The Fall of Fear The Walking Dead - How The Show Ruined Its Potential

[@wayasaunooke3424]

I wish they had shown, for at least 2 seasons, the literal fall of society. The paranoia, the denial, the slow collapse of a world we once knew. That was what I certainly craved as we had skipped all of it in TWD. That would have been phenomenal to have the slow, confusing and mindblowing reality of an apocalyptic world to every day people. People who never shot a gun and so they had to learn. People who were scared and didn't suddenly become badass fighters but who were human and relatable; slowly debating what the new normal is and what they're capable of and morally able to do. The irony in fear is that there isn't actually enough fear. The characters are fine with dead people eating others. No slow build up, no real terror, no trying to save neighbors in vain etc etc. Just straight to killing machines, leaving their home and everything they know. Leaving all supplies, familiarity, not staying to help others (as would be the normal human, pre apocalyptic mentality) Instead they turned from a family/community to only caring about survival and number one, all knowing how to fight and shoot, no grief for the loss of the entire world as they knew it. I could go on and on but THAT is what many of us wanted. The beginning of an actual zombie apocalypse with real people who are scared to death, who have no idea how to survive and who have to gain courage and skills in this new world.

[@lapplandkun9273]

nah fam, take this skimmed over fallen society of a show and timeskip to the TWD. Nobody cares about that. I swear the writers are braindead sometimes.

[@theredhare2483]

Ironic

[@randeli7785]

Like Rick's group had better progression from hopeful survivors to nihilistic killers, and that group doesn't even start at the beginning of the apocalypse. In FTWD, it's like as soon as they first see a zombie, they immediately have a TWD season 5 mentality of killing anyone who looks at them dirty, not trusting anyone and have little fear (ironic) about society collapsing. Not to mention we only had like 3 episodes of the collapse which happened too quickly.

[@JC_Cali]

That 6 week time skip in the first season really upset me. I really never forgave the show for that.

[@cdt549]

well it's only you... fuck of with ur slow shit...

[@matthew90276]

The biggest failing of the show, among many, was skipping past the early days of the outbreak. There was a lot of potential to cover the collapse of society but they just left that in the rear view mirror.

[@TKNDxTeqneqe]

Not Really It Was Boring.. Especially After TWD.. It’s Soooo Slow..

[@rexzombiesbrasil]

For me that was the whole point of the show, after season 1 ended i just lost interest as it became worser version of TWD.

[@shadows_star]

Literally was the whole draw to the show imo

[@RecluseBootsy]

Right? Even after saying in promos that the early collapse was going to be a big focus. It was the script equivalent of a stand up comic saying "so cellphones... what's up with those?..." and leaving it without a punchline.

[@didelphidae5228]

It could have been made interesting if they wouldn't chicken out on explaining more of the world, the infection, government, etc. they didn't have to stick to cliches and yet they did, and then instead of correcting, they just hurried forward into the apocalypse. What a shame.

[@highonsugar6273]

Losing the main cast of the show really ruined it for me, I feel like Travis, Ofelia, Nick and Madison left the show way too soon

[@sikusher]

The main cast is boring and annoying af. Travis is just a cuckold being bossed around by literally everyone, his wife, his ex wife his kids and his step kids. The only good "main protagonist" moment he had was in s1 being the mediator between the army and his neighbours and when he killed the two guys that killed his son back at the hotel. Ofelia, is a spoiled annoying snake. Abandons her feiends at the hotel only to later betray them and literally attempt to murder them over her white knight boyfriend and his sacred land jibby jabba. Madison is just unbearable. Tries to be the boss lady and stuff and goes from one fck up to another. She has the opposite of Midas Touch, everything she touches turns into shit. Stubborn, stupid and way too emotional, currently watching s4, can't wait to see her finally die. Nick and Strand are the only people with main protagonist vibes. Shame they killed Nick. Alicia's and Daniel are pretty cool as well, ngl Daniel is a badass.

[@jamaicanbambosa]

all imma say is this, never believe someone actually died unless u seen it happen on screen

[@MasterIceyy]

I understand Travis leaving, he got a movie role that could have kick started a mainstream hollywood career, but Nick left the show through AMC's interference and the narrative changes that were made that didn't line up to the promises that were made to Frank Delaney about his character and the main story

[@jaredgalarza]

They killed off there main characters too soon.

[@daoyang223]

The junkie was terrible and his death was pitiful.

[@virus_v73]

@@daoyang223 Nick was the best character on the show. You can't change my mind.

[@Spiritwolfmac]

@@virus_v73 Like Nick, not the best character but I liked him... I was very happy when Maddison was gone... I hated that character. I also really like some of the new characters

[@Ycjedi]

@@Spiritwolfmac Glad you're happy with them, but they're pretty much drizzling shit that further ruined the show, to the rest of us.

[@Ryanlexz]

@@virus_v73 still trash yo. Rick or Shane is way better yo

[@MTKUKF]

When Nick died, the show died. When Madison died, every chance of forgivness for Nick's death died. I stoped watching after Nick's death. Was thinking of going back, then i heared Madison died. I never came back.

[@slow4you476]

MTKUKF exactly nick was like the main character after he died it wasn’t the same but the first 3 seasons were the best

[@MrGreaves]

MTKUKF exactly the same story as me dude ! I didn’t really mean to slip away from the show, and I was gonna go back to it after the mid season aired so it’d be easy to catch up. I saw Madison died and I still haven’t watched an episode of the show since then

[@yuuni9134]

@@MrGreaves Same with me... I tried to watch 4B but didn't enjoy it, i tried to like the new characters but... Show felt empty for me with most of the core cast gone.

[@noneed4me2n7]

Same I was still semi on board till Madison’s death. Just like I stopped watching the main show after they killed off Carl. Really bad as he was integral to the whispers arc.

[@MrGreaves]

noneed4me2 yeah agreed. Though TWD really fixed the Carl issue, it was still a huge wtf

[@jposensei]

I agree with everything you said. The season with Morgan and friends helping everyone was terrible. The new showrunners ruined it. Pushing Alicia to the side was a mistake. They killed John. Every other character sucks now. Strand is bad now? Really?

[@xymos7807]

Seriously...Strand should have died in season 3. Such an insufferable man.

[@MidNiteR32]

I agree. The showrunners ruined it. I just hope the final season ends really well, maybe it can redeem itself.

[@RebeccaWilliams-q5d]

Bro I wish they never killed Nick, but to make it worse everyone just forgot charlie killed him

[@Klaatu2Too]

And now Strand is gay.

[@Klaatu2Too]

@@PicklefatherNurgle Ya, you're right. I forgot about that.

[@mattbischof45]

They killed off their best characters the moment they got the most interesting. Travis becoming crazy after the death of his son was amazing and then dead 2 episodes later. Nick I understand because the actor wanted out of his contract so that he could pursue movies but Madison didn't want out of her contract and they still killed her for no reason whatsoever!

[@jackmarshall3255]

Yeah my favorite character were travis and nick I wish they would not have kill these two off.

[@lunashiva]

Madison was the worst character xD

[@prabhakaranpillai835]

@@lunashiva WTF U MEAN U DUMBASS

[@prabhakaranpillai835]

Madison not dead tbh

[@jackmarshall3255]

@@prabhakaranpillai835 yeah she still alive in walking dead if you don't see the body they are still alive like Glenn he hid under a dumpster and kenny from the telltale game survived somehow but yeah I'm pretty sure she still alive.

[@captaincluster316]

Nick was one of the most interesting characters I've seen in a show. Extremely flawed but very likeable. He held the whole thing together.

[@bojaboom1407]

Flawed how?

[@LowResCatExplosion]

@@bojaboom1407 meth

[@HufflepuffDaddy]

@@LowResCatExplosion nah, Nick was addicted to Heroin

[@famousgigachadgeorgewashin659]

Breaking bad is superior to everything walking dead and it’s only 5 seasons.

[@imsomewhatcertain1024]

I wish we had more of FTWD’s Tobias, he knew about the outbreak and the possibility of society collapsing long before everyone else knew about it. He seemed like the kind of guy that would’ve had a conspiracy board in his bedroom.

[@ciarajones4970]

That and I'd like them to bring back Walker. He just left with crazy dog after the dam and that was that.

[@krystalRosex0x]

@@ciarajones4970 They were such good assets to the show too! Like what happened to them?!

[@anthonyt1t5]

​@@krystalRosex0x they left to find the rest of their tribe or people which I understand but the Clark group or Morgan group could have been their family. I like in the walking dead universe, even strangers can be your family. Or blood or race don't matter.

[@annre1342]

And I miss Travis. I loved this character. There was a lot of potential developing his character, much better than bringing over Morgan.

[@PricefieldPunk]

They shouldn't have killed Travis in such a random way

[@Tengokuchi]

His actor wanted out of the show, but it could have been handled much better.

[@benwolverton4421]

C&M Punk for real

[@BlazingOwnager]

Nah, that was GREAT. A true "anybody can get ganked at any moment" death. Way way way better than the pointless Nick death or confusing, pointless Madison death.

[@michaelrenkes4463]

The actors who played Travis and Nick both requested off the show. Cliff Curtis (Travis) is part of the Avatar franchise and wanted to be free to do its sequels. Frank Dillane lives in Europe and it sounds like he may have had some off-camera demons.

[@calendarfactory8566]

Nah man they did him a Favor, he got an Offer for Avatar to shoot 3 movies. Don't get me wrong it sucks but I'm glad he got such a great opportunity

[@gpan62]

They panicked and thought Morgan could save the show. Morgan's exit from The Walking Dead was ridiculous. He'd just helped defeat the Saviors and he wants to leave?

[@LeeEverett1]

Why would they panic though? Season 3 of Fear was absolute gold, it was actually way better than the whole savior arc.

[@tommyg9719]

Lee Everett seasons 1-3 of Fear were miles better than 7-8 of TWD

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

What was even more ridiclous is that Morgan just so happened to run into Fear's characters when he could have ended up anywhere in the US, i mean it's a bit of a coincidence, and then to have Dwight appear in the same location as well is absurd.

[@ryans413]

Yep season 2-3 I could see the show starting too take off I don’t know if they got new writers for season 4 but it was like it fell off the side of a cliff

[@LeeEverett1]

@@ryans413 Season 4 was when Scott Gimple took over the show, the same guy that ruined the Saviors arc for seasons 7-8

[@MillsyRT]

Maddison falling into madness and becoming a villain would've been one of the best story lines over both shows damn really wish we'd seen that

[@caydenwhite2576]

Honestly we still can see this with her return.

[@tree7136]

like season 5 rick!! tbh, at this point, don't bring her back to that awful show, it doesn't deserve her.

[@Sparta_cus91]

back then fan theories where saying she is gonna turn into alpha

[@NiqRipple]

@@Sparta_cus91 The show would’ve been great if it taken that route. Seeing the group slowly turn into villains as they try to survive. Eventually making their way to Rick’s group. Madison as Alpha Strand as Beta Nick as Gamma Alicia as Delta And so on Have a grand final season with mixed perspectives. It’d be hard picking who to root for.

[@skylarmercykilled1986]

I mean that was the original plan until they changed showrunners in season 4

[@frenchtoast9926]

The true main character was Nick and I guess the writers failed to see that it was nice to see a Morgan and Dwight but honestly after Nick died the show went WAY down hill

[@ronaldgomez6750]

Nick is one of the best survivors in the series, he's my fav character, so sad he died

[@dummykhoto1418]

I agree , nick is the rick grimes of the show and they failed to see it 👍

[@andypaul1356]

I stopped watching after Nick died

[@wzafflee6210]

nicks actor wanted him to die so he could focus on other projects

[@assassindancer914]

No, it ended when Madison "died". Replaced with just a side character from TWD, Morgan is cool but only as a side badass. Madison was a unique protagonist with a troubled past, forming her as a protective mama bear. At least Alicia is still around, but it barely feels like her story anymore.

[@Bowblax2]

Fear died so that the original series could live. Gimple ruins everything he touches. they should have just given him a brand new twd series that he could make from the ground up so his shit doesn't spread to already established shows

[@mirahkasadi6988]

Well about that do you see world beyond

[@Narc0YT]

@@mirahkasadi6988 Its amazing how bad he ruined such a good concept...

[@TheNickSweat]

It's so weird to see you here man. It's even weirder that both sentences you wrote are exactly what I say to people about FEAR.

[@Trazynn]

His spin off series would fail and he'd demand the successful series for himself.

[@InvaderZed]

But. That's the same time they fucked up TWD seasons and the boring ass whisper arc

[@_Devil]

I just want a zombie show that shows the technical and logistical aspects of how the world collapsed for once. L4D and TWD are my two favorite zombie medias of all time so I'd crave anything from those universes that explains why the military fell so quickly (In TWD its because theyre dumb but in L4D the military/government is in the active process of falling, since they abandoned every state east of the Mississippi River because of the powerful zombies, however I'd still like for Valve to make a movie, tv-show, or another game that shows the events of the downfall as it happened, rather than just showing the aftermath like TWD)

[@jacobwells9792]

In Fear they kind of touch on it. Troops are dieing in parts of the country they aren't from or nescisarrily care about. They want to help their families and they are stationed away from them. Why work for pay if pay might not matter? There is a shortage of manpower when essentially trying to police an entire country so the gaps in logists leads to a higher casualty rate. All our high tech equipment means nothing without a vast logistcal network ( the U.S Homeland). I'd have quite fighting too in the situations depicted. Family first. Pay second. Flag is third.

[@praisethesun.praisedeussol6051]

@@jacobwells9792 how many people in America have guns ? like I'd get such an outbreak in Europe ore Asia but in America no way

[@nathannewman6555]

The problem is that the more you know, the less it makes sense. Any zombies powerful enough to take out the military, would be too powerful for civilians to handle.

[@Nyghtking]

I would suggest reading the book World War Z, they touch on a little bit about how the US went to shit by stating that at first everyone was in denial about the zombies and the government was covering it up to prevent people freaking out, plus they had just come out of a war they lost ad people didn't have much faith in the government, the military really falls apart after a battle called Yonkers, the news about zombies is out and troops are mobilized to a town called Yonkers to fight the zombies using all the latest gear available, and it becomes a shitshow with the commanders putting people directly in the path of zombies, having them wear bulky armor, and having them equipped with a headset that let them get a bird's eye view of the situation and see what other soldiers are seeing, which goes to hell when they wast ammo to do vary little to the zombies and get to see the million+ hoard coming at them, plus getting to see first hand as a guy gets eaten alive by a zombie that was in a house they didn't clear behind their lines

[@mvtv-montanavigilantetv5976]

Yes. Those are always some of the more interesting scenes for these movies but goes fast.

[@otleyltd6544]

They basically neutered all the characters. Maddison was no longer tough. Nick was no longer savvy. Strand was no longer sly. Alicia was no longer smart. They all basically had the same personality, same goals, same wet blankets. The writers just don't know how to write interesting characters

[@Mimoo7]

thats the problem i had throughout the entire thing. everything felt so bland and i never got hooked into watching the show. i never cared about the characters or their story

[@comdrive3865]

This is way more apparent if you re like me, drop american Tv and watch animes like HunterxHunter where the whole thing is flawless here compared to any season of TWD

[@kummakummakummakummakummac8606]

@@comdrive3865 - Is it on Netflix?

[@kummakummakummakummakummac8606]

@@comdrive3865 - I found it.

[@kummakummakummakummakummac8606]

@@Mimoo7 - I didn't immediately love the show, I thought it was okay, but it was good enough to keep watching. The more I watched the more I liked it. I thought the characters were ok but the story felt kind of bland.But once they killed off most of the original characters I lost all interest and didn't care at all.

[@olivermarcos6205]

Watching season 5 was like watching Tara's episode but this time for a entire season

[@jdjdjcjdjx3107]

That's correct

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

haha brilliant!

[@GabesEdtiz]

Oliver Marcos I mean at least Tara’s episode was better then Season 5

[@jlm5078]

hahahahaha

[@bradcarver8127]

I “Swear” I lost brain cells watching FTWD 4b and the first two episodes of 5

[@Carinth6]

I would have preferred that they didn't kill Nick and just had left him in limbo after the season finale where he was swept away in the waters. They could have implied he drowned and left an opening for him to have somehow survived, for a later storyline. Instead they had him survive the finale, just to be killed in a more permanent fashion that had no way of ever creating a scenario that he may have come back from. Madison though, they have left it open that she could possible return as you never actually see her die. Either way though, the death of those two characters were like nails in the coffin. The show lost direction and the writing just went downhill.

[@88K-d6h]

That's their biggest problem always killing off characters like the actor might come back. Also giving the character deaths that make no sense. Jesus was probably the best death after an actor asked to be killed off.

[@LeeEverett1]

It's all Scott Gimple's fault. He came in at season 4 because he was forced off TWD for running that show to the ground, and he immediately tried turning season 4 of Fear into season 8 of TWD. The moment I heard him becoming new show runner I knew the show was set for failure.

[@Lalvon_Zelpharr]

Scott gimple is not a very good writer, frankly I was disappointed with the show from the beginning

[@kummakummakummakummakummac8606]

Lee Everett - As soon as he came over the show sucked. I really liked it before.

[@calibmatlock]

@@Lalvon_Zelpharr what's disappointing is that Scott Gimple is an extremely talented writer. He wrote iconic episodes like Clear and The Grove, which showed it very clearly. That's what made his ruination of Fear so much more disheartening. S4 was on pace to outclass TWD and he absolutely squandered it when he had the potential to make it incredible.

[@alkavonstra5479]

Honestly, Gimple was heavily carried through s4 and 5 of TWD. He had the comics to go off of, so foundation was set. He had former seasons that already setup beautifully crafted characters with exponentially increasing chemistry and flow. He had some of the best plot lines to cover (i.e. Terminus, Alexandria safe-zone, the end of Governor) which truthfully could be done blindly and still work out perfectly fine. What happened in s6-8 was he actually began to take hold of the series and control more aspects of each plotline as it progressed. In other shows, he may have shown great potential as a skilled writer, but after 5 seasons collectively (FTWD S4-5 + TWD S6-8), he just isn't that good. It has been literally written in front of our eyes that he either has no intentions of making this show great, or he's just...bad. There is no way the past 5 years went down the way they did if not for those two possibilities.

[@meatsweatmundungus6415]

I can't believe he got another job after the terrible season 8, sad I loved the first 2 seasons of fear

[@dimitrescu182]

They should have never done a timejump. If they want to crossover someone, it should have been Abraham and Eugene

[@BlazingOwnager]

A time jump COULD have worked, if the Clarks were separated for years and trying to stay ahead of the Proctors takeover of the West. But this was less a time jump and more a soft reboot.

[@dimitrescu182]

@@BlazingOwnager that's what I was expecting before I watched season 4, I was also expecting to see Morgan interact with Madison and the others, be some sort of adviser to the group. But instead they had him takeover the show turning it into "Morgan and Friends".

[@markb742]

Having Abraham, Eugene, and maybe that girlfriend of Abraham's (She always wore that camo hat but I can't remember her name) would have made more sense. They were originally from Texas, which would have been a close proximity to where the Fear characters eventually ended up. They wouldn't even have to timejump. The idea of Morgan walking across half the country from Alexandria is just too much to be believed. Morgan was the WORST of the Walking Dead characters to crossover. He never seemed to know what he wanted to do, and the other characters just followed around behind him like little ducklings.

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

agreed 100%

[@daoyang223]

@@dimitrescu182 i liked Morgan cause him and Rick were like the yin and yang but best buddies with complications. They're complete opposite in some ways also really similar. I wanted more of that but then Morgan left again and now he has his own show in FTWD

[@DastardlyTea]

Season 3 was a master piece, best season of both shows, how it shows a multi dimensional conflict in which no side is totally irrational and every important character feels layered with their own philosophies. Along with the pacing of the season it felt long but 90% of screen time moved the story along compared to the typical 50% in most twd seasons

[@caydenwhite2576]

easily the best of each show. The dam scene at the end of fear was incredible. Troys character was insane but a fan favorite. Season 3 made nick one of the best characters of each show.

[@notcosby5650]

I hate how they decided to kill literally everyone from season 1 for no reason. There was no reason to kill travis, nick, and that one guy who used to be an asshole and died at the dam

[@twd1071]

Travis left to film Avatar, Nick left because he wasn't happy with the change of people in control of the show and he wanted to explore other things as well

[@Memnoch_the_Devil]

Not Cosby actually I see why they had to kill Troy. Same reason Merle had to die. They might have been somewhat likable characters, but they were also racists who had done horrible things not so much in the name of need or survival but for selfish reasons. That being said I really enjoyed both characters. Thought they had great interactions with the rest of the cast

[@danshehorn9813]

I disagree. Those characters were horrible. I found myself actually rooting for the zombies. The show got much better in the later seasons.

[@willvaldez2801]

I'm guessing that they were trying a Game of Thrones approach where they just kill off everyone?

[@lickredup]

I'm glad chris died. Total waste of a character. His was offscreen, told secondhand, proof of how worthless he was. The worst though, was it should have transformed travis into a major badass. Instead, he's gone a few episodes later, a true loss of great potential.

[@Trazynn]

I just pretend there's only 3 seasons of this show. Erickson is a genius.

[@hahahabut3197]

Lol this is my exact thinking

[@matthewvillarreal2504]

Literally my exact mindset

[@videlin2003]

right on

[@qqxyz6550]

Same. Just like community show and borderlands game.

[@Ginger-Sage]

Its sad cause it just got good again but its not about the clark family so what is the point

[@aidenhall8593]

“they just go from place to place helping people” morgan: *I have a settlement that needs your help*

[@sabribeser2268]

Morgan Garvey commonwealth minuteman at your services.

[@kgspvgsp7569]

Side quest

[@Gabriel-ki7uj]

​@@sabribeser2268he even dresses like him

[@mrmiz4372]

At its heart, the problem was that they transitioned the show from being about the Clark family to Morgan. Killing Nick was horrific and then offing Madison was unforgivable.....

[@Logan912]

I never liked Madison, and she reminds me of Comic Rick in the worst ways, but her death could've been done so much better.

[@sGSdYgsdGA8fSWrRb2uzpMzzt2ys90]

@@Logan912 Madison was supposed to be a villain

[@assassindancer914]

@@sGSdYgsdGA8fSWrRb2uzpMzzt2ys90 Would have been amazing and the ultimate villain/anti-hero tbh.

[@88K-d6h]

@@assassindancer914 she grew on me after season 3. She was ruthless and I loved her relationship with Strand

[@jeff6589]

The actor wanted to go home like a bitch so they had no choice smart guy

[@GarryWilliams555]

I adore the first 3 seasons. I genuinely would take them over the main show. I just can't believe how hard it fell in season 4. I've never seen a show drop quality that fast and to that extent. Love your videos man.

[@angreydoggo4357]

Season 2B and all of three are pretty much perfect.

[@JS-jg7iv]

Garry Williams I felt like 4A was still good even though it betrayed the first three seasons. 4B on has been such a disappointment and season 5 might be the worst season of any show I’ve watched on tv

[@aronmao94]

@@JS-jg7iv I still can´t decide wich one is worse, if that one or TWD Season 8

[@JS-jg7iv]

AJ 2000 at least season 8 of twd had some good action set pieces and a nice season finale. And season 8 did have emotional moments like *spoilers* Carl dying

[@GarryWilliams555]

@@JS-jg7iv I thought 8b was mostly decent other than the finale. I even like season 7 when it's binged.

[@ThrottleKitty]

Season 3: Hey this show is actually finally finding its voice Season 4: Ha no

[@geoffreyhhill]

Can Season 6 sink any lower? Yes, dont underestimate the genius of the Gimp

[@eddiethealbatross5734]

Gimp the Simp

[@TGTDestiny]

Dont forget to give Goldberg and the other dude (Chambliss?) plenty of blame, their their ones writing the overall story for each season.

[@eddiethealbatross5734]

@@TGTDestiny Gimple chose them

[@TGTDestiny]

@@eddiethealbatross5734 Yeah he deserves the most blame but just dont forget to give it to the showrunners as well

[@geoffreyhhill]

Gimp has gotten most of the attention. But credit for this brilliant masterpiece should also be given to the other guys whose names I can't remember. I guess I could look what y'all said their names were but I've already invested 30 seconds typing this and I'll never get that time back. Whoever they are they deserve an Emmy

[@amcthewalkingdeadone2208]

If the writers and amc really wanted to do a crossover, why didn’t they crossover Abraham, Eugene, and Rosita. They could’ve kept the timeline more close to the end of season 3 and the Fear group would meet Abraham and gang as they’re on there way to DC (before they met Glenn) and this would have been way more better for the show, and we’d learn more about Abraham, Eugene, and Rosita a little bit more. This would also make sense to use these characters, because they came from Texas and that area. This would’ve made a lot more sense and later on if this crossover didn’t pay off then they would have the shows split apart again, as obviously they’d have to get rid of them to match the timeline to season 4 of TWD. But if it did payoff, then at the right moment, then do another appropriate crossover at an appropriate and better time. Btw I like the video and content, keep it up, stay safe.

[@oxleygames5571]

amcthewalkingdeadone that’s exactly what I thought they would do! Follow on from the Dam and Have Abraham, Eugene and Rosita on Fear for a season and then have them leave at the end of season 4 and then continue on with fears story for season 5,6 etc. Not all the save people bullshit! The two show runners can fuck off honestly! TWD wasn’t this bad during 7 and 8 and thanks to Angela seasons 9 and 10 have been great! Fuck Gimple and the other two!

[@tevcon317]

The funny thing is that Daniel and Abraham could know each other

[@tatersalad76]

Michael Cudlitz would've been freed up from his recent death on twd too. He would've been a great addition to the group. Straight up would've made accomplished killers out of everyone in the group lol

[@oxleygames5571]

Potato King he would have been open to do it aswell cus he directs on the main show now and he’s really passionate about this show and so he would probably want to do it! But hey ho! A missed opportunity by AMC! 👍🏻

[@haydeng3316]

I remember a lot of people thought there was gonna be a crossover with Abraham before they announced that it was Morgan. If only lol. I still don't think the crossover would have been neccessary, but that would have been better. If they had done a crossover such as that in the past, it would have been temporary rather than a reboot. Not to mention Abraham is a much better character than Morgan. Hell Eugene and even Rosita are better at this point lol

[@Jon0387]

They should have just made Fear a 5-7 season show about Madison and family. Morgan should have just been given a separate Walking Dead spin-off.

[@maureenl1448]

Season 3 was amazing. I was so mad when they killed Troy. He was the best character on the entire show. And then season 4 sucked, I hated how they skipped ahead.

[@LeeEverett1]

Man they hit a goldmine in season 3, the show was really becoming something to the point it had way better storytelling the the Saviors arc. Then Gimple came it and destroyed the show.

[@maureenl1448]

@@LeeEverett1 Gimple is the worst! TWD has been much better without him

[@wenders4908]

Lee Everett duuuuude season 3 was SOOO GOOD i was waiting for season 4 for SO long just to be disappointed

[@boydcrowder5034]

Dave Erickson: season three of FTWD was amazing. The show is finally getting its footing, and, it is on its way to bigger and better things. Scott Gimple: Hold my beer.

[@FUNNYMANERICWHITE]

😆

[@boydcrowder5034]

@Zealed true, but, Gimple is chief content officer of both shows. He pretty much accepted everything the new showrunners wanted to do. That,imo, makes him responsible, as well.

[@boydcrowder5034]

@Zealed they sure did. They brutally butchered Fear. I'm really surprised that all their ideas got the green light.

[@LeeEverett1]

@Zealed Gimple became showrunner for TWD in season 5 and showrunner for FTWD in season 4, both in which the shows started going downhill. That ain't no coincidence

[@CrazyWerewolf444]

@Zealed Did you remember their comment on when fans expressed their distaste of Season 5 and they responded that as far as they were concerned they did no wrong and season 5 was perfect? I need to find that article. Almost every media covered that article.

[@hhoges9895]

See I actually really enjoyed the slow burn of season one because every moment I was wondering when the walkers would make themselves known on a wide scale. And I found some of the moments in season 1 - the school and then the attack by the walker neighbours nail biting. And the scene with the “sick” boyfriend and his parents house with the car left in the driveway stuck with me. Because you don’t know what happened to the parents but you have a pretty good idea.

[@andrewbarisch]

They should've been the whisperers. It was kinda teased with nick always hanging out with walkers

[@Marcell2aG]

That would've been amazing.

[@guardianforce3460]

I legit thought that was where they were going. Would have been an amazing perspective to see

[@seditt5146]

If they had made him the start of the whisperers it could have became one of the most satisfying moments in TV, instead the show just blows. Picture a world in which his discoveries of covering himself in guts became the beginnings of them and his past junkie dog eat dog mentality became the basis of their philosophy. Instead.... we got Morgan who I promise I would have used as Zombie food very early into the apocalypse.

[@godaimer999]

Bro ur so fckin right damn. Nick was planned to kick whisperers ass, he was covered in walker’s blood so many times before. Maybe thats why the nick’s actor quit the show, maybe hes dissapointed with the way that story turns because of gimple. Ftwd and twd could be the best tv show ever if that happens damn

[@h3ard878]

Nick would have been amazing

[@johndough8699]

The biggest missed opportunity? Fast forwarding through the early outbreak. THAT was the MAIN reason I was excited about this spinoff. Also: - Killing Travis was a huge mistake - I hated Madison. I’m sorry I dropped out before getting to see her die. - I dropped out before Nick died, but I think that was a big mistake. - I had ZERO interest in having Morgan join the show. His character had turned into absolute garbage well before he left TWD.

[@tylermunday2146]

Totally agree, we should have gotten way more of the beginning of the apocalypse, trapped in the city as everyone around them turns. The show never should have tried to catch up to the main twd in time period, i didnt want to see these characters 10 years into the apocalypse, i just wanted to see a family struggling to survive in a world just starting to fall apart.

[@randeli7785]

@@tylermunday2146 The show made it look like that after one riot (which had nothing to do with the zombies), Los Angeles just collapsed immediately after two episodes. And instead of focusing on this new fear of zombies rising from the dead, they immediately jump to human threats like attacking the military, and the group starts to act selfish and screws over anyone around them. At least Ricks group took like two seasons to get to that mentality from hopeful refugees to killer nihilistic survivors, and his perspective didn't even start at the beginning of the apocalypse.

[@jay2thaudy]

Exactly we should spent more time in that world.

[@JC_Cali]

Definitely agree to the biggest missed opportunity.

[@ghostleemann955]

a random fucking kid shoots and kills the main character, it's so dumb

[@tldhaley]

I thought Troy’s character was pretty interesting. You know, the human experiment thing he was doing and how he gathered so much insight about the virus and how it behaves by murdering people. I gotta say those scenes were not even half as eerie and disturbing as similar scenes of terror and gore in TWD but it brought us viewers some curious details like BMI linking to time of revival, the force field of dead acting as a repellent. I wanna see them explore that aspect more as well as finally seeing how the outbreak started. (Hint, alien spores)

[@bradcarver8127]

Season 6 opening Morgan: These walkers live in horrible conditions, many of them are walking around in tattered rags no protection from the harsh elements. Even worse many are literally falling apart. For just the price of a cup of coffee you can sponsor one of these poor unfortunate souls. I’m Morgan Jones and the best way to “clear” your conscience is by sponsoring a walker today. You know you’re supposed to, because everything gets a return.

[@dalegend7215]

I stopped watching after the mid-season of Season 4,i lost interest,because,it turned into a Morgan spin off,it should've stayed a show focused on the Clarks,also Nick and Madison dying didn't help to keep my interest.

[@markblemler5410]

This is a perfect statement; it did turn into The Morgan Show. And I detest Morgan.

[@SIKE01]

the series was about a dysfunctional family surviving in the zombie apocalypse.

[@J0Nramirez]

The actor for Nick wanted to leave. His choice. Not the show runners.

[@ivanmari5690]

Jonathan Ramirez he left because they destroyed the show

[@Frozennova18]

I remember seeing something when FTWD was coming out that it would be focusing on the downfall of society, not on the actual end of society like TWD. I think they moved too fast, and just like everyone else I don't think Morgan should have been put into FTWD. I really enjoyed Seasons 1-3.

[@devriestown]

Yeah, definitely. They should have shown a few more people's stories who died but on their survival in the collapse/fall

[@Mr_Sir_2000]

I really with they got rid of scott gimple before season 7 , I can only imagine how great the Negan arc would've been. Carl wold still be alive and who knows, maybe Andrew Lincoln would still be in the show. Also fear probably would still be pretty decent without that stupid clown gimple

[@LeeEverett1]

Dude I know, Gimple has failed miserably as showrunner. He destroyed two great shows.

[@TheKaijudist]

Gimple wrote some of the best episodes of the series. A shame his tenure as showrunner didn't go as planned.

[@LeeEverett1]

@@TheKaijudist He wrote 3 episodes back in season 2, which was a time when both the writers and the showrunner were on the same page for the show's direction. Season 4, which is exactly when people slowly started losing interest, was when Gimple took over. Then when he left for Season 9, the show was good again. With FTWD the show was solid for seasons 1-3, then when he took over for seasons 4 and 5, it bombed. It's definitely not a coincidence.

[@killercacturne7000]

I think Andrew Lincoln would've stayed if they didn't kill Carl. Them killing Carl pissed of so many of the legacy actors that Andrew Lincoln left, Norman Reedus and Lauren Cohan both tried to get new shows

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

Same, i'd love to have seen Angela Kang deal with the Negan arc, it would have been so much better.

[@BadLuckLuke]

"FTWD is dead and like one of its walkers, it's now wandering around aimlessly and needs to be put out of its misery..." When you're right... you're right !!!!!!

[@jasonadersonwedion9874]

The biggest mistake was not focusing on the early days of the outbreak

[@PantoniStrikesBack]

I remember enjoying the first season just for that. And then the 2nd one came out and it was already like TWD... but worse. A pity.

[@zestyh3861]

Pitch Meeting: We're gonna make a show that goes into detail about the early stages of the outbreak, which everyone wants to see. Then barely spend any time on the initial stages and make family friendly TWD (Season 5)

[@bradcarver8127]

Producer: Can we bring TWD characters over and ruin both them and the show? Writer: sure it’ll be super easy barely an inconvenience

[@koofoo7793]

wow wow wow wow...wow

[@JowoHD]

exactly, i was so hoping for more time in la and then they just ran away to mexico

[@burtfurt1995]

Uh oh... whoopsie

[@NerdX151]

Skipping things people want to see is TIGHT!

[@MattS-cr8yp]

I think they should have offered Frank Dillane (Nick) the opportunity to appear in the movie with Rick. Also Madison should have never died.

[@tommyg9719]

Matt S I don’t know about that one, Nick is pretty dead unfortunately. I would love a Fear movie with Nick, Madison and the gang after the dam explosion

[@MattS-cr8yp]

TommyG97 1 No I mean they should have made him leave the show and go to the movies, I would have written it to be that he just didn’t come back in season 4 and the Clark family just didn’t know what happened to him.

[@tommyg9719]

Matt S ohhh my bad I mis read that. I would’ve loved having Nick in the Rick movies. I always theorized how their meeting would be

[@jlm5078]

Madison's death was the last nail in the coffin for this show

[@dragonsgreedgaming13]

Your synopsis of the new characters added in season 4 was hilarious, and quite spot on with charlie. The fact that anyone thought killing off Nick and trying to make Charlie likeable/redeemable was actually going to work still boggles my mind. And yes, John Dorey was too good for the show.

[@joeyplays6020]

Morgan should've had his own spin-off series with John Dorie, June, and Althea (and every other character that followed up after, so Jim, Sarah, Wendell, Clayton, Logan). FTWD should've continued on focusing on the Clark family + Daniel, Strand, Luciana, and Taqa. Nick should've been the one leading the horde inside the baseball stadium since he had to die (the actor wanted to leave the show). Madison should've gone on to lead the group and grow as a strong leader. Dwight could've been introduced in FTWD or the Morgan spin-off since it makes sense for him to go wherever. He could even appear on both because he will follow his wife throughout the entire country. This show totally ruined its potential by killing off Madison and Nick. Their deaths didn't even seem to have a huge impact on the other characters and it's downright stupid.

[@AtariDad]

Nick's death was kind of unavoidable, his actor was ready to move on to other things. And they're undoing Madison's "death" so...

[@cdt549]

fuck madison... though she can die but nick nah they failed it and yeah also agree about them not carring to much and it was too fast

[@krystalRosex0x]

Right like where did Taqa even go?! He & his tribe were a great addition to the show, & then they just vanished! 😒

[@PuddleofOJ]

I remember reading somewhere that Nick wanted to leave once he found out that Dave Erickson was leaving.

[@kevinmiranda1769]

Nick died because the actor wanted his character killed off so he can leave the show. It sucks that such a good character had to go.

[@greengarnish1711]

Can't blame him, dude probably saw the script for season 4 and dipped out knowing it was getting worse and worse.

[@Alex-ox1fq]

Yup

[@MothMizzle]

I watched a few episodes with my brother. All I could think was "this woman (the mother) single-handedly causes every problem the group faces." She's an Apocalypse-Karen!

[@TITANICLUSITANIA]

She’s a psychopath. It was revealed during season 3

[@Godloveszaza]

​@@TITANICLUSITANIAI cannot remember any problems she started in the first few episodes ngl.

[@TITANICLUSITANIA]

@@Godloveszaza It is told through a story in season 3. She killed her own father to save her mother, and she slowly stopped having intense feelings of empathy. She even gets called a “killer mom” by the Proctors at the end of season 3.

[@kk-ei5zz]

Season 2 and 3 are amazing. Why couldn't we follow the badass group lead by Madison...

[@boydcrowder5034]

It is so sad to see a once fantastic show get turned into crap. I loved Fear (season 1-3) for what is was. After that, it is no longer the same show. The way I look at it is, season three of FTWD ended on an amazing series ending cliffhanger. Thank you for another awesome video. I appreciate all the hard work that you do for us 😎😎😎😎😎👍👍👍👍👍

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

Agree with everything you've said, and no problem, thank you for watching!

[@lapplandkun9273]

my headcanon is season 4 of other countries attempting to control the outbreak and at CDC dr edwin jenner and the other doctors are studying wildfire

[@matthewcooke4011]

Everything you've said here is spot on. The show nearly lost me at the start as I was hoping to learn more about the outbreak and fall of civilisation. It would've been interesting if the main characters had been a soldier and a doctor for example, giving us some insight into how everything unfolded. Instead, after 2-3 episodes of increasing zombie incidents and confusion, it pretty much just flashed forward to the same world that Rick wakes up to. However, I stuck it out and I agree that Season 3 was fantastic. However, I only got about 4-5 episodes into Season 4 and never went back.

[@SaraKhan-xj5oy]

You nailed it. Every single thought I had you said. Gimple is a murderer.

[@colderratic5681]

34 minute long Predatoure videos are the only thing keeping me sane in quarantine

[@AlejoConejo-vb8ln]

I agree... Although... I find the lack of Scotty G disturbing...

[@colderratic5681]

AlejoConejo2209 I heard that Josh and Scott aren’t on speaking terms after Josh found Scott farting into his cereal... Here’s hoping Scott finds it in his heart to forgive Josh and continue being in his video!

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

@@AlejoConejo-vb8ln haha don't worry, i plan on the next video being something more stupid/lighthearted so Scotty G will make an appearance

[@LeeEverett1]

KZbin as a whole is what keeps me sane during these times. At this rate I'm running out of content to watch tbh

[@TheAwesomeAlan]

Imagine if the fall of civilization was stretched to the first two seasons, and season 1 focused on several different groups across different regions, all handling the initial outbreak, with the show slowly showing us how ALL of their paths cross by seasons 4-5. We could've seen the fall in many different perspectives, something fans have been craving since The Walking Dead first aired, along with potentially a military and government perspective showing us how they fell.

[@MikeisMAV]

The show ended after the explosion, I stand by this and its canon.

[@applejuice6459]

Morgan

[@romeoalvarado6226]

not anymore i believe

[@theweedman780]

@Cameron Hawthorn yes*

[@MikeisMAV]

A year out from this comment and I still stand by my beliefs. I don't have faith in Madisons return being handled in a way that she deserves, so unfortunately I'm still actively choosing to the believe the show unfortunately got cancelled ahead of its time and ended at Season 3. Damn shame.

[@colinrea9576]

@@MikeisMAV wait what are the chances i see this video and comment 10 hours after you reply to yourself 1 year later...dunno if that makes sense but thats crazy

[@Matthew-vs5yh]

The way I took the marketing and what made me excited for the show was seeing the decline of society at the beginning of the outbreak. When in season 2, they practically abandoned that idea: it was so disappointing. Those episodes with the soldiers in season 1 were amazing because I wanted to know why and how the military/government collapsed. I wanted to see how people rationalised and dealt with the outbreak before it completely destroyed society. Instead it just was one disappointment to the next. I stuck around only for John but gave up with this current season and didn't bother because it just adopted all the tropes and boring storylines of the main series. It took what made it unique: this is the beginning of the outbreak and threw it out the window.

[@veronicak2759]

yaaaassssss exactly

[@adinal1958]

Agreed! That premise was the main reason I was interested in watching it.

[@Nomad_SwitchTa2]

4 season survivor and walker here...got to see alot of BTS and reasons why the story played out the way it did. All in all the horror of the show didn't compare to what we had to go through in real life to make it happen. So many fell to heat exhaustion for little pay being treated like sub humans even though we had been there for years even outlasted alot of crew. That said it was a hard show to make. Props to my Fear Family that lasted as long as they did.

[@zenweeb8506]

Scott Gimple is a scourge on TWD universe. I’ll never forgive them for killing Maddison in such a disappointing and stupid way.

[@hahahabut3197]

Yeah Angela Kang is SO much better for TWD

[@jackmarshall3255]

Well is she dead we did not see a body.

[@andrewhezekiahdaniel]

Madison was by the far the best character. They spent three seasons building up her character, and the third season was brilliant - easily the best in the series. Then they basically killed her off screen and the show took a huge change in tone. The family the show was based on are all dead apart from Alicia, and they introduced a bunch of boring main characters and villains. Madison and Troy made season three, and they just got rid of them so they could make TWD-lite.

[@mrbaitandwatch2259]

Hate to say it, but they did not kill Madison Clark. She is returning in season 8, I hear.

[@andrewhezekiahdaniel]

@@mrbaitandwatch2259 OK but that's pretty lame - keep her out for four seasons then bring her back to a totally different show.

[@Man0War_Loki]

Madison best character.. you doing too many lines off a hookers flat ass my dude

[@turemorrow8545]

Nick was like The Joker of FTWD. Completely unpredictable but sensible as well.

[@davidbrakefield2362]

When Morgan Jones crossed over the show plummeted. You cant have a passive person as leader during end of the world.

[@VoidfulSwag]

That's debatable because Morgan isn't a passive person, he just chooses to be so he doesn't go into that clear phase again, if he needs to he will kill, it's why I really like Morgan and wish he could go back with Dwight and sherry to the og twd show bc gimple fucking ruined ftwd and Morgan Dwight and sherry does not deserve to be on this shitty show.

[@AlexJones-ue1ll]

FTWD lost me with one line: "9 days later" when Chris mused about the time spend in Quarantine. The only thing I really wanted to see a show tackling a believable take on how society would collapse in an outbreak slow zombies, but we aren't shown that. Probably because the writers had now clue how to make that a believable story to tell - so they just skipped it. After they skipped in what I was interested in the first place, I stopped caring.

[@JamesBurrTV]

Same here. I carried on watching for a few episodes after that but then once society had fallen it was essentially TWD with inferior characters, so why would I want to watch that? Made it halfway through the second season. Was a real missed opportunity.

[@angelphoenix7784]

I agree. They should have never done a time jump in the first season. It was suppose to show a slow burn, not just get into it. that's what got me to watch it in the first place. Then I stopped watching, after Alex's last appearance.

[@timlarsen1597]

Exactly. FTWD became just another version of TWD, with fresher zombies. I really wanted to see the 'nuts and bolts' explanation of how a fully technological and sophisticated world technology of the 21st century could be taken down and collapse in the 30 or so days Rick was in a coma. Instead we got 'just because...' broad-brushstrokes. Guy looks out the window of a plane at night. L.A.'s grid goes dark chunk by chunk. There! That's your explanation. Shut up and like it. By the way, if you want to see a 'nuts and bolts' highly detailed description of society disappearing, read 1958's 'Alas, Babylon' about a small pocket in central Florida that survives nuclear war. Author: Pat Frank.

[@AaronClow]

I'm actually surprised how many of us really wanted that slow burn. I wonder if most audiences have the tolerance for that anymore? It would probably take a caliber of writers higher than AMC would want to pay. Maybe HBO or Showtime could pull it off. I really want to see a good group of characters from day one when the very first headline comes out, and then I want it to take a few months or maybe even a year or two as civilization slowly unwinds and no one seems able to control any area for more than a few weeks or months - I want to see what areas of the world really fall first. Would it be rural areas? The suburbs? The cities? Slow burn is where it's at. I really hoped FTWD would be that.

[@chikipichi5280]

Same I really wanted to see at least like 3 seasons dedicated to society's downfall and a cross the country road trip showing its the same everywhere. Eventually resulting in the group going to Alaska and crossing over into Russia by boat or plane and see that the rest of the world is fucked too but there are variants of the zombies.

[@1983metsfan]

This video is spot on the only thing you don't mention is the reason Frank Dillane ( Nick ) was killed was because he asked to be killed off the show BUT if you read through his interviews he says being he's from Europe and he's home sick but he also continues to mention the change of direction in the show so my theory where I agree with you is that he was pissed off with the change of direction and him being the main character with Madison we're getting bumped down to Morgan now being the main character and he took offense to that and asked to be killed off the show . Also the character Madison was killed and in her interviews she says it shocked her when she found out and she thought she would ride the show out till the end. I just did did a FTWD rewatch of the first 3 seasons and finished the finale for sea3 last night and I think all 3 seasons are terrific . They watch so much better binge wise then they did week to week . I agree season 3 was INCREDIBLE . Everything about it and we get these awesome characters like Troy and you didn't even mention Taka and Crazy dog . They were terrific too also proctor and if you remember even after Madison hit Troy twice with the hammer and the water started filling in . Fans were still on the boards hoping he survived somehow . My final point Scott gimple ruined this awesome show

[@stacyhauser4964]

Madison was Rick of FTWD, replacing her with Morgan(who I’ve always found to be boring) was a mistake. The Clark family was the essence of the show plus the original characters. The new characters were not that interesting either, except for John Dorie.

[@julesclarke6140]

Yeah she was an awesome character for the first three seasons, maybe not as wow as Rick but still. And Morgan is so beyond boring, I wish they would just kill him off. I love the new characters though.

[@niyyahh8373]

I think Alicia is more like Rick, and she had great potential to be the female Rick Grimes but of course the show writes are just stupid.

[@aetherian31]

i liked Nick as a main

[@honkeykong4049]

John Dorie? I've heard Gordon Ramsay demand those plenty of times.

[@lukefitton7329]

Morgan was great on the main show. I get why people are pissed about Fear’s main characters dying but their actors wanted to leave it’s not Morgan’s fault. Morgan’s character didn’t really have anywhere else to go on Fear admittedly but I think he’s being unfairly overhated. He used to be fucking awesome.

[@Narc0YT]

I really was disappointed by FTWD, it had everything going for it by not being afraid of showing way more gore but I gave up at the end of season 3...

[@MrFasho123]

Wierd that you gave up when it was still at its best. Most people love the first 3 seasons.

[@Narc0YT]

Yeah I loved the first 3 seasons, but I had a look at 4 and just didn't like it as much tbh

[@oOcitizenOo]

same!

[@The_OneManCrowd]

It was going OK for a while there, then it just fell apart. If I wanted to watch a zombie soap opera, then I'd just watch TWD.

[@trashxraccoon03]

Seeing as the actor of Nick wanted to leave I can understand why they killed him off but the way they did it and the timing were just ridiculous and stupid. Killing Madison in the same Season? Why? What was the idea behind that? I will never understand ... But what I get even less is why push Alicia's characters to the side after doing it? This show was about her family and watching her deal with the loss and being the only one left could have been a really interesting storyline, and the next logical step would have been to push her to be the main character. I would have loved to see her maybe go down a dark path killing charlie and just going into full survivor mode. Morgan could have been incorporated into this so well since he went down a dark path after losing his son. I think what many people don't seem to know is that a big chunk of fear-twd watchers are Alycia Debnam-Carey Fans and making her the main focus of the show could possibly attract even more of her fans to watch the show. I've stopped watching after season 4 but the few chunks i saw of season 5 were horrible and boring. At this point, I'm just praying for the show to get canceled.

[@jand.4737]

Season 7 should have started with in the Bunker, instead of just not showing her until what is apparently supposed to be the mid-season finale. (And her prothesis made out of her own bones is a bit morbid and I would not have expected that from her in any way.)

[@boydcrowder5034]

I think it would be awesome if Virginia's group gets killed off by the Proctors within the first few episodes. Then, it could be revealed that the Proctors have been holding Madison hostage this whole time. Shortly after that, Crazy Dog, Walker, Pickaxe Lady, and Tobias could resurface, and save the day. That, imo, would be a great way to get Fear back on the right track.

[@charliecanson3425]

Which will never happen as long as Gimple is there

[@tommyg9719]

I agree, that would be awesome. But I’m not holding my breath for that

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

please pitch this idea to AMC

[@susanarudy9125]

I'd watch a spinoff show with Crazy Dog and Walker all day long.

[@amon8579]

And then Troy returns and brings Nick back to life! The only way they could save this show

[@sirclownsalot5800]

Not surprising that this happened. Given with what amc did to Frank Darabont, things can only get worse for the world of twd.

[@alannashea6344]

I actually have never watched fear because I had heard so many bad things about the show so a few weeks ago since we’ve been stuck at home I started watching it and I LOVED it! I was sad when they killed Travis off but I could live with it, and I’m just starting season 4 and Nick is dead and I’m beyond pissed! I feel like the show could’ve done without Alicia, but to kill off nick and Madison? What’s wrong with them? ****i couldn’t finish the show, it got so bad! UPDATE! I rewatched it and told myself to finish it no matter what. This show is actually really good and I think it gets a lot of hate for NOT being like TWD but that’s the point! It’s different. I loved Madison and Nick, I loved that Nick was an addict and could fit into the world. I loved the then being in a boat, then a hotel, then a ranch, then eventually an underground bunker then island. They should’ve never killed off Nick, they should’ve never got rid of Madison because that’s when the show fell off. The idea of them helping people while struggling to survive was NOT realistic. But after that season it started picking up again. Once they were at virginas that’s when the show started getting good again because you were on edge wanting them to be free. Alicias character really started to grow on me once they found teddy and the bunker. That following season with the radiation and looking for padre was great! Alicia’s character evolved so much at that point but it should’ve sooner. I’m so glad that brought Madison back, that last season had me on the edge of my seat. And I’m glad they brought Troy back I actually like his character. One character I could not stand was sherry!!! Dwight found her and was always trying to keep her from running. He deserves better. Same with June, the name changes were ridiculous and she was always trying to run away. I did end up liking her way later on, once she killed Virginia lol. I’m so happy I rewatched it and made myself get through the season I hated. Stop comparing it to twd it’s not it’s fear twd and I liked that it was different, and had some similarities.

[@grogulous7465]

s6 and beyond is amazing

[@alannashea6344]

@@grogulous7465 I might have to check it out. Just got stupid bringing Morgan in and killing off Madison and Nick. Lol

[@alannashea6344]

@300Thieves I hated that they killed Madison and Nick off, then brought Morgan that was so confusing

[@alannashea6344]

@300Thieves I hope they do!!! The show needs Madison back!

[@ciarajones4970]

@@alannashea6344 season 6 is actually really good, but season 4 and 5 is absolutely terrible.

[@Skaidrite64]

This show is kinda dead.

[@bobjames6284]

If they'd killed him off in the first episode, I might have watched the show. Just couldn't make myself care about some scumbag junkie.

[@delljr2769]

Nick had too many demons. he was never on 100% at any given time. Always loose, never tight. He had moments where I was like, okay this kid goin manish but scenes later the dial gets turned back the other way.

[@multifantv1245]

Bob James Nick became the best character on the show. I understand but you should give characters more of a chance on a show

[@johnanthony2333]

@@multifantv1245 Nick lasted 39 episodes too many. "Best character on the show," tells just how lame this spin-off was

[@StandWatie1862]

Way to go. Kill all the original characters. The secrets to a successful show

[@Franco1395]

Nick was my favorite too! That one scene when he was cool strolling through the zombies…loved it!

[@wlsmojo]

Morgan used to be great!! Gimple ruined his character m. Gimple coming over to Fear, totally ruined the show too! It was pathetic! All hail Angela Kang. :-)

[@kingoftheworld1018]

Warren Stampe yes all Morgan wants to do is save the world which is not bad but he wants to be a hero at the wrong time

[@dimitrescu182]

Oh how I wish Kang took over as showrunner during the Negan arc and kept Erickson as showrunner for Fear

[@wlsmojo]

President Garrison yes that would have been great!! Every character would have been so much better under her watch

[@wlsmojo]

Dei !! Yeah. Morgan saving the world would be great if they wrote his character well. It’s just endless preaching and soppy dialogue now and almost a ridiculously split personality like In TWD where he let the wolves free and murdered a loyal kingdom member. Wtf?! Lol

[@BlazingOwnager]

Absolutely. Kang's won me over entirely, TWD improved like 2000% as soon as Kang took over. The last two seasons have been great, the best the show's done.. and I was in full hate watching mode during the abysmally handled savior war.

[@Stelios78910]

Well this was a welcome surprise. Haven't watched it yet but just wanted to say thank you for putting a smile on my face despite the fact of going back to work tomorrow. Will tuck into this later. Hope all is well.

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

No problem dude, hope you're staying safe at work

[@Stelios78910]

@@HeyJoshyJosh Thanks man. It's all good ta. Hope it isn't too stressful for you in local government. PS Vid was excellent btw.

[@AaronDGreen]

I Fell off Fear the Walking Dead when the Dad got killed off. The relationships between the family was my biggest drawing point, and if their just gonna start killing them off I didn't have any interest in the show. Glad I didn't watch them kill the other 2 off as well. Jeez, what a way to kill a show.

[@BenRai2k]

I loved Madison as a lead. Not bothered to watch it since.

[@BlazingOwnager]

I hated Madison in season 1 & 2. By season 3, she was awesome. She was turning into the Heisenberg of the zombie apocalypse.

[@haydneasy9736]

couldnt stand her, cheered when she got killed. I didnt think she was a strong charachter, just obnoxious.

[@BenRai2k]

@@haydneasy9736 I liked the fact she was a pretty cold person, already having emotional strain from having killed her dad as a child. A lot of people didn't like her though, wont ever understand it.

[@haydneasy9736]

@@BenRai2k fair enough, but for me I've either got to like or respect the character, i didn't with her I at all, hoped from the start that she would get chomped ! 😁

[@BonafideShaunDent]

I flip-flopped on Madison. One minute she was the great, strong, do whatever it takes character then the next she was so aggrivatingly annoying that I wanted her dead on the spot. But I will admit I would probably rather still have her on the show. Plus the way she went out? She could have easily, with some hustle, lured the walkers into the stadium, shut and locked the doors then got out.

[@mxenoskorpion3072]

Season 4 is as confusing as the SAW movies, flashbacks in flashbacks.

[@robertlopez444]

I mean the saw movies aren’t really confusing but ok-

[@SydMountaineer]

Brilliant review of the series! Explained very well. I have tons of complaints about FTWD, but I didn't realize what happened with the posters - Thank You! Yes, what happened with the ratings of Season 4 episode 1 is how Gimple operated with TWD, too, taking advantage of the hard work others have done - lots of people watched S4 E01due to being so satisfied with Season 3 (along with the SuperBowl) and in TWD, viewers got heavily invested in the story & characters in Season 1 thanks to Frank Darabont, then Gimple and others took advantage of all the hard work he did, when they fired him for being upset that they were not doing their jobs properly. If only more actors, other than just one, would have protested when Darabont was unjustly fired in the very beginning and had Gimple's group of a-holes removed, imagine how amazing the franchise would be! The Science Fiction & Horror genres would have a better reputation and viewers would have quality shows to watch. When Darabont was in charge, the story engaged us and made us use our brains to think, but the storytelling from all the shows now is nitwitted, braindead, and humiliating for everyone.

[@mrrooster4876]

I recently went back and watched season 1 and the first few EP of season 2 that Durabont produced and directed. Man is it a wayyyyy better show. It doesn't feel the same as at all you can feel The Green Mile and Shawshank in the production and camera work. It's a masterpiece of film made for television. Glen and Rick in the city...Mearle on the rooftop...Otis and Shane at the school...Everything about it is exponentially better. Then FTWD starts off with so in much potential...and it's ruined by another Gimple/Hurd/AMC takeover. FTWD then immediately begins using the same camera filters, character development and shitty writing. AMC ruined everything The Walking Dead franchise could have been....

[@blackdragon6]

The show is clearly a victim of a lighter and softer retool. Season 3, was even better than the mainland show imo. Then season 4 happened 😭😔😭😔

[@marcotuliovazquez6821]

FTWD went to shit after the third season. They shouldn't have killed off Madison and Nick. The gap in story line between the dam rupture in Tijuana and then all of a sudden, next season they are in Texas.

[@TDArocks2]

Marco Tulio Vazquez I agree with you. It’s like they tried to erase all the characters from season 1-3 and start over 🙄

[@OffTheTopPodcast21021]

Altoid Bazingá I still rather Season 2A over season 4B, and I haven’t even watched 5 cuz I heard it’s worse then 4, and 4 is absolutely horrible

[@lapplandkun9273]

they copy pasted TWD season 7-8 to FTWD season 4-5. Thanks, scott nipple. That's what the audience exactly wanted

[@donkeysaurusrex7881]

@@TDArocks2 Yes. Doing so is what saved the show.

[@stevienightheat1]

@@donkeysaurusrex7881 it didn't save the show though. It killed the viewership for the show. The first three seasons were far more successful.

[@laurensimendinger8887]

Hello! I've watched before, but this video got me thinking, what would *I* do if I'd handed the reigns for Fear. I personally think their main problem was having a screwy timeline in the first place. The timeline of the actual fall doesn't make enough sense for it to work pacing-wise. *But,* if I had been told to write the pilot, this would be my pitch: We open on a family, (either the Clarke’s, or following the Morales family would be a cool tie-in with my ending), and they get a call saying that their grandfather has had a heart attack. We follow them rushing to the hospital, saying bye, to grandpa, etc. Grandpa flatlines and dies, and the family tearfully starts to leave, but then they hear stirring behind them. They turn around and see Grandpa moving and twitching. He’s still flatlined, so they stare, confused and horrified. He gives a final twitch and his bloodshot eyes open as the granddaughter says “Grandpa?” *Cut to title card* The rest of the first season follows the family trying to wrap their heads around what the hell happened, and the cases of dead people coming back and behaving oddly popping up over the country. The first season ends with the president making a speech to the country about “grave times ahead” and putting the country on a national lockdown. Season 2 (there’d only be 2 seasons) follows the family dealing with being quarantined. (yeah yeah I know it hits too close I promise we don’t stay in quarantine) They’re locked down and desperate for answers and news from the outside, which is being denied to them. The midseason finale is them getting ahold of the quarantine-zone doctor and threatening them for information. (Perhaps Madison’s role if we keep the Clarkes?) The doctor reveals what we as viewers know--that the dead are coming back to life and eating people. The second half of season 2 follows the world being unable to cope with the pandemic and falling apart. Our main family watches the cities be bombed, quarantine zones be abandoned, etc. The family and other side characters flee and form a settlement outside of the city, much like Rick’s group at the quarry. The series finale is some of the group members wandering around, looking for supplies. They come across the hospital where Rick is. The final shot is a zoom-in on the hospital, zooming through the destroyed hospital and all the way into black...and with a jolt Officer Rick Grimes wakes from his coma.

[@morihui]

They could have done so much with Travis, he was the one who brought moral to the story and his change between dealing with the life in the apocalypse was nearly perfect. You could see he was changing from morality to brutality (much like Rick) . And then they killed him off

[@dudemynameiscat]

I would have loved for Jake and Troy to be alive still! Their relationship would have been amazing to be explored more than it was... and could have ended with Jake not being the 'nice' guy anymore and killing Troy

[@dutchvanderlinde6076]

Jake was holding back some demons. That’s clear.

[@herospeedy3174]

Very happy they didn't with mr g0mple getting involved

[@chaoshock]

I could see why some people weren’t too fond of the direction the earlier seasons went, becoming a spin off rather than truly exploring the first days/weeks of the apocalypse and the effects it had on its environment/people but at least (to me) season 1-3 was a solid and enjoyable experience and the setting in Mexico during the 2-3 season gave a fresh new perspective for the walking dead universe. New people, new behaviours/attitudes, new events. That being said, season 4’s time jump and change in setting was in my opinion one of the shows biggest mistakes. Things became a lot more predictable and cliche’d and just plain stupid. Scott gimple basically just got a hard on for having a spaghetti western esque zombie show and changed everything to achieve that with the addition to shoe in Morgan.

[@calendarfactory8566]

The 4th Season is just Morgan the Show, not Fear. In my mind the show ended back on the Dam

[@kanden27]

I liked Fear from Season 1-3. After killing the two main leads then bringing on Morgan was the worst idea. Felicia is a good character for the most part, but she worked well with her family. Not Morgan and when she was drawing on trees was dumb. They tried being too sentimental with none of the build up.

[@AxonicIon]

@AIDS says the morgan stan😭 as soon as he was introduced it was all about morgan, morgan, morgan. alicia who had been in the show for 3 seasons was all of a sudden pushed.. i would say to the side but i’d rather say out of VIEW. they never showed aspects of alicia’s grief for her mom or nick but made nicks death about morgan??? what? a character he knew for a couple of days compared to his sister??

[@destructo3457]

@Larry_Mate Morgan came and it was all about him, as simple as that.

[@EmuCavalry]

This is what would've made the show great 1. A great writing team, which it lacked 2. Slower paced and staying in the early days. They could only pull this off with good writers though, which is my guess why the skipped the collapse. The could appease the viewers who wanted more action with any kind emergency worker character. 3. Smart and slightly faster zombies like those in TWD s1. They are objectively waaaaay creepier and much more dangerous 4. Slightly decomposed fresh zombies with distinct facial features and past personality. It plays into the uncanny valley effect and also humanises them a bit, which is sad. 5. Play into the tragedy of the mass death and terror. S1/2 did an excellent job of this with environmental storytelling, but they'd obviously have to do it live action. 6. Inexperienced characters who have no idea of what they're doing or how to defend themselves. They are more relatable to most viewers and it gives the show more suspense. 7. This is the one thing they actually did quite well, but focus on the atmosphere and world building 8. Add heaps of new lore that they main show couldn't or didn't need to. Ideally set it in a more distinct location too. Tbh the show was doomed from the start because AMC had their grubby hands on it. I think the show would have some in common with Better Call Saul for a number of reasons.

[@emoney7731]

Andrew Chambliss and Ian Goldberg. There's your problem

[@onetallpheeesh]

Nah they have to do what Gimple says

[@rudydesi]

No shit! Horrible writing

[@rudydesi]

Kang is doing good and she's under pimple

[@LeeEverett1]

*Laughs in Scott Gimple*

[@joaquinflores8489]

They are probably pizzagaters

[@m.scottyoung9650]

They spent 3 seasons building up this family and then just brought in a whole new cast basically and expected us to jump in with these new randoms . Also scott gimple happened.... Travis and nick should still be alive if this show were to be any good, I get they didn't just want another rick so they made a madison but her actor was lame and didnt seem invested.

[@annefrankenstein9290]

the actress who played madison was so flat and emotionless throughout that i never got invested in her character. i found myself bursting into laughter when alicia was pouring her heart out because Madison looked like she could have been watching the home shopping network

[@dudemynameiscat]

@@annefrankenstein9290 literally the point of her character, she was supposed to be emotionless. You’re not supposed to sympathise with her or *like* her, that’s not the point of her character.

[@MoistTowelette125]

6:30 I understand your thinking, but FTWD was supposed to show the beginning of the outbreak. It would defeat the purpose, if they skipped past everything, even though we all had an idea of what was going to happen.

[@lonniebledsoe5423]

WOW.........I feel a bit lucky now that I stopped watching after the third season. As TWD seemed to repeat itself time and time again, I quit after Carl died. A friend told me that with the Whisperers that the show had returned, I was almost done with this entire concept of this universe of WD. I really liked Fear. I always wanted to know how Madison and Nick died. You summed it up well. During this lockdown time that we live in I was looking to binge on some shows that I am normally too busy to watch. Thank you for this video. You saved me from two seasons of bad programming. Thanks again.

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

No problem, thank you for watching.

[@benn255b3]

Yeah they lost a lot of fans after Glenn and Carl died, and tons more after Rick left. Now it feels like a whole new audience then it was a couple couple year's ago.

[@rustykuntz94]

This show went into the toilet so fast it’s still hard to believe. While Season 1 & 2 weren’t great, it held my interest. S3 was actually very good IMO. Then the showrumner changed and it became and absolute joke.

[@janeallgood9833]

i hated the intro convo between rick and shane. i felt like the writers were trying to be Tarantino as i was watching it.

[@blockedhaat]

Fear really went downhill, I'm glad you made this video to really go in depth why people stopped watching. Fear turned into a joke, bad writing and shitty character development didnt help with the slow pacing of the show. Geat video!

[@HeyJoshyJosh]

Thanks!

[@Dani..663]

I stoped watching after nick died he was the only character I liked

[@Skaidrite64]

Me too

[@kavehteimory6413]

Rick's not dead they took him with helicopter.

[@Dani..663]

Kaveh Teimory I think you’ve misread my comment lol

[@kavehteimory6413]

@@Dani..663 well, you said after he "died" so I thought you didn't watch that episode till the end.

[@Dani..663]

Kaveh Teimory I know I’m only kidding lol I still watch the walking dead even now :)

[@skylarmercykilled1986]

Honestly the change of showrunners in season 4 ruined the show, because the original plan was so good with Madison becoming the villain and like no time skip.

[@brentononeal8372]

I agree with 100% of what you've said. Me personally, was hoping that the show would take the opposite turn of the walking dead. Yea the characters did a lot of bad shit in TWD but they were still looked at as the good guys, taking the high road whenever possible. I would have preferred that in Fear, the characters developed into the "bad guys", being pushed to commit unthinkable acts until they became too far gone to turn back. I think that is what would happen in the real world in a apocalypse. Fear the Walking Dead is super soft with a whole lot of mush mouth dialect.

[@AnthonySforza]

Honestly, where it went awry for me, was when Madison wasn't Alpha. Seriously how cool would that have been if Alpha pulled her mask off and it was actually Madison? I think it would have been rather cool, as every time we've come upon a villain in TWD, they're already "bad." Negan, The Governor, Terminus, the Hospital people, the guys Darryl joined, etc etc. So it would have actually given Fear the Walking Dead a purpose beyond being a massive viewer grab to piggyback off of TWD. We would have seen how all these "Evil" people in the show, could have possibly started out as well meaning individuals who just kept having to get their hands dirty or pushed to the brink of madness by circumstance and just never stopped to ask if they've gone too far. Where seeing that Madison was Alpha, it would have somewhat added something new to the show by forcing us to consider such a thing, having already been part of her journey. . Besides, let's not sugarcoat things, Madison was pretty much the villain everywhere her and her family went. Which is good, as trying to protect her family could have been what drove imher into such a Darwinian perspective.

[@toffee3944]

"Sorry Nick, this is my show now." - Morgan 'No-violence' Jones, 2018

[@Gabriel-ki7uj]

"I'm the fear the walking dead now"

[@brianachim2670]

Favoring Nick over Alicia? Madison was crazy!

[@noahnagic]

Travis' death made me mad, then Troy. I got excited for Nick and Madison to meet Morgan in Season 4, but when Nick got a Travis death at the beginning of the season, then Madison died in the middle, I lost almost all my hope. Alicia is still there, after all. It seems that just when characters are changing to even better versions of themselves, the show kills them off. I don't understand. That especially applies to Travis and Troy.