The 800cc Years: The Most HATED Bikes in MotoGP History

[@SuperbikeJohn]

What do you think about the 800cc era and its legacy in MotoGP? Did it deserve the criticism it received, or was it a necessary step in the sport's evolution?

[@yogibarista2818]

Sorry, but I disagree that the engine size has much to do with the quality of racing. It's always been about the contact patch and the available grip from the combination of tyres and now electronics and aerodynamics. Dial back the size of tyres and their level of grip, and you will inevitably increase the differential in cornering & braking that everyone is nostalgic for.

[@tjroelsma]

I see it as one of those decisions that are driven by panic only, just like many decisions in other race sports, like F1 for example. Something goes wrong, often catastrophically, and the panic reaction is to immediately scream "the bikes/cars are too fast" and decide on the spot that they must be banned and replaced by slower bikes/cars. Those slower bikes/cars then don't take long to be even faster than their predecessors, as engineers always find ways to make things faster.

[@derekcharlesgrey]

800 CC twins are gonna be the new middleweight bikes I think

[@ktkace]

@@yogibarista2818 ur just one data point man .

[@ktkace]

If not for superstars like rossi and stoner , no one would be watching the 800cc , bloody POS's

[@lukemiller_6]

I'm concerned about the likely return of 800s for 2027, for me, the litre bikes are iconic

[@SuperbikeJohn]

I understand, they surely can’t repeat the same mistakes again.

[@lukemiller_6]

@@SuperbikeJohn surely! I wonder if it'll be a great opportunity for Honda and Yamaha :)

[@Team-fabulous]

Why does this notion of yours concern you..

[@PallesWorld6309]

Concerned?... Perhaps you should be looking at Tennis instead...But Ok....Look out for the Balls...

[@Team-fabulous]

@@PallesWorld6309 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🏁🏁🏁🏁

[@richardhall5489]

I think the saddest thing about the 800cc era was the death of Marco Simoncelli. It felt like if he could have survived until the end of the 2011 season he would have been competitive and spectacular on a 1000cc bike.

[@nsr150sp1]

super sic death was on a rc213v, not rc212v, Rossi already moved to ducati that season

[@mArvAlcao71]

@@nsr150sp1 no mate. He was aboard the 800cc RC212V when he died. The RC213V is 1000cc

[@nsr150sp1]

@@mArvAlcao71 as i remember, the year rossi moved to ducati is the year motogp change from 800cc to 1000cc

[@mArvAlcao71]

@@nsr150sp1 Rossi spent the last year of the 800 and the first of the 1000 era with Ducati.

[@RANDOMZBOSSMAN1]

I agree with the much higher HP for the 1000cc era it would have negated the massive weight disadvantage Marco had in comparison to other riders who were much smaller

[@blakebikess]

well this didnt age well

[@33alltheway14]

Why idk shit about bikes

[@recalculationdaduck8841]

@@33alltheway14 motogp is planning to switch from 1000cc to 850cc in 2027

[@RambO5018]

@@recalculationdaduck8841 i just hope they won´t. They´ll lose me as a spectator

[@adamsjoberrg]

I remember the 800cc era with fondness. On the track, they looked so fast and they were stunning to watch. And the rules made it possible for example for Stoner and Lorenzo to take drastically different approaches and riding styles and don't forget the fact that there were different tire manufacturers. The problem today is that the tires are so limiting and the rear height devices together with aero make the bikes so stable that it looks very solid and everyone needs to have nearly the same way of working which to me is a bit sad. Racing is good though in a way even if it's a little "plastic".

[@radost0514]

go for WSBK ..its way better to watch

[@Sprocket74]

​@@radost0514May be a stupid question but where can you watch WSBK live? Or where's the easiest way to watch it? Thanks in advance

[@radost0514]

@@Sprocket74 i dont know i download it from traker and watch it on tape :) but its still nice

[@radost0514]

@@Sprocket74 i donloaded from torrent

[@matthewsalisbury4789]

WSBK is on Eurosport.

[@mylexicon2]

Kato was the catalyst, but not the reason. Jerry Burgess remarked on several occasions that the manufacturers were stunned when Dorna made plans for a 990cc 4-stroke class. Many of the Japanese manufacturers and teams thought it would be closer to 600cc than 1000cc. When Kato died the MSMA made their move against the 990s. The issue with the 800s was that they kept power roughly the same as the 990s by raising the rev ceiling, but they reduced fuel capacity. That’s what required the crazy electronics and deprived fans and riders of superfluous torque.

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Nice explanation. Thanks!

[@bobbifumi2006]

Katos death I don't think was due to power. I thought back end slipped and flicked him direction of the wall?

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Correct, but it seemed that the organisers of Motogp at the time concluded it was due to power. The official inquiry into his death never once mentioned that the speed killed him. Most likely it was the angle of impact on the barriers.

[@AlonsoRules]

typical overreaction to a death caused by angled walls

[@vsmaster6162]

Not overreaction. The real reason behind it was Honda who wanted to make the perfect bike for Pedrosa. The change to the 800 was never about safety but for Honda to start winning again​@@AlonsoRules

[@zogzoogler]

I would argue that 97-98 was the worst. Doohan dominance as a parade, 500s ‘tamed’, ultimately giving WSB and the panel bashing Fogarty, Edwards, Bayliss, the real showtime.

[@bearcatracing007]

Agree 100%

[@zogzoogler]

1997 500s race winners, Doohan, Criville, Okada. Doohan winning 12 of 15 races. Meanwhile in WSB, Kocinski, Slight, Chili, Fogarty, Haga, Yanagawa across 24 races on Ducati, Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki. Man I miss that type of racing.

[@Andy-co6pn]

Yeah people forget that the 500cc championship became unwatchable, the racing wasn't all that in the Doohan era .

[@AlonsoRules]

Doohan had no competition once Wayne Rainey went down. 5 years of boredom.

[@blantant]

Doohan era definitely the most boring

[@Jezzaj167]

Please do longer form videos, mini docs on motogp, bsb, wsb, etc, it would be great, I love learning new things and hearing good stories on the bike racing genre. Your voice makes for easy listening. Thanks for the videos so far !!!

[@colinstewart1432]

Paradoxically, the era everyone absolutely loves is 500cc Strokers. This is true in Superbikes as well as GPs.

[@derjaxxer]

Honestly massive probs for the video, i was shocked when i saw you "only" have 1500 subs. Keep up!

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Thank you. Lots more to come!

[@PhilipBurton-dn3ce]

Dont agree on one tyre brand at all....."how does that tyre work...lets design a bike around that tyres performance"

[@madguitarist63]

It makes sense though as today the limits are the tire not the engine. So you have to build to the tire "No such thing as too much horsepower, just not enough traction" - Carroll Shelby

[@Flamewake]

I'm not really a moto-gp fan, but as a racing fan, I'd recommend you look into the NASCAR tire wars or the F1 2005 US grand prix. Multiple tire makers has historically never been a good idea

[@bourbonyoung6237]

So it’s more about the electronics than the capacity. Despite the comments about bigger equals better. The 500’s had less power but were infinitely better to watch than the 800’s and the current aero liter bikes.

[@Worther12]

I personally don't hate the 800cc era, but i don't like the modern aero technology. It makes the bikes less classically beautiful....

[@Pwnz0rh3nk]

Luckily there will be less aero from 2027 on

[@TheInfantry98]

Your extremely wrong grandpa

[@loslogo]

@@TheInfantry98aero is pretty goofy. Even worse on road bikes

[@BastardX13]

They're looking a.little crustaceous these days.

[@itsmebatman]

The 800s had their charm. I liked how they shook up the pecking order. The dangerous highside accidents were not really due to the bikes, but because of the tires. The tire manufacturers tried to make their rubber so they would be great in ideal conditions and last a race distance. But that meant they were dangerous in non-optimal conditions. And because they were meant to last it took the riders too long to get them warmed up. Can't blame that on the 800cc bikes.

[@dikkado]

I hope in the 2027, there were more overtaking from start to finish. For a past few years, we only seen fight in the start of the race and the last of 6 laps because the tires can't handle the speed. In between of those laps, we almost don't see any battles, you can just do your things in your house and come back to 6 last laps and you don't miss anything. I don't mind they reduce the CCs, but I just hope there's more spectacle races like the old days.

[@kevinbezal5739]

Maybe the 800cc era wasn't successful in achieving safety nd lesser crashes but as a motogp fan, glad the experiment took place, the variety of multiple tyre manufacturers was interesting and watching Casey Stoner slip nd slide, Lorenzo, Pedrosa carry maximum corner speed nd ofcouse "the doctor" battle it out together, the extraterrestrials was special.

[@mikeyerke3920]

500GP is a tough act to follow. 🏁👍🏻

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Never saw a race live, but I was deafened by a 50cc bike at the Goodwood Festival of Speed. That was just onebike, so I can't imagine what a race sounded like, live.

[@mikeyerke3920]

@@SuperbikeJohn Nothing like the sound of the two strokes!

[@Jimmie92]

What, watching Doohan win by 15 seconds for the most of the 500’s years?

[@mikeyerke3920]

@@Jimmie92There were a lot more interesting characters than Doohan. Please go away.

[@Jimmie92]

@@mikeyerke3920 tbf mate rose tinted glasses do hurt the eyes. Jokes aside, every era had its greatness, for sure man.

[@thebigd9989]

Sadly we are going back to 850 cc 😢

[@Mangiapizza01]

2027 be' like: oh shit, here we go again

[@FlipWarBucks]

“The bikes were too quick” Today tho 😂

[@mrpalaces]

Great video. I've been following MotoGP for the past 3 years, but I still have much to learn about its history

[@fadhelfarras1175]

people hate the Idea of reducing the capacity from 1000cc to 850cc because how bad it was in 800cc era, but from your explanation, the main problem is not the capacity itself, but the electronics, and tbh, the electronics also become a problem today, today the problem are the electronic + aerodynamic, so if they reduced the electronic aid, I don't see any problem with the 2027 regulations, the one problem I see from the 2027 regulations is Moto2, if they decided to reduced MotoGP's engine capacity, they also need to reduced Moto2's engine capacity, I mean the gap is too close from 765cc to 850cc, at least reduced it to 600cc just like in 2010-2018

[@freesoul85vis]

The 800cc era was better than the "aero+1000cc" era we have now. The operating margin now is very less due to aero and tyre temperatures, outbraking is more risky as braking distances have reduced due to the front aero. Acceleration off corners are no longer fully "throttle control and managing wheelie" based, instead the ride height devices take over. This era is more about the bike & tyre than the rider compared to what the 800s were. 800s had epic battles between Stoner, Lorenzo, Rossi & Pedrosa. Stoner power sliding the bike and on the edge riding style taking on Lorenzo's smooth and flowing style. 800s allowed different kinds of riding styles to be competitive on different machinery. Sadly don't think that is the case now.

[@miguelramalhao6510]

Unfortunately, this seems to be the case in F1 too. Both pinnacle of motorsport in 4 wheels and 2 wheels rely incredibly on eletronics and aero package. Basically no matter how good you are, Lewis Hamilton or Marc Marques, if you have a bad car/bike the chance of you winning something is very low. I think the golden era of motorsport was the 2000's, when the cars/bikes were well developed but not *that* well developed and you could make miracles, be far behind and still win somehow. Those were the days.

[@Arrow12212]

So it's more of a I would rather 5 riders dominate bc they are better than 5 riders dominate bc the bikes are better? At the end 5 riders are still dominatjn😂 they say the lower cc and less aero will make it more competitive then in yalls case real skills will show thst 5 riders will just dominate everyone. So instead of ig ducati gp it will just be ( I'm using mm93 as my example) it will just be Marquez GP which is still boring in ur ideals 😐. Complain when a company is just doing good, well when 1 rider shows he just better and you turn it on and you alr know who's going to win then wouldn't be the same thing?

[@Scoots1994]

I heard a suspension tech on the same team as Stoner that those years the computer was doing more than the rider. They were literally telling Casey that he could pin the throttle and the bike would stay on the track.

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Very probably true.

[@Scoots1994]

@@SuperbikeJohn I do love tech in racing, but I think it's better in F1 than on bikes because the difference of the rider is so much greater on bikes than cars, and from that perspective F1 is already lost :) When they started using optical sensors to measure the direction of travel and yaw by literally looking at the track go by on a bike and added GPS for location based throttle control I really thought it would be outlawed.

[@mrbungle3310]

Im glad i got reccomended this,im a MotoGP noob and im tired of f1 videos because i know everything

[@suzukishogun1192]

I follow MotoGP since 2000 (formerly known as GP 500) but i admit it WSBK is more interesting these days than MotoGP.

[@SuperbikeJohn]

The appeal of WSBK is that is is relatively simple. Tyre wear is much easier to understand than tyre pressures for example. The first two weekends of this year has produced fantastic racing.

[@renorailfanning5465]

I think it was to help some of the smaller Spanish riders coming up through the ranks. Dorna's HQ was in Spain. I'm probably wrong, but I do remember that being some of the talk back in that era.

[@renorailfanning5465]

On a side note. My reasoning that Rossi is the GOAT is because he won on 125's, 250's, 500's 990's and 800's. Just my opinion.

[@Maidenintime86]

I'm not sure if racing with 800s was more boring than the previous bikes but I've certainly watched some pretty boring races from that era, it was usually either Lorenzo or Stoner just getting away at front and no one could catch them, don't know if that had to do with the bikes or if they were simply too strong compared to the rest, but one spectacular race from that time was the epic 3 way battle between Dani, Rossi and Stoner at Barcelona 2007, that race was better than the one between Rossi and Lorenzo at the same track because Dani was there too, fantastic race.

[@LongWeiner-x9y]

I liked the 800s...lighter and they revved the crap out of them to regain the power from displacement loss....really cool bikes

[@purwantiallan5089]

We could see the impending return of 800cc in 2026.

[@elcobra98]

This is an amazing documentation video. Is there a chance you could be talking about CRT bikes from the early 2010s in the future? Cheers John!

[@SuperbikeJohn]

I’ve just uploaded one on that exact subject an hour ago!👍

[@elcobra98]

​@@SuperbikeJohn Talk about express delivery. Thanks a bunch, will watch at night. Cheers!

[@JOLI144]

and nowadays with the aerodynamic sorcery come to play, I think MotoGP progressing into a more exciting territories.

[@dontaskme7004]

Towards the end you highlight the increase in certain accidents, it happens in many ways across all domains when technology is in control. People come to rely on the object (in this case the bike) doing it for them, but a slight alteration in a single qaulity/quantity (tyre temp) can cause a total catastrophic failure and the person either doesn't know what to do or isn't allowed (by the object) to do anything to solve it in the moment. New inventions/technology are hailed as progress, but all too often they strip of us of a mental or physical capability, and all we do is regress... If you never learn to read a map then what do you do when your satnav dies while you're driving? You sit there trapped in a state of incapability that in some ways you chose to be in.

[@MisterAki43]

Really enjoyed this video. Didn't you make a video about the backmarkers of GP saving Ducati? Where did that one go?

[@SuperbikeJohn]

I did, but it got took down by doorna for copyright infringement (I’ve sacked the editor). I’m going to reproduce it again over the weekend.

[@HarryTaylor91]

Great video John, pleased your channel popped up on my suggested.

[@donachille3351]

I grew up in the 800cc era. There are so many iconic moments, and the bikes were high revving and exciting to me

[@dammdaniel9953]

You need check your audio man too much high frequencies need to tune a little bit down it hurts to hear all the shhs shhhs ccccss throughout the video

[@kerimca98]

Bruh even I noticed this as deaf guy with hearing device

[@rorywoods2144]

It's getting to the stage now that WSB is more exciting to watch rather thank the motogp because of all these new aeros and electronics

[@theant9821]

What are you talking about? Wsbk hasn't come close to Motogp since 2002 Bayliss vs Edwards. Its had brief resurgencies but never reached the heights of 90s early 2000s when it was undoubtedly the greatest world championship. Apparently the British round of wsbk one year had 4x as many spectators as the British Motorcycle grand prix. Bsb is better than wsbk at the moment i think, simply for its better rulebook which makes better racing and the bikes better to watch. If Toprak wasn't there WSBK would just be bautista clearing off into the distance. He's artificially made the championship better than the rules allow by being the best rider not on the best bike.

[@vincentmamotos9937]

I had no idea that electronics can track the GPS and make adjustments base on corners. That is absolutely bonkers to me.

[@evilelf5967]

get rid of all the electronics and let them just race,be way more entertaining than watching a procession every weekend.

[@mArvAlcao71]

Tbf I think it would be weird to see MotoGP race without electronics yet the superbikes still has it (No way they could get rid of it). Put that aside, I do wish the reduced aero in MotoGP

[@Maidenintime86]

Races during the 500 with no electronics were WAY worse than this, it was Honda in the top 5 all the time and hardly any battles, get your facts right before you say things like that, good or bad racing has nothing to do with electronics because again the 500s didn't have any and racing was awful, every Race Honda would pretty much lock out the podium, racing today is better than that crap whether you believe it or not, pretty much anyone has a chance to win on any bike if they are feeling good when Sunday comes, back in the day, if you didn't have the best bike, you weren't going to win, Phillip Island in 2022 was a lot better than any crap during the 500s days, 8 riders fighting for the win, I'm sure that didn't happen in the '90s.

[@kotnn-g]

I agree but sadly true motorcycle racing is over. Except for BSB I think everyone else uses electronics

[@chriswest2290]

It's strange how people think the manufacturers go racing just for the fans. They race to develope technologies for their road bike. These equal sales.

[@qaywsxefb]

Well, my man, thats basically the nature of human beings. Improving until everything is as perfect as it gets, boom, boring. With Acosta vs Marquez vs Binder vs Bagnaia vs Martin, i think its one of the most exciting season since a decade or what. Obviously races are not as entertaining as they were in the past, but if you watch motogp for pure driving entertainment, you should consider Moto2, Moto3 WSKB or basically any other racing series you can watch. I still wanna say, i dont really like how motogp is evolving aswell due to the missing entertainment factor. But its MotoGP. This Racing series is to build the fastest Bike on Earth and seeing them crushing records like nothing ist extremely rewarding as a viewer. So, adjust your expectations rather than bragging about how boring motogp has become.

[@ROBERTSMITH-io7tb]

Not trying to take anything away from Stoner but Honda and Yamaha were having a major title battle during 2006 which left Ducati miles ahead of development on the 800cc

[@jezza4193]

I have been watching MotoGP since the early 80's as a kid. The 800 era was definitely not the worst racing but I think spectators want to see big power bikes that only the best and bravest riders dare ride. For me the dominance of Ducati with all the wings, ride height and electronics is getting like F1. The times are faster but the racing suffers. Look at Misano a few weeks ago, a absolute snooze.

[@flaviov303]

800cc are still better than the todays bike with all the shitti aero

[@Scouse.Malinois]

Better, as in looks?..... Unfortunately mate it's a race not a Beauty contest

[@michaellavery4899]

Great video. That's how to summarise history.

[@andredeketeleastutecomplex]

In my years I liked 2 types of racing. The 500's when manufacturers went wild, and the superbikes with the privateer teams. Moto GP is just meh to me. Most of all I enjoyed WSB when the bikes were 750cc for V4, and (I believe) 900cc for twins. Honda RC30 and Ducati 888, stunning bikes with great performance, real grand prix bikes in my view.

[@Reznor_Meeks]

I think the 800cc period the bikes took a step down from the spotlight, I think Rossi, Stoner, Pedrosa, and Lorenzo ("aliens") with the race in between these talents made MotoGP far more interesting than what we have today. to me the 990's will always be king, but between today's MotoGP and 800cc era, 800 all the way.

[@elliottbailey2522]

@3:50 the REAL machine learning

[@patmays7344]

Casey Stoner didn’t seem to mind them? And also there should be more than one tire manufacturer, there should be more tire choices? And all the electronics, should at least be toned down, or gotten rid of, and the wings should be removed , they make overtaking more difficult, as the bike following is made unstable, in the after draft, of the bike in front.

[@Kittysune12]

yeah cuz man have built in throttle control in his own body not everybody is stoner sadly

[@michaelhart5886]

Stoner is simply brilliant

[@atomlurch1]

The current era ist way worst imo, its f1 on 2 wheels...

[@FurryestX]

Bro, ducati was secretly experi.enting with wings since before 2015, if it wasnt for that, we wpuld have a INCREDIBLE CHAMPIONSHIP BATTLES... Still, aprillia and KTM are getting closer race by race At least, its not like Max Verstappen in F1

[@atomlurch1]

@@FurryestX ofc ducati earned their success but the racing is dogshit. Winglets/tire pressure and ride height device are ruining racing, everyone is managing tires 90% of the race. Just watch one weekend if superbike and you will agree that gp isnt it at the moment

[@sarezfx]

​@@atomlurch1totally agree, it's "watch start" then "turn in for the last two laps, because everyone is just managing tyres anyway, because of dirty air"

[@Toro_Da_Corsa]

​@@FurryestXIt doesn't compare at all. The guy couldn't have watched MGPlast year

[@yasgamer]

⁠@@FurryestXreplace Ducati with Mercedes and wings with v6 hybrid engines and it’s mercedes 2014 to the dot lol

[@doublea-on-dexx]

great video, although I disagree. I find that period to have some of the most exhilarating races with great competition! Bikes looked phenomenal too..

[@ThatDepressionGuy]

I've been watching 500's and motogp for a long time and there are a lot of the greats saying for a long time that there's to much tech and not enough emphasis on rider skill and I agree , I understand the need for safety but we are loosing the essence of what racing should be ! I don't want motogp to turn into F1 where races are won by the teams who have the biggest budget not the best driver's!

[@nsr150sp1]

2008 m1 was the most beautiful m1 till now!

[@SuperbikeJohn]

I agree with that. They were perfect looking bikes.

[@geoffheard5768]

Seems to me, the whole MotoGP/F1 thing is the result of what happens, when you let corporations run things, without oversight, or control.

[@motogp4658]

Im not sure if it’s a good decision to go back to the 800cc because in theory will make the bikes slower, I think they want to help Yamaha and Honda to be on front. Maybe remain with the 1 litre but with heavy aero and electronics regulations could work too but idk.

[@TomHenksYT]

I don't think going down to 800cc will change much. If Yamaha and Honda are the teams that can't keep up with the power levels of, say, Ducati at 1000cc, then they likely won't get the same performance as Ducati at 800cc either. Sure, everyone's power figures will be lower with 800cc than with 1000cc, but the stack will probably remain pretty much unchanged.

Really well explained, mate. Thank you.

[@lastgentleman8099]

I don't see how Kato's death in 2003 made them change to 800cc in 2007. What I remember everyone talking about was how fast the 990cc were in 2006 and that switching to 800cc would lower the speeds. However, after the first 800cc ducati proto being tested by Capirossi, in 2006, was already beating lap records Dora decided to reduce the fuel capacity from 22 to 21L. That pushed the teams to increase electronics and made the 2007 Ducati worst for Capirossi.

[@lastgentleman8099]

The same argument is being made today and I fear that the new 850cc in 2027 will bring new problems...

[@lastgentleman8099]

Also the switch to 800cc was detrimental to Team Roberts and Kawasaki who were both becoming very competitive by the end of 2006.

[@RANDOMZBOSSMAN1]

@@lastgentleman8099Yup basically ended Team Roberts in MotoGP and Kawasaki never recovered and the economic downturn ended their participation

[@queenslander954]

Well Stoner kicked Rossi’s arse in the 800cc era by a dozen races & then Marquez kicked Rossi’s arse in the 990 by the huge margin in the head to heads of 56 wins to only 10 for Rossi , so much for being the GOAT

[@ropany]

I suspect that being called the goat has to do with what Rossi had accomplished on 125s, on 250s, on 500s and on 990 Honda as well as Yamaha, well before Stoner won his first championship ever by beating Rossi in 2007.... as for Marquez: Rossi was already well out of his prime years by the time the two raced together, but still was a force to be reckoned with

[@tamasvarga67]

How many WC Stoner or MM won and in how many categories on how many bikes? MM won 59 races Rossi 89 so MM has a long road to catch up to Rossi. But he’s 14 years younger so he has time… but it doesn’t look like he can really cut it nowadays…

[@99gpandy28]

Be interesting too watch guessing they still be 200+ HP

[@claxxz1]

i think electronic would have developed anyway. having lighter and easier bikes like the 800cc actually gave skilled riders like Stoner to ride LESS dependent to the electronic. that's the reason we saw many different styles of riding between Pedrosa, Lorenzo, Stoner. with 990cc as i said electronic would have developed anyway if not faster and every single rider would have been MORE dependent to that than 800. a bit like today with the aerodinamic. everyone apart from KTM have a very similar style

[@worldtraveler8613]

What i remember about the 800 years was every rider being 5 seconds apart by halfway through thr race 😑

[@nvcnc]

the 800cc makes it sound like a the turbo hybrid switch to f1. maybe good on paper and hoping to reduce costs, control speed, and add interesting technology, only to spiral costs, reduce competitiveness, fans didn't like them, drivers didn't like them, and now we can't wait to get rid of them.

[@zepm7184]

Fans won't notice the difference. The current 1000cc bikes can't even use full power in gears 1-4. They throttle them back by the ECU to keep the front wheel on the ground.

[@InsertNameHere-pk9lx]

Going back to 850cc

[@jfm0155]

Isn't the thumbnail from Valencia 2012? They raced 1000cc bikes that year.

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Lol, you're correct! I always make a mistake in my videos (intentionally or not!). In this instance, I was looking for a specific type of shot and never realised that the other bike was James Ellison on a CRT, whom Lorenzo blamed for the crash. CRT = 2012. The new image is from China 2008.

[@matteocecconi7560]

Stoner was as much faste without the electronic, rider must learn and adapt, the problem was not the 800 cc engine or the bike, it was the regulations like always in motorsport

[@Andy-co6pn]

2007 Ducati made a long low dragster that was tuned with the help of the fuel for max power. The Japanese manufacturers went for small nimble bikes made for high corner speed. Stoner was able to get the Ducati round the corners close enough to the Yamahas and Hondas so he could motor past on the straight. None of the other Ducati riders could ride the bike in that way

[@absolutedan9173]

Great video John! Really enjoyed it!

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Thank you!

[@G-Man01]

Imagine your golden child Muckez on one of these? His already huge crash record would increase exponentially.

[@HEKTIC458]

I really liked the look of the 800s. Way less aero on them.

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Agreed, they were great-looking bikes. Very pure, I'd say.

[@82Bjarni]

I like the 800cc instead of this Ducati GP

[@BlitzkriegRap]

So It’s not the displacement but the era where they introduced ECUs?

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Yes, they went into overdrive with the electronics. If it were up to me the current bikes would have relatively basic controls like the Motec ones used in BSB.

[@3um3le3ees]

I actually really enjoyed this period... 🥴🥴🥴

[@googlreviews7813]

I used to attend multiple races each year, had the privilege meeting several of the riders between 1999 and 2010... I stopped going though and lost interest when electronics took over... Modern MotoGP is all about electronics, not sure why even put riders on these bikes, may as well just have RC racing series.

[@soraaoixxthebluesky]

I hate 800cc era because how big the gap between the 1st and 2nd place vs the rest.

[@DisAstra-qx9gq]

Ive never been a fan of driver/rider assistance. Things like anti wheelie, abs, t/c, auto blip on downshift, esp. Its just to make the bike/car easier to ride/drive and when the computer cant sort it then your on your way to an accident. I was racing a r35 gtr on a track day and you can see the computer reacting to yaw angle, body roll n wheel slip . The car re-adjusts as the computer does its thing. I say racing losely, it took him a lap n half to catch me then pull about 300m on me 😂

[@Maidenintime86]

I don't think it's possible to ride a modern GP rocket without any electronics, I mean, it was possible to do that with 500s because they made half the power of modern bikes, but when you have 300hp and 157kg, trying to ride without electronics is just impossible I think, just imagine how many injuries they'd have every weekend? I'm sure Dorna would have to call off the season due to broken bones, these things are just too fast.

[@DisAstra-qx9gq]

@@Maidenintime86 thats my whole point, the bike does too much work. Accidents are a part of racing regardless of 2 wheels, 4 wheels or even 4 legs. Accidents happen and always will. Those 2 strokes were 180-220bhp. Not that much difference tbf, low down torque is probably the biggest difference but can't find any official figures. Might be an option to go back to 2 strokes if the torque of the 4 strokes is too much for todays rider

[@SN13K3R]

@@DisAstra-qx9gq Though returning to two-strokes is never gonna happen with how the economy is

[@StringTone-t6v]

Ban grip e kebakar temperatur. Karo tengone mesin ning traksi suspensi.

[@fgm1197]

Too complicated, too much electronics and too expensive that's not just a problem in Moto GP... Driving aids and electronic assistants in "civilian" cars and motorcycles is one thing, but motorsport should be kept simple. It should depend on the ability of the driver and not on who has the most money for development.

[@Arrow12212]

So instead of a company dominating you just want 3 riders to dominate? Wouldn't at the end it would be the same? Now it's ye I alr know a ducati rider is going to win but in the future it will be ye I alr know ( ur fav rider) will win. Which is equally as boring. There is a clear skill gap so racing will be the same just 3 riders winning every race

[@adadadatt]

Can you do a video on what happened to Honda!?

[@bartthetreeguy4764]

I want to listen to this but the levels on your audio are blown out and my ears can't handle it. If you still have the files and feel like editing it again I'd be here for it.

[@ralphallen-ch1lt]

John we all love your videos and would much appreciate an induction hob remake or an air fryer video. Many thanks!

[@DaveFerg47]

Most fans only hated it as Rossi was awful in that era. GP fans obsession with him is beyond weird. Was at Silverstone, and an exceptional Stoner getting booed ruined the sport for me

[@Arrow12212]

So you don't like the sport bc people favor one rider more than the others? Typa logic is that😂

[@iceman9678]

One person craps their pants and everyone wears diapers.

[@TWOlb-nn7uw]

800s were lighter needed less electronics. Reved higher and also sounded better. Reminding Stoners Winning bike with the screamer engines.

[@karelpgbr]

I honestly think that the current era is really good, there is good action, the bikes are cool (the aero!!) and they are right between “easy” and “snappy” to ride, which makes for (imho) good single player actions on track.

[@lovelessissimo]

I like the reasoning for the upcoming 800cc GP bikes. It will negate some of the idiocy of aero, it will help with tire management, and put more emphasis on riders competing with each other and not whose bikes are better. Watching Quartararo wallowing in the back is so painful. He's a great rider on a shit bike. Hopefully more manufacturers join up with a lower barrier of entry.

[@TomHenksYT]

I don't think lowering the engine capacity will change much, if anything. MotoGP is and has always been a battle of who can make the most powerful engine within the given rules, and design the bike around it to make it work optimally and handle well. Some manufacturers are better at this than others, and that won't change by lowering the maximum capacity. You'll still see teams that trail behind everyone else down the straights, and it'll likely be the same teams as it would be with the bigger max capacity.

[@lovelessissimo]

@TomHenksYT oh I agree with you 100 percent. In fact, with the new engines, that will be even more so, as the efficacy of aero and tire management will decrease substantially, placing more importance on engines and rider ability.

[@Arrow12212]

Think racing will still be the same. Instead of ducati gp it will be top 3 ridersgp. Same result as racing now you alr know who's going to win bc the skill gap. It's like college football. If you put all the levels together and gave them the same money. The top team will still dominate bc the players are better. Maybe closer games but at the end you can turn on the TV and have a 1/3 chance of guessing who's going to win

[@lovelessissimo]

@montrefletcher8048 not necessarily. The Marquez brothers are a prime example. How well was Marc doing on a bike custom designed around his riding style versus how well is he doing now on a year old duc?

[@TheLiddleBigChannel]

Michelin removed tire models from the allocation which left teams with useless test data. Some bike work better with some tires that others and riders often have a preference for a type of tire carcass and/or compound of a specific manufacturer. Having different tire manufacturers makes for a good equaliser as long as there is enough testing during the season but Motogp is all about sustainability and cost so we'll never see that gain even though we pay a lot more now for tires that ever before. Is it really about sustainability or is it really all about profit?

[@yalvar]

Where is John's accent from?

[@gofigure1171]

Midlands.

[@zidannemaulana1537]

850 cc MotoGP feels like 1.6 litre touring cars with twin turbo and hybrids and also like 2 litre touring cars with single turbo and hybrids as well

[@lukeridley6214]

Crazy for rossi to say anything against electronics, when it was him, burgess and Yamaha that really got it going.

[@fj06carnone]

This video felt a little biased against the 800s. There were so many variables in play it's hard to which one was impacting safety and in what way.

[@captnpsycho8231]

That picture of the full carbon bike @ 2:56 is str8 up moto porn. hnnnnng. Reminds me of early 90s F1 cars with the body removed.

[@brandonm8901]

Isn't it a MotoE bike?

[@rzaultra165]

hated because it was not yet based on the m4gnetim4relli platform, but when it was based on the m4gnetim4relli platform, m4relli customer manufacturers became enthusiastic and had lots of ideas and innovations, at the m0t0 m4netim4relli GP event, this was very funny. In the past they were afraid of the ultimate full factory spec, but since 2016 they have become enthusiastic and look very professional...

[@bilson34]

nice video ! subbed ! and you have a nice voice !

[@alanunruh7310]

lol it wouldnt take a system built even in those days 15 laps to learn that it was on a different surface. back then mayb 15 mins and that is be VERY generous as it was most like something like 30s to a 1min tops

[@CrypticApathy]

And we are going to go back with the 800cc in motogp.

[@pro12312]

2:56 why is the moto e bike there?

[@thewatcher5271]

You Know, I'm An Ol' Man, So It Doesn't Matter But, GPS On A Racetrack!?! Next Thing You Know, They'll Just Automate The Bikes & Let Them Race Themselves! Thank You.

[@vivekananda.madanmohan8101]

Its a very bad idea to go back to 800s. Introduce stricter fuel limit or air inlet restrictions.

[@hbsupermage]

still better than the modern era

[@mark4lev]

I only just started watching moto gp again. Is it true that the bikes now have a wake? And you can’t follow too close as the front tyre overheats? I can’t believe bike racing has ended up like f1

[@SuperbikeJohn]

Correct. They can lose stability under braking in the draft. However, the overheating issue has always existed. Even BSB stock 1000 bikes have problems with overheating in the slipstream, particularly with brakes.

[@blendin9140]

The 800cc era was considered a disaster,however,if you go back and look at the most iconic races you will find ,Catalonia 2009, laguna seca,2008,Assen 2008,Quitar 2011, Philip Island 2011, The difference was the rider line up,,Simonchelli, Dovi,Pedrosa,Stoner,Lorenzo, Rossi,Bautista,

[@fockewulf9518]

Imma yonder what would happen if Peko Banniyayya had one of those beasts