The Kong Family Tree - A Danger To The Space-Time Continuum

Donkey's Kong's family history drives me to the brink of insanity in this prelude to my upcoming "Making Sense Of The Mario Universe" video.

[@VoltShatter]

Hypothetical solution to the age issue: It only takes gorillas 12 years to reach adulthood in real life and they only live to be around 40. I could reasonably believe a young Mario having his adventure with Cranky who's already about 40, then DK Jr who could already be 6 years old grows up and has his own child 6 years later, and then modern Donkey Kong grows up to age 12 to be fully grown. This would leave Mario at around 40 years old if he was 21 during the events of Donkey Kong, which is still a little older than you'd expect, but isn't completely unreasonable.

[@legoboy7107]

Mario is canonically in his mid-twenties throughout the games though. Maybe he just has "mascot syndrome" or something where he just stops aging once he reaches adulthood and is just perpetually in his mid-twenties for the rest of time, much like, idk, Sonic being a mid-teenager perpetually or something lol.

[@lasercraft32]

@@legoboy7107 Yeah Mario has been in his mid-twenties since 1981 lol

[@mrfox9090]

I think probably we shouldn't really trust much on that, because they most likely don't fit into the Mario universe, idk that's my opinion 🤷‍♂

[@mrfox9090]

@@legoboy7107 I don't think more than 30 years have passed from the first game to the last

[@thebigheartyradish]

@@legoboy7107 i play into the Jumpman theory, where Cranky Kong fought Mario's father.

[@sterlingdragon123]

My unifying Marioverse theory explains the Kong age discrepancy well, I think. See, as far back as Super Mario Bros, Extra Lives have been a real tangible resource in the Mario world. You can get one for 100 coins and find them growing in the world as mushrooms, and even farm them by jumping on Koopas on staircases. As such, the Mario characters who are possessed of great wealth - such as adventurers like Wario and Mario who go about collecting coin, and royals like Peach and Bowser who have the resources to fund armies - are functionally immortal and unaging due to the effects of the 1-Up Mushrooms. In fact, most citizens of the Mario world likely have one or two extra lives, but only the most powerful people have a near limitless supply. Strangeness surrounding these would also explain the presence of alternate incarnations of characters, like Dr. Mario and Dry Bowser, as being a discarded version of themselves that didn't quite die before the 1-up replaced them. And this clears up the Kong family tree discrepancy as well. We know that Cranky Kong, the original Donkey Kong, was Mario's pet gorilla, and that he was held captive by Mario during the events of Donkey Kong Jr. At this time, neither Mario nor Donkey Kong had access to in-universe extra lives, but after Mario was sucked down the warp pipe into the Mushroom Kingdom he quickly became near-immortal. Meanwhile, Donkey Kong and Donkey Kong Jr. had escaped captivity and fled to the jungle, but without access to 1-ups, they aged as normal. It was Donkey Kong Jr's son, DK III, whose adventure across DK Island to recover the Banana Hoard, led him to the collection of 1-Up Balloons (which may be a type of inflated fungal sac with a dangling thread of mycelium, related to the 1-Up Mushrooms). From then on, the Kong family has also had enough 1-Ups to stay alive indefinitely, which is why Cranky Kong is able to still be around despite his old age. (Wrinkly only died because, as a woman of faith, she believed it necessary and just, and chose to relinquish her 1-Ups to the rest of the Kong family.)

[@backseatsakurai]

Lol. I love this so much. The flipside of the immortality stuff would be Dry Bowser / Dry Bones / Koopa involvement with necromancy in general via Kamek magic.

[@MDLuffy1234YT]

​@@backseatsakurai 1. Fedora Kong could actually be an older Donkey Kong Jr. since he was meant to appear in Donkey Kong Land for the Game Boy, specifically in Big Ape City, which was supposed to be full of references to the Arcade games. 2. Kamek's magic would actually be the only real explanation for the existence of Dry Bones and Dry Bowser.

[@incognitoman3656]

@@backseatsakurai There could also be some members named DK Kong where DK stands for Donkey(smthn) Kong or inversely, DK jr and DK II. There could be as many identical DK monkeys as we want, and anyone can be anywhere!

[@AquaDoesStuff_]

I'd honestly be interested in hearing what else your unifying Marioverse theory has this is really interesting lol

[@brawlfan]

I guess this could explain Tiny Kong aging despite none of the other Kongs aging since DK64

[@rieblox11]

Since Diddy is a monkey and not an ape, I like to believe that Diddy Kong was adopted in by some unknown kong

[@incognitoman3656]

Like Frodo

[@whyrwehere]

I think he was a mix between some monkey and a Kong

[@mightyraccoon7155]

@@whyrwehere He’s a Chimpkey. Half Chimp half Spider Monkey. He’s likely an adoptive nephew.

[@Eevee860]

It's fiction, his dad was an app and his mom was a monkey or something

[@arcuscotangens]

It would be deliciously dark if Swanky actually was Diddy's lost dad. There is the abandoned son, finally finding his long-lost dad, and that very dad doesn't even acknowledge him, only wanting to play some weird game show he dreamt up, presumably in a drunken stupor.

[@kingofslimes233]

I’d also say that Swanky is a sibling of Donkey III, but I think Swanky fell out of the family before both Donkey III and Funky where born. He led his life on the run, and Diddy Kong was the result of a fling, so he never actually knew his family, besides Wrinkly and Cranky. This results in Cranky finding Diddy, and through some old man wisdom realizes that Diddy is a kong, and invites him into the family.

[@vince11harris]

That sounds like a lifetime movie 😂

[@fawfulmark2]

And this is why with the Movie they took a more streamlined approach to the family tree: in that they just made DK into Cranky's son, and if the events of the DK Arcade title happened it's implied Cranky would have taken on Guiseppe instead of Mario.

[@slappybio1686]

i could see Donkey Junior being Modern DK due to super Mario Kart

[@numa2k147]

The DK family has to take accountability for their children 💀

[@SteveNathn]

There’s a racist joke I could make here…

[@Markt.400]

They better call kong protective service's

[@JUMBAGUAP]

I died when he said kiddy kong was neglected and his dad is a deadbeat 😂

[@paulinetrivago.7540]

Mario lore has changed again, its now confirmed that Jr is modern dk

[@cosmicXtropics]

Then who the hell is baby DK??? 🤯

[@paulinetrivago.7540]

@@cosmicXtropics I think retro actively he's the same character as Jr and modern dk, that's the simplest answer

[@cosmicXtropics]

@@paulinetrivago.7540 Their erasure of Jrs existence really caused a lot of problems

[@MDLuffy1234YT]

So what you're saying is, the SMB Movie just erased DK III from existence and moved the family tree below Jr. up a generation? I honestly will never know why Illumination replaced the word "grandson" with "son".

[@paulinetrivago.7540]

@@MDLuffy1234YT that's my understanding, which honestly makes things simpler

[@Joseph_Drew_III]

MatPat suggested that maybe Jumpman is actually Mario’s father. I know he makes a lot of blunders, but this idea in particular is worth keeping in the back pocket imo.

[@dario9074]

Miyamoto confirmed that it’s been the same Mario since Donkey Kong

[@Joseph_Drew_III]

Well, I tried. And it was a good idea.

[@TheLuigiBrother77]

He's clearly also dr.mario

[@Joseph_Drew_III]

@@prageruwu69 Gonna need a source for that first part

[@madnessarcade7447]

@@prageruwu69 the woman in the dk game isn’t Pauline that was a mistranslation Pauline became her own character later on The woman in the dk game her name is lady and she’s gotten her own smash trophy where she’s labeled as lady So ya that’s not Pauline

[@luckysix1015]

Alternative idea, Donkey Kong III is the baby DK from Yoshi’s island DS. A big part of Yoshi’s Island DS is that all the main baby characters have Star power in them, so wouldn’t make sense for that baby DK to grow up to punch the moon out of orbit. Making Cranky Kong, significantly older then Mario and co. cranky could’ve been in the twilight of his youth in his arcade appearances. For conspiratorial evidence in DK64 Cranky is a mad scientist that can create potions that allow Kings to preform special moves. Why did he learn that? He rags about any basic quality of life game feature. My theory is that he studied the art of potion making So that he could stay physically fit for as long as possible but in the end it was never enough to beat the Star powered Mario and he became the Cranky Kong we all know today. How Donkey Kong Junior fits into all of this? I don’t really know, maybe he just never grew out of wearing that outfit, or between all the magic and science in the Mario world he got stuck as a child, or he was retconned out of existence, who’s to say. But yeah, this was a really fun video, and I hope to see the Mario universe one get uploaded some day. Thanks for reading have a nice day.

[@cosmicXtropics]

I'm pretty sure that Fedora Kong is DKs Dad who used to be Junior, Old DK became Cranky Kong aka current DKs grandpa. Current DK is a matured baby Donkey Kong hence why he is a baby the same time as current day Mario.

[@cosmicXtropics]

Nevermind. Unless it's a different Nintendo universe, the Mario movie confirmed that cranky is DKs Dad. Weird.

[@lookslikenik6931]

@@cosmicXtropicsIt is a different universe so the Mario Movie isn’t canon to the Games.

[@cosmicXtropics]

@@lookslikenik6931 That's also a possibility. From what I've heard I don't think Cranky is called “Dad” in the Japanese dub which is also interesting. May be wrong though it's been months since I did research.

[@Kyleeeeeeeee]

In the Dk Jr. Saturday supercade cartoons, Donkey Kong Jr has an uncle called ‘uncle Julius’, who would be Cranky Kong or Wrinkly Kong’s brother

[@sonicfanboy3375]

I don't know if that show is "canon" to the games especially when it's very different from the modern incarnations of the franchise

[@SodaDungeon]

i love the idea that Lanky is from an outcasted part of the family i feel like that background just fits him. could also give him reasons to be overly funny just a way for him to cope all the negative treatment he could have potentially gotten (maybe im overthinking that but its interesting)

[@_1oofi]

​@dinkleberg2871"Its a fictional organtuan. get a Life." How about you let people do their thing.

[@adora_was_taken]

i mean he's definitely mistreated in the DK rap, you might be on to something

[@andrewmorrill7228]

It would be stylish and make sense that fedora kong would be diddy’s dad. He’d pass down his hat-wearing to his son. Also he’s unnamed like his dad.

[@TheDaphinator]

Much respect to you for doing this deep dive. You are doing a service to DK lovers everywhere with your research. Very well-explained and well-edited. Awesome video; earned yourself a new subscriber.

[@stevensteviepryde5888]

Feels like Miyamoto tries to nix the whole "Cranky is the original Donkey Kong" thing, as multiple later games would address DK III as the original rival to Mario, and also included Baby DK to prove it more. I wish they'd have Jump man be a separate character and I'm surprised Miyamoto doesn't use that idea because saying it's been the same one from the beginning means that Mario being a poacher is still canon.

[@legoboy7107]

Well Donkey Kong Jr. explicitly refers to Mario by name in the game so to retcon Jumpman into being a separate character you'd have to say that DKJR is not the direct sequel to the original DK game anymore and the characters are not the same characters and all that mess, and ignore the literally identical sprites between the two games lol.

[@LostSoulSilver]

So much of this would be so easily fixable if nintendo just stated that apes in the DK series age differently from real life ones

[@rubinjaberi5781]

Don't forget to include punchout characters, Stanley the bug man from Donkey kong 3, and Captain Syrup in your map of the Mario universe. I hope you dont miss a single corner. (Also idk how far along you are but you will make your life easier if you look at Mario, Wario, and Donkey kong games mainly).

[@backseatsakurai]

Your head is in the right place, you're gonna really enjoy the vid

[@littleclown9420]

​@@backseatsakurai oh boy

[@lookslikenik6931]

@@backseatsakuraiYou made a really good Video lad ❤😊 hope your already working on the Mario Universe Video because I can’t wait because I love your Videos😁

[@theneonchimpchannel9095]

Diddy's relationship with the Kong family seems to vary. In some things he's referred to as a nephew but in others he's a friend. Perhaps he was a friend whose parents died and so he was adopted by the Kong family. For the sake of simplicity rather than explaining all that and possibly bringing up traumatic memories for Diddy, they just call him a nephew if anyone asks. As for Donkey Kong Junior, I have heard a rumour that he was meant to be the Fedora Kong but that idea was scrapped early in development. My own theory is that he's a big sports star in either swimming, wrestling or gymnastics given that he's wearing a leotard or swimsuit type costume, seeing as he's an ape, he would make a good gymnast. So he's busy representing Kong Island at competitions and doesn't have much time to appear in video games or go on adventures anymore like the rest of the family. If he's still active, then he'd be training most of the time. If he's retired, he's probably coaching the next generation and would still not have that much time. I'm sure he does make time for his family. He has been spotted in the audience for some of the Mario sporting games so he's probably there to support his family members who are competing. Maybe if they ever do a Kong Gymnastics video game, he could star in that, but gymnastics is a sport that doesn't really work in video game format. The wrestling possibility though, they could have him in a fighting game. Perhaps he could be a Nintendo exclusive unlockable in the next WWE game. In regards to the aging of Cranky compared to Mario, Gorillas don't tend to live as long as humans. So even if they are the same age, in Gorilla years, Cranky would be much older than Mario. Then again, he was old 30 years ago and is still alive so maybe he's actually immortal but will just continue to age.

[@zml9592]

Bruhhhh, this is fire. It's so in depth and well explained. Can't wait for the full video!!!

[@matane2465]

Trixie Kong also appears to Age between DK 64 and later appearances.

[@A13XLaircey]

Who's Trixie Kong?

[@geschnitztekiste4111]

@@A13XLaircey Tiny Kong.

[@thomasdesjardins5057]

Doesnt Tiny Grow up at some point and everyone is surprised? Like she’s the only one actually ageing

[@deadheat1635]

And now the Mario Movie suggests that DKJr. and DKIII are the same -person- Kong.

[@nicoflight3982]

All dk enjoyers need to watch this for the sake of a kong

[@Goremasterhelsing]

You forgot the guerilla and chained Kong from Mario RPG

[@samotxd]

Just brought to this gem by the algorithm. Marvelous video, keep up the good work!

[@Savannah_Simpson]

I saw a video where someone speculated that the Baby DK in Yoshi Island is a baby Cranky Kong, which is why he’s a baby at the came time as Mario.

[@Stathio]

Play DK64 - literally the first time you visit Cranky Kong, he calls the current Donkey Kong his son. (This is the case in the modern Super Mario Bros. movie as well)

[@MagnificantSasquatch]

Rare kiiiiinda made a mess of things in this regard. The main problem where this all began was making the original Donkey Kong be old because A) they believed Mario was an older man, and B) wanted the "hip young hero on the block" appeal that Sonic had - which worked for the time, but now that this time has passed, it's basically become a detriment. Nintendo clearly understands the best way to handle this, as they've been trying to shift into the mindset that the Donkey Kong Mario knew was always the same DK, but it's the more or less the fandom pushback refusing this on principle rather than any sensible standpoint that's holding it back. The Mario Movie portrayal of his and DK's rivalry is pretty clearly the way they'd like to have it.

[@trash_lol]

how is this video not called “a danger to the space time kongtinuum”

[@backseatsakurai]

Definitely a missed opportunity

[@trash_lol]

@@backseatsakurai nothing’s stopping you

[@slateoffate9812]

Idea: 1: All the Donkey Kong Country games take place in the somewhat distant future, and Diddy Kong has traveled back in time, so the Donkey Kong we see in Mario Kart and Party is Cranky Kong's younger self. Idea 2: It was retconned. Donkey Kong 3 was the original Donkey Kong (the Mario Vs. DK games are evident enough that if they're the same DK, he hasn't really learned from his mistakes). Donkey Kong Jr. was actually DK's older brother(or parent in a midlife crisis), who later got renamed Funky Kong, and Cranky Kong was in Donkey Kong Jr, which takes place long before Donkey Kong, the antagonist of Jr. not being Mario, but someone else in conveniently similar clothes(Spike, Wario and Waluigi dress similarly after all). So timeline: 1: Donkey Kong Jr.: Cranky Kong gets jailed up by someone who looks similar to Mario(given time travel in the Luigi's Mansion 3DS games, Bowser Jr, perhaps?) and is saved by Baby Funky Kong, at the time known as Donkey Kong Jr. 2: Donkey Kong: Modern DK's debut. 3: Mario Vs. Donkey Kong: Clearly, DK has a tendency to repeat his mistakes. As for your Mario Universe project, I was wondering if it was possible to find the in-universe locations of almost every course? I understand Maple Treeway could be in the Golf Leaf Galaxy, but where the heck is Sweet Sweet Canyon!? Is it Sarasaland's CAPITAL!?

[@legoboy7107]

The antagonist of Donkey Kong Junior IS Mario though, that's overt because he's explicitly called Mario by name IN THE GAME, the first time he's ever even called by that name (it wasn't Mario Bros. like some people think). Though I don't blame someone if they didn't know that because those cutscenes where it happens were cut from the NES version for size reasons, and most people probably know the NES version better, but the real arcade version explicitly calls him Mario in-game ("Get key from Mario, save your papa!" for example). Unless we're trying to suggest that this is a second guy who not only looks identical but also happens to be named Mario which...yeah I'm not buying it, it's obviously supposed to be Mario lol.

[@crebecca]

"Donkey Kong has an unknown amount of siblings, and at least one of those siblings is the parent of Diddy Kong" That's the scariest 'at least' I've ever heard

[@kingadam69]

I don't think it's ever been stated that Candy is related to Tiny and Dixie,but I'm gonna make it a little headcanon of mine now.

[@CallMeFreakFujiko]

I'm pretty sure Jumpman was confirmed to be Mario's father, and not Mario himself.

[@aprinnyonbreak1290]

That was "confirmed" by Game Theory, who pulled it out of their ass because their timeline of events didn't work otherwise

[@reeyees50]

​@@aprinnyonbreak1290in the new movie it is implied

[@legoboy7107]

@@reeyees50 It's really not, that one guy is named Giuseppe and solely exists in the movie as a way to have Charles Martinet's non-Chris Pratt Mario voice from the games cameo in the movie and also be a fun nod to Mario's debut but nothing more. Him literally having Mario's real voice is the critical blow to the idea that he's some major new different character retconning revelation or anything, he's just a cameo role for Martinet's Mario voice at the end of the day. If Martinet WERE voicing Mario in the movie instead of Chris Pratt he probably wouldn't have even existed. Not to mention the movie doesn't even really match up with the games anyway so anything in the movie only means so much.

[@legoboy7107]

No, all you have to look at to decomfirm that is the very next game where "Jumpman" appears, the direct sequel Donkey Kong Jr. There he literally is called Mario in the game, and is obviously the same guy as Jumpman in the first game (even having the exact same sprite not to mention the direct story continuity). Him not being called Mario yet in the original was solely due to him not having a real name yet, but he already got his real name Mario by the very next game. And there's way more besides that, but that's the earliest evidence that Jumpman IS in fact Mario, later games would have even more.

[@YophiGames]

Twist! Donkey Kong III is the one who kidnapped Pauline in the original game, but Bowser sent him back in time to get rid of him. Then, as he lived and aged, he became Cranky, due to his never getting to live his life out like he wanted. Soon, he ends up becoming his own grandpa!

[@SurlyUJest]

this video is explicit Great Kong War denial and frankly it's disgusting. (cute video! love the family tree)

[@soggy.burrito14]

316 views? Come on now KZbin, people should be able to see this gem

[@bokcmeatyvstheworld8273]

Hey man wtf I miss you fool we need you more than ever right now

[@backseatsakurai]

Backseat never dies... not gonna make promises but i always have a few vids churning in the background. Appreciate the support, this made my day

[@bokcmeatyvstheworld8273]

@@backseatsakurai fam once I found your channel I knew then that there is still good content on KZbin. All this other shit is for the birds so Take your time G I'll be patiently waiting.

[@Thrillin_Chillin_Drillin]

Let's just call him Kong

[@ajr01-x6e]

My theory is that Cranky Kong being the original Donkey Kong is not canon anymore and neither is the existence of Donkey Kong Jr.

[@Eris1987]

Donkey Kong shows up as an adult in Super Mario Kart and Mario's Tennis which are canon games like DKA and DKJ. Cranky being the og DK is referenced as recent as MSSB and SMO.

[@littleredpony6868]

Another possibility for the divergence in the generations between the Kongs and Mario is that Mario and his family travel between different worlds and time goes by at different rates on those worlds. Anyone who is familiar with the Narnia series will be familiar with this sort of idea

[@Daryom]

Surprised you didn't acknowledged things like how DK jr. on his baby state is able to both participate on the first mario kart, and play tennis with his grown up son. that aside, the Kong family tree is so fucked up, absent father and mother figures, criminals, and how the orangutan part of the family tree is implying some kind of deformity/mutation or something that happened to the tree at some point. Wouldn't suprise me if the fact that they are "rednecks" is implying some kind of inbreeding.

[@happygol-lucky5938]

My man: I'm late to the party, but Bowser, when taking Baby DK out of time for Yoshi's Island DS, had to get through an Adult DK Jr, meaning that DK Jr. is dead in our main timeline and DK lll is actually just the time displaced version.

[@Grim_slayer21]

uncle kong states in the guidebook he’s not related to the kongs

[@mrfox9090]

Wow, Mario literally fought 3 generations of Kong and is still in his 20's (And NO, the ape ages faster doesn't work in the Mario universe)

[@SuperSneedSwag]

Swanky kong is the Drake of The donkey Kong universe. Deadbeat dad gang💪🏽💪🏽💪🏽🇧🇷

[@TheEbrithil2]

The Yoshis Island thing is a hard nut to crack, but the age differemce from Cranky to DK III compared to Mario makes a bit of sense. Human life expectancy is about double that of gorillas.

[@Enlightenment0172]

Chunky Kong (Deceased)

[@QueenSunstar]

According to the new movie, Donkey is Cranky’s son.

[@PvpiMir]

movie is non cannon

[@QueenSunstar]

@@PvpiMir Cranky is the original Donkey Kong. It’s stated so in the SNES games.

[@kkplushproductions]

I’m pretty sure it’s never been stated that Candy is a sister to Dixie (or Tiny for that matter).

[@lookslikenik6931]

It could be that she is also Dixie’s and Tiny‘s Cousin or maybe their half sister which would explain why Tiny has that mutated gene to grown fast and human like proportions because we know that in the Mushroom World Time runs extremely slow compared to the Human World or Earth whatever. Maybe Fedora Kong is shrouded in mystery because he left his original wife or girlfriend from where he gave birth to Candy and with a new Wife/Girlfriend then to Dixie and Tiny who knows.

[@BenjifocusTV]

You did your homework 👏

[@eggshellfan406]

Since when was Cranky Kong the grandfather of Funky Kong. I was under the impression Funky Kong was a family friend

[@kurikuraconkuritas]

I like to think that kong is just the species and they are not necesarily related

[@Rubbocodille]

The fact you can play the same Kong or Kremling twice or even thrice or 4 times, at the same time in a game, doesn't mean there's 4 Donkey Kongs, 4 Diddy Kongs, 4 Lanky Kongs, 4 Tiny Kongs, 4 Chunky Kongs and 4 Krushas existing in Donkey Kong 64 and 4 Donkey Kongs and 4 Donkey Kong Jr. existing in Mario Tennis 64. Old Games have that tendency to let you play the same characters re-colored, since they didn't have a lot of characters selectable, but of course, there's series like Super Smash Bros. that are continuing to let you play the same characters multiples times, at the same time.

[@denifnaf5874]

What if Donkey Kong junior grew up and became fedora kong?

[@Eris1987]

@Eris1987 That is highly unlikely because, we have already seen what an adult DK Jr. looks like.

[@pallukun]

mans saw a bunch of gorillas and said "they must be related"

[@Dr_Damon_1111]

Funky has lighter hair so maybe funky is actually the son of pinkly? There's a way that he doesn't have to be donkey Kong's brother but he can still be crankys grand son

[@kkplushproductions]

The main problem, I would say, would be Donkey Kong Country and Yoshi’s Island’s different origins of Donkey Kong. Mario is a middle-aged man, around 24, and Cranky is stated to be the OG DK (in his younger years). Since IRL gorillas age faster and have a shorter life-span than humans, it would make sense for Mario to look about the same age by the time DK III is an adult. Everything would be all fine and dandy…except…Yoshi’s Island contradicts this. Yoshi’s Island DS introduces the Star Children. Ones that are destined for greatness. This game also shows Baby Mario alongside Baby DK, who is implied to be Donkey Kong III (the dude can punch the Moon out of its orbit, it just makes sense). This would mean that both Cranky and Junior are older than Mario, which doesn’t really feel right. And if you go by IRL gorilla aging, Cranky Kong would be super old by the time of Donkey Kong (1981), if not dead! The Mario vs. Donkey Kong series doesn’t really help much, stating that DK’s “up to his old tricks again,” which implies he’s the original DK. It just wouldn’t make sense as this would be DK III’s first time meeting Pauline. Unless, he’s not even DK III. He could just be DK Jr. all grown up. Ah, yes…the classic debate about whether DK is Junior’s son, or Junior’s adult-self. It seemed that Donkey Kong Country has shown modern DK was Cranky’s grandson, but the Rare devs, Donkey Kong 64, and even The Super Mario Bros. Movie seem to say otherwise. This whole debacle is complicated, kongfusing, mess! There would be three possible ways for this to be fixed. 1) Donkey Kong’s family tree would follow the “grown-up DK Jr.” path, now revived by The Super Mario Bros. Movie, and Baby DK is Junior. 2) The Baby DK in Yoshi’s Island would be a young Cranky Kong, and the whole Star Child thing would be a generational situation, and would be passed down from Cranky, to Junior, to DK. 3) One of the theories in this video. Time travel shenanigans lead to Donkey Kong being taken from the past as a baby, and substituted as the son Junior never had, making Cranky Kong and Donkey Kong being the same person biologically. The song “I’m my own grandpa” by Ray Stevens would really fit here.

[@McShmoodle]

Mario being described as "middle-aged" implies he will die of old age at around 50 lol

[@pacblox5417]

What I don’t understand is how is Diddy a nephew to Dk if they’re 2 different species? Dk is a gorilla and Diddy obviously isn’t as he has a tail, was there some kind of cross breeding going on? Also Dixie kong has a tail but her older sister candy doesn’t have one. It just makes no sense to me

[@backseatsakurai]

I always assumed the species was just Kong and they have more varied appearances than earthly monkey varieties

[@Dr_Damon_1111]

Every single monkey on donkey Kong Island is a fictional type of monkey as far as I know called a Kong and that is what did he come is despite what he's based off

[@samuelkernohan267]

This video needs to be sent directly to the Nintendo execs

[@SpongeMan020]

AND THEN THERES CHUNKY! he’s dead…

[@pyragaflare]

Not a bad video. Candy kong isn’t Dixie’s and Tiny’s sister. Though that would be interesting. I heard a theory that fedora Kong could actually be Jr grown up. Apes take less time to reach adult hood compared to humans which would help explain how Mario could interact with both Adult version. Of cranky and DK. Though that being said. I always figured baby donkey song with just a baby cranky.

[@fanoverdell]

It's actually quite fun to discuss... In the first Donkey Kong game, we see a young Cranky Kong and I guess a young Mario... Then in the series Mario didn't age, and Donkey Kong already has grandchildren... And I have a couple of theories: first, there are different time zones in Mario's world. The presence of magic in the world allows such a theory to be! As we know, Donkey Kong 1 and his family escaped from Brooklyn and are now living... where they live... But what if time goes differently in this place?.. Remember that different worlds have different times... and if it ends: Time Up - minus life. This is a game convention of many super Mario games... The timer after which the life ends. And what if it's something real? What if time really goes differently and at different speeds in different places?

[@Eris1987]

_"As we know, Donkey Kong 1 and his family escaped from Brooklyn and are now living... where they live... "_ He left Big City and traveled the nearby Kong Archipelago to his homeland DK Island. The only off part for your hypothesis is DK III's aging.

[@richardbradford4266]

(I forgot to add this part) uncle Kong might be donkey Kong Jr's brother and dk's uncle, I hate it when some people always get the DK Family Tree wrong.

[@auditect950]

In the Super Mario Bros. Movie, Cranky Kong is Donkey's father rather than his grandfather.

[@pianomanty]

I subscribe to the idea that Kiddy Kong is actually young Chunky Kong

[@VaniRoyal]

I hate that everyone just assumes that DK Jr is somehow the father of the modern DK, and write it on wiki pages as if it’s fact. It is pure speculation, there is absolutely no official source, misinformed or otherwise, calling DK Jr DK’s father. Sure, Cranky has been *implied* to be the original Arcade DK, and that DK’s Son is DK Jr, and he was *originally* referred to as DK’s grandfather, but even if he is, that doesn’t automatically mean that DK Jr *has* to be DK’s father, Cranky could just as easily have had a different, older son, and *he* is DK’s father. or if DK Jr *is* DK’s father, he could’ve been the DK seen in DK ‘94, and *that* games Jr is our modern DK. or of course, the most obvious answer is usually the correct one, and the character we’re told is named “Donkey Kong” who, in all most recent examples, has been called the son of the original “Donkey Kong” and showed up right as the character “Donkey Kong Jr” stopped appearing, even “replacing” him in every Mario spinoff appearance, is, in fact, Donkey Kong Jr. But all of that is still just speculation, DK Jr. has never once been confirmed to be DK or his father and it’s about time somebody changed the wikis to remove false or redacted information. Besides, every most recent appearance of Cranky calls him either DK’s father, or the vague “DK’s elder” and Nintendo most likely doesn’t even consider the “Cranky is the OG DK” bit from the original DKC to be true, they use that same bit to sorta imply that cranky in the newer DKC games is somehow the DK from the SNES games, saying things like “back in my day, WE TOOK TURNS! None of this simultaneous multiplayer malarkey!” (I’m probably paraphrasing, but I know they made that joke) they probably see it as the original design intent, which was for DKC to simply be a redesign, and Cranky a new character. That’s kinda the only way modern DK appearing alongside a child DK Jr in Mario Tennis could make sense without time travel (although, that game does have baby Mario in it…)

[@Eris1987]

_" It is pure speculation, there is absolutely no official source, misinformed or otherwise, calling DK Jr DK’s fathe."_ While it is technically speculation, it's more of what is called inference, as in putting 2 and 2 together. _"Cranky has been implied to be the original Arcade DK, and that DK’s Son is DK Jr"_ Not implied to an extent, but he is also outright stated to be such. _"and he was originally referred to as DK’s grandfather"_ He still is. _"Cranky could just as easily have had a different, older son, and he is DK’s father."_ That just seems to be adding unnecessary steps, and would basically empty conjecture equivalent to saying their could be a third Mario Bro. _" if DK Jr is DK’s father, he could’ve been the DK seen in DK ‘94, and that games Jr is our modern DK. "_ One that game was originally intended to be the original game expanded upon. Plus Donkey Kong Junior in the game was called Junior and not III thus was more than likely intended to be the same DK Jr. from the other games. Also, you run into the issue of Donkey Kong III seeming to first meet Mario in Mario Vs. Donkey Kong based on the opening cutscene dialogue. And Mario vs. Donkey Kong: Mini-Land Mayhem is the first time DK III has seen Pauline. While DK Jr. knew her from 94 at least. We also see DK Jr. as an adult in Super Mario Kart and Mario's Tennis. _"the character we’re told is named 'Donkey Kong' who, in all most recent examples, has been called the son of the original"_ Incorrect, he is only ever been called his grandson in the games, with only one exception from the past which was a mistake. _"is, in fact, Donkey Kong Jr. "_ Incorrect, DK III and DK Jr. are 2 separate characters. _"Besides, every most recent appearance of Cranky calls him either DK’s father, or the vague 'DK’s elder'"_ Not entirely true. _"and Nintendo most likely doesn’t even consider the “Cranky is the OG DK” bit from the original DKC to be true"_ They do consider it and have mentioned it a few times. Btw, hold off on a response, I'm saving the best bits for last ehehehe. _"They use that same bit to sorta imply that cranky in the newer DKC games is somehow the DK from the SNES games, saying things like 'back in my day, WE TOOK TURNS! None of this simultaneous multiplayer malarkey!'"_ You are more than likely misreading the intention behind that line given in another game he refers being a hero with kidnapping maidens last time I checked. Cranky himself represents the never satisfied gamer who complains about everything new and is nostalgic for the old. He himself gets nostalgic for DKC a game he previously bashed on. This is his character. _" DK appearing alongside a child DK Jr in Mario Tennis could make sense without time travel (although, that game does have baby Mario in it…)"_ Womp womp Anyways........ Time for all the evidence of why Cranky is the original Donkey Kong, Donkey Kong III is his grandson and only his grandson, and Donkey Kong Junior is best inferred to be the father. So first off in Donkey Kong Country's opening you have Cranky Kong on top of the Classic Steel Gutters from the original Donkey Kong Arcade game, with the arcade theme playing. Only to be interrupted by his Grandson with boombox playing the DKC theme. This is a meta way of showing the 2 different generations of Kongs, and basically telling the player Cranky is the original Donkey Kong. But if that's not enough the DKC Manual has the story of the game in it. In this straight up says that Cranky Kong is the original Donkey, and the current Donkey Kong is his grandson. In Donkey Kong Country 2 GBA's Prologue Cranky references his past of kidnapping maidens and throwing barrels, and how he'd do it quite a bit. There is a line from DKC2 Diddy's Kong Quest that Cranky says further confirming this. _"Say hello to your old grandpappy Cranky. I'm back by popular demand to offer my wealth of gameplay wisdom for this unnecessary sequel."_ In Mario Superstar Baseball it says DK III's grandfather is the original Donkey Kong. While some people think this was forgotten about, in the manual for Donkey Kong Country Returns Cranky is again called Donkey Kong the Third's grandfather. In addition when leaving is Cranky Kong's Shop you can get this line of dialogue from Cranky, _"glad I could help my grandson overcome this deadly challenge in exchange for a little cash money."_ Alongside several more lines of dialogue you can get confirming he is Donkey Kong the Third's grandfather. "_Well, you've amazed your old grandpa by getting this far."_ _"You made it all the way to the Volcano! You may have some of your grandpappy in you after all."_ The Classic Outfit which only DK Snr. and DK Jr. saw Mario wear is stated to liked by many fans and that Donkey Kong was never a fan. NOM says about Cranky _"he passed on the name "Donkey Kong" to his grandson. Since then, he has been called Cranky and is loved as the elder member of the Kong family. There are rumors that he is a bit of a nag..."_ NOM says about DK, _"grandson of the original Donkey Kong. He took on the name "Donkey Kong" from the original in Donkey Kong Country."_ As stated in game and in the manual for Donkey Kong Junior, he is the son of Cranky Kong. NOM says DK Jr. is _"He is the son of the original Donkey Kong."_ The only the deviation from this information the game canon was a blunder in DK64 which future games like DKRC corrected. Even Gregg Mayles clearing things up in 2017 that this was a mistake, and Donkey Kong the Third was always Cranky's grandson.

[@VaniRoyal]

@@Eris1987 1: it’s not putting 2 and 2 together, it’s jumping over 2 to put 2 and 3 together. 2: no it has not, the games have never outright said “Cranky Kong is an elderly version of the original arcade donkey Kong”, they’ve simply implied it with meta references. 3: no he is not, in the past decade +, he’s been called DK’s father, and his “elder”, but never grandfather. 4: there are way more unnecessary steps in trying to say that offscreen, DK Jr grew up, had a child, and that child is now an adult, with DK Jr himself completely out of the picture. 5: the game expanded, not the story. The story of DK 94 was always a separate sequential event that takes place after the original Donkey Kong games. 5.2: why would he be called “DK the third”? a jr of a jr is still just jr, not a jr jr, are you expecting his dad to call his son “DK the third”? and we don’t even know that the OG DK isn’t himself a Jr, his father before him could’ve also been a Donkey Kong, and his father before that, and so on. I’ve always seen “Donkey Kong” as title that basically means “King of the Jungle”. 5.3: genuinely, fair points, but if DK jr can go from being a kid to being grown up and having a fully grown son within the span of less than a year IRL time, how can we be sure that exactly that hasn’t happened multiple times by now? Maybe by the time of the DK from Mario vs DK, it’s another new generation of DK. 5.4: I don’t get why everyone says this, nothing about DK Jrs appearance in either of these games shows him to be any older than he was in his first appearance. Is it just because he looks big next to the Mario cast? He’s an ape, apes are fuckin huge. 6/7/8: incorrect correction, he hasn’t been called his grandfather in like over 2 decades. 9: Okay sure I’ll wait 10: I’m not misreading it, they 100% use him for that exact bit. He’s more of a joke character than the real character, so making him suddenly “elderly DKC DK” isn’t even that weird. Also, refer back to 5.3 ^ where I’ve realized it may actually be possible that it’s not even entirely a joke. 11: I don’t know what you mean “womp womp”. Now for my own replies 1: meta reference does not equal lore, this is literally just a cute way of saying “this ain’t you pappy’s DK!” 2: the English manual? The unreliable English manual from the 90s? When localization was far worse than it is today? You’re trying to build a skyscraper with ice cubes for foundation here. 3: implication is still not confirmation. 4: is that line from the unreliable manual, or the game itself? and wouldn’t that directed at Diddy or the player, not DK? 5: that just be how whoever wrote character trivia in a Mario baseball spin-off interpreted a character from the DK series, that doesn’t necessarily mean it is confirmation. But it is the most compelling thing you’ve mentioned by far (if it’s true, that is). 6: weren’t all of those lines removed/changed in the 3DS version, though? and what are they in the Japanese version? 7: it’s weird that you think there was somehow a point in Mario’s life where he was only being observed by 2 apes, like, what? I don’t even know what you’re trying to say. Not only would Pauline have seen him wearing that, but yknow, every other resident in the city that saw this Italian man jumping on construction sites? or anyone in his day to day life, or various other odd jobs, as he wouldn’t have just put overalls on for the purposes of chasing a gorilla up scaffolding. 8/7/9: I don’t know what NOM is, but that all seems to confirm more so than disprove modern DK being Jr. how would he have passed his name on if he didn’t raise him? and he had already passed the name on to his son? It’s a simple solution: modern DK is both his grandson, and DK Jr, DK Jr was always the grandson of DK. With DK III’s (aka DK Jr’s) father absent/MiA , his grandfather (aka the OG DK) took it upon himself to raise his grandson as his own, hence why he’s referred to as DK grandfather, father and simply “elder”. modern DK/Jr grew up thinking of him as a father, and Cranky still sometimes thinks of him as his son, despite being one more generation removed. Just because Cranky is Modern DK’s grandfather, it doesn’t automatically mean that DK Jr is his father, or even a separate character. Also, I don’t really care whatever Gregg Mayles or anyone at Rare says specifically, it’s Nintendo’s character, Rare doesn’t even work with the IP anymore. and even if back in the 90s something Rare said contradicted something Nintendo did, then Nintendo’s version would overtake Rare’s. DK is Nintendo’s toy, Rare was just playing with it.

[@VaniRoyal]

I also find it ridiculous that all you’re doing is arguing that Cranky is DK’s grandfather, which I never even outright disputed. My entire point was that Cranky being DK’s grandfather does not automatically make DK Jr a father, and they have never said that, and have contradicted it many times, it does not belong on wiki pages unsourced the way it always is. Is Cranky DK’s grandfather? Most likely, yes. but did Cranky raise DK like a son? Yes, equally as likely. Tell me, what makes more sense: DK is the adult son of a literal child with the same name that disappeared just before he was introduced. or DK was raised by his grandfather, and he used to wear a bib.

[@Galamoth06]

It's not "Donkey Kong 3," he's not a sequel to his father lol. It would be "Donkey Kong the third."

[@byronsmothers8064]

I've always been led to believe that Fedora Kong is junior when he grew up, do DK II But that's speculative

[@auditect950]

I prefer to explain the age discrepancy with Jumpman being Mario's father, instead of Mario himself.

[@Eris1987]

He isn't, Mario is Jumpman.

[@howyadoinkid]

Bro the fedora kong lmfaoooo, the lore is massive and that's just within their own family tree. Don't go crazy crafting the universe

[@Bowshewicz]

I think you're onto something with the "Cranky is DK pulled back in time" theory. In Donkey Kong Country, Cranky constantly tells you about how he's beaten all the levels and found all the secrets. This actually makes zero sense, except in light of your time-travel theory.

[@DanteCrowlley]

One day they'll drop a DK anime origins

[@frogerzard6606]

Chained kongs from mario rpg?

[@Party64DS]

Just subbed, i can't wait for that Super Mario video

[@gpoop23]

I actually love the "Baby D.K. and D.K. III are an alternate timeline Cranky" theory. That's gonna be part of my headcanon now.

[@urban_radagast]

I always assumed that Donkey Kong Jr. grew up to be DK, and after watching this, I still see no reason why that couldn't be the case. It could fix the timeline up a bit and make pinkly a contender as one of Diddy's parents.

[@SurlyUJest]

they've confirmed multiple times that Cranky is DK's grandfather, not father

[@1stCallipostle]

​@@SurlyUJestThey've said both over time. Which is why it's a headache and a half.

[@Eris1987]

Various sources have called DK III the grandson of Cranky who is stated to be the original DK as recent as DKCR. Also, DK III never saw Mario were the Classic outfit and seemed to had met him in Mario Vs. Donkey Kong alongside MiniLand Mayhem being where he first met Pauline.

[@Dr_Damon_1111]

How soon is soon it's been a year!!!

[@AizaBreathe]

how about Swanky Kong being related to Donkey and Funky? since he didn’t appear in DKC (1) they might not talk to each other, like it’s not said they are bros 😅 but i could imagine

[@Barveth]

I was today's years old when I discovered Candy is Dixie's older sister

[@commanderblackheart5856]

A lore inacuracy's: The "Ghastly Kongs" aren't actually related The Wii Jungle Beat manual say's that Ghastly King is trying to take over the universe with his Black Mist Creatures, the other Kong's you fight where the kings of the fruit kingdoms who Ghastly defeated in battle and turned them into mind-slaves, they have no ties to Ghastly outside of the aforementioned enslavement and are likely NOT the result of mutation, especially given how old Karate Kong is.

[@Ringtail]

I still subscribe to Panoots's theory that Fedora Kong is Donkey Kong II hiding from his family after the trauma of the ape war

[@epp678]

Head Cannon: King K. Rool Has A Fur Coat That Is DK Jr.’s Fur

[@nicoflight3982]

well the young cranky couldve been fighting who we all know jumpman marios father as they say

[@wafflegear]

the movie seems to imply that mario's dad is 'mario bros' mario that cranky kong fought

[@Eris1987]

It doesn't imply that.

[@Tablecuppz]

or maybe, marios granfather, just like cranky is dk3's grandpa, jumpman is probably mario's grandpa, i really hope we can get a look at jumpman now

[@sahilhossain8204]

Lore of The Kong Family Tree - A Danger To The Space-Time Continuum momentum 100

[@DrSmug-yj9ot]

Fedora Kong is p DK Jr., but as an adult.

[@qoombert]

Maybe in The Mushroom Kingdom there is a sort of αμβροσια, the thing that makes you immortal (actually just unaging) like in greek myths. That would explain the ætrrnal youth of Mario, princess Peach and others from the mario cast.

[@qoombert]

as @sterlingdragon123 points out, the ambrosia may be the one up mushroom. it's obvious too!

[@finnmarr-heenan2397]

I call it the kong-tinum

[@Fossilized_Tea51]

at this point "kong" is proboley just the species

[@luks7069]

still waiting for the Mario video ☝🏼🤓

[@princessmaly]

"Maybe it's time travel and DKIII is actually Cranky or Cranky is DKIII from the alternate past where the future never happened and DKJr. is secretly a clone and and and..." Jumpman is Mario's dad. It's not that hard. This is old news.

[@backseatsakurai]

In DK Jr. it refers to that era of Mario as Mario, I show it in Mario Map 2. Though I did always think that was a fun theory

[@Bacxaber]

I prefer the theory that Fedora Kong is DK Jr., and he died as a prisoner of war in Mario RPG.

[@aprinnyonbreak1290]

We have seen the Mario Movie. I can't wait to see Nintendo bring The Great Ape War to life

[@Bacxaber]

If you're implying I got the theory from the movie which I haven't seen, or that the theory originates from it, you're wrong. @@aprinnyonbreak1290

[@aprinnyonbreak1290]

@@Bacxaber I just want a sequel following the events of the Great Ape War, the great mystery of Donkey Kong's lore

[@theprimegamer7086]

Regardless of statements that disprove it, i prefer the theory that jumpman is the father of mario, then yoshi's island happens where he ends up in the same world as the mushroom kingdom, comes back to live in the same world as his parents with luigi for the mario brothers arcade game then return to the mushroom world to stop the koopa troop from invading. Also gorillas have shorter lifespans than humans and jumpman appears torturing dk sr in various games with dk jr so id say its natural to have 3-4 generations of kongs with just 2 generations of mario

[@Eris1987]

It's more like an incorrect hypothesis, a theory is typical something that has proof behind it while an incorrect hypothesis is well disproven. It is established that Mario is Jumpman. Mario Bros. takes place in the sewers of Big City which is on the same planet as the Mushroom Kingdom. The Koopas were probably sent after the Bros. specifically by Bowser. Kongs age rapidly, are sapient, and speak their own language, and live in a high fantasy world with hexapod dragons.

[@lordpsi99]

I would like to see your Mario follow-up video. I hope your work didn't get lost!

[@samuelkernohan267]

Ok halfway through this video I straight up through “no way this is real. He’s just making up donkey kong’s” (I know it has to be real)

[@YophiGames]

Unknown Fedora Kong would fit as Diddy's dad and Donkey Kong III's brother, as Donkey took Diddy Kong in, so maybe he's looking out for Diddy because he knows how much of a deadbeat his brother is. It also makes sense to have Swanky as the father and his money chasing ways are so large that nobody even tells Diddy that Swanky is his father.

[@xylopiano3]

Missed chance to make the "continuum" in the title "Kong-tinuum"