The Circle of Stars Druid: D&D

[@TreantmonksTemple]

So I'm getting a lot of comments that Guiding Bolt can be upcast for free because the rule doesn't say you can't do that. Sage Advice says: "What level is a spell if you cast it without a spell slot? Such a spell is cast at its lowest possible level, which is the level that appears near the top of its description. Unless you have a special ability that says otherwise", Of course, play however you want, but my assumption is that this applies here.

[@smile-tl9in]

can you take a look at pathfinder 2e ? I'd love to see how you would make a god wizard in this game. I throughly enjoyed your guides for pathfinder 1e and 5e

[@godofzombi]

Agreed. You don't even need Sage Advice. It says right in the spell description: "At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 2nd level or higher, the damage increases by 1d6 for each slot level above 1st." since you are casting it without using a 2+ spell slot the damage doesn't increase.

[@Oniphire]

WotC's rule of thumb is generally to state what something can do rather than what it can't

[@Yeimi66]

I’m Playing it now. The free casts are always level one. You can ‘buy’ higher spell slot casts because it’s on your spell list. Hope that helps maybe 🤔

[@Razdasoldier]

I am curious about how you read chalice needs to target a second creature?

[@timeforsuchaword]

You forgot to mention that twinkling constellations lets you switch between starry forms at the start of your turn for free, so you no longer have to commit to one form for the whole 10 minutes. You can thus use archer on a turn when your concentration isn't at risk or chalice on a turn when you're healing, and then switch back to dragon when you might be attacked.

[@Adurnis]

Somehow I had completely missed this! An amazing boost.

[@einzuschauer4712]

Yeah thats makes the other forms also very useful

[@Mmmbop0987]

This may be an update since this post is a year old, but d&d beyond says you can change form with a bonus action each turn.

[@timeforsuchaword]

@@Mmmbop0987 It's not in the TCoE errata, so that sounds like an error.

[@Mmmbop0987]

@@timeforsuchaword I don’t own the book, so you’re probably right, no one tell my DM!

[@thebitterfig9903]

The thing I like most about Stars, why it's my favorite Druid, is that it's just you. Shepherd and to some extent Wildfire are pet classes. Moon is a shape-shift focused class. Spores is a melee class. All kind of direct you into particular playstyles. Stars is just you. You have various powers, you stay yourself, and all's good. That's just appealing to me, regardless of power level. That said, doesn't hurt that this is just better than Dreams or Land. :D

[@wassentme1891]

I would say it is stronger than the other Druids, but not by much compared to the best options. And I like the flavor.

[@phrogprince2223]

For healing by the Chalice, the target being “you or another creature ” means “other than you,” not “other than the original target.” You can heal the target with a Cure Wounds spell and provide that same target with the healing from Chalice.

[@Razdasoldier]

My favorite thing to do is HP tank with this build. Chalice + Healing spirit to restore any round 1 damage before the HP comes online or Dragon + Healing spirit to make sure the HP doesn't drop.

[@colinlove4659]

It is worth noting that the Circle of Spores now does necrotic damage not poison, which is a definite upgrade.

[@GrimViridian]

I thought the spores always did necrotic? I have a spores druid, the poison damage is added to melee while the halo of spores damage is the necrotic if the save is failed

[@colinlove4659]

@@GrimViridian I see you missed the update! Your Symbiotic Entity now does necrotic damage not poison. The Halo of Spores remains unchanged. But you not knowing does rather illustrate my point.

[@GrimViridian]

@@colinlove4659 ah I did! That's awesome and much better, too bad that campaign is on hiatus right now XD

[@archmagemc3561]

That really helps Spores be that combat necromancer, but spores is still reliant on how much downtime your DM gives you to raise a zombie/skeleton army.

[@ChristianW1975]

The channel really seems to be growing fast, well deserved !

[@dajosh6271]

So true. I'm always happy to get a push notification when there is a new video =)

[@goranfrka]

yes, Chris rly makes an effort and produces good stuff!

[@Cellix312]

@@dajosh6271 kinda crazy that it’s taken this long. His God Wizard guides were incredibly popular. I guess there just wasn’t KZbin marketing in them.

[@shikanosuke8898]

you should note that this is one of the few subclasses that offers something scaling off of proficiency right off the bat, which makes it an incredibly appealing multiclassing option

[@andrewmcmillan229]

Archer form is just Spiritual Weapon that lasts 10 times as long and you don't have to worry about moving from one enemy to another. Most people consider Spiritual Weapon a pretty good spell, right?

[@timeforsuchaword]

Yeah, a decent number of the spellcasting subclasses in tasha's get some kind of spiritual weapon equivalent. The reason it's not quite as good for the stars druid is that it comes at the opportunity cost of the other starry forms.

[@Kurse_of_Kall]

Well Archer form can't be upcast at all, so it is only scaling by your wisdom mod, at least until level 10, and at level 10 it's not going to keep up. Means it is great at low levels, and then falls off as you have better things to do with your bonus action/wild shapes.

[@andrewmcmillan229]

@@Kurse_of_Kall I don't know who upcasts Spiritual weapon at 6th level anyway so at 10th level you're basically replicating the 4th level version. As far as keeping up, it's a bonus action. Druids aren't always going to be doing something with their bonus action anyway, and at 10th level you can change forms as a free action at the start of each turn, you aren't always going to be in direct danger of attack or concentrating on something vital and damage is damage even if it's not as much as a great weapon master divine smite.

[@matiasrostworowski5141]

@@andrewmcmillan229 refer back to the first reply. The reason it isn’t that good, is because if you take archer then you can’t take dragon, and dragon is better than archer in almost every scenario past lvl 5. Like, with resilient constitution feat it would be almost impossible to lose concentration

[@moto2442]

@@matiasrostworowski5141 yeah but the 10th level ability let's you switch forms. This means if you are safe you can switch to chalice for healing or you can go and do some extra damage to that pesky backliner. I mean it isn't a very long range but if you are making other casters take damage and do concentration checks as well then that is worthy.

[@Kurtlen]

Honestly a 2 level dip into Stars Druid seems like it's competing with the 1 level dip in Artificer for the best multiclass for a Wizard. Going five levels into Wizard for huge Concentration spells like Hypnotic Pattern/Haste and then taking the 2 level dip and guaranteeing all those concentration saves is pretty busted. And it works on Intelligence checks too. So if we have a 20 Intelligence and we use Counterspell/Dispel Magic with a 3rd level slot it's almost like we used a 5th level slot on it instead. And you're likely to get to the 20 Intelligence relatively quick because you don't need War Caster/Resilient/Lucky for those Con saves.

[@master_rafiki]

I've been thinking exactly the same.

[@navidmohebbi2462]

As somebody who played the Ua version till late levels, archer and chalice are clutch. The chalice is an automatic upcast for your healing spells and as my group, I found it really helpful and that was before the level 10 increase to 2d8.

[@gabrielseller6434]

Yeah, I mean Chalice stuck out to me quite a bit. Doubling or tripling my first level cure wounds is pretty great for stretching my spell slots

[@andrewfornes5320]

Did you ever use the Dragon form for the concentration bonus. I mean a lot of druid spells are con. I've heard people blasting with Guiding Bolt + Archer form as bonus action.

[@RulesandRulings]

It really does sound like the main benefit of Stars druid is freedom. Guidance frees up an extra cantrip slot. Dragon constellation frees up an ASI. And the other abilities are just fine.

[@hylohunter]

my friend and I had an argument about archer vs. dragon. He said "I don't really care about making concentration saves on small hits". What a misguided soul. Glad you agree dragon is the best :)

[@blackfang0815]

Probably has War Caster and a lot of faith.

[@jaredpuwalski8545]

I think dragon form pairs better with resilient constitution than war caster since it gives a minimum of ten before modifiers. Low rolls can still happen with advantage, but improving your minimum total is always nice.

[@benry007]

I do like the the archer though. Its basically spiritual weapon without using a spell slot. Then later its an improved spiritual weapon. Dragon is still the best but having the option of the other two is nice especially once you can switch them up. Shame druid don't get spirit guardians as that would work great woth the dragon constellation.

[@Dave004]

Weal could help that a little. If you get hit, especially if its 22+ dmg where you're needing more than a 10 to save, give your self Weal and a d6 to help with the Concentration Check. Can only use this a few times but helpful still. Woe is basically a weaker version of Unsettling Words, you cast a spell that requires a save then throw Woe at them taking d6 away to make sure it sticks. Great for Polymorphing an enemy or other big take out spells.

[@tai-cx5vj]

The fact that this class doesn't get Crown of Stars is absolutely just wrong

[@TreantmonksTemple]

I think they limit themselves to spells in the PHB or the current book to make sure that owning another sourcebook is not required.

[@adamkaris]

@@TreantmonksTemple they could have reprinted it XD

[@Wade8419]

I think I'd allow that if one of my players asked because it just fits.

[@ExeErdna]

It should be what you get at 14th level and have it work like your guiding bolt which makes it a direct upgrade and a decent capstone.

[@usernameunavalible00]

Do any subclasses get extra spells that are as high as 7th level spells? The highest I've seen for expanded spell lists for subclasses is 5th level spells. Edit: not counting magical secrets from bard

[@Twilight5007]

Finally a cool druid that isnt moon. Hope to see the Fathomless warlock soon.

[@naturalkind5591]

Sad Shepard & spore druid noises

[@emeraldflask8865]

Moon isn't bad, it's just the only ciecle people seem to know or take?

[@OneSpikeyGuy]

Shepherd is cool bruh

[@Toolcontrol22]

While moon will always be strongest, Wildfire, Spores, and stars are all awesome.

[@andrewpaul8732]

D4 did a great fathomless warlock. Took 1 level is sorcerer for frostbolt because it's on theme. Whole build is about frost damage and slowly enemy movement. One of my favorite builds of his

[@MrNicster]

Excellent walkthrough of an interesting subclass. i do agree with your concern, that to much is cramped into the wildshape.

[@AntTheBugcather]

Best couterspeller in the game. - Get 20 wisdom - Get Tome that bumps Wis by 2 - Get Orb of the Veil - Be Mark of Sentinel Human - Get 2 levels in bard for Jack of All Trades - Enter dragon stance - Counterspell 9th lvl spell with a 3rd lvl counterspell without the need to even roll. - ?????????? - Profit

[@eliaspatrikis1926]

Guiding Bolt I think is a very good spell and stays relevant for quite a while. Druids most damaging cantrips are only d8's meaning up until 11th level a cantrip is only tieing with GB. GB also has great range, great damage type and is effectively free. In terms of Action Economy druids dont have many good non concentration spells to cast so once you are concentrating you just spam cantrips. This gives a nice boost to those subsequent turns. Additionally it combos very well with the Archer feature firing off a GB first then getting that advantage on the Archer attack.

[@menthol2833]

I actually used your thumbnail for the archer form wildshape token for one of my players. I love that art a lot. Nice vid.

[@Sixfingeredmage]

I think the best part about circle of stars at early levels is the synergy between guiding bolt and the archer form. You can hit them with a free guiding bolt, then use the advantage to hit with your arrow. Not the best combo and there's lot of better things to do, but it's a fun interaction that's reliable and easy to pull off

[@timpietz2279]

This combo is pretty much the only reason my level 2 party didn't get TPK'd in Rhyme of the Frostmaiden!

[@halifaxsteppenwulf7980]

I think you underestimate the Chalice a little bit. At 2nd level, a 1st level Healing Word combined with the Chalice effect will recover an average of 13 HP compared to an average of 6 HP (assuming 16 Wis). This is the difference between "conscious" and "back in the fight" at 2nd level. Similarly, even at 10th level, if you wanted to do a bit of healing out of combat, you can switch from Dragon to Chalice and now suddenly all your Cure Wounds are upcast by 2 levels for free and get to double your Wisdom modifier for healing. This means that (assuming 20 Wis), a couple Cure Wounds for the Fighter when the pressure is on and you need to keep going will restore 47HP on average. That is probably about 50% of a frontline martial's max HP at the cost of 2 1st level spell slots, which is very, very good. Only a Life Cleric casting Aura of Vitality to distribute a pool of 120 HP can really outclass you in actually *efficiently* healing a tier 3 party.

[@magnuskeisneerbek8847]

Excited for when you will eventually go over the College of Creation bard! The bard is my all time favorite class and the creation bard seems very unique but not neccesarily powerful in an obvious way

[@Grorl]

I've already made an odd amalgamation of halfling swarmkeeper ranger 3/wildfire druid +. The theme is that the swarm is a bunch of birds (thinking humming birds). Pretty much a blaster, seeing as if I recall, swarmkeeper extra damage doesn't specify the attack source. So, blasting spell + 1d6 piercing. Then the wildfire spirit makes all the swarm catch fire (for looks) but the 1 spirit that attacks just adds to damage. Then adding the 1d8 laster seems like fun. Haven't tried it yet, but thats the build so far.

[@quetzalcoatlus1892]

I mostly see the archer form as a twice-per-shortrest free Spirtual Weapon; not as good of a range, but it's still pretty good at low levels.

[@coltonhorton4225]

I mean tbf, when I played my cleric using SW, I was frequently frustrated with the slow movement of it, especially with people moving around a large map. While SW might have a higher max range, being able to hit anyone in that range reliably without having to worry about movement speeds is very nice.

[@andrewpaul8732]

The form lasts for 10 minutes. There are plenty of times when there's 5-10 minutes of in game time between encounters and getting more than 2 or 3 battles before taking a short rest is pretty rare itself. This ability really shines when used with something like swarmkeeper where you have spike growth and move them with thorn whip as your action and bonus action shoot them for more movement (for groups of enemies) or for single target plop down a moonbeam shoot them move them put of the moon beam then action move the beam for 2d10 damage and another 2d10 when they start their turn. It's a pretty powerful bonus action

[@andrewpaul8732]

Wdym? You have 30 feet of movement and it's a ranged attack. Last I checked you couldn't move spiritual weapon 60 feet lol. Feels more like 6 feet most days

[@kyleaphillips1384]

Love that you put chapter sections in the time! Awesome for when I come back here and need reminders :)

[@Similacrest]

If you're lucky to play in Ravnica or Eberron, Azorius guild or Mark of Sentinel human add Counterspell to your spell list, and the Dragon Form makes you the best counterspeller in the game.

[@texteel]

do yo uthink that is intentional or an oversight?

[@ATinyWaffle]

Bards with Glibness cast on themselves are actually the best counterspellers. Just sayin'...

[@keeganmbg6999]

Actually the best counterspeller in the game is a 10 Abjurer / 2 Star Druid, at that level you can counterspell 9th level spells with 3rd level slots and that’s automatic. Second best is Bard with Glibness.

[@Similacrest]

Yeah, that's valid. I meant to say it makes them the best counterspeller class

[@keeganmbg6999]

@@Similacrest totally fair.

[@Wlerin7]

17:34 Are you basing this on the "another"? Because I think the wording here is highly ambiguous. A plain reading would interpret "another" as meaning "other than you", rather than other than the creature you healed. Even if we read it the latter way, you can still _explicitly_ heal yourself with both the spell and the Chalice constellation.

[@TreantmonksTemple]

Yes, I based on the word another. I agree you can heal yourself and apply the boost unquestionably.

[@jaredpuwalski8545]

I think since you can do the bonus to healing to yourself the intent is to be able to do both the initial spell healing and the bonus healing to the same creature. That’s how I’d rule it. Either way, being able to heal two creatures with the same casting of healing word is nice.

[@JanLopezPlanas]

Great video! Thank you! Totally agree with the problem of weak time limit. I think the subclasses that relies on a main-early-level ability are weaker than the subclasses that explores one dimension of the class. IMO

[@thetattooedyoshi]

As a druid enthusiast I really like this circle and the wildfire circle quite a bit. Both have very fun flavor abilities for role-play and both offer some interesting battle abilities that could turn some encounters on their head. :)

[@ChristianLee87]

I created a variant human (+1 WIS +1 DEX) with Fey Touched Feat to get +1 WIS, Misty Step and Gift of Alacrity. Gives me three spells to cast (Guiding Bolt) without using spell slots, plus Misty Step gives me some mobility that as you say the Druid spell list lacks. I also think Misty Step and Gift of Alacrity stay relevant as I level. As always, I think your videos are incredibly insightful! Thank you for sharing!

[@scottmcley5111]

Love the versatility of this subclass. Blaster/Healer/Summoner or Buffer depending on which wild shape you go with. I'd have changed one thing. I would give it the Crown of Stars spell at 14th level.

[@Rapatto]

Would love to see something on the aberrant mind sorcerer!

[@jefftheless]

I'm absolutely loving the look of the Psi Knight, Seems to me to be about equal with the Eldritch Knight in power. Hope you'll give it a look!

[@MethosChannel]

Late to the party but at level 4 with Magic Initiate (Cleric) feat, you can cast Guiding Bolt 10 times! Insane amount of damage and as bonus action, just keep shooting arrows with your Starry Form: Archer.

[@tiradentes4525]

Cosmic Omen + Dragon Form give you a really strong Dispell Magic potencial. You can literally dispel a 6th level spell using a 3th level spell with a 100%. (With +5 Wis)

[@Dave004]

I like Woe as a bit of a weaker version of Eloquence Bard's Unsettling Words. Cast Polymorph or other big spell on creature then react with Woe taking d6 from the save to make sure it sticks. But ya Weal is great for Dispel Magic or if you get hit by a big attack and need more than a 10 to keep concentration (if not in Dragon form) give yourself a d6.

[@nastube4052]

Is there anything preventing you from casting a concentration spell, wildshaping into a beast, and then using a wildshape to add a stary form?

[@TreantmonksTemple]

No

[@andrewpaul8732]

I've made a starry eyed Harengon who sees the world as a black landscape where shapes are merely outlines of stars. His swarm are fire flies and he takes gift of the metallic dragon to grow stary wings to protect maybe a backline caster. Also the form of chalice will come in clutch when you need it. Thinking I'll go ranger 3 druid 2 then ranger 5 then go druid from there

[@cryface2404]

Just compare the stary form to a barbarians rage, its the key ability but at least it refreshes on short rests

[@andrewpaul8732]

And start form lasts for 10 minutes. If your dm runs 3 encounters in a short rest 2 of them might be within 10 minutes of eachother

[@Stephen2K4]

You give a less than enthuseastic thumbs up for this subclass. I see it a bit diffrently. As I am currently playing a Druid. I rarely use my first or second level spell slots as they are very situational and never used in combat. While in Chalace form you are essentaly up casting a Cure Wounds by three levels granting you a 4th level (+2d8+5) for a 1st level spell slot(1d8+5). or a 5th lvl (+2d8+5) for a 2nd lvl spell slot (2d8+5). That is a huge bonus to use of unused resources. Also Druids rarely have bounus actions and Archer allows you to do that. Agreed thats its not much and I may rarely use it. Ill have to see how it plays. But I do think you missed the benifit of the Chalace form.

[@andrewpaul8732]

A spore ranger 5 stars druid 2 gets 3 attacks plus the spore damage. Something like 4d6+12 minimum and you can push and pull your enemy into moon beam for single target or spike growth for big mob fights.

[@Wanderingsage7]

So, the sixth level ability is, basically, a bardic inspiration that you can only kind of control? Neat. I mean, 2d8 damage as a bonus action isn't bad by any means.

[@jaredpuwalski8545]

What color would you rate this subclass? I was thinking dragon form alone makes it a solid green. The mechanics of this subclass class are pretty strong, but I also really like the theme of being an astronomer Druid. This is definitely high up there for classes I want to play alongside the twilight domain cleric.

[@TreantmonksTemple]

Yep, green is where I would go

[@0zvm1]

Going to be starting a lizardfolk stars druid in my current DMs homebrew world once we finish killing Tiamat. I’m stoked about it, and looking forward to comboing spells with the archer damage and dragon concentration boost. Gonna be alot of fun backing up a rogue swashbuckler and warforged armorer

[@wowostylehess1575]

I like the new wild farmiliar thing, but tbh I personally believe Druids should just get that spell into their list Still with the fey limit, but they should totally just have the spell

[@zinglii]

There's an interpretation of the guiding bolt feature where you get to use it with higher level slots without expanding a spell slot since it doesn't set a level limitation

[@colinlove4659]

That feels fairly TO, which Treantmonk has put a video up about recently about deliberately avoiding.

[@TreantmonksTemple]

Generally, the assumption is lowest level unless an ability says specifically otherwise

[@TreantmonksTemple]

I've posted the sage advice quote in the pinned comment.

[@godofzombi]

They'd be wrong. t says right in the spell description: "At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 2nd level or higher, the damage increases by 1d6 for each slot level above 1st." since you are casting it without using a 2+ spell slot the damage doesn't increase. Even if you were to cast it at lvl 9 or whatecer you don't use a spell slot. No slots no extra damage!

[@Dave004]

Great analysis. One thing I thought about for the Weal and Woe attribute is with Weal, the positive thing is you get to decide to use it after its announced you need to do a saving throw, so in circumstances you take a massive hit of 30+ dmg meaning you need at least a 15 constitution save to keep concentration, you decide to use your d6 for the saving throw. But if you get hit for 20 dmg or less, you don't since you know you'll pass. Very useful if you absolutely need to keep concentration like for Conjure Elemental. Woe great for that extra help if you cast a spell with a saving throw you really want to land, taking a d6 of their roll is like a poor man's Unsettling Words lol but reaction vs bonus action. Also, we all agree you can use this on yourself right? "A creature you can see" can count as yourself correct? I always thought it did unless I was blinded.

[@TheKabukimann]

This subclass is really nice for m,ulticlassing for ranger or clerics because the dragon gives you so many ups and you basically become a concentration god with warcaster. And the Archer form is great for Rangers getting a free bonus attack on your turn and it works great with hunters mark or hex.

[@philosopherhobbs]

Ahhhhh! Yes, more! More! It's all coming too slow. More Tasha's now! More updates to past builds now! MORRRRRRRRRE!!! And thanks!

[@MFewwy]

I would allow this druid to spend these free guiding bolts to do starry form again. :) I think it's ok

[@joshuahendershot196]

As someone planning to Multiclass into this class I like that someone else recognized the massive buff that Dragon is, further in depth it's essentially reliable talent without the proficiency restriction on 10 out of the 18 skills in the game and it also applies to concentration checks. I plan on Multiclassing from Monk to Druid taking a 14/6 Split Proficiency in all saves and with Starry Form: Dragon I can't roll under a 21 on con saves at level 17 (10 from the roll 4 from con mod+ 6 from prof., And +1 from Cloak of protection) A creature would have to do 44 points of damage or more on a single hit to break my concentration. This build is going to be absolute BS and I'll love every second of it. Besides, most of our party benefits from short rests so we take them more often.

[@hisnameiskish4874]

I think the Chalice and Archer can shine if you are optimizing for healing. Getting an extra 1d8 + Wis Mod increases minimum healing a decent amount especially if you have other features that pump healing like Life Cleric's Disciple of Life feature. Archer can let you do damage and heal in the same round if that is what the encounter calls for. I do agree that Dragon eventually takes over though.

[@collegeoffoliage6776]

Apropos Tasha's sub classes, there might be a useful monk subclass (a paradox, I know). How do you interpret the rules for the astral self monk's spectral arms? I am unsure what the design intent here is. Can the arms only be used for unarmed strikes, or could they also hold an item, perform a shove or a grapple etc.? I have tweeted at sage advice, but I would be curious as to your interpretation.

[@thehikingviking2049]

"you or another creature within 30 feet of you" doesn't exclude the person you're healing. You could easily use healing word to heal someone for 1d4+1d8+(2xWis), which is nothing to sneeze at. I wish I had this option back when I made my Life Cleric 1/Coastal Druid X elementalist tank, particularly at later levels with resistance to physical damage and free starry form swapping when needed

[@mplee555]

Please do a circle of stars tank build! Heavily armored with some bronzewood perhaps?

[@TheMoistOink]

the thing about guiding bolt spell casting for free means you can cast it at any level since it doesnt specify it can only be caster at x level only, so it will grow in damage as you do and become a single target fireball that give adv to your ally!

[@TreantmonksTemple]

See the pinned comment.

[@godofzombi]

t says right in the spell description: "At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 2nd level or higher, the damage increases by 1d6 for each slot level above 1st." since you are casting it without using a 2+ spell slot the damage doesn't increase. No slots no extra damage!

[@Razdasoldier]

I just wanted to say: This class with the new Critical roll feat "Remarkable recovery" is INSANE. It triggers off the spell and the chalice.

[@BlakeFaeMorton]

Okay. Dragon is great and all. But if I am in a safe location and there be a zombie horde you bet your stary butt I am going Archer and throwing out those Guiding Bolts. (Though, TBH I do value Guiding Bolt more already.)

[@CharmingLiveEnt]

I like the idea that you can cast guiding bolt for free then if it hits your starry form archer has advantage to the attack on its bonus action attack

[@evans178]

17th level star druid with shapechange dragon starry form Nice

[@mirageowl]

battlefield control and concentration free flight definitely make a great pair

[@wyfuslayer8230]

I like to imagine the star druids summons and familiar are translucent animals that have the constellation visible inside them.

[@SIZModig]

I'd really like to find that artwork at 13:40, I can't find it when I'm looking for it.

[@Wanderingsage7]

As a druid, most of your money is going to be going into trying to obtain spell components.

[@emeraldflask8865]

That's easily solved by having your druid attend circle meetings, asking for ingredients, and *maybe* having to earn them with a quest that ties to the main story of the campaign? I've brought this up to my DM/GM and they were for the idea. Because there's nothing stating you can't use circle meetings for this, I've even had my druid form bonds with other circles. This is a great roleplay option too. Especially if you have a DM that cares about your inventory for your spell ingredients anyway.

[@pepperazzie8202]

I just stole my components, and made profit

[@ramshacklewizard]

It's certainly not an ideal scenario, but you COULD wildshape, and then turn on Starry Form, either gaining the resistance from level 14 changes and making your wildshape go further, or Wildshape into a flying creature, and archer form attack from on high :) suboptimal, but Laser Eagle sounds comically satisfying.

[@lordbachus]

I dislike abilities that don’t scale well, so as a dm i always think of ways to make those abilities scale better (in this case the ability scales and is cast at [max spell level the druid can cast / 2]. Rounded up

[@ryanlau8489]

First thing I thought of when reading the archer was “enhanced spiritual weapon” that uses a wild shape without any scaling.

[@changesforthebetter7172]

If you use guiding Bolt you can give yourself a advantage on your Archer attack potentially turning the d8 into 2D 8 or two d8 in to 4d8+5 that's very good

[@changesforthebetter7172]

Tbh I think they are tall good if you use them right

[@ariashkenazi9211]

As sad as I am that they took fireball from the wildfire druid I much prefer the power level of these druid subclasses compared to what happened with the cleric. Powerful classes getting more interesting options that are similar power level to existing options instead of pushing the classes' power level out even farther is much better design IMO

[@DVDMaster2009]

I miss the firebolt cantrip more. It should have given a choice of a fire based cantrip when you picked the circle.

[@ERBanmech]

Chalice stacks really well with spells like aura of vitality or healing spirit since you can then boost healing you can do on your turn by casting heal or cure wounds and then bonus action use either aura of vitality or healing spirit and get the bonus again, and at 10th level just use archer or dragon and then swap to chalice. My favorite magic item for this class is personally the moon sickle since your spells get more powerful and you get an extra 1D4 healing on your healing spells. Edit: my bad it’s only initial cast not subsequent healings but that still works with something like healing word and another action cast healing spell.

[@Raoul9753]

I am currently playing a Circle of Stars Druid, and I have to say, I love it. This might be the strongest Subclass for a Healer in the Game right now, even better than Life Cleric. The Chalice constellation basically gives you a free Cure Wounds on for every Healing Word you use. That makes the Class really safe and effective. And if Healing isnt needed right now, the Archer constellation is a nice Damage Boost too. I never felt like Dragon was worth it to be honest, though that might change when I reach Level 10 and get the flying speed, though I still feel like in most cases, the other 2 are better. I would basically only use Dragon after Level 10 if I cant attack anything this round and noone needs healing... which might come up, but I guess its going to be a one- or two-time in the whole game deal.

[@emilya.4925]

dragon isn't a combat form, primarily. it's just straight utility. having advantage on wisdom and intelligence checks for 10 min is pretty good. that's arcana, history, insight, perception, and investigation being the prominent ones. i can think of more than a few situations where i would be willing to expend a charge of wild shape for 10 min of advantage where the light doesn't matter much at all. and you can drop it whenever you want. i think 2 combat forms and 1 utility form is more than reasonable. and being a utility form it won't see combat very often. after level 10 though, aside from using it for flying, it'd be decent in the situation that you know you're going to take damage and you really want to keep concentration up, as you can't get lower than a 10. switch to dragon for the turn(s) (depending on how hard whatever is attacking you hits on average). i feel like this form is underrated. which it definitely is if you're only thinking of it in terms of combat. on an unrelated note, chalice doesn't say that extra d8 can't be used on the same target as the heal. it's basically: you restore hp to a creature (with a spell slot), and then also to you or another creature. so you can def do it to yourself if the original spell was on you. or another creature other than yourself, which would still include the original creature the spell was cast on. just found it interesting the video interpreted it that way.

[@Raoul9753]

@@emilya.4925 Yes, you can totaly focus Heal with the Ability, which makes it pretty nice in a game where the DM actually punishes players dropping to 0. If the DM doesnt punish it and just goes RAW, you can totaly abuse that you can pop up 2 allies with one Bonus action and a Level 1 Spellslot... Regarding the Utility of Dragon Form, I agree that the advantage is nice, but its still very rare that it will be worth a limited ressources, unless you are in downtime and know you wont need Wild Shape for something else.

[@theshadowbadger]

Commenting for the algorithm. Also yay Friday videos!

[@brianreisbeck6592]

The archer forms ranged attack is a bonus action (on all the subsequent turns) so couldn't you still use a 1 action cantrip or spell in addition to it? It is a ranged spell attack but is NOT casting a spell per se...

[@godofzombi]

yes. it's the way I'm running it. And even if it did count as a spell you could still cast a cantrip using your action.

[@ElManReborn616]

This might be the best druid at spellcasting. Dragon form grants concentration under 20+twice your con mod damage taken a and weal can add a d6 on top of it. Of course you can't know if you're rolling odd or even, but still. If only they had an expanded spell list... They get guiding bolt, which is ok, but it's nothing compared to wildfire

[@joshuahendershot196]

I personally feel like the 10 minute duration is fine but that's mainly just because most of the starry forms abilities are centered around combat so 10 minutes is 100 rounds of combat and no combat lasts that long, the only exception is dragon and maybe chalice.

[@nastube4052]

Seems like the only point of stars druid is dip for dragon form and go somewhere else that is concentration heavy.

[@benry007]

Maybe cleric for spirit guardians? Cast spiritual weapon and you basically have the archer effect as well. Then you just need something effective to do woth your action and you are set.

[@alizard3356]

I have been playing this in a game. I am the main healer, main long range attacker, and main short range attacker.... ...

[@johngleeman8347]

So odd they made the dragon form scale nicely and shrugged their shoulders with the other two. XD

[@Zr0din]

Shilleleagh is needed at Tier one. You are the only person in the party with a magic weapon. I am SO glad they have this in the game. Hey, I have a couple crazy questions: I missed it if you covered this. Can a Druid perform a Reaction spell (Absorb Elements or Shield if you have it) while inside their Wildshape form? I believe not (because you can't cast spells), but I wanted to check. Can a Circle of Stars Druid cast Guiding Bolt from its Star Map in wild shape (a brown bear with a crystal hanging from a chain around the bear's neck)? Normally the Star Map would be adsorbed in the body during transformation but they can CHOOSE to keep it as something they wear as they change forms. Is the Star Map a usable object that acts as a focus for a sub-class ability (as opposed to a spell that is cast)? When you cast Guiding Bolt as a 5th level Druid, does it use the default damage? Or does it use a higher level since you now have access to level 3 spell slots? The Guiding Bolt class feature does not use spell slots.

[@UnbornHeretic]

I wish it clarified what level guiding bolt was and if it could be upcasted. It just say it can be cast without expending a spell slot. Does that imply I can cast it as a 9th level spell without expending a 9th level spell slot?

[@TreantmonksTemple]

I would assume it is not giving you the ability to upcast it

[@UnbornHeretic]

@@TreantmonksTemple I agree, but on the other argument, the only other scenario with which this matters is warlock invocation with false life, which specifically says as a 1st level spell. So there is no other rulings to really rely on.

[@timeforsuchaword]

@@UnbornHeretic It's in the sage advice compendium that spells cast without slots are cast at their lowest level unless otherwise specified. I do agree that it would have been better for general clarity if they just said 1st level in the ability.

[@TreantmonksTemple]

@@UnbornHeretic See the pinned comment.

[@godminnette2]

Imo, the 2d8 should come at 7th level, and a 3d8 at 11th. For archer, this renders it to a free use of spiritual weapon with their highest level spell slot, and I don't think this breaks the healing, especially when compared to dragon.

[@theswad]

Late to the party but figured I'd ask here: Aura of Vitality + Chalice healing? How have you ruled it at your tables? I'm pretty sure RAW it will not trigger the Chalice healing but I could see other interpretations.

[@blazinlatino89]

can u make a build for this circle? or what tips would u give to optimize it? feats? races? i was thinking maybe protector aasimar to add lvl to damage per turn when using hte bonus action archer starry form?

[@chriswood7632]

and you can effect the same creature with the spell and chalice heal

[@moto2442]

Star Map doesn't specify what level you cast guiding bolt at. The wording of it suggests to me you could upcast it without expending a spell slot. This makes star map really powerful as even at like 9th level doing 8d6 + advantage on the next attack 4 times is a really solid ability. I assume the RAI is that casting it at first level but I think it does help with the scaling of the ability. Maybe if it could be cast at half the maximum level you could cast rounded up. So it stays ahead of cantrips and you get the advantage. I also think star map should increase the duration of the starry form. If you are holding it starry forms duration increases to an hour.

[@TreantmonksTemple]

Would we make the same assumption for Fey Touched and Shadow touched? They also don't say...not sure "the rules don't specifically say you can't" means that you can assume otherwise.

[@moto2442]

@@TreantmonksTemple I haven't seen fey or shadow touched. But other similar abilities all say the level of spell you cast it at so it makes sense to me that you could cast it at the highest level available to you

[@TreantmonksTemple]

@@moto2442 I can see that reading of it. We are in that area where the rules say you can cast guiding bolt without expending a spell slot, and they don't say you can't also upcast with a higher level spell slot and gain the same benefit.

[@moto2442]

@@TreantmonksTemple I couldn't font the example I was thinking of but I could be wrong. However the text for the tieflings spells says 'hellish rebuke as a 2nd level spell'. That is probably a counter example as the darkness just says at 5th level you may cast darkness. I do feel like it should either scale or star Map should increase the duration of starry form.

[@Babidi111]

- with the free casts of guiding bolt, can you use the free casts of it to use it with the highest possible spell slot we're capable of or is it only meant to give you the free casts at it's base level?

[@kbeazy_3050]

So for cosmic omen, it says to roll a die. It doesn't specify that that die should have an even number of sides, and the game is getting more and more features using d3's. Now I'm not saying to do this, I'm actually bringing this up to remind players, this is a clear example of the rules not saying something, so we begin making assumptions. Don't try and do this to your DM.

[@vinland5558]

DM's hate him! See the one trick that makes this stars druid unstoppable He bought one of those d1 dice that exist

[@smile-tl9in]

the archer constellation is essentially a sacred weapon

[@Wannybooi]

I think you misinterpretted chalice form. How i read it, you or another creature within 30 feet doesn't mean the creature has to be a different creature than the one you healed. In other words, i think the different is to be interpreted as different from you instead of different from your initial healing target.

[@mike9139]

YOU ARE AWESOME! ❤❤❤

[@tiradentes4525]

One question: There is nothing saying that guiding bolt can only be casted as a first level spell. So, can you upcast it, when you became able to use stronger spells?

[@lunarcat4278]

You could upcast it with a spell slot. The rule of thumb though is that when you cast without a spell slot, unless otherwise stated, you always cast the spell at its lowest level so using the ability? No. Ofc if your DM says it's cool then it's cool. Even then using it during turns you're concentrating on something else or to have advantage on your Archer attack is likely the play here.

[@huntercarvey670]

One thing you didn't note about the free guiding bolt castings is that it doesn't specify what spell level you can cast it as! Which I BELIEVE means you can upcast it to your highest level slot for free. Guiding bolt still scales pretty poorly, and 12d6 at level 17 is pretty bad, but it is free, and you are getting 6 of them by then

[@timeforsuchaword]

I'm afraid not; spells cast without a slot are always cast at their lowest level unless otherwise specified.

[@TreantmonksTemple]

The assumption is lowest spell slot unless the ability says otherwise. See the pinned comment.

[@ATinyWaffle]

Hey, Treantmonk. Do you think you could make a video describing your opinions and rankings of the new warlock invocations in Tasha's like you did for the rest of them a few weeks back? I love Investment of the Chain Master but I don't know if it's really that helpful in the mid to later levels, especially if you really want to keep your familiar alive for something like Gift of the Ever Living Ones (For my Celestial Warlock's bonus action healing and Cure Wounds). I'd rather my familiar stay invisible and far away but within 100ft away so I get that full benefit but keep it safe from AOE's.

[@lisaia7877]

Using star map as focus is saying instead of you hold concentration, the map does for you?

[@Totally_Baked]

Why is starry form such a short period of time? My DM is currently thinking it works like regular wildshape a number of hours that's half your druid level and I had no intention on telling them that rule.

[@mihailov2801]

Where did you get from that creature you targeted with healing spell can't also benefit from Chalice healing?

[@Pastromi93]

A gloom stalker ranger multi class would be dope

[@ATinyWaffle]

Would a 2 level dip into this subclass make sense for a build to basically get a better Spiritual Weapon with the Starry Form: Archer?

[@TreantmonksTemple]

A 2 level dip into anything to get spiritual weapon seems like too big an investment. Besides, if you are going to dip 2 levels for a bonus action attack, why not dip Wildfire? You get 2 hours instead of 20 min and get a 9 square AoE attack with your bonus action every round. Should outdamage the archer significantly I would think.

[@morganpetros9635]

The Archer form is basically up to *TWO FREE CASTINGS OF SPIRITUAL HAMMER* per short rest. Without Concentro. That's the equivalent of multiple free castings of a second-level spell per day ... third-level as of druid level 10. Any paladin player would likely murder loved ones for a subclass ability resembling the Archer form, and if you want a druid capable of doing solid single-target damage, Circle of Stars + Archer is a great way to go. Not sure who's *REALLY* going to be interested in playing a blaster druid, though. 😉🤣

[@keeganmbg6999]

I really feel like you hate on Guiding Bolt a lot Chris. It deals on average 14 Radiant damage and gives Adv to the next person to make an attack roll against the target. That’s more damage than most characters can do at that level unless they have an AOE ability. I get what you mean overall, but give it a little more credit. Haha. Great video as always buddy!

[@TreantmonksTemple]

I did say it was the best of the "need to hit on target for damage" spells at first level...

[@keeganmbg6999]

@@TreantmonksTemple you just sound so upset in the video that it’s not an AOE spell. Maybe it’s just my perception that’s askew.

[@chriswood7632]

comparing the damage output to the archer/crossbow expert/sharpshooter jenk isn't fair. most of us don't play in games with the type of player who chooses min/max options. the Archer form makes a great damage dealer compared to most normal class options, and it comes with the versatilty of healing and concetration options that this class gives.

[@smile-tl9in]

can you take a look at pathfinder 2e ? I'd love to see how you would make a god wizard in this game. I throughly enjoyed your guides for pathfinder 1e and 5e

[@jeepersmcgee3466]

Why can't the chalice healing go to the recipient of the initial healing? Is it because it says "you or another creature" instead of "you or a creature"? They do sometimes get that pedantic, and their editing is not flawless, but I'm not convinced that's the case here. Why would they not just say "other than the initial creature" like they do with so many other things?