The Isle | Why is V3 so bad?

[@XZaguer]

Yes i know, "buy a new microphone", I'm poor ok? xd

[@tacokn1ght600]

Your content is still amazing nonetheless :D

[@marsasafe2338]

lol

[@galkepic9229]

There is always that one guy that comments it lol. They should offer to buy you one

[@spite949]

Ay bro I'm here with you (poor gang rise up)

[@spite949]

We definitely need a video like dis when the map rework comes in update 4

[@K8theKind]

I think Dondi has been making these maps himself without any understanding of geology or functionality in biospheres either irl or in a cooperative multiplayer, pvp survival video game. But they have someone new on the team reworking the maps and biospheres and they have several people populating the map with appropriate vegetation, etc… So hopefully all of your very good points will be addressed and the next Evrima map we get will be far improved.

[@xemiii]

considering the map we have now being only part of a larger one(along with it just being poorly-designed), it doesn't look like the future is too far from the past

[@troythedeconstructionist1382]

The problem was never "appropriate vegetation" is that a joke roflmao? How naive and gullible can a person be.

[@Evrimomono]

You really connected with me there when you said that aviary attracts new players only for them to find its just empty. This is exactly what I've done when i first saw it. I was like "hmmm interesting.." I thought flyers were there, i thought inside that, there was another ecosystem that has its own food chain, but nope, it was literally just...nothing What I was expecting from this game was some scenarios like finding a trike herd, roaming in the forest, or by just sheer luck, coming across a nesting area of diablos. But what i got was a game with fixed locations for herbivores and naturally, carnivores. I hate being forced to roam in a certain area to not to starve, as a rex or giga, if you don't hang out in one of those hot-spots(lest be fair, great falls mostly) you die. I hope diet system will change this in Evrima

[@mr.ajmeister5244]

this video was worth the wait and actively also addresses the problems i have with v3 although im a lil shocked you didnt mention BoB once during the biome part

[@XZaguer]

you are right. Out of the 3 games, BoB is the one that does biomes the best. The reason I didnt mention it was because I wanted to emphasise what the isle did wrong and how we could solve it, instead of simply showing that BoB did it better

[@karenboy1005]

A discussion video on Path of Titans in this style would be pretty cool to see if you ever have the time. There are LOTS of issues worth talking about in that game.

[@mojolmao1752]

that "game"

[@slayer4932]

@@brassbeast8582 as if the isle is a "game" either.6 years later and its still the same early access tech demo with no mechanics of any kind. This walking simulator rp genre needs to die.

[@Supersaurus4]

I couldn’t stand this map because of how big it is. I could never find any players to hunt as a carnivore, I mostly just hunted AI. Plus I couldn’t find any players to herd with as a herbivore. Not only that, but I grew tired of groups and just decided to be solitary, since that allowed me to keep a low profile.

[@mrbeardmTV]

V3 is the perfect size for a map. It's suppose to be a vast open world. Survival must be hard. Plus, if you know the map, it wouldn't be hard at all. The isle is suppose to be challenging and hard. Those who can't survive shall die.

[@scrap5407]

@@mrbeardmTV yeah

[@mojolmao1752]

@@mrbeardmTV bro I know hte map easy and its too big, seems like someone completely ignored everything in the video

[@mrbeardmTV]

@@mojolmao1752 Do I have to agree with everything in the video now?

[@mojolmao1752]

@@mrbeardmTV if you make no good counter arguments, yes

[@NicoVH1]

Really nice video! you didn't just complain, but you actually gave ideas and pointed what's wrong and what could be better. its really weird how the 2017-18 v3 map had way more diversity in biomes, and even places with similar biomes where more unique. (not even mentioning v4, that despite having some really bad map design choices was my fav map and had some amazing diversity)

[@tregrenos8615]

Given the current play-area of Isle Spiro I don’t expect to see any huge tonal shifts between the Biomes as that just wouldn’t seem realistic. Beach, Plains, Swamp, Jungle, Mountain and the Underwater atmosphere are the current Biomes on Spiro and they’re all we honestly have room for at the moment. After seeing Jaces work I’m really looking forward to the update. The current Mountains seem to only interact with the rivers around the middle of the map, but the updated Beaches showcased feature the stoney elevated cliffs and caves that make the Beach seem more unique while also leading players heading toward the Beaches to general locations rather than randomly anywhere around the ring of the map. Based on what I’d seen of the updated Beaches, if 2 players were on the same general side of the map and heading toward the portion of the Beach with the easiest access then chances are they’ll run into each other at some point. As for the Hotspots, I’m looking forward to that massive docking yard they’re currently working on. Even if there’s nothing much to sustain me there it’d still be a cool place to explore and host events.

[@Kokogata]

I just discovered your channel and I'm in love with it. I especially like your concept art analysis videos. You deserve more subs

[@XZaguer]

Thank you 🙂 I really appreciate your compliments, hope you keep enjoying my content in the future

[@YStardust26]

The Diat System is propaply a good solustion! If you make some plants you can only eat as one specias at one place and other at other places, you can split hebis into Different areas. Carni's will know where you can find diffrent specias of hebis, so they can hunt the size of pray they can handle. But they need to make hebis more enjoyable to play..

[@benanders4412]

You make some good points. I'm new to the game. Only played it for 4 days. I,m not that knowledgeable about the game itself yet. I do have some experience in map/game design however. Some basic ideas: #1 Roads Make AI migrate from one place to another instead of randomly spawn around players. These traffic routes can also be shown on the ground texture forming natural "roads". This will encourage carnivores to follow and hunt around these roads for AI and players. And larger herbivores can use them for easy movement and navigation. And very much like our real life road networks, introduce a road hierarchy. With one or two highways {could be rivers} leading towards the maps larger landmarks that can be seen from almost everywhere, making navigation and orientation easier. {they tried doing this with the dome structure, but failed to give it any other functionality or bigger meaning} These highways are then connected by "collector roads", the paths created by traveling AI from the highway {river} and land marks towards each biome. These can be shown by mud and barren landscape texture on the ground, giving the idea that large herds have traveled there regularly. And smaller travel paths connecting the collectors with points of interest within each biome. #2 Biomes Biomes can represent the ideal nesting ground for the different types of Dino's. Giving them a natural territory. The spawn points can also be in these nesting areas. Naturally separating species when they fresh spawn. Giving them a short start up time when they are relatively safe the first moments of a new life. Because the species defending the home territory won't have to travel to the other side of the map when they re-spawn after death. This also helps with immersion, as Dino's normally are not born alone on the beach but with their own kind. And it will reduce unnatural mix-packing. Grown animals can be guided away from these nesting grounds towards more abundant food and water sources in the middle of the map. Forcing them to "leave the nest". And guided back because of the ideal nesting ground and protection for their young, forcing them to travel between the two. Although there should always be at least two alternative routes towards the same goal. And there should always be at least two possible spawn points to avoid one being overtaken and camped. #3 Advantage Each species should have an area where they have the home field advantage. Preferably the home biome and nesting ground. Think about obstacles that are hard to navigate by larger animals, but offer easy escape routes and hiding places for smaller ones. Or cliffs that allow agile animals to cross them but not by others. Deep water that can be easily crossed by some, but not others. Etc. #4 Risk and reward. The most risky areas should also offer the greatest reward. Places where players know they have a certainty of food and water, but that are also the most contested. Nobody should be starving not knowing where they could find food. They should be forced to way the risk of trying to survive on scraps with the possibility of starving or dehydration. Or take a risk and go for a higher reward area with the chance of being eaten themselves. This can also encourage teamwork and herd mentality. Large herds might be able to make a trip to the center of the map/landmarks and eat their fill. While solo's, smaller herds and more cautious players might go to a more mid tier area to feed. #5 Hunger and thirst/day and night/sleep There should be a re-balance of hunger and thirst. Grown animals should take a lot more to fill themselves, but should also have more reserves when they regularly do. Giving them time to travel back to the nesting area, birth their young, and have some spare time before being forced back to the more risky area's of the map. This encourages travel between food/water and safety. There should also be a sleep mechanic in place. This will open up more possibilities for day and night game play. Where some species might be more adapted to see, hunt and travel in the night. While others will be more likely to seek shelter and sleep. Giving more diversity between the species. #6 Tracking. There should be more possible ways to track players, and avoid being tracked. This capability might also be different for different species, giving some better smell or eye sight. Dino droppings might also be a thing. And footprints and smell can be avoided by traveling on hard rock or in water. Footprints and smell might also wash away by rain and fade by time instead of de-spawning after a short time without good reason. #7 Rain and water pools Rain might fill up smaller water pools that slowly drain. This can solve problems for younger animals not being able to really travel outside their nesting area. Enough to sustain newborns, but not adults. And create mid tier area's that can only sustain a smaller group of adults for a limited time. It can also be used to trigger new growth in plants that have been eaten. Some sort of hidden map reset. #8 Dead bodies Death bodies should rot away over a longer time period instead of magically de-spawn. It's more immersive and gives others the opportunity to contest the body. The smell of the body should also increase over time. Making it more likely to attract other carnivores from farther away as time goes by. Dead bodies should also have multiple stages of decomposition. And might be different depending on the way it was killed Making it possible to tell how long ago the kill was made more or less, helping others to track the possible killer. Increasing competition between different carnivores. #9 Team mechanic. A team mechanic that limits the possibilities of mix-packing might also be an option to increase immersion. A T-Rex should not hunt in large packs filled with other carnivores. #10 Breeding. There should be a male and female to be able to mate. #11 Transport food and feeding young. There should be a mechanic to realistically transport some types of food and feed the newborns. And also to eat in a more safe location than that the kill was made. This again will encourage travel by the parents between food sources and the nesting area. While others species might be forced to take their young with them after birth because they can't transport food for them. Giving more diversity between the species. Long list, hope you guys like the suggestions.

[@Yami_Soryu]

I hate how v3 doesn't feel like an 'island', it doesn't feel like a natural landmass, unlike v2 and Thenyaw. I love Thenyaw but I have no clue why the community just abandoned the map.

[@Rexz2000]

Dondi Try Not To Make A Bad Map Challenge

[@eyes5204]

(impossible)

[@gajspalt]

Good vid! Another reason I hope the Devs will release a specialized Devkit similar to Skyrim so we can make our own maps.

[@oliverstianhugaas7493]

Related to this i want to tell how a good RTS map is made, it has *THREE* people on it that have specific tasks. First makes the map itself and the landscape, the next one makes human settlements and the last one populates the map with signs of life. This is how the original COH maps were made if i remember correctly.

[@xemiii]

natural guides in the map showing where to go is why my main stomping ground was the rivers between twins and dock. There were still areas inbetween without water, but they were close enough for me to remember the path. regardless, I often roamed alone for hours at a time, often getting lost in the trees if I tried to diverge from the rivers too much. Its amazing how bad this game's maps have been, or how they ruin maps if they are fun. I loved old thenyaw, but they covered the plains with dense forests and removed major landmarks like party pool. Makes you wonder what their priorities are on how they want players to be dispersed.

[@chaoticcatartist]

Their are good parts like haveing recognizable landmarks but thats it. At least its not as bad as path of titains that map is so unessercarily big i legit cant find anyone and will spend half my time just trying to find others (rvrn yho the map is pretty. And no the providence of a visible map doesnt help haveing to walk ages to go to a hotspot) Edit: OOP YOU MENTIONED IT

[@XZaguer]

Ahaha it's okay xd

[@vcamv2354]

The map was designed, iirc to sustain up to 200 players normaly, so for now, where the limit is 100, it definetly is a very gigantic map, and some areas are basically a pure desert where we'll find no one. But we have to remember this as well, the mao was not designed to have this low amount of players, and instead of making a bunch of maps, they just made this one great, so it can be fully appreciated when it get's update to be able to sustain the amount of players ot was designed tl

[@edulucifer]

although i understand the problems with the map, i wouldnt expect much about Biomes from a map that is suposed to be just a "tropical" island, its basically just a small island, with just 1 biome in it, which kinda makes sense, otherwise you would have something like beasts of bermuda that have, forests, swamps, deserts and snow mountains all in the same little space. which comes to the point, is is The "Isle", which brings the question, how many biomes are possible to make in a specific size of map before it gets too nonsense?

[@gajspalt]

It's sandbox vs amusement park. MH doesn't focus on having big maps, because they make them dense and more vertical. Focusing more attention on the monsters, hunters and the hunt, and they do it fantastically.

[@nymeriagloves3957]

maybe v3 could be better but compared to spiro it seems amazing to me. on v3 i could actually tell where im at. see where other areas are that i could go to. i could see my own dinosour instead of bushes. ect.

[@Nana-sc6mj]

I know folks are saying that it’s “realistic” for evrima to not have biomes. But I think that’s a pretty pointless idea that fans have regarding the fact that the isle is never about realism. Yes it wouldn’t make sense to see multiple biomes on an island. But it also wouldn’t make sense to see human buildings when half the roster isn’t in yet. While I’m glad they have new artists for separate things it seems they can never get priorities in a good state. Realism and fun don’t always go together and I think such a large map would actually benefit from biomes. It’s already lacking landmarks and hard to navigate, it also doesn’t help that we don’t get much dev blogs on level design itself and I think it would be very cool. I see a pattern with both spiro and v3 and that it’s just completely clouded with foliage for no good reason even after hearing feedback that maps don’t have to be large and clouded. I think a lot of people are forgetting that spiro is and was done by dondi. Even with the new level designer, you can still see dondis amount of work and pattern there. What doesn’t make sense is how they remade thenyaw and shown it off so much and then it vanished. We need smaller maps, not maps so large with little player count and hardly any if at all, AI. People want to claim Evrima is so much better and the updated version but 6-7 years in and the patterns are still the same to me. Maybe I’ll pick the game back up in update 4 but I’m not counting on it. Maybe in another year that mysterious memory leak will be gone. People are free to like or dislike, but I genuinely don’t get how people who point out problems with videos made on legacy when patterns of problem still reside in the “updated” game.

[@thunderclanwarrior1253]

I miss V2 so badly 😭 It was the map I had the most hours on, I think, and definitely the most memories. The last time I played it was probably 4 years ago but I still remember the general layout. Here's to hoping that someone will mod it in the future...

[@fefek1]

Honestly I love huge maps and I could literally write a perfect game concept rn which ima do cuz I'm bored Imagine a map four times the size of v3, divided into 4 parts. The map has deserts, mountain ranges and tundra, forests and redwood forests, swamps, islands and archipelagos, rivers and lakes and savannahs. Ravines cliffs and caves. The map would be the main focus of the game. Each segment would be a separate server, each able to hold 150-300 players each and when approaching the border you have to option to join the other segment's server. All four servers are still one single big server, so your Dinosaurs are the same and the server still has the same rules. The right and left side of the map change seasons every few hours, where the right side is in dry season and the other is wet season. In dry season, all herbivores including AI have to migrate to the other side because food will no longer regrow on their side. The wet season side has always food regrowing fast. Some AI herbivores will stay in the dry season side as it'll bring them opportunities exclusive to their species. Ah, about the ai. There would be ai Dinosaurs that don't spawn when people do, but rather spawn when the server starts similarly to ARK. The Dinosaurs act realistically and can be intimidated, scared off, aggrevated, befriended or even you can have kids with them. They move around the map, and have to find food to survive. Hungry ai dinosaurs are often more aggressive, where full Dinosaurs are calmer. AI Dinosaurs hunt eachother and the players. There could be also an option of winter/summer instead of dry and wet season. The functions would essentially be the same but you would also have to stay warm in the winter side and there would be snow. Ngl I wanna write this all out and write myself a game I'll never make cuz I'm not a dev

[@ashesofmonsters5296]

Late to the party but on the biomes idea, you don't even need to do wildly different biomes to make that work and add interest! That's where sub-biomes come in. And things like stage of growth in a region can add intrigue and uniqueness to an area. If you walk long enough in the woods you will see what I mean, here in the Pacific Northwest, I can find very different looking places all in the same forest on a one hour hike. Areas full of old growth trees, some with nothing but pine, others dominated by red alders and other deciduous trees. The density of trees varies based on the kind growing there and the terrain, same with amount of undergrowth. There's plenty of inspiration to draw from life that's not being well used in The Isle's development for sure. Shame, I want the game to succeed and sort out it's issues but I'm not an optimistic person.

[@titanuskolasaurus2050]

This is quality content. Also have you seen the Jurassic World evolution 2 trailer and videos?

[@XZaguer]

Yes i have, i will try to make a review of the game once it comes out

[@legakattack4771]

And they're planning on making Evrima even bigger and PURPOSEFULLY leading players to separate areas through diets for the sole purpose of realism. Like you're off your rockers. We want semi-realism, but still combat relatively often

[@saymumssoul5062]

You would be good for game design in my opinion

[@2I000]

Do you ever post these ideas in the feedback channel in islecord? Cause these are like professional level critiques of the game, and I think they’re really needed, but the devs refuse to listen to anything in video form, and the mods prevent it from even being seen :/ (I found out the hard way)

[@ender_z4nd3r83]

Well, most of the time i hear people complaining about spiro saying they prefer v3

[@XZaguer]

Not to generate any hate but Spiro is worse in many aspects, and that's saying much since we have v3 already

[@ender_z4nd3r83]

@@XZaguer will you make a concept video about the new baryonix concept?

[@XZaguer]

@@ender_z4nd3r83 indeed i will, see you on Friday!

[@maxlch5943]

As a deino player getting hella fuckin bored EVRIMA need more rivers fo shuree

[@lhamaseveramenteirritada9760]

2:43 BoB is.... something....

[@jainoakes2529]

Very nice

[@Ricon313]

I like your material, I even link it on my discord dedicated to The Isle, but unfortunately this film bored me halfway through. In my opinion, your slow way of pronunciation and stretching the topic too much are to blame for this. I hear a lot of information about how the map should look, but all I see for the lion's share of the video is a slow presentation of the landscape, so slow that it starts to bore.After the title, I expected a maximum of 12-15 minutes of material, while the intro itself is 2 minutes long. Maybe you should try to speak in a normal way more often? 7:49 - 7:51 Otherwise, I look forward to the next videos ;).

[@XZaguer]

I appreciate the feedback, I tried to make a more "hands back" video where people can just hear it and still understand the messages, like a podcast of sorts. It's not how I usually do things but at least I tried XD thank you for the respectful criticism tho 🙂

[@powerboom5809]

Mhmm.. is this the same guy i played with yesterday???.?.?.? ( Skomboom)

[@XZaguer]

You bet 😉

[@powerboom5809]

@@XZaguer mhmmm

[@powerboom5809]

@@XZaguer can i subscribe ?

[@XZaguer]

@@powerboom5809 sure feel free to do so 🙂

[@powerboom5809]

@@XZaguer oke, but do u wanna play today or tomorrow or no

[@joeyjonquantaviusjr9927]

T

[@Gmh-]

I really think you should be judging the work of the level designer they hired (Jace) , and not a map that was made before they even had a level designer , just the lead dev making maps

[@Moriturius]

It is the legacy game. There will be no developing in the legacy system for future and also there was no for nearly 2 years. they also Alrady planing to shut down legacy. So everyone will migrate to the isle evrima. The whole overworked and new designed game. 🤦🏼‍♂️

[@Nana-sc6mj]

It’s been out an entire year and has had the same issues since day one. There’s a reason why the majority are still on legacy. As long as legacy exists, people are allowed to cover it.

[@Moriturius]

@@Nana-sc6mj it is like cover a dead game. Yes Evrima is out, there they keep updaten contend and Map design. Covering a game that didn’t get any update since 2 years is lame. Special when the team works on the overmake of the whole game. He should go there and criticize the new map, there it would be constructive. Blaming the design of a official dead game (legacy) and map sucks. There will be no change ever happen in the legacy System. It will be shut down at some point. Ppl playing legacy couse evrima is missing on contend. That will change with the next major update. More and more migrating from legacy to evrima.

[@Nana-sc6mj]

@@Moriturius firstly they shadow patch. Secondly it’s pretty sad when the majority of the player base rather play the “dead” version.

[@kavtherenegadeangel8006]

Damn legacy is so dead than my fav server the last day were 147/150 players instead of 150/150

[@sbigbro]

your problem is about to be addressed in update 4 and will be more refined in the future Evrima is not it's own game it's the isle, Evrima is an updated version of legacy every thing that legacy has evrima will eventually have everything legacy has and more.

[@Nana-sc6mj]

People have been saying that about evrima since before it came out. There’s a reason the majority have stuck with legacy. Evrima is almost unplayable

[@sbigbro]

​@@Nana-sc6mj that is because evrima is a recode of the whole game everything from scratch, think of the isle day one the first time the isle first become playable, how long did it take from then to the last update for legacy, how many years for just one new mechanics or dino to come out, compare that to evrima I also play legacy but the reason being that evrima haven't added Spinosaurus yet and there's almost no one playing in the servers

[@Nana-sc6mj]

@@sbigbro it’s empty because after an entire year they can’t fix the same problem.

[@sbigbro]

@@Nana-sc6mj which is?

[@Nana-sc6mj]

@@sbigbro frame decay/memory leaks. Horrible lag.