have to play on a modded server for a long time, which is also unlikely.

[@andrewbloom7694]

​@@teainus3252 Most of the hermits would do it, they are all playing Iskalls Mod right now. And they play the Life SMP and such too

[@Stinkbug_Ab]

Definitely would like to see a joint project for DO3 with someone else

[@bobbysimon1078]

1:09:14 I will say, I think it NOT telling you which card you lost actually helps keep the card in check. If Etho doesn't know that he lost a bounding strides, he could plan for it late in the run only for it to have no chance of coming up. With 2 in the deck like he has, you run that risk even more.

[@DisasterAster]

Good point

[@adaelion3772]

I don't see that card as being overpowered though. If you can memorize your deck, that should be a part of skilled play. It also lets the player gauge the value of the card over time. If you know what you are losing you can better balance the deck.

[@Theforgottenvictor]

@@adaelion3772l agree, and it would improve viewer experience especially if a high value card gets skipped.

[@Lv3Wizard]

The sibling energies between Etho and Gem is amazing 😂

[@dawntreader8370]

​@@idontcare_wtfisnt etho married?

[@jde12]

@@dawntreader8370 Don't think so lol

[@ChurroPuff]

@@idontcare_wtfhe’s like 10 years older than gem and is almost in his 40’s

[@67Arctic]

please dont ship the hermits its weird...@@idontcare_wtf

[@ZNotFound]

​@@ChurroPuffDon't say that. You're making me remember that I'm getting old. I'm almost certain I'll get to the point where I'm watching Etho for more than half my age.

[@BoomStickization]

I loved the "builder" talk around 3:00:00 between Etho, Scar, Gem, and Cub. Tango seemed a bit annoyed (in a good-natured way) that people were going on about block textures, and not running the dungeon.

[@KuroroSama42]

2:25:00 Honestly, that does feel too... cheap? Other parkour places, you're safe from ravagers and if you fall it's just damage - no big deal. This place, ravagers can just camp you and it can basically be a run killer (rather than just damage). I think Etho's tunnel request isn't a bad idea. Make an alternate exit from the pit that leads you deeper into floor 2 (it's usually a problem on the way out, not in). If you fail the chains, then you get lead back to the dripstone room or something - make your way back to try the chains again. For it to not be too easy, make that tunnel into another parkour challenge.

[@MisterLongShot_Official]

Etho's tunnel idea was only so he could pull the ravager back another block or two in the time it takes for him to lose aggro, not an alternate route out of the trap.

[@PinkMan-cv7wc]

​​@@MisterLongShot_Officialyou are right, but I do think the idea they propose could be more valuable. When Etho made his suggestion Tango flat out denied it, but he also clearly doesn't want falling to be guaranteed death, so punishing the player while giving them a slightly better chance at thinking their way out is not such a bad idea.

[@aayush_dutt]

1:02:53 Etho ditches Suit-Up and Tango is surprised 1:07:42 Etho explains why he did it

[@kellymorris10342]

It'll be interesting to see his runs without it!

[@donaldclark1019]

Then One Eye Willie provides a different argument for Suit-Up

[@lx-icon]

honestly think he's right to ditch it! It's still useful if you want to go fast and maybe take a few too many risks, and end up triggering a lot of clank anyway. I think it's a great card for when you're starting on a higher difficulty (like if you're moving up to Deadly and are more focused on getting the artifact out of the dungeon). That said, if your playstyle is farm-heavy and risk-averse like Etho's is, it's one of the worst cards to have. He doesn't ever really tank damage except when at max clank, at which point treasure stops dropping into the dungeon - so it's effectively only useful for generating additional clank throughout the run.

[@john38825]

Etho always has the most treasure cued up in level 3 but gets the least amount of treasure. All the drop locations are never in his line of sight.

[@vonmiekka]

Hey Tango! One possible solution to the "I can't win, why should I buy Victory Tomes" problem would to divide the players into three or four "divisions" before the last two weeks of gameplay. The four first would play for the absolute win, the next four would play for the win of division 2, and so on. This way a player could still win a division, and the victory tome / point system would stay relevant even for those who aren't power-gaming.

[@terror_nightmare9308]

Your suggestion won't make a difference... it's just the equivalent of "yay im 5th place better than (a hermit)!". Everybody can play the game at their own pace/style and I don't think Tango mind it at all.

[@RandomUser311]

Personally I never liked the win or fun choice and was always disappointed when players chose tomes over a new card we hadn't yet seen played.

[@Blubbii88]

@@RandomUser311 I absolutely hate victory tomes because of that. Everytime a hermit says "Oh I want this card so bad, but I could get 3 victory tomes (for absolutely no discount at all, because they had +30 embers) And I seriously don't understand how anyone watching could be hyped for tomes. I would not even be hyped if they had nothing to buy, for the simple reason that I would always hope for a new cool card in the deck. Scar wasted everything in first week to get the shallow victory. And since others had so good decks and explored deeper earlier than him... tango already changed and buffed the dungeon to compansate, making it even harder for people without stronger decks. Everytime I hear or read anyone trying to sell the hermits the victory tomes as "desireable" and "worth" over good available cards in the shop, I die from cringe.

[@stanleydodds9]

doesn't that encourage sandbagging for those who kind of know they wont win the next division up?

[@16m49x3]

better to just get rid of it and count the amount of embers gathered imo :/

[@mr.dr.prof.patrick3359]

Gem: "I really don't like jump boost for the dripleaf parkour" *doesn't know that its completely skippable by going up to rusty/over the fence*

[@clausschuchmann118]

There is a "entity distance" slider in video settings, if you crank that up you dont need to move to render in items on the ground etc

[@b.assmaster1504]

Problem then is that all those entity's getting renderd will take up ALOT of the Rendering process, and you would lose performance.

[@TastyMunky]

Assuming the server doesn't limit the distance it broadcasts entities to clients, as a server bandwidth and cpu optimization. Similar to server render distance. I think they run a modded server with lots of performance optimizations.

[@sinom]

That is a server side setting. So it only has an effect if you're in singleplayer, on multiplayer worlds you need to change that in the server settings

[@clausschuchmann118]

@@sinom thats Simulation distance, entity rendering is pure client side (obviously limited vy simdistance, but they need to be in sim distance for DO to work anyways). The only thing that could limit tango is lag (wich i dont think is an issue on his pc) or packet limit of ehat the server broadcasts, but looking at stuff doc has done i dont think thats an issue

[@clairekholin6935]

It will reduce performance, whether it matters is not known, but I think it would (or could by changing a few settings) work for him.

[@clairekholin6935]

Adding a maintenance mode where that activates Regen and resistance, triggers the beast sense bells and perhaps other changes would make it easier to work on.

[@Bulldog_65_2]

That's a great idea

[@joeschmoe487]

How about wrapping the outside of level 3 with as much wool as possible to prevent Wardens from targeting bats and slimes that are outside?

[@ianerickson2210]

Cotton is a Minecraft 1.35 feature, you stepped off at the wrong spot in ur Time Machine friend

[@darkienl5886]

​@@ianerickson2210I was genuinely confused but I think he meant string lol

[@PencilGames]

​​@@darkienl5886nah, wool

[@ranie7350]

It has already been sugested on stream

[@julipana]

​@@darkienl5886actually I think they meant wool 😂

[@budderguy2128]

If I had a nickel for every time a warden looked like he was about to wipe a dungeoneer and immediately sprinted past them to chase a bat, I’d have 2 nickels, which isn’t a lot but it’s weird that it happened twice.

[@dragonridertechnologies]

LOL! Doofenschmirtz would be proud.

[@sanga1380]

@@dragonridertechnologiesIt was unexpected, and by unexpected I mean COMPLETELY EXPECTED.

[@bobsthejunk88]

Hearing Etho say Loot n Scoot brings joy to my heart

[@violet7773]

There is an Etho Loot n Scoot compilation on yt

[@lmr4403]

The simplified math behind Cold Snap: A current top run (Etho's run) got 22 embers with 40 cards, Cold snap double 7.5% of the cards' embers. So Cold snap on average on a top run would get about 7.5% of 22 embers extra=1.65 real embers per run. A rare card that adds 3 hazard and only adds on average 1.65 real embers is not worth it.

[@lmr4403]

And when stumbles gets shuffled in it, this value gets even lower.

[@AmeliaPond.]

The way Etho talks to Rusty is adorable

[@Yau_G.R.]

The best descriptor for suit up as a card was "It was great at solving the problem it caused"

[@MrInfinity418]

Just something so soothing about etho.

[@lilypotter3794]

I thought it was just me...

[@SillySyrup]

1:16:06 Mill is the term for attrition taken when there are no cards in your deck or when your deck runs too fast. In many card games, the player is punished for not being able to draw a card at a point in their turn, usually the start. Some people make mill decks for running out their opponent's deck. In Decked Out 2 terms, mill would define spending longer in the dungeon than your deck can handle, constantly losing benefits and drawing Stumbles.

[@lamborn3D]

My understanding has always been that milling is being forced to discard cards. Hence terms like "Mill 3" in MTG. When you can't draw at the beginning of your turn, you lose the game; but that's not milling. Milling someone to death is forcing them to discard cards until they can't draw. At least in MTG, I have less experience with others.

[@SillySyrup]

@@lamborn3D That's basically the same thing. Discarding cards until you can't draw falls under the category of your deck running too fast. I just used a broader definition because there are some weirder mill strategies and mill exists in other games. Yes, that is the most common form of mill. Mill in general just means bad stuff because you can't draw.

[@lamborn3D]

@@SillySyrup well, what I said is that mill is being forced to discard, not what happens after you can't draw. So those would be distinctly separate. I have not played games that use the term differently than that, but they could certainly exist.

[@SillySyrup]

@@lamborn3D I see. I have heard that being forced to discard is a step in the process of mill and is included in most mill strategies, but there are people and places who have heard differently, which is okay. For reference, here is Google's definition of "Milling the deck:" "Mill decks are decks that try to win by completing the win condition of making you not be able to draw cards at the start of your turn, thus losing, and them winning." I believe the version that most people have heard is the instruction in Magic, which is a different thing than the strategy. Milling in Magic, as you probably know, is an action which means to move cards from your library to your graveyard. But that's the action - or, the verb - definition in it, which may lead many Magic players to assume that the noun defines the act of that, or the strategy thereof. It may be true - what I'm saying is that it's less likely because that idea of Mill applies to Magic because of its specific action instruction. Evidence also points to Tango referencing the idea of mill which I have heard, because in Decked Out 2 there is no such thing as discarding cards or a graveyard, but players are punished for having a depleted deck. In conclusion, either may be true. In fact, I think that both are true, because it's just two different ideas that accompany different games and scenarios. But, we can't really decide which definition Tango is referencing, especially because he admitted he doesn't know himself.

[@willguggn2]

@@SillySyrup Uhm, you do have a draw pile and played cards are discarded into the 'graveyard' except for 'exiled' ethereal cards. (There just isn't any mechanic to do anything with discarded cards of any flavour.)

[@luni-craft]

Tango, who brought a warden to the surface in double life via a water stream (not an elevator), who watched his warden bob around the river in the same series before it was fishing rodded to fall damage death...has forgotten the buoyancy of wardens.

[@Bird2920]

32:00 Decked Out 3 could be a team effort. Pick either a really fast builder like Scar or someone with really great redstone expertise like Ehto, Impulse, or Scar. That could catapult the game to completion much faster 😁 OR pick someone to help like Zedaph to make sure that the game is full of quirky mechanics and fun/interesting ways to die and get points 😁

[@msAstraea]

Would be cool to see DO3 as an collaborative hermit project. Everyone who can and wants to help could all work together. To see everyone bring in something unique that would fit the hermit well. Think that would be awesome

[@16m49x3]

or just make it on a separate server with creative mode and mods

[@msAstraea]

@@16m49x3 creative could too yea. Mods might make it more difficult for people with less powerful pcs to play it too. Depends on the kind of modpack.

[@willguggn2]

But then those hermits have to either be barred from running for points, or they'd have a huge advantage over everybody else. A third option would be to make everything known to all players beforehand and eliminate exploration altogether. None of those options sound appealing tbh. :/

[@texanfan2777]

If it’s a colab, they build the areas, tango and other redstoners wire it all up with-in reason. Just reduce the work load.

[@ChiriVulpes]

"Skip your next card draw." could instead be "Silence your next card." Skipping a draw sounds like it's the inverse of Quick Draw, which it isn't. Silencing sounds like what it actually does

[@jakobr_]

“silences” kind of sounds like it plays but isn’t announced. I’d personally use a word like “nullifies”

[@ChiriVulpes]

@@jakobr_ Nullifies is good too!

[@hellterminator]

@@jakobr_ “Discard,” like in every card game.

[@jeanlou3]

If you want to add risk/reward to level 3-4, you can have clank slowly auto generate with time (since players barely generate any), and have pressure plates or buttons that add clank block, but of course make noise and attract wardens. So you have more strategic decisions to make instead of always sneaking and accumulate clank block.

[@iamayamiamitik5880]

There are already plenty clank spots at certain pressure plate spots in Level 3.

[@SillySyrup]

Stumbles already accomplish this. There is a time limit implemented into the game.

[@bruhbutton4520]

@@iamayamiamitik5880his comment says pressure plates to add clank *block*, the idea is the player has to risk if blocking clank is worth making noise

[@OscarLT321]

This would be impossible to balance without perma aggro net. Either you sit far away from the wardens and keep touching pressure plates, or you never touch them because instant death is not worth a bit of extra clank block

[@OscarLT321]

And with the aggro net you would also just never touch pressure plates. Only thing that changes is that you get rewarded for making a mistake (if you don't die)

[@sealyba]

I love how much Etho messes with Gem. Payback for all of the punching and the "let me in Tango's"

[@baseballjustin5]

True Sibling energy

[@defiantmars9910]

I love the sibling-like energy between Gem and Etho. I find it hilarious to watch.

[@koalas-cave]

I love how good Tango is getting at his little flights from his storage area to his observation spot

[@baseballjustin5]

Practice makes perfect

[@matthewparker9276]

To be really evil, add an evoker to the chain trap. Make falling into it at max clank a fatal error.

[@nchls1343]

💀💀 honestly that's too much work for something that can be achieved with lava Either way it's 100% death

[@Zedantic]

@@nchls1343 good point, if he wanted to kill the players who fail he would just do that

[@alexgrissom3513]

Too deadly, no chance of survival

[@NotOnQ]

@@Zedantic Ideally it would be only at max clank though

[@matthewparker9276]

​@@nchls1343 the vex serve an additional purpose than just killing the player. They also add additional pressure, and make the player rush, so they're more likely to make a mistake. It means the chains can move slower, so the trap isn't as punishing before max clank, but still be really difficult to pass at max clank.

[@Blueeyesthewarrior]

The loving way that Mrs. Tango places the witch hat on Tango's head was so sweet. Always love a Mrs. T cameo.

[@knulllord654]

Etho longest Run take 2 was hilarious to watch on stream. The reaction of the chat was equally priceless😂

[@Metcraft2]

When Gem said "You have maximum dad energy" the first thing I thought was I want a shirt that says that. Then you said you wanted a shirt with it. You should add one to your merch.

[@copperbonsai]

@Metcraft2 Yes! With large Tango eyes above them.

[@alexanderkonczal3908]

tango also has the most powerful dad-bods I've seen in a long time, in a good way.

[@maloriezastrow971]

The lighting change / flash at 1:54 was Etho with glow ink in his hand. It was very quick, but it was definitely there. :)

[@100StepProgram]

I would totally watch hermits if they posted the time between the runs, just really enjoy them chilling

[@tienlebon3994]

Suit Up definitely doesn't need to be nerfed, the extra clank adds up so much that when you run it you're basically guaranteed hella vexes and hazard on your way out

[@idontcare_wtf]

I think the card is useless at this moment without the resistance :/

[@BingusFodder]

Yeah, it really is pointless now. Because wardens ignore armor, and ravagers still two shot you. At best it gets you one or maybe two more hits from willie/vexes. May be a good option to try re instating resistance & increasing clank to a 33 or even 50% chance for double. Or even guarantee max upon grabbing your artifact.

[@ZeroKOR1]

Etho is not wrong about that card being honest. 10 is probably a little to many cards, but at 8 cards and assuming 0 have been played prier to the card dropping you would have a 50% chance to double 1 ember card, 9.6% chance to double 2, and a .57% chance to role 3. When I build decks for competitive play I usually aim for in the 80s% chance of what I want to do to happen, and push for over 90% to start something. Also the fact that most of the chances right now would be for low ember rate cards, would reduce the amount of embers generated from a rare card. Increasing the card count to 4 would probably make the card more worth while since it bumps you to 60% chance. The card also loses a lot of value the later it is pulled. One more thing to add also is the fact that if people do get a higher bump on things like reckless charge, they will be more interested in staying longer on a floor, ultimately adding more clank, or at least wasting some more of there cards value. @Tango

[@levi8971]

3rd etho run was insane, greed run paid off, he only had 1 last shot at the chains and he made it!

[@memyselfandisaacmusic7819]

I had a suggestion for something to add to the crowns shop: snowballs! A well-thrown snowball could save your life against a warden, and they're inherently single-use. Make them a little expensive, and you might be able to make people super strategic about using them, and coz you can't get them any other way they feel a bit special and add an extra element to the game! Also hello from Australia! Love the streams, and as a comp sci student your redstone is genuinely super inspiring!

[@autumnwhistles-yc5xb]

oo I love this idea!

[@memyselfandisaacmusic7819]

@@autumnwhistles-yc5xb if you're ever able to make it to streams, feel free to plug it there so tango can potentially see and implement it! I can't ever make it coz timezones sadly, but v supportive of plagiarism LMAO

[@ekaruna42]

Tango has already said he doesn’t want to add snowballs unfortunately

[@WhatZrice]

I also had this idea but I couldn’t donate to him on stream. But still a good idea tho

[@BlueCyann]

This has been suggested so many times. It doesn't work the way you think it would work because snowballs are projectiles, which themselves add aggro. In almost all cases they will focus the warden on you rather than on the snowball.

[@StuffandThings_]

I think to fix Cold Snap, it should also double any loot as well. You could keep the 3 card limit that way, and the downside is pretty fair. It would keep it balanced, since you wouldn't get ridiculous amounts of embers like with upping the card limit so that an ember card is very likely to play, and it would become worth it since for loot heavy decks it would do something more often than not. It also makes it like a sort of upgraded version of Swagger, which seems like the initial intent anyways. Plus Etho the loot goblin would 100% go for it then.

[@TheBreadBasketOfficialOfficial]

Then it would be too much for the hazard it gives. It would have to also give clank

[@StuffandThings_]

@@TheBreadBasketOfficialOfficial No because now you've just made it a bad card again. Remember, this is supposed to be a top tier card, its really expensive for a reason. 3 hazard for a card that has a chance to not even do anything is more than enough, especially if you're paying 58 frost embers for it.

[@KuroroSama42]

Not a bad suggestion. I think it could just give a static +5 embers, on top of its current effect. Reckless charge is +2 hazard and +1 clank (you need to trigger a shrieker) for +10 embers. Cold Snap with a static +4 embers on top would be a very similar cost for on average +7 to +13 embers, depending on the deck. A super tailored deck, with less than 40 cards, might get more than +13, but that's a lot of extra sacrifices being made for it. A lot less potential hazard/clank guard and/or less potential treasure.

[@MermaidHair5091]

I just love that the term “he got willied on the way out” is both accurate and in context

[@ellabarnum3391]

hermits joining the server just to make comments to tango during his streams and immediately leaving will never stop being funny to me

[@chaz1146]

Have you considered adding a path that opens on max hazard. Like a super difficult path. Just so that if a ravager finds itself behind a water stream on level 1 and makes winning impossible there’s still “technically” a way out.

[@Reveleijn]

I dont think theres any change of Tango doing that. He still considers the fear for max clank to be too mild, as he also stated in this stream (Etho didnt even see the stumbles connected to swagger (which increase clank) to be that much of a drawback). Adding another path or opportunity to make max clank more survivable seems to be the opposite of Tango's future plans of the dungeon at the moment

[@BlahCraft1]

I believe you mean "max clank" instead of "max hazard"

[@iamayamiamitik5880]

No thank you. At this point I'm pretty sure the Hermits knows about the water streams and should plan accordingly.

[@chaz1146]

@@BlahCraft1I do mean hazard, but I don’t think tango would do this just cuz it’d be a lot of work to fix a very rare occurrence that can technically be avoided with enough forethought.

[@kushj9568]

Honestly, the water dropping is the hermits own fault, they should be building more hazard block.

[@LostColtmusic]

Two thoughts: 1) “Special Tango Time” needs to be the name for the next warden 2) On the Suit Up nerf going too far: with the Nerf, both warden shrieks and Ravager boops are back to being two shot kills. The only benefit remaining there is needing slightly fewer berries to heal, which is not enough value to justify the added clank. you will probably have heard this from others, but my suggestion is that suit up should have synergy with speed, run strategies, including with the rare card that drops embers at the start of level 3. if you put a five or eight minute timer on the resistance 2 Beacon, players will need to make a choice between getting in and out quick or going on a longer farming run. Smart players will combine with a tactical approach card or keys purchased from the crown shop. The extra clank with the suit up card will add colour to both speed run and farm strategies.

[@dragonridertechnologies]

This is a really good analysis. I missed when the nerf happened, but this is a good suggestion to make the nerf induce gameplay changes rather than merely making it bad.

[@jonitapp4091]

Thank you for being a good sport with Mrs T's hats... They were fun!

[@sagebauer1077]

instead of "skip" or "mill", "discard your next card" might work... it conveys that the card is gone a little better. Although I think skip is totally fine

[@LoecatchXD]

Have you considered witch stations when the game is off? Witches throw instant health at ravagers when they’re low hp.

[@zacke.1286]

He has, but is so situational that for it to be useful they would need to be EVERYWHERE. Too much work, easier to just replace dead ravagers.

[@Wouldyurather133]

Can't wait to see ethos week 6 runs

[@FireBat31]

Tango shall forevermore be known as “The Dungeon Heckler.”

[@josiahhill4993]

You know, Tango, while you're watching Etho, he's farming you for intel. You slip him little bits at a time..

[@christopherwest5662]

Have you considered zoning wardens in Level 3 in three vertical stacks instead of three horizontal layers? So each warden would have access to all three floors, but be constrained by height barriers to keep them to their respective zones: one on each end of the long hall, and one in the center section. I'm not sure if this is more feasible and visually aesthetic than constraining each to a separate floor, but I though I'd mention it...

[@charnlangford4298]

This is pretty interesting. What if the zones moved using pistons, they may wander around more for unpredictability. It does mean they can't chase the player through zones. And any smart player will learn them straight away

[@rainbowkaz215]

Scar logging in for a single second just to type "Hi Dad" XD

[@Taz__-kz1ej]

For Levels 3 & 4, maybe have a note block play a sound when artifact picked up to help draw the Wardens closer to the player.

[@willguggn2]

They're already drawn towards the artifact drop. Wardens only listen to sounds within 16 blocks, so even dropping the compass on the floor has the same effect as a noteblock on them.

[@Drapvi]

Hiya Tango! I'm a graduate student currently studying probability. I know how unintuitive some of these random draw results are, so regarding the Cold Snap discussion, I thought I would lend my two cents. I ran simulations using a generated deck containing 1 cold snap, 5 ember seekers, 3 frost focuses, and 3 cards that give +10 embers (i.e. Reckless Charge, Swagger). On over half the runs (52%), there were 0 embers generated by cold snap. About 35% of the runs generated 2-6 from the low level ember cards, and about 10% saw 10 or more embers. The average from all of this is ~2.5 embers per play. In contrast a deck with *only* the ember generating cards caused cold snap to return ~10 embers per run. Hope this helps. Thanks for all the content, been loving your + the other hermits vids.

[@Johngle]

Regarding eerie silence, you could do something similar to what you did with reckless charge and play a sound 29 seconds or so after it’s played to let them know the next card will be skipped.

[@delta3244]

worth noting that quickdraw will cause this idea to fail sometimes, by playing the sound before the wrong card. It would work well most of the time, though.

[@thesaxiest4480]

I think eerie silence just discards a card and the card after will play at the next instance, correct? Because then this change wouldn't work.

[@nomsomething]

On the issue of Bounding Strides: Raising the ceiling in certain parkour areas would honestly fix the entire card and why Hermits don't want it. Such locations include Dripleaf and Wither roses. Low ceilings reduce jump distance in those scenarios

[@carraradezembronatal]

21:30 "Skizz playing Decked Out". Any chance of making a separate map out f The Citadel/Decked Out, reset the player chambers and have a mini series with other MC friends playing DO? Skizz, of course, would be included, but also folks from the life series, empires, etc.

[@filipspurny5880]

I think I agree with Etho with his view on Cold Snap. If I were him I wouldnt probably even consider buying the card if it didnt have the downside of adding 3 hazard. See in games like Hearthstone for example, cards like that will be used in combo decks, where there would be a high probability of the card being impactful. In decked out, combo decks like that are quite hard to build, since clank and hazard block are so important and they will always take up a certain portion of the deck. Even if cards like Sneak, Stability, Evasion and Tread Lightly get eventually replaced by Eerie Silence and Dungeon Repairs, thus saving spots in your deck, as you make deeper runs, the player will probably be still required to run Evasion and Tread Lightly (what is more Eerie Silence burns a card, again not good when trying to combo). In my opinion, the way to fix this and make peoples deck vary a little more would be adding cards that combine the effect. For example have a card that gives +3 frost embers and +3 clank block or sth like that. That would cover the necessity for clank block, add a combo aspect and save up some space in the deck, being only 1 card rather than 2. Of course its necessary to thoroughly consider the cost of the card, as the biggest benefit in my eyes is that it saves up deck space, which is something the players now have to consider more and more as their decks fill up.

[@KuroroSama42]

"In my opinion, the way to fix this and make peoples deck vary a little more would be adding cards that combine the effect." The real problem can be found by looking at averages. Etho's deck generates a total of 42 embers, once every card is drawn. That's only 1 ember per card, on average. That means cold snap will double those 3 "average draws" of 1 ember each. It's only +3 embers. I don't really think this can be fixed with other cards without breaking other things. For your suggestion, those cards will be OP on their own, unless their ember and block values are rather low. To make a good comparison: You have evasion and frost focus, for +4 embers and +4 block. For your combo card to be balanced, it would give +2/+2. Replace your evasion and frost focus for 2 of that new card and you've kept everything the same - the same average ember draw and the same blocking capability. The only fix is changing the card itself. More turns, less hazard, give it another benefit, triple instead of double. Something. P.S: More card variety would certainly be good to have as well though. Choosing between +4 or +2/+2 is fun.

[@filipspurny5880]

@@KuroroSama42 Well yes of course such cards would be rather strong, thats why maybe they should be put in a higher category, to limit the amount you can run in the deck or set the price high. I dont think high power cards are necessairly a problem, since the dungeon also gets harder as you run deeper. The average amount of embers is a good thing to point out. That amount even lowers, when you run Eerie Silence, which might burn one of your ember generating cards or Cold Snap itself. What is more, later into the game you get Stumbles which would also interact with Cold Snap. So the actual potetial outcome is even slightly worse than what you described.

[@sagebauer1077]

I think Etho is right. Cold Snap seems very weak, especially with the +3 hazard. Realisitically you're probably only going to get like 1 frost ember card afterward, and even if its doubling swagger, you could just have another swagger.

[@Styder111]

Just seeing them hang out and chat like that is so wholesome

[@TheSl4900]

I love it, Etho gets the first Swagger: "Hmmmmm, might be overpowered"

[@ducvu9651]

I guess he's an actual ninja, quick and fast, suit up like a samurai makes him slow.

[@SiBebok]

Etho is such a good clickbait, everyone just eat it callously. And me just gobbles it hilariously.😂

[@clairekholin6935]

I think that after the world download, the community should work together to rework parts of it to create a "Decked Out 3" with the changes Tango wanted to make

[@TheOmNomGirl]

decked out 2.5

[@ej558]

Tango will make DO3 at somepoint.... maybe on Create server for fun

[@Lv3Wizard]

I think 2 stumbles for swagger is fair. If the shuffler gets fixed to properly shuffle stumbles into the deck during play then its fair.

[@Saandy_]

The slimes are a double-edge sword I suppose. On the one hand it makes level 3 easier, but on the other it creates a lot of tension for the player. The wardens do a lot of noise, and you don't always know if they are angry at you or something else.

[@GPLB]

Tango’s builds this season Are insane! The nether hub is ubiquitous and overlooked, but he built that so well and so long ago

[@bb010g]

yeah, that's a beautiful nether.

[@trufflesnout5179]

I think cold snap is insanely good if your playing an ember farming deck where you’re staying on level 1 and most of your cards drop embers. But it’s hard to justify playing otherwise

[@ExcitedSloth_]

@TangoTek, I think that spider hat is my new favourite! I think we need a best hat vote / hat vs hat tournament, to crown the best hat.

[@OscarLT321]

The skipped card being announced is a great idea. Out of sight and out of mind is a problem for letting players feel the downsides just like the stumbles of the jackpot card. Also, the balance changes depending on the difficulty of max clank escapes. It has impact on any card which has an effect on clank (clank block is worth more, clank generation/stumbles are more impactful), but it also changes strategy. Sneaking through the entire dungeon would become the norm

[@upthedubsguy]

That light flash was in Etho's hand. It happened once before the time you noticed it. Fantastic game! :- )

[@LottieTottieWasTaken]

Hey Tango I have an idea for the trick or treat area. Maybe you can change the house into santa's house and make the halloween pumpkins into cookies or milk. Then instead of trick or treating, you either get a present from santa when you were good and clank when you were bad. I think it would be a fun idea since Christmas is coming up next! You're amazing, keep being you! ❤

[@idontcare_wtf]

I do like the idea of it being closed and Santa’s hut be somewhere else

[@sukhman._]

Tango has his own idea for forge. But this is how i would implement it. Since legendary cards are powerful and are only crafted, crafting them in one run possible and it wouldn’t be as rewarding so what I would is that recipes can be bought after at the frost ember shop and the forging can be done outside. The forging material can be found inside the dungeon and brought outside the dungeon, can also be bought at the end of the frost member shop and outside in the crown shop. Every shop will have some kind of which is not available in the other shop so by this way player has to manage everything. He has to get materials from the from inside the dungeon from the shop and from the outside shop. This would make forging legendary card more rewarding. Any suggestions by anyone else

[@idontcare_wtf]

Or you need to carry your recipe through your next run? Or maybe a side quest compass? Idk

[@Polarisk2106]

Etho's right about the rare card though, doing a rough estimate, if there can be a total of 45 cards in play during a run at any given time, those 45 cards are individually loaded into the system and randomly played, there is at least 2,025 possible combinations. Etho (from what I could see and what I remember about his purchases) has 8 potential cards that drop embers, the odds of any of those cards getting played after Cold Snap is 0.4% at most. For 58 embers and a slot in that 45 that is way too low a chance to really gamble with. Etho is right, that card should get a small buff, even if it's a +4 embers to the end of the run if no embers are triggered after that card is played.

[@KuroroSama42]

Your probabilities and numbers are definitely way off there. For one, it's max 40 cards per deck and Etho has 10 ember cards (5 +2s, 3 +4s and 2 +10s). For the stats, going with your numbers and assuming cold snap is the first card drawn, he has an 8/44 chance to draw one of the 8 ember cards on the first draw. If that fails, he has an 8/43 chance on the 2nd, then 8/42 for the last draw. (8/44)+(8/43)+(8/42) = ~56% chance to draw one of those 8 cards within those 3 draws. The odds won't change too much even if you draw it later - you'll filter your deck down in the same proportions. 1 ember card drawn for every 3-4 non-ember cards. That being said, a lot of the 56% is just doubling an ember seeker or frost focus for +2 to +4 embers. *Terrible* result, considering you paid 3 hazard for it. Etho was mentioning his 2 +10 cards only. The odds of drawing those from his 39 non-cold snap cards is 2/39+2/38+2/37 = 16%. Not as bad as he thought, but still not good. And again, let's say it's halfway through the deck instead. Chances are he'll have drawn 1 of the 2 +10 cards along with the other cards. So we're at (1/19)+(1/18)+(1/17) = ~16% anyways. The best way to look at it isn't with probabilities, just use statistics: Etho's entire deck generates 42 embers. Ignoring stumbles, that means each card gives on average just over 1 ember. So drawing and doubling 3 of those random cards means doubling that average. On average +3 embers per cold snap.

[@mapmage]

i couldn't help myself, so i simulated 100.000 runs with ethos current deck if he replaced a treasure card with cold snap (if he would've bought it and never changed his deck again) this resulted in an average 1.46 ember drops added by cold snap per run, assuming his entire deck would be drawn. going by hypnos currently know deck as of writing this, he would get an average of 2.52 embers added by cold snap over 100.000 runs

[@KuroroSama42]

I take it your program considers some stumbles getting added? Doing the math without considering stumbles puts it at about 3 embers per cold snap in Etho's current deck. I guess the stumbles have quite an effect on cold snap...

[@adaelion3772]

​@@KuroroSama42they would actually make it worse. They are added to the end of the deck for the most part, but they add cards that do not give embers, resulting in a smaller percentage.

[@Blubbii88]

I think beastsense usefulness is not the only problem about the card. Beastsense generates 1 clank, but does absolutely nothing on the turn its played. The opposite is the case, it just draws one clank without any benifits. The effect is only useful for the first levels, before it triggeres the hermits usually scouted the area more than enough to know the locations. Beast Sense is not worth the ember IMO, it actively weakens your deck for a benifit that most player never get when actually useful. I would consider Beast Sense worth while if it was more frequently or predictable. Best change would be having it as permanent card for me. Either make it chance based to trigger beast sense on every card draw, or trigger beast sense when entering a new level (and possibly for the next card draws), where its the most useful to have insight where the ravagers are to choose a path. The visibile effect is so short, that many hermits rarely react to it. If they know that the next card after opening the level 2 door, will triggger beast sense, they have at least a plan what to do with the card, which is not currently possibly or reasonable.

[@DominikGuzowski]

beast sense should've been a permanent card with a chance to reveal ravagers with each card drawn.

[@bb010g]

​@@DominikGuzowskipair that with a guaranteed beast sense on first card draw and that's probably well worth the clank

[@Brienna82]

*While watching Etho in the mushroom area* Tango: "There's mushrooms everywhere" (somehow sounding surprised)

[@nakkajin]

just thought of this when you disabled the noisemaker, but you could definitely add various noisemakers spread out that trigger randomly or in sequence to give the wardens a patrol path

[@CJsResearch]

Etho saying a card is trash has got to hurt tango's feelings a bit. Decked out is his baby. I know it wasn't malicious but I still felt the twinge. (No hate here LOVE Etho and tango)

[@youtubeSuckssNow]

Eh its feedback, he takes feedback well. And given the heckling Tango was giving him I doubt its an issue

[@Spectrum.Io_oI]

Tbh if I can't take 2 ravegers hits and left with 2~ heart, with the suit up card, then the card is trash.. agree or argue

[@whistlehammock]

tango loves constructive criticism lol, there was a bdubs stream where he said tango tells him to be meaner whenever he gives feedback

[@caulifloodle]

This is usually how people tend to talk about cards in deckbuilding games, I doubt Tango’s offended by it at all. One of the common discussions/arguments in TCGs is the whole “not every card can be good” issue, and part of the skill is being able to evaluate cards that look good at first but are actually bad, or figuring out why a card someone else calls trash can actually be good.

[@ye3623]

In general hermits are too nice to say anything like that so he has been encouraging them to be more direct when it comes to decked out feedback. Like how earlier in the video he was telling Etho not to be Etho and tell him his honest opinion. And by not being Etho he means not to be nice. But again, this is just for the hermits because they know each other.

[@Kaiasky]

I love watching Gem, Cub, and Etho so much

[@humourlessjester3584]

If you're taking any suggestions for how to make eerie silence tell players what card they lost how about maybe have the the card's audio play and then end prematurely followed by a burning audio? So it'll go Treasure hu... *burn*. Maybe you can do that using the new feature to pull a disc out of a juke box using hopper carts?

[@EuropesNinja]

Fantastic idea

[@bobosaurus331]

I don't think there's a way to tell which card is skipped redstone wise, but if there is this could be cool

[@humourlessjester3584]

@bobosaurus331 Tango did say he'll look into doing it during an etho run, so I do have hope that he could do something like this.

[@justinbchen]

Or alternatively, since cards all have different lengths, have it play entirely and have another sound fade into the middle of it.

[@jacobjordan6406]

tango in regards to the "skip next card draw" upon reading I thought that the meaning was players essentially had a delayed draw phase or the next card would be played after double the time. I did not realize that by skipping it meant it removed the next card

[@adaelion3772]

It should say "skip next card drawn". The sentence as is means exactly what you thought.

[@charlieanderson5490]

Tango you really need to buff Cold snap. I did a statistical analysis of the card and it is worse than a frost focus. Lets say 1/4 of your deck is ember related cards. The average amount of embers received per ember card is 3.7 for Etho, because he has (5 ember seeker x2 + 3 frost focus x4 + 1 reckless charge x 5 (estimated 50% success rate for reckless charge) + 1 swagger x10)/10 total cards + 3.7. Once calculated into a binomial model, he will hit on average .742 ember cards per draw. Multiplied by the 3.7 average, the average yield for this rare for etho is 2.74 frost embers. The card isn't good even if you are generous. Lets say etho added 2 more reckless charge and 1 more swagger. This will make the deck now be .325 ember cards, and make the average yield per ember card 4.38. Into a binomial model, he will on average get .959 ember cards in the 3 card sample. Using the binomial model and a strong frost ember deck, the average yield for the card is still only 4.2 frost embers. Essentially, even with a strong ember deck you are only getting .2 more frost embers than a frost focus at the cost of 3 hazard.

[@KuroroSama42]

And your stats aren't considering Stumbles being added into the deck.

[@miladparao4606]

I think this idea will make level 3 hard and scary again: You can add new wardens inside the walls that can't fallow you but they can hear your steps on pressure plates or sniff, and Sonic blast you, and they will give you darknse that will make you panic and make more noise, and because level three is vertical, it can be random that warden's are in which levels, it can be handled by simple water columns , or they can be inside walls and covered by wool like before the max clank wool walls are opoen and wall wardens can hear you,but in max clank they get closed to aggroNet come in play

[@thesaxiest4480]

I think if you introduce too many wardens, you actually risk players getting caught in the crossfire often when the wardens aggro on stuff like slimes and bats.

[@miladparao4606]

@@thesaxiest4480 we have three floors in level 3,so it can be random number of floors , like 1 and 2 , 2 and 3, and you can cover top and bottom of the warden's room inside the wall with wool so they just hear things happening in there immediate vicinity, you can do even more like having warden in some distance from the game just close enough to make some spot of the map always dark , like its a cursed spot or something , they even can be on water streem that take them closer when clank or hazerd gos up

[@archniki_]

He said it would be learnable

[@dalefishfishdale]

For Cold Snap : Gem's idea could work if you did a one of trigger for the next card to generate Frost Embers gets doubled, no just holding the signal open for three cards. Though I agree with Etho that the card feel way too hit or miss for the downsides, unless you have a lot of Ember generation in your deck, the total effect of the card may just be negative, or very little positive. For Swagger : I feel the stumbles probably aren't enough of a downside to want Tango has intended, everybody is looking at the positive side and are willing to take just about any downsides for the effect. Three stumbles MAY be enough to make Hermits think more carefully, but the high tier, reliable effect, is worth a lot.

[@ye3623]

Tango time in Etho videos is very fun indeed!

[@oksenmu]

I "did the math" (bruteforced it in python) for Cold Snap; The perfect deck, where Reckless is triggered all all three times, and you have all frosember cards, Cold Snap would give 5.98 frost embers, The same as above, but Reckless is triggerd half the time, Cold Snap would give 4.89 frost embers, In Ethos current deck, if he Reckless is always triggered, Cold Snap would give 3.06 frost ember, If Etho triggers Reckless half the time, Cold Snap would give 2.71 frost embers

[@KuroroSama42]

I don't think your math is considering the fact Stumbles get added into the deck. Those tank the numbers too.

[@jozzywolf7520]

I love how Tango just accepts that this is his life whenever Mrs T comes in and sticks stuff on his head. 😂

[@jnyc96]

Etho not having a mouse pad is insane

[@Chris-pd1zo]

For the double ember card, it may be interesting to instead of doubling the ember number on the card, for the next 3 cards, whenever an ember would drop it drops twice instead. It makes it so that built up embers, by drawing the card at a not ideal time, also trigger the cards reward

[@Book_Wyrmling]

Just a suggestion, and I don’t know if this is possible, but could you make Eerie Silence also kill the heartbeat for a while? Just to make it truly silent.

[@idontcare_wtf]

Heartbeat and drones, until next card draw

[@loool72]

this is such a cool idea!! would make it a lot more cinematic

[@Book_Wyrmling]

@@idontcare_wtf The same hard cut off that dying does.

[@Gkenie39]

Has tango ever considered a hardmode toggle. A difficult option that doesn't replace the easy..deadly level select but changes some redstone - i.e more embers but triple stumble chance. Then the pro players have an extra choice at the start of each run instead of always going "deadly" (just a toggle button above the level select, called challenge mode ). Love y'all edit: it could add a 30min timer instead. if you take longer then 30mins, the escape door doesn't open and you must commit die, but twice the ember/loot dropps. :)

[@MoonlitBookworm73]

Ooh, this is interesting

[@andrewcavallo1877]

Some name suggestions I’ve seen for wardens on level 4: Peril Paranoia Phobia Psychosis Punishment Perish Pray (or maybe Prey?) Predator Putrid

[@Broanater]

I somewhat agree with Etho. I don't think Cold Snap is trash. But I do think its not a great card. Maybe bumb it up to next 5 cards. Because the odds of getting multiple ember cards within those 3 cards played is quite low. For it to be more profitable than swagger it would need to hit atleast 2 cards. Hitting 2 ember cards in 3 draws is pretty unlikely. Unless you have an insanely ember heavy deck which then you wouldnt have enough of the other cards. Overall its a good concept for the card but I think the number will need some reworking.

[@KuroroSama42]

Note that hitting 2 ember seekers is still very weak. That would make it a frost focus that gave 3 hazard.

[@blakerobinson4198]

I'm sure this has already been suggested (sorry Tango) but just wanted to voice my opinion. I think for gameplay and balancing suit up, you should bring back the resistance and ditch the armor. I then really like the idea that the resistance beacon goes away at max clank. 1) this is easier to maintain as you don't have to refill chests with armor 2) the resistance is more effective than armor at tanking hits, and feels like it strikes the right balance for surviving warden and ravager hits. 3) removing the beacon at max clank provides a clear consequence to being "noisy" in the dungeon. I understand that an objection to this may be that the card is called "suit up" and it would be weird to not have any armor with that. But I think the feeling of the card is still conveyed with the beacon, and I think this leads to the best gameplay rather than prioritizing "lore".