The evolution of Magic The Gathering Counterfeits...from Hilarious to Serious

koun(t)ərˌfit = pretend to feel or possess; an emotion or item
PATREON : / alphainvestments
SHIRTS: www.ebay.com/itm/-/162268260486?
~FAN MAIL~
Rudy's Magic Store
10950-60 San Jose Blvd.
Box # 139
Jacksonville, FL 32223

[@zerotheory941]

awwwwwwwwwwww I'm sad now. But not sad for my dog Jedi. She's world famous now.

[@ModestestMouse]

g j Jedi was just using her force to show you the truth... good baby..

[@marc1941]

Jedi knew it was fake and tried to show him there was no blue internal

[@electronicshaman]

Really wanted you to bite the corner off the real Library, sign it, and send it to gary.

[@kingarthur7255]

You guys are too much🤣

[@AlphaToOmegaMC]

Second card, behind the dark ritual, is a Crystal Seer, just if anyone wanted to know.

[@basketballbroson620]

Someone give this person 3 floppy tacos.

[@thetoxie]

Thanks, that thoughtseize made me question the authenticity of EVERY rare and mythic I own. My first projection: 80% seem fake

[@StereotypeLucas]

thetoxie I know the exact feeling... especially since I bought a lot of cards from eBay and Amazon.. assume they were real and put them in sleeves because I don’t want them bending or getting dirty.. now I’m paranoid that a lot of the cards I bought for my edh deck are fake...

[@sincm91]

Is It possible that there are counterfeits Commander decks or theme decks? I never saw any of them tho

[@danieldukai1380]

I love how most of these authentification tests just straight out destroy your cards.

[@fuckingimpossible]

Rudy tells you in the video to get a Jeweler's Loupe. This is the best way to test for authenticity and often the simplest. if you are tearing cards or bending them or putting water on them, you should not be testing cards for legitimacy.

[@WeskersPlayhouse]

Daniel Dukai if you mean bend test it actually doesn't, they spring back very fast and nice. I've gotten to see someone bend test a Lotus IRL before buying it.

[@fuckingimpossible]

WeskersPlayhouse and that's fine, you bought a card that passed a test that wears out the card. You should not have to be told not to bend a 20 year old piece of cardboard to test authenticity, but if you do, I hope you plan on buying it regardless. It works because it was designed to work, but old paper is old paper and it will fail eventually.

[@kurtilein3]

The bend test is destructive, there is no way around it. Jewellers loupe 20x, a decent one not the crap shown in the video, is best. You will see the dot pattern, and you will see that solid black areas like the card text, mana symbols, the black border, and any old expansion symbol WILL NOT HAVE a dot pattern because that is a second printing layer in genuine cards. So the card text must be solid black outlines with clear boundaries on top of a pool of colored dots. Smelling and touching and feeling will also not degrade the card if your hands are clean and you know what you are doing and you stay away from the edges. The bend test can cause irreperable damage in the form of cracks in the surface, and by causing the card to bend more easily forever. Go straight to the final rip and tear and peel test after you are 100% sure that it is fake. If you bend it, you buy it, because you diminished it, you might as well spit on it and wipe off your spit.

[@donnasprague767]

kurtilein3 i spit on all my cards to prove they are mine.

[@Dremin2009]

Rudy you should send the Thoughtseize to PSA for grading as a test.

[@Scorch428]

theyd use a loop..

[@saminthecan]

the best ones arent heard of because no one has found them.

[@ipbrian]

I don't find this one boring at all. I would love to see more of these!

[@CommanderReplay]

Instead of the a jewelers loop you can use a high definition scanner. I had to do some high def scans for a buddy who needed the images for a newspaper, and at 4800 dpi you can easily the see the print pattern on the card. You will need a good comparison card, but if you're looking to buy reserved list, you can easily spend to get a common from the set to compare with.

[@paulmakl6282]

When you put away the library of Alexandria, you put the card in bottom first for the inner and outer sleeve. This is not how it was when you took it out. Just thought you should know so nothing gets into your card and damages it.

[@azraelswrd]

Yeah, I noticed that too. A good double sleeve leaves no direct access to the card, unlike the way he packed it up on the vid.

[@cykadelic6524]

everyone needs to like this to the top to make sure he sees ^^

[@spkoftdvl]

You think he will care about it? He must have like 50 cards like that..

[@Dohyden2]

is anyone impressed by the fact the dog's name is Jedi and he bit into a fake card? I think the dog has special fake finding powers.

[@Germancouch]

Had a bloodghast sent to me through pucatrade that was just like that thoughtseize. Played it for about a year in shops and no one could tell (including myself). Wasn't until a few weeks ago where I went to trade it with the rest of my playset and the person I traded it to pointed it out that there was something off about it. Sure enough it didn't pass the light test and they were able to consistently pick it out in a stack of 20 or so cards so I ripped it and it had a black core. I couldn't believe someone would counterfeit a mere 20 dollar card and actually trade it.

[@MrRanger316]

Germancouch That's really unfortunate. All this talk of high quality fakes is making me think of getting a light to check my own cards now.

[@derzerby]

That smell test. Rudy is the bloodhound of the Magic community.

[@CommanderReplay]

No one is talking about the $.52 4th Dark Ritual....not sure why they would counterfeit that one. It has to be cheaper to just buy the real thing.

[@SqueaksGameWorld]

KZbin: Making people self-conscious of their hands since 2005.

[@SonAlexander]

I owned a Beta Time Walk for near 15 years. I traded for it back when Invasion came out. I think the card was worth around $200 at the time from Scry Magazine. I attempted to trade it at GP Seattle after it hit around $1500. Come to find out it was fake. Someone took a Collectors edition Time Walk, split the card, then split another card and re-backed it. They also used Blue ink on the inside of the card so it passed the light test. Everything about the card seemed real, aside from the fact it was fake. Needless to say I was devastated... really a bummer to find out something you've own for that long finding out it was fake, then having people assume I was trying to peddle a fake.

[@StereotypeLucas]

SonAlexander how did the people in GP Seattle notice it was fake then if it was that good ? :o I’m so sorry to hear that..

[@markhebert3998]

at 12:07 you can see what he's talking about there are little diamonds with a dot in the middle of each. Thanks again for sharing Rudy!!

[@pietjepolo]

Rudy, maybe this sound really stupid, but are you sure that the thoughtseize is fake? aren't comparing a Belgium printed card vs a US printed card? In the Netherlands, the boosterboxes that we buy (Belgium print) have a darker finish than the boosters that are inside the Fatpacks/pre-release kit(US print). The US printed are a few shades lighter, you can see this effect the best on Swamp cards. now the days its not that noticeable, but during M15 it really caught my attention.

[@bubbabenali]

That was even more so back in the days of 3rd/ 4th edition here in germany. The german prints where several levels darker. Sometimes we thought the english cards bleeched out... Quality was risen tremendously with Mirage tho.

[@hairyhulkvideos]

I was thinking of how some cards just come out of the printer in worse shape than others. sometimes you get a darker colored pack for some reason, or a lighter colored pack, etc. I've seen it before and realized that even a "pack fresh" card might not be mint.

[@DavidJolt1r]

I also noticed that the US prints are glossier than Belgian. When I sort through my cards I can easily tell where they've been printed. Specially with the newer sets

[@Xenocyde3000]

If it fails the loupe inspection and UV light test, it's a fake. Those are the only 2 reliable tests these days. I'm guessing Rudy knows what to look for with the loupe.

[@ApatheticallyClowning]

David Jolt1r I've bought quite a few foreign booster packs and singles and all of the Asian cards are a lot more glossy than the US ones. Additionally the foils tend to be more dull, at least on the Japanese ones.

[@degeneratedna3210]

sadly I seen that Library on eBay about a month ago for $999.00 with the same dog story

[@aaronvanbreugel9450]

Degenerate DNA possibly before he sold it to the store he tried selling it online

[@arenkai]

If he wanted to scam someone online he would have never sent it to Rudy for it to be public knowledge that the card is fake. Like Aaron said, he probably tried to sell it online before selling it to the store.

[@degeneratedna3210]

arenkai never said he was trying to scam anyone...... just telling you what I saw, you make your own conclusions. On eBay in the item description he tells you that he left the deck on the coffee table an the dog got the deck an chewed up the cards, I would think that it would be a pretty expensive deck with a Library in it, wonder how the rest of the cards made out?

[@aaronvanbreugel9450]

Degenerate DNA considering dogs kinda go all in I'd say he lost hundreds to thousands depending on how real the rest of the deck was

[@degeneratedna3210]

Aaron Van Breugel well there you go..... glad he mentioned them in the letter

[@Sparky2618]

I want to see some counterfeit counter spells. Preferably not in my own collection. Thanks for the awesome content Rudy. Recent subscriber after getting back into magic. Love your unique take on magic and your quirky humour. Keep it up.

[@fucclessmasterlord3960]

How do you hone your nostrils to distinguish types of ink printed on paper several years ago. This is a skill I must acquire.

[@gavinmacko9617]

for anyone else who cared the card underneath the dark rituals fake was a crystal seer, from guildpact

[@bastokrepublic]

You need to train a dog to recognize the scent of 'Wizards Ink'.

[@MakeThisPlaceIgnite]

I saw that library on eBay a couple months ago lol

[@cyberneticthezero]

i got a Journey to Nix God pack a few days ago and i was really hyped i ever googled articles about it haha!

[@llamaloaf8134]

How do we know, we aren't already at a point where conterfeits are pretty much perfect? I mean... we won't be able to tell, right?

[@philaspen6569]

Moral of the story: always smell the cards you're trading for.

[@dimitrir.2112]

That last Thoughtsieze is looking scary real!

[@nathantoothaker3096]

The second card you looked at, that you couldn't tell what it was, is called Crystal Seer, if you were curious. It's a blue creature, vedalken wizard, with the words "Crystal seer" visible in the text box, although "Crystal" is mostly covered by the paper.

[@AoiKaze2000]

What about shining a really powerful light through the card to see the glue color and patterns?

[@trainern8173]

Found a use for me Hand lense now... but all the cards are Green screen anyway so what do i do now!?

[@kurtilein3]

You forgot to mention two solid tests. In real cards, only the colors will have the dot pattern under magnification, the black is solid with no dot pattern, so in a real card, when you look at an oldschool mana symbol, the black is a solid layer of black paint, no pattern, and around it you get the dot pattern. You get the same around the card text. You see solid black with sharp outlines on a background of dots under huge magnification. The second one is translucence, real MTG cards will have some transparency when using a powerful flashlight, it is very limited and clearly defined. Then, you can also look at the edges using magnification, and you can also use the weight of the entire card as an indicator. Those are all non-destructive methods that hit hard, this is difficult to fake. By the way, your jeweller loupes suck, i have one that i got for 10 euros, its a double-convex chunky glass lens (really thick) in a metal frame, its a 20x, perfectly polished, it rotates into a metal casing and comes in a leather pouch. The black plastic diminishes what you have, you really just want one thick glass lens, and you can throw away all the lower magnifications, if you have one that is 10x to 20x, you can throw away all the lower ones once you know how to use it. I have it because i actually collect diamonds and opals.

[@MrScourge42]

What about the light test? pass the card over a powerful light to see the blue in the middle. Does the thoughtsieze have the blue inside?

[@Bigolelevi]

what was on your shirt in the reflection I can't freeze frame it in the right spot. did you tape something to your shirt?

[@Kayzizzle]

Glad you put this video out. Been having to return a lot of fakes recently that are HQ

[@mauricioe.matamoros8993]

Hello there I have a dark betrayal with the coloration way off than my other 6 copies of it, yet I opened it from a born of the gods event deck, is there a possibility it's fake?

[@MrBmwatkiss]

Thanks Rudy, great video.

[@Ottawa3453]

A good magnifying glass allows you to see the "flower"-pattern as well, I found out. Thanks for the tip Rudy :P

[@acex222]

Buying loupes is probably the best piece of advice you've given that isn't about bonds

[@700NitroXpress]

Our card shop had a play set of fake Thoughtseize and they did know until we took them out of the sleeve. The back of the cards was super glossy, but you couldn't tell with it in the perfect fit sleeve.

[@anthonylee9415]

I heard that you can put a light up to the back of a card and see the glue pattern that gives away a counterfeit vs a true card. Is this correct?

[@AndyThomson03]

So I recently bought cards from an online store up here in Canada and I trusted the store for the longest time and still want to but my friend pointed out that one of my cards had a black faded line down the middle of the card, hardly noticeable but there. I went and looked through this deck that was solely bought on this website minus lands and I found out that about 25 out of 40 of the cards had this same line obviously. Some are $3 cards but most are $0.25. I can't make it to my LGS very often but I don't wanna rip test these cards and not have my favourite casual deck ready. What can I do?

[@fredweasley6182]

Thanks for the vid! I've been collecting Alpha cards for a few years now and just barely got a jeweler's loupe a few weeks ago. I was worried about a few of my cards but I believe all of the high dollar cards to be authentic.

[@VernsHobbies]

Hey so what about the new holo/foil window on rares? Is that working so far? Coming back to the game I've been trying to avoid old cards without them because of all the fakes out there

[@samuelingram597]

wow, i couldnt even tell the difference between the libraries when you pointed it out.

[@DoctorGunderson]

I saw a similar theros fake a couple years ago that had the different corner cut. It also had a slightly different font for the artist's name. I can't tell from the video if this is one but it's easier to spot if you compare the same card, or at least the same artist name side by side. I agree the feel and smell tests alone work most of the time.

[@johndeckard6592]

I remember that Library with the dog bite from Ebay awhile back lol

[@quickdiy8127]

who made the thoughtseize? looks like black or villa unless it's american made from houz?

[@thomas_ct]

How can you tell the difference from a card from a bad print run, and a counterfeit card? I have opened a few cards from a sealed box, where the text is faded.

[@patrickduquette4306]

great vid Rudy..I'm with you for the smell of these cards..nothing else smells like it!

[@patrickduquette4306]

gotta say though, I've purchased french cards of magic origins and they all had the same glossy, different feel to them

[@borlow9083]

light test is soundproof?

[@iceverin4083]

02:26 it's Crystal Seer from Guildpact

[@jonahshriver3358]

Back when it was standard, I remember opening a foil Thoughtseize out of a Theros pack that was a severe misprint. The guy's face was missing, there was no ink; only foiling.

[@p5yc0d3]

Recently bought some cards from Card Kingdom... is older cards darker from the back than the newest one?...

[@TheRoadtoRugbyFitness]

If you have a good, very recent smart phone, the cameras on them are good enough where you can zoom in enough to see rosette patterns.

[@loganabela375]

Does the bend test and light test work on better fakes?

[@MagikGimp]

A true connoisseur of home printer ink from the early 2000s.

[@tamhuynh1905]

good to know, I learned about the jeweler's loop several years ago but thanks for the video regardless

[@bwuceli3801]

I scan all vintage cards I acquire at 600 dpi and compare them with what I have. To date this method has never let me down. You can scan at a higher resolution, but that's not really necessary, at 600 dpi you are already more than able to discern all relevant patterns and the crispness of lines on the cards . Get a few commons of the appropriate sets and scan those in for comparison. More often than not fake cards will look as if the black print (which happened on top of the normal color print back in the day) was 'bleeding'. If you have a very delicate touch you can actually 'feel' the black print on top of the card. I have some experience with this as I was a printer/QA at an industrial printers (in Belgium for what it's worth) that used a mechanical print for almost 10 years. Scanning in the cards also give you an idea about the flaws and imperfections you would otherwise miss if you want to decide if it's worth it to get a card graded. Just don't get too paranoid about those, keep in mind that those imperfections will appear huge while in reality they may be barely noticeable. There is a caveat however, very old sets can have to 2 or 3 different patterns depending on the print run. Do not panic if you notice a pattern is somewhat different, it could happen back then, the printing was done mechanically and not digitally up to 1995 (AFAIK, maybe even longer). Anyway, at 600 dpi you can easily tell what is fake or real and you can blow the card up until you see a single printing pixel. Hell, even at 300 dpi you can comfortably spot a fake. Needless to say, I haven't used a magnifying glass anymore in a long time and I don't trade unless I've seen 600 dpi scans of the cards I want to trade. TLDR, Scan cards at 600 dpi and make a small database as a reference yourself. I haven't been burned in ages. On older cards the print pattern and the blacks never lie (for now).

[@notaliaraliar2755]

I recognize those coke sniffs @ 11:27

[@jeremybds1901]

not a liar a liar been saying that forever! lol

[@Mike_Genisys]

I'd like to know how much inventory on tcg player is authentic

[@Masterfrogg]

That Dark Ritual is printed over a Crystal Seer.

[@azraelswrd]

Nice plug for those magnifiers. At this rate, the best way might be to set up a dual magnifier rig (similar to what the police use to examine bullet striations) and then hook it up to a video feed so the images can be shown side by side (real vs. fake). Might make spotting that Thoughtseize easier because on this vid, I couldn't tell at all.

[@bCosby17]

Hi I have a couple questions, is there a way I can contact you to send you photos of a card?

[@russellanderson8844]

I have now seen two cards whose art was done by mark Poole did he sign all his cards because my urzas tower has Poole in it

[@KrepsyK]

On the last example you can tell by the TM on the back of the card after magic

[@benjaminspiker1360]

wait, i have a ton of those 4th edition dark rituals laying around. is there any money to be had?

[@herbert164]

no

[@PaddyRoon7]

That deep sniff and blood cells comment really got me for some reason

[@itachi1211]

Great Video Rudy. What about the light test?. As far as I know, the current proxies do not pass completely the light test. When you do the light test 3-4 cm away from the card, you can catch very easily which one is fake. The real magic cards let go though much more light than the fake ones. This is very useful for who doesn't have the original card to compare or a card of the same edition. Keep doing such a great videos about the world of Magic.

[@h2_]

Rudy, what do you think about misprints?

[@testthewest123]

Rudy, have you tried using a macro lens on your camera for these kind of things? Make 2 nice close up pictures and even youtube quality can't ruin it.

[@amadeusskinkerx7228]

Shady Rudy is embarrassed about hands. He is confirmed uncle Jack from Always Sunny.

[@TheEpicenterGaming]

2003 Gencon Indy I saw a guy with 800 count card boxes full of fake power 9 and other high value cards. I traded $50 worth of cards for about 15 of them. They were all like the one you showed with the darker back. I still have them

[@JonnyKipping]

What magnification do you recommend for Jewellers Loupe?

[@timmccalla7298]

jewelers loupe is usually 30×

[@Raaanch]

I once did something similar with fake revised duals. I'm fairly certain I ripped up the Tropical Island but I'll ask my buddy (the one who gave me the Trop) if he still has his underground sea. If so, I'll mail that to you.

[@MrBlackpink]

Rudy is the thoughtseize thicker on the edges. I've seen some proxies and it's like two cards were glued togather.

[@geof18]

can you still check if its fake if the card was altered? (by altered the guy covered almost everything besides the name of the card no logo and card text)

[@Clabian96]

I really enjoyed this. Some of the new fakes, like the Thoughtseize, are pretty hard to tell from the real ones.

[@wesomek]

In Tampa we've always had an issue with counterfeit force of will's. Now that they are so readily made and hard to identify I wonder if the problem will get worst with Fow's and other cards.

[@acex222]

come on dude, I literally ordered a legacy 4.0 set today and you're gonna spill the beans? are you watching me?

[@acex222]

I am joking. I only order from Ron Liu, Zheng is too sus

[@MikFrey]

Rudy what about wizard's misprints ? I opened once a card from booster which looked totally fake, but it was straight from a booster. Other cards from the same booster box looked fine. Are you interested in cards like that?

[@Macro11Underscore1]

well with the library of Alexandria, could it have been sun-baked? Also, the thoughtseize, i know alot of dragonmaze/rtr packs had severe smudging and blurring... going to do an article on misprints? keep going! :)

[@ericofire]

the library wasnt blue on the inside, so it was definitely fake. the thoughseize, dont forget he also has texture to go off of.

[@damanstover2035]

rudy, do you cut up mtg cards and snort them?

[@JJDinomiteLives]

Did that Thoughtseize pass the lighting test? That would have been neat to see.

[@TiredinIT]

Good to know about this sort of thing. Thanks for posting this, hopefully now fewer people will get scammed.

[@jerethgryphon4244]

i have a chaos orb how can i check its real without shreddi g it

[@free-mtg-stuff406]

Is there a reason the light test was left out? Is it so useless that it wasn't mentioned?

[@moodlampActual]

"can I get real close?" -rudy's fav pickup line

[@mtg-art9696]

I've got a lotus petal that I have suspected of being fake for a long time. its been heavily played over the years but the texture seems so strange. very curious about it.

[@tacotimmer8288]

RIP IT

[@insomniac1313]

Rudy, Do you plan on getting any more XXXL shirts in? I see they are already out of stock. I like tacos.

[@ericstewart6514]

I actually had a run in with one of the guys who lived in town where i am, bought his entire collection and all the higher end cards turned out to be fake. I didnt think about even checking when i got them because he was one of the more well known players in town. Id be happy to send you some of the cards to do a video on, theres a savannah and a stack of modern staples. I ended up hanging onto them for use in a cube with a giant black X drawn on the top of them to keep them from being fed into the local supply somehow.

[@ToxicTravesty]

the jewelers lens isnt the only way to tell. our shop has been plagued by scammers with these fakes (and they have since been banned) but if you take an led light under the card the magic logo will shine through on a real card. on a fake card the logo will not be seen.

[@jameshudman3879]

A guy just leaves a Library of Alexandria lying around for his dog to nibble the corner off of? Okay.

[@nayrash5207]

Well, at least the Dog didn't take another Library out of rotation, but that sucks to have such a history only for it to be fake.

[@ramses7309]

The rip test ALWAYS works in my experience. 😭

[@TheWoodenshark]

Word on the street is some fakes already use blue core paper.

[@AnonYmous-mc5zx]

Thats just spiteful. You have a fake but think you ripped the real thing.

[@TheTrueChaks]

Blue core fakes are normally lower quality and can be spotted out to be a fake through something like the light test.

[@joechapa4751]

I feel like a more Rudy thing to do would have been to open the scene with you holding a piece of power, ripping it in half and then telling people its fake. Gotta get that shock value :)

[@sanctred]

What about green dot test with jewelers loop?

[@uristmcstout-horn]

Out of curiosity, what's the most economical vs. safest way to ship singles for you, Rudy?

[@denispellerin2815]

The thoughtsieze looks extremely authentic.