The Hermes Birkin Lawsuit Disaster: Judge Calls Out BIG Legal Mistakes!

[@ritatheviolinist]

@Dacob, I am an antitrust lawyer, and your description of “tying” theory of antitrust violation is exactly right. “Tying” is an antitrust violation only if it harms competition. Otherwise tying is perfectly legal. For example, if I have 10 acres of land, I can legally insist that I will only sell to a buyer who buys all 10 acres and refuse to sell to any buyer who only wants to buy 1 acre or 3 acres. The plaintiffs’ lawyer in this case don’t know what they are doing.

[@deborahcurtis1385]

In law everything comes down to the facts, as we both know. The issues will depend on how they can be tied to the terms of the legislation, which will vary in relevant countries. No doubt this is why Hermès house 'rules' will vary in particular about what they are prepared to state to a client. In some countries Hermès staff will explicitly state you must buy a certain $ amount and in others there will be only gentle suggestions made. Not wanting a Birkin is a liberating thing.

[@algebraist1997]

I've wanted to ask, if you recall the Microsoft anti-trust case... There they basically hindered the installation of software from other companies, specifically say, a browser if you didn't want to use Internet Explorer. With this mind, I thought it wasn't anti-trust because it's their prerogative as the designers of the system and a user can opt to use another operating system. However, there is the added detail that Windows comes pre-installed on many computers and so the user who wants the computer hasn't necessarily chosen Windows over another operating system. Is this the crux of the anti-trust argument there, and would the argument be non-existent then if Windows didn't come pre-installed?

[@DelvecchioRussin]

I'm researching mini bags and am a little hesitant about whether to go with a square or rectangular mini bag. But I prefer the square ones, I think mini bags are cuter and more suitable for casual styles, but small bags can also play this role, my dream Chanel bag is a small tweed bag. While Chanel leather bags are common, tweed bags are even rarer.

[@AFAskygoddess]

I bought a classic Chanel black caviar leather handbag many years ago. It still looks great because I rarely use it. I soon discovered that when you carry around a bag costing thousands of dollars, you attract attention from unsavory people who think you have thousands of dollars inside that bag. A Birkin bag SCREAMS "STEAL ME!". In these days of high crime, the last thing I'd do is to fight in court to be able to buy a handbag the price of a nice car.

[@mothra__13]

If someone could afford to want to buy a Birkin, you'd think they would be able to afford to hire more competent lawyers.

[@joyLoveC]

I never thought there was a case to begin with, and the judge said it right - it is a luxury good. People can choose not to buy it! Now, if it was an essential good and the only company that is selling it tells you that you must buy a bunch of other stuff from them before they will sell it to you, then it’s a different story because you don’t have a choice to walk away.

[@DMCM84]

The company should be transparent with an online system where both client and staff can see the total dollar amount spent and once they reach that quota amount they’ll be notified that they’re next in line to get a bag.

[@ericp1139]

There is no “line” or “quota.” They’ll invite you whenever they feel like it.

[@DMCM84]

@@ericp1139 - hence the lawsuit which is the topic at hand. FOCUS!

[@ericp1139]

@@DMCM84 lawsuit which is failing…as described in the video…

[@DMCM84]

@@ericp1139 - hence my original suggestion to prevent future lawsuits. Why are you being argumentative?

[@ericp1139]

@@DMCM84 you came at me first. Don’t start nuthin, ain’t be nuthin.

[@ladyharriet4136]

The preloved market selling Hermes Birkins,Kelly, Constance are struggling to sell these bags. Some are brand new, even less than retail, still no one is buying. Honestly, they can buy loads in any colour, any leather choices by saving money hiring these less than useless lawyers. 😅😅 So embarrassing. 🙈 By the way, I noticed the Hermes SAs are getting worse in Hermes, I saw customers are chatting and meeting others there, while the SAs are chatting among themselves ignoring these customers. It felt cheap (like a coffee shop with no coffee). Definitely no forcing me to shop there, thanks!

[@tizi2003]

But this is exactly the issue! We all know that if you want say a Birkin you really don't want anything else and you are not going to shop anywhere else! And we all know how Hermes operates. BUT...they are a public company with shareholders that they responsible for. I would change it to anti trust to old plain discrimination.

[@hankypanda]

I agree. The fact that you have to find an SA who is nice to you, or spend more than 10k on other items is discriminatory, but people roll their eyes because they think a person who wants a $13k bag without being expected to jump through hoops or prove themselves in some way, or at least not be lied to about inventory or how to proceed to buy one is “spoiled” “entitled” etc. and “no one feels sorry for them.” Hermes does this with their non-quota bags too, so sometimes it’s a $2200 bag they’re gatekeeping from customers who aren’t as lucky or haven’t proven themselves rich. There are influencers who look presentable and ask politely and buy a couple of things in hopes, but they’re still told they don’t have bags to sell. Also, I don’t think it’s fair to push customers to buy from resellers who increase the price and you have to wonder if the bag is authentic. it just sucks bc Hermes did not have this reputation before and it’s frustrating to be treated this way, where you just keep getting told there are no bags, they won’t tell you over phone, the stores will claim they don’t take appointments, they won’t offer to track one down for you bc they “don’t get many”. It’s a lot of shenanigans even if “perfectly legal and pro-capitalistic” or whatever.

[@OrangeIsTheNewBag]

@@hankypandaHermes has always been like this. The change is the sudden influx of demands due to social media.

[@chrisjone7555]

Congratulations on 70K Dacob.

[@landcraftwellness9850]

Woo hoo! So happy to see you reached 70K!

[@jamesallenraynes]

The lawyers should be sanctioned for such a blatant frivolous lawsuit. If Hermès. Doesn’t want “Karen” to have a bag. It’s their right to dangle their other items in her face all day, all the while still giving her false hope that one day she might get the opportunity to purchase one, while knowing that they will never see her one. I’m loving it.

[@pasitheathanatosasmr488]

I love “modus operandi”😄 we say it all the time in our household for like the plan of the day casual stuff loll

[@Nat11884]

There is no case. Maybe if they can prove their SA lied to them by saying that the only way to buy “x” they must purchase “z”, but then never allow them to purchase “x”… maybe just maybe they would have a case. But we all know this is an unwritten rule with Hermes. So almost impossible to prove in a court of law.

[@891Henry]

If you are wealthy enough to buy a Birkin, just go ahead and buy the silly belt. Rich people's problems.

[@AFAskygoddess]

Exactly. Then they'd gift the belt to a client for Christmas and write the belt purchase off on their taxes. 🤣

[@lillygirl7238]

Well said, Dacob!

[@SuperDacob]

Thank you lillygirl 🥰💖

[@tarreemhacaruso2687]

The linked selling is what the crux of the case should be about. If you require a certain amount of spending before a person can purchase a Birkin or Kelly where is that legal ? Does rise to the level of Antitrust? Not sure but it surely isn’t legal either.

[@michelinep1892]

I would also like to point out that Hermès faces numerous counterfeit attempts, and this is another reason why the brand takes measures to protect itself. They are determined to prevent their products from becoming mass-produced items.

[@seabreeze4559]

look secondhand, they already are resellers create fake demand

[@mslml6949]

I think it’s a good case they just need to show their injury. Hermes is making it a requirement to buy other Hermes goods to have the opportunity to buy a bag. Which locks the customer in just to have the opportunity.

[@JJ2222W]

If you don’t like how Hermes does their business- do not support them- and Hermes does not have a monopoly on the luxury bag market.

[@pasitheathanatosasmr488]

Makes sense!

[@melissaleslie7755]

Very simple. Have Hermes show proof a customer was able to purchase a BKC only. No other item purchased. Only the handbag.

[@bnb0510]

I would agree that it’s the end of luxury for the poor to middle class. Not for the rich/wealthy though.

[@Ashanti_flower24]

I agree

[@hallmark4]

As an attorney, I would not have taken the case.

[@OrangeIsTheNewBag]

For some reason I thought the attorneys are the buyers. I don’t know why I think that.

[@DBhhgff-bq4qc]

70k now ❤️

[@Mariathinking]

Handbags are luxury goods, and not a necessity like medication - any company should be allowed to use whatever selling model they want for their luxury products. Thats capitalism baby. Hermes doesnt have a monopoly on the handbag market at all, there are hundreds of luxury bag brands avaliable in infinite styles and price ranges. If i was running a luxury company I wouldnt want just any customer to make demands of my workers. The whole thing is ridiculous and a waste of court time, there are other companies that could do with getting sued like american insulin dealers. I wouldnt be suprised if some of the people sueing were just nasty customers who were turned down for being obnoxious.

[@NicolePapincak]

OOF the secondhand embarrassment chiiiiiii!!!

[@SuperDacob]

Totally. I felt it too through the text alone… hahahah 😩😩😩💖

[@seabreeze4559]

If Hermes can discriminate, luxury brands are being held above the law, so can luxury hotels.... consider that...... consider the people they could BAN.....

[@DebShops-e3v]

It’s the “link selling” that is the real issue not the anti trust…even I with no legal background figured that out…It was never anti trust…..jeez….but with all the grammatical errors in their brief I figured those attorney were over their heads. The linked selling is illegal.

[@mslachimolala6430]

Yes, the forced bundling of goods (the belt etc with the birkin) is illegal. A certain IT giant was fined millions many years ago for such behaviour. The only difference is that the purchases involved in the forced bundling takes place over a period of time during which customers have to build a purchase history.

[@OrangeIsTheNewBag]

@@mslachimolala6430Someone was saying the issue with Microsoft is that their software is pre-installed in all computers. Except Mac.

[@shikmabonfil286]

No client was pushed to buy , but the client knew if he won’t buy the belt he won’t get the Birkin 🙃 I know it’s a rich world problem but they do have a point and there’s nothing they can do about it that’s what so annoying

[@seabreeze4559]

coercion vitiates consent

[@cordulam]

They don't have a case, their complaints are just childish. Hermés produces a small amount of their bags and sell worldwide in many countries. Of course they sell them only to good customers.

[@carlahaiduk1878]

It's hard to prove there ua a hermes journey, because there are people who just buy birkins without a previous shopping history at Hermes. The argument that Hermes can produce only 5 bags a year and charge a million for each is hilarious and true. Also, the plaintiffs can buy an Hermes bag on the second hand market. It's hard to prove that Hermes didn't sell those people a bag because of discrimination.

[@TheRealFeechLaManna]

I never understood how they had a case, and indeed it seems they do not. But atleast a bit more public spotlight is being cast on the shady business of socalled luxury. Why anyone would pay thousands upon thousands for a boring grandma bag that surely cost less than 1K to produce is beyond me anyway.

[@marvinjuliusmag-aso1137]

It is not even 500usd to make

[@sheonlydances]

@@marvinjuliusmag-aso1137This is inaccurate. The bags are hand made and it takes up to 5 days for artisans to make a Birkin. Only for labor Hermès pays about 2000 euros monthly per person. Then you have the skin artisans, who inspect, dye the leathers, for the exotic animals there are additional costs.

[@OrangeIsTheNewBag]

@@marvinjuliusmag-aso1137That amount would only cover a week’s wage I think. Minimum wage in France I believe is about $1700 or so a month.

[@OrangeIsTheNewBag]

@@sheonlydancesIs it true they their artisans no longer build one bag from start to finish these days?

[@mslml6949]

Judge is requiring them to spell out the damage. It’s cock blocking.

[@ItsTheBaroness]

It’s a private business. They should be able to sell as they please and if people don’t like it, they shouldn’t buy.

[@tizi2003]

But Hermes is NOT a private business as their stock sells on the European stock market and as such it must respond to their stockholders!

[@ItsTheBaroness]

@@tizi2003 correct, but when I say private business, I mean it is not government owned, therefore not subject to the same regulation as a government product.

[@corikay]

I’d hire new lawyers!!!!!!😳😆

[@seabreeze4559]

simple it was coercion across categories, I don't need to buy a prada belt to get a hermes sushi plate, do I? That is anti-trust for the items being gatekept.

[@cristinadaley8553]

I can see in feel years ahead lots change with this brand . At the end the game it’s not about the super rich buying it’s the people following the stupid game. When the large amount people buying we see what rest for the birkin and Kelly. I can imagine people get on 2nd hand and the Hermes will try to stop this company’s not to selling their products. That’s will be game over …

[@lilylife4426]

They need proof Hermes SA's told them they would sell them a bag after they purchased all the other stuff. Without that proof, it's he said she said. And we can already see who has a better legal team, allegedly.

[@tarreemhacaruso2687]

One of the plaintiffs has text messages

[@arribaficationwineho32]

Oh go buy a decent knock off and move along. There are no legal grounds here

[@pauldean8072]

Rolex do the same

[@OrangeIsTheNewBag]

They didn’t use to.

[@cristinadaley8553]

I bet Hermes give to him free expensive bag to his wife or lover . Because it’s shame what the brand doing with people like the casinos online . It’s a shame . I hope people listen and be smart stop try to get this bags at end not cost of the money and game they played. The people need to be opening their eyes and mind to see how BS it’s this company. Greed and corruption.

[@Ashanti_flower24]

Hermes don’t give out free bags

[@denisadellinger]

This is totally off. Definitely not what they want to say

[@Daria-bg3ds]

Interesting. If the judge wasn't sympathetic, wouldn't he just throw out the case? Why give them a second change to resubmit?

[@tarreemhacaruso2687]

To show that they aren’t bias. They do this I alot of cases

[@greenfash6328]

how embarrassing , they should have watch judge Judy. LOL

[@DenmarkScandinavia123]

💟

[@lauralangham9657]

9/29 - you are at 70k !

[@GOPMichael1]

there’s nothing they can do in the american legal system. hermes is allowed to set the stipulations on the purchase of their products. if you don’t like it, shop elsewhere.