THE ATHARI CREED | THE JUSTICE AND ADMISSION OF ASHARI SCHOLARS!

[@BroHajji]

Before we present future videos highlighting the Athari creed from the Imams of the Salaf. This video will show you the justice and admission from Ashari scholars. #brohajji #salafi #ashari

[@khadijamcdonald5709]

What are you talking about!

[@niis1]

Just a correction akhi.. the text says جبرية not خبرية

[@patrickcarter8762]

7:50 u just proved you are not an athari. You dont understand the words used. You dont know what Haqiqi means here nor what "above" here. Yes the salaf did not deny jiha because they did not spoke about this you genius. As for the Quote of Imam Malik rahimahullah this quote is mawdu' it has no sanad. HOWEVER WHAT U IGNORED ABOUT WHAT IMAM QURTUBI rahimahullah is that he also said under surah 3 ayah 7: مذهب السلف ترك التعرض لتأويلاتها *_مع قطعهم باستحالة ظواهرها_* فيقولون أمروها كما جاءت ، وذهب بعضهم إلى إبداء تأويلاتها ، وحملها على ما يصح حمله في اللسان عليها من غير قطع بتعيين محتمل منها What did imam Qurtubi rahimahullah said under surah 2 ayah 29? و قال بعضهم نقرؤها وتفيرها على ما يحتمله ظاهر الغة *_وهذا قول المشبهة_* Your mistake is mixing حقيقي with ظاهري which is what all salafi do.

[@elprofesor8571]

Agreed.

[@cowdyayaad6378]

Then what does haqiqi mean?

[@patrickcarter8762]

@@cowdyayaad6378 kzbin.info/www/bejne/joi8k5xueaelgJI

[@RamliIsmail-q6n]

You must be wahabi.

[@aaronabuusama]

All of these points about direction or any of this is beneficial knowledge. What ever Allah said is what he said and that’s it

[@Morris-OumarLombardi-cf9nz]

Is there a problem with the position of tafwīd?

[@adnankassem8114]

I bet the difference between the pdf and the book comes from different manuscripts. Probably each publishing house relied on a different manuscript. One of the manuscripts probably has an error. The correct one is probably wajh(face) - because that is affirmed all over the place. I have also seen saaq (shin) affirmed all over. But i have never seen rijlayn in the dual tense - that seems like a scribal error. But Allah knows best

[@thrilled2bits]

Difference between Ashari and Athari? I thought every Muslim affirms what Allah affirms for Himself and His Majesty...? Im now a confused Hanafi... I thought this was going to be a basic explanation...

[@muhtasimmahin5057]

you can be hanafi Athari. but don't follow hanafi as well as other three fiqh blindly.

[@al-farooq7192]

Learn the athari one, so that you are on the safer side. You can be athari in Aqeedah and Hanafi in Fiqh, it is totally fine, in'sha'allah

[@FactsWithActs]

Athari 'aqā'id is what the athar were upon Follow that

[@trecool9336]

may we wait for the day when Mahdi our final khalifah, to reunite all athari, salafi, wahabi, asyairah, maturidi, as syafie, al maliki, hanabilah, hanafiah all - all back into the 1 true accepted way

[@ReturningRuh]

1. Poor interpretation of the translation. 2. Let’s see your isnad for creed. 3. If we brought forth all the current Hanabilah who aren’t salafi influenced, then we’d understand how your interpretation of the Athari creed is mistaken. No matter how many quotes you bring, your interpretation of them are not even sound. You attack Salafis left and right but carry their creed.

[@ShafiAshari]

me too akhiii

[@inakhtive]

What about the video on tabari last video

[@ReturningRuh]

@@inakhtive The interpretation is off. The Ulema have already spoken about the Aqeedah of Ahlus Sunnnah Wal Jammah in length. If a person wants to believe that Allah literally rose after the creation of the Throne, then that would mean that He went through a change after bringing the Throne into creation. Allāh is eternal and doesn’t go through changes. Ahlus Sunnah Wal Jammah state that above is in regards to Exaltation and not direction. If a person believes that Allah is literally above the throne then they would need to understand that since the Throne has size then they would have to resort to giving Allah size too. Also if a person believes that Allah literal descends, then they attribute size to Allah because the Throne compared to the Kursiyy is like a ring thrown into a desert. So imagine that compared to the lowest heaven. People that believe that Allah literally descends then would have to resort in believing Allah shrinks and enters into His creation. You see how absolutely disgusting these beliefs are?

[@inakhtive]

@@ReturningRuh wdym? Tabaris interpretation? Or bro hajjis interpretation of Imam Muffassireen at Tabari? Because At Tabari quite literally clearly says of Allah’s ﷻ sifat as the salafi atharis do

[@ReturningRuh]

@@inakhtive The true Hanbali creed is what is found in the works such as, Ibtal ut-Ta'wilat by Al-Qadi Abu Ya´la, Lum`at ul-I`tiqad by Muwaffaq ud-Din Ibn Qudamah, Najat ul-Khalaf by Ibn Qa'id An-Najdi, Qala'id ul-`Iqyan by Ibn Balban, Nihayat ul-Mubtadi'in by Ibn Hamdan, Al-`Ain wal Athar by Al-Mawahibi, Manhaj ul-Ahmad by ´Abdullah Sufan Al-Qaddumi, Lawami` ul-Anwar Al-Bahiyyah by As-Saffarini, and others, which are all the depended upon (mu´tamad) creed texts of the Hanabilah.

[@luvlybaluga]

Can you add the page numbers of the ones you showed on screen from the Tafsir please and thank you brother.

[@Qytrh]

It will be under one of the ayats regarding istiwa 'ala al arsh. Probably "الرّحمن على العرش استوى"

[@goidogoi]

Has anyone deny ALLAAH is above HIS Throne except the sections of the Mu'gtaziyla who proclaimed that ALLAAH is everywhere (thus the implication is HE is both above and BELOW the Throne implying HE is permeating HIS creation). And hence the reason why the Salaaf who were opposing them kept emphasing "above". It was to deal with the issue and whackjobs of the day. The problem is, instead of asking about ALLAAH, people can just shift and start asking about the Throne of ALLAAH instead which is a creation (makhluwq) and thus occupy space, time and direction. Then they will ask what is above? World is round. Please expain the word itself. Before you know it, Ibliys will got you fiddling between his fingers just by that word "above" alone. One will end up a khabar mutawatir rejecting FlatEarther. The FlatEarther part is not the main problem as it is a symptom. It's the khabar mutawaatir rejecting [doctrine] part is where things will go F.U.B.A.R. And yes, we are well aware of some of the Salaaf believed the world is flat too, Imaam At-Tabariy RHM I believe so if my memory serves, but he was limited to the tools and knowledge of the world of his time and thus excuse, nor followed in the matter. In fact this is the reason why ALL Salaafis are in truth FlatEarthers (even tbough some of them are in denial of their reality), because they affirm a direction for ALLAAH, and when push comes to shove they have no choice but to declare the Earth is flat because they can't neither explain "above" or the Throne in a round world where every inch of the globe there are people raising their hands towards the sky asking ALLAAH for favours every minute and every second without breaks. Is there 360 Thrones? Or does the Throne cover the Earth like an egg shell? And we all agree that ALLAAH is above HIS Throne, yes? Mind you we are talking about the Throne which is a creation and not touching the sifaat nor zdaat of ALLAAH at all here. Ponder on it mate, and you have become an Ash'ariyya/Matuwridiyya without even realizing it... or you could choose the other path, that of the Hashwiyya way (ie the two najdayn). Idealism vs reality of the world we are living in.

[@whn2058]

Don't overthink it bro. Allah is above our comprehension to begin with. He doesn't have a beginning or an end. Which in itself is beyond magnificent. Would you say this explainable? No you wouldn't so forget about this overthinking theology

[@ShafiAshari]

mashaa Allah jazakallahu khairan akhi.

[@imranqqq7307]

Exactly. Well said akhi.

[@najeebjohnson7747]

What do you mean by above

[@TheGEOPOLITICIANGUY]

As the man said to u - Allah is above your comprehension - so above u cant even think or imagine the Necessary existent - the creator of all, aka the beloved Allah swt… so above his throne literally at every moment and better not say anything else?- so ur giving Him a location - as if thats where He is plain and simple and thats it and U cant say anything else about Him- why even give a direction or deny direction? leave it be - that is not for us-- but …WHAT do we DEF know? WE DEF KNOW Allah swt is above EVERYTHING in every shape or form,,,its his majesty because if I am not mistaken….He says he is closer to u than ur jugular vein does He not??? his his throne next to my neck??? when there is three in the room He is also the 4th as they plan/plot…. He said that right???? soooo what did u mean there?? how do u AFFIRM THAT ONE??! hence tafwid is what we do as muslims, affirm it and let it go but also understand that its not heretical if one does tawil if the tawil itself is not heretical even though I stick with tafwid and leave the Kaf alone…… because when it comes to those questions I just mentioned, dont say he meant his knowledge - or his will etc…. why? because guess what u would be doing tawil as well (which is okay to me if one said that) but those who hate Tawil as u seem to, well u would be doing tawil like many of u do without realizing it…… be a muslim- submit ur will - pray and hope for his mercy - and be a good person, try to perfect ur soul (though perfection will never happen but strive for it) dont act like u know x y and z about Allah swt… as He said some this his literal which makes up the majority of the revelation and others are similar but not of the same kind (which is actually the correct translation) but many usually just translate it as “ and the others are ambiguous”…..and He also says not to worry about the ambiguous because only few men can possess that knowledge so when we know via many many “explicit” statements that there is nothinggggggggggg like him - as in we cant comprehend our Creator etc ….. why would we even try to say x is here - just as creations have certain places- just as creations have hands - u dont think he said my hands are over u in the sense of how to communicate with our human understandings to show his power over his creation?… ibn Abbas - A SAHABAH even said he meant his power ….. ibn abbas made tawil on a few things btw - look it up While yes, I just stay with Tafwid - as in I stay away from the Kaf like most Ash’aris - but if its not heretical, why would tawil be bad ??? I would not call someone a heretic for doing so at all….thats on them (as long of course that its not heretical) especially a tawil that wants to keep Allah away from anyyythinggg to what we comprehend, which is noble -- so while I dont do tawil…. u think Allah swt will punish some his righteous servants for saying he does not have hands even though they affirm what he says but understood hands as his sheer power as the creator ?? or especially if they dont believe he hastwo RIGHT HANDS because one songle transmitted hadith?? get a grip - the “aqeedah” was simple and laid out for us from the Quran alone - why try to make it anything more than that….. hence “creating division and sects” believe in the last day believe in the judgment believe he is Allah, the one believe in the punishment of hell and mercy of paradise believe in the need to worship and pray believe that NOTHING EVEN RESEMBLES ALLAH IN HIS CREATION IN ANY SHAPE OR FORM Believe in righteous deeds over evil believe in giving alms to those who need as an obligation believe that Muhammad (saw) was given this beautiful revelation believe in the prophets believe that He is all knowing all seeing all hearing all powerful …. and of course ALL MERCIFUL that is AqEeDaH….. simple … plain and simple….. as the guy said to you…. dont overthink it because he is also ABOVE OUR COMPREHENSION and ur worried about those who differ about his location above his “throne” … which is also a human constructed word btw always meant a seat for the King….. hence he is saying he is even above that….. its deeper than you think…. by why think of it? Just obey…. and be righteous and love ur fellow Muslims AND u may want to include AS TAHAWi laid out …. in relation to not resembling Our Almighty to his creation….which includes affirming a literal place, which as he says is not to not place our Creator in a given direction - just “as humans are in a certain receptacle and locus” as Ghazali would say (not verbatim)- because whats up for us is down to those in China right now - so THINK… and ease up…. and affirm what Allah says in his Power Will and Majesty but dont affirm “well he is only above because down would be like his creation” ….. meanwhile Allah reveals that he also descends to the lowest heaven (well dont humans descend to the bottom floor using stairs ?? u see how this can be played a billion ways?? and that He is closer to us than our jugular vein and that he is the room with plotters- but they know naught etc etc etc etc etc

[@kbayli.jsk1256]

Stop misquoting our imam al qurtubi, you have a habit for this, misquoting, the Malikiyyah have clarified the statements u brought up

[@BroHajji]

I’ve got other Maalikiyaah Atharis of the past to quote. Be patient my brother

[@jamalatmaca8071]

Bring the correct quote then...

[@kbayli.jsk1256]

@@jamalatmaca8071 do u have discord?

[@kbayli.jsk1256]

@@BroHajji Maliki atharis like who? Ibn Abd Al Barr? Who Ibn Rajab mentioned to be upon the ahlul hadith who did ta'wil of nuzul....

[@whn2058]

@@kbayli.jsk1256 Abi Zamanin Al-Andalusi was Athari and there are many more

[@abdulrahimnassor1904]

Sifat al-Khabariyah were affirmed and Jiha etc was not denied by the Salaf because they never talked about. One cannot talk about a matter that is non-existence. They used to take the Ayah al-Haqiqiyah as it was understood by the Arabs at the time. "THE HAND OF ALLAHN IS ABOVE THEIR HANDS" There is no Sifaat but a Khabar that when taken in its Haqiqi meaning means "Allah is with those who takes Allegiance with him." That is the Haqiqi meaning which is transmitted according to how it came and understood in Arabic as how it came. The Dhahiri meaning that you confuse with the Haqiqiya is that Allah's essence of his Hand is above their hand which who would contradict the Qur’an. Ammah "we are closer to you than the Jugular vein" and "Allah descends in the lowest heaven in the third part of the night"..... Those two verses would contradict each other if you take the Dhahiri meaning. The Haqiqiya is what is understood by the Arabs of the time. Which negates Jiha in its own without outright negation. It is like in English when i say "I will be with you no matter what you do or say." The Haqiqiya of the sentence is that I shall agree with what you do or say. The Dhahiri meaning would be that my essence, which is my literal body will be there when you make a decision. First of All, please study classical Arabic in a manner that is befitting according to the scholars. Secondly, do not assume even for a second that the Salaf were ignorant in Arabic while infact they were even more learned and understand in its complexity more than us. Thirdly, please dont pick and choose what only befits you. Read al-Qurtubi's whole regard into the matter.

[@markward3981]

It is actually simple, it shocks me how people twist this up. Every language has face value (literal) meaning and figurative meaning. Otherwise language would be so simple it would barely if at all contains eloquence sufficient to communicate things we experience daily. May Allah help us

[@sohail6759]

This is a good series 👏🏽 👌🏼

[@a-r5640]

Can you make video explaining the ashari and maturidi aqeedah???

[@UmerKhan-zy2sg]

These are aqaaid developed after the salaf habibi. I’m not here to do tabdee’ but I would advise to stick to our Pooh’s predecessors and sahabah

[@ShafiAshari]

@@UmerKhan-zy2sg bro are you serious??? the ashari and maturidi are the same as the athari mufawwid, they just differ on the ta’wilat, the ashari do the ta’wil al ma’na but it is not the certain meaning, they used it in the debate with mu’tazila and the christian, stop acting like they’re different from the salaf bro forreal, the majority of the ummah were ash’ari and maturidi, prophet muhammad pbuh said, Allah protected my ummah from straying unanimously. of course everyone sticking to the salaf and the sunnah.

[@BK_Beloved]

@@ShafiAshari I relied to you in the other video. One thing we can't deny is history. There was tension between Ahl Athar and Abul Hasan Al-Ashari (Rahimullah) because of creedal differences. Imam Barbaharee declined Abul Hasan permission to teach (Barbaharee was the head imam of the hanbali madhab at that time and getting his permission was a sign that the preacher was teaching creed correctly). After that, then Abul Hasan wrote his famous book on when to use Ahl Kalam to defend his position. Yes, I agree with you that a lot of the fighting needs to stop. But don't forget that extreme Asharis and Maturidis accuse other Atharis who do ithbaat of tajsim and not being from Ahl Sunnah. No one says anything about that. If this is about being fair and just then they should be criticized as well. It goes both ways.

[@UmerKhan-zy2sg]

@@ShafiAshari what are you talking about lmao. Asharis reinterpret most of the attributes of Allah. They say istiwa means dominion of Allah. No where was this found in the interpretation of the sahabah. To deny that these are not later developments is being purposefully ignorant. Asharis deny Allah speaking to Musa AS literally even. They go through all sorts of word plays and loopholes to avoid ‘contradictions with Greek philosophy’. Are you not aware of these things?

[@whn2058]

@@BK_Beloved you said it best brother. Athari's are called anthropomorphists continuously as if it was a term of endearment

[@imranqqq7307]

Seriously, what is the problem you have with Al-Ghazali, for example, and why is it a big deal in practical terms? Because it seems to be a matter of pointless semantics.

[@sulaimanqadhi4992]

Tbh this topic is a fitna, like Allah knows how and when the lines were drawn long before.

[@sulaimanqadhi4992]

Best to stick to Iman and Amal - good deeds is going to get you to Jannah!!! I am speaking as a lay and for the lay the expert scholars are well qualified to discuss!

[@Qytrh]

@@sulaimanqadhi4992 Part of iman, and the main part of iman, is aqeedah. Whether you like it or not, and yes there has been much dispute. But what must be done, must be done. The sahabah and the muslims after them till modern times have always fought for aqeedah

[@sulaimanqadhi4992]

@@Qytrh ok than I reword it to better not to indulge in these matters. Learn what is true but avoid debate its not our place.

[@Qytrh]

@@sulaimanqadhi4992 in what matters? Im not trying to refute you or anything, and i definitely think there has been a lot of fitnah due to aqeedah, but that is expected when that has always happened and will always happen, because its aqeedah that differentiates right from wrong and even muslim from disbeliever. And debate is necessary sometimes you can't let deviance just go rampart, you have to by necessity silence it and respond to it

[@trecool9336]

@@sulaimanqadhi4992 Imam Malik r.a once said that even bringing this topic up for discussion is a bid'ah

[@jiji1044]

Wait for the Super Asharis/Maturidis make excuses in the Comments. “No the Salaf were Mufaweeda” lol

[@whn2058]

I almost look forward to it lol

[@zakyzayn5361]

I don't know about mufawida but what is your opinion on this " God is absolutely transcendent and independent and yet is in whichever direction one faces and is with His servants wherever they are; He sits on His throne and He descends to the lower heavens. All these Quranic verses and ḥadīths should not be interpreted allegorically, al-Kūrānī writes, because “if you know that the Real has true absoluteness that is not restricted, [then] you know that the Real manifests in forms and with other attributes that came in ḥadīths such as laughing, wondering, coming, descending, ascending; all these descriptions do not negate [His] transcendence (lā tunāfī al-tanzīh).” All passages in the Quran and ḥadīth that suggest that God has bodily or human form or spatial location should, in this account, be understood as descriptions of the manifestations or epiphanies of God. After mentioning the Quranic verses and ḥadīths that contain an apparent anthropomorphic sense, al-Kūrānī always reminds his readers that the salaf ’s attitude is to accept the literal meaning of these verses and ḥadīths and simultaneously to negate any similarity between God and His creature, because “nothing is like Him.” According to al-Kūrānī, accepting anthropomorphic descriptions of God does not entail that we affirm that God has corporeal organs ( jāriḥah); rather, we affirm that God can manifest in a phenomenon that has corporeal organs, and His transcendence remains because “there is nothing like Him.” God’s essence is different than the essence of creatures: He is independent by Himself, concretely individuated by Himself, and nothing conditions or restricts Him, while the essences of creatures are nonexistent quiddities with specific dispositions for specific forms of actualization. Every creature is restricted by a form that fits with the essential dispositions of its quiddity (istiʿdād dhātī lil-māhiyya).77 God is not restricted by any manifested form because essentially He has noform (lātuqayyiduhu ṣūrat al-tajallī idh lā ṣūra dhātiyya lahu). God’s manifestation in forms is something added to His essence that does not change the essence; what He has essentially (bi-l-dhāt) never ceases because “His absoluteness is essential for Him and what is essential never ceases to be.” Since manifestation in restricted forms does not change the essence, it does not affect God’s transcendence. Al-Kūrānī’s position, manifestation in forms does not restrict God because He is absolute existence, which is not restricted or conditioned by anything other than Himself. In other words, only absolute existence itself is unrestricted, and anything other than Him is forever restricted. God’s manifestation, however, is always restricted by the form in which it occurs. Thus, the Quranic verses and the Prophetic ḥadīths that describe God in bodily or human form or in spatial location should be accepted as restricted manifestations of God’s unrestricted existence, without allegorical interpretation. Source: Intellectual Life in the Ḥijāz before 17th century : Ibrahim al-Kurani’s (d. 1101/1690) Theology of Sufism By Naser Dumairieh "

[@MaeidUddin]

@@zakyzayn5361 u have to much time lad

[@kbayli.jsk1256]

@@whn2058 yes the salaf did tafwīdh al ma'ana

[@ShafiAshari]

i am an athari but I stand on the salaf being mufaweeda, so stop accuseing us super asharis/maturidis.

[@guidanceseeker8038]

This is totally uncalled for. U better refrain from putting lay Muslims into such things. If Nabi e Kareem s.a.w has explained these verses of the Quran then plz present, if some later scholars hv done it, u should not b presenting their explanation becoz a Muslim is only required to believe Allah and if there r verses of mutashabihat better is to not talk or question or make clips about their possible meanings.!!!!

[@FactsWithActs]

Shush 😂 This is 'Aqīdah If it's too complex then don't watch