The HD-VMD story - The format that lost to the format that lost

[@mcolville]

If you ever wonder if these bits are any good; yes. They are good. Keep doing them, you are good at them.

[@hossaneece5856]

Love your work, btw.

[@lukahutinski9075]

I still like the muppets the most. The Bl ray puns were the best done youtube jokes flat out.

[@bob7872]

Yes, good comedy is welcome on KZbin!

[@jonjohnson2844]

Not bad, although I kind of just wanted to learn about this media format I’d never heard of.

[@frankmurphy5]

Yeah, that was funny and made for a succinct intro as well.

[@PeterBull1951]

Techmoan enjoys a few glasses one evening, then has a look at eBay. Next day "what the hell am I going to do with a box full of shonky wigs" ...

[@computer_toucher]

Oh, he knew. Loved the stab at all of us that yell for the puppets all the time though :P

[@blazeelvirafirehoof7844]

"hmmm, might use them for a bit of fun I suppose." Techmoan the next day:

[@jorgepais2876]

I only imagine how was Matt when he bought that bunch of broken Minidisc players!

[@Kalvinjj]

@@jorgepais2876 Then he proceeds to make two videos: one for the normal audience, and one troll speedrun of what was it, 10 min or so (compared to the 1h+ original) to please the ones that complain the videos are too long EDIT: original: 73 min. Perfectly conveniently about the same running time of a CD or MD. "Abridged" version: 2 min 41 s.

[@luisclaudiofugolin6250]

He enjoys a few glasses, but apparently, not the drinks inside of them...

[@WalrusStu]

I like how LazyTown was listed as if it was a country.

[@keiyakins]

I mean the legal and cultural background of the place does seem rather unique, maybe it is?

[@uncleho1945]

Look at this format that i just found. When I say flop get ready to drop. Nooooo flop Blu-ray, not me!

[@kenhukushi1637]

It's the world's leading exporter of slack

[@CCCW]

Well, you gotta do the cooking by the book

[@fwiffo]

That was the real downfall of the format. They would have been fine if the Lazytown bundle wasn't a regional Lazytown exclusive release.

[@bobdeinterlace]

I love that "HD-DVD is out, now only Blu-Ray and HD-VMD are left!" statement, as if HD-VMD had any relevance to begin with.

[@juststatedtheobvious9633]

Reading the reviews for the American bundled movies really puts their desperation into context. Cutting Room. (2005) "This movie is so bad that it makes a Troma movie look good in comparison." - The Pit of the Pendulum The Naked Ape. (1973) "I was bored senseless." "A train wreck on every level" - ShockCinema

[@coffeetime1001]

Yeah, that's what I thought also. It's NME vs SONY who owns Colombia Pictures. Zero chances for NME.

[@penguin44ca]

I unfortunately bought an hd DVD player, literally day after new years 2008. Thankfully after hearing warner make the jump to bd three days later, best buy took mine back and swapped it for a Sony bd. The slowest loading player on the market. I loved it.

[@ToastyMozart]

I like the regional bundle grid's implication that LazyTown is a real place.

[@loturzelrestaurant]

@@StukaUK Hi. I ask around to see if someone would be interested in a lil Project of mine. Some people try to be the 180 Degree Opposite of Cancel-Culture and try to help KZbin become less... well, lets say 'Messy' to use nice words only... ... Interested to hear a bit more?

[@loturzelrestaurant]

@@sedme0 Sorry for being random, alice.

[@wolfetteplays8894]

@@sedme0 it’s not even spam, this is the only place they’ve posted it

[@InnerTurbulencia]

*Mexico

[@mr.g-sez]

my thoughts dude!!!

[@ethanpschwartz]

“This would have been better with the puppets.” I think you underestimate those wigs.

[@hossaneece5856]

I don't disagree... but I think you underestimate how much I miss those puppets XD

[@StarkRG]

While I do think most of these bits would be better with puppets, that line alone made the whole thing worth it.

[@speedster29]

Wait, they weren't puppets?

[@teknowil]

3 muppets

[@BurtSampson]

He reminded me of an even more insane James May with that one bald wig with the longer hair in the back.

[@MrDuncl]

As you mention it seems streaming has won the HD media war. Large UK supermarket Sainsbury's recently announced that they are stopping selling all discs apart from vinyl ! In a couple of years you will be making "Blu-ray discs. An appreciation"

[@mor4y]

Physical discs kinda died a few years ago when the studios stopped offering extra features on the disc, well unless you bought the super special edition, and there was no extra 'value' to having a physical copy, and streaming quality is rather good For music physical media is still alive because streaming quality is so awful! There is a extra value to having the physical copy, so people will still buy it

[@Pacmanfan-po9rn]

I still buy physical media because of ITunes and ripping music.

[@thewatchman8640]

@@Pacmanfan-po9rn I still buy physical media only because I don’t like how some streaming service cut or change the original music in some shows or films, plus if you purchase from Amazon or iTunes at some point they will loose the license & that means you can’t watch anymore. Physical media I hope will be around for long while

[@Ichijoe2112]

@@Pacmanfan-po9rn how much longer does iTunes have on Windows? iTunes on the Mac has since been replaced by Apple Music, with other bits like importing of Audiobooks & Podcasts, have been shoved off to Apple Books.

[@mor4y]

@Tom if the streaming world follows the gaming world, then you might find that some films disappear because they only have 10 or 20 year licences on the music used in the film. TV companies will pay up for a temp licence, but steaming services who work off payment-per-views might drag their heels Many classic games have disappeared from sale thanks to that. It means places like steam cannot distribute them. GoG (good old games) has a few where they managed to get a version made with royalty free music, but its not the same.....

[@SrCarpi]

“You know this bit would have been better with the puppets.” 😂

[@sidneyhuckabee3598]

He's not wrong

[@Danny_Boel]

nah, I think it was great.

[@Ichijoe2112]

I miss the Muppets. What's the story with them? Did Techmoan used to work with Henson?

[@petedan5746]

He should have a another KZbin channel where he does skit's with his puppets

[@jonat_gabl]

@@Ichijoe2112 Recalling this vaguely from his website, he got them from the FAO Schwarz Muppet Workshop on a trip to NYC.

[@tickandslug]

It's pretty cool that you were able to get James may to host the quiz night.

[@syahminorizan8064]

I swear, I thought that was the real James May hosting a quiz night

[@Knaeckebrotsaege]

23:40 As someone who's done drive fixes on XBOX360s and occasionally some other equipment with ODDs back in the late 00s early 10s, that laser in there looks awfully similar to a Sanyo SF-HD66 or HD68, which would be embossed in the plastic somewhere on the lasers body. If it is, finding replacements should be easy and cheap as those two types were at one point *the* most common laser units in anything that could read DVDs, including some XBOX360 disk drives and countless DVD players and DVD readers in desktop PCs. Heck if I still have one in my stash, I'd be willing to send it over just to give this oddball early player a chance of working again if the laser is all that's wrong with it (which is likely cause it's at least _trying_ to read but fails)

[@shinyplaid]

I legit laughed at “you know this bit would have been better with the puppets.” 🤣

[@ericpode6095]

I miss the puppets...

[@alexdhall]

@@ericpode6095 Ditto.

[@JamesPawson]

I am one of those annoying people who always says he misses the puppet outros. Well.. now I am going to be the annoying guy who always wants these one-man comedy intros. Haha, sublime, man!

[@iainlaskey7285]

Totally, I was laughing out loud watching that

[@mjetektman9313]

I wish we could have both

[@ccateni28]

I want both...

[@RJDA.Dakota]

Used to enjoy the puppets. The joke at the end was always pertinent, if dry. Very humourous.

[@ILoveWomen]

It was gold

[@jozefdoyle4621]

"you should've said if you wanted to go to that real ale pub" Genius

[@kaitlyn__L]

The best joke in the skit

[@darkcoeficient]

It would have been funnier with the puppets XD

[@BenHeckHacks]

What they "save" with a red laser would likely be "spent" trying to ensure the multi-layer focusing worked accurately.

[@deathstrike]

This is just speculation, but by what Techcmoan described with this format, it could have potentially been used (kinks worked out of course) as a decent replacement drive for the XBOX Classic, the PS2, and of course with proper flashing, the Xbox 360. This would have been a great drive for those classic consoles. The benefit of standard DVD, plus Hi Def. And done with a standard laser, so it did maintain compatibility. And with fairly minimal modifications since it's apparent the player could accept firmware update. What could have been...Especially when parts for the classic consoles run dry. Toshiba and Mitsumi are still common for now, but for how much longer? And we will need parts to keeps these consoles running. This really could have been special!!

[@TrigramThunder]

@@deathstrike or... Just don't keep them running? Old hardware has to die some day, no big deal. This is why we move toward standardization, in the future, you will want your videogames to be playable decades after their launch, and for that they have to be free from the shackles of aging physical formats, by you guessed it, moving to digital format.

[@flightlesschicken7769]

@@TrigramThunder You act as if digital is forever...

[@TrigramThunder]

@@flightlesschicken7769 I mean. It is? Or at least certainly lasts on way longer timescales than physical does. When digital moves platforms, it's a matter of copying and pasting your content. When physical does the same, you need to use a machine to read the content off the original format and rewrite it into a new physical format...

[@flightlesschicken7769]

@@TrigramThunder First, the information stored on punch cards will still be around when the last bit of data decays from any HDD or SSD. But that's just something to note, not really relevant to games. Second there are countless games lost to time because they were digital only and the servers that hosted them shut down, wiping them from existence. In the same situation with physical media it can be found at some later point in time and replicated. People have replicated the information Core-Rope memory used on the Apollo missions, which only survived because they were physical. Additionally you can never truly own a digital game like you can a physical game (unless we sail the 7 seas), there have been games that people have purchased and downloaded that became unplayable because the publisher pulled the plug. Digital offers a lot of convince, but the corporations prefer it to physical media, both because it's cheaper and easier to control. I don't know about you but I like to actually own the things I spend money on without resorting to piracy Edit: As far as I am concerned both physical and digital is needed for true information preservation, one without the other has problems

[@acorgiwithacrown467]

"It just turned out to be a DVD containing the anaglyph 3d version of journey to the centre of the earth", Idk why but that was quite funny.

[@AliceGeus]

i'm loving the techmoan cinematic universe

[@vwlssnvwls3262]

When DVD came out I recall a salesman trying to sell me a Phillips machine that used DiVX and you bought the DVD, but you had to hook your player up to a phone line so you could rent the use of the DVD you already bought. It cost less than the actual DVD movies, but it also did not come with any of the extra features. It was basically like having Blockbuster in your house. Of course I just nodded my head knowingly, let him do his pitch, then bought an actual DVD player. :)

[@noiselabproject9659]

DivX able DVD players were great for some of us as plenty of people were downloading DivX/mp4 stuff easily from the net and so that ment that you could burn that content to a DVD on your computer and then play them on those players but as for the intended store use of DivX yes that was a flop

[@evil7011]

I used divx format for pirated movies on my pc. That was the go to format for downloading pirated movies. When i wanted to watch it on a DVD/DiVX player, just burn it into a disc.

[@evil7011]

@@noiselabproject9659 It was not a flop you used it on a pc, mp4 compression allowed you to download movies in smaller file sizes, divx too. Divx died and mp4 still is the superior format today.

[@anvis-cathouse]

@@evil7011 There is a difference between DivX (the Video Codec) and DIVX (the movie rental system Vwlss Nvwls was talking about). It is pretty easy to confuse them since both have something to do with video.

[@evil7011]

@@anvis-cathouse thanks for the info. I burned pirated divX Cds and watched on my DVD player back in the day. Good old times.

[@kcgeil]

That's an impressive number of mistakes crammed into one disc format! Shocked it got into shops at all.

[@MrSonofsonof]

It's amazing the number of physical audio/video formats that used to exist, from wax cylinders right up to Blu-ray. Every time I think that Techmoan has covered them all, he does a video on another one. Got to say that I never heard of HD-VMD. I think all these things that passed me by (like minidisc too) came out when my kids were little, and I didn't have time for anything apart from work, nappies etc. I remember saying to my mum that the sixties must have been great, and she replied "truth to tell, I didn't notice - I was too busy having kids".

[@luisreyes1963]

Never knew there was a third HD video disc format that existed, albeit briefly. Thanks for the history update. 😁

[@AttilaTheHun333333]

Matt, you went to the next level with that intro. You never settle down and always evolve your channel. Thank You for years and years of entertainment!

[@computer_toucher]

Yeah, good man. Good to see such dry, peculiar humour reach an audience as well

[@mrb692]

Woulda been better with the puppets though 😉

[@MrSatyre1]

I was part of Pioneer's product planning and marketing team for Blu-ray in NA back in the 2000s. I won't get into the HD-DVD/Blu-ray battle, but it was a lot of fun! I would add l, however, that Pioneer developed first a 10 layer, then a 50 layer Blu-ray disc (out of corn starch, no less!). The idea was that they'd be perfect for TV and film series by reducing the amount of discs and packaging and waste. For better or worse, obviously that never happened.

[@kaitlyn__L]

Oh that would’ve been sweet. An entire box set, in FHD or UHD, on one disc!

[@Clay3613]

They hiring?

[@Quast]

And once you are sick of the movie and your taste has changed, you can even toss it to the rabbit! :D

[@disgruntledfaerie]

A cinematic masterpiece. Somewhere, Scorcese is scratching his head and wondering how the heck you pulled it off.

[@MrNegativecreep07]

I'm impressed he managed to get Bill Bailey to play the quiz master

[@Rhythmattica]

@@LostInTech3D "The Little Book of Calm" Read on Camera , by Bill Bailey , Available on PUB-VMD

[@JrGoonior]

@@MrNegativecreep07 I thought that was James May myself!

[@kcgeil]

Possession by the ghost of Kubrick is the only logical explanation!

[@ian_b]

@@pablorai769 He's referring to Tim Scorcese, a plumber from Cheam.

[@larsmuldjord9907]

Love the intro! Confused about the format. So if those HDVMD's were actually just dual-layer DVD's. Then, did a 3-layer or more HDVMD ever even exist? If not, I think one could argue that the format never really existed either out of being a special way to name and encode files onto a standard DVD. And a bunch of fluffy marketing. What a weird tale! Thanks for telling it.

[@BlueNeon81]

Yes, 3 and 4 layer VMDs were produced, one magazine in my country tested the player with bundled discs back in 2007, they also mounted the drive onto PC and found that those discs had capacity of 10 GB to 12 GB. Those VMDs had only a movie with 2 sound streams in Dolby Digital and 2 subtitles. No bonus materials, no uncompressed sound formats.

[@LegendaryMaoMao20]

As a guy who's somewhat technical, I've never heard about this format before, really interesting I would say

[@SuperSmashDolls]

So... I *do* remember hearing very early on that blue lasers *were* more expensive. Not because they were harder to make and that they were NEVER going to get cheaper, but because they were uncommon and no economies of scale had taken hold yet. "HD on barely-modified DVD drives" would have been a genuine selling point if they hadn't launched hilariously late and weren't one step above Soulja Boy in terms of electronics prowess. Also, I'm genuinely disappointed (not in you, you did your best) that you couldn't find any genuine HD VMDs. I would have been interested in seeing if they read in standard drives. Or, if the drive with supposedly modified firmware that shipped with the device, would let you read them in a PC. Not that you'd be able to play them - they're almost certainly encrypted, like DVDs and all the other HD formats were. But it would at least verify that there was *something* to this other than just rebranding DVD/EVD technology.

[@DondarfSnowbonk]

Yes, many people I know got a PS3 instead of a blu-ray player early on because the blue laser drove the price of the units up so much, and as usual the game console was being sold at a massive loss (though for similar reasons it was much more expensive at launch than its competitors).

[@Stettafire]

@@DondarfSnowbonk Yes, everyone I knew didn't bother getting a "blue ray player" they'd just get a PS3. It's effectively a blue-ray player AND you can play video games. So a win-win. Also lots of console gamers I knew got the PS3 because the XBOX 360 "ring of death" incident. Though now computers are so much cheaper and there is such a wealth of indie devs, hardly any of the console players I once knew are still on console. They've all moved onto PC only.

[@mikeselectricstuff]

Would be really interesting to try to get in touch with someone who was involved with the company. Sounds like they started off in good faith but then descended into fakery to keep things afloat. Reminds me of Nikola.

[@radry100]

Sounds more like they got scammed. They bought a technology that didn't even exist in it's full specs, then somehow managed to create some discs but at a much lower size and by burning millions of capital. The only winners were the inventors that got paid.

[@synthfreak291]

Reminds me of several Kickstarter projects.

[@jorgepais2876]

@@radry100 yeah, sort when you know you were cheated but try to give an impression that everything is allright.

[@lightningslim]

@@radry100 Seems like the real victims were those who bought the machines and disks!

[@jorgepais2876]

@@lightningslim better to have both machines and disks than to have one and not the other... but who knows if this things will not be profitable in the collectors market, especially after the so called "Techmoan effect"? ;)

[@xavierrose8208]

Matt that beginning skit was fantastic, do them more often!!!!!!

[@nucflashevent]

17:30 -- IMHO the mistake HD-DVD made was not simply discontinuing DVD-only releases and taking advantage of the fact you could have HD-DVD/DVD combo discs. I remember looking in stores and...I kid you not...a copy of a movie in HD-DVD only, DVD only AND a copy in HD-DVD combo with absolutely nothing to differentiate them. They turned Blurays biggest limitation...the fact you needed a new player to play them...into it's advantage because with Bluray it was "just bluray" (meaning if you bought BR movies and a BR player, there was no mystery, etc.) Had HD-DVD replaced every DVD printing with HD-DVD combo discs, people with DVD only could have begun buying them and then had an HD-DVD library already when they bought an HD TV and decided to upgrade their player.

[@ZulcanPrime]

I bought my first DVD Player in 2004. I remember the new HD DVDs were released in Australia but I used the wait-and-see approach when Bluray came out. I waited till 2010 when I bought a Bluray player. I won't upgrade my movies and series on DVDs and Blurays discs on 4K Bluray. I am happy with the two formats.

[@rollertoaster812]

Every time Matt says the company name "NME", the auto-generated caption says "enemy". 😆

[@Davej82]

Yeah, not very wise choice of name for this type of company (or any company at all) :D

[@nthgth]

Haha, that would work really well as a band name along the lines of XTC or XLNT

[@charliebrown1976]

I keep thinking of the monster company from the Kirby anime!

[@ebinrock]

This is why all videos should be manually captioned.

[@hurricane567]

Malibu Comics Ultraverse featured a villain called Nanotech Mechanized Entity.

[@MrFiver1111]

*HDDVD quits* HDVMD: We shall now take their place Sony: I don't even know you! HDVMD: What!! I've been compeeting for so long!

[@ZGryphon]

Having worked for several such companies back in the day (albeit in a different field, namely ISP-related stuff), I get the distinct feeling that NME was the kind of company that exists pretty much entirely to spend as much venture capital as possible.

[@RobCamp-rmc_0]

That’s the impression I got, NME seemed like a two-bit fly-by-night operation as all hell, jeesh.

[@VitorFM]

And It also sounds like money laundering

[@ZGryphon]

@@VitorFM Yes, that's what I meant.

[@UpLateGeek]

Interesting, back in the day I remember hearing rumours that a multi-layer DVD format with more than two layers was "on the way". Now I'm wondering if this was that format, or if it was whoever sold NME the concept that was trying to drum up interest.

[@Owyn_Merrilin]

For a while there every few years you'd hear about a holographic disc with three dimensional data storage on it. I wonder if all three of these are the same thing?

[@mabiniss2]

@@Owyn_Merrilin The closest I could find on wikipedia to what you mentioned was HVD which according to the wiki page was supposed to be even better than Blu-Ray with 100GB read only and 6TB of capacity. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holographic_Versatile_Disc

[@UncleDonut66]

It may have been FMD. I thought it was the future and bought stock. It never went anywhere. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluorescent_Multilayer_Disc

[@sm3dwnftwofficialsaveukrai289]

NME acquired DVD Forum's Multi-layer DVD, to build Versatile Multi-layer Disc, named VMD as HD VMD.

[@RobertK1993]

@@Owyn_Merrilin I rather SD or flash card/stick then another optical disc.

[@ManiacalForeigner]

Have you considered making a video on the VCDHD (Versatile Compact Disc High Density) format? Assuming you've even heard of the thing, that is, it's very obscure. It's noteworthy for being bendable to quite an extent without breaking or being damaged. Nifty.

[@gregmark1688]

I think what they were claiming was that a standard DVD reader would only see a front layer and read that as a standard disc, while the VMD reader would read the high-def version on the deeper layers. It is a fantastic idea, except for one flaw: the movie companies were of course fully intent on re-selling all their old catalog yet again.

[@TofumanFC3S]

Exactly, that’s what I was thinking. You’d have a “regular” DVD movie in layer one, but if you had a VMD player you could unlock, so to say, the HD version. Sounds great to me

[@hermanmunster3358]

That happens all the time. First with Vinyl, then 8Track, Cassette, CD, then SACD, and now we have digital downloads, the cheapest form of music and video reproduction, without ANY physical medium. And with Video formats, there have been countless iterations, such as Umatic, Beta, VHS, SVHS, HD VHS, Laser Disc, CDi, CD Video, DVD, HD DVD, BluRay, and also this VMD format. More formats than you can shake a stick at really.

[@mrchips23711]

And that ended up being an actual feature of HD-DVD, albeit a compromised one because you could only use 3 layers max unless it was double-sided.

[@donaloflynn]

What are you basing that assumption on? Surely if that's what they meant they would have stated it more explicitly? The discs Mat opened in Finder only had VMD files, nothing that a standard DVD player could read.

[@TofumanFC3S]

@@donaloflynn They also were only dual layer, not 20-layer. Obv. they made concessions to get to market. Original plans were likely to have both formats, why else tease backwards compatibility?

[@liamcinq]

The humour is so good, please never change 🙏 10:22 - I made a job out of it 👏

[@FranLab]

I would wager that those multi-layer optical discs have an HD_VMD version of the classic Laser-Rot, likely due to the adhesives used in the layering process attacking the substrate and making the disc unreadable.

[@1blisslife]

It's Fran again! Nice to see you here 😊

[@lamecasuelas2]

Channel crossover!!!!?

[@Warutteri]

@@lamecasuelas2 Oh THAT'S a collaboration I'd like to see, these two could make some great stuff together!

[@highpath4776]

can you see it under a microscope, I am feeling its more software changes

[@adamreid5901]

I had about 400 HD DVD’s that I picked up for couple of dollars each when the format failed, about half of them now have laser rot and are unplayable.

[@ChristopherHallett]

Wow, I'm impressed! Not just by the video, but also how on Earth did you get Bill Bailey to host the quiz night at your local?

[@simonnaughton2272]

Would be awesome if you could interview with someone from the engineering team from HD-VMD. Would be great to hear what they did when they changes codec etc.

[@iNerdier]

12:55 actually not so sure about that with the blue laser point, Sony I know for a while were losing money on PS3s specifically because the high wavelength optical parts were so costly to produce. Might be cheap now but certainly was a factor then.

[@Ranger_Kevin]

Great bit at the start :-D "Have you ever noticed that this pub looks like someone's house?" had me cracking up

[@DavysFlicks]

What makes this channel for me is Matt's humour. The "shoulda used the puppets here" line, adding the beard on to the old pic with a few MS Paint scribbles. Genius.

[@TheGramophoneGirl]

I thought he had used the puppets ;)

[@BlokeOzzie]

Dry British humor is the best.

[@paperdes]

"You know this bit would have been better with the puppets." I was wondering why you weren't using the puppets when this came up. I laughed and accidentally got orange juice in my nose. Ow, but funny.

[@Future_shpck]

It's so crazy that a random video about something I don't care about kept my attention. You've successfully summoned my inner nerd. I actually missed that guy.

[@MusicOnCassetteTape]

i am always impressed how many formats exist that i have NEVER heard off!

[@my3dviews]

I thought that I knew all of the shinny disk formats, but no, not after watching this video.

[@scaper8]

@@my3dviews Every time I think that I've at least heard of all of them, I find out about another. Or at least an improvement or change on one I did know about that is just different enough that a good case could be made for treating it as if it were a separate one. :-D

[@SelfIndulgentGamer]

The moment Microsoft announced that you had to buy the drive separately for the 360, was the moment HD DVD died. 🙂

[@spunker88]

Sony won the format war in large part because they included the ability to play Blu-ray on the PS3 which meant anyone buying the PS3 now had a Blu-ray player. If Microsoft had done the same with HD DVD and the Xbox 360 while also incentivizing OEMs to add HD DVD drives on Windows PCs, the format war may have ended differently.

[@SelfIndulgentGamer]

@@spunker88 Exactly, although Blu-Ray would have still ultimately won due to the massive abount of additional storage :)

[@alexatkin]

@@SelfIndulgentGamer I doubt it as once you have a huge market of people with players, which format is superior becomes irrelevant. Although despite buying into HD-DVD myself and it being the superior format in the early days (it had many features the early Bluray specs did not support), Bluray did keep getting revised to a point where it was vastly superior in the end. Apart from the most annoying aspect of Bluray, that titles using Java do not automatically remember where you left off and manufacturers can't be bothered to add it. Its an absolute curse combined with power saving regulations causing a paused player to turn off after a while, losing your place. Its the one thing I absolutely HATE about Bluray. But the quality is so much better than streaming.

[@SelfIndulgentGamer]

@@alexatkin NIce that you know your stuff :) To be honest, I still just rely on my DVD collection :D

[@SuperPickle15]

@@spunker88 i doubt the ps3 won them the format war. The ps3 came a year after the the 360, and it was more expensive. Sales were sluggish. You could got an xbox360 and the hd dvd drive for much less than a ps3. Nah, HD DVD was already on life support when the ps3 launched.

[@scottthemediahoarder]

You've elevated your art from demonstrative to performative. I don't even know if that's a thing, but bravo!

[@jaypadron6302]

Technically DVD had a few competitor platforms actually and they came from China; CVD, SVCD, and HQ-VCD. Reason being China attempted these formats was because their government was a tad worried that DVD was too regulated by foreign companies and that there was an opportunity to develop a domestic format that would be around the same technical specifications as DVD without the restrictions DVD made them abide to.

[@nthgth]

Interesting. Wonder why they were so worried while say Europe and Japan were just like "cool, DVD, yup let's go." Free market vs communists maybe.

[@ebinrock]

This is why Techmoan is Techmoan, and why I subscribe to him. He knows about stuff I've never heard of, and I thought I paid pretty good attention to the format wars. Keep up the great work!

[@bengarland]

I'm not even really into obscure forgotten technology, but I love this channel anyway and I frequently find myself watching the entire videos. Somehow Techmoan guy makes otherwise bland content seem immensely interesting. This channel should win some award for being the best of KZbin.

[@32mlucas]

HD-DVD helped push new advanced codecs and for Blu-Ray dual layer 50GB discs rather than 25MB, the format war had a positive effect on the eventual outcome

[@highpath4776]

Can you play hd dvd in a computer dvd drive?

[@32mlucas]

@@highpath4776 Not a standard computer DVD drive but both Toshiba and LG made internal HDDVD drives for computers, you can also use the external xbox 360 drive on a PC.

[@davasg96]

The first segment might be utter nonsense in the chapters, but it was hilariously entertaining!

[@janmelantu7490]

This video had me fluctuating wildly between “this is a total scam” and “this is a total technological achievement”

[@FrostMonolith]

0:48 even with no puppets this bit is absolutely golden. I watched to the end but restarted multiple time from the start just for this skit. Thank you for making them!

[@surrodox]

Very impressed on Techmoan's acting!

[@aarocka11]

The fact that LazyTown was one of the launch titles is kind of hilarious considering it’s now a giant meme. Looks like I will have to look out for this piece of “lost media” #ripStefánKaralStefánsson

[@AfferbeckBeats]

The whole VMD system seems like a dodgy scheme his character would have cooked up as he watches it fail badly

[@Snaily]

I'm sure I remember Lazytown having YTPs as early as 2008

[@Ynot101]

When your company is called NME but pronounced "Enemy" you're pretty much doomed 😭😭😭

[@butcharmstrong9645]

That's exactly what I thought too! NME = Enemy. NOT good.

[@hahasamian8010]

I think that's also the fictional company in the Kirby anime... NightMare Enterprises, if I recall correctly.

[@bsharpmajorscale]

You better get your players with a money-back guarantee!

[@SuperSmashDolls]

I need a player to clobber dat dere HD-DVD

[@stanagepole9633]

could sound worse, Enema

[@newphilmz3605]

I remember the Bluray vs HD DVD war like it was yesterday. I was considering getting an HD DVD player, and by the time I could decide, they were already gone from the market. I never heard of HD VMD, so it must have had a very limited release.

[@Carewolf]

Pretty sure it was yesterday

[@kyleflounder9783]

I think the biggest bomshell to me in this whole video was not that an alternative to HD-DVD existed, but that _LAZY TOWN WAS ICELANDIC?!?!_

[@JippaJ]

Can we just have an hour-long video of mildly funny Techmoan intro's? Really digging this.

[@ioioio13]

When the insomnia is in full swing and techmoan uploads, the sun rising doesn't seem as bad.

[@Thejebe]

I feel you man, same here

[@nathanmerritt1581]

Being there. stressful!

[@startedtech]

13:20 While this is somewhat anecdotal, I remember blue /violet (405nm) lasers used to be very expensive. A powerful blue laser pointer was a few hundred dollars IIRC, if not more. Cannibalizing a Blu-Ray player for it's laser used to be the best way to get one.

[@mjetektman9313]

It still is expensive

[@startedtech]

@@mjetektman9313 you can get dangerously powerful blue handheld lasers for $20 or so from china. High end lasers are still expensive ofc, as they always will be

[@mjetektman9313]

@@startedtech i know, I'm talking about the blu-ray drivers, here in my country the most affordable ones cost half a minimum wage and their prices can go as high as a minimum wage

[@PsRohrbaugh]

I found a "Wired" article from 2007 that estimated that the blue laser diode added $100 to the cost of the PS3 at launch. My memory was a number closer to $20, but either way it was definitely expensive hardware.

[@mrb692]

@@startedtech I wonder if those layers are rejects from the media players? Like the good ones go into a player, and one that emits wrong or whatever goes into a pointer

[@kevinjokipii4260]

23:45 makes more sense than any actual episode of LazyTown that my kids ever watched.

[@loturzelrestaurant]

Hi. I ask around to see if someone would be interested in a lil Project of mine. Some people try to be the 180 Degree Opposite of Cancel-Culture and try to help KZbin become less... well, lets say 'Messy' to use nice words only... Interested to hear a bit more?

[@GamesNTech]

You got me with "You know this bit would have been better with the puppets." Have a great day!

[@raymondpenn1066]

The only thing you didn't mention was encryption. As I recall, the different movie studios all insisted that the encryption systems employed were supposed to be harder to crack (they weren't but that's for another video). I would wonder what encryption NME employed. That would probably go a long way to explain why standalone media players, like VLC, would just fail.

[@userPrehistoricman]

I think VLC can't read it because the discs are corrupt - same as the player.

[@LiEnby]

it mentioned AACS and AES on the website shown in the video

[@userPrehistoricman]

@Velzek How do you know there aren't any errors?

[@wright96d]

@@userPrehistoricman Well I think it's safe to say the working LazyTown DVDs would've had no errors.

[@userPrehistoricman]

@@wright96d We're talking about the other discs.

[@Tecstar70]

First two minutes are pure gold! Pure gold I say!!

[@luisclaudiofugolin6250]

26:20 No it didn't! This video is very interesting, I really liked the pub scene, you should do more of this (still missing the puppets, though) but I think this video needs a part 2 to find real VMD discs and their proper VMD readers WITH THE FRIGGING RED LASER in it! The impression I've got from the video is that HD-VMD ended up looking like a scam, promising a whole new hardware technology where there was none.

[@PM9Video]

Inspired by all of the taking things apart on this channel, I had a go at my old DVD player - and fixed it! Thanks for giving me the confidence to try. It was very satisfying.

[@FezTheSpaceBiker]

To be honest, Microsoft's backing of HD-DVD was half-hearted at best, likely because they were more invested in digital distribution and that was honestly a smart call.

[@krald8421]

@@Andersljungberg vs the blu ray player being built into the ps3 , no wonder it succeeded

[@Peterraawwrr]

I think part of it was just not backing what Sony was, especially when looking at the Xbox 360 HD-DVD add on

[@pistachiodisguisey911]

The 360 was crazy for renting movies back then especially if u didn’t pay for on demand

[@thedarksideoftheforce6658]

@@krald8421 Sony owns Blu ray and let's Ms use it

[@Henrex2000]

Microsoft was trying to sabotage the whole physical media market as a whole by fueling the format war

[@petesmith4498]

Feels like a pilot for a sitcom. "The Pub Quiz"

[@MrKletch]

I'd watch the crap out of it!!

[@TheUlitamateStunt]

The greediness involved in the HD format war is happening again with H.264's replacement into H.265 vs AV1. It's just sad.

[@Carewolf]

Not really.. There is one greedy update to H.264 called H.265 and one revolt against it called AV1 which is free.

[@jonasthemovie]

As much as I miss the puppets, this skit was lovely.

[@BrianRRenfro]

I always wait and hope the "Unfunny Annoying Puppets" will be back one day. Maybe it is the Gen-X in me but I usually found them snarkily hilarious!

[@jefgirdler7232]

I wish I was half as good at making the absolute most trivial stuff of tech history captivatingly interesting as you are. Also that bit at the beginning was great.

[@nickcurrier1546]

Didn't realize you faced so many challenges but your videos are absolutely awesome man. I'm far from tech savvy but im a history/documentary fiend and am interested in basically anything I don't already know and your channel is one of my absolute favorites! Wishing you the best sir!

[@RegebroRepairs]

Must be a good pub, since Bill Bailey does quizzes there.

[@joshuarosen6242]

Curses, you beat me to it.

[@joshleafjl1]

@@joshuarosen6242 I also gave you a like for the same Thought, and the great name👍

[@PavelUrusov]

The introduction is a true masterpiece!

[@batterieman3001]

Really happy to see you uploading so frequently in the past months! A 35 min Techmoan video is always a welcome surprise, feels more like a 5 min one to be honest. And loving your sketches, this one had me cracking up again.

[@davidewhite69]

I remember Australia's channel nine taking out a full page ad (the ad was pretending to be a review) in an Australian newspaper (that was also owned by Kerry Packer) that glamorised this format. as for the cost savings, they were severely mistaken, the most expensive parts would be the HD decoding and rendering circuitry

[@loturzelrestaurant]

Hi. I ask around to see if someone would be interested in a lil Project of mine. Some people try to be the 180 Degree Opposite of Cancel-Culture and try to help KZbin become less... well, lets say 'Messy' to use nice words only... ... Interested to hear a bit more?

[@shodan2958]

Interesting video about a forgotten format and a interesting note about the HD format war too. Sure streaming took over in the end for many but I think the collectors market and ultra high quality fanatics stayed around and is what keeps it afloat. If anything I think the war was ultimately a battle to decide what format Criterion style releases would be on in the future.

[@SteveC86]

“This bit would have been better with the puppets.” Haha, Mat you are a lovely chap, wish I could be your friend.

[@simonsaysrewind]

Love this comment.. must be nice for those who are lucky to be his pal.

[@tomokokuroki2506]

"unfortunately, it's Lazytown" No issues there.

[@bmhater1283]

WE ARE NUMBER ONE

[@ReyMysterioX]

The intro is one of the most hilarious things I've seen in a while…

[@bobblum5973]

To watch those HD-VMD discs you need a player that supports the correct region they were made for: Lazy Town!

[@alangriffin8146]

Late to the party, but I LOVE these format videos. Your presenting style is perfect for this kind of thing. And I always like your silly skits.

[@whomee2]

This skit is great! Loved it! Hope you feel inspired to do more like this!

[@6581punk]

Real ale :)

[@MildMisanthropeMaybeMassive]

It would have been better with the puppets.

[@keith_5584]

0:31 I don’t think that wig gives James May enough credit.

[@karlramberg]

Blue lasers were extremely expensive when they first came out. Not sure about the price in 2006-2007.

[@GenGamesUniverse]

If you take the prices of PS3s when they were released, it'd be the same price as a blu ray player back then. I remember blu ray players being hundreds of pounds in cost (which is why I never managed to get one until a few years ago lol) and thus I would always rely on either a) DVD films coming out that were cheap and easy to get or b) burn your own films (remember that? XD) to a blank DVD and hope to god that it worked on your DVD player.

[@1freedlander]

Thanks for your thoroughness and curiosity, and persistence to figure things out. So fascinating to watch. Rudolph

[@nicospanatos6605]

Sooooo Cool !!! You are not only a cool technerd, but also have a lot of humor! Great !! thanks from bavaria for this very nice and special episode ;)

[@AndrewFremantle]

I'm really curious if that Asus DVD-R drive in the HD-VMD player had custom firmware on it? If so, might be worth finding someplace online to dump that firmware to so others can experiment with it.

[@noahnewman5413]

Can we appreciate the time stamps: “utter nonsense” and “moving on”

[@DangerousDevilOfficial]

Had this tech launched 2-3 years earlier, it may have actually met some level of success.

[@anononomous]

I'm assuming they actually got physical VMD discs working at all and it didn't just end up being high compression HD video files on a normal dual layer disc that the players were designed to decode?

[@alanmooremobile]

Yeah that's what I thought.. I reckon that copy of 'Saw' is HD compressed to 4GB

[@Knaeckebrotsaege]

@@alanmooremobile Might be a dual layer DVD and it's just 720p to make the entire thing fit onto one disc. I mean... no one said the whole format is 1080p-only right? Plus they could've still called it HD at 720p. Would've been very scummy but technically not wrong...

[@Errcyco]

I’ll never forget going to a family event and one of my cousins husbands worked for Bose. This was right when they were blowing up in the mid 90s. I don’t remember exactly what year it was but he had a DVD player and a big screen he wanted to show off. I’ll never forget that massive brushed metal unit. Had like two buttons and was crazy loud. The first two or three tries it wouldn’t play. When he finally got it we were all kinda amazed. That was really neat. I didn’t even see another one for a very long time.

[@mwsoft669]

For me it's obvious, that they always used standard 2 layer DVD + modified Chinese DVD players with HD MPEG decoder. Probably that "Saw" release on single disc just uses lower bitrate.

[@binba9]

Exactly what I came here to say

[@cohort6159]

Chinese were masters of low bitrate media. My spouse brought back some bootleg DVDs from China that had a dozen movies on each one.

[@Formulka]

Still mad respect for actually making the product itself.

[@turrican4d599]

18:00 William Riker's heart was pounding, when he saw the opportunity, to get Lazy Town in HD!

[@daapz]

I haven't looked into the specs, but the bit about it being compatible with a standard DVD player made me wonder if the propeller heads had something similar to some SACD's compatibility with CD players and the suits upstairs just ran with it without understanding the technical mumbo-jumbo. The players themselves looked extremely cheap. Thinking back when BR disks appeared, all the players in the first wave had this high-end feel to them. The production version for this format looked like a discount DVD player from Lidl.

[@RabbitEarsCh]

Lovely skit. Please never stop making them, I adore them every time. Great research work as always!