THE NEW CHEATER SWITCHES...

[@RoastedSushii]

Tip: Don't calibrate on the Sayodevice by pressing down hard, press down lightly. If you press down hard, you can cause the calibration to read more than what you get from a normal keypress such as when you play osu! This causes the key to release by the finger shaking at certain settings no matter the switch. Gentle is better!

[@Shikkesora]

Absolutely vouch, pinned comment! I forgot to mention in the video that I was doing it as hard as possible just to get the most raw data for the Tierlist. For me what works best is not to do it gentle but to try do it slowly, but pressing just 20% hard or something (slightly hard) just to replicate what you do when you play (at least in my case I monke tap sometimes).

[@Rlsc1109]

as a sayodevice admin i must say, actually the best way to do is not to calibrate the switches all the travel down like decrease around 100~200 raw data and better to adjust a bit the rt end. Although the full travel soft pressing calibrate has nothing wrong, but there is still a slightly chance that the key would accidentally release.

[@Shikkesora]

Interesting! @@Rlsc1109

[@RoastedSushii]

I have also found this to be quite good at allowing you to min max your settings, ty for a data number! @@Rlsc1109

[@DriftJunkie]

Disclaimer: I am not a keyboards enthusiats. I am an electronics engineer, using low travel, rubber dome keyboards for everything. In this video it feels like the author is manipulating the results, to promote one of the products. Hall effect sensors are analog devices, reporting voltage differences with theoretically infinite resolution (raw data). The (raw data) values you are reading, are all dependent on the Analog to Digital conversion electronics, which should be housed in the testing device (I wouldn't expect complicated electronics to be placed inside each switch. Too big & too expensive to do. So, the resolution (raw data) read of each switch, is fully dependent on precision of the testing device. Also, hall sensors are very precise & delicate sensors, so this test, showing that one of the keys doesn't change its state when the key is wiggled around, to me, an electronics engineer, shows that this key is defective.

[@LittleLily_]

All that raw data is, is a measurement of the magnetic strength the hall effect sensor under the key is measuring. As the key is pressed down, the magnet in the key switch gets closer to the sensor on the board, and so the raw value goes up. So basically all a higher value means is that the magnet in the switch is either bigger/stronger or it got closer to the sensor. Given the distance to the sensor shouldn't differ much as the switches are all similar shapes, it just means that the raptor switches have stronger magnets in them. By itself, a stronger magnet does not equal better, so the claim in this video that higher raw data = better isn't necessarily correct, but what a bigger magnet might do is make the sensor see more variation between the minimum and maximum readings, and therefore be able to have a higher effective resolution. This would depend on the specification of the hall effect sensors in the board though and what sensitivity they have between various ranges of magnetic strength. For example one hall effect sensor might be more accurate between values of 200-2000 or something like that, and another might be more accurate for lower values of 20-200. So for maximum precision you need a combination of a switch that is fairly stable (doesn't wiggle much) with a magnet who's strength lines up with the range where the hall effect sensor you're using is most accurate. With most mechanical keyboards, people are used to the switches being all that really matters, whereas with this style of switch all the smarts are really on the board, not the switch, so the switch is just determining the strength of the signals given (which isn't always stronger = better) as well as some of the stability of the readings (like if the moulding allows the magnet to wobble more).

[@Shikkesora]

Thanks for sharing your comment! I put a disclaimer saying what I say might not be correct and that I'm not an expert, hopefully people don't take what I say as an objective truth, cuz it's not meant that way, I don't know how all this stuff works I just share what made me play better

[@St0RM33]

i thought the same but the issue is not the range but with missclicking; to quote a part of my comment: "edit watching the video again, the issue seems to be a combination of switch mechanical fit tolerance and hall effect sensor sensitivity; it's possible that on the raptors you are maxing the sensor but from the calibration value i don't think so, looks like it should go up to 2048"

[@parloca13]

Exatamente a tendência é o sensor com mais força no imã ter mais condições de repostas efetivas....mas isso por si só não define a capacidade do do switch ser melhor ou não, existe a PCB - existe as controladoras (MCU) do teclado etc. Colocar os Lekkers em uma PCB + MCU ruim, não faz seu teclado virar um wooting 60HE apenas por ter o mesmo switch

[@d-floe]

I dont think I've ever heard of someone complain about the quality of GEONs products. He's clearly a man with an eye for sheer quality. Absolutely brilliant.

[@Grundoko]

DrunkDeer keyboards use their own switch design which is not compatible with Wooting and other hall effect switches, because the switches used by the DrunkDeer have the magnets off-center.

[@sean12444]

yea its kinda a bummer but at least theyre spring swappable, 35g with rapid trigger is pretty nuts

[@uwuowo7775]

​@@sean12444 what is so helpful about spring swapping? Are there actually better and worse ones that make a big difference?

[@Rlsc1109]

they dont use or made their "own switches", they use a switches that oem called raesha and it called raesha white

[@julpezri]

@@uwuowo7775just feeling

[@sean12444]

@@uwuowo7775 spring swapping just changes the amount of physical force you need to apply for the key to go down, lighter springs require less force to bottom out whilst heavier springs require more typically people stick with like 60g springs and 45g is considered light, 35g is kinda overkill but i have them

[@GoatedASF2K]

POV: you boght a few of them to test but forgot u dont have a hall effect keyboard

[@Rlsc1109]

Raptor HE uses optimzed gateron mold, which is same size of spring coil and housing so that you can swap any parts with gateron ks switches. Overall they were same design as gateron ks/lekker series but improved stability, and having more magnetic. Please attention that any drunkdeer keyboard, atk keyboard(it uses gateron 2.0 but different housing design) or any keyboard that uses different swicthes design to gateron could may not compatible with it. Fun fact: you can swap lekker switches stem to raptor HE and get the maximum stability and wobble issue was insanely eliminated, we calling it suturing a switches. REMEMBER DONT BUY ANY GATERON 2.0 THAT WITH SQUARE MAGNET THEY ARE DIFFERENT MAGNET DIRECTION AND POSITION

[@Shikkesora]

I recorded this a while ago, I will try all of them for the next vid! :D

[@dragonwulin]

I don't think the raw data matters really. The keypad is still pulling data at the same speed, and since it rounds to the nearest 0.1mm, the larger data numbers won't matter. Raptor HE has a much stronger magnet which is why the raw data (i think magnetic force) is larger. Also I vouch for the gateron jade switches which is very smooth, very light, and has shorter travel distance which is really underrated.

[@Shikkesora]

I see! Maybe the Raw Data doesn't really have much to do with performance but they surely win by a landslide compared to the switches in the video (at least in my experience as a high level player) I just ordered the Jades!!!! Next week new video with new info I gathered from the comments and new benchmarks :3 Thanks!

[@DriftJunkie]

It does not. The raw data read is fully dependent on capabilities of the Analog to Digital Conversion electronics, which are part of the testing device the author is using. What more, the fact that the key doesn't respond to wiggles when pushed fully, shows to me, an electronics engineer, that the sensor is defective or has some deadzone.

[@dragonwulin]

@@DriftJunkie ​The device is a simple board reading the change in magnetic force when you press a switch, really. It's very customizable but has no dead zone. It takes the default position and registers it as 0 and takes the max position and registers it at a certain number. The pinned comment of this video explains the rest pretty well. It's not supposed to respond when you wiggle since you don't want it to be too sensitive. Yes, there is a dead zone if you think about it in this case, but it's fully manually calibrated.

[@gillsejusbates6938]

PCB designer and embedded dev here. The Hall-effect sensors used in this PCB are unipolar on the Z-axis, probably a TI dvr5055 or some cheap china clone. This sensor has 3 pins, input voltage, output voltage and ground. If you read the datasheet of the sensors, you will find that the output voltage relies mainly on 2 things, the input voltage, and the strength of the magnet. The output voltage gets read through by the chip on one of its analog pins and is converted into a number, which gets printed on the screen. the higher the output voltage, the higher the number. What your test demonstrates is that Geon's Raptor switches have the strongest magnet. If I had to guess without having a look at the firmware, the 1850 reading means the ADC pin read a maximum dV/dt of 1.85volts(assuming V=0 at un-pressed position to simplify), and saves that value as being fully pressed down. From there it can calculate how many volts are required to for example actuate the switch at 2mm travel distance. This would mean that the raptor switches have a higher resolution, which is part of the truth. The other part of the truth is that hall effect switches aren't always operating in a linear way, the higher resolution/sample-range could land you into a range that the sensor or firmware isn't made to optimally work at. Also, a bad designed PCB can generate a lot of noise, especially on mixed analog-digital circuits where you have multiple 16-bit multiplexers that are constantly switching at high speeds, inducing crosstalk/noise into analog victim lines. Or the board has been designed is such a way that doesn't provide an accurate return path for the signals, which is also bad for performance(you would be surprised how many boards have terrible PCB design). Keeping the temperature stable is also very important for most hall effect sensors, and i wouldnt trust chinese manufacturers to use the expensive sensors that account for temperature switch. Try testing it in the freezer and outside in the sun and see if you can get a difference! my prototype used cheap china sensors and i was getting a lot of noise from just breathing on them!! What I'm trying to convey is that the 'best' analog switch is more dependent on your hardware, the talent of the firmware devs and the software, than the switch itself(except for sound and feel, those are personal). It's tough for a non EE to test all of this in a reliable setting, but it would be interesting to see the results. good luck on future videos, cheers. edit: calculation for sensor from datasheet: 7.3.2 Magnetic Response The DRV5056 outputs an analog voltage according to Equation 1 when in the presence of a magnetic field: where VOUT = VQ + B × Sensitivity(25°C) ( × (1 + STC × (TA ± 25°C))) • VQ is typically 600 mV • B is the applied magnetic flux density • Sensitivity(25°C) depends on the device option and VCC • STC is typically 0.12%/°C for device options DRV5056A1 - DRV5056A4 and is 0%/°C for DRV5056Z1 - DRV5056Z4 options • TA is the ambient temperature • VOUT is within the VL Magnetic flux that travels from the bottom to the top of the package is considered positive. This condition exists when a south magnetic pole is near the top (marked-side) of the package. Magnetic flux that travels from the top to the bottom of the package results in negative millitesla values. range (1) As an example, consider the DRV5056A3 with VCC = 3.3 V, a temperature of 50°C, and 67 mT applied. Excluding tolerances, VOUT = 600 mV + 67 mT × (30 mV/mT × [1 + 0.0012/°C × (50°C - 25°C)]) = 2.67 V. The DRV5056 only responds to the flux density of a magnetic south pole.

[@gillsejusbates6938]

@@Shikkesora also let me tell you a funny story about the wooting pcbs. a friend of mine once brought one to my workbench, and we measured that the hall effect sensors were operating at 4.2volts +- 0.5v(which already is crazy unstable) - then i read the datasheet for those sensors. it explicitly tells the designers to use either 3.3v or 5v, but NOT anything in between (: edit: datasheet DRV5056 7.3.5 Operating VCC Ranges The DRV5056 has two recommended operating VCC ranges: 3 V to 3.6 V and 4.5 V to 5.5 V. When VCC is in the middle region between 3.6 V to 4.5 V, the device continues to function, but sensitivity is less known because there is a crossover threshold near 4 V that adjusts device characteristics.

[@sguzaki4545]

1:04 Well not every keyboard actually, all of these are North facing magnetic poles which are incompatible with Akko's HE boards. But the good thing is, almost every HE switch is compatible with the Sayodevice, North and South poles. The only incompatible switches here are normal contact switches and HE switches with protrusions into the PCB.

[@justbubba4373]

I've been using an apex pro since before rapid trigger was even an idea. Hall switches are genuinely the best decision I have ever made.

[@St0RM33]

it's just the magnetic field strength mate..as long as it's in the min and max range is fine..you don't gain anything with a stronger magnet the step size will be bigger, what is important is than min and max field strength is in the range of the hall effect sensor sensitivity, edit watching the video again, the issue seems to be a combination of switch mechanical fit tolerance and hall effect sensor sensitivity; it's possible that on the raptors you are maxing the sensor but from the calibration value i don't think so, looks like it should go up to 2048

[@Shikkesora]

If you watch closely the video when I'm calibrating the switches, I said that I got more than 2000 data before with a different GEON Raptor, so what you say makes sense!

[@Eggawii]

That’s it… I’m convinced… I’m buying the switches

[@pann5n]

In this video, the host explores the latest gaming switches, specifically focusing on Geon Raptors. The title immediately grabs attention with its reference to "cheater switches," hinting at the potential advantage these switches may offer to gamers. The video likely begins with an introduction to Geon Raptors, providing background information on their design, mechanism, and intended benefits. The host may discuss the key features of these switches, such as actuation force, travel distance, and tactile feedback, highlighting what sets them apart from other switches on the market. Good video make more plis

[@AKFGinstrumental]

nice video ;)

[@Iak_Gnaw]

1:13 *works with PCBs that have the sensor on the bottom of the switch, my friend cant get the raptor he to work on his polar65 (sensor is in front of the switch)

[@Rlsc1109]

polar65 uses gateron 2.0 but square magnets version which had different position and the most important things: the direction of the magnet and hall effect sensor is opposite to the raptor HE.

[@cliftonchurch6039]

When trying to explain why raw data number = better, I would compare it to screen resolution. A 65" TV is the same size no matter what, so the only thing that can effect image clarity is screen resolution, where more pixels means more visual clarity. In the same way a key switch has a standard travel, the total distance a key can be pressed, and so the only way to get more accurate data is better resolution. In that way, if you double the resolution you can be twice as accurate in the key's exact position. As someone who had a Dreamcast, and is now showing a preference for hall effect joysticks in my game controllers, The killer device for my PC gaming is a hall effect keypad like the old Logitech G13 (which I still run daily) with each key having haptic feedback. Let me get feedback based on what percentage of keypress I'm pushing directly back into that finger.

[@Shikkesora]

That makes so much sense! Thanks for your comment :D

[@tonisnooker]

I liked the looks of the swtich ngl. Didn't know they'd performed better too

[@siriusgames_]

I switched from Outemu (yiqian) pink to Gateron Jade, and I can say that they are simply perfect. Sayo case does not wobble; when calibrated, it gives a value of approximately 1400 (a 3.5mm magnet is installed on it). The ringing sound of the switch disappeared. There are no problems with double click either.

[@Frozoken]

Phenomenonal video and exactly what I was looking for. Regardless, If one thing is clear it's that hall effect switches demolish mechanical ones in performance in all ways. Having both a much more performant and faster than speed switch keyboard for gaming and a longer actuation keyboard tailored to you for typing all in one is phenomenal. I've had 3 gaming keyboards and they were membrane first then mechanical cherry browns and then now hall effect and each has been a massive upgrade over the last. Only upside other than cost to mechanical now is tactility and sound presuming u don't already prefer linear mechanical keyboards in which case there's 0 downsides. They also last longer. I'm never going back

[@StephenMcGregor1986]

Wooting 80HE and TTC Magneto switches is what I am looking forward to

[@celakkvfx]

sound > gameplay

[@RC-1290]

When you say "Raw Data", I think you're trying to describe the bit depth, or the precision with which the amount you press down is described. The difference in value per given distance. So depending on the tolerances in the part (the amount of 'play') you'd need slightly different values. It seems to me your demonstration most accurately describes that you can't use the same settings for different switches. Not necessarily that you can't get a good setup with one of the switches you called bad. Sure, higher bitdepth means less aliasing, but I think it's more helpful to look at orders of magnitude than comparing exact values, when they're similar.

[@Shikkesora]

I understand your point but it's objectively not true I can't use the same settings no, that's why they suck, if I put lower settings they will mess up my inputs which forces me to put higher actuation point. For me and pretty much everyone that wants to play speed, higher actuation = less speed and more fingerlock. So lower actuation = more speed and less fingerlock. Hope that makes sense!

[@Shikkesora]

Ah also forgot to mention this but when I say raw data I say it because it's literally what it says in the keypad screen

[@RC-1290]

@@Shikkesora I understood that you meant the values displayed. I was just trying to relate it to a more general concept. Perhaps I should've gone for the word resolution. I get that there are benefits to higher resolution, but I'm warning against looking at that number as an objective measure of its quality. A super squishy plastic could give higher values. Or it could just report high numbers while being really noisy. And sure, I guess the test might be fine for figuring out which switch has the combination of the highest resolution and lowest noisefloor. But it also makes it seem as if the other switches are broken, when it's just not configured with them in mind.

[@dergzx]

I already read the comments that you ordered the gateron jade. They are good, but order another Gateron KS-20U double-rail from mechkeys shop for review. They were released at the same time as the jade and judging by the reviews have much more stem stability than the jade/lekker/raptor and whatever else is out there now. Also no video reviews on them, you'll be the first :)

[@BenjaminG12979]

I have only 1 question, 0:11 what is that document?

[@Shikkesora]

It's in the description btw!! Its just a list of almost all the hall effect boards to date

[@puffonxe]

wtf i thought ~190 was normal i actually got scammed

[@sendevia]

waht edit oh nvm

[@lad2987]

I get 230 normally 😭

[@boy-who-likes-bats]

what. i use laptop keyboard because the travel is so little, mech keyboard guys are beyond insane. i'm surprised hall effect isn't here sooner, clearly cost prohibitive is something mk people have ever heard of before

[@Shikkesora]

Okay just for your information, I recently tried Hall Effect with a couple O-rings in the keycaps, which make the travel shorter obviously, and it felt really freaking good, probably replicating the feeling of a laptop keyboard. You should try something like that on a keypad or something, might fit you if the full travel is too long!

[@boy-who-likes-bats]

@Shikkesora are the h.e. switches plug n play, or do you need to install software to configure them? i'm a v e r y big fan of tactile keyboards, the lil scissor switches in these cheap-o keyboards have a nice heavy wall, and a thunk for a break. never been a fan of linear switches at all, and of the few mechs i've built, haven't really found anything as short stroke and tactile as my old laptops.

[@Shikkesora]

​@@boy-who-likes-bats Oh, I think there's no tactile Hall Effect switches in the market for now :( since the switches are analog and the actuation can be anywhere, we would need a technology that puts the bump higher or lower depending on how you set it up Responding the first one, yes, they are plug and play, but if you have a HE board it will let you change around the settings and stuff. The wootility for example for Wooting, it's not even a software just a website where you can configure your keyboards without installing anything

[@Breno606]

awsome review bro!!! You can tell me if ATK68 is compatble with Geon Raptors???

[@AnimByBmXu]

Are the Geon Raptors still the highest raw data HE switch out there anyone has tested?

[@xaytana]

I wish the peripheral space, gamepads included, would move away from hall sensors. They're noisy as all hell, inconsistent as all hell, and they develop voltage drift as they age. Alternatives aren't even that expensive, such as MR sensors, or even inductive position sensing, not to mention the solutions outside of the space of electromagnetic sensors.

[@Shikkesora]

I can agree to certain extent but rapid trigger with HE is the best thing that happened to osu players hehe

[@MajatekYT]

I've been looking at Hall effect switches with great interest, but I'm a wannabe author/programmer and what really annoys me is wobbly stems. Still looking for good non-wobbly switches. ^^'

[@tuanlangtu9138]

I think jade equivalent to geon raptor. The thing is, geon raptor use open housing. So u can made more raw data as the geon magnet came close to the sensor with a bit mire force. Jade however use close housing. No deadzone

[@Shikkesora]

@@tuanlangtu9138 Jade is not equivalent, feels more friction and over lubed, good for control and feeling but not for speed

[@tuanlangtu9138]

​​@Shikkesora how about new gateron jade dual rail. Not the orange stem one. I believe they called jade mahjong dual rail mini e. Have u test it yet? I want to know does it compatible with my redragon m61. Cause it using retangular magnet. People say it will burn my pcb. But gateron said it will compatible with wooting(a typical one that can use normally jade switch)

[@Gwiddyy]

ok we will start the video as if you already know *proceeds to explain it for anyone who doesnt know*

[@Shikkesora]

KEKW

[@eastcoasthandle]

Wow, awesome demonstration on those switches. Who can actually counter what you've shown to say that, somehow, the other switches are better in competitive games like FPS? ????

[@eastcoasthandle]

@Shikkesora Boardzy is vindicating your video and people missed it. He is reviewing the Steelseries Apex Pro Mini and he explains exactly what you pointed out. Even though they use OmniPoint 2.0 switches the principal remains the same about mis-inputs. KZbin Video: Did Steelseries KILL Wooting Keyboards? At the 2 minute 21 second mark of the video he says that at 0.1mm he would press a key on the Apex Pro and it would register like 7 times.... Vindication my man, vindication... 😊

[@beneverest7054]

uh, this is just a stability test (not saying that's a bad thing). But it seems like the raptors just have a bigger magnet (also not a bad thing). Bigger number doesn't necessarily mean better as far as missed inputs are concerned. The resolution on the lekker switches are already overkill imo, but the stability of the raptors is definitely an improvement.

[@Shikkesora]

I just talk from my experience as I player, it happens to be that the ones with more raw data are the ones that make me play better so that's how I shared it :D I'm no expert at this so thanks for pointing it out

[@SuperSlokky]

The issue seems to be related to the build quality of the switches. One switch wobbles while the other does not, and due to the rapid trigger being set very tightly, it registers a keypress. The row data is quite basic, the switch have a magnet attached to the stem, but the sensors located on the board, and why readings are so different confuses me. Probably magnet strength....

[@osku388]

How can the raw data matter in terms of which switch has the wiggle problem? Wouldn't a more sensitive switch be more likely to expose differences in build quality resulting in the wiggle? I mean that's not true but I just don't get why and is it really perceivable the difference between a 100 points switch and a 1000 when 4mm / 100 is already so small that you can't perform small enough finger movement to not activate it anyway?

[@osku388]

so just thinking if it's the same case as with mouses and graphics tablets where the dpi/resolution these days is just a marketing number

[@Shikkesora]

it's just my way of measuring it, it happens to be that the ones with lower raw data, are more innacurate, and that forces me to use higher distance in rapid trigger and actuation points, and if I just use a better switch, I can put those settings lower, therefore squeezing more juice out of my skill and speed with rapid trigger, without suffering the consequences of doubletaps, misinputs, key release when i didn't release, etc

[@andy02q]

Trigger 0.3mm and Release 0.2mm seems very tight settings; like you would possibly use to intentionally Release and Retrigger with just shaking the finger and no finger release at all. Obviously more raw data is better, but I wonder if 200 vs 2000 really makes a noticeable difference if both are calibrated independently.

[@Shikkesora]

They are not super super low, some ppl use 0.1mm like xooty when she tries to play speed for example. Mrekk actually sometimes disabled rapid trigger and puts a higher actuation because he is getting mis-taps and stuff, which I repeat, gets 90% completely fixed with the GEON Raptors (in wooting's keyboards/keypads too ofc), and I can even go with 0.15 and it'd behave like a lekker switch with 0.30, sometimes making mistakes yes but allows me to get so much more out of my tapping, and in general it's like you can get the best from both worlds, super low rapid trigger for when you really need it, but also moderately maintaining precision and consistency! Also yes, it makes a whoooole difference I can tell you already, I played with the outemu for around 1 month last year without knowing any better or anything at all, I was very happy with it but had to use like 0.60 and have a worse rapid trigger actuation distance too if I want to for example FC things or play tourneys well where I'd SB a lot randomnly or tap like 4 times in a triple causing me to miss and notelock a lot

[@DriftJunkie]

It does not. The raw data read is fully dependent on capabilities of the Analog to Digital Conversion electronics, which are part of the testing device the author is using.

[@Sommitps]

Could you try the Drunkdeer a75 and their Raesha switches, have heard good things about them and that they should actually be better than the lekker switches, but I don't personally know.

[@cloudwalker9572]

Mfw when my switches are red ' - ' At least they feel way better than my old cherry brown. xD

[@гидлерТВ]

mine default pink switches works good, and dont have such a problem, even with low RT settings, no doubletaps, nothing, it's like, just perfect. maybe im just lucky, maybe someone just want to advertise their super mega switches

[@Shikkesora]

I talk from my experience as a high level player, no one pays me to advertise anything I do what I feel would help other players.

[@kirasmith1147]

You should never have this problem when wiggling keys. 100% a software misconfiguration or a problem with the sayo

[@Shikkesora]

Happens with other devices too, again, this is only when pushing the limits of the rapid trigger, if you have normal settings nothing of this sort will happen. But when the actuation is so low, a better switch makes the difference.

[@kirasmith1147]

@Shikkesora I have actuation completely minimum on a 60he+ module. no matter how much I wiggle, it will not register a lift as long as the key is bottomed out. unless the sayo is significantly more sensitive than the 60he+ module, I don't think it's meaningful

[@janmagtoast]

your voice is so chill. i forgot to sub last time. changed that now :D

[@JacobSchueler-fe9en]

you sure its not because you are shaking your finger and its naturally moveing up and down

[@Shikkesora]

well, obviously, yes, but there's a point i'm trying to make

[@kristoferdevibar7600]

can this work in the arbiter polar 65 keyboard?

[@Shikkesora]

Unfortunately, no :( www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fuhjhqkvk8ghc1.jpg%3Fwidth%3D1179%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3Daa4338c3d388351bf16ce6a53163ccd8176e0f6d

[@ashtonki6769]

Not me thinking he said “GR” switches

[@clarkettinger6958]

0:44 That is not true, hall effect keyboards have existed for decades, it is specifically the wooting 60he that created this fad for hall effect keyboards among gamers, according to wooting's own website, they say that hall effect keyboards have existed since 1968.

[@Shikkesora]

@@clarkettinger6958 cool I think you know what I meant anyways

[@clarkettinger6958]

@@Shikkesora I wasn't trying to blame you, there is a very common misconception among gaming communities that Wooting invented hall effect keyboards. While it is impressive that they managed to implement it in to the existing mx style architecture and pave the way for many future keyboards. It completely discredits the entire vintage keyboard community.

[@Shikkesora]

@@clarkettinger6958 yeah I mean I know that they existed before, but they were properly adapted to gaming just now, I think what I try to communicate is clear, if I start talking about the history of it, the retention rate would go down, it's just the content I'm making knowing my audience are young gamers

[@MightyKongGaming]

I just got my piifox walker 75, would like to know it's stock kailh magnetic switch any good?

[@Hemi790]

I think that it is because of stem - housing tolerances the better it is the less the magnet moves left and right and so it has a more linear travel and at the bottom you are not able to make it wobble and so make it raise a bit yeah I said left and right and know I say this but trust , I have some ks-20 and the wobble exists and I think it makes them raise just enough you know . I would have to make a schematic to explain that . Anyways , stem - housing tolerances is on of the only possible explaination because in a switch there is no electronics but maybe the raptors have a better quality magnet or something it could also be it but seems weird because in the he switch market the magnets used have not always the same magnetic force so I think it doesn’t matter but it probably matters

[@Hemi790]

Never mind for the magnetic force of the different switches

[@Hemi790]

Sorry for bad English

[@imbingle]

great video, surprised you don’t have more subs

[@thomasszewczyk1923]

Hi, I have a humble request. Can you test the new lekker v2 switches, pretty please? Thanks

[@Naccer2]

When I calibrate my Geon switches it has 4.6-4.8k raw data, its so different from this info. I bought em of aliexpress cus of a lot of cheaper shipping. Any1 got the same issues?

[@Shikkesora]

Please look at my previous answers on the matter, I have answered this so many times!

[@Synophic]

Have you been able to test the gateron orange dual rail lubed switches?

[@Shikkesora]

Yes! Video in near future :)

[@numberz010]

Would love to see you review the new gateron jade switches

[@sm_tf7804]

Same I want to know what's best

[@heyo6198]

yo i got this geon switches, thanks to lifeline for distributing this to indonesia

[@Hnkka]

I love apex pro more than wooting. After fully customizing this keyboard i really cant do anything else

[@tadfibonacci4926]

Hall effects switches weren't "recently implemented into keyboards" they existed since the 70s. If anything they were one of the earliest switch and keyboard design. But it's true that modern hall effect switches has seen a resurgence lately.

[@Shikkesora]

well I think it's pretty clear what I meant xD

[@93SupaFly]

i bought a redragon k701 irelia hall effect keyboard and one thing i straight notice weird about the switch and the board, the pink outemu switch does not have the 2 prong stem, it just clean flat. But all other brand HE switches has the plastic prong thing, so it means i cant used other 3rd party switch. DAMMMM

[@Shikkesora]

Right! I hate when they do that... Its to cut costs!!! The keyboard I reviewed in my channel a few months ago had the same problem!!

[@93SupaFly]

@@Shikkesora but i just found out kailh has release new HE magnet switch that has flat bottom too. Its called Kailh Flame

[@jkjgdafglkjadsfjk225]

this will def help me get that 400pp score

[@MichaelHarto]

now, let's see if the FGC picks this up

[@shiro3146]

so now it is possible to make Keyboards that works like a joystick especially for that game that allows walking with analog joystick but not for keyboard like PSO2

[@enzeyess]

You should try using transparent keycaps for next one, anyways great video

[@Shikkesora]

Good idea! Sadly I don't have rn haha, white was the closest I could use, I will order some before I forget!

[@VicharB]

Thanks for this video, gives some useful insight on the magnetic switches. I am still on mechanical switches, Keychron V1 Max using TTC Silent Frozen V2 (also really like Gateron G Pro 3.0 Yellow), but I was wondering how come many manufactures of HE keyboards specify they are compatible with their/xxx switches only, like even Keychron Q1 HE states "*The Q1 HE is compatible with the magnetic switches sold on the Keychron website only.". Why is that so?

[@Shikkesora]

I am not sure! It's a nonsense in my opinion, I hate when they do that :( ! Less customization is not a good feature. Thanks for watching the video!

[@Neeeeeeeeeeeee]

Hi, I bought an o3c and I have raptor, jade and lekkers switches, but they all give an average of 800-900 raw, even with the configuration you showed in the video, what could it be?

[@Shikkesora]

The newer sayodevices give a lower number, but that doesn't matter, if you try a shitty switch, it'd give like 100. For me Raptors are around 1000-1200, Gateron and lekker family around what you said, and the shitty switches around 100 or even lower lmao. It's just a different way to display number but still proportional :)

[@Pulverrostmannen]

And still my IBM Model M gonna beat all these switches in accuracy 😅

[@that-red-oreo-guy]

Try the new Jade magnetic switches, they sound amazing. Apparently there “gen 2” Hall effect’s.

[@Aerobrake]

Problem with raptors is they use a red housing and not a clear one...

[@baecere2]

ok time to buy a wooting 80 and geon raptors

[@NightmareChronicles49]

can i used the geon raptors on my Drundeer HE keyboard that have north facing RGB?

[@Shikkesora]

@@NightmareChronicles49 I don't think so :(

[@NightmareChronicles49]

@@Shikkesora 🥲🥲

[@mataznuiz]

the new osu logo ur using in thr thumbnail isnt the new new one its the first version of the new one

[@nicotimov]

can someone explain why my sayodevice says i have 4600+ raw data with my default ping sayo switches?

[@Shikkesora]

I have replied this in other comments! Please look at the recent comments :) it's basically the same, its just the numbers have changed with the newer sayodevices.

[@Ohrami]

This is extremely misleading information. The analog-to-digital conversion device itself is likely registering different amounts of voltage from each of the switches due to differing strength in the magnets. Furthermore, the issue you see could be "fixed" by adding a dead-zone toward the end of the switch's travel, which very well could be what's happening here. This would be a bad thing, since this dead zone can be created artificially in software.

[@Shikkesora]

That's why I put a disclaimer I am no expert and encouraged people with knowledge to clarify in the comments, it wasn't my intention, I just try to share what made me play better. Thanks for your comment

[@moomz6388]

So basically buy this switch plus wooting keyboard, you have the best responsive switch raw data? and actuation reset?

[@elMario02]

And the optical switches. Where do they belong? Are they bad?

[@Shikkesora]

I've tried them. My experience was good! :D

[@elMario02]

@@Shikkesora ah okey, do they have more input lag than the magnetic one’s?

[@bloox2671]

What happened to the Gateron Jade switches review?

[@Shikkesora]

Been on a hiatus for a while, I was very busy with university, other projects, and now been in vacation for two weeks in my home country with family :) I don't have my recording/editing equipment. But trust, huge mega switches guide comparison is coming. I have read all the comments and bought all the switches you guys have been asking for Estimated time maybe 3 weeks. I still have two weeks here in my home country before I go back to Singapore.

[@sarinthegamer]

Can you please compare STICKY RICE HALL EFFECT SWITCH to the other Top 2 HE switches in this video …? Type: Hall Effect Actuation force: 40g Bottom out force: 50g Total travel: 3.5mm Mount type: PCB (5-pin) Top housing material: Polycarbonate Bottom housing material: Nylon Factory lubed

[@Yenfai]

What do you think about optical switches for playing osu? I used Gateron Optical 2.0 (KS-22)

[@Neeeeeeeeeeeee]

please bring a comparison of the jade switch with the raptor

[@MiniDark2049]

these are meant to be gatekept gang

[@vitorkuwabara42]

how do you setup the sayodevice to calibrate like that?

[@Shikkesora]

press the Knob (wheel) for around 2 seconds, the menu will come up!! do the same i did also remember to press it again after you do everything, pressing the wheel one time will mute your PC audio. if you don't hear anything, click the knob(wheel).

[@Nixo1x]

How much of a difference will I see in speed because I’m getting the Wooting and I have the red switches for the sayo device and I’ve always struggled with speed.

[@Shikkesora]

@@Nixo1x Rapid trigger or new switches won't necessarily immediately give you more skill. It's more like your boundaries will expand and it could be easier to see improvement

[@Nixo1x]

@@Shikkesora yeah I know that I just wanted to know if there is a noticeable difference. I’m only like rank 58k rn but I have like 380 hours and about 350 focused SOLELY on aim so I wanna start grinding speed more.

[@davidusfintor350]

im quite new to learning about switches what would these switches provide to me in fps games like valorant ? do i get lower latency with the higher raw data number ? kind of confused - also what would i need to fully utilize them ?

[@Shikkesora]

First of all, YES, it's lower latency generally speaking, since you can customize the switch however you want and can make it so the switch activates as soon as you press the key. And higher Raw Data won't make much of an impact for you, I speak from an osu! perspective where EVERY little more input you can get can make a difference when you're tapping 15 times per second. I recommend watching Wooting's videos about rapid trigger

[@HarryDaRed]

The fact when you press and wiggle the switch and it starts going crazy because of how wobbly the stem is but the raptor isn't had any wobble at all so that's why i didn't do that i think

[@lad2987]

Do you feel a large difference going from Yiqian to the Geon? My default sayo switches only get like 230 raw input

[@Shikkesora]

YES!!!! GET THE RAPTORS :) (or anything else)

[@lad2987]

​@@Shikkesoraalready ordered raptors :) I hope this fixes my dropped inputs

[@ppyree]

those gateron jade magnetic switches aren't good aswell? I've seen some reviews talking about them but I'm not sure if they're worth it at all, btw these geon raptor seems to be really nice to play on

[@patrikmedia]

the Jade should be very different to the Lekker, much better build quality, lower travel distance and probably best sounding. I'd be surprised if they fall close to Lekker since most people actually seem to prefer Jade over Raptor (generally speaking used in a Wooting, not just for OSU)

[@morgenanspyrys]

@@patrikmedia I have both and the Raptors sound better, at least according to "conventional tastes" (more deep / thocky). WIth Jades you can hear the Desk more, they are higher pitched / more clacky (which I usually prefer), but unfortunately they also have a really annoying high pitched sound that you can notice when bottoming out (probably due to the springs? could also be the magnet hitting the switch housing, the raptors wouldn't have this because the bottom design is different).

[@patrikmedia]

@@morgenanspyrys interesting, most feedback I heard so far were people preferring Jades over Raptors for feel and sound

[@morgenanspyrys]

@@patrikmedia idk what to tell you, my Raptors are smoother than my Jades (which have also have the classic Gateron Inconsistent Lube Job™). They objectively sound deeper (you can just look at a noise spectrum). This applies to both the Takka60 I have (Alu Case, Brass Weight, CF Plate, no Foams and OG Cherry Doubleshots from a 90s HAD), and my o3c (Rev 1 off Taobao). Add to that the cucked travel distance and the unpleasant high pitched ping they produce when bottoming out it's just a loss in every way (well I actually prefer the more clacky signature as evidenced by me using a CF plate but the ping is still terrible) Edit: And this isn't just a batch issue cuz I got some with my Takka60 from KBDfans from when I bought the Takka and another bunch off Taobao from when they launched originally in china

[@patrikmedia]

@@morgenanspyrys ok, I'm using Jades myself on a heavily modded 60HE, couldn't be happier with the purchase. I tried to lube a few but it ended up being identical to factory lube so I just used them as is, there is no inconsistency on my batch as far as I can tell, every switch feels and sounds identical to me. I was deciding between these and the Raptor but went with Jades not only because overall feedback was recommending them over Raptor, but also because i preferred to have the lower travel distance. I'm sure I'd be just as happy with Raptors if I'd pick those.

[@haruchiyo6278]

Is the Geon raptor switches compatible to all keyboard?

[@Shikkesora]

no only with the magnetic keyboards also I posted a list of all the magnetic keyboards in the description

[@haruchiyo6278]

@@Shikkesora Thank you!

[@papifernan3]

me using the 191 one XDDD

[@benjamin_reborn691]

Me too ☠️☠️☠️ (hey they aren't that bad for me i can still do duplicity shade or vibro with good accuracy)

[@papifernan3]

@@benjamin_reborn691 i cant vibro with these, extremely hard

[@jesus2056]

Idk how both outemu and lekker switches are compatible with this keypad. I thought those two switches have different polarity (I might be wrong lol).

[@Shikkesora]

They are!! All the HE switches I have tried so far (which are roughly 80% of the ones to even exist) do work with it as well!

[@jesus2056]

I know it’s not technically an outemu switch on the reddit post but my HE keyboard that has a pin-less outemu pcb don’t seem to work with Gateron/Lekker switches either. Good video btw.

[@Shikkesora]

@@jesus2056 that's also correct, I don't know, this thing is little but built like a unit, can handle anything 😂

[@blanky9129]

they dont have rapid trigger so consider staying with wooting 60he original switches

[@Shikkesora]

What do you mean?

[@blanky9129]

@@ShikkesoraThat they dont have rapid trigger😭

[@Shikkesora]

@@blanky9129 What do you mean? They do have rapid trigger. Any magnetic switch has it, that's not how it works.

[@amirulirfan5800]

can the gateron geon raptor work with the drunkdeer g60?

[@Shikkesora]

I don't think so unfortunately

[@Jaisukee]

I JUST ordered the Jades but I'm seeing this video and wondering whether to cancel and get these instead. Do you have a review of Jades coming soon? 😩 Great video btw!

[@Shikkesora]

Coming soon! Jades are great too!

[@Kehbi93]

still waiting for the jade raw data comparison 🙏@@Shikkesora

[@machitor8935]

Damn these raptor switches are little bit too heavy, it also looks like they sometimes little bit stucking on release.

[@Shikkesora]

Hmm not my case, maybe I'm just used to heavier switches

[@HoRiiZeN]

This is quality content

[@CVireq_]

Quick question, I’m someone who use the L45 and I’m wondering if I should go for the Jades or the Raptors. I like lighter switches more so I might go for the Jades but if the Raptors are better for speed I’ll go for it.

[@Shikkesora]

Are you an osu player (or high level player in other games in general)? Are you looking for speed? Then Raptors are for you! Jades are overall a good experience and the smoothest and cleanest sounding HE switch I tried, but it's not as good as Raptors for speed and precision :)

[@CVireq_]

@@Shikkesora wow that was quick… anyways thank you, I guess I’ll go for the raptors then since I’m an osu player, and I’m willing to sacrifice some sound for speed lol.

[@Shikkesora]

@@CVireq_ definitely!

[@zivik5577]

my sayodevice came with the terrible red ones, they are wiggly, i can barely get 180 raw data and i basically cant use rapid trigger at all cuz if i set the settings too low it starts to randomly doubletap they feel terrible to tap hard, just copped the raptor switches and im hoping to get a much better experience with them, thank you for the tips.

[@Shikkesora]

Glad you found out about this video then! :D Let me know how it goes :3

[@k680B]

"rapid trigger is all over the universe not only in osu, also seen success in esports", now that's rich coming from an osu player it will be a hard pill to swallow, and you probably never will swallow it, but you guys were DEAD LAST to the party, literally years after hall effect switches were dubbed the potentially best switch for any rhythm game fucking hell, pointing you at wooting for years, and once you finally listened you almost act like you invented the bloody thing

[@Shikkesora]

calm down buddy, I never said we were the first, turn it down it's just a video lol

[@ArznikAaron]

Nice info, have you tested the Steelseries switches, not sure if its their own design or not, would love to know the data from theirs as well cause I have an Apex Pro TKL 2023. Not sure if I could put raptor switches on an Apex, I would assume I could but you never know.

[@Shikkesora]

Not yet! i tried buying the switches separately but couldn't find it anywhere. Also the switches are not compatible as far as I'm aware :( I have heard good things about it though so no doubt it's a good keyboard!

[@KevinOnezzz]

Im waiting the comparation of lekkers, raptor y jade.

[@flyingwhale7176]

Have you tried the Gateron Magnetic Jades? I wonder how they fare in these tests. A lot of people have been swapping the Raptor stem with one from the Lekker, you should test the Franken Switch.

[@Shikkesora]

I definitely should try the Frankenstein switch. Yes I have tried! I actually recorded a video about them already but I had a mouth surgery and can't talk so the video has been delayed a bit. I will give you my thoughts here: They are super smooth, probably the smoothest hall effect switch there is out there, it's super satisfying and I would love to have a keyboard full of them, but unfortunately, for osu they don't feel great when I am trying to tap super fast, they are good for control and precision, but not for speed, GEON's are still my go to for high level osu gameplay since it makes the keys feel "bouncy" and end up using less stamina. Overall super great experience with Jades!

[@flyingwhale7176]

@@Shikkesora Wishing you a speedy recovery! Thank you for sharing your thoughts, I look forward to the Video as well :)

[@chengong388]

ok, but hall effect switches has been around for what 4 years? I got them in the Steelseries Apex Pro years ago...

[@Shikkesora]

I am aware of that, no need to try very hard I think you get my point

[@freakiehammie]

Does the he switch works on normal mechanical keyboard?

[@Shikkesora]

@@freakiehammie NO!!! Mechanical keyboards are mechanical. They only accept mechanical switches. This switch is a magnetic switch for magnetic keyboards, not mechanical Hope that clears it! That being said, I have a video on the channel talking about a very budget friendly magnetic keyboard to get into the space :)

[@freakiehammie]

@@Shikkesora ahh that make sense. Im new to this scene. Abit confused. Thanks btw and sure i will check it out

[@superxboy1234]

now that gateron jades are out what did you think they are compared to the Raptors HE?

[@Shikkesora]

jades are a lot smoother, good for feeling, premium quality, id like a full keyboard with them, but performance wise, they still are behing the raptors HE!

[@TheRealSamSam]

​@@Shikkesora but do they have better performance than the lekkers?

[@Shikkesora]

@@TheRealSamSam lekkers are slightly better!

[@TheRealSamSam]

@@Shikkesora so do you think the raptors are the better option for speed and acc or the jades bc of the light and smooth feel?

[@Shikkesora]

@@TheRealSamSam if you're playing really high bpm I'd advise you to not use Jades, but if you're a low bpm precision player go for it totally. Raptors are the best, mostly if you take the spring from the lekker green or yellow and put it inside the raptor feels much better!

[@lltalionll]

Interesting, i don't play osu but it's a really interesting vid about HE switches, i have Gateron Jade (KS-20T) in my 60 HE, i wonder if they are similar to the first gen gateron HE switches or closer to the raptor HE. Also did you heard about Raptor HE frankenstein mod ? (Raptor HE with Wooting L60 stem), it will be nice to see how they compare to the stock Raptor and L60.

[@Shikkesora]

Thanks for commenting this, I DID NOT KNOW!! But I am really intrigued, can you explain a bit about them? Also, I just bought the Gateron Jade! I will be making the review in about 5 days when they arrive :) I recorded this some time ago and I am pretty sure the Jades weren't a thing at that point or I just couldn't spot them

[@Rlsc1109]

similar to 1.5 gen which is like double rail ks20 orange.

[@lltalionll]

@@Shikkesora It's a stem swap (the part with the magnet), open both L60 and Raptor switches then replace the black raptor stem with the green lekker L60 stem. I can't find the video i saw about them but apparently the switches have less wobble and sound better (and feel even better if you lube them). If you have a switch opener lying around it might be interesting to try.

[@lltalionll]

@@Rlsc1109 Thanks, it's a bit disappointing :/

[@Rlsc1109]

@@lltalionll someone has sell stem swap raptor on taobao and some buyer comments has video, but you may a bit hard to watch it because it was fully chinese haha