The End of the ACC: Why Clemson and Florida State Are Leaving

The ACC began in 1953 and for the last 70 years has mostly been a southern basktball-centric conference. That doesn't work in the new landscape of college athletics. This video takes a look at what Clemson and Florida State bring to the ACC, a timeline of the conference and the world around it, and what's next for all parties involved. Make sure to hit the like button and subscribe if you enjoyed it!
0:00 Intro
3:17 Timeline of Events
16:56 TV Ratings
22:41 What's Next?
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[@ericlofroos2405]

Numbers don’t lie! Nicely done! Go NOLES! FYI, FSU has ALWAYS been in the top 15 most viewed teams nationally, going back to the 1980’s. That’s a FACT!

[@westjordan3077]

Two top 10 teams FSU vs Duke in baseball played last night and the ACC network had women’s lacrosse. You can see why the ACC is ridiculous.

[@tarheel7406]

Per the general consensus that I've read, FSU was snubbed by the CFP to prevent the SEC for having no representation. Explained elsewhere, but one can see how LSU's rank last season and the prior to see how SEC bias can be additionally proven.

[@christopherhooter1937]

No. 12-1 Bama lost to playoff team Texas early in season, and finished beating #1 UGA to win SEC Title. Bama deserved the nod, IMO Whom did FSU beat? No defense LSU in Week 1 ... OK. Clemson (let's be honest, Clemson BLEW it!) ... the Miami game was too tight. IMO, Bama improved greatly over the season. Did FSU? Not really

[@tarheel7406]

@@christopherhooter1937 Again... "per the general consensus that I've read". You are free to have a minority opinion.

[@karenbuchan1]

Hey Christopher, your a hoot, and a homer, buy that narrative, big $$$ talk and BS walks

[@christopherhooter1937]

@karenbuchan1 I'm not a Bama homer, and I didn't buy the excuse of the injured QB. ... At the end of the regular season, 12-1 Bama (who just beat #1 UGA) looked more the part more than 13-0 FSU. That's my honest 🏈 opinion

[@photo2george523]

Awesome information !!!

[@christopherhooter1937]

Good information!

[@stevemak8620]

Great work!

[@FSU.Seminoles1]

June 30th is a HUGE date to watch.

[@Alan-lv9rw]

EAST: Syracuse, Boston College, UConn, Duke, Wake Forest, Georgia Tech, USF. WEST: Tulane, SMU, SDSU, Cal, Stanford, Oregon State, Washington State.

[@MetalGod999]

Dustin, congratulations to you on another excellent video. Once again, your research was very thorough and spot-on, and I applaud you for your love and passion of college football. I gotta ask you, though: What are your thoughts on a College Football Super League? I know you’ve done videos about how you would do conference realignment in the past, which by the way, were excellent. But do you think we’ll have a Super League someday? Let me know what you think about this. And keep up the great work!

[@cfblifer]

That would make a great video haha not thrilled about a "super league" but I am fine with the Power 4 becoming a seperate division away from the Group of 5. So somewhere in the middle I guess?

[@k-hustlethesportspreacher5941]

The move for all teams is based on how ESPN and Fox wants to negotiate TV deals moving forward. Those schools could leave but they must have a place to go. 😒

[@stevemak8620]

You are correct. It's my impression, however, that FSU and Clemson have to be out of the ACC before they can talk to B1G/SEC officials about joining either league, because apparently the SEC and the B1G cannot officially negotiate with Clemson and FSU without becoming liable to be sued by the ACC for interference. On the other hand, FSU administrators have been spotted near Chicago very near B1G headquarters. Interesting. Also sniffing around office space there. You never know. They could happen tp run in to some B1G guys while having lunch... Nothing official, mind you. No interference...

[@BPeavy]

As a Clemson fan, I'm ready to see us play some new teams. Been a fan for over 40 years and watching them play the same core. Mostly !

[@tarheel7406]

The BIG12 is the benchmark for a former peer major conference that has fully depleted/backfilled. Absent evidence otherwise, the ACC should end the same.

[@JVAlabama]

Cant wait to see all southern big boys in the same conference

[@jbaskinger]

The question I have now is if Clemson and FSU leaves, which other teams leave or get kicked out of the conferences? You gotta think teams like North Carolina, Notre Dame, and Miami would want to leave the ACC when the floodgates open but when is enough teams enough?

[@brodyh2895]

my only hope for college football not deteriorating into unwatchbility is all the P5 schools canibalizing each other so bad the whole ncaa self destructs and we get regional conferences focused on rivalries and drive-to games back. as a Delaware fan, I'm glad we got in when we did but I'd love to be in a conference with JMU UConn Temple Navy etc and the demise of the ACC might shake up how conferences look on the east coast in a big way that trickles down. Or not and it just keeps getting worse and more unrecognizable

[@cfblifer]

I feel like college football should break away and we should re-do all the conferences on the "Olympic Sport" level, including basketball. Football has outgrown the other sports so much, it's literally ruining every other sport. So I agree to a certain extent

[@brodyh2895]

@@cfblifer if that does happen, whatever governing body that oversees the sport NEEDS to have more actual governing power than the NCAA has over football now. can’t let the powerful conferences make all the decisions if things are going to be equitable across the FBS

[@jansonroberts2616]

⁠​⁠@@brodyh2895 equitable? If it were equitable, then every University in FBS would have 100k stadium capacities and all would have 10 million dollar head coaching salaries.

[@brodyh2895]

@@jansonroberts2616 not necessarily

[@stevemak8620]

@@brodyh2895 The way to get to equity is to have the B1G and SEC (With FSU, Clemson, and ND) get together for a playoff and a trophy. They belong together metrics. Be interesting and exciting in a whole new lane. Don't begrudge the SEC/B1G. Rather, the ACC/Big should look to increase their own value. Have the best playoff ever. have night games, Thursday games, whatever. Be different, be more valuable next time contracts roll around.

[@kingspleen2152]

FSU DID NOT state an intent to leave. They literally said they have to have the BoT vote on that to Judge Cooper in Leon County

[@CatsClaw44]

The Pac-12 schools transition go into affect on August 2nd because for some reason their TV deal and grant of rights expires on that date.

[@cfblifer]

Good to know!

[@lesaustinjr5796]

What are your sources. FSU already meeting in Chicago which is the BIG 10 conference headquarters with people that matters. Please do a little more homework they’re BIG 10 bound.

[@shanekeenaNYC]

Alford was meeting with boosters in Chicago. They had a big launch this week on it. Not a guarantee but the trolling is real!

[@CatsClaw44]

I hate that you ignored Big 12 expansion thereby giving a complete overview of the landscape but still a decent video,

[@tarheel7406]

What the BIG12 has done since the TX/OK news is mostly irrelevant to the ACC. What the PAC did (or didn't do) has been more relevant.

[@cfblifer]

Well it was just to try and explain the ACC side of all of this. The ACC and Big 12 are kinda running parallel so besides OU/Texas jumping to the SEC, there wasn't a lot of connection

[@MichaelSmith-xb5cp]

Sometimes, institutions are born full of BS. Dixie Conference (1948) Formation of purely amateur conference In 1948, the administration of Florida State University, which had returned to coeducation in 1947 after more than 40 years as a women's college, wrote leaders at other southern institutions seeking to create a "purely amateur" athletic conference. The NCAA had recently tightened its rules on the amount of money that could be paid to collegiate athletes, which caused difficulty for many established athletic programs. Florida State hoped to create a new conference based on the principle of complete amateurism, including no athletic scholarships.

[@buzztp5119]

MONEY !!!! greed has destroyed college football like everything else

[@VBHokie]

14:13 The trade secrets are in the Media Agreement - not the Grant of Rights.

[@michaelwall3393]

You did a great job as always. I have been trying to tell Big12 people that they are not as good nor as bad as people think or they think themselves. Bear in mind that the Big12 numbers over past 10 years of 32 games at 5 million viewers or more primarily includes Oklahoma and Texas. And though not as bad a situation and scenario as ACC if they lose Florida State and Clemson; it’s not exactly vastly better and thus no schools go to Big12 until 30/31. I don’t disagree with that the ACC would be hurt with the departures. But contrary to Big12 and others with doom and gloom and hypocrisy, the ACC would still be a Power/Autonomous Conference and will backfill appropriately and probably get the current media deal they have extended and then justified to be that under ESPN and any other network, as opposed to what is going on now. But I think in the future the ACC could lose both UNC and NCST and maybe both Virginia schools to the SEC. If that happens, then they would be in serious trouble unless they really add true contenders in football and other sports; with their academic standards and requirements they are limited to who they can add. The three service academies for all sports are a no-brainer along with WazzU and OzzU and San Diego State and Tulane and USF. After that it gets tricky. Believe it or not UCONN, Buffalo, Toledo, Ohio, Miami-Ohio, Marshall, ODU, App State, CCU, UAB, Memphis, UNT, UTSA, Troy, Southern Miss, FAU, South Alabama, Liberty, ULL, UTEP, Texas State, Wyoming, Colorado State, Utah State, Nevada, UNLV, and Hawaii are all Tier 1, Carnegie 1, R1 schools. I might be leaving out a few. But from those schools, who are successful at all sports and especially football; and, who are closely associated with high academic standards and success that the ACC and new members would appreciate and approve for? And who networks respect and honor and give decent revenue streams for financial support and gain? Those are the schools that the ACC will add to keep their conference and status. They will be in 4th place among A4/P4 but better than G5/6/7/or whatever they become.

[@MichaelSmith-xb5cp]

What do you consider a contender? Say a team that has won 4 FB Power conference championships in the last 25 years, plus the directors cup more times than can be counted?? THE truth is there really aren't any such teams around because most power conferences have been lopsided top light for the last quarter century...usually with just two teams trading FB chips back and forth between themselves...and those teams are already claimed. You have VATech with repeat FB chips , Baylor, and KSU....and then you have Stanford with 4 FB chips and amazing at all other sports collectively...ACC already went out and got them over the complaints of the ACC power programs...real welcoming, Do you think anyone else would really join even though such other schools don't exist?

[@proud_bird5916]

All East Coast and mid-area teams have the advantage of television time slots to allow viewing of the major game, in a more convenient time slot, allowing personnel to make the direction of college sports. On the flip side for teams on the West Coast television viewing in a limited time slot for viewing in other parts of the country. All persons making decisions for college sports, directly ESPN has by dispersion of revenue, has caused directly the final decisions of items on the West Coast. The leadership in past years was blind to any movements and the effects that should have been discussed without having a big head of stupidity. The Pac12 current leadership is hopefully trying to change any direction they might be going to try. The opening of the transfer portal for sports, students in the transfer portal is in some respect the same as COVID had through all aspects of life in the USA.

[@patrickdag4601]

They'll just refill with uconn and some aac schools.

[@kennethmayner]

UConn, Oregon State and Washington State (to gain travel partners for Stanford and Cal)

[@davidbrown386]

If Miami leaves USF is a given along with Tulane.

[@marym9023]

Go Noles! 🎉

[@walktalk2170]

I actually think FSU and Clemson will stay, why? Because of Notre Dame, you know that Notre Dame is an opportunist above all else and I have a feeling they will find a way to keep them around and bring in more teams that the ACC wants.

[@marym9023]

Zero ACC games (not featuring FSU or Clemson) reached 5M views. Numbers don’t lie, ACC! Why we are leaving. Cya. Go Noles!

[@roris5882]

College Football Traditionalists want to go back to the 90's conference structures because the sport was more regionally balanced. Unfortunately that's not realistic because the Clinton Administration signed NAFTA into effect, which destroyed the Rust Belt by selling the manufacturing center of the country out to China. So by the mid 2000's the SEC became the most dominant conference because of all the blue collar families relocating to the South looking for stable work. The B1G was forced to expand their footprint into other regions of the country for the recruiting benefits to remain relevant and competitive. That's why teams like Ohio State had to pivot to recruit nationally, due to population loss, instead of getting 3/4ths of their roster from Ohio, like they historically have done.

[@Newtothis-oy4gd]

Exit fee isn’t the issue,totally media rights

[@davidkreitzer4401]

We tend to conflate national title numbers with being best overall in strength. Unfortunately the B1G in a 10 year stretch over the last 11 years had the BEST P5 conference vs P5 conference win percentage. The B1G in that period also had the BEST bowl record that also happened to be against the toughest competition.

[@jamesrawson241]

We also tend to conflate light with day and night with darkness, but if I put a bunch of nonsense together in a word salad, I may can convince someone who doesn’t want to believe, that this just isn’t so. A-lot more going on to convince us that Big10 is weak than how uncompetitive they are in Playoff games.

[@michaelwall3393]

I went back and looked at conference records against other conferences including the soon to be defunct PAC12. The BiG10 did not have the best winning percentage or most wins against other P5/now P4 schools/teams. That is false. The BiG10 did not even have the best bowl record over the past 10-13 years or bowl wins against other Autonomous schools and even non autonomous schools. The SEC, ACC, and Big12 have better records. Heck we all hated that damn P6 propaganda the AAC (American Athletic Conference) was spewing out, but in non conference games and bowl games they were living up to their moniker and pitch. Oh by the way, the success that the four PAC schools had against other conferences counts for the PAC not BiG10 and this goes for the Big12 conference as well with their 8 additions successes counting for their previous conferences not the Big12. The BiG10 conference has performed well over the last ten years or so but not the best.

[@LeeNobody]

I will happily take a bet the other side of the bet that FSU and Clemson will be playing in 2025. Name the amount that you would like to bet.

[@chrisg4931]

Convenient fact giving! Maybe because Clemson and FSU are playing more in prime time affects the amount of viewers! VT had one and it was third on your list. If VT or UNC or NC St. was in prime time more, than the viewers list would be different. Also convenient is how you only go back to 2014! why don’t you go back to 2005 when the ACC expanded?! oh that’s right because that’s when Clemson got good!

[@LeeNobody]

Relevant point that broadcast networks make a big difference

[@tomsmithdeal775]

Oh, Geez Louise. The networks exist to make money and show the games that make the most money. They are not a charity. FSU averaged 5.68m viewers per game, UNC averaged 974k. What network is going to bump FSU for UNC? It’s damn sure not ESPN. You are claiming that the schools that no one cares about would draw higher ratings if they could get on the main channel more often but totally ignore the fact that they don’t have the attraction or viewer interest that the top teams do. And that is why Alabama games are shown more than Arkansas games. The networks are responding to viewer preference. If you are under the delusion that after FSU and Clemson depart that that opens the door for VT, UNC or NCSU to start drawing FSU viewership numbers, you are living in a parallel universe.

[@tarheel7406]

@@tomsmithdeal775 FSU deservedly gets the best times/channels since they are the bigger draw. The difference could be 1 to 5M viewers. Regardless, FSU is likely at peak athletics and has a lower football ceiling within an ~48-team P2 than UNC (which is blue in overall sports).

[@cfblifer]

I mean, yeah obviously primetime games typically bring in more viewers, but it's also important to ask why some teams have more primetime games. Also I went back to 2014 because it was the last round of realignment, beginning of the Playoff era, and a decade ago. Wasn't to spite VT

[@tomsmithdeal775]

@@tarheel7406 I presume that this is a parody account. UNC has a higher football ceiling than FSU? Hmmm….FSU ranked #7 in viewership. UNC ranked #46, behind several G5 schools. And they have the higher ceiling? That literally means that they have the potential to finish #6 or better. Oh, and FSU has three NC’s, how many does UNC have? Again, you are saying that UNC will win four before FSU does. There is not a human being on the planet that believes that, except for you.

[@artpowers812]

I really turned a deaf ear when you said the GOR was "sealed" It is not and if Clemson and FSU don't have their own copies of the agreements they signed, it is on them. So stop trying to make some binding tie between the GOR which is between the conference and the individual teams and the media deal which the GOR empowered the conference to act on their behalf.

[@JamesSterling]

Correct. The Grant of Rights between each school and the ACC obviously has to have a signed copy in the possession of each school. The broadcast agreement between the ACC and ESPN is what the ACC is keeping under lock and key and will not let the schools have a copy to examine. The conference consists of the members, not the suit and tie guys in the headquarters office, who are employees of the conference. Yet the ACC headquarters guys run it like they own it and the schools are a nuisance to be dealt with. Imagine if you owned a business and your manager signed a 20 year, billion dollar contract but then said you were not allowed to have a copy, only examine it while he watched you. This is the ACC headquarters position.

[@trick7884]

The GoR's own language ties it to the ESPN Agreement. If the ACC signed poorly drafted contracts, that's on them.

[@elicabelly2119]

Louisville TAMU, Music City Bowl, Dec 30, 2015, 5.4M viewers LSU Louisville, Citrus Bowl, Dec 31, 2016, 6.4M viewers I think you left out bowl games from this analysis. I'm going back and you also left out ACC championship games. Furthermore, I haven't seen any mention of ACC games that could have been rounded up to 5M views, or what was the highest viewership in an ACC game over these ten years that didn't involved FSU or Clemson. There is a lot needed to improve this analysis. Also, Notre Dame has full voting rights in the ACC. They have to be considered members for the purpose of this analysis. They just get to keep their football money. At that point you consider Notre Dame and Miami, and then there's only 7 of these games that don't include those teams, plus whatever bowl games you missed like Louisville TAMU in 2015.

[@brandonstrickland580]

I do get the perspective on TV ratings. You should keep an eye on UNC the silent 3rd voice in all of this. New TV market for the SEC, national brand, and one of the hearts of the ACC. The SEC wants UNC badly, probably more than any other school in the ACC right now. UNC is watching and waiting to see what settlements are reached. FSU/Clemson/UNC are losses that will relegate the ACC to a minimal power. I agree with the points on Clemson and FSU, but I thinks it too narrow.

[@tomsmithdeal775]

I disagree completely about UNC. To say that the SEC wants UNC badly is bizarre. Let’s look at why…… First, college football viewership is the new currency. Eyeballs = Money. No eyeballs, no money. UNC ranks a dismal #46 (974k average) in viewership, behind many G5 schools. In their own state, they lag FSU, Clemson, Miami and Duke making them the fifth most watched ACC team. IN THEIR OWN STATE. That’s not acceptable and no amount of PR spin can cover that up. As for untapped markets, some markets are untapped for a very good reason. They don’t exist. North Carolina is a college basketball market, not a college football market. Want proof? In next door Tennessee, with a smaller population, UT ranks #13. Why doesn’t UNC have similar numbers? Because Tennessee is a football market, North Carolina is a basketball market. The numbers don’t lie. Then there is the matter of a potential new school being either financially additive or dilutive. They can hold their weight in revenue generation or they are a financial boat anchor. At present, UNC generates about $36m a year revenue for the ACC and those numbers would not change much in another conference and may even decrease. If the SEC payout is $70m per school, UNC would literally COST the schools in the SEC $34m per year. To say that the SEC would pay UNC $34m a year to be in the conference is ludicrous.

[@brandonstrickland580]

@@tomsmithdeal775 We will have to agree to disagree. It has been reported on multiple fronts UNC is the top target for both the SEC and the BIG 10. I will concede that UNC is not a national blue blood in Football. However, when you think of North Carolina you think of UNC. Mark my words, given a choice if UNC leaves the ACC. They would be offered a spot immediately to the SEC and the Big 10. Again very narrow in the picture of only football. I imagine the P2 sees that opportunity as well.

[@tomsmithdeal775]

@@brandonstrickland580 So you are saying that a P2 conference would gladly suffer a $30-40m a year hit to their balance sheet for the privilege of having UNC in their conference? As for a “very narrow in the picture of only football”, uh, football generates 80-90% of the revenue. That’s narrow? You are literally saying that a P2 conference would pay any price to have UNC in their conference. And ESPN, who is strictly in the business of making money and paying the SEC billions of dollars to broadcast games, would be fine with losing millions and millions of dollars to add unwatchable UNC games to their schedule? UNC has had exactly 1 game in the past ten years that drew 5 million viewers. ONE. Some of their games drew less than 350k. So, ESPN would suffer losses every year of millions of dollars, but they don’t care? Adding UNC would hurt ESPN.

[@brandonstrickland580]

@@tomsmithdeal775 I am going on the reports from reputable folks it’s out there. You should ask Sankey why he wants them. Probably would shed some light for you.

[@tarheel7406]

@@tomsmithdeal775 Football driving viewers is the general rule. UNC is a rare school that draws big numbers elsewhere. The value is diversified.

[@joecartwright9221]

ACC WILL NOT BE A POWER CONFERENCE if Clemson & FSU are able to leave. ACC will be group of 6 . The Big 12 doesn’t want any teams

[@trick7884]

super skeptical that we have an announcement/settlement this summer/fall the acc is going to cling on for dear life until their fingers go numb and they plummet to their death. and FSU will laugh as they watch. the acc isn't going to want to make a deal. even if/when they lose the lawsuit, it may be better for them than settling. the acc is going to die either way, so may as well "cling, baby, cling"

[@josephcernansky1794]

You MISSED the June 30th Deadline for the current 50% of the ACC membership to be able to dissolve the conference....On July 1st....that number goes from 8 to 10 members to dissolve when Stanford, Cal and SMU become full/voting members.

[@cfblifer]

Oooh nice. I did miss that

[@tarheel7406]

If there were close to 8 votes to dissolve, CAL+2 would not have been invited.

[@tarheel7406]

Honestly? The ACC got a binding scheduling agreement and "must join" agreement with ND as part of allowing ND to join outside of football.

[@tarheel7406]

a) UNC/DUKE voted against the MIAMI/VATECH addition, but UNC did vote for the FSU invite. Your claimed reasons are suspect. DUKE may have feared an emphasis on football and/or a loss of influence, but UNC likely didn't approve of MIAMI demanding CUSE/PITT and/or the Virgina Governor's interference. b) I suspect that the BC through L'VILLE unanimous invites were due to the damage already then done and necessity.

[@CatsClaw44]

You are desperate to defend the ACC but those schools want out. 😂😂😂

[@tarheel7406]

@@CatsClaw44 UNC will be fine, so I can be cold and objective. No ACC schools wants to join the BIG12. Regardless, correcting the vid is fair game. DUKE and MD objected to the FSU invite.

[@jonnybaze7449]

You don’t know what it did for the acc??? How? Money. I brought the acc money.

[@scottmorrison147]

Careful what they wish for....

[@gearmonkey5904]

FSU brings in a lot of money and viewers to the acc. I believe they carried the acc for many decades from 1992-2014. For the acc to be very weak on the CFP last season was the last straw. It’s time to leave the acc period and sue them for failure of fiduciary responsibilities to all member schools. The acc is a 💩 conference. 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@jasonwalters5478]

Thanks for wasting 30 minutes of my life on a pointless video

[@tomsmithdeal775]

You can get it back if you watch it in reverse.

[@LeeNobody]

Yawn FSU and Clemson aren't leaving for any less than the full GOR and Exit Fee. FSU just had its claims dismissed and sent to mediation. Neither can afford the to leave til 2030.

[@brothermouzone1307]

You are out of your mind. You think the ACC is walking away with $700 million of Florida taxpayers' money.😂 Higher than $200 million? I will be shocked. $150 million is my number.😂😂

[@LeeNobody]

@@brothermouzone1307 they signed the contract. This isn't school yard deals this is a multi billion dollar broadcast agreement. You don't get take backs of you don't like it 10 years later.

[@paulclifton655]

FSU is leaving and no we will not be paying anywhere near that …. Yawn

[@CatsClaw44]

​@@LeeNobodyYou are clueless. They were told to re-introduce it with more info

[@genewatson4093]

I’m being told it will be 100 to 125. The fraud case from the FL AG looks to have legs here. No way ESPN wants to stay attached here. Just the resurfacing of J Skipper deal will force them to settle.