The AVATAR Disaster | Way of the Water and Avatar 13 years later

[@AmandaTheJedi]

EDIT: VIDEO SHOULD BE RE-SYNCED!

[@avengingkitty]

I thought I was losing my marbles... Restarted the video three times

[@mel_virgo]

i've opened the video in two tabs to watch it with synced audio :)

[@nischalakash]

Yeah the audio is unsynced

[@Black0Rabbit]

I spent too long wondering if it was a complaint about the lip syncing in the movie 😂

[@taylorlc]

@@mel_virgo I did the same!

[@Advent3546]

James Cameron is too good of a director to be settled with working with a writer as mediocre as James Cameron

[@Gchildwarrior]

The epitome of being your own worst enemy 🤣

[@jurney3478]

Nice comment stolen from Twitter.

[@KeybladeMasterAndy]

Considering some of the writing we have for big budget movies, "mediocre" is a compliment. And there are other writers on the movie.

[@LizRealGirlBeauty]

Just be glad you're not the AI that runs his house, or he'd be making you translate everything into Na'vi.

[@ShadowProject01]

😂😂😂

[@centuryg.9456]

I just could not get over the fact that Jake did not AT ALL expect the humans to come back.

[@Belavula]

Which makes no sense when at the end of the first movie it hinted that they would likely come back

[@gggthsb]

it wasn't only hinted but as a human he should know that we are a pest that is not as easily gotten rid of....

[@GalinaEv]

ok i didn't see the second one yet, but everything make it sound like exactly the same story as the first one. but now it's navi=water navi and tree = whales

[@2manyballfaces]

He said they would. I don’t think he was surprised lol

[@gateauxq4604]

He really is just a terribly dumb character. That tribe could have done so so much better

[@Artemis820]

I completely forgot jake had a twin brother that was a scientist, how come they didn't just use that for Jake's reason of trying to learn soo much of the na'vi it could have been his way of trying to connect/honor his brother by accomplishing his goal.

[@bened22]

Just because the movie didn't spell it out for you that doesn't mean you can't make and appreciate this connection yourself. :)

[@Arosukir6]

@@bened22 The movie doesn't go for that at all, though. After he gets into the Avatar body Jake never mentions his brother again, and even the scientists only talk about him once or twice more. We don't learn anything about his brother, barely anything about how Jake felt about him, nothing about how the other scientists might have felt or even if they'd met him before they left for Pandora. His brother dying is just a device to get Jake to Pandora and into an Avatar despite not being at all qualified.

[@heythere9371]

They did. That was the whole first movie. Jake mentions how his brother was murdered "for the paper in his wallet" drawing attention to the "insanity" of valuing material possessions over human life. The Na'vi represents a society who values life over material objects and greed. Obviously this is appealing to Jake. Sorry that James Cameron treated you like an adult, and didn't spell it out for you like you're a baby

[@Reaper1Reaps]

Whats really stupid is if the main villan from the 1st movie could download his memories into the navi body why didn't they just do that for his brother?

[@Reaper1Reaps]

@badboysboogie9095 That doesn't make any sense his brother was obviously important to the organization, so much so that they offered Jake to take his place just because they shared dna......

[@Arosukir6]

Found out recently the "oh, Avatar is Pocahontas with blue cat people" thing isn't just pushback. James Cameron *literally* said he got the idea for Avatar from watching Pocahontas. He just took the plot and made it about Unobtanium instead of gold, put it in space, and added the scientists. There's even a Kokoum character that Neytiri is betrothed to beforehand. They just don't make John Smi-- I mean Jake Sully go home at the end.

[@t3rki179]

And thats funny to me because Pocahontas is still a guilty pleasure for me (i don't have to explain why it's problematic) but Avatar was always "meh" to me

[@isabelleshoe147]

@@t3rki179 it’s that kickass, rad soundtrack and beautiful artwork! Alan Menken slaps as a composer. Also disney knows how to pull at the heart strings.

[@theprowler18]

I would add a good dose of DUNE as well. The motivation/political and corporate maneuvering for resources is literally the conflict of that story, and Cameron just straight up ripped it off. As well as the recent film, displaying numerous plot points that are literally from that series (special one connects to the flora and wildlife of the planet, generational conflict that defines the planet, etc.) Yeah, it is that frigging derivative.

[@SonicHedgehog1991]

Dude, J.ohn S.mith J.ake S.ully

[@elenarodriguez7809]

I'm a 90's kid who loved Pocahontas, so, when I saw Avatar I definitely noticed the parallels. But, again as a 90's kid when I saw Avatar my first thought was "oh snap Pocahontas and Ferngully rolled into one movie. Cool. And for those who don't know what Ferngully, your lost.

[@ijlayugan4149]

I agree SO HARD with how they sidelined Neytiri. I wished they explored her and Kiris character more. I just REALLLLYYY hope the next movies would explore their character more. The one thing that still pisses me off is how quick they've glossed over leaving their first home. Jake gives like one speech, Neytiri gets emotional and they're suddenly leaving the clan. It literally happens again when their Neteyam died. Jake gives a speech, Neytiri sucks it up I guess and goes full mama bear mode (love that for her). Im gonna take a wild guess on the future Avatar sequels- Neytiri still fuckin HATES Spider, Jake is gonna talk to her with at most 15 words, she'll turn around and finally accept Spider or something like that. Don't get me wrong I enjoy watching Avatar- but the writing is getting old and sick real fast

[@sunsetskye483]

I’d like to add to that. They all find out that spider saved the soldier guy, neytiri hates him even more. Then Tiri convinced Jake to like him and again and he gives a speech and everyone’s happy again, or Tiri gives her own speech

[@deathdragoncat]

I agree like I wanted to also dive more into how she feels about having "half-breed" kids and how that challengers her way of thinking. She really got very little attention in this movie which is kinda frustrating. Also little nitpick but why was Jake teaching his son how to arrow a fish when she is the master at the bow and arrow? We got very little of her bonding with her very own kids and imo I wished she had more conflict with Jake. She was so easy to fold especially when she felt he was going to hard on the kids (rightfully so he lacked little to no affection to them and was constantly fighting with them). A ton of the female characters kinda got sidelined for like no reason.

[@SonicHedgehog1991]

​@@deathdragoncat agree, and I'm pretty sure Jake never once show that he loves his second son at all throughout the movie until they just forced it in at the end.

[@deathdragoncat]

@@SonicHedgehog1991 Yup, he doesn't show any kind of affection for any of his kids expect for in the intro. The second kid clearly needed more guidance because he was so impulsive and what Jake was already doing wasn't freaking working. He needed to be genuinely sat down and talked to about doing stupid crap.

[@blokey8]

@@deathdragoncat tbh the actual conflict over the "half-breed" thing felt under-explored. Along with the new iteration of the Avatar concept itself. For that matter, how isn't Quaritch using the connection mechanic, which Jake was taught to do as a kind of communion, played as more of a violation? It's such a thematically rich seam, and then they just... barely dig at all.

[@kkaugustine1958]

Thank you! Jake was NO innocent! There was a scene where the 💦 Chief’s wife was like “This is all your fault!” to Jake after the military kept attacking their ppl all cuz of him. And I was like, yeah….yeah she’s got a point.

[@ellencoleman4604]

Well yeah, that's why the line was written into the script.

[@kkaugustine1958]

@@ellencoleman4604 Like Amanda Jedi said, the movies have framed him to be some really good guy tho and want us to believe it too despite his actions. That’s my point.

[@daria_r2784]

The Na'vi said basically the same thing to him in the first movie and he didn't learn anything from that.

[@ajc1233]

@@kkaugustine1958 Well. In all of our worldviews we all believe ourselves to be the good guys. And this is Jake's story. Like he was literally narrating the movie to us at the beginning if I recall. I'm interested on how the next few movies pan out cause I do believe the movie to be flawed as well but not bad.

[@subhajitdeysarkar9724]

Same. I blurted out yup she is right, in the hall 😂

[@Alex-vl6yt]

I just love the world of Pandora, I honestly don’t care about the characters like at all, but the world itself is just so beautifully put together and the flora and fauna is just amazing.

[@mahogania5536]

The ecosystem was wasted on this movie

[@ameliasellers6396]

@@mahogania5536 Fr it's so stunning and then the storyline and the character building are so remarkably disappointing it's a crime.

[@Thatcaramelchic]

I agree I’m a fan more for the visuals when I saw the first movie I remember leaving the the theater and being genuinely sad it was over and for a second the world was last beautiful in comparison

[@Thatcaramelchic]

I agree I’m a fan more for the visuals when I saw the first movie I remember leaving the the theater and being genuinely sad it was over and for a second the world was last beautiful in comparison

[@anisaafsar4528]

@@ameliasellers6396 see that depends. In my opinion the second movie was so much better because of the characters and because of how well the movie was able to bring in so many new characters. And I really enjoyed watching all of these new characters rather than the ones from the old one. This movie in my opinion was so much better despite its simple storyline

[@saddlerrye6725]

I like the original well enough, mostly for the unique ecology of Pandora. It's surprisingly consistent in a way that you can actually see how the evolution was different from ours. BUT. If there was a movie that didn't need a sequel whatsoever, then it's Avatar. I enjoyed it once, but I don't have enough attachments to any of the characters to be interested in their life.

[@AmandaTheJedi]

Pandora is pretty bitchin'

[@lindseystein9676]

I agree. I liked the first one just fine. Idk how all of these sequels will go, though. I think there are going to be 5 avatar movies. That’s what I’ve seen on IMDb, at least.

[@Tablis0]

I actually dislike it for completely opposite reason - for being so generic. All the animals feel to me like lazy mixtures of Earth ones with some fancy paint over them. Science-fiction is capable of so much more!

[@mymyhi9921]

@@Tablis0 I felt the same way

[@diamcole]

This sums up my feelings about it perfectly.

[@cassandrathomas6015]

The whale hunting scene for me was the saddest part of the movie and the part I cared most about. Watching that whale hunter die was the happiest moment for me in the movie. The whole storyline could have been evil whale hunters getting murdered by whales, and I would have been satisfied.

[@velvetnightmare3133]

I actually cried :(

[@Draco19970125]

Of cpurse it was a sad moment - until you realize these are not ordinary, Earth whales...only they stupid "no killing" rule keeps them as human prey... Because as we saw, only ONE Tulkun can demolish the huntig party(which only consist a single ship by the way). Somebody really had no problems watching as the humans kill all of their families and children.

[@Affranchie]

My five-year-old daughter leaped for joy when the whale hunter died😂

[@megzasaurusrex]

Yes I was screaming at the TV "take that fuckers arm!!! Yes fuck yes!!!" Then I was bored again lol

[@thejasminedragonmerchant6843]

Same. The whale hunters were absolutely horrible, soulless douchebags (seriously, there is no good reason to set up shop torturing and slaughtering all the whales, especially for such an insanely tiny payback in a universe where CLONING TECH EXISTS and with Earth being mentioned as basically dead already meaning their market is essentially non-existent) and I felt vindicated when Payakan got his revenge.

[@butterslizzard]

my biggest complaint about the end with the sinking ship is that we keep seeing the eclipse coming with all the action happening and i was like “oh shit, Kiri’s gonna go into the Avatar state and do something amazing” but it was so tame

[@Affranchie]

And she was SOOOOO slow in tapping into her powers! Her whole family was literally drowning, and she spent 10 mons calling upon the light creatures to find them and lead the way. During the battle scene, I was like "Girl, you just discovered you had the ability to control nature. Call upon some wild beasts, create a tidal wave, do something!"

[@efrenyalung1348]

I think you're the first content creator I saw talk about this movie in-depth who brought up how dumb Jake Sully's plan was. THANK YOU.

[@gutzz1519]

How was it stupid?

[@blackvalio4060]

@@gutzz1519 how was it not? His logic is idiotic. Lets leave the tribe cus they want me and the tribe is safe. In what world is this happening? Every millitary logical move is to go there and kill and torture the tribe to tell them where jake is...

[@Killjoy_Mel]

@@gutzz1519 Dumbass played both sides, selling out the Na'vi just so he could spend more time in his blue, able-bodied Avatar getting to know the wild life and chasing the teenaged blue princess, then acting mighty angry and surprised at humans acting on the intel he so freely gave them. In the process getting the clan's Patriarch killed, the princess' betrothed killed, countless other Na'vi killed... if you're going to play both sides, you have to be ruthless, intelligent, and above all, self-serving. Sully only fits the bill when it comes to the latter. Guy killed pretty much the whole clan just so he could run around and shag the princess instead of rolling around in a wheelchair and not shagging the princess. Which... honestly, there's something to say about how media still treats disabled people.

[@viixenous]

@@Killjoy_Mel I think it displayed the toll disability has on retired military people well. No one wants to be disabled and given a choice to not be disabled most people would take it. But that’s not why he chose to stay as an avatar. He learned the culture and fell inlove with not only neytiri but the whole culture. He didn’t care at first because he knew nothing of the people he was harming and he was told they were savages that were violent. But once he learned and developed connections to the people and cared for them he understood that everything he was told was incorrect.

[@melvv18]

@@viixenous And did nothing to help them, until they got attacked. Not even a warning, heads up, nor did he tried to sabotage the human side, until he lost access to the culture he was fetitchizing.

[@greythecolour3681]

My least favourite thing about these movies is assuming someone’s talking about avatar the last airbender and feeling like a fool after (I has happened me far to much)

[@lazyknowledge6286]

XD Saaaame! XD

[@prohiadam9]

when someone talks to you about avatar, you always have to ask: the good one or the blue one😃

[@lazyknowledge6286]

@@prohiadam9 so true!

[@SpookiePossum]

@@prohiadam9 or if it’s the movies it’s: the blue one or the other one

[@prohiadam9]

@@SpookiePossum there is no movie in Ba Sing Sei

[@DarkFairy207]

My issue with Avatar, the first one as I haven't seen the second, is that it seemed like Cameron had this really good idea for a world and the avatar concept itself, but then shoe-horned in a very basic plot around it with little love or care given to the actual characters and story. Pandora is undeniably pretty and well fleshed out. I loved all the creatures (though I 100% agree with you about the psychic linking thing against their will) and thought the plants were just gorgeous. The concept of being able to transfer your consciousness isn't new by any means, but I think the idea of being able to transplant yourself into an entirely different species is a really fun and cool idea. And yet... with ALL that potential, we got just a basic, messy story with extremely unlikable or bland characters, questionable character motivations (like wtf Jake, why was his plan SOOO bad?), and it was super frustrating. Pandora and the avatar concept would have been better, in my opinion, if the writing had been given a fraction of the love and attention that the CGI and world-building had been given.

[@laurenwilson9383]

You know whT would have been awesome. Like a nature documentary but of the avatar world, just Sigourney weaver as the scientist lady showing off all the nature of this alien world

[@heythere9371]

Most of the time when people say the story of Avatar was bad, it usually just means they have bad politics and they wanted Avatar to be another pro-military propaganda film like Marvel

[@lijakaca]

@@heythere9371 no they don't. I don't like pro-military stories but the Avatar was bad in many other ways, did you watch the video?

[@dotty3825]

The same with music in Avatar. Cameron literally hired so many people to make a completely new music that is something no one heard before but then when they given him a demo of the soundtrack he changed his mind and thrown it out saying that it is too foreign to people to hear and went to make music that is just similar to western music. It reminds music from films about cowboys. It is great but it could be so much more if Cameron didn't back down from the first vision.

[@chetsi_099]

100% AGREE

[@nomdecomputer]

I haven’t seen Avatar: Water World. Wasn’t a big fan of the first. I finally figured out why. Jake is the guy sent by the company to screw over the “small town” but ends up falling in love. Avatar is the plot line of a Hallmark movie.

[@Anita-nw5ts]

Thank you for making me laugh!

[@lilyeturnal3720]

Nailed it with this comment. 🎯😂

[@Florfilm]

That’s awesome. Great observation. 😂

[@jackmayor3574]

I mean sci-fi Hallmark movie isn't that bad.

[@tronam]

Except now the Hallmark movie has become a messy post-marriage story with interracial and adopted kids trying to integrate like immigrants in a new country with grotesquely detailed whaling sequences. It's a fun time.

[@RB-vo4gi]

See, it’s not that the hair bond thing is an inherently sexual act, but the truth is that they MAKE it overly sexual. The idea that you can create bonds/mental links with animals/people makes…. some kind of sense… but they literally frame it all as a sexual thing. That then makes it super uncomfortable to watch, especially when it comes to the interactions with animals. I also think the reason that the scenes where there are so many Navi on screen look so weird is because the Navi don’t have, like, shades of blue. People have shades of skin colors that make them different but everyone in Pandora has the same shade of blue skin so it just looks super fake.

[@lissaquon607]

yea theres no bruising - no real variety of skin shades - even on ike palms of hands or elbows or anything- the freckles are those cute stardust on the face no where else

[@Dash123456789Brawl]

At least in the Disney + version, that’s not quite true; the Forest Navi are a distinctly different shade of blue from the sea Navi. I didn’t watch it in theatres so maybe it was changed later.

[@TheOdyssei]

​@Dash123456789Brawl I think they mean more in the sense that within the forest Navi, there's no differing shades as you would find in most groups of peoples/cultures. While yes its to be expected that individuals in the same area and race are to be of similar shade/color, there still should be some form of way to show these are all different people. Slight color shifts amongst the crowd kf slightly lighter or darker individuals.not just a blatant hue switch when you switch tribe. While yes that is also inherently accurate, it doesn't take awayfrom the fact that everyone in either group is roughly the same shade of their respective tribe and it looks add from the view of most humans.

[@MrSoullessness]

The whole pacifism whale thing ruins the movie for me. They view self defense a cause for outcasting as it's as bad as killing but at the same time are "spirit siblings" to the water navi??? like the navi kill things and will kill humans to protect their own. You can't have it both ways.

[@MartinzW]

This is what happens when you want to make one side of the story 100% good but also want to retain complexity of actual, conscious minds where good&bad are just our individual beliefs. It's always a bad take unless you are making a simple story with simple characters but the moment you try to apply that template to a more complex story, it starts to show cracks.

[@subhajitdeysarkar9724]

If a creature is described as more intelligent and emotional than humans, there is no way they would not attack someone who is killing their loved ones. The Tulkun backstory was so stupid. Also SPOILERS AHEAD .. . . . . . . Am I the only one who was disappointed to see the other Tulkuns and sea creatures not coming for the final battle? Atleast they could have shown the outcast bull reuniting with its pack.

[@eb2681]

@@subhajitdeysarkar9724 that's probably for part 3.

[@subhajitdeysarkar9724]

@@eb2681 yes. The entire movie felt like a bridge-movie to renew the viewer's interest after the decade long hiatus so that they can make a third movie

[@AlphaSajza]

As a biologist, I really liked the idea of Pandora's world being interconnected on a far more visible and neurological level, especially as in the 13 years since the first Avatar, we have come to understand a lot more about how flora across the Earth communicate via chemical signaling. It wasn't executed perfectly, sure, but the concept is at least something to chew on. Yet the plot of Avatar was always...meh. It is, a movie. It's very movie, for sure. But that's all it had to offer for me and most of my friends. The confection as a whole is bland and forgettable. I'm not really interested in seeing the sequel and probably won't seek it out, but if offered to me on a bad movie night with friends, I'd sit and watch.

[@KateeAngel]

The level of interconnectedness of life on Pandora is totally unlikely in real world though. Such a thing is literally almost shown to transfer parts of consciousness from one body to another. It is just mysticism packaged as science. When they want to include usual elements noobs love like souls and afterlife but make them sciencey-sounding, thye create something like this. Similar things was katra in Star Trek, when the mind of vulcans could be transferred to someone else, if you remember. It always happens in fiction. Usual pop-culture love for mysticism and supernatural always wins over scientific accuracy. Life on Earth literally doesn't have a hivemind consciousness and worldwide grand interconnections like this. All chemical signals are on a much smaller levels. Co-evolution happens through competition and cooperation, not through one grand mind controlling all life forms. The thing like in Pandora is very unlikely to ever happen naturally anywhere

[@AlphaSajza]

@@KateeAngel Yeah. It's fiction and fictional science. "What if trees but with brain tissue?" James Cameron stated that the Na'vi are not placental mammals and shouldn't have boobs, yet they do because he and the art team wanted them there so I don't think you're supposed to take Pandora as a serious hypothetical proposal of a biosphere. If you take any work of fiction too critically, you can risk missing the forest for the trees. The weird trees that have brain tissue in this world.

[@SilverstreamPJ28]

If you're a biologist the sequel is even more interesting in that aspect. You're missing out.

[@chiefpurrfect8389]

My favorite thing about Avatar 2: The Way of Water is that it’s a movie that feels like a real movie

[@eb2681]

If you are gonna watch it, it should be in theaters. Oogling at the beautiful imagery is basically the reason to watch it haha

[@aki-kf4bo]

i feel like a huge problem is that a bunch of people only liked the first one for the effect and now it’s not that special anymore

[@benzaiten933]

that most certainly should be a large part of the appeal of the first one.

[@AbuHajarAlBugatti]

Yeah like me. 3D and 100% CGI was special back then. But this BS movie is just reheated microwave food with a very bland social brainwashing shadow of a story, made buy a guy who says Testosterone is Toxic

[@luffyduffy7817]

For real if you asked me what it was even about I couldn't tell you

[@screencut4237]

Then why are the reviews from critics and audiences mostly positive with a 78% positive critic score and a 93% positive audience score on rotten tomatoes and similar scores on other platforms and youtube critics that also have gotten positive reactions on their reviews on the movie?

[@bigbearkat2010]

I watched it theaters and as impressed as I was with the effects, I still knew that was all it had going for it. The projector actually went out for about five minutes but the audio was still coming through so I got a nice dose of how bland the movie is without it's visuals

[@holdeck]

I really wish there was more of a focus on the bigger picture in this franchise; like I'm so interested in seeing how Earth is like, how far in the future this is all taking place, how Pandora was found etc. I get why it focuses more on the characters interacting with the world, but I wish there was more of a sci-fi angle.

[@tronam]

There will be. A4/A5 will be partially set on Earth.

[@elliannawilson9551]

Finally someone brings up Neytiri's hate/ambivalence towards Spider! When I watched it, I was like "Ma'am, your husband is human. That hasn't changed. You cradled him in your arms and looked at him with curiosity?? With slight understanding??" And for it to change, it just kinda. Weird. As for Kiri, I think it'd be interesting if like. Weaver's voice made sense in the next couple installments if she grew up to look like Grace, or like. Because this is, in essence, Grace and Eywa's combined life force, she is not only her daughter but like. A form of Grace, herself? I dunno. While it is really noticable that Weaver is voicing her, and it can be a little. Bland and bad at times, it'd be more interesting if Kiri was more of an adult than a teen

[@shanjida8353]

I think neytiri kind of hated him because he was the colnel guys son.a son for a son.

[@elliannawilson9551]

@@shanjida8353 Right, but how it was addressed was due him being part of the "sky people" and even Jake's narration was that Spider was a boy who was abandoned, not that he was the colonel's son. It wasn't really talked about or revealed until later in the movie, or so I thought

[@SonicHedgehog1991]

​@@shanjida8353 "a son for a son" would work but then again, Spider is already *practically their son.* The kid literally grew up with their children and is treated as another brother by the kids so nothing changes.

[@mtver8348]

I think the thing that I personally dislike the most about Avatar is that critics often look down on big budget sci-fi/action movies as being not sophisticated but when James Cameron does it with a pretty run-of-the-mill story line and a CGI technique that isn't all that novel anymore, suddenly critics are on board and willing to give him all the awards for it. Edit: I was referring to the first movie in this comment since I haven't seen the second and to motion capture in general since mocap is used in a lot of movies and videogames nowadays. I get that it was novel at the time but looking back on it now I find it less impressive. (Also there were other movies that used mocap at that time but not to the same extent Avatar did such as Gollum in LOTR). Just my opinion.

[@hinatanin]

I love the world building of Pandora, the storyline however is a different story

[@bigbearkat2010]

Personally what I was most annoyed by are the folks that clinged to it's supposed quality ten years later when the last Avengers movie was coming after it's box office record and suddenly people came out of the woodwork to praise a movie that had barely been talked about since it's original run ended.

[@coolsenjoyer]

@@hinatanin I couldn't even get into the worldbuilding because the Na'vi are like "what if people who actually have religious beliefs that are objective biological and ecological reality on their planet, unlike all the silly human cultures back home that just happened to develop pretty similar beliefs but have almost no basis in the reality of life on Earth"

[@frostfang1]

@@bigbearkat2010 ahhh that makes sense why all the circle jerk over why Avatar is so bad. It's mid. No reason to hate it or hype it because it's mid.

[@hqb5276]

Please tell me what movie Avatar 2 copied this time. I would love to hear you attempt to come up with something.

[@skyemccready]

Coming from Graysons video where she adored the first avatar and being so disappointed with the second one and going straight to yours where you vehemently HATE both is so so funny to me

[@AmandaTheJedi]

ah! I knew there must be someone with the reverse take

[@natalia-grace9314]

It was like whiplash, lol.

[@KeybladeMasterAndy]

And then there's Grace Randolph, who did not like the first one but liked the second.

[@andrabook8758]

i liked the first one, but the 2nd one is so silly....and the messaging is awful and the dialogue is horrific. Like, they literally copied and pasted dialogue from the 1st movie. That's so odd and lazy.... it was horrible.

[@KeybladeMasterAndy]

I swear, reactions to both movies could almost be some sort of litmus test. Such a wide range of opinions.

[@oneinathousand2156]

Avatar’s best cultural impact was the Papyrus sketch from SNL, it gave a voice to so many graphic designers out there.

[@theyoungkamikaze19]

Ryan Gosling went hard on that performance, Oscar-worthy XD

[@BBULLSHlT]

90% of what snl shits out, is someone else’s material. It’s all lifted. Maybe legally but they morally and creatively bankrupt

[@wephilips6651]

@@BBULLSHlTlol I love how triggered people are by SNL. Go look at any comedy video period on KZbin and someone will there bitching and crying about how bad SNL is. It must be the only thing in the world that people who hate it obsess about more than people who like it

[@BBULLSHlT]

@@wephilips6651 I don’t obsess over thieves.

[@wephilips6651]

@@BBULLSHlT and yet here you are…

[@thaanuvi]

I wanna say they really did Neteyum dirty in this movie cuz he literally never showed up to the point that i didn't know that was his name until they mentioned it a whole bunch after he died. And yeah I still teared up at the ending scene but I was more annoyed that they literally just excluded him from the film. I could never understand spider's stance and motivations, and the fact that jake literally didn't care about him though he practically raised him (especially because they treated Kiri as their daughter). And the whole Neteyum as the model son and Loak as the disappointment honestly felt really superficial and I just never felt that conflict betweem him and jake too seriously. And yeah I really just hated Jake's character and the white savior energy it clearly gave off. And not to mention Neytiri being completely sidelined and at times confined to the kitchenesque locations of the settlement didn't go well with me especially since she was a warrior clearly stronger than jake in the first movie. Loak straight up annoyed me a few times, also the same thing where he bonded with the outcast tulkun just like jake did with the hotwheels phoenix, at least it made more sense here since he is some sort of navi and he is an "outcast" as they tried to forcibly show. The motives of the humans were also very unclear that they just wanted to hunt down jake as if all the rest of the people would be absolutely powerless without him (again savior energy), yet they were okay with hunting tulkun and angering the water tribes. But perhaps the most annoying thing to me was how at the end when all the family was almost drowning they kept showing the setting sun as if to indicate that Eywa was going to be the most powerful making kiri very powerful and able to save everyone, but it was so anticlimactic the way she just sent some glowing things to where Neytiri and Touk were. Also just the fact that Quaritch made it out alive after being strangled and sunk for straight up half an hour though jake himself almost passed out despite having trained with the Metkayina to be able to breathe longer underwater felt like such an annoying stretch that it really killed any interest I had of seeing the next movie. I know he'll probably have a redemption arc at some point since he's in a navi body now, but the moment it became clear to me that the series was centered around a white savior to an indigenous race it lost it for me.

[@kirbycathy]

@Blondchen Not even gonna comment on the ‘yellow man’, thing you said, but James Cameron literally said he was directly inspired by Pocahontas and Dances with Wolves. Also even if it is supposed to be a Jesus allegory that’s? Not much better? He is still at the end of the day a white person, and the navi are indigenous which has (at best) upsetting implications

[@geert574]

u cant communicate with leftoids its a cult, these trash films are the max of their mental capacity

[@Soladat]

One major thing about the first avatar that people often overlook is the cultural impact. The plot and characters of the first movie were very forgetful, most people couldn’t even remember the characters names or the overall plot. But most importantly: it has so insanely few fanfiction stories on ao3. Most of them are mislabeled atla stories. There’s more fanfic of masterchief meeting my little pony characters than there was of Avatar back in 2015. No one cared about the characters enough to create more for them.

[@c.a1019]

judging a movie based on fanfic/fandom is one of the most terminally online shit I've ever seen, touch grass, not everyone cares about characters fucking and all that bullshit

[@wtfiswrongwithyou9045]

@@c.a1019 do you think you'd like xenoblade 3 over avatar 🐝

[@sickonshimmer]

recently a martin scorcese film that doesnt even exist got more fanfics than avatar did lmao

[@dusteebowl]

i was just thinking about this. avatarsonas SHOULD be a thing, especially when you think about how fandoms operate, but like there’s absolutely nothing. of course a big fandom doesn’t mean a piece of content is good, it just means that enough people felt impacted by it that they want to expand it themselves. it’s baffling that’s not the case here.

[@lily_flower0686]

@@c.a1019 It's not about basing opinions on a piece of media by seeing how much fanfiction it has. This is more about the cultural impact that said media has in the world. And how come the HIGHEST GROSSING MOVIE OF ALL TIME doesn't even have that big of a fandom or even that big of a cult following? That says a lot about how this franchise just doesn't really resonate with people that much, at least not to the level for them wanting to explore the universe more tbh

[@xxDeeMmmVeexx]

The ponytail animal thing ALWAYS weirded me out too… did back then, still do now. It’s WEIRD.

[@shanjida8353]

That thing is just there to make things scifi y.

[@noimnotakpoppfpsheacy2526]

Well that's because you're a surface level thinker and can't imagine ways to make it work without it being weird.

[@xxDeeMmmVeexx]

@@noimnotakpoppfpsheacy2526 lol kk do you I’m just grossed out by beastiality if that’s what you’re into then I wish you all the horrors the world has to offer. I’ll be basic on that, thankssssss. 🙃

[@noimnotakpoppfpsheacy2526]

@@xxDeeMmmVeexx Those are humans concepts, they're not human LMAO. It's only sexual with equals and obviously not with the animals because two different species can't sexuality connect 😬 to me you're just telling on yourself

[@AnaAcuraErica]

@@noimnotakpoppfpsheacy2526 idk I’ll have to agree that is is kinda weird lol..

[@imjustdandy9799]

The White Saviour Trope doesn't get better the more money you throw at it James.

[@twistytoast5533]

Too real.

[@sdathomas5088]

Fr fr

[@monsieurfrancoise]

YUP

[@2manyballfaces]

Blue savior

[@wrestlinganime4life288]

Still doing it in 2022

[@clockworktri]

Uhhh... is no one else seeing a Amanda talking with completely different audio over her? Like, it starts with a clip from her podcast but that's just playing over her talking to the camera...

[@Geospasmic]

Your description of the original Avatar is perfectly in line with my memory of watching it. It was infuriating that Jake used the Na'vi to get what he wants while selling them out and lying and getting a bunch of them killed and still thinks he has the right to be one of them, much less a leader with the best pterodactyl who everybody continues to trust.

[@draum8103]

Um...he's on an alien planet and helped them protect their planet against his own people. How stupid do you have to be to think that is somehow disrespectful to the Na'vi when he literally did everything to try save them lmao...

[@draum8103]

@sewerrat7418 wtf are you talking about? Other Na'vi also let their people die. So what? Then the rest of the humans tried to kill them. He's literally the best human character trying to create a bridge between the people, amanda's critiques are just totally stupid as usual in ignoring that kind of stuff...

[@Geospasmic]

@@draum8103 eventually he helps them, when he's in danger of losing his perfect new world, but until the last minute he's working with their enemies to take over the planet and exterminate them. He only changes his mind when he "falls in love" with them. I wonder if he would have done that if they were ugly and gross.

[@draum8103]

@@Geospasmic oh shut up, you must just be another brainwashed amanda simp. Wtf are you talking about, the entire two Avatar movies Sully is defending Pandora...in what fucking way in the recent movie is he 'working with the enemies' like you claim let alone that he tried to exterminate the planet, man you amanda people are just so incredibly stupid and biased it's bizarre.

[@johnhenry4844]

@sewer~rat He told the Navi to run from home tree as they had no hope in winning a battle, they ignored him and got themselves killed

[@i.m.b4398]

Honestly i went in with the hope that I was about to watch almost 3 hours worth of pretty screensaver visuals (one of my childhood possessions was an encyclopaedia of pandora so that was my main draw) and I was really well fed in some areas and really let down in others (the action scenes really tested me they just kept going and the flashes gave me a headache). Also I have a lot of feelings about Kiri’s “epilepsy attack” since I had epilepsy growing up myself. I was always an out-cast watersport-loving kid so technically this should be so very personal to me…but let’s be honest they’re probably just throwing that around for now and then it’s gonna be something else entirely (I will hate that but yk). The storyline is just so bland. It’s every weird magic kid story ever and after the epilepsy attack she heals so quickly and it’s not brought up again. The scene itself is horrifying tho…but overall it saddens me how this blandness and lack of focus just left me neutral on the whole, when it shouldn’t be that hard to rouse me with such a storyline. She was still my favourite tho, but that’s more because she is really pretty and less because of any special attachment to her character…

[@ace_of_cakes]

I was literally thinking how weird the epilepsy story is because it's pretty clear that Kiri actually does have a connection with Eywa so I assume for her it's not epilepsy? It just felt so weird and not thought out. To paraphrase Jenny Nicholson, it wasn't exactly a plot hole, it just made me go "hmm". And then they talk about how she can't connect with the spirit tree anymore and considering how spiritual a kid she is I figured that would be a conflict, but it doesn't come up again. Setup I guess?

[@i.m.b4398]

@@ace_of_cakes Yes exactly!! I‘m Not really angry or anything but I’m giving the whole thing the biggest side-eye. It really does feel like they just wanted a quick scientific explanation for the incident so they can talk about it in later movies and it feels so cheap to me…like it’s not given the weight it deserves and that sucks. Epilepsy lacks good rep as it is. Just say it’s a fit. The plot line of her having to refrain from connecting could be really great. From my own experiences, a thing a lot of people w/o epilepsy is how restrictive having it can be. There is shit I still can’t do to this day because it could trigger an attack, no matter how much I want to. And I do understand how the movie only had so much time and I do want them to treat it with care so I guess I am kinda happy they didn’t attempt to rush it, but man I do not want to have to wait till the next movie comes out and at best makes this one better as a carried on story. But all of this implies they handle the subject with care which after this, I don’t trust them to do. Like, just say it was a generic fit or something. This is so iffy.

[@KiwashiHatsuro]

Am I the only one that has a shift between Video and Audio?

[@darkthaumaturge587]

For 13 years, until this very day, I have lived utterly alone. But now... there is... another.

[@clarapilier]

Count three now.

[@ziggystatdust6008]

We were always out there bud.

[@SB-qx5xz]

I am here!

[@tombsofak]

And my axe.

[@monsieurfrancoise]

And my bow!!

[@ambrosiawing]

i literally cannot watch this video bc the audio is so messed up amanda plEAse😭😭😭

[@sniderguy]

Yes. It looks like the podcast clip that's right at the top of the video may have been synced to video that is no longer there, because the video goes straight to Amanda saying "I don't think there's a movie that's been less for me...", so the entire audio is on a 15-ish second lag and it's very hard to watch. Posting this on as many of these comments as I can in the hopes that she sees this and it's an easy fix.

[@esotericsb]

I liked Avatar for the fantasy and creative aspect, but we made the mistake seeing Avatar 2 in the 4D Real experience at our theatre. The seats move up and down and shake side to side on a platform, there's wind fans, water spray, and seat vibrations to feel impact like arrows. I feel like I was held hostage on a episode of Whale Wars the seats moved to follow the boat and creature flying/swimming patterns. Incredibly nauseating 😂

[@minathermopolis2551]

When I heard you talking about not really caring about the character I realized that I felt the same way during both movies but I did care for the nature. Couldn't tell the blue people apart but I could NOT watch the nature and animals getting killed lmao

[@thatsmyOPINION]

The flora and the fauna was honestly the only thing I remembered from the first movie

[@daydreaminboy7671]

this movie had so much hype back then and no one talked about it for 10 yrs and now people are hyping it up again. I am confused to say the least

[@karoliinalehtinen6701]

I'm so glad someone else also feels a little icky about how na'vi treat the animals of pandora. And I don't think it's nitpicky, because I think it's part of a larger problem with the whole worldbuilding. They constantly tell how deeply connected the na'vi are with the nature and how much they respect it, but I don't think they actually show it meaningfully. I don't think Cameron even really understands how to connect with nature, which is why they do it super literally and just literally connect nerves or like talk with whales or some shit. But that doesn't feel real, because then in those small moments for example the ones mentioned in the video, we see their approach to nature isn't necessary actually that different. It feels like they still believe, and in someways are correct, they are the masters of nature. The control it with their hair nerves instead of technology, and they can pacify nature with it, like we humans have pacified nature with technology. And no relationship can be that genuine or strong if it's not equal, and it's not if they are the masters.

[@Tifa495]

I completely agree with you and Amanda and the animal thing. Cameron did a terrible job on showing how connected the Navi are to nature and show them "taming" it like humans do.

[@RENX5]

Yep. James is supposedly vegan, and I can see why he would make it so that na'vi need to eat animals to survive, but the whole using animals as literal vehicles thing is weird.

[@dhaburuk6494]

I agree, the lore is a bit off. If they are thanking the beasts they hunt for the sustenance required to survive, then communicating that while the beasts are alive to hear it makes sense... but since all things are connected anyway there is no need for the beasts to be alive for gratitude to be given to Pandora itself.

[@karoliinalehtinen6701]

@@RENX5 Yeah, the way they control the animals rather than like form mutually beneficial relationships does not feel very "in tune with nature" to me

[@karoliinalehtinen6701]

@@dhaburuk6494 Yeah, like if the animal is suffering and dying, even if it understood that they were thanking it, I'd guess it would be pissed to suffer needlessly. And in many nature worshipping cultures around the world they thank(ed) the souls of the dead animals, because they were/are usually very animistic. And like they would pay respect to the animal by eating it in a big feast and singing songs to it etc. They would also often ask permission to hunt from some deity that reigned over the area or the animals, promising to only hunt what they needed, and so on. I think these would have been so much better ways to show respect for the animals they were hunting and showing much more equal and balanced relationship.

[@eduardozayasrandel1854]

In regards to the exiled Tulkun. What I understood was that the rumors, legends and tales said that he was exiled from his clan but, the reality was that he was that last surviving member of his clan

[@dillon1037]

I'm so in to learn about the different landscapes and cultures and how the Navi seem to adapt to them. Even more down to see more alien creatures, especially in the water I just wish Cameron would get a little weirder with them. Only real wish is to see it through the eyes of someone other than Jake Sully.

[@punkithecat]

Omg yes to all of this, I'm not in interested in the action, not interested in the humans and their dumb military brains, not interested in Jake Sully, I just want to see the actual Navi people doing their thing and handling things on their own without Sully meddling every time pls

[@Ellisepha]

Pandora is such a cool and fantastical place, with new and interesting flora and fauna, it's such a shame that the movies have such boring plots.

[@audiochicky]

I honestly thought I was the only person on the planet who hated Avatar. I was never interested in seeing it, but did because I make myself watch all Best Picture nominees. I do not like it. I don't want to see the second one. Thank you for taking one for the team and watching the second one for us, Amanda! I can stay in the know for pop culture but save myself some time.

[@johnlondon5516]

It's probably more common to hate on avatar now.

[@Syd448]

I didn’t like it when I saw it, didn’t hate it but never wanted to see it again and won’t be seeing the new one 😅

[@greenleaf37]

It took me a lot to watch it. It was so boring I could barely make it past the begging.

[@johnlondon5516]

I thought it was incredible, As well as the sequel. It's not the matrix, it's a simple story, where the main character is the world itself.

[@ruthmeow4262]

I never had any interest in watching it. I saw the previews and was all meh. And I love soft science fiction and fantasy.

[@Gr4yson_Id0l]

I can't be the only one having issues with the HUGE audio to video delay-

[@theothersienna6328]

I am too!

[@ebonyjack]

I thought it was my browser acting up. Glad I'm not going crazy.

[@StrigExLibris]

It's not even really a delay, the first minute of the audio happens like 2 minutes in, and the audio from the first minute of the video is... somewhere else? I hear the podcast first when we see the podcast like a full minute in. Shit's whacked

[@Orion_TheyThem]

THANK YOU. Literally NO other comments are addressing it!

[@strawberriesarah]

Yes the audio is like 1 minute delayed compared to the image, it's a bit disorientating

[@kaelynevans1874]

I do agree with you. I was so bored when I saw it. I just think it was overhyped too much, especially when the story was essentially what can be found in Fern Gully, Atlantis the Lost Empire, Dances with Wolves, Nausicca of the Valley of the Wind, and Princess Mononoke. The visuals are beautiful, they are, but that’s it. Like you said, there really isn’t a large imprint that has been made by the movie in similar ways other modern movies have.

[@rohegarcia2802]

Unless people were hyping up the story and characters, which no one was, how exactly was it overhyped? To this day, people hype it up for its groundbreaking visuals, which it has. I think people simply like to hate it because it’s the most successful movie of all time and they can’t wrap their heads around how a movie with such a simple story made so much money.

[@bhavya5692]

@@rohegarcia2802 the thing is they could've done a better story for this concept than nausica , and they literally could never compare to nausica because it wasn't soulless and had a better grip at the scientific facts of fauna interaction with humans. The visuals are great tho. But that's it.

[@BrutalNewby]

What are u talking about, pretty much every movie is based in real life events. I don't get it people complaining about this like... That's what movies are based on.

[@samspotz8r8s]

SPOILERS but I really have a problem with how little time Nayteri had to grieve moving away from her home. It was a really culturally def moment Imo, adding to the upset I hear from indigenous people criticizing the movie. That Forest and people were every ounce as important to her as her her husband and children. I think she deserved more screen time to be hurt by being so far from the rest of her family and land. It’s really odd that they were all happy to be accepted as true water cats by the end. Maybe this turns into a plot thread if we ever get to a third movie.

[@terebertuccivoicemusic9821]

Hi Amanda! I really liked this video and your reflection on soo many problems with Avatar. I want to offer my view on the Neytiri narrative in the sequel...I felt it had so many sexist and rac!st undertones (I don't think it was on purpose, I hope...but that's how implicit bias works I guess). While Jake is shown as this rational, calmed down leader who is kind of the white savior (and being in an avatar, like you say, doesn't change this), Neytiri is painted as this very emotional, visceral "female" character (I use quotation marks bc of the deep binary take on sex/gender that Cameron uses), who seems more primitive, has to be talked down into staying calm, and there is even one scene where Jake apologizes for her, and all we see is her saying very softly "do not apologize for me" without this problematic behavior being addressed anymore...she is reduced not only to just being a mother, knowing how fierce she is (and being a mom is nothing bad, but just reducing the woman to only that, especially when the writer is a man, is)..but also dehumanized as the stereotype of a hot-headed, indigenous character. Whilst Jake is the male white character that knows how things work and knows to stay calm. I saw this narrative throughout the second movie, more than the 1st one, and it was so cringy for me! So I think the "Neytiri hating Spider" part, is part of that perspective. I just wanted to offer my take on it.

[@LumeyBloon34]

I think the narrativ of the second movie is more showing that Jakes ideas and plans are not the best thing..Him calming everyone down, getting them to leave their clan. It all fires backwards, he is in a conlfict with his human military side. The way that even his sons call him "sir" is showing this clearly. For me it was painted the other way around, jake seemed to be irrational. It literally bites him in the ass at the end of the movie, loosing one of his sons. I think it will bite him even more in the ass in future films. It shows that he still clings to his human side, and this won't work in the long run.

[@genevievedisemelo5584]

you aren't alone, every scene with neytiri felt sexist and weird to me aswell. jake was talking down to her the entire movie and we get to see him interacting with his kids in a unique(yet stupid and just out of left field way) but all interactions that neytiri has with the kids are identical to ones you'd find with a human mother! there is zero effort to display or even ponder on how navi culture might differ in terms of parenting and that could affect teenage behavior. the teen navi are just blue skinned human teens and even the ocean navi teens who are uninfluenced by jake and the other humans are the same, neytiri is just a regular old (culturally human-like)mom and jake acts like a military general!?!?!?!? i also noticed them setting up a plot point of neytiri being like an animal the entire movie. whenever quaritch describes her he never fails to mention that she's like an animal. and in the final battle when she goes on a rampage, spider ducks and hides to imply that "wuh oh shes in beast mode she'll kill me indiscriminately" that just rubbed me the wrong way too. infact the navi people who arent main characters feel like they're just little defenseless sheep or deer who know nothing and can be pushed around. james has put zero effort into making the navi actual aliens with an alien culture. another thing that grinds my gears is the fact that for most of the movie they were speaking navi but it was translated to english, why even make a conlang at that point.

[@raylue6273]

@@LumeyBloon34 I agree with you. Though, I think that even though I saw Jake as that irrational, very flawed character (like you did, too) they should've made that more clear through writing. Because that's just our interpretation. When jake talks about his (very human, very western) role as a father protector of the family blabla you can see he's clearly still in this mindset that this "nuclear family" thing and the roles it has in his worldview is the right way to live. While this and his way of parenting gets criticized by neytiri several times and also has consequences, it never really gets thoroughly explored as a cultural difference and conflict. While we see that the na'vi definitely live in a seemingly somewhat patriarchal society in certain aspects, the woman have a significant amount of authority (especially the shamans, who seem to not have less say than the chief in most cases) and are also generally not seen as weaker, as they take on the same physical roles as they're male counterparts in battles, hunting etc. Imo it seems like, the na'vi would have more of a community system when it comes to raising kids (which is or was also common for most human societies that live sustainably and in a more natural environment). You can clearly see neytiri having a hard time leaving her clan and adapting to life as a small family in a new culture, which is also probably partly because leaving the community might equal leaving the literal family to her, so it wouldn't make much sense from her view, leaving the family to protect the family seems illogical in a way. Even though in the beginning of the movie they spend a lot of time as a nuclear family, but that could very well be Jake's cultural influence). Also the way the kids grow up roaming around freely a lot (thus bringing themselves in danger) with their parents nowhere in sight, which some people have brought up as a weird concept in the story makes this more probable to me. The reason they would be in more trouble in their new home would be not having their clan mates looking out for them as they might do in their home clan, but instead facing discrimination by the metkayina clan. BUT everything ends up only being explored as a conflicting parenting style between Jake and neytiri instead of letting Jake learn that this is how na'vi families work (which he could've learned in the metkayina clan, as well). Instead he ends up reciting his father role in the end of the movie, even though we saw neytiri protecting him and the family way more in both movies (which also didn't seem out of place or unusual at all in her own cultural context). So Jake's process of integration and cultural learning could've been a part of the movie that would've made it way more realistic and interesting, leaving it to criticize not only the human's (in a western, Eurocentric, capitalist social context) entitlement when it comes to treating nature however they want, but also their family dynamic and how it is flawed in many ways. But alas, I guess it had to be "the father is the protector of the family" 🤷🏻‍♀️

[@terebertuccivoicemusic9821]

@@LumeyBloon34 I understand your perspective and I think both things can be true, I was referring more to what other commenters have said about the screenplay not addressing these issues that are more systemic in depth...and in a movie that is sooo long I think there could be space for that! Thank you for your perspective!

[@Cysubtor_8vb]

The original Avatar felt like a decent one-off spectacle that doesn't have the legs to build a franchise. Well, to me personally. Wouldn't be the kid-friendly moneymaker they want, but one direction that universe could go that would be interesting is horror. Everything there is already alien to the viewer, but that also opens the door to a very creative creature feature.

[@naluzoniro]

Completely my opinion as well. There was a lot of hype for the original Avatar because the technology and CGI was revolutionary... for 2009. Nowadays it's on par with every other big studio CGI, so... what are we watching it for ? The deep and compelling characters ?

[@empressawesome1655]

I felt indifferent to both movies, and I agree with all of your criticisms. I realized after watching them that I can’t enjoy a story, no matter how good the world is, if I can’t connect with the characters. The only character I found remotely interesting in the 1st movie was Neytiri thanks to Zoe Saldaña’s performance but then they completely sidelined her in the sequel

[@melleblanc9537]

The colonel reminds me so much of the commander from Disney's Atlantis that i just end up wanting to watch Atlantis

[@NanashiSaru]

Even that guy is more interesting than this colonel

[@wrestlinganime4life288]

Literally the first movie is exactly like Atlantis... Except the later was soo much better

[@baronessunicorn8208]

Yes! Thank you! I had a lot of those same feelings when I watched Avatar the first time too. And then again when I watched it years later. Everyone around me thought I was crazy for not loving Avatar and it's good to have validation that others feel the same.

[@tksm97]

Love the video, Amanda!! I STRONGLY dislike the first Avatar - I’m disabled and use a wheelchair, and it’s exhausting to be told so often that being in a wheelchair is the worst thing in the world, or that it needs to be “fixed”, the way Avatar does. I desperately wish there was more media featuring disabled joy, rather than acting like disability is something that has to be solved (to be clear, I know that there is some media that is like the former, but it’s not nearly as common as the latter, which can be very very tiring).

[@shanjida8353]

It made sense in that movie.he was a combat veteran.

[@tksm97]

@@shanjida8353 im not upset he was in a wheelchair, or that he’s a veteran. i’m upset that a disabled protagonist is “fixed” by his disability being removed by the end of the movie - something that is unfortunately far too common in media.

[@wyterabitt2149]

If you could not be in a wheelchair, and chose to not bother, then that is a mental health issue and a disturbing as anyone who thinks it's just a bad thing that should be looked down on.

[@thefilmdirector1]

thats sucks but you cant convince me or anyone that not having working legs is better than having working legs. Like wtf are you on about?

[@anodyneghost]

Is the video not synced to the audio for anyone else? Am I missing something?

[@Kitinelli]

My favourite thing about Avatar is the bioluminescence in plants and animals because it’s such a cool vibe that I love in real plants and animals too. Also if you haven’t seen it the Sideways video about the soundtrack and the potential it had is absolutely amazing.

[@lise1902]

I'm so happy to see someone recommend the Sideways video. I went to the comments to do so myself, if no one else did.

[@KevinWeirG2]

Am I the only one who the audio is WILDLY out of sync? I restarted my browser and it's still some random audio. Guess I'll come back later to see if it's fixed itself.

[@sniderguy]

Yes. It looks like the podcast clip that's right at the top of the video may have been synced to video that is no longer there, because the video goes straight to Amanda saying "I don't think there's a movie that's been less for me...", so the entire audio is on a 15-ish second lag and it's very hard to watch. Posting this on as many of these comments as I can in the hopes that she sees this and it's an easy fix.

[@leviathan8215]

That moment when Kiri was like "oh man, I'm tied up again??" really summed up the quality of the plot for me

[@thefilmdirector1]

That was tooq, which shows how much attention you actually paid during your viewing. 3 hours too long for your tik tok rotted brain?

[@jonnyc429]

​@@thefilmdirector1 Tuk*

[@Ellisepha]

The story beats really repeated a few times that it got ridiculous. Also the fact that there were at least 5 scenes throughout the entire movie where it seemed like the eldes son was gonna die any second now lol. Poor guy had more death flags than a character played by Sean Bean.

[@fierytopaz]

The main critique that always stuck with me for the first Avatar was, about 3 years after it came out...name a character you liked from it. Maybe you remember "Jake" or "Sigourney Weaver's character". But I'm willing to bet that before this movie was finally scheduled to come out and people started rewatching in preparation, even most fans of the original would have had a hard time naming more than "a" character. They just had so little emotional impact, no one ever brought it up as an option for movie nights. I barely remembered the plot other than "kind of like Pocahontas, but focused on John Smith. With aliens."

[@heythere9371]

Pocahontas had a terrible message. It said "colonization is OK, the problem is that the colonizers and the Native Americans are BOTH racist," John Smith stayed a colonizer at the end. Avatar says, "No, you can't stay neutral in the face of colonization, environmental destruction, and militarism. You must stand in solidarity with the oppressed, and defend our planet"

[@mooni6799]

@@heythere9371 avatar still has colonization is good thoughts, by not showing Jake learning or have more character for him to be shown in a pot about what happens because of it, avatar is no better then pocahontas.

[@devanarayans5131]

@@mooni6799 what?

[@heythere9371]

@@mooni6799 I don't know what you just said, but it's wrong

[@mooni6799]

@@heythere9371 Jack the character in the movie avatar. The colonist within the story is never shown proper character development neither repercussions for his actions that the movie is on par with Pocahontas (Within its theming of colonists/colonization). Also you can't say someone's wrong when you don't understand.

[@symmetrykidkun8]

I’ve always thought James Cameron’s films were a bit overhyped…and it seems like a large part of the first Avatar’s success was the graphics of the time, but now it’s like everything else.

[@rohegarcia2802]

Have you seen the movie in IMAX 3D? Because trust me, it’s not like everything else.

[@lordschnitzel7961]

The Movie was actually pretty decent. Better than the First one. Loved the aquatic life. Was it a crazy next level groundbreaking new era of Science fiction ? No But it was a really good time

[@Not_Always]

Im going to go see it next week and I haven't been to theaters in over a year.

[@neliabedelia]

@@Not_Always definitely watch it in 3D, it was really cool :) there's scenes where the water bubbles or air particles look like they're floating out of the screen, it looks beautiful but i didn't expect less

[@Flugs0]

@@neliabedelia did you go to imax? i want to watch it in 3d, but i don't have an imax nearby.

[@neliabedelia]

@@Flugs0 no worries, i didn't watch it in imax either :) i wish i could've because our theater has it, but it was pretty packed that weekend so we worked with what we got lol. it still looked pretty good in my opinion

[@neliabedelia]

@@Flugs0 i watched it in 3D at an AMC if that helps :)

[@Beautyonthebrain_]

is it just me or is the audio completely out of sync with the video???

[@silvertongue.242_99]

The son for a son line was more symbolic than real like the irony of it all he wanted to trade sons through blood but it ended up being the bonds. Like blood only a part of it

[@silvertongue.242_99]

He is accepting him truly as his son. Before it was more he just his kids friends coming over from school since he lives with the other humans

[@gracetorrance5109]

I think the 'a son for a son' comment from Jake is really meant to be read as him accepting Spider as a son in place of the one he lost. Neytiri says the same thing when she's threatening to kill spider so I read Jake saying it later on as him spinning it to have a positive meaning.

[@eelnetflix5196]

Is anyone else's audio not syncing to the video???

[@monolithus4064]

So, the video and audio are WILDLY out of sync

[@poluticon]

I agree with you regarding the story of the first movie. I saw it twice in the theater when it first came out because I was enamored by the technical aspect of the movie, I thought the 3D was great and I thought it was a beautifully artistic movie, but the plot never really grabbed my attention. In fact I haven't seen it since then because I honestly don't care about it anymore.

[@davidcameron5308]

I saw a GIF of a character trying to cut out a fish from a net and I rolled my eyes so hard. My biggest complaint from the first one (besides it not being memorable) was the hamfisted themes stolen from real world indigenous and environmental concerns, except now it's about aliens and entirely divorced from its actual context so it's more "palatable?" I suspect the sequel has the exact same problem.

[@misscandle]

As someone who just watched the movie, I've been wracking my brain but I don't remember a single scene of someone trying to save a fish from a net. The only time a net was cut was when a character was trying to rescue other characters.

[@LumeyBloon34]

The themes are there to make you aware of our problems on earth. + James hired a LOT of people from different indiginous backgrounds to help work and develop the film. The amount of time and respect involved in making the film is huge.

[@davidcameron5308]

@@misscandle It's possible that was only used in promotionsl material? I'm not sure but I believe that's what I saw

[@cyagami90]

@@LumeyBloon34 inaccurate he hired the help and then disregarded it. Even the films musical score is shit. He hired ppl who study indigenous music for the score and didnt like it bc it didnt sound white washed enough, scrapped it and gave the world shit

[@eddis6283]

@@LumeyBloon34 I wish that films heavily utilizing/incorporating indigenous culture didn't result in me leaving the theater feeling retraumatized. Maybe it brings awareness for the masses, but for me it just feels like being smacked in the face with the problems that have impacted generations of indigenous people. That's just my opinion though 🤷‍♀️

[@sabrinastratton1991]

I like Avatar. It's one of my favorite movies. I saw it with my dad in 2009 because he LOVED Sci fi movies. I actually even learned a bit of Na'avi which is a very pretty language. And the complexities of Pandora and its flora and fauna were very creative. Haven't seen the 2nd one yet but I hope to soon.

[@Rugops42]

Hey Amanda a review of "Our Flag Means Death" would be much appreciated. They've just wrapped up filming season 2.

[@thestoryfactory8429]

There's a hard dividing line between Cameron's work before and after Titanic. Before, you got creative filming and some really good character work. There's a reason watching the T-800 melt/ John's reaction to it hits so hard in Terminator 2. The death-swim in The Abyss is pure emotion. Etc, etc, etc. Then came Titanic. The budgets started matching the ego and character went out the window in the name of spectacle. "AVATAR" is unintentionally an allegory for the soulless, hollow his movies have become. They're pretty, but empty.

[@TitularHeroine]

In this reply that basically adds nothing, I'll say I thoroughly *despised* Titanic when it was released and I still do now.

[@KeybladeMasterAndy]

"Soulless" is not the word to use here. If anything, it's "patronizing". Nothing feels like it's there because of a mandate. Cameron apparently gives his all(his soul) to a message we already have heard before, and acts like we haven't heard it before.

[@Manuel-ks9qo]

Titanic is the last great kolossal of the 1900s. A classic melodrama like no other. Soulless avatar? It is the summit of his cinema. Consistent and sincere in his approach. This channel is not credible in talking about cinema, with Spider-Man poster behind it.

[@lumenx7499]

James Cameron dreamt of Pandora when he was 19 and has since wanted to create it. Avatar is less about story and more about the technical marvel created. Avatar is definitely a passion project and a huge amount of love and time has been poured into it. It might not have a good story, but passion is something you can’t deny. You can see it in every thought out detail about the ecosystem, and how every creature is named and has a place in the ecosystem. As a plus, I haven’t heard anyone say anything about crunch time during Avatar’s production, so I’m glad the artists got their appropriate time.

[@gateauxq4604]

Really absolutely 100%. Glad to see someone else appreciating The Abyss.

[@diamond_dynamo2214]

My biggest thing about the new movie is that it's so weirdly intensely patriarchal, in a way that the first movie really wasn't. Like, Jake has a through line about how "a father's role is to protect, without that he has no meaning" or something, and it just goes completely unexplored or critiqued. And the gender dynamics felt really "only men can fight, except for the mom who is really intense about protecting her kids". Overall I definitely liked the first one more as a movie, although both of them are far from perfect. Like, the plot of the original is definitely unoriginal, but I just find it really fun, while the new one is a lot more off-putting. Oh also, it's really clear to me that whether he knows it or not, what James Cameron really wants to make is a Pandora prestige tv show, not movies. There are way too many plotlines crammed into the new movie, even with the ridiculous runtime, and a season of tv would give him time to really devote the viewer's attention to each individual story

[@shirinzed6481]

There were two things that I liked about the second movie: the water looked amazing and I liked how the water tribe people had this unique characteristics. I kinda hated how everyone spoke English, I haven’t watched the first one but how is English now the official language of Pandora? And I was pissed off that they buried their son in the sea, all he wanted was to go back home and they buried him in a place he was bullied and hurt.

[@AnkouBlake]

They subtly explained the English in the opening. Jake says that the Navi language has become so natural to him now it "might as well be English" and from there on its in English

[@shirinzed6481]

@@AnkouBlake oh thanks you I missed that

[@fermintenava5911]

Yeah, all that money for the creation of a language in the first movie, and the sequel ammounted to using "bro" and "sis" for the kids. Tolkien would be rolling and screaming in his grave if he knew...

[@versatildoom]

Finally someone put into words why I just never understood the hype behind Avatar

[@jossecoupe446]

The world is just so f*cking mystical, cool, enthralling and exciting, and as a kid, when bad dialogue and acting didnt really matter, it was absolutely magical. I had dreams about living on Pandora, it was wild.

[@DumbxPuddles]

i never saw the og in the theater...but for this one I got to see it in 4dx...i was crying in the opening with all the visuals. I didn't even care still this go around at 30 years old about acting or story. I just was so happy to see it and experience it.

[@TacticusPrime]

Pandora looks too much like our world for me. I like sci-fi worlds that are properly alien.

[@sydroper4761]

Same! I had a bunch of the extra ecology/anthropology books, and I thought it was badass and meaningful because I was 13 🙃

[@KateeAngel]

I never understood why most people love mysticism. I prefer real world where all live forms aren't controlled by some creepy worldwide hivemind, and which is run by blind natural forces, not some mystical powers

[@jossecoupe446]

@@KateeAngel A world of mysticism inspires endless awe, imagination, and wondering, you dont fully understand the world, and thats exactly what makes it so infinitely fascinating. I usually read fantasy for that reason, it's just so magical. Real world novels have their own but different merits, though they will never be as transformative and wonderful in their worldbuilding. The fact that such a world was aptly brought to life on the big screen will never fail to make me giddy.

[@bridgetmadden5716]

...was the audio and the visual way out of sync for anyone else in this video?

[@sniderguy]

Yes. It looks like the podcast clip that's right at the top of the video may have been synced to video that is no longer there, because the video goes straight to Amanda saying "I don't think there's a movie that's been less for me...", so the entire audio is on a 15-ish second lag and it's very hard to watch. Posting this on as many of these comments as I can in the hopes that she sees this and it's an easy fix.

[@melodymagickal6508]

Finally, someone that feels exactly as I do about Avatar. Everyone was gushing uncontrollably about how awesome it was. in school when it was almost Winter break or something it was on the projectors in some rooms. I had watched it on a small TV before and the dialogue destroyed the movie. They could have made it good. Keep some deleted scenes, fix the horrible dialogue, have Jake actually try and find the solution for humans to get the unobtabainium (why not call it Goddess Crystal or something? Anything but the other horrible name.) Jake feels like...a crummy run of the mill video game character that dies half way through the beginning of the game. I haven't seen the second one... I hope it's better but I doubt I'll love it even if it is.

[@erinanderson4185]

I love Avatar. People often forget that Pandora is technically a large group of all organisms connected together and that Pandora's goddess is real. I love that the film lets me dive into the world to postulate neo-humanistic ideas in conjunction with scientific and religious philosophy. I love it. I watched it when I was 8 and was captivated. I was worried going into the second movie that being an adult now would dull the experience, but it didn't. After the film I felt incredibly emotionally affected. I understand that Avatar does not resonate with everyone, but for me it does and the most of any film in my life.

[@punkithecat]

Yes I love that, honestly wish we could see that more instead of the human stuff haha

[@playfulpanthress]

I was a full on adult when the first one came out. LOVED IT!! 😍 This was amazing series!!

[@ramonchristianplacido1608]

Avatar is white savior garbage

[@wendiewebb4457]

@@ramonchristianplacido1608how

[@Britterzbee]

The audio/video desync is a bit rough, hope you can get that fixed! In the mean time, shout out to a comment I saw by @Z Zeigerson regarding their solution! They opened up a second tab and then synced up the audio from one tab with the muted video from the other. Tried it for myself and it was a big help, I'll just need to remember to pay attention because I can't pause without having to resync lol

[@PequenoGiant]

I only recall liking the visuals when I saw the first, then being bored out of my mind during the actual plot, so feeling very validated

[@wingedyera]

I would also argue that the uniqueness about this movie was the visuals. It was the first movie using 3d well. If you generally dislike 3d then yeah it's not an interesting enough movie to stand on its own as good. But personally I didn't think it was dead boring it was enjoyable enough in the comfortable predictable kind of way. But in general I like my movies brainless... and comfortable

[@sim771]

I hated the Notebook and fell asleep in 5 minutes. One of my favorite movies is In Time with Justin Timberlake and Amanda Seyfried. It has terrible reviews but i think the concept is genius despite the execution being not as great. Movies are totally subjective and speak to how we are all different, if we were all the same we’d be boring. Totally get you on things just not being for you.

[@tombsofak]

I wish In Time would turn into a franchise or a series even. Such a cool concept.

[@nathaliemillerr]

if u like the concept of in time u should read everless and evermore I thought they were a fun turn on the concept :))

[@flyingwind66]

OMG another person that enjoyed In Time! I also wish to explore that concept more. There feels like so many more interesting stories could be told with it.

[@flyingwind66]

​@@nathaliemillerr thanks for the rec! I just borrowed it from the library :D

[@strawberryfox8819]

The most memorable thing for me from Avatar was the strange hair sex scene. It baffles me to this day and I vehemently remember sitting in a Hotel room in London, watching it with my mom on a tiny screen and wondering "How the hell did I get here?"

[@highfae]

I loved everything but the third act (of the original), or humans in the story in general- omg _imagine_ if they’d just shown that world, *without humans having to be a part of the story at all!* Anyway, THANK YOU SO MUCH for airing how weird it is how they connect with animals when it’s regarded as this intimate thing… that’s exactly how I felt about it!

[@ace_of_cakes]

Yes! I kept thinking while I was watching the second movie how would have been so much better if there were no humans, just a story about this beautiful planet and these beautiful sea creatures.

[@renzorro2001]

@@ace_of_cakes but then what would the plot be? The whole point is that it’s an allegory for colonization

[@ace_of_cakes]

@@renzorro2001 There's literally a million plots you could write that don't involve humans. It's about colonization because James Cameron chose to make it about colonization. It could have been about family issues or a coming-of-age story or a love story or literally anything James Cameron wanted it to be. It could even have been about a war between two Na'vi tribes. But no, James Cameron wanted it to be a colonization metaphor and I personally think that's stupid (not because colonization metaphors are inherently bad but because James Cameron has nothing new or interesting to say on the subject).

[@benzaiten933]

using the Papyrus font is just *chef's kiss*

[@Glimare]

For some reason, your visuals and audio isn't lining up for me. Refreshed it, paused it, still not syncing. Did something happen to the vid or is it just on my end?

[@kimjongun5613]

I’m so glad that more people have come out saying they never even liked the first Avatar because I’ve been saying that since it came out (and I was young so I should’ve liked it because of kid’s logic) and people always thought I was weird and didn’t know what a good movie is

[@myka788]

The non consensual tendril twiddling has always freaked me out about this movie 😅

[@antoinettedubarry5742]

james cameron is a classic writer - not wanting to give up control of their baby ... even if their baby really .... really needs it

[@xxZigxx]

which is wild because he was the guy who swoops in takes control of an IP to make an amazing sequel that's arguably better than the first! he really feels like hes lost his touch with avatar, and lost touch with reality. somehow these movies feel as fetishy and self gratifying as when tarantino shows close ups of bare feet in his movies.

[@karsen6948]

Anyone else's video messed up?

[@Tentacult]

i think the mothership visual part was accidently deleted which result in the entire video's audio off sync? will come back later to properly experience Amanda's hate for avatar

[@sniderguy]

Yes. It looks like the podcast clip that's right at the top of the video may have been synced to video that is no longer there, because the video goes straight to Amanda saying "I don't think there's a movie that's been less for me...", so the entire audio is on a 15-ish second lag and it's very hard to watch. Posting this on as many of these comments as I can in the hopes that she sees this and it's an easy fix.

[@efoxkitsune9493]

Commenting so Amanda can see this

[@devildham]

0:29 it was at this point that I realized that I had found one of my own. Subscribed

[@mxmissy]

The one thing I hate about Avatar that I didn't think about it when it came out, but the fact that like Jake's disability is "fixed" because he's become an alien-human hybrid. Like, what the actual fuck?

[@Darkthestral1]

Reminder that James Cameron designed the Navi to be as sexually attractive as possible. Literally would show guys the designs and change it based on how fuckable they found it It makes the movie significantly weirder to engage with

[@KateeAngel]

Manipulation of audience's desires to get them to spend more money... Yeah, and we are supposed to believe this is his passion project with deep meaning to him

[@monicavelazquezrodriguez3035]

I found them completely unattractive, I imagine it works with furry comunities...

[@rosiv9617]

What the f.... childhood ruined

[@Arinaretina]

??? where did you see this

[@tyclone6266]

Source: it was revealed to me in a dream

[@tascha255]

I have to say, I finally feel understood. I never liked that film either despite watching it in cinema back then and until this day, I have never encountered anyone that shared this view. Finally. Thank you!

[@ScozBazz]

just a heads up the audio and visuals are wildly out of sync, video isn't really watchable in its current state :/ looks like the audio got desynced real bad when you removed the first clip

[@LameBushido]

Its watchable

[@leonie8525]

Went to see Way of Water with my friend last night, and afterwards we both were like '... so, Cameron did a Titanic with how the boat sank, right?' Right down to Spider and Kiri pulling each other up and over as it was going down and keeping hold of each other as it sank.

[@morgan5923]

So… have you seen Fern Gully from the 90s? It even has Robin Williams and Tim Curry. Yeah, that was proto avatar.

[@katiebailey3439]

What's really strange is when I first watched the movie I got used to the visuals of the blue people but now I'm just vaguely unsettled every time I see them cause my brain can see the cgi. It just focuses super hard on the cgi and bothers me.

[@stucrew7232]

Is there something wrong with the audio? It's all "un-synced" and makes the video difficult to watch for me. Is it just my device?

[@annelooney1090]

Same.

[@sablebranwen2539]

I really tried to like Avatar when it came out. I really, really tried. I heard all my friends and family talking about this amazing masterpiece of a movie and thought 'that _has_ to make it good, right?' I thought something was wrong with me. I bought several versions of it just to see if maybe I was missing some hidden magic. But nope. Just turns out I didn't like it. 🤷‍♀

[@iramrafiq5075]

...I thought if I watched it at home again it would make it better, but sadly it wasn't for me

[@mysticmistress6101]

I feel like the dialogue is very authentic to a group of military grunts. I’ve hung out with a lot of them and it sounds a lot like that.

[@joshwondra9821]

I loved the newest avatar movie almost entirely because I am the exact same kind of weird fish nerd as James Cameron. The awesome biosphere counteracted the awkward anglo-centric story about the white savior and cultural imperialism. I also liked some of the awesome sci-fi ideas the brought up, even though they wasted basically 100% of them

[@fischerondracek9983]

anyones audio messed up on the video

[@gabbie7265]

Is the audio desynced by 16 seconds for anyone else?

[@justinwilliam4644]

The whole vid for me

[@marimarianations9355]

The whole video for me, on mobile.

[@sniderguy]

Yes. It looks like the podcast clip that's right at the top of the video may have been synced to video that is no longer there, because the video goes straight to Amanda saying "I don't think there's a movie that's been less for me...", so the entire audio is on a 15-ish second lag and it's very hard to watch. Posting this on as many of these comments as I can in the hopes that she sees this and it's an easy fix.