The Crisis in Girls’ Sports with Lauren Fleshman and Linda Flanagan | Revisionist History

In a live conversation taped at the 92nd Street Y in New York City, Malcolm and his Martian friend consult athletes Linda Flanagan and Lauren Fleshman on how to level the proverbial playing field. What would they ban from youth sports: Coaches? Parents? Uniforms? Whatever it takes to bring the love of the game to everyone.
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ABOUT REVISIONIST HISTORY
Revisionist History is Malcolm Gladwell’s journey through the overlooked and the misunderstood. Every podcast episode re-examines something from the past - an event, a person, an idea, even a song - and asks whether we got it right the first time. Because sometimes the past deserves a second chance.
ABOUT MALCOLM GLADWELL
Malcolm Gladwell is president and co-founder of Pushkin Industries. He is a journalist, a speaker, and the author of six New York Times bestsellers including The Tipping Point, Blink, Outliers, David and Goliath, and Talking to Strangers. He has been a staff writer for the New Yorker since 1996. He is a trustee of the Surgo Foundation and currently serves on the board of the RAND Corporation.
ABOUT PUSHKIN INDUSTRIES
Pushkin Industries is an audio production company dedicated to creating premium content in a collaborative environment. Co-founded by Malcolm Gladwell and Jacob Weisberg in 2018, Pushkin has launched seven new shows into the top 10 on Apple Podcasts (Against the Rules, The Happiness Lab, Solvable, Cautionary Tales, Deep Cover, The Last Archive, and Lost Hills), in addition to producing the hugely successful Revisionist History. Pushkin’s growing audiobook catalogue includes includes the bestselling biography “Fauci,” by Michael Specter, “Hasta La Vista, America,” Kurt Andersen’s parody Trump farewell speech performed by Alec Baldwin, "Takeover" by Noah Feldman, and “Talking to Strangers,” from Pushkin co-founder Malcolm Gladwell. Pushkin is dedicated to producing audio in any format that challenges listeners and inspires curiosity and joy.
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[@cindylou82kingdom36]

What an excellent conversation!

[@pagesculptor]

I'm a lifelong athlete and when my kid played hockey I would tell my husband to stop going to the box to coach our kid unless he was going to sign up as an assistant coach. Eventually, he became an assistant football coach and suddenly understood while I said this. I never coached, but I was a ballet teacher and I never let parents in the room. They had a viewing window and I always required them to schedule a meeting away from the classroom to talk about the child's progress. I have long retired and would never volunteer to teach or coach. Not because of kids. Even the wildest hellion is better than a overly involved parent anyday.

[@gsilcoful]

Eye opening. Thank you.

[@mry5892]

Actually, oboe players are often offered scholarships in exchange for playing in the orchestra. Bassoonists, too.

[@seanenglish6398]

As a martian i would ask why we materialise what is essentially something of the spirit . Money spoils everything

[@L33PL4Y]

This is so wise.

[@willmpet]

“They’re 9 years old and they’ve been playing for 6 years.” !!!!!!!

[@danielrussell9416]

The better model may already exist, Division III athletics. No scholarships, no multi million-dollar facilities and no multi million-dollar coaches. I played Division III soccer and it was emphasized that school took priority. We were told repeatedly that classes, labs and test took priority over practice or games. If you have a conflict, you miss the practice or game. We could leave the Division I pro athlete factories to minor leagues paid for by the pro leagues.

[@bobcornwell403]

I think a major problem in US sports in general is an over emphases on winning. I think winners are grotesquely over rewarded. I know this is part of our meritocracy. And this is how it is usually justified. But perhaps the reliance on meritocracy in our society has done more harm than good, with its emphasis on winner-takes-all.

[@PhilipLeitch]

Are the problems inherent in sports. List the positive values unique to sports and then think about the reasons we assert these values are objectively positive. Because any value not unique to sports can be gained outside of sports. We can agree that fitness is healthy, and yet fitness isn't a value (a personal attribute, an enduring beliefs or principle). Teamwork: yes but specifically adversarial teamwork which seems to normalise unhealthy in/out group dynamics. Discipline: yes and yet it can be developed in almost all aspects of life, and specifically within sports seems to be discipline at the expense of personal well-being such as the normalisation of ignoring pain or "breaking through the pain barrier", which are objectively unhealthy. For some sports it's adherence to specific diets which again can cause long term harm. What's more, strict discipline often leads to high stress and eventual burnout, with following anxiety and guilt for having been unable to meet unrealistic standards. I often ponder how much of the normalised partisan/ideological division in our society is amplified by a sports culture that values winning and values our group to win at almost all costs. That the idea of "teamwork" of everyone in society working towards a best outcome for all is foreign because no sports has everyone working together to win.

[@EdSuastegui]

An entire conversation about women's sports and threats thereof without mention of the trans phenomenon? Fascinating. Perhaps, in a cynically ironic way, trans athletes are the solution to all the female body development challenges. Plateau? Voila! Where did plateau go?

[@pachelbel1]

If you ban scholarships, that would bring an immediate end to women’s intercollegiate athletics. Men would still continue to compete, in hopes of continuing on to the professional ranks. Maybe it would a good thing actually. I’m not interested in college athletics anymore with what they have become, and have little interest in pro sports as well.

[@buster9106]

I have a neighbor, an 11-year-old boy, playing in the soccer nationals. And he told me it makes him afraid. He's an excellent player and comes from a family of athletes, so it's just the thing his family does. I don't think his parents put undue pressure on him. They are a very loving family. Striving in athletics is just part of their family culture.

[@mooster47]

My daughter had a scholarship for playing clarinet. If I remember right, it was $700 per semester (in the mid-1990s).

[@dexstewart2450]

Lets go for empathy instead of performance...diversity over competence

[@mooster47]

Most sports fans wouldn't pay to see a game of any sort if competition wasn't the main driving force. But teams could be sorted by size, weight and skill rather than gender and age.

[@bm.6349]

pathetic

[@jimmyolsenblues]

i think the change will happen by girls chosing not to run. you won't have teams at high school level anymore

[@kauffner]

If men shouldn't coach women's teams, what about transsexuals? The administration wants to forbid "categorical" bans. Its hard to see how female sports can survive at all if a school cannot make a categorical ban on boys participating in girls' sports. The video discusses numerous aspects of women's sports -- but not the one that is threatening the entire concept of separate sports for women and men.

[@intuitionz1198]

maybe because it's not actually threatening the entire concept of anything. the only thing it's threatening is the fragile people. those who think of women as lesser humans, religious nutters, the misogynists and their apologists, and the bigots. thankfully, they're such a minority in the country that theiri opinions can be taken with a grain of salt. which they should gladly accept because they're worth much less.

[@Redmenace96]

Sorry Malcolm, I did not take anything away from this. I'm not sure these two runners have a lot to say about sports in the U.S. "Ban male coaches of female sports" is pretty radical. Are you sure these ladies are in touch with the mainstream of youth sports in the U.S.?

[@jimmyolsenblues]

I do not know how to say this without sounding like a terrible person. But I am surprised how Malcolm is taking the yes we do know the difference between man and women that the left is pushing. The left has ruined women sports and not enough women stood up. Yes I will accept your hate comments now.

[@intuitionz1198]

🙄🥱

[@mcfmckain]

@@intuitionz1198 I do not know that the "difference between men and women that the left is pushing" means. What does that mean? What are they pushing? And what is the Right pushing? I"m so confused by this statement. I genuinely have no idea that there is a difference. Where do you get this information? My team never talks about this - we talk about training, food, sleep, race prep, racing etc. Is that Left or Right?

[@intuitionz1198]

@@mcfmckain this person couldn't care less about women's sports until it was a avenue to attack trans people. that's the right-wing agenda. the left just wants everybody to be treated equally and be allowed to live their life how they wish without being attacked. it sounds to me like you're just living your life. which I'm sure will be okay with everybody as long as you're not part of the lgbtq community, have skin darker than white, or have a religion other than Christian. right-wingers hate those things. they're fascists and want to control the lives of everyone else but refuse to be held accountable for their own behavior.

[@nubopgritty634]

Watching the pulsating waveform is distracting and kind of makes me feel ill. i DON'T WANT A SEIZURE MALCOM.

[@L33PL4Y]

Then don't watch, just listen.