Testing pH of the Car Soaps I Use

[@LoganDoesStuff2014]

When you dilute something acidic/mildly acidic in water you’re decreasing H ions and increasing pH.

[@voizfree8734]

mildly acid has plenty of H+, if water is neutral (where H+ and OH- is balanced), the mixture still has more H+ than OH- so you still get a slight acid mixture. Noway the pH increases

[@StrikeEagle15E]

What your testing is proving, Matt, is that the functional pH of any of the soaps you are testing can vary depending on the actual chemical makeup of the local water supply. The tap water in Central Florida IS different from the tap water in, say, Las Vegas, or Upstate New York, or Seattle. Sure, using DI water will make things more even, but there will still be differences in the final solutions. This reinforces what you have been saying all along. These are the products YOU use. These are the results that YOU get from using your selection of products and techniques. The MOST important key, for me, is that you are being very transparent, and open about ALL of this. You give us the functional information and the technical information, all the while, allowing us to learn with you. We, as members of your community, get to collectively learn and input our own experiences and opinions for the greater knowledge of all of us. Thanks, Matt.

[@ObsessedGarage]

Thanks man. I'm not a chemist, but I am curious about findings. It was a bit eye opening that my decon soap registered a pH of 8 with my crude testing. Doing tests like this open me up to critique, but I enjoy that conversation.

[@TechnicalLee]

As a chemist, it was pretty entertaining watching you learn the joys of pH meters firsthand. I think the weirdness you saw was due to the ionic strength. Simply, pH meters don't read accurately with super concentrated or super dilute solutions. Straight concentrated soap is going to have a lot of ionic strength and won't read accurately due to reduced hydrogen ion mobility and effects on the liquid junction potential. Likewise, you can't get a good reading on distilled water because of the extremely low ionic strength, so you'll notice a huge fluctuation in pH readings. Distilled water also picks up CO2 from the air very quickly (turns to carbonic acid) which will actually make it slightly acidic in pH. In short, the only readings of value here are the soap solutions diluted to working concentration. So throw out the concentrated pH readings, but the diluted readings should be valid for comparison. But as Dave pointed out, pH alone is not a valid measure of car soap performance, there are other factors like the chemistry of detergent being used. Anything in the range of pH 4-10 should be fine to use on your car, and you don't have to worry until you get to the crazy high or low pH products meant for stripping or extreme cleaning.

[@nickemangione]

It's midnight and I'm 10 minutes into watching a man mix soaps in cups so he may test the pH levels. Why am I the way that I am?

[@hlcepeda]

You're just going through a pHase. 😉

[@SpreadingKnowledgeVlogs]

It's not just you!!! Lol hence why this man's business does so well...

[@shaunbooth2954]

Same here lo 4.30 am

[@shaunbooth2954]

What did you end up getting ?

[@timkinley1779]

I've read most of the comments below and I'm going to chime in for some clarity. The soap directly from the bottle is thick and is difficult to acutely measure. Once diluted, the probes ability improves. The correct dv method would be to use a stir bar in your solution. Also, a buffer solution is not necessary at that neutral of a ph.

[@memnoch1974]

Makes sense. If the chemistry of the soap has chelating chemicals , it will tip off the OH levels and affect pH. Most tap water is hard water so the chelating action will bind these minerals out, softening the water if you will. Laundry detergent and dish soaps have these chelators as well and help the soap to its job. You will need a very high pH to strip wax, maybe up in the 10 - 11 range, my opinion and there would need to have a strong hydroxide (sodium hydroxide is a strong, very common degreaser) in the soap in order to remove waxes and sealants.

[@memnoch1974]

Also, you need a little bit of alkalinity (ie, 7.5 or 8.0 pH) to help the soap bind to surface soils on the paint. Most soils get washed out with soap. If the ph was a perfect 7.0, you may need to scrub harder on the paint to clean the soil off. Anything less than 6.0 ph would fall into the acid category and not really do much for cleaning the paint (unless you are trying to decontaminate iron particles and a low Ph will help).

[@williambellisIII]

This soap, that soap... 7.6, 7.8... eh... I'm sure your cars will remain spotless and sealed regardless.

[@SpreadingKnowledgeVlogs]

Love that you made your kids a part of this episode I can tell you they probably love that you involve them as well!!!

[@ninetres187]

Another example of why this channel is the GOAT. Even though the results are muddy.....it was fascinating to watch and listen to the chemist. Thanks for putting in the work!

[@derekhanson4215]

How awesome is Dave Phillips!?! That was super cool of him to take your call and help out. I only understood about every third word he said but still....👍👍

[@ktsevens]

For more accurate PH readings in liquid mixture, best to use distilled water.

[@SpreadingKnowledgeVlogs]

So true I had went threw this conundrum when testing plant fertilizers for pH

[@AudiS5Automatic]

Take your confusion about the soap pH out on that lonely sunjoe right there.

[@gammalight1312]

You should buy some high quality PH paper, pipettes and a liquid PH tester kit. Digital testers are extremely sensitive and don't do well with any kind of concentrate. That digital tester is good but it's really more for testing organic water quality then it is for chemical tests. P.S. I'm basically a PH wizard ;]

[@gammalight1312]

To be more specific, after a consumer digital PH tester sees concentrations over 1800 PPM or TDS, the scaling for PH begins to degrade. Even in most controlled scientific applications they'll dilute the sample solution with a neutral base untill the PPM / TDS is within the testers calculable spec's, usually under 800 PPM. The lower the PPM the more accurate the PH will be, generally speaking. I'd expect a 750 PPM soap solution to show a 7 PH in a liquid PH tester as well as a paper PH test. Just make sure your soap dilutions for A, B and C all have the same PPM before testing for PH.

[@IntervalePC]

Great video, Matt👍👍 Just for fun with the kids try mixing equal parts of the pH buffers(calibration solutions) into a cup & watch when you mix them that the colors are completely gone and you have a clear solution.

[@phasmata3813]

Reinforces my belief that pH is not as important or influential as people want to believe it is. Sure, it's a factor, but there is soooo much more going on in the chemistry of these soaps than just their concentration of H+ ions. I'm guessing it's just that most people have a basic grasp on what pH is and what it can mean that it's easy for them to fixate on that rather. To start paying attention to chelates, surfactants, detergents, salts, foaming agents, scents, colors, local water chemistry... it gets overwhelming.

[@dustin3700]

I've gone through all of different prewash and wash methods through the years as a detailer and my final method for vehicles about to be prepped for a correction is snow+ or a apc diluted in a foam cannon or sprayerdepending on condition followed by a rinseless wash solution with 4 mitts no reducing and for well protected vehicles I pre spray with rinseless wash then rinse and do a wash with a rinseless wash. Cheap, effective and simple method without spending over 100 bucks a gallon for presoaks and soaps which is awsome marketing results to get ppl to pay over 200 bucks for a prewash and soap. Also PH definitely isn't the end all be all of cleaning power.

[@bpsdetailing8822]

Interesting, this explains why some products work great for some people and not for others. There have been a few products that I like that you don't, and ones you like that I don't based purely on how well they work. The products that we have differing opinions on have all been for exterior detailing - probably purely due to us living on the opposite sides of the country. I am in Oregon - so NW vs SE - and I would say that my vetting process for products is similar to yours. All about that water and climate!

[@joshtobin8302]

Hey Matt. Just a thought but what if you mixed them in clean glass containers with precise measurements using a glass stick to mix. I'm wondering if when you put your finger in the bottle to shake the mixture if you might be introducing something from your skin that could be affecting the end result. I love watching these long videos about things that most never think of. Keep them coming and thanks for the content.

[@AaronMelendez23]

JOSH TOBIN not to mention blowing into the sensors, our saliva is slightly acidic. But I definitely appreciate the work

[@draxxes1]

You also have to account for your pH meter margin of error. Some meters will have a margin of error between 0.2-0.5 +/- I have 4 pH meter for my fish tank and all 4 will read different pH even after calibration. Also, off the shelf distilled water isn't to the standard of lab chemistry testing, you are better off using RO/DI water for more accurate and stable reading. The more you dive into chemistry the more complex it gets. There are some instance where you can add high alkaline product on a neutral pH water and will have a reverse effect on the pH and go bellow neutral base on your negative/positive ion bonding and precipitating out of solution.

[@paulfarmer6498]

How kind is Dave from P&S? Just a wealth of knowledge and willing to share it!

[@SWAGURA]

Ph neutral is 7, anything higher is alkaline. That being said, if a soap with a PH of 7.8 starts stripping your protection, then you're protection was weak from the beginning, a good quality sealent can handle a ph up to like 9.6

[@EdvardsAntonovs]

And yet something like Bilt Hamber autofoam has pH of 12 or 13 yet is wax safe, let alone sealant safe. pH isn't everything. You can't judge the stripping power of something just by pH. If we could, such products would be easier to produce and we wouldn't have so many issues with stripping paint. For now the only real way is to polish.

[@SWAGURA]

@@EdvardsAntonovs I agree, ph if anything is a baseline.

[@ImBarryScottCSS]

Autofoam is heavily diluted by the time it hits the panel so it's effective PH at that point will be way below the quoted 9.6 (no source though).

[@Darkhunter218]

@@ImBarryScottCSS PIR should be 1-4% so it should definitely be diluted enough to lower the PH

[@FlipnKraut]

33:52 Matt uses the NES method of fixing issues

[@SpreadingKnowledgeVlogs]

What towel is that your using? Looks like a damn good towel knowing who the man using it is that likely is a damn good towel hence why I'm wondering what type it is.

[@doublesdetailer7709]

I felt your pain on this experiment. Awesome vlog. Keep pushing through life detailing conundrums

[@maryb.9391]

So..The water activates the sodiums in the soap creating a stronger PH solution. Distilled water and the Decon soap in a cannon would Rock !

[@TomB1988]

This was really interesting. Thanks, Matt. Hyper Wash seems decent. Adam's is very expensive compared to the higher concentrated stuff on the market and is the only reason I don't use it.

[@cls63amgwagon34]

Yeah acid base reactions are not always intuitive, but as a few people have noted, to keep it simple, there are a myriad of chemical reactions that can happen with given chemicals and the soap and minerals in the water

[@bigbadbri08]

If temp has an effect maybe will mixing you are raising the temp cause of friction in the bottle try adding just the tap water into the bottle and agitating it and see if it rises

[@collinhopper7542]

Heh, I literally just bought my self pH test strips to do the same thing, but mainly for testing pH of the foam on the car. pH is one of the many colligative properties that make some soaps heads and shoulders better than others. Also started using HyperWash full time, I love its slickness. One tid-bit, poor the gallon with the label to the floor, no more shloshing the ridiculous PF-22 over. With the rising pH, you may also be running into contamination with the 'rinse' cup. Of course I type this w/out watching the entire video.

[@bbdetailing9123]

"do it, do it" - that gave me a chuckle.

[@Curryolla]

The chelating agent idea sounds logical considering minerals binded to hydroxal (-OH) are dropped out to reduce the effect of water spotting. Therefore, [-OH] concentration increases. The only other thing I can think of is ionization of the salts in the soap. The increased ions, if reactive enough can react with water, create [-OH] ions and increase the pH. Who knows, but the MSDS does show many salts (most sodium based). PS...I'm loving these videos. You don't know how badly I've wanted to sneak some car products into my lab to test them. Pretty sure my Professor would kick me out if he found out!

[@xaye24]

Where did u get those cool spray bottles on the top of the cabinets from?

[@Antimatter.]

Hi Matt, thanks for the test but I think everyone here watching it doesn’t matter if it strips the paint Protection , I’m sure most of us apply some kind of protection after every other or even every wash , I use Bead maker after every wash for a drying aid , so if the soap did strip the protection off I’m putting it right back on , this test is for people that wax their cars once a year , but very interesting.

[@maxwired2235]

I just tried Adams Mega Foam and it's incredible, great lubricity and very thick clinging foam. Have you used it?

[@ObsessedGarage]

I haven't used it yet.

[@dossegundos7145]

Love all the extra details for extra knowledge 👍🏻

[@violetandi]

Thanks for all the in depth videos. Do plan to do a similar test on shop vacs like you did on the pressure washers? Or do you have a recommendation?

[@ObsessedGarage]

Yes, I will be chasing that some day soon.

[@perfectman3077]

DI does not necessarily have a pH of 7.00. Solutions that have a very low ionic strength do not respond well to pH meters.

[@obliviondio]

The gallon bucket would be great since hyper wash says 1oz for every 5 gallons.

[@rayfisher4665]

Why don't you use water from the CR spotless. That most of us use. Now I know we don't wash with this but it would be nice to see if we used that to fill with. Thanks Matt as always 👍

[@evergreenenduro]

Was just thinking about this over the weekend. Thanks for doing the leg work to test these. So in the real world, do you notice a difference between Adams and the hyperwash as far as removal or degradation of wax/coatings?

[@ObsessedGarage]

I do not.

[@james27092709]

Very nice. Did you check meter with calibration fluid? My probe in my saltwater tank (Apex) varies and I think needs to be replaced every few years.

[@ObsessedGarage]

Yes, that was the yellow and pink solutions.

[@darsuz9994]

@@ObsessedGarage you need 3 soultions, low, mid and high to get an accurate calibration

[@ObsessedGarage]

I had buffer 10 as well. The Milwaukee manual didn't call for it.

[@milkmanfitness]

I love that you drive yourself crazy about these things so don’t have to

[@GTUniverseOfficial]

Great work with the little experiment, not bad results 👍

[@KelvyGoveo]

This was a very interesting video and its making me think on how I mix my soap in my bucket. does it matter if you mix your soap solution with hot water vs cold water ?

[@ObsessedGarage]

Heat would make it a little more soluble.

[@ImBarryScottCSS]

How many soaps are we using at dilution ratios where there effective PH would be anything other than nominally different to our diluents PH? I'd wager very few, even on a strip wash we don't use *that* much product. This would suggest that the common attitude that the alkalinity of the soap is what gives it it's stripping capabilities is wrong and that Dave Phillips suggestion that the alkalinity of stripping soaps is inconsequential to their actual stripping power is closer to the mark.

[@TheRealAbsorber]

Is it your foam bottle completely clean/sterile? I wonder if there are chemicals in it that area raising the PH?

[@mpoppe]

"The answer is basically nothing " LOL !!! Stay calm Matt, let's not go crazy with PH !!! LOL

[@steveyoung3044]

I wonder if oxygen is being mixed in with the soap and water. In the world of salt water fish tanks people try to dissolve more oxygen in to the water to raise the pH to around 8. I think the big take away from this video is that pH isnt the only thing when it comes to soap.

[@whiteywho7151]

Have you done any chemical guys reviews/testing Matt? Or is the chemical guys products junk? Thank you

[@ObsessedGarage]

I wouldn't say they are junk, but they aren't worthwhile. They are just marketing products that happen to be used for cleaning cars.

[@AZDESERT2024]

Not sure this test proves much. You don't wash with pure soap . The actual test should be according to manufacturers instructions - ex. 1oz to 2gallons of water etc.

[@ObsessedGarage]

I'm testing soap as I use it in the foam cannon.

[@AZDESERT2024]

But the soap isn't sprayed on the car as it is concentrated in the foamer - it's highly diluted with additional water from the pressure washer. Maybe , spray the foamer into a bucket and measure ph as it would be when actually applied to the car.

[@ObsessedGarage]

Ah...that's a darn good point. I didn't even think of that one.

[@michaelkenney2845]

Ph of the soap is kinda DEPENDENT on the Ph of the water. So if your using tap water in one town with good Ph then drive to another and use horrible tap water... .obviously its gonna screw with things.

[@willdamian1066]

Have you tried p&s pearl shampoo. How does it compare to adams shampoo?

[@ObsessedGarage]

Yes, I have. It doesn’t foam well. I think Adams is much better.

[@sensoryoverload8915]

Great video, I always enjoy it and feel a little bit better about myself! Lol.

[@mariodesmo]

Now that you have all that soap mixed up and ready to go, you should have a car wash party!

[@cobra454tim]

The guy on the phone sounds familiar is that one of the brothers from P&S I can’t remember if his name is Phil?

[@ObsessedGarage]

Dave

[@kirkcameron620]

you didnt think about the fact that water has a ph of 7

[@camver100]

Did they let you get your hands on angel wax h2go /ti02 and angelwax enigma aio ?

[@ObsessedGarage]

Yes, I have those in the corner cabinet.

[@camver100]

Obsessed Garage I’m very excited to see what you think of h2go and AIO

[@abTraX95]

People actually do stuff like this ? I came here just to learn how to detail. This is like practicing for an s.a.t

[@nandor690]

“Do it! Do it! Do it!” 😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@CW-oh2lp]

Absolutely amazing content. Thanks, Matt

[@darrentsosie6334]

This video does not need to be 3/4s of an hour.

[@jayz313]

So is Meg's Hyper Wash the new official OG Soap?

[@ObsessedGarage]

I'm not quite sure yet. I need to use it a bit more.

[@benedekszuts1306]

Is there a m3 carbon intake on the shelf in the backround💪👌😎

[@ObsessedGarage]

Yep!

[@UaeDelta]

Where are all the chemists in the comments below, please chime in.

[@steveanimatrix3887]

Which color would you like to do first? Purple? Ok, let's do blue lol.

[@riccardopavan5209]

the lower the ph, the more acid it is. higher the ph, the more basic. right?

[@beauward4415]

Riccardo Pavan correct

[@cobra454tim]

Yep that’s why I love using DI water for everything are use it in my ONR, I have free access to it because our lab at the winery has a DI system!

[@Jeeper1378]

Reset??

[@mikeshevlin]

HAs anyone tried Chem-X ? Stars and Stripes. Amazing soap. Check out his website. Literally don't have to touch the car if you follow the directions.

[@henrycollins2478]

The problem with soaps like that is that they aren’t pH neutral, which is so they can clean “effectively” then there’s the discussion of what does the cleaning, the physical touching of the paint or the soap.

[@epicon6]

More F10 M5!

[@jackemerson1171]

Thought your Decon soap was higher than that

[@ObsessedGarage]

Me too.

[@DevonRegan]

I see that new "stupid joe" in the background

[@SuperDave21]

Is there calcium in the tap water Matt?

[@ObsessedGarage]

There likely is.

[@acrviper10]

Now matt can sleep at night lol 😆

[@ObsessedGarage]

Ha, ha... I thik this may have open up Pandora's box of curiosity even more.

[@acrviper10]

Obsessed Garage keep it up Matt were all a sucker for the data ahaha make a shirt saying that lol

[@kennyweaver3597]

Boot that meter out the door Matt lol

[@TheSamMabe]

it's been a while since we've seen Matt throw something in the woods......

[@kennyweaver3597]

@@TheSamMabe lol yeah

[@robmarrow9778]

m5 update?

[@ObsessedGarage]

Parts are rolling in. Dinan stuff will be here tomorrow. I'm going to start paint correction in two weeks. I'm headed to Seattle next week.

[@ralphralphin]

Another long video bro, Man you have been putting in the hours lately.

[@ImBarryScottCSS]

Sooooooo... Chemistry is hard.

[@Bran252]

360p?

[@r3ktfahdle120]

Rendering

[@nyusufffff]

be patient...

[@Jeeper1378]

I like turtles:)

[@mikeburr114]

nineteenth

[@frankcasendino8662]

Waste of time