THE CARRIERS! Bisu 🇰🇷 (P) vs Light 🇰🇷 (T) on Benzene - StarCraft - Brood War Remastered

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[@farhorizons6163]

With that SCV perched on the hill overlooking the city -- also came to mind was: SCV knew he was gonna die with the dragoon coming "up the hill" behind him, so he takes one long final look over the horizon before succumbing to his fate. Kinda sad/epic/melancholy all at once lol.

[@serioussilliness2064]

Lovely.

[@fatemakeus]

This carrier rush build is kinda risky …he skips zealots speed…he skips reaver…he skips photon canon for probe protection …once Light see the carrier come out, Bisu immediately lose 3 bases for nothing …

[@josefmynona4228]

Exactly!!! Zeal speed is a MUST and playing without stormimg??!!

[@user-iu1ru1qz7u]

Bisu often drops games by losing too much income to vultures. The vultures were erasing his workers during that last attack. Pro players are a bit too cocky thinking they can defend several bases through micro. It costs more to replace all your workers than to put 2-3 cannons at hard to defend spots.

[@MittensOnly]

1:17 "Morning Frank." "Morning Ralph."

[@g22sda83]

Always good to see Carriers vs Terran.

[@arbootieoaks]

Bisu was also very low on interceptors at the end there too, which I think was key.

[@MrMaddox57]

In his younger playing days, Bisu probably could have still won with the limited number of workers, all the elites, but I think ALL of them are slowing WAAAAY down or just retiring at this point. Starcraft needs a reboot, or it too, EVENTUALLY, will become a game of the past, despite it's legacy and history.

[@VOLKOV9]

Abstract math is beautiful, and always ends up finding applications. What we should be saying "screw you" to is the curriculum that shoves it down all children's throats, and the societal priorities we have that funnel almost anyone that likes math away from education and leaves it to be taught largely by people who don't like it or know what it is. (It's not memorizing formulas, but we're all taught it is. It's really exploration, principles, puzzles, problem-solving, and structure.) I know some wonderful math teachers out there, but unfortunately they're in too small a minority.

[@kellereclub3828]

Strange decisions and prioritizations. Again why Archons? Scarabs would have wrecked the Goliaths. 11:52 Why try to snipe the Science Facility and later Supply Depots? The key targets were War Factories. Supply blocking works best versus Zerg because 200 minerals apiece and Overlords consume larva to be produced thereby slowing army growth. 23:45 The carrier group could have just attacked laterally from the side. Burst down that Command Center - why bother to attack upwards from the bottom?

[@Ziegfried82]

Science facility was actually a great choice, prevents the terran tech tree to continue upgrading vehicle attack/armor. Killing turrets and depots was not optimal but the factories have a lot more HP. The archons were ridiculous though, a terrible unit choice for that matchup only good as damage sponges. You're right that scarabs would have been better. Or why not just not merge the high templars and use storms? Or even illusionary carriers?

[@kellereclub3828]

@@Ziegfried82 From many comments on replays, I have a prejudice against Archons. I do not find them sound and suitable for competitive play. In PvT matchups, everything Terran and ranged kills Archons. In PvZ matchups, very cheap Hydralisks can be massed and outmaneuver your army killing the Archons. I do not find Archons suitable damage sponges on the same level as Ultralisks, Forges, Cybernetics Cores. Even for the cost, Zealots make better damage sponges and are yet cheaper. Archons simply have no place. No niche.

[@Mitissa515]

Been a while since I've played SC1, but can't you just right-click the repair icon for Auto-repairs or was that introduced in SC2?

[@-Nick-T]

there should be a falcon paladin unit in sc3, whenever it drops

[@FalconPaladin]

Hahaha that'd be super cool. Maybe a critter!

[@poplach]

@@FalconPaladin then I guess Kakaru gets less attention :(

[@critter2193]

@@FalconPaladin I'll take that as a compliment.

[@Maltbyr]

@@critter2193 so you were hiding all these years for this comment

[@stefanc4520]

How did Bisu lose.......? If I had to guess it's cause he wasted too much time trying to kill turrets and supply depots instead of the factories.

[@Ziegfried82]

The choice to attack the turrets wasn't the greatest idea but it was draining a ton of Light's minerals. I think it was more of the questionable moves with his ground army and lack of defense is what allowed Light to take the match.

[@Azurel777]

you got 60k, yay :)

[@FalconPaladin]

🎉

[@djupsman]

Here. We. Go !

[@DrZergling]

Missle turret is 75 Minerals i think..

[@Bubonic22]

Yup, was a Brood War buff to Terran

[@DrZergling]

@@Bubonic22 I think it was always 75 minerals?

[@Ziegfried82]

@@DrZergling nope it was 100 minerals in the original game.

[@DrZergling]

@@Ziegfried82 dont think so. U mean in starcraft without broodwar? In broodwar it 75 minersals..

[@and6239]

Carrier cheese couldn't stop a mech army on open fields

[@ericjepson3765]

My favorite P v T is Reach vs iloveoov. The mantoss vs the manterran.

[@ObeliskM]

Looks like protoss usually prefer arbiters to carriers. I wonder why.

[@SocietyOfTheLiftedLorax]

A few valks. I keep wanting a few valks or some cloaked wraiths .

[@haroldtoca8015]

Nice cast

[@dave199010]

make ghosts, lock carriers down?

[@cuse123456]

they need to do a resurected version of brood war, like they did with diablo 2. i like the HD gfx but diablo 2 resurected style, omg......would be amazballs

[@YaksAttack]

Are valkyries worth it vs carriers?

[@ИванПетров-ж7э]

In fastest maps yes, in regular games they are too expensive, need another branch of upgrades (ship plating/weapons), and if Protoss just swap to Zealot/Dragoons you just out of usefull army - Protoss can just dont kill Valks and you will have no free supply to fast go mass mech (every Valk is 3 supply, and you need a lot of them to really counter Carriers) Wraith at least dont need much upgrades to be effective (only Cloak), much cheaper (like 2-3 Wraith cost 1 Valk) and use 2 supply instead of 3, and also have ground attack, so opponent cant just ignore them and go GW army transition - if they are ignored they just will kill all your workers, so Protoss must to kill them, and Terran can go back to ground after freeing up supply, Valks could be completly ignored and you will have like 60-80 dead weight supply

[@ChannelMaestroVito]

Ghost + lockdown should work fine imo

[@Ziegfried82]

Never a good idea in any normal game. Carriers have way too much armor (4 starting armor!) so valks are terrible against them. Valks would only come out against mass scout/corsair really which never happens in TvP.

[@ИванПетров-ж7э]

@@Ziegfried82 Point of Valks are good against Carriers is because they simply kill ALL interseptors fast with splash, faster than Carriers build them (same as mass Marines or mass Hydra vs Carriers are super good - they just kill interseptrors and Carriers without interseptors do nothing) Also Valks dealing dmg vs Carriers (little, but constant) with splash, when interseptors returning to Carrier body - missiles following them and damaging body from 2 miles away, thats also killing bodyis, not fast ofc but constantly crippling them (you can see that on Fastest maps - Carriers all time taking dmg from Valks even when Valks just attacking interceptors) Valks in fact are very good vs Carriers, they are just too expensive (plus another upgrades branch) and too specialized on air for common TvP matches (not on Fastest Map)

[@VerdeART]

Can someone explain splash damage?

[@KrisD23]

you fire on one thing, and things next to it (enemy and friendly) also get damaged to an extent.

[@EbonAvatar]

Bisu is on a big Falcon Paladin losing streak 😔

[@JJ-qo7th]

As a Terran fan: If cloaked wraiths was a better method of handling carriers than goliaths, we'd see the professionals using cloaked wraiths.

[@stefanstoyanov4926]

I haven't seen anyone won with those goliats against carrieers. Maybe i recall Flash won against Snow, but it was not exactly the same, because when he realized that Snow goes for carriers, he just rushed immediately with his army.

[@zolniu]

Cloaked wraihts can be very good counter to Carriers but you have to keep them hidden before attacking. Otherwise few Corsairs will just melt them. But if you look at this game, there were few instances where Bisu's carrier group was out in the open without any observer nearby - few Wraiths would do wonders in that situation.

[@fwoopmarkin7467]

As another Terran fan: the player was trying to rebuild useless turrets instead of making just one Science Vessel with EMP ready patrol the perimeter.

[@Ziegfried82]

Wraiths can and do kill carriers esp when the carriers have zero obs or corsair support. Ghosts can and do completely shut down carriers as well. This was the type of game where Light was sitting on a ton of gas and could have transitioned into either one of them no problem and almost lost because he spammed missile turrets instead draining all his minerals. Luckily for him in this game Bisu made some bad plays with his ground units and didn't play very good defense.

[@JJ-qo7th]

From the discord, a comparative breakdown: Their air dps is almost identical, but goliaths have over twice the ground dps, an extra point of armor, slightly more HP, 60% more range... And are *50 minerals and gas cheaper per unit*. And they come out of a building that makes tanks, which you probably have a bunch of anyway. And they can counter carriers any time of the day instead of just when they have energy. And you can build 3 in the time it takes to build 2 wraiths. In short, Wraiths are much more expensive, much slower to build, fragile, require a divergent tech path and buildings not commonly used by meching Terrans (which makes them even more expensive), are dependent on energy and the Protoss not having detection, and have less general utility when not hunting carriers.

[@kurtzmann22]

bad positioning by the carriers on the last battle

[@pirogovpavel]

carrier control is ok, but the other part of army is missed... just dying without carrier support

[@serioussilliness2064]

Sweet

[@gasparmc]

good macro vs micro example

[@andreluiskarpinski732]

I think he ggs when he has no more money for interceptors and carriers would certainly die

[@jp92382]

honestly sometimes i prefer broodwar to sc2

[@FalconPaladin]

You and thousands and thousands and thousands of my subscribers. :)

[@decocinaonline4285]

8 gas = 42 galons

[@stevestevenss5193]

Why don’t we ever see lockdown In the current meta I feel like it owns carriers

[@FalconPaladin]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/n2qTf3lrjctpiNk&lc=UgzTnQvyrfNHRKEk4xJ4AaABAg

[@stevestevenss5193]

@@FalconPaladin I’ve watched every single brood war cast you’ve ever done I just figured we’d see much more lockdown as it works so well

[@stevestevenss5193]

@@FalconPaladin wasn’t that one more for arbiters than carriers though?

[@FalconPaladin]

Artosis? kzbin.info/www/bejne/a4XVe4BnrNaGhpY&lc=UgzwDLtkA5Y001Q7ue14AaABAg

[@detaildad4894]

Screw you unapplicable math 😎👍

[@narcirvalor2718]

WHY??? Why all terran NEVER make: Wraith, Valkyrie or BC again carrier? A yamato or couple missiles down carrier faster! Wraith with invisibility can kill them without a hit! Or some gosth with lock down?

[@thunderdragon2125]

Valks, Wraiths and BCs are useless against a ground army, so if they kill the carriers they just swtich back to Zealot and Dragoon Production and now Terran has a bunch of useless units and Protoss can just walk in. Ghosts definitely should have been made though.

[@ObeliskM]

@@thunderdragon2125 well wraiths are not useless, if you snipe observer

[@Ziegfried82]

Valks are terrible vs protoss unless for some crazy reason the toss decides to mass scout/corsair. BCs simply take too long to ramp up...the yamato needs 150 energy which takes even longer to gather up once your BCs are out. Keep in mind protoss has some hard counters to BCs: 1) scouts 2) dark archon feedback & mind control 3) high templar psi storm and illusion. Illusion carriers is one way to make the enemy terran waste their yamato shots. But ideally protoss just makes a few dark archons and wrecks.

[@utarian7]

Bisu carrier micro weak. Sometimes I think toss is UP but when I see top tier toss make shit mistakes like fighting gols with carriers and fighting tanks and vults with gateway I think toss players just haven't got their shit together.

[@greenwave819]

GoT!!!

[@vincently1995]

Is it cool or what?

[@EbeeDeeby]

How bad credit cards are? How's a fella supposed to quickly send money to Vtubers? Just jam a buncha cash in an envelope and mail it to them!?

[@FlymanMS]

Bisu has been constantly losing probes while not killing Light’s SCVs in numbers, no wonder it ended that way.

[@poznanie10565]

Amazing terrible playing from bisu Why need to fly over whole map Haras 11 12, add cariers faster

[@cyberneticdex69]

the T won by pure luck ..