The Drydock - Episode 288

00:00:00 - Intro
00:00:50 - Why was Hiei's armor able to mostly keep out San Francisco's shells at Friday the 13th?
00:06:03 - Was the FAA lack of single-seat fighters at the start of WW2 an issue of budgets, doctrine, interservice rivalry (with the RAF), or a combination of some or all of above?
00:12:09 - Floatplanes on a carrier?
00:15:42 - SS Jeremiah O’Brien?
00:17:41 - Since the Lord Nelsons and Dreadnought are near contemporaries, was turbine power considered for the Nelsons?
00:20:10 - Elco Thunderbolt testing?
00:25:03 - Were some of the lower-ranking French officers and sailors stuck in Alexandria, who favored continuing the fight, able to defect to the Free-French/British?
00:27:01 - Do you think the Mers el Kabir tragedy could have been avoided if the officers (so to speak) on the ground were allowed to handle it, without the backseat diplomacy from the government?
00:32:24 - How much difference did armour thickness and gun calibre make in actual battle?
00:38:03 - British submarine operations in WW2?
00:41:50 - During WWII there were several speed build demonstrations of bomber aircraft and Liberty ships for propaganda purposes. Were there ever, in the period the channel covers, similar record attempts made with the construction of naval ships?
00:45:04 - Had Ark Royal survived past 1941. How would she be able to handle US Aircraft (Wildcats, Hellcats, Corsairs and Avengers). Compared to the Illustrious and Implacable-Class Carriers?
00:47:14 - How long did Age of Sail battles last?
00:49:26 - In the modern day, ship naming conventions are often subject to a complex and very committee-driven selection process, for a variety of mostly political reasons. How much did these concerns play into the names of ships during the period the channel covers?
00:52:58 - How effective were USN and IJN carrier escorts at assisting the capital ships when under air attack?
00:58:23 - In the Age of Sail how much choice did captains have over the choice of their senior officers?

[@ajumbo7762]

This channel has some of the best content to be found on the entire benighted web.

[@chriswatson9818]

True story!

[@dyerwulf5459]

Collaboration with Rex's Hanger!?!?!?!? I can't wait. This is AWESOMESAUCE!

[@MayaMediated]

100%. Gonna be epic.

[@marckyle5895]

My two faves combined!

[@duwop544]

There's a Rex's with Drach as a guest from about a year ago showing in my feed. "How Aircraft Went To Sea - From Biplane Barges to Aircraft Carriers."

[@ludvigthebirb7131]

They have done a few collabs before. Though any additional are always a treat

[@sugarnads]

Prefer ed nash

[@nmccw3245]

I’d recommend extensive consultation and coordination with the local curators before traveling to San Francisco in order to safely negotiate the pitfalls. Just showing up as a tourist with a car load of equipment is not recommended. As a frequent visitor I don’t even bother with a car unless I’m traveling outside of the BART service area. The Jeremiah O’Brien and Pampanito are definitely worth the visit. 👍🏻

[@danielkorladis7869]

Yeah I would avoid using a car at all. Since there'd be a transfer flight from the UK anyway, I would recommend flying into Oakland Airport and maybe staying at one of the hotels in Alameda. If renting a car, just use it to get to and from the airport and BART station (and to USS Hornet, as it's quite safe to park nearby). Jeremiah O'Brien (pronounced Bryan) and Pampanito are relatively accessible from Embarcadero BART.

[@bull614]

You all just dont get it. Out of respect for Drach I wont tell you how I feel about your "state". To put it mildly your "state" is a problem and that is too much to do for what should be a simple visit

[@ACMIch]

​@bull614 Hey everyone, we've identified the tinfoil hat guy in the chat. I live in the Detroit area, but ive been to SF. What they say about ditching the car is absolutely true. Its a rare part of America, like NYC, where you don't need one. Otherwise, use the same common sense you would in any big city and you'll be fine.

[@MayaMediated]

I guess you're right. But he could also just message a local like me & I'd tell him the bad publicity is mostly hype from people looking to score political points. Our mayor wants to hire more police, you see, and then there are other players.

[@MayaMediated]

Some folks are saying you don't need a car here, and that's true for those staying within Oakland or San Francisco. So if you're staying at Fisherman's Wharf and want to see our Gato class boat with its real TDC, no car. But Essex class Hornet is in Alameda where you really should have a car to get to. And if you stay in Alameda (I wouldn't), then same problem getting to our sub.

[@michaelimbesi2314]

If you don’t want to go to San Francisco, you could try Baltimore. There’s another Liberty ship there, the SS John W. Brown, in addition to USCGC Taney and the sail frigate Constellation.

[@ghost307]

Not to mention that the additional taxes and fees added to your hotel bill can exceed the cost of the room itself. Your best bet may be to contact one of the museum curators directly with your concerns to see if they have any suggestions, up to and including bunking onboard for the few days you would be in town.

[@ROBERTN-ut2il]

Baltimore is just as bad. Another Blue city....

[@murderouskitten2577]

Nice joke. Baltimore is as bad ans sanfrancisco

[@craigfazekas3923]

Oh, yeah- I can attest that the John W. Brown trip in Baltimore is WORTH EVERY PENNY !! They even offer a side-line Steam School, a few times a year. Never did it, but my brother is considering it. It is a very involved class, to where you eat & sleep on the ship for several days.... 🚬😎👍

[@greg5095]

and you can get shot as a bonus feature

[@DardanellesBy108]

I thought to add some more about the San Francisco Bay Area. Drach if you do come to the San Francisco Bay Area to see the USS Hornet don’t come in March when they have Carrier Con! I went yesterday and didn’t realize it was Carrier Con Day and it was nuts. I’m glad the museum has found a way to rake in more cash but I can’t unsee what I witness yesterday! LOL!

[@charlescasturo9146]

Yeah an Essex class full of coplayers and gamers would be quite the sight if you’re not expecting it lol

[@user-sq5uo8oh3g]

When Churchill was First Lord of the Admiralty prior to the First World War he kept trying to get a new battleship named HMS Oliver Cromwell and KGV kept rejecting the name on the understandable basis that Cromwell had one of his ancestors beheaded. Eventually there was a C-class destroyer named HMS Cromwell, but she was sold to Norway almost immediately. Churchill also wanted to name a battleship HMS Pitt, but KGV rejected the name as his experience as a sailor told him exactly what the lower deck would rhyme it with.

[@notshapedforsportivetricks2912]

Almost true, except that King George's regnal number was VI, not V. Oh, and as the King was an ex-sailor who (among other things) fought at Jutland, I doubt that he needed to have naval rhyming slang explained to him.

[@user-sq5uo8oh3g]

⁠@@notshapedforsportivetricks2912 Churchill was First Lord 1911-1915. That is the period I’m referring to so KGV is correct. In his second stint as First Lord 1939-1940 he had more important things to worry about than ship’s names.

[@notshapedforsportivetricks2912]

@@user-sq5uo8oh3g Sorry. I missed the WWI reference. I believe that he was still hawking the idea in WWII after he became PM . I recal reading a biography of KG VI that he suggested it as a name for HMS Vanguard. The King, by contrast, was quite keen on naming her HMS Home Guard. It's probably best that neither got his way.

[@sugarnads]

Shoulda tried with HMS Thomas Cromwell

[@HaddaClu]

Drach, If you get the chance to swing by the States again; I recommend adding LST-325 to your list of vessels to see. She has one heck of a history, and the folks who restored her and sailed her over from Greece deserve to have all the praise in the world. If you do some digging; there is a documentary on Vimeo of the restoration and voyage. Its well worth the watch.

[@stanislavkostarnov2157]

I would say somewhere like Baton-Rouge or Baltimore is more dangerous in terms of crime than San Francisco

[@marckyle5895]

Corpus Christi where the Lex is? Houston metro and USS Texas? Definitely worse. Don't be dumb, don't flash credit cards or cash and drive an ordinary car.

[@grahamstrouse1165]

As someone else mentioned in the comments, it’s a bit of a lateral move. Smash & grabs are pretty common in San Fran but you’re more likely to be physically assaulted in Baltimore. Anytime you’re in an urban area it’s a good idea to get some local advice.

[@kemarisite]

56:17 Japanese escort formations, as stated in Shattered Sword, were generally too scattered to offer effective AA fire against aircraft attacking major ships. Carriers would be operating across 6-10 km spacings, with major escorts like the Kongos and Tones also being thousands of meters away from any of the carriers. This in comparison with US circular formations with major escorts 500-1000 yards from the carrier with destroyers another few hundred yards out of part of the major escort ring.

[@GrahamWKidd]

Saturday night and One small step for Drach, but one great step closer to 300!

[@theol.1988]

I enjoy the Drydocks so much, I think I only have been with the Channel since around the 15th of December 2024, and despite their volume and length, am already struggling to find ones I have not listened to yet.

[@billbrockman779]

It appears the Walrus in the answer to flying boats on carriers 12:09 is being catapulted off with a crane in the foreground. At first I thought it was being hoisted, but look carefully. The prop is turning and the crane rigging is not over the aircraft.

[@Trek001]

Huh, so it is... Nice spot

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

Okay, I see what you trying to correct here....

[@John.0z]

Drach, I hate to point out such a small detail; but that photo of a Walrus shows it departing the ship, not being hauled aboard. The crane just happens to be in between the plane and the photographer, with the lines happening to look like they connect - but with the wingtip. The crane hook was connected to a harness over the centre section of the upper wing - a rather tricky thing for the crew to do, especially if engine was still turning.

[@ROBERTN-ut2il]

The Dustbin at the masthead of HMS Ark Royal is a homing beacon, not radar

[@RupertFoulmouth]

World of Warrahip battles are fought in and around a bunch of tiny islands. I would enjoy a video discussing terrain's impact on naval battles across the time covered on the channel. Things like actual land masses, reefs, shoals, depth, distance, weather, and the like.

[@bryanstephens4800]

The right thing for a rainy day

[@ROBERTN-ut2il]

One drawback is the T-bolt was a power mount, the singles/duals were not. Lose power due to damage and you lose a lot of firepower.

[@themanformerlyknownascomme777]

if you suffer a loss of power, that would suggest that the bomber has already dropped it's payload on you.

[@user-hw1qo2mu9e]

Thanks Drach.

[@StevenPalmer-cs5ix]

One suggestion if you come to the San Francisco Bay Area, stay in Alameda. The USS Hornet is located at Pier 3 at the former NAS Alameda and you can take a ferry from Alameda to San Francisco to visit the S/S Jeremiah O'Brien. While attending high school in the 1980's a number of us volunteered to help with the restoration.

[@indplt1595]

The FAA's early-war aircraft procurement woes also were affected by a major factor/obstacle the Royal Navy did not match the RAF in addressing much prior to 11 March 1941: turning to the British Purchasing Commission once aircraft demand began to far outstrip UK aircraft production capacity in 1940. Prior to the passage of the Lend-Lease Act in March 1941, the only fighters the FAA acquired from the U.S. were F4Fs that had been originally ordered by the French. This order was taken over by the British Purchasing Commission (becoming the Anglo-French Purchasing Board from September 1939 to May 1940), which had been established in 1938 in New York City under Sir Henry Self...and had made a name for themselves in 1940 when North American Aviation had responded to an AFPB inquiry in January 1940 if NAA could acquire a license and build CurtissP-40s for British and French service with a proposal for the Mustang instead. First flying on 26 October 1940 and entering RAF service in January 1942, the British quite literally paved the way for RAF and USAAF P-51s to seize control of the air over Europe in 1944...the same year the F4U Corsair entered large-scale carrier service and were instrumental in seizing control of the air over the Pacific from TF37/57 (the Corsair-laden BPF carrier fleet) and TF38/58. Still, the F4U prototype first flew on 29 May 1940, five months prior to the Mustang prototype...yet entered combat with the USMC in February 1943, 13 months AFTER the Mustang began flying against the Luftwaffe. If the Royal Navy had approached the BPC in January 1940, the FAA perhaps could have bypassed both the Wildcat and Hellcat to go straight to the Corsair (the F4U's performance being much better than the F6F, as evidenced by the Corsair remaining in U.S. service until the close of the Korean War in 1953, long after the Hellcat AND Bearcat had been retired from American service). The F4U first flew the same month the Fulmar entered FAA service, which presented the Royal Navy with a golden opportunity, had they seized it. The first production F4Us were not delivered to the USN until 31 July 1942, more than two years after the prototype first flew. The U.S. Navy was overly disracted during this timeframe, as the Brewster Buffalo had not been performing as advertised and the USN elected to reevaluate F4F suitability (the Wildcat having originally lost to the F2A in a 1939 competion). theaviationgeekclub.com/buffalo-flop-the-story-of-the-brewster-f2a-the-aircraft-deemed-superior-to-grummans-f4f-but-that-was-totally-outclassed-by-japanese-fighters/ Vought undoubtedly would have jumped at a BPC inquiry to purchase F4Us in the summer of 1940, as they only built the Corsair and Kingfisher in large numbers during the Second World War. The British being the initial customer for the Corsair would have also come with the added benefit of the FAA's knowledge of operating long-nose fighters such as the Fulmar and Seafire. The USN had largely eschewed liquid-cooled engines since 1927 in favor of air-cooled radial engines, which made the 81.4-inch-long R-2800 engine coupled with an aft cockpit hard to land for USN pilots...but not for FAA pilots that had been accustomed to the 88.7-inch-long Merlin engine that equipped the Fulmar, the Sea Hurricane and the Seafire, especially after developing the 90-degree-turn, 30-degree-bank curved approach to land the long-nosed fighters equipped with inline engines...and if the British had been involved in F4U development in 1940, the FAA could have also suggested Vought incorporate the Fulmar's ability to boost the pilot seat to improve visibility over the nose for carrier landings...

[@dogsnads5634]

One thing Drach doesn't mention, and he should, was that a lot of the partial myth around FAA fighters is based on Americans comparing the USN in 1942 at the start of their war with the RN at the start of the war in 1939... But when you look at the dates it doesn't add up.... FAA got the Fulmar in May 1940....at the time the Wildcat had not arrived in service, and in fact by Pearl Harbour the USN only had 1 seagoing squadron of them..thats 18 months later... FAA got Sea Hurricane , which in the air (if not on the deck) was a marginally better aircraft in mid 1941. Before the USN had gone operational with Wildcat...in late 41...and then the FAA got Seafire in mid 42. No-one will argue that Wildcat was a better carrier aircraft overall, but the FAA actually had better performing fighters than the USN until the Hellcat turned up in mid 1943...

[@indplt1595]

@dogsnads5634 The F4F was an older design than the Fulmar--the first production F4F-3s came off the assembly line in February 1940 and the Martlet entered service with the RN that year. The Smithsonian's website has an entry on the F4F, mentioning that the first aerial victory was scored by a British F4F pilot that downed a Ju-88 over Scapa Flow on 25 December 1940. Grumman was all too happy to take foreign orders in 1940-41 as the USN still preferred the F2A, not having realized Brewster was a basket case; and the F4U prototype began flying in May 1940. The Corsair, which considerably predated the F6F, outperformed the Hellcat and was the preferred fighter of the BPF (HMS Indomitable could not fit them on her hangar decks, necessitating F6Fs instead while the Implacables couldn't fit either American fighter, necessitating Seafires). Had the RN made inquires with the British Purchasing Commission (or set up HMS Saker in 1940) Chance Vought would have jumped at the chance to fulfil foreign orders. It still would have required a lot of design work, but as the FAA did most of the heavy lifting to get the Corsair carrier-qualified anyway...

[@ROBERTN-ut2il]

USN J2F Duck amphibian had a tail hook as well as a hull

[@Trek001]

Drach: "...and indeed the ship is upside down, so it's possible some of that might be submerged..." Me: I'd argue its *ALL* submerged

[@mpetersen6]

Just like the ballast tank in Titanic's fore peak. So well built it's still holding water to this day.

[@jackvonkuehn9038]

Avoiding San Francisco, or really any place in the Soviet Republic of Californistan is wise. You're not reading too much into it. There are places in Afghanistan that are safer than SF. Love the idea of more colabs with Rex's Hanger.

[@greenseaships]

The FAA also didn't feel comfortable asking pilots to both fly and navigate so especially in the earlier days of the war, they liked to have a 2nd crewman doing the navigation.

[@trauko1388]

regarding single seat carrier fighters and iys engines... the Fulmar ALSO used a Merlin AND it was a pre/war design, so engine availability due to war cant be the reason they had no single seat fighters. Plus they ordered the Firefly also a two seater once the war began to replace the Fulmar, they clearly felt the need to have a two seater fighter. Even the one they had, the Sea Gladiator, was not meant for carrier service, but for base defense. They just werent interested in single seat fighters until the war began and showed them the need.

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

But that's ignoring all their pre-war fighters.....

[@trauko1388]

@@WALTERBROADDUS Yes, but that reinforces the point, the FAA did have single seat fighters before... and then willingly went for the Skua, Roc, Fulmar and Firefly. Nobody forced them. And in 1939, when they expected a LW attack, Ark Royal landed its Skuas and trusted on its flak for protection.... No one forced them to do that either. This is what they thought in January 1940, before Norway set them straight... NOTES BY FIFTH SEA LORD OF FLEET AIR ARM MEETING HELD ON 4 JANUARY 1940 [ADM 1/ 10752] 22 JANUARY 1940 A. LONG TERM POLICY: It was agreed that Fleet Air Arm Fighters were required for the following duties:- (1) To destroy enemy shadowers. (2) To intercept enemy striking forces. (3) To destroy enemy spotters and to protect our own. (4) To escort our own striking forces to their objectives. 2. Functions 1, 2 and 3 could be met by a Single Seater using the homing beacon as a navigational aid. Function 4 was considered to be problematical but apart from this it was agreed that there would be many occasions when fighters would be required to fly over the sea outside beacon range of their parent ship. It was therefore considered to be a sound policy to develop a 2 Seater fighter having navigational facilities, provided this did not entail a serious reduction in performance compared to a Single Seater. ... 6. The Director of Air Materiel outlined the tender designs which had been received from various firms to the revised N. 8 (two-seater front gun) specification. These included aircraft with top speeds, as estimated by the firms, of around 380 miles an hour, which compared very favourably with the estimated top speeds of the single seater designs which had also been received; the differences varied between 2 and 25 miles/ hour. ... 12. The problems of using either Spitfires or Hurricanes for this purpose were discussed. The main difficulty was that of the embarkation of these types in Carriers. Without folding wings they could be embarked in the GLORIOUS and FURIOUS, owing to the wide lifts fitted in these Carriers, but they could not be embarked in the later Carriers, which had narrower lifts, unless their wings were made to fold. The Firms concerned were already working on designs for modified wings for this purpose and they hoped to be in a position to report upon the possibilities very shortly. It was expected that it would be at least nine months before Aircraft of these types with folding wings would come into production. It had been contemplated that if the designs of folding wings were successful, some 50 Aircraft might be obtained. 13. The meeting argued that a force of this kind would be valuable to the Fleet Air Arm, and they recommend that the possibilities should be pursued with all despatch. 14. (3) Possible use of Foreign Types. This in practice meant U.S.A. Aircraft. The meeting considered that the types available and the possibilities of obtaining them offered no advantages over the Spitfires or Hurricanes, and that there was nothing to be gained by pursuing this suggestion further. ...and then Norway happened, so browned trousers and fighters were thrown on decks as is in a panic.

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

@@trauko1388 keep in mind carrier tactics Are a evolutionary process. Most of the air threats did not require Anti fighter protection. It was more of a Reliance on anti-aircraft guns rather than combat Air Patrol. And most Fighters would not have the range to attack carriers sea.

[@trauko1388]

The RN was well aware of the Bf 110 and expected to fight it escorting LW bombers. But yes, that is why they preferred two seaters... and why they ignored single seaters, no one forced them, they wanted it that way. The USN, LW and IJN saw it differently.

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

@@trauko1388 It's not that they ignored them, it is that they decided they wanted a dedicated Navigator. Several of their pre-war Fighters were single seats.

[@vespelian]

One interesting feature of naming conventions in the Royal Navy in the run-up to WW II was the notably absence of an HMS Trafalgar or an HMS Waterloo, after the embracing of the Entente Cordial, when such names suddenly became very politically incorrect.

[@Dave_Sisson]

Yet the Americans intensively sent a bunch of ships named after people or battles where they fought the British, to fight alongside the Royal Navy. But the much later, when the channel tunnel opened, trains arriving from France arrived at Waterloo Station, which was a reminder to the French of what happens when they upset the UK.

[@tokencivilian8507]

Good point on DoY vs Scharnhorst in re gun caliber. It makes perfect sense that the "You will respect my gun caliber" factor would have been far more in play had Scharnhorst had 15's vs the 11's, keeping DoY at a more respectful range, even if the KGV class was one of the best armored period BBs around. I have to think things would have played out broadly similar given DoY's superior radar, armor, and more than satisfactory firepower vs Scharnhorst's capabilities, even had she been rearmed with 15's.

[@kidmohair8151]

47:14 I had this thought come into my head at the mention of the battle of the Glorious 1st of June, that, if it had gone on any longer, a lunch break might have been negotiated… like in cricket.

[@lessonslearned2569]

Pardon the possibly very obtuse question, but where was the Marine nationale during WW1? We hear about the RN from Mapatan to Jutland, the Japanese driving away the Germans from the Pacific and the USN and their role during the First Battle of the Atlantic. We even got a look at the Austrian-Hungarians bombarding Italian water towers (see The Bombardment of Ancona - Derailing Your Mobilisation on this channel) but little or nothing of the French Navy during this period. Was this an effect of the Jeune École on the French Navy or were other factors involved?

[@BishopStars]

Sailing away as fast as possible 🏳️🏳️🏳️

[@hughfisher9820]

In the Mediterranean. The British and French navies had agreed pre-war that basically the RN would face off against the Germans in the North Sea, the MN would face off against the Austro-Hungarians and Italians in the Med. Although as it turned out the Italians decided that they didn't want to pick a fight with almost all of Europe, instead joining the Allies. The Austro-Hungarian navy, realising how outclassed it was, sensibly did not send big surface warships out to be sunk. So the MN spent its time doing the boring grunt work, convoy escort, shore bombardment, sub hunting, mine laying and mine clearing ...

[@robertmatch6550]

Morning from dark Alaska.

[@johnshepherd9676]

FAA multirole fighter development did continue after the start of the war with the Fairy Firefly which was introduced in 1943. As a strike aircraft it flight performance was better than both the Avenger and Helldiver if falling short on payload. The Firefly had a post war career as an ASW aircraft. However, you have to evaluate its capabilities with both missions and it is not really competitive with the Hellcat and Corsair. It was an inferior as a fleet air defense fighter and the two US fighters could carry more ordinance. Given that the FAA was buying superior US single seat fighters that could fill both roles continuing on with the Firefly seems like a waste of resources.

[@WhatIfBrigade]

10:16 Fighters are also situational. Not only was nobody worried about German aircraft carriers, meanwhile the UK effectively functioned as an unsinkable aircraft carrier. In the question of how to best defend London or attack Germany, navy fighter planes were a nice to have not a requirement.

[@TheIamfrustrated]

For the age of sail question I have the image in my head of captains of the various ships trading personnel and academy graduates around like the football and hockey clubs trading players and draft picks.

[@Cbabilon675]

Absolutely good call on not going to San Francisco with your equipment😊

[@LiftOffLife]

You might end up with a Tenderloin 😁

[@danielkorladis7869]

San Francisco has a lower vehicle burglary rate than Des Moines and Dallas, and a lower robbery rate than Milwaukee or Houston. And it's mainly obvious "rich techie" cars getting broken into. You can avoid this by simply taking public transit. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_crime_rate#Crime_rates

[@jamesharding3459]

@@LiftOffLife Bullshit. Unless you're some far right asshole who owns a dozen AR-15's because you're scared of black people, San Fran is just another city, and an unusually pleasant one at that.

[@kennethdeanmiller7324]

Way, way back in 1991 my brother and I drove across a large portion of North America, meaning from Greenville, SC to San Rafael, CA by way of also going 4 hours out of our way to see the Grand Canyon otw. We had seen quite a few Grateful Dead concerts & we had decided that we wanted to see them on the West Coast. Sort of like the difference between seeing an animal at the zoo & seeing an animal in there natural habitat.ie a place they were very use to playing & they could basically drive from home to the coliseum & then drive back home after it was over. We had heard that the West Coast shows were a lot better for that very reason. And so we found out they were playing 3 nights at Oakland Coliseum for Chinese New Year near the end of February. Since we had found out about it early we were able to mail order tickets straight from Grateful Dead Merchandising. They were playing 3 nights & we got 2 tickets for each night. Since we were having to rent a car to drive so far we knew we wouldn't have enough money for a hotel for that long too. So we decided to take camping gear with us and stay at a National Park that was near by called S.P. Taylor State Park. I got to see the Grand Canyon and drive across the Golden Gate Bridge within 24 hours of each other. However, when we got to the park it was 2am & pouring down rain. If my stupid brother had listened to me everything would have been fine. I wanted to just sleep in the car & set up camp in the morning. But no, he said "I've been in this car for 2 days now & I want to be able to stretch out & sleep." He never would listen to me about anything & usually ten times out of ten something would go wrong because of it. And, of course, this wasn't the first or last time. The Ranger woke us up at 8am that morning and we get up to discover that someone had broken into the car & stolen ALL OF OUR STUFF. Including our tickets to the shows & the 2 gas credit cards that our cousin had lent to us to make sure we had gas to get back. I told my brother that I was really glad he got to stretch out & sleep for the night. For some stupid reason he had even left his shoes in the car & they had stolen those too. So he didn't even have any shoes to wear. Well thanks brother, we just drove all the way across the country to apparently get all our stuff stolen cuz you wanted to set up a tent in the pouring rain & stretch out. And that was back in 1991, 35 years ago. I'm fairly certain that by now the number of thieves & robbers in San Francisco has probably doubled about ten times over. If you REALLY WANT TO DO SOME FILMING IN SAN FRANCISCO- If you can afford to do this... rent the equipment you need from a company that is there & have them deliver it to the site, make sure they will have someone there constantly to ensure the safety of the equipment and I do believe if you pay for it with certain credit cards it's automatically insured. But it never hurts to ask & find out. And speaking of "It never hurts to ask & find out." If you spoke to some of these companies that rent such equipment you could probably get a decent discount for "mentioning" their help & that it was filmed using their equipment. Any company, especially a new company just starting out would probably be thrilled to get basically free advertisement and any potential clients get a chance to view their work, which of course is also YOUR WORK.

[@Macquarrie1999]

If you are worried about SF I will pick you up at the airport lol. People mainly run into issues when they leave things sitting out in the open in their cars, and the areas where the ships are docked are very safe.

[@johnlander4635]

I am thinking Fulmar and Skua was not pure fighter so they did other tasks where a navigator was needed. The Roc had 2 roles such as fighter and a piece of garbage. Seafire didn't needs an observer as the aircraft had short range so it could just turn round.

[@Niels_Larsen]

My hopes for a theoretically peaceful solution, comes from some rescued french sailors after the attack who states, that it was Gensoul's intention to scuttle or sabotage the french fleet to make it unusable.

[@tombuchanan379]

I have a question. If Ark Royal survives the torpedo hit and goes to the US for repairs, does she become USS Robin?

[@mikebrower8450]

Concerning Scharnhorst class battlecruisers(battleships); How far did the Germans get in the up-gunning to 15" main batteries? What would this have achieved in improved capabilities. Would they have been up-armored as well?

[@michaeldenesyk3195]

The one other drawback for the Thunderbolt is ballistics, the cal .50 has a different ballistic computation than the 20 mm. The USAAF B-29 hd a mixed 20 mm and cal .50 mount, but afterwards they deleted the 20 mm and kept the cal .50 to simplify the fire control solution

[@themanformerlyknownascomme777]

Draq mentions that he is talking about the 20mm ONLY version.

[@michaeldenesyk3195]

@@themanformerlyknownascomme777 I guess I should wait for a court summons now?

[@forgetmeshots]

Love the SF trolling. 😏👍🏻

[@brucelownhole]

14:00 That walrus's doesn't appear to be being hoisted. It looks like a fly past.

[@rashkavar]

On the topic of speed building: one concrete example of this is the construction of the SS Robert E. Peary, a Liberty ship built in 4 day, 15 hours and 29 minutes. (Obviously, given the very specific timeframe, this is definitely a case of a deliberate record attempt rather than just standard production being absurdly fast.) That's somewhat less than a sixth of the overall average production time of 30 days for the 2710 Liberty ships that were completed during the war. Must have been intense being on that construction team!

[@scottciesielski6854]

My grandfather served on the O'brien

[@davidwrenn2719]

It’s pronounced o-BRI-en, not o-BREE-en. And yes, the namesake was a descendent of Irish immigrants.

[@MFitz12]

The advantage of the Oerlikon is that it is free-swinging. Once you put it on a heavy powered mounting you might as well just use a Bofors.

[@themanformerlyknownascomme777]

the Bofors is larger and significantly heavier then the Thunderbolt.

[@MFitz12]

@@themanformerlyknownascomme777 - Depends on the Bofors. The weight of Thunderbolt is a? with Navweaps giving the obviously ridiculous figure of "560 lbs" for the mounting. My suspicion is the accidentally dropped a "2". This makes Thunderbolt a bit heavier than a Bofors Mk 3.

[@themanformerlyknownascomme777]

@@MFitz12 actually, 560lbs is a very believable number, I've seen images of this mount being on the back of a 1940s COE, and it was supposed to be mounted on 80 foot boats.

[@MFitz12]

@@themanformerlyknownascomme777 - So a powered mounting with armor plate, carrying FOUR(4) Oerlikon 20mm guns (each gun 150 lbs. not including ammunition s 600 lbs. of Oerlikon guns without the mount or ammo) and TWO (2) 0.50 cal M3 machine guns (about 84 pounds each) weighs a TOTAL of 560 lbs. Or about 1/3 of what a single free-swinging 20mm Oerlikon Mk 2/4 mount weighs? And you _believe_ this is reasonable? Do you maybe want to re-think that one? Thunderbolt was intended to be mounted on 80 foot PT Boats, yes. *TO REPLACE a 40mm Bofors Mk 3 mounting*

[@themanformerlyknownascomme777]

@@MFitz12 I was suspecting that the 560 lbs weight was unloaded (AKA not carrying ammo) plus, I'm pretty sure that "armor plate" is just splinter protection and isn't actually that heavy. not to mention, the Thunderbolt mounting franky has a far smaller "footprint" then that mk 3 bofors, you can see that on thouse torpedo boats where the Mk3 is struggling to fit on the boat's deck with it's rings barley not going over the side.

[@anatolib.suvarov6621]

Algorithm Engagement Comment. I have to write such things so that the algorithm will share this content with other people!

[@mattfantastic9969]

Me, living in Frisco, going to look out the window to figure out wtf is happening... Looks normal to me

[@metaknight115]

Being honest, penetration tests were often inaccurate to a ship’s actual penetrative capabilities, often highly over exaggerating or under exaggerating their realistic penetration, thus I highly doubt an 8-inch shell could penetrate Hiei’s belt at 12,000 yards. I mean, look at navyweaps’ penetration table for the Iowas class battleships, vs both Ryan in New Jersey’s KZbin channel (specifically the video discussing what the crater of a 16-inch gun looks like) and a gun tour of USS Iowa have stated the Iowas could realistically penetrate up to 18-inches of steel.

[@hughgordon6435]

why was the Royal Navy known to service members as "the Andrew?"

[@notshapedforsportivetricks2912]

Rhyming slang, apparently. Andrew ... Andrew Davey ... Navy. Just don't ask me who Andrew Davey was; I wouldn't hava a clue.

[@robertschultz6922]

Do we still have the ability to make ship class a armour

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

Most steel plants are not set up for it.

[@robertschultz6922]

But how difficult would it be to retool a plant. Say they wanted to put the uss Iowa back in service and repair the turret what would be required

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

@@robertschultz6922 anything is possible if you want to throw enough money and resources? But you are talking about taking resources from other production. For rather small scale products.

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

@@robertschultz6922 quick look at Google , says it would be rather difficult. You basically have most of the industry involved in making steel from scrap. You only have four major companies. Most production is for the auto or construction industry. We have more Onlyfans creators than steel workers today.

[@patttrick]

As I understand it the UK has developed glass armour. Half the cost,half the weight and 50% stronger. That was 10 yes ago.

[@bigsarge2085]

⚓️

[@loganhesse413]

Hi, appreciate the reply, enjoy the channel very much. Regarding San Francisco, I’m local and the media narrative is blown entirely out of proportion. I hope you decide to see for yourself one day.

[@PelhamExpress]

Strongly advise you go to San Francisco. There is so much nautical history to see, go with friends if you are concerned about safety. The O’Brien itself is well worth the trip, plus the Hornet and other nautical history present

[@1982nsu]

"I left my _______ (fill in the blank) in San Francisco."

[@danielkorladis7869]

He could even stay in Alameda if safety is such a concern.

[@MayaMediated]

Yup. Fox "News" hates us, obviously, and Mayor Breed always wants to hire more police. So much hype.

[@cbbees1468]

​@@MayaMediatedMy personal favorite was when CNN tried to debunk that crime wasn't rife in SF and then their own car got broken into. Lol, Libtards vs Libtards is a wonderful thing to watch.

[@Andy_Ross1962]

If you are going to fit something as large as the Thunderbolt put a 40mm mount in there instead.

[@themanformerlyknownascomme777]

the Thunderbolt is considerably smaller and (more importantly) lighter then the 40mm quad mount.

[@mikolajgrotowski]

The one more reason Britain had trouble developing naval single-seat fighters was a problem with the engines. The best engine for such a fighter was the Merlin. But it was used in many designs for the RAF - Spitfire, Huricane, Lancaster, Mosquto. And all of them had a higher priority because they were used to defend the home islands or to transfer the fight to enemy territory. Meanwhile, aircraft carriers were mainly used to fight for overseas territories. Therefore, cold calculation showed that they were less important. It didn't help that a tank engine was also built on the Merlin base and was also widely used. So there was no spare capacity. And American planes did not burden the domestic industry. Later, the situation improved when Merlins began to be assembled in the US and Canada, but then the production of American aircraft was so developed, with new models such as Hellcat and Corsair, that there was no point in introducing additional confusion with the new design. As for other engines that were available in the UK in the late 1930s, they were either outdated and too weak, or they occupied the same factories as Merlin, or were not ready yet.

[@trauko1388]

The Fulmar used a Merlin, so did the Fairey Battle, they were never denied engines. They just didnt want single seat fighters until reality hit.

[@mpetersen6]

The Lancaster did not exist pre war. The Manchester did but that used 2 24 cylinder X layout Vulture aeroengine. Problems with the Vulture led to the Manchester's wing being redesigned to take two Merlins per side. In 1939 RR was tasked with engineering development work and production on the Merlin, Vulture and Perrigrine. Plus it was doing work on the X-24 cylinder aircooled sleeve valve Exe, Pennine, early work on the H-24 Eagle and the V-12 sleeve valve 2 stroke Crecy. Vulture was dropped due to operational issues. Perrigrine was dropped due to limited use (1) and HP potential. Plus RR was commited to supporting the establiding of Merlin production in non RR facilities.

[@mikolajgrotowski]

@@trauko1388 Battle production was stopped as soon as the RAF's needs for fighters became known and losses began. But it was already realized that there was a problem, because a large part of aviation production is based on one type of engine. The development of several types of machines was stopped as a result. An example was Halifax, whose development was stopped by the need to change engines from Merlins to Hercules. It must be remembered that before the machine goes into production, and even before a prototype is created, research is carried out on its production possibilities. The fact that there was no Lancaster yet does not mean that there were no plans for it, there was no Mosquto in the plans, but there were powers reserved for a heavy fighter with 2 Merlins. Fulmars were produced because it was impossible to leave aircraft carriers without planes, and they already existed, flew and could play various roles. But talks with the US about purchases began immediately. However, the US itself was preparing for a big change on board, so they couldn't offer something sensible right away. Besides, there were priorities again, first land fighters - P40 and then P51A, the P39 was also tested, but due to poor parameters at high altitude, they did not work. There was even an idea to make a naval version of the P39 for the UK, but the US Navy certainly did not want it because it demanded air-cooled engines, and the UK itself did not need too many naval fighters, so the idea was rejected. Especially since in the meantime the production of Wildcats was in full swing and the US Navy could share them.

[@trauko1388]

@@mikolajgrotowski Yes, but at somre point it was implied that lack of Merlins was the cause for no single seater for the FAA... the Fulmar disproves that. And no, until Norway the FAA had no interest on the Wildcat, they were happy to wait until 1941 for navalized Hurricanes or Spitfires. Then reality hit. NOTES BY FIFTH SEA LORD OF FLEET AIR ARM MEETING HELD ON 4 JANUARY 1940 [ADM 1/ 10752] 22 JANUARY 1940 ... 14. (3) Possible use of Foreign Types. This in practice meant U.S.A. Aircraft. The meeting considered that the types available and the possibilities of obtaining them offered no advantages over the Spitfires or Hurricanes, and that there was nothing to be gained by pursuing this suggestion further. IF the Wildcat was even considered, since they first production aircraft hadnt beend elivered yet and the French made an order first.

[@chuck1428]

Greetings from South Texas what if the dolittle raiders had carried small incendiaries instead of demolition bombs do you think it would have done more damage given that Japanese cities were very flammable would it changed the timeline of the war

[@mpetersen6]

As I remember from reading 30 Seconds over Tokyo many years ago the bomb load was 3 HE and one incendiary.

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

I don't think 16 aircraft of medium sized are going to do much more damage that way.

[@mpetersen6]

@@WALTERBROADDUS I don't think they were expected to do much physical damage. Especially to industrial facilities. In terms of attacking infrastructure they probably would have better off attacking the power grid. The main damage the Raiders did was to Japanese morale and defensive considerations as per the Home Islands. If the Doolittle Raid caused the Japanese to keep significant air or naval power in Home Waters it was a win. As to casualties caused by the raid. The overwhelming majority of those were the estimated 100k Chinese killed as the result of either sheltering the aircrew or the IJA killing civilians while searching for them.

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

@@mpetersen6 I would agree with your analysis that the primary goal was more psychological.

[@grahamstrouse1165]

@@mpetersen6Level bombing in WWII was notoriously imprecise. It was basically the bombing equivalent of “pull it and pray.”

[@amorbis4210]

hi guys

[@SgtSoda]

You are wise to avoid San Francisco until their *ahem* problems, are taken care of.

[@w.osterberg9385]

My inlaws live in the bay area of California, even I don't go there unless I have to.

[@Archie2c]

USS Second Ammendment Rights adds Thunderbolts

[@nowthenzen]

00:25:03 - 00:27:01 any speculation about the French fleet after the June 1940 armistice must be informed by the fact Pierre Laval became Vichy's political leader and he was so pro-German he was executed by France after the war. Laval would not embrace pro-German policies unless he believed the Nazis would win and he could only be expected to want to contribute as much as possible to that victory and that means using the French Navy in support of the Nazis. There's no 'yeah, but'-ting this. Laval believed Hitler would win Laval would help Hitler win and that means the fleet. "But Darlan would not let that happen." Great, Laval fires Darlan and puts a puppet in his place. That's how political control of the military works.

[@1982nsu]

"I left my _______ (fill in the blank) in San Francisco."

[@salty4496]

:)

[@phluphie]

I feel ya, Drach. Used to live in LA and I wouldn't goto San Francisco.

[@ryder6070]

Exactly what people from SF say about LA. It's all the same

[@bkjeong4302]

The issues with carriers coming to the rescue of battleships, especially in the Pacific theatre, was that the enemy in that situation rightfully tended to leave the battleships alone and attack the carrier itself, as it was perceived as the more urgent enemy threat (for both the IJN and USN) and the more valuable enemy asset.

[@drewhardin3992]

Crime in San Francisco tends to be smash and grab kind of stuff. I was travelling for work and we had a smash and grab of our rental while in Palo Alto. So it happens. But San Francisco in my experience is perfectly fine during the day, even rather pleasant. I lived in San Jose, which was perfectly safe and I had no problems, but I did go to San Francisco a few times and had a good time. Attacking San Francisco is sort of a game people play, because it is super expensive, relatively high density for the US, and because housing prices are so high there are serious housing issues. And because there have been efforts to not imprison people constantly for petty crimes there are groups that make a living doing it. So don't leave anything in your vehicle when you are not in it, don't have packages delivered to your door, but don't freak out that you are going to get mugged on every corner either.

[@eliasthienpont6330]

🦁🦁🦁🦁🦁🦁LION c LIKE No. 935

[@merlinwizard1000]

38th, 10 March 2024

[@johannderjager4146]

You're 100% right about San Francisco, Drach, those media reports aren't sensationalized.

[@KFINCHIE31]

Yeah best stay away from SF

[@danielkorladis7869]

Yes they are. San Francisco has a lower vehicle burglary rate than Des Moines and Dallas, and a lower robbery rate than Milwaukee or Houston. And it's mainly obvious "rich techie" cars getting broken into. You can avoid this by simply taking public transit. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_crime_rate#Crime_rates

[@ryder6070]

ANy bbig city in the world is vulnerable to the same shit..don't be a pussy. seriously kind of childish fear of media crap.

[@Ensign_Nemo]

@@danielkorladis7869 In Iowa, if you call the police and report a theft, the police will try to arrest the perp, and the local DA will try to convict the accused if the evidence of guilt is strong. In California in general and SF in particular, that is not true. People stop reporting crimes if the local authorities never punish criminals.

[@ManiusCuriusDenatus]

​@@danielkorladis7869Citing Wikiipedia?

[@bgclo]

HMS King Edward the Whatever... striking fear into the hearts of Royalists (and their publicists) everywhere!

[@notshapedforsportivetricks2912]

If you going to San Fracisco Drach, Be sure to wear a flower in your hair; But don't wear your good shoes. 💩

[@EXO9X8]

Have you considered hiring an armed escort for the purposes of visiting San Francisco And I take great offence to the present lack of any vessel in his majesty’s navy named Pickle since its untimely demise in 1808. I shall be writing a very strongly worded letter to the current sea lord on this matter.

[@nmccw3245]

lol - violent crime isn’t really the problem. Property crime (theft ) due to organized criminals gangs and drug addicted homeless is the biggest issue.

[@1982nsu]

"I left my _______ (fill in the blank) in San Francisco."

[@danielkorladis7869]

If Drach's not an idiot he'll be fine. San Francisco has a lower vehicle burglary rate than Des Moines and Dallas, and a lower robbery rate than Milwaukee or Houston. And it's mainly obvious "rich techie" cars getting broken into. You can avoid this by simply taking public transit. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_crime_rate#Crime_rates

[@ROBERTN-ut2il]

RN Subs slaughtered Italian convoys to North Africa. See Adm Ben Bryant's book, Submarine Commander

[@MayaMediated]

Hi. San Francisco filmmaker here. There are people who want to knock San Francisco for political gain. At best, you've been hearing exaggerations. I work here and in the East Bay where, for instance Hornet (Essex Class) is. Please come and I will give you every heads up on everything and anything you want to know as I grew up around here. Don't believe the hype. Gato class USS Pampinito is awesome. I got the info. Please pay no attention to the haters. Thanks.

[@MayaMediated]

And I forgot to mention The San Francisco Maritime National Historical Museum and Park. I know you'll love that, and the old art deco Maritime Union Hall.

[@DardanellesBy108]

I live across the bay from San Francisco and used to go there to take pictures and videos of the cruise ships as well as navy ships that visit there. No more. I won’t sit foot there now, too dangerous. Thieves there are busting out windows while drivers are still in the car! That’s how bad it’s gotten.

[@1982nsu]

"I left my _______ (fill in the blank) in San Francisco."

[@danielkorladis7869]

so don't drive there. It's a headache because of parking and traffic anyway.

[@DardanellesBy108]

@@danielkorladis7869 Actually I would take the ferry out of Alameda. It’s a nice trip. The last time I drove there was to go to Mission Cliffs Climbing gym. The traffic home was always a nightmare. So now I only climb in the Alameda or Contra Costa gyms.

[@stuweiss-zi9rc]

Don’t be scared of coming to San Francisco - the media reports are overwrought and we would love to have you in the Bay Area

[@MayaMediated]

Yup. I'm so sick of the corporate press. They get worse every year. And the Mayor continually angling for more police with her propaganda isn't helping.

[@Bilskirnir3124]

Absolutely justified concerns about visiting San Francisco. If anything the reports undersell the urban decay happening there.

[@danielkorladis7869]

No, SF is just a punching bag for the right the same way that Florida is for the left. San Francisco has a lower vehicle burglary rate than Des Moines and Dallas, and a lower robbery rate than Milwaukee or Houston. And it's mainly obvious "rich techie" cars getting broken into. You can avoid this by simply taking public transit. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_crime_rate#Crime_rates

[@grahamstrouse1165]

🙄🙄🙄

[@cbbees1468]

​@@danielkorladis7869Libtard cities have the most crime.

[@MrArtbv]

With all due respect your answer as regards Fleet Air Doctrine was PURE gibberish... BUT to be fair SO WAS ADMIRILATY DOCTRINE. ABTW Armored flight decks don't have a damn thing to do w this argument. I get that the schism between British BB Admirals n "Airwing Adms" was every bit as great as those between their US counterparts...LOOK just own up that because of internicene politics British Carrier tactics SUCKED from 1939-42, Taranto not withstanding.. You make a big deal about USS/HMS "Robin" in the Pacific... Please share what her Airwing by type was comprised of... YEAH.. LOOK, not until it didn't matter did the Brits have ANYTHING close to an F6F, SBD... or a Corsair.... And all that knowledge of the threat land based bombers represented??? Please explain again how HM Navy shoved POW and Repulse shoved themselves into the jaws of that Nutcracker...

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

Originally Force Z had a carrier. But due to hull damage in an accident, the carrier was left behind from the trip to Singapore .

[@CharlesStearman]

@@WALTERBROADDUS Also, as Drach explained in his video of Force Z, the British were unaware that the Japanese had land-based aircraft within range of the operational area.

[@grahamstrouse1165]

@@CharlesStearmanIt was pretty much a doomed adventure from the start. Adding a character to the would have just doomed another vital RN capital ship to Davy Jones locker. Royal Navy tactics in the Atlantic were consistently solid but they had a bad habit early in the war of deploying assets piecemeal to the Pacific.

[@MrArtbv]

That is simply not true. They, the RN at Singapore were VERY aware of the 2 plus squadrons of long range (For medium bombers) the Japanese had deployed to S Vietnam... BUT because they were ARMY bombers they discounted their effectiveness. Despite the RN designing their carriers for operations in the Med AGAINST the threat of "Land Based Bombers". They had aircover available. The Brewsters at Singapore, outdated as they were, were more than capable of defending against UNESCORTED Jap twin engine bombers. PERIOD. Hard Stop.@@CharlesStearman

[@MrArtbv]

@@WALTERBROADDUS It was the outdated Lt carrier Hermes and wouldn't have been able to keep up w POW or Repulse. Plus it's airgroup, if memory serves was down to 4-5 functioning "fighters"... Given British Doctrine it would have been in a separate Task Force and watched/overheard helplessly as events unfolded.... Until it was her "Turn"..

[@mattwilliams3456]

Yeah……avoiding San Francisco is a wise call. For cargo ships you can always come to Florida and see the SS American Victory, a Victory ship in Tampa.

[@marckyle5895]

I had a great time touring USS Hornet at Alameda. Well worth the trip. The view from the Air Boss chair :-)

[@VintageCarHistory]

Not wanting to go to San Francisco.... Good on you, Sir! My wife and I are both natives of that God forsaken state, her from the SF area. We both left that pathetic place in 2005 and with mixed emotions- happiness and joy. We now live in Ohio where those who are not illegal immigrants or minorities can live without persecution.

[@1982nsu]

"I left my _______ (fill in the blank) in San Francisco."

[@danielkorladis7869]

ok coward. Cleveland and Cincinatti both have higher robbery and burglary rates than SF.

[@MayaMediated]

Sad!

[@ryder6070]

More likely to get struck by lightning than car robbed.

[@johnlander4635]

If you got to San Francisco. Be sure to wear a flower in your hair.

[@aaronmonke6825]

Yeah San Fran is shitty

[@TrickiVicBB71]

I always hear of bad things about San Francisco. And I don't even live in the same country. Ya'll really have a poop on the street app???

[@danielkorladis7869]

no, as usual it's the media selling fear for ratings.

[@kemarisite]

No, it was discontinued because it had basically become a map of the city. How much of that was legitimate and how much people spamming the app is a separate issue.

[@Archie2c]

San Fran has fallen greatly a girl moving to bora bora lost all of her belongings the morning before her flight while she was getting coffee they took everything but what she was wearing.

[@1982nsu]

"I left my _______ (fill in the blank) in San Francisco."

[@danielkorladis7869]

Why would you leave anything in the car? Idiotic behavior.

[@Archie2c]

@@danielkorladis7869 she was moving she left her luggage and some odds and ends thought she could grab a coffee on the way to the airport locked the car but it was a rental they busted the window s

[@mahbriggs]

Your hesitation about traveling to San Francisco is unfortunately well founded! Hopefully, things are getting bad enough there, that sane people will take charge, and restore Law and order. I am staying away myself!

[@1982nsu]

"I left my _______ (fill in the blank) in San Francisco."

[@danielkorladis7869]

No it isn't. San Francisco has a lower vehicle burglary rate than Des Moines and Dallas, and a lower robbery rate than Milwaukee or Houston. And it's mainly obvious "rich techie" cars getting broken into. You can avoid this by simply taking public transit. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_crime_rate#Crime_rates

[@mahbriggs]

@danielkorladis7869 So you live in or often visit San Francisco? Or are simply an idiot!

[@mahbriggs]

@swampfox4425 Ooh! Hit a sore button with you, did I? Perhaps if you would clean your town up and lower the crime rate, it would be a nice place to visit again! Any place that publishes maps of where to avoid human excrement on the sidewalks, and has cars being broken into while driving down the street is a damned good place to avoid! If you approve of that behavior, please don't leave! Nobody else wants it in their neighborhood! You can keep your crime and feces infested city to yourself! I prefer not to visit a third world city!

[@mahbriggs]

@danielkorladis7869 What about the human feces on the sidewalks that you print maps of? And in Dallas and De Moines they don't break into occupied cars! I have been to SF in the past, it was a beautiful city! Please clean it up and restore law and order!

[@deathpallie]

In the U.S. if it's a "blue" city, avoid if at all possible. The inmates run those asylums I'm afraid.

[@trauko1388]

Hello trumpbot!

[@deathpallie]

@@trauko1388 Well you succeeded in "insulting" me, but you failed to prove me wrong.

[@trauko1388]

@@deathpallie No point in trying to deprogram certain people. You just believe hwatever you are told. 🙂

[@deathpallie]

@@trauko1388 Awful presumptuous of you to assume that I need deprogramming and believe what I'm told. You seem to be the one in need of deprogramming from your apparent TDS. Since Drach hates politics, out of respect I'll end my participation in this conversation.

[@trauko1388]

@@deathpallie LOL! You were the one that brought politics in... hilarious.