The Fall Of Númenor » Book Review » The Tolkien Road Episode 317 » CS Lewis, Brian Sibley

Is the latest Tolkien book worth your time and money? In this episode, I take a close look at The Fall of Númenor and tell you what I think!
EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS » Kaitlyn of Tea with Tolkien, John R, Jacob Lockham, John H, Scotchy Bobo, Eru27
Buy THE FALL OF NÚMENOR » amzn.to/3U7Z3Vf
“Of Númenor [Elrond] spoke, its glory and its fall, and the return of the Kings of Men to Middle-earth out of the deeps of the Sea, borne upon the wings of storm.” - The Lord of the Rings
FOLLOW & SUPPORT US:
- / tolkienroad
- / tolkienroad
- truemythspress...
- / tolkienroad
- / tolkienroad
LINKS & MATHOMS:
- listen to The Silmarillion for FREE » www.audibletri...
- buy The Silmarillion » amzn.to/3FOKAY5
- buy The Atlas of Middle-earth » amzn.to/3KLOxQa
- buy Tolkien's Requiem » tolkiensrequie...
- buy Tolkien's Overture » tolkiensovertu...
SPECIAL THANKS TO THESE PATRONS:
John R
Kaitlyn of Tea with Tolkien
Jacob Lockham
John H
Scotchy Bobo
Eru27
Ms. Anonymous
Andrew T
Redhawk
Shannon S
Brian O
Emilio P
Zeke F
James A
James L
Chris L
Chuck F
Asya V
Ish of the Hammer
Teresa C
David of Pints with Jack
Jonathan D
Eric B
Johanna T
Mike M
Robert H
Paul D
Julia
Werty
Matthew W
JoeBagelMan
Chris K
Jacob S
Richard K
Matt R
Garret P
John W
Eugene D
Seb M
AS WELL AS THOSE CELEBRATING THEIR PATRON ANNIVERSARY IN NOVEMBER OF 2022
Michael L
Matthew F

[@brianonthebox]

Thanks for a very generous review. You really understood my intent in undertaking the book!

[@TolkienRoad]

Thank you, Brian, for the outstanding work in assembling this volume. I'm hoping there is more work of this nature done in the future to assemble the scattered aspects of the legendarium into more topical volumes. I'm really enjoying going through chapter-by-chapter right now.

[@ace9924]

Ive been reading it and its pretty amazing. To have all those spread apart notes on Numenor in one Book is great. I wanted to know more about Numenor and to have it in this book rather than sifting through all of Tolkiens notes was refreshing. But i agree that there isnt new material but that was honestly the intent of Sibley from the get go.

[@TolkienRoad]

🙌

[@robertsleeth861]

Glad you gave it a thumbs up, John. I just bought the deluxe version signed by Sibley and Lee. Can't wait to get it!

[@TolkienRoad]

Very cool!

[@PleaseNThankYou]

Ho, ho, ho...Merry Christmas to you, from you!! Lucky dawg. Enjoy!

[@ceeece]

It’s a great book through and through. Not only wonderful content and illustrations but it is quality paper and binding. Highly recommend. I don’t have Letters or HoME so glad all 2nd Age stuff is here.

[@TolkienRoad]

Totally agree, but do yourself a flavor and get the Letters. Highly worthwhile your purchase... amzn.to/3F8I7K5

[@TolkienRoad]

Also, there's a lot of good stuff scattered through HoMe...we reviewed each volume a while back » kzbin.info/aero/PLqUat2OcwnPBVoNIRkl942TbYaeIzmYHr

[@DavidBigwood]

Thanks for the review. I'll pass but I can see why others may want a copy. For starters it looks like a nice volume. Paper, design, layout, and illustrations. The commentary by Brian Sibley should be decent. He did do my favorite adaptation of the Lord of the Rings. Personally I never found Christopher Tolkien's writing too dense but YMMV. If I find it in a used book shop I'll likely pick it up. I've been reading and buying Tolkien books since 1968. So I already have all the material contained in the book and more. I was hesitant to pick up Beren and Luthian and The Fall of Gondolin for that reason. But I did. I think I've hit my limit on the the repackaging of previous material. On the other hand there is an audio book version. Some of the material has not been available in that format before and I've already bought it. It is next in line for a listen. Sibley and West are the narrators. One for Tolkien and the other for the commentary I'd guess. This arrangement worked well on some other audio books. If the Kindle version gets inexpensive enough I might spring for that too. There are some advantages to having an electronic version, like searching. Happy Thanksgiving.

[@TolkienRoad]

Thanks for the thoughtful comment, David!

[@PleaseNThankYou]

Mr. Hostetter advised us that his editorial publication presented the last of the unpublished notes, scribbles, marginal notes, etc. I was surprised when Sibley came out on the heels of Hostetter's claim. I was skeptical as well. Ok, the book should absolutely be included on our shelves possibly as a stand alone appendix. Very handy, I would think, to have as a reference. Maybe Mr. Sibley could do another such effort from a different time period, pulling together all of the scattered works into one compendium ( if I'm using that word correctly). And then shorter efforts like Individual ancestories. Sort of what's available on YT in lore channels content but in small book forms. I don't always have internet/wifi and if my utility bills don't stop going up, electricity will make book reading by candle light cool again.

[@barto_got_game7727]

At times it reminded me of a wiki page

[@Tar-Elenion]

Hostetter says: "Based solely on what I have seen of Tolkien's manuscripts - which to my knowledge is nearly exhaustive, save for letters and personal papers - I don't think there is enough unpublished material concerning Middle-earth (outside of the linguistic papers) to form another volume like NoMe. There are of course many of Tolkien's academic writings and lectures that remain unpublished (for now), but nothing substantial pertaining to Middle-earth."

[@TolkienRoad]

I actually love the idea of doing work to make the more obscure writings more accessible. As much I admire Christopher's hard work over the years, so much of The History of Middle-earth series can be confusing. For example, "Athrabeth Finrod Ah Andreth", which we'll be covering soon. The work itself is amazing, but the organization and commentary in the chapter is a labyrinth.

[@PleaseNThankYou]

@@barto_got_game7727 I haven't had the pleasure of reading it yet. But I am building my library slowly. BTW, I like wiki. So great either wa!

[@PleaseNThankYou]

@@TolkienRoad I'll be looking forward to it. Elvish names are plentiful even for an individual character. I imaging it has to do with a variation of a image and tense of the name. I think you will well sort it out. Happy Thanksgiving to your household from mine.

[@akselm.bjerke9490]

Great review! Looks like Im getting this one. Sounds very nice with something a bit more accessible than some of Christophers writings

[@TolkienRoad]

Exactly!

[@ianhaygreen9899]

Might have to drop a few hints to Mrs H vis-à-vis Christmas pressies!

[@TolkienRoad]

Hope your Christmas wish comes true!

[@terrystewart1973]

Like you I wasn't sure of the value of this book, as I have all the HoME volumes along with Unfinished Tales, but ended up buying it eventually anyway. And I'm glad I did because it's a really handy aid to quickly look stuff up about Tolkien's Second Age. Yes, it does miss a, very, few things out, like Tolkien's last notes on the Blue Wizards arriving in Middle-earth in the Second Age. As to the end of freshly uncovered writings by Tolkien himself, I can think of two possible sources. Firstly The Letters of J R R Tolkien, edited by Humphrey Carpenter, are really just a selection of his letters, many of which are not given in full. So a collected unedited Letters would be great at some point, similar to The Collected Letters Of C.S. Lewis that came out in three volumes. Secondly, after the publication of The Lord of the Rings, Tolkien gave many interviews to newspapers, fan magazines, and broadcasters, and often included snippets of stuff not elsewhere recorded. Some of these still occasionally resurface for the first time since they originally appeared, so hopefully some budding academic someday will collect them all and publish them as well.

[@TolkienRoad]

Both of these would be amazing - although I suspect a collection of transcripts would be a nightmare to compile, and you'd have to pay so many different sources that it might not be feasible from a business standpoint.

[@sherry3099]

I am just finishing The Silmarillion right now, and got The Fall of Numenor to read next. Then I’ll re-read LoTR. I really think each book deepens the appreciation of the others and the legendarium. I’m excited for this book!

[@Halfwit_The_Brave]

Very cool! My copy just arrived today, but I haven’t opened it yet. I found your channel just recently, but have been enjoying it very much. Thanks for the good insight. And one question, have you entertained the thought of collaborations with other channels either in videos or podcasts? After this dumpster fire amazon made, I’ve discovered quite a few channels I didn’t know about that I very much enjoy.

[@TolkienRoad]

Always a possibility - any suggestions?

[@Halfwit_The_Brave]

I have recently found a channel named European Lore, I think he mentioned that he was going to look into possible collaborations. The One Ring is very good, Men of the West is also amazing. Tolkien Untangled is another amazing channel. I’m not sure what their plans are, but all have great Tolkien content. I know of more KZbin channels, but of the ones I’m familiar with I think these you’d be me best suggestions.

[@progfan9917]

@@TolkienRoad what about Tolkien Lore?

[@stevenjones7170]

LOTR is great,a masterpiece and thankfully finished but The Greater Silmarillion surpasses it. There are passages in the history of middle earth,Silmarillion and unfinished tales that are just sublime,poetry and prose,where Tolkien is on fire and at his peak.It was his heart,his foundry,his cauldron from which all his alchemy flowed.Top of my head passages such as Tuor and his coming to Gondolin,Beren and Luthien (poetic form),Hurin(alliterative verse),Quenta SilmarillionFlight of the Noldoli,oh so many sections exceeded even the best passages of LOTRs in quality of writing. Don't get me wrong for I adore LOTRs but the Silmarillion,even unfinished,is his third and greatest masterpiece.My subjective opinion of course

[@TolkienRoad]

Very interesting perspective. Tolkien was a transcendent genius, lucky we even got the finished LOTR in his lifetime.

[@bookmarkswithjason9445]

I got this at Costco for $22. Should still be available at most stores

[@TolkienRoad]

Nice deal!

[@AnfalasHerdsman]

The idea is amazing but the final result not so much, he should have gathered absolutly everything there is about the second age, why on Earth make an appendix summary of the third age, and leave behind the notion club papers and Tal-Elmar??? Makes no sens; it's like okay we have most of second age in one book but a few more things not included, why?

[@Tar-Elenion]

Barring any lost manuscripts surfacing, what remains unpublished is linguistic writings (which should be published eventually).

[@jorgedacunha2676]

There's still the entire unfinished Lay of the Fall of Gondolin which Christopher only gave us about 10 lines in The Lays of Beleriand - Poems Early Abandoned. He said there were 130 lines, so I'd love to have the entire thing published. Such a missed opportunity to not include it in the Fall of Gondolin stand-alone book as an appendix. There's also the prose version of the Lay of Leithian. Also abandoned early and also a missed opportunity not including it in the Beren and Luthien stand-alone book. And isn't there an abandoned text of Tolkien's attempt at rewriting The Hobbit in the LotR style? So yeah, still some stuff out there.

[@Tar-Elenion]

@@jorgedacunha2676 For the Lay of the Fall of Gondolin CT notes: "I do not give this poem in extenso here, since it does not, so far as the main narrative is concerned, add anything to the Tale; and my father found, as I think, the metrical form unsuitable to the purpose. There are, however, several passages of interest for the study of the larger development of the legends." (He the notes some of those things of 'interest') Lays of Beleriand The attempt at rewriting The Hobbit is contained in Rateliff's History of the Hobbit. I don't recall off-hand about the prose Lay of Leithian, does CT note if it contained 'new' information? Or did it simply restate what is found in the verse? In the event, my initial post is too declarative, and there may still be some known bits and pieces that remain unpublished.

[@jorgedacunha2676]

@@Tar-Elenion Thanks for letting me know about the Hobbit rewrite. I love reading Tolkien's alternate attempts even when it's abandoned early. Christopher does mention that the prose Lay of Leithian is too similar to be of interest, just like he did with the Lay of the Fall of Gondolin. But I'd still like to read them and decide for myself. ;-)

[@TolkienRoad]

We discussed the Hobbit rewrites here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fn-9dGx4qLGcbqs kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWecgpiLi5iEprs kzbin.info/www/bejne/gmiVgKKLgMx7nNE

[@Tar-Elenion]

@@jorgedacunha2676 Here is what Carl Hostter says regarding unpublished material: "Based solely on what I have seen of Tolkien's manuscripts - which to my knowledge is nearly exhaustive, save for letters and personal papers - I don't think there is enough unpublished material concerning Middle-earth (outside of the linguistic papers) to form another volume like NoMe. There are of course many of Tolkien's academic writings and lectures that remain unpublished (for now), but nothing substantial pertaining to Middle-earth."

[@stevenjones7170]

Unfinished Tales and The History of Middle-earth contain many passages of Tolkien's best writing eclipsing The Hobbit and LOTRs

[@TolkienRoad]

I'm not sure anything could eclipse LOTR, but I'm curious as to what you have in mind...

[@stevenjones7170]

@@TolkienRoad LOTR is great,a masterpiece and thankfully finished but The Greater Silmarillion surpasses it. There are passages in the history of middle earth,Silmarillion and unfinished tales that are just sublime,poetry and prose,where Tolkien is on fire and at his peak.It was his heart,his foundry,his cauldron from which all his alchemy flowed.Top of my head passages such as Tuor and his coming to Gondolin,Beren and Luthien (poetic form),Hurin(alliterative verse),Quenta SilmarillionFlight of the Noldoli,oh so many sections exceeded even the best passages of LOTRs in quality of writing. Don't get me wrong for I adore LOTRs but the Silmarillion,even unfinished,is his third and greatest masterpiece.My subjective opinion of course

[@stevenjones7170]

Pointless publishing exercise.No new material as everything published before.Highly disappointing.

[@TolkienRoad]

I disagree, but thanks for stopping by!