The Problem with Presets

[@JamesonNathanJones]

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[@MistyMusicStudio]

As someone who loves designing sounds, I do think tweaking presets is probably better for musicians who aren't audio engineers. Sometimes I think it's only us synth nerds who really worry about if our tone is unique enough. Lots of artists just stick with tones they love and focus on the instrumentation, and I don't think that way of thinking should be off-limits for electronic artists. That being said... there is endless joy to be had in discovering new sounds for yourself. Furthering your understanding of sound can be incredibly rewarding in its own way.

[@makipri]

So many songs are based on a synth preset and add very little on top of it in the end. A good example is LFO’s LFO. Not only the sound but the notes in the chord come from the same preset. They added drums, bass, the bleep and the speech on top and .. that’s the song. When I get a new, old synth that I’m not familiar with my favourite thing is to find all the sounds I’ve heard in songs by other musicians. I got a laugh when encountering the very same sound that made 808 State’s In Yer Face distinctive while browsing through Roland D-550’s Presets. Jarre also has used many presets in various synths.

[@6079-smithw]

I subscribe to this. Nerds might have fun noodling around with synthesizers. But I claim on the side of music listeners you would rarely find a person waiting for any never-heard-before sound. Also, I have serious doubts that one will even design a sound that is not already covered by at least some of the well known flagship synths like Zenology. It's like trying to reinvent the wheel. And don't get me wrong - I'm not a pro and I also used to love tweaking synths myself. But I had to face that by accident and gladly it stopped me from wasting even more time.

[@MistyMusicStudio]

@@6079-smithw oh we DO have fun making strange bleep bloops lol. Admittedly most of them aren’t usable in popular genres but great for ambient, psytrance, soundtrack stuff etc. Lots of new sounds left to be made! It’s easier to wind up in unique places with modular synths and certain guitar pedals 👾

[@ChristopherOrth]

Being both a guitar player and a synthesist, it's always amusing to watch these conversations play out. In the synth world there is a huge push for originality, even though most people all make essentially the same sounds. But in the guitar world there is MASSIVE pressure to get EXACTLY the same sound as some piece of vintage gear. A synthesist doesn't want to sound like everyone else. But a guitar player wants to sound exactly like everyone else, but then label it as somehow distinctly "my tone". ...and both sides of this conversation are bullshit, because getting a song done is all that matters.

[@vaiman7777]

But the same people in EDM want the same kick & snare for their banger. But vomit at preset users 😅 Guitarist here also, hence I don’t care what I use or when either. I agree, it’s amusing to watch. Fwiw, guitarists are equally anal about tubes and cones blah blah. I bought a first release Kemper. Never humping a dusty ass cab around again.🎉

[@brianbergmusic5288]

I'm also a guitarist, although since my nocturnal bat-cave has to run silently, I'm stuck with amp-sims (but I digress). I think what is being described here is a universal phenomena: the learning process. Everyone who enjoys music and wants to participate in it will start out wanting to capture the sound of their heroes (guitar heroes or electronica-champs). Just as every visual artist uses references to hone their hand at their craft, so do are the disciplines of guitar tone-dialing or sound-design. Unfortunately, we are inundated with a world where people want instant satisfaction. Now that we are on the brink of an "AI" age (which is not really "AI" at all), we have more and more short-attention-span newbs who never grow past the beginner stage. No, it is not some sin to use presets. Orchestral music composition is a lot like being a champion of existing presets (although a lot more nuanced in scope). However, I would argue that sometimes knowing how to make basic sound recipes can give you results that are quicker if one starts form scratch (initialized patch) than scrolling through an endless library of presets in an attempt to craft the music in your head AND somehow sound like yourself. Most honest preset users end up mangling the preset beyond recognition anyways, so this point may be moot.

[@DmitryPuffin]

Presets are like a toolkit. Sometimes while writing you think 'oh, I need that "lately bass" patch in this song', and you just go and get that, without stopping the creative flow. Knowing where which presets are located is important, as when you should know where your hammer is when you need it. It's definitely not cheating, its about saving your time. I usually split my sound design session and my writing session, so I can focus just on one thing and make it good. This is how I got used to work with my Novation Circuit, and it actually makes me more productive all the time.

[@6079-smithw]

So true! I even think that the idea of having to 'design' your very own sound in order to produce appealing music was spread by amateurs only. Browsing Gearslutz back in the days, I frequently red posts along the lines "I never use presets, I always start with init patches". The authors were cheered for it. But whenever I happened to take a closer look at an authors profile it became obvious that he is not a professional. Maybe all that stems from a misconception of what Sound Design is by most practical means: Creating follies for making film soundtracks. Therefore you'd really be challenged to 'design' sounds by choosing the most appropriate material and think of ways to record and edit it in order to make audible what's seen on screen (like frying bacon to fake the sound of rain).

[@DerekPower]

I compare timbres to pigments as the former is to composers while the latter is to painters. Time was, a painter had to know how to make his own pigments. Now, a painter can go to any craft store and buy paint. But the pigments - made or pre-made - do not make the painting. So carrying this over into timbres, the pre-made timbres do not make the composition; the composer does. Personally, I lean toward presets because 1) I don't have the time to learn all the ins and outs of an instrument and 2) I tend to trust whoever has designed them to come up with something that I can use. Over time, yes, I can tweak or even create my own if so moved. But in the end, if something can help me create a piece of music, I will use it, whether I made the preset myself or not. In the end, the piece should sound like me and that often comes through in the other aspects such as melody, harmony, rhythm, and arrangement. Also, remember that artists also stand on the shoulders of giants. The "originality" comes not from "how many brand new things can be spotted" but rather "this work could have only come into existence because you and you alone made a series of infinitesimal choices that resulted in this work." If I choose to use a preset, it's because there's a quality that I want to use - or exploit if you like - in my piece. This is just one aspect of many that I am involved in.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Good analogy

[@MistyMusicStudio]

Very wise! I do know the ins and outs of creating patches and even so, many synths are full of incredible sounds that I might not have though of on my own. The people designing them absolutely know what they’re doing, and are creating them with the hopes that they’ll be used and inspire music 🎶

[@samprock]

As JMJ just said about presets last week, piano and guitar had just one fixed preset for centuries :)

[@samprock]

…. wait, adding a snippet of JMJ video, saying “here is what my friend JMJ is saying about presets …..” :)

[@samprock]

Before it was stupid debate analog vs digital, then DAW vs standalone, now re-spin of preset/sampling vs. design etc. Not your video, which is inspirational and not “we all jump now to splice or smthg”. In fact, technology achieved new heights, I only wish all synths designers have Polybrute like multi-instantiated presets with visual in VST effortless to understand preset better and automate with purpose.

[@Cautionary-Tales-Band]

My experience, admittedly as a synth player who doesn’t really like synth sounds, is that pretty much everything I’d find in a synth preset library is either: A: kind of cheesy and overly familiar, or B: kind of a “song in a bottle” - way too complex for anything other than melodically simple ambient music Synths can be used to make amazing, interesting noises, but in my view it requires way more hands-on engagement than simply picking a sound and playing a part. In particular, I think it requires much more interaction between arrangement & sound design, with synth sounds specifically sculpted to lock into the structure of a song. Just picking a preset and playing a synth as if it was a piano can sometimes work, especially if you’re going for retro vibes, but personally I think synths struggle to compare with pianos or electro-mechanical instruments like Rhodes pianos for these piano-style parts that focus on harmony or melody. My personal metaphor that helps me clarify my own thoughts is that synth presets are like printed images from other artists. They can be fantastic works of art in their own right, and great sources of inspiration, but if I’m working on a painting, I’ll probably need to paint each part of the whole myself so it all fits into the overall composition. (Unless collage, but that’s a different thing)

[@pad00]

I love your content, you're always saying the harsh truth that art in general requires practice and hard work instead of "quick tricks and tips that'll make you instantly better" to get views, keep it up

[@bricelory9534]

I don't find presets "cheating" at all, but I am personally in love with creating my own patches because I just find it fascinating to put together sound with the ideas I have. Honestly, I like creating my own presets that I've crafted as my sort of own musical toolbox - because the sounds are more "me" - they resonate with how I use them, and I know what ideas I had when they were made, so bridging the gap between musical idea and execution is a lot lower than it would be by flipping through presets I'm only half familiar with. Of course, there are some presets that are exactly what I want, so I just happily plug 'em in and do my thing. I find the same thing with sample libraries/instruments, but I also rarely use sample packs because I tend to just want to make the things I sample myself. But I also don't have a problem with people who like to remove what might just be intimidating noise to the process of creating the music they want to make - kinda like how some people keep only one or two distinct styles of outfit so they don't have to worry about what to wear, while I love to just kinda go into my wardrobe and pick what inspires me for the day. Regarding presets, you can make a lot of compelling and unique music using the same sounds or styles as everyone else - it's more about why you go into music, I think, than what tools you use to make it.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Largely agree here. I think it also depends on the kind of music you’re making - if it relies more heavily on the arrangement of sounds or the sounds themselves. Something like drone ambient is going to rely almost solely on sound design, so I feel like some time should be spent there attempting to do something personal.

[@bricelory9534]

@@JamesonNathanJones very true! The line of composition/arrangement/sound design/performance is more blurred than ever because of the power of music making tools, which I think can be pretty nifty!

[@JamesonNathanJones]

@@bricelory9534 Agreed! I love combining all of it!

[@jayneubauer3401]

every time I start a new song I choose 3 VST's (I am completely in the box for numerous reasons that are my own) along with whatever Kontakt instruments I choose. This forces me to really dig in to those 3 to get the most out of them for that particular song. Now, that being said, often a preset will inspire an entire project. It may be (and often is) edited to fit that particular song, as you mentioned, due to sonic density or whatever reason, but in truth, I don't typically stray too far from the original sound. There is an element of sound design as well, which is a lot of fun, but also a lot of work, and can be distracting from inspiration. Most times I will replace a preset within the project with a new creation. This way I can concentrate on the "flow" of writing and worry about the minutia later. But then again, sometimes it will take me in a new direction which may manifest itself as a new project or a rewrite/edit of what I had been working on. Now, sample libraries are a different matter. I have loads of them. One thing I try to stay away from is loops/MIDI files (premade). I have been a musician long enough and play enough instruments that I would like to think I can come up with my own parts my own way...... I would like to think, anyway.....

[@organfairy]

The way I see it is, that presets are only bad if they have become over-used and stereotypical (like the FM harmonica in the 80's). I use presets a lot because, after all there are only a few ways a trumpet, saxophone, piano, or xylophone can sound. If I need a more 'exotic' sound I will often design it myself.

[@zaqareemalcolm]

honestly the only reason I'd just defer to presets is because I only have so much time (especially for a hobby!), and personally I'd rather that the bulk of whatever time I can allocate to music be used for writing/composing, arranging and mixing, which are already daunting but imo "more" necessary timesinks on their own. if I had infinite time and energy, I'd do that too because in a vacuum, messing with a moog vst to see how each knob and switch worked was still alot of fun

[@dracul74]

I love presets. I am not a pro, but do make music weekly. Presets give me a starting point which saves me precious time. I mostly mangle them in some fashion often mangling in real time while I record with more mangling in Ableton. So, I use them and I love them, sorry (lol) !

[@JamesonNathanJones]

No need for apologies - this video is not anti preset :)

[@dracul74]

@@JamesonNathanJones thanks… was hoping I wouldn’t get banned :) I guess I always thought of presets as colors of paint… i pick a blue I like and then alter it for my painting. Btw, it’s a great topic for conversation and applies to more than music… I read a good bit and when reading fantasy I see some people hate fantasy’s tropes and others almost feel comforted by them. I guess I am somewhere lost in the middle. I just want my art or literature to make me feel something… if it invokes the response that is what I am looking for. Sorry for rambling on, lol…

[@MuffinMachine]

The other day I pulled out an old album (Republica - Self Titled) that I hadn't listened to in a long time. I spent a lot of time listening to this album in my teens, as a guitar player who had never owned or used a synth, trying to understand the sounds I was hearing. At the time they seemed incredibly complex and I had no vocabulary for them. Today when listening, now having a ton of experience with both formal and informal learning on synths, I can easily understand what makes the sounds on the album stand out and be interesting. I wouldn't have that understanding and ability to create my own sounds without learning synth basics back on the old FL Studio TS404 and onward through Serum and Pigments. But I still pull up presets and just play with them because sometimes a particular sound gives a particular feel and that leads to a particular melody that may not have existed before. With knowledge of what is happening though, I can take the reverb out of a synth patch and apply it to the entire project so everything meshes, or separate the oscillators into two instruments. You said all this basically but I'm just saying it again so that there is evidence that we all existed. Great video!

[@mod3l]

I think there are two sides to this coin. For me, it definitely feels logical to make and record my own sounds when making my own music that is released under my moniker. It hightlights what I do and what I can do. But for commissioned work that needs to fit a certain mould or a genre it definitely helps to start with the right sounding presets (that you can edit later if there is a need to do that). When you're on an hourly rate or even on a budget it makes no sense to spend extra hours doing stuff that will not matter at the end. If I need a juno sound, I'll grab a juno sunding preset and move on.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Absolutely

[@frankwalders]

Learning, doing and figuring out stuff is just so much fun!

[@jloiben12]

I feel this. I really want to get into FM synthesis but there just isn’t a lot of ways to learn. It is such a preset-based way of making sounds because it is so…. not standard. Like I wish someone would create a video series / show me the where I can learn more of how to make actually useful sounds (synth leads, brass, plucks, etc) because all I am really capable of is taking a preset and doing very minor tweaks to it which is just way more limiting then I’d like

[@TheBiggerNoise]

It's wonky and it's for the SY-77, but I found the following pretty good from the perspective of describing what sorts of sounds you can get out of various operator stacks at various frequency ratios. Herbert Janßen: SY Programming.

[@DEADLINETV]

To counter what you said, when I start programming a patch, that mostly takes me away from writing music. So when I'm writing I hardly ever program synths. The reverse, like you said, does happen that when you're programming a track can come up. It's great that both options are available. Plus one is not building a new piano or guitar to start a track, you use what you have. Right?

[@JamesonNathanJones]

I agree, and it really depends on the track in terms of how to approach it. I typically separate out the sound design so I have a pool of my own sounds to choose from when it comes time to develop an idea. The comparison that many have made to acoustic instruments doesn’t hold for me because acoustic instruments aren’t designed to be sound design tools. They are built with inherent mechanical limitations, so the player has to conform to what the instrument can do and learn to get the most out of it. With a synth, getting the most out of it requires some knowledge of sound design.

[@DEADLINETV]

@@JamesonNathanJones thanks for your time replying! And I can see what you're saying with the acoustic instruments.

[@stefankristinkov]

Thank you for not agreeing that there is no unique music today! You are right - like with presets, most people are just too lazy to look for unique music.

[@thecolorcomputer]

And then they get bored listening to the same old stuff 😂

[@neilloughran4437]

I think presets are great for just getting a feel for a synth.. i.e. understand the tonal range, do some tweaking to your own tastes and be inspired. With VSTs especially I find this really useful to get some ideas down in a DAW... the sheer breadth of presets available is breathtaking once you buy a few classic "collection" synths. With hardware I find myself hitting init after a honeymoon phase and rolling my own. The classic one for me is the Iridium... making sounds from scratch on that is just an amazing and addictive experience.

[@dj_timoy]

Along my electronic music journey, I went from "searching for presets", aggressively browsing through every patch to eventually find one that fits, to finding patches "close enough" and then diving in to find whatever I didn't like about it and changing it to then work. Now, since getting into hardware synths, I'm starting to get to imagine a sound and then make it accurately, as if I'm "learning the language of synthesis". I feel like it's pretty easy to tell when someone is just "organizing patterns" or when they're actually "writing music".

[@qbg63]

One thing I've learned from messing around with presets is how much of a sound comes from how you play it--it could even be more important than the patch itself.

[@qbg63]

Because of the dependency between the patch and the playing technique, that could be why reverse engineering patches is useful: you end up rebuilding the patch to work with your technique.

[@watchaddicts1213]

It's JOHN!!! John led me to TWO really cool instruments (both avail on SPIT) so thanks for that, John.

[@joshtackett]

Hey Jameson, Which would you recommend as a first synth between things like Prophet 6, OB-6, Pro 3, Take 5, or possibly UDO Super 6, Moog Matriarch or Arturia PolyBrute. Up to this point I have tons of great VSTs (Diva, Zebra, Repro, Omnisphere, V Collection, Serum, etc) but wondering if a hardware synth with bring something new to the table for my sound/workflow? Synth music I enjoy ranges from new and old Blade Runner, to Stranger Things, Trent Reznor scores, Daft Punk and Tron Legacy. Also, I’ve already got a nice controller (Studiologic SL88 Grand) so should I aim for a desktop module, or is the keyboard version worth going for? Thanks for any advice you can offer!

[@kunaikai]

I use the GarageBand present all the time. I usually make custom presets out of them. It’s a pretty great middle ground.

[@CaidicusProductions]

It feels like cheating, to me, not because I would feel like someone else is cheating by creating stuff with either or, but because for ME it feels like I didn't do the work of creating the sounds myself. But, again, it's a weird psychological thing where I realize the double-standard I'm doing by saying "not for them, but for me". Thinking about it like that, rationally, I don't think it's actually cheating. But... It does FEEL like cheating. :D I guess it feels like I have someone else's work in my own song instead of entirely my own. I think that's where the "cheating" feeling comes from. Then again, I've never listened to an excellent rap song with samples and thought "this song's ok, but it's not really theirs." Even if I totally recognize the original, the song itself sounds entirely like the rapper's song.

[@ArmageddonPunk]

You could also see it as a collaboration between you and the sound designer. I'm pretty sure that i often find uses for sonuds that the designers never intended.

[@CaidicusProductions]

@@ArmageddonPunk I'm not that creative, but I do like the idea of it. :D

[@kiillabytez]

You never really create the sounds. you only manipulate the available sounds into something different.

[@FirepowerIGuess]

This is all well said. I used to be a sample junkie, pretty much making drag and drop beats and calling them my own music. Thank goodness I've matured out of that phase and have learned when it is appropriate to use samples, and when it isn't.

[@DaveS-Ace]

I never use presets, I just don’t see why when u have a beautiful synth that can be used to create. And I’m trying to creat my own style/ideas I don’t want to listen back to my tune and think someone made that pre set. Yes I use pianos sometimes, and other instruments that u can’t design/change but that’s different. A synth is for synthesising not for using presets. Presets just give u a rough overview of what it’s capable of. For example I have an iridium that I looooooooove to bits, 4th one that finally didn’t have any problems, but that’s another story😂, but if I just used it’s presets, Jesus man what be an absolute crime. The sounds I’ve made on that and in a very short time blow my mind, they give me goosebumps it’s pure creative beauty. To people that use presets and that don’t creat their own patches, just give it a go, it’s not nearly as hard as u think, and the reward when u creat something great is so exciting, fun, inspiring, epic. And to top it off u feel proud, well I do anyway 😊

[@ultimateXsounds]

I have a lot of experience in creating music and sound design. The truth is that when you're making a song, you're focused on the idea. With 3 days to write a song for a project, there is no chance to making great sound design and music. I can't imagine losing 1-5 days for one sound. Using presets is a very good idea as a starting point. The songs I know from the 90s were mostly created on the sounds of factory synthesizers. Is it something bad ? I do not think so. It's worth being open to different options.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Lots of merit to both approaches, and absolutely agree that when working on a tight deadline, readymade tools are extremely beneficial and often necessary. However, there are instances when working on my own projects that the act of sound design itself has sparked the idea for a piece. It can be approached from either direction I think.

[@tedandersen5403]

I absolutely love your presets for virus ti. thank you for your work!

[@ultimateXsounds]

@@tedandersen5403 Thank yo !! I'm pleased to hear that !

[@feralfoods]

nice tracks, great sound. i totally agree with what you said-for example, i can spend hours in VCV Rack, no problem, just exploring sounds and techniques. i probably learned more about sound using VCV Rack for six-months than i did using a DAW for three-years!

[@bf0189]

I'm in the underground dance music world and presets are super common but will be deployed in interesting ways or very musical thus memorable if it's a good track. These days I'm moving away from techno, bass music...etc and going into a more 'organic' direction with house and disco (the real stuf not the cheesy megahits) so your friends video on the drums will be especially helpful! Getting a groove with drum samples to sound natural is a lot more tricky than most people think. Great video!

[@heatherpruner2284]

Couldn’t agree more! I’m all for presets and they have their place, but learning sound design is so educational and satisfying that it’s definitely something we should dive into as music creators. I’ve been taking a class on synthesis that starts from the very fundamentals of sound physics and goes all the way into complex modular synthesis, and I’m so glad I got on this path. I can tell it will really help me to truly take ownership and agency in my music creation process. I also like your points about layering and thinking like a mix engineer. Definitely something else I need to learn more about. Thanks as always for your thoughtful, balanced approach!

[@nobodyinterestingyou]

I love how relatable and insightful your videos are for us, music composers. Makes me feel less '' dumb '' when I hear and read comments about problems that used to make me feel like I was the only one. It truly Is inspiring!

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Thank you!

[@bricelory9534]

Regarding using presets to learn from, that is entirely my plan when I get my Osmose later this year - the Eagenmatrix is a terrifying but amazing synth engine, and I want to learn it badly, so I'm going to look at the presets that exist to see how they actually work. I'm excited to dive in!

[@TechGently]

You bring up a great point. I got the Korg Wavestate and it's just insanely complex and I think the only way I can learn that is to use the presets and examine them. Whereas my Roland SH-4d is a pure joy of an initialized tone dream machine.

[@mickeythompson9537]

The downside of the Osmose is that everyone is going to be using that deduk preset, and it's going to be everywhere.

[@bricelory9534]

@@mickeythompson9537 like how pianos and guitars and violins and clarinets are everywhere? Or hoe sawtooth wave sounds are everywhere? I get your meaning, but people are still figuring out the instrument, and I have yet to hear anyone running Osmose through effects, and only Expressive E's demos really tried to set the Osmose in musical settings. That is to say, the Osmose really blends in well to other settings, and even if it somehow becomes a ubiquitous instrument (it won't, I think), it'll likely feel like it belongs in the same way as piano, guitar, or even analog super saw pads. I think if we grow tired of the Osmose's dudek it's because people aren't being creative about it, but that's true of any sound or instrument. I personally am often ambivalent to the sound of saxophone, but even so there are times when it is used in a way I absolutely love, and it is exciting. I do think the Osmose has enough expressive range even in one preset to have that sort of variety: there'll be lazy ways to use it and fascinating ways to use it, like how there are ways to play piano that feel absolutely tired, cliche, and pastiche these days, but it's far from all it can do. Since it has like 500 presets, people are bound to explore more of those even without diving into the Eagenmatrix. And honestly, I'm okay if super saw swells take a back seat to something else for a while.

[@Ulvens]

Reverse engineering presets is one of my favourite past times. It's really fun, and I'm learning a lot. It's lead me to find some of my favourite sounds. Simultaneously I'm learning how to use the particular synth I'm working on atm, and others, it seems.

[@worthmoremusic]

New subscriber. Thank you for common sense, technical and melodically inspiring videos... Your knowledge is invaluable ! A former drummer, now I play guitar and for the last few decades have used some vintage Korgs along with Logic Pro and a plethora of plugins... I think presets can be a wonderful template as you mentioned. My thing has been trying to tweak them to something new, uniquely my own. Sound design has opened up a whole new realm in the world of the melodic ! 🙏

[@RaquelFoster]

I was watching JNJ's new video today, looking at the synths on tube scaffolding and thinking, "The Pro 3 is the coolest synth this guy has. Have I seen him use it? Maybe I just like that knob..." then A FEW MOMENTS LATER this pops up in my feed and 9:55 bam! Pro 3! I'm probably being stupid, but I think it's pretty obvious that a patch on the Pro 3 would be inspiring. Because the Pro 3 is badass. Springs is so good. It's the type of thing I'd play at a sketchy house party at 4:30 am, but then someone would give me a bump and I'd have to switch to a Chris Liebing track. Some of JMJ's stuff reminds me of Ulrich Schnauss or like Dive or Past is Prologue when Tycho was good. I don't know how anybody works with stuff they don't connect with. Whether it's a synth or a VST. It needs a good interface. But it also needs a good vibe. It needs some personality. I need to want to use the thing. Like Marie Kondo says, just sell your synths if they don't spark joy. Maybe you like something for ridiculous reasons. Who cares. I like stuff with red blinking lights. I like to see the blinking running lights on my 606 triggering the blinking running lights on my SQ-1. I wish my Minitaur had more blinking lights. Some stuff is really good but it's a bit of work to connect with spiritually because of the lack of blinking red lights. My Jomox MBase11 is clearly better for kicks than my 606/727/TR-6S are, but the blinking trigger and MIDI lights are VERY small. I have a hack, though. I hook it up to a Korg Pitch Black Custom pedal which makes pretty lights when the kick triggers.

[@kristoferkristensen9021]

This was great, thanks. I have a semi-modular synth sitting on my desk here and I have used it embarrassingly little because I've been intimidated. I will commit myself to making a song using only it. Thanks, Nathan.

[@distantsea]

It's not exactly the same as building a sound with a synthesizer, but I was looking for a way to replicate the crunchy electric guitar sound. I don't have the cash to buy a guitar and amp or a guitar sampler, so it was a fun challenge for me. I ended up realizing that an amp simulator like Guitar Rig Player can amplify any sound you chuck at it, and decided to try using an acoustic guitar and putting the audio files through the amp sim. It's certainly not the same sound, but what surprised me was how close it sounded while also sounding unique. Really opened my eyes to what can be done with tools when you're on a budget and have even a small bit of creativity. Needless to say, I spent a lot of time running vsts through the amp sim to see what would happen

[@rayderrich]

On my journey to make synth music I found out that making presets was even more fun than playing them. Of course I make few songs this way, but I do love my new hobby.

[@mjfentertainment6927]

That piano in the beginning was beautiful, was that something you composed?

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Yes, thank you! Hoping to release it later this year :)

[@brianbergmusic5288]

Thanks, I had the same question.

[@commodoor6549]

I think in many ways you're correct in thinking that a background in orchestrating can give people an advantage. But there is something to be said about artists using tools without being encumbered by a set of rules that need not be followed to make interesting music. Don't underestimate innovators willing to break with tradition.

[@gregmakesmusic8805]

I am following you and although I am sure I fully agree I was kinda distracted by the question whether you were wearing your T-shirt inside out? And if so... Was it intentional? I mean sometimes we're saying things that feel kind of socially adequate and friendly in general but do we totally agree with what we are saying all the time? Me personally, I wouldn't like myself if I were using presets (I could not) but I think it's cool if others do so. Somehow there is a very thin line between being judgemental and not being judgemental. Great channel by the way! I like watching your videos and I like seeing your channel grow. Keep it up!

[@edwinbrown9951]

Great video. Thanks,

[@andtheywillknowusbyourname5511]

Wow Jameson, I know I’m late but I watch your videos all the time. They are so well crafted :)

[@tedandersen5403]

omnisphere, which is pictured in the preview, is a brilliant instrument with a great sound for sounddesign.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Definitely

[@rolandserna7805]

I've tried learning how to program synths, but I'm just not very good at it. Besides, there are thousands of amazing preset sounds out there readily available for me to use. Maybe I'll just add some effects and do some editing, but that's about it

[@ambientideas1]

There’s another edge to that coin worth noting. Presets and sample packs draw more people into the music making process; there’s a democratization of the process, and while that may dilute the music pool, many of those new musicians go on to produce more organic, original music and sounds.

[@MH44444]

I think it is good to work on sound design as part of a daily routine. I also think that composition of the future will be a combination of both formats. I think composers will be more like what the producer was in the past. Someone who assembles the composition, combines the parts using available tools. It is still a highly creative process assembling the sounds into a rich composition, but one might not be the sole creator of each part as the tools themselves do some of that work. Soon AI will be chipping in too.

[@TechGently]

There was a time where I was just using presets, but now other than "how was this sound made" I typically go to init patches, Roland's new synth box the SH-4d turned on brings you to a Preset sequence and a Preset tone. (there may be a way to program it to go to init, but I've not RTFM yet), I tap right away into a bank I know that is empty, go to one of the 11 synth engines and hit the Init button where I can create my own tones, occasionally grabbing a tone I like, I'm finding out of the 256 presets, I might like 20 of them. I'm a hobbyist and learning and I won't get better at it if I don't learn from the basics w Filter/AMP/LFO's and effects.

[@johnnyraphaell]

Thank you for this great vid!!!

[@christoroppolo8742]

This inspired tons of design for me big time ! Dave designed a beast of a synth that encourages exploration and delivers the goods! 👽✌️

[@TobyBorrow]

Why reinvent the wheel. Copy and edit the preset to your user patches for your own needs. You can explore but it’s a balance as music itself will lead you on to exploring for different sounds. It’s another way of getting there.

[@macronencer]

It's an interesting topic. I wonder whether the only reason anyone feels they've "cheated" when they use a preset is that electronic music (unlike traditional acoustic) has a more obvious history of sound experimentation. Is there any difference between writing a synthesizer "symphony" using standard sounds, and writing a symphony for an orchestra (which also has "standard sounds")? Only if your goal was to make new sounds. It comes down to personal objectives.

[@kenb7540]

I agree 100% ! Well said. 👏👏🎶

[@BlackMan614]

When samplers first came out I absolutely thought it was cheating - at least the part of sampling a drum track or a hook. After I bought a sampler and started using it with other folks’ input, I saw it as just another tool. And back in the day, setting up loop points was definitely NOT cheating. What a PITA.

[@badoedipus2551]

Idk, it might be that we are all called to different things, or something, but I fine.. in a very mystical mysterious way that always seems to surprise me, when I make my own sounds.. seems like my work is somehow better? This was even true when I was very bad at sound design. I think.. you get in “DAW mode” and it’s like you measure how you’re doing based on how quickly you create work.. and that can keep you from really going on the sound design journey. Or I mean I imagine this is what’s happening for a lot o folks.. and then it can be easy to get sorta intimidated by the unknown… and starting out.. we’ll I liked having the freedom to explore where ever my inclinations sent me.. and there was soooo much to learn that it seemed fine to leave sound design till another day. The one place I didn’t agree with you was in the recording stuff to mono thing. Exercising control over the stereo width of stuff is a big part of how I mix.. having stereo width in the first place just gives me more options.. if I use them or not…. Err, just figure I should find something to nit pick? I mean this is the internet after all? Err, sorry…..

[@JamesonNathanJones]

I was referring to using multiple mono sources in a layered approach to provide more clarity in the imaging of a full mix. Helps maintain more control during the mixing process and can actually lead to a “wider” sounding image. :)

[@badoedipus2551]

@@JamesonNathanJones yeah, but what’s the difference from that and turning down the stereo width?

[@watchaddicts1213]

Like you, John is another great teacher.

[@PenolAkushari]

reverse engineering my beloved well, to be fair, i did happen to pick up some of the modelling tricks by checking cool models in blender, so that method of learning is quite good, and thanks for bringing up the point of trying to reproduce some of the sounds that standard libraries may have, sounds like a simple idea yet i didn't think of that! would be quite cool to try that out, maybe i'll also get hang of some stuff

[@brianbergmusic5288]

My two cents: MAYBE sound design (patching and even drum loop creations aka "beatsmithing") and music creation require two different areas of the brain. Attempting to tackle them simultaneously puts the musician at a mental disadvantage (almost like driving with the brakes on). That's why I'm trying a novel idea of separating the times of the sound designer and the times of "composing"/arranging/jamming. The reason why presets feel like cheating is because people forget that it is a separate discipline from playing an instrument or composing a pleasing sequence of notes. Presets get you to a place of feeling musical faster (I often used the cheat code of tweaked, flipped or transformed presets). Juggling the two disciplines in separated time-slots is counterintuitive because you want to have a vision from beginning to end. However, when I was younger and more naïve, I would force the processes together, and ended up losing a lot of time getting lost in the forest for the trees. Suddenly I would find myself spent an hour figuring out just the right snare sample. I like sound-design, but it is time consuming, I have to switch gears to be truly "musical" again. I got so frustrated with these two separate worlds that I temporarily gave up on electronic music for a while to focus solely on guitar. TL;DR -- if you are worried about writing music with synth presets or canned drum-loops, then ignore the presets and budget the time to create your own presets at a time other than composer/producing/arranging.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

That’s exactly how I approach sound design and patch making. Good thoughts 👍

[@ErwinSchrodinger64]

Learning sound design has also helped learn synthesizers so much more. Just the other day, I walked into Guitar Center and they had a Sequential Take-5. Within 5 minutes, I modulated LFO-1 to the filter. Then, I modulated the LFO-2 to LFO-1. That would have taken me hours to do just a year ago.

[@Orpheus.Machine]

Is playing a piano (1 preset) cheating ???

[@JamesonNathanJones]

I don’t know. The video isn’t out yet ;)

[@bricelory9534]

Yes, yes it is. 😉

[@entropybentwhistle]

Yes, yes it is. Get in there and mess with the guts ‘til it sounds like an alien invasion.

[@mod3l]

Is buying a 303 like buying a preset? :O

[@hermask815]

That’s exactly the spirit. A synth isn’t the end product. I’d compare it to a lathe, a CNC cutter, or a 3D printer. Each timbre/ preset is a separate instrument (not necessarily mimicking a counterpart in the domain of classical instruments)

[@m.g.kroger]

I'm so happy to follow you.... ❤

[@DKH712]

its not cheating, but its a personal taste thing. like many people here i do like to make my own sounds on synths though. however, i despise making drums from scratch so i exclusively use samples for that. But i'd rather use single shots than drum loops though. weird how this works

[@LouisSerieusement]

really nice video thank you so much ! I usually do composition and patch creation on differents day (not too far apart tho) because sound design take so much time when you have a complex synth with menu diving 🤣

[@issiewizzie]

Whoever says that needs their head checked . Top Grammy awards musicians couldn’t care less .. it’s all about the music. The notes the harmony the chords … how it’s makes you feel. New synth head seems to have lost sight of that.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

I’m really excited to see how I feel about it… 😂

[@gatergates8813]

If winning Grammy awards is your measure of achievement as an artist I kinda feel sorry for you, award shows are just an industry circle-jerk

[@hmurchison8123]

Quality over quantity. Subscribed

[@headphonecommute]

One of my favourite things to do beyond reverse engineering patches that I like is "porting" them to another synth. This makes me learn two synths at once, as well as the limitations and versatility of each tool. Did I really need that third oscillator? What about the second filter that could be serially chained? And how come this particular synth does not have snappy envelopes?

[@JamesonNathanJones]

GREAT stuff! 👍

[@klstay]

For me this is where the benefit of a 100% knob per function design is most evident along with relative simplicity of voice architecture. All voice variables along with their interactions must be conceptualized in this effort if one wishes to be more than a monkey banging on a typewriter hoping for Shakespeare. Every layer of abstraction (menus etc.) and additional feature ups the number of variables you have to juggle. Unless you are well into the less than 2% of a population with a normal IQ distribution that number is not huge. This (along with the sounds) is why I consider the P5 interface/workflow/voice architecture the pinnacle of analog polysynth design. Same for minimoog in a mono (special mention for MS-20) and monopoly in a para (special mention for matriarch).

[@cinamynj]

My favourite artists are sound designers, Sta and Solar Fields as examples. As for me, I get frustrated trying to make sounds. Since I often get sounds I was not going for or don't like, it makes me sad, and not sure how to proceed.

[@omeralsoma_]

I will put this video in repeat 🔁 very inspiring 👏

[@JamesonNathanJones]

🙏🙏

[@SpikesStudio3]

Many (many)years ago, when i started learning synthesis on the ol 106, i would play a note, tweak a bit, repeat for hours. Wheni moved out of the unit i was living in, the neighbour said "what the fuck were all the beeps?" 🤣🤣

[@donaldpriola1807]

Learn the basics for sure. Know WHY, not just what. After that, embrace a little chaos. Even if you have extensive knowledge of synthesis, be a kid again. Go into the modulation section of a synth, and mess around with sources/destinations. Or take a field recorder and record sounds you like, pop them in a sampler, and experiment. You don't even need much cash. Mess about with a good synth/sampling amp. Do it a lot. Find a voice. It's hard, but worth it. Do what you want, how you want. Be you.

[@nunomollc]

Preset is sometimes overcooked and hard to reveal, so I like to start from raw oscillator wave.

[@perfektspace]

Some people want to plug and play and some live for designing new patches. Some are in between and take presets or patches designed by others and modify them to taste. If your goal is songwriting then you need to write songs more so than designing synth sounds. Just a question of where you priorities are and what you need to accomplish rather than worrying about if it's cheating or not.

[@michaelgiordano2458]

Which is the blue synth behind your head? Is that a Poly Evolver?

[@OperculumAudio]

Def not cheating. I've purchased presets to reverse engineer them to learn how to fine tune my own presets. That's being smart and intentional.

[@minioclass2891]

What was that piano piece in the intro? It sounded interesting, thanks.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Thanks! I haven’t released it yet, but it’s from a set of short pieces I plan to release later this year.

[@minioclass2891]

@@JamesonNathanJones Thank you for responding, that’s a very nice piece. I’d be interested in purchasing it once you release it. Please keep me posted, and keep up the great work with your content!

[@thomaskolb8785]

It depends what you are after, right? Fast results on a deadline calls for different methods than being given the luxury of tweaking sounds for hours at end without any result other than having had joy and fun. Also, it is not a new phenomenon: producers like Stock, Aitken and Waterman during the 80's kept churning out hit after hit that were nearly identical in both sound and style.

[@lofomuses]

sometimes it (using a preset) feels like cheating to me, also... until I remember... when I sit down at my grand piano... I am using a 'preset', then, also. If I play my acoustic guitar... I am using a 'preset'. Even if I play my Irish D Whistle... I am playing a 'preset'. :-P So I think we only push this standard (cheating vs. not-cheating) on an instrument that has a zillion preset sounds! But we never do this when using an instrument that only has 1 or 2 'presets', especially when it has a fairly standardized 'sound' (piano, tuba, harmonica, cello). That being said, I would never intentionally use a synth patch that is too easily recognizable... like that obnoxious synth sound from Van Halen's 'Jump'!

[@JamesonNathanJones]

That’s true in a sense, but I don’t think using acoustic instruments is exactly a one to one comparison. Synthesizers and sound design tools are typically made to create highly variable, moldable sounds. Acoustic instruments have inherent limitations in that regard, so the player has to learn how to conform to what it does best. Neither is better or worse, but they are made with different intentions I think.

[@lofomuses]

@@JamesonNathanJones Of course, we have different expectations from instruments that are highly variable, and I agree. I am not saying I go with ONLY presets. I'm always tweaking little things, like envelopes and filters and modulations to make it 'my own', and to serve the musical passage better. I'm just saying that, now that I have Arturia's synth emulations, and Omnisphere, and Pigments, and Diva, and Zebra, and Vital, and Massive X, and and and (lol), and.... a zillion 'pad makers', I don't feel really guilty for starting with a preset. I don't often start with INIT, though!

[@tonyrapa-tonyrapa]

My personal take from this video: 1, patience... again. You absolutely need patience. 2, I like the idea of making sounds in a particular frequency range, in mono and with as few on-baord FX as possible. Let's give a go.

[@laurentsauvagnac]

I love your videos.

[@RaidersOfTheLostHeart]

every piano is a preset, ...every pipe is a preset, ....every violin is a preset, ....or do you build this instruments before you play it? hmmm, .....there we are, ....at the beginning of music culture: beethoven, bach, mozart, ......damn, ....they are all cheaters ;-) ;-)!!!!!!!! i am using presets to create songs, i am happy that there are great "sound designers" which build sweet presets, which i can use to compose my songs! it depends where your main emphasis lies, .....i want to sit down to play and to write songs, .....i scroll through presets by default and when i like a sound i use it. i am not interested in sitting down for hours and turn knobs to build a sound, .....omg, i could never finish a song, if i would start turning knobs for hours lol ;-) ;-)!!!! what i want to say: NO, it's NOT cheating!!! it depends what is your aim in music: "sound design" or "song composer"!!! one more thing: if you come from the 80's like me, there is one big synthesizer which is called "the Synthesizer that defined the '80s", the DX7. so should we say a whole decade of "super pop songs" is cheated, cause on every second song you hear sounds of the DX7??? and they are played like they are, cause when you take a DX7 today, you can take a preset and you say: "damn, this was this song" or "this was that song"!!!! but this is all just my personal opinion :-) :-)

[@zdravkodimitrov]

I'm a player, not a sound designer. I want amazing presets to be readily available, so I can just start playing.

[@brianbergmusic5288]

There's nothing wrong with that. In fact, orchestral music (which I love) is kind of like that mindset.

[@rolandserna7805]

Same. If the presets are already there, then I don't see what the problem is

[@6079-smithw]

And that's how professional musicians work. The advice to start with an init patch is spread by amateurs in internet forums.

[@gaston-alegre-stotzer]

It is not cheating... it is collaborating 😉

[@obsoletecd-rom]

If music can be collaborative, isn’t it sorta like working with someone you’ve never met?

[@alainthiry3965]

is jnj network usable on windows 10 computer?

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Absolutely! As long as you have a web browser you can access it just like you would facebook or discord. 👍

[@BIONDIEST]

I recently discorved this while recording myself banging on house hold items with my cell phone then choping it up in the sampler and adding some effects.

[@djchromatix4640]

I use an SP1200. My “sample packs” are my record collection. Synths, by design have the ability to tweak parameters to create something new. Just imagine if Phuture followed the intended use of the 303. They would have had one of the worst preset bass sound ever.

[@JayM928]

Very good video! Sound design is my least favorite part of music production. When I follow the “that’s not your sound” mindset, all it does is make me feel crappy about making music. Fortunately, I’m able to quickly shake that when I see my friends music room… several nice guitars and various pedals… That is… You know… “presets” The day he starts making his own guitar and guitar strings from scratch is the day I let myself feel bad about surfing presets. (Not to mention most presets get heavily modified to fit a mix anyway)

[@MistyMusicStudio]

I had that same thought about guitar! If presets are cheating, then we're not allowed to use a les paul through a Vox AC30 cause that's Jimmy Page's tone. Or a strat through a plexi (Hendrix) or a martin D-28 (Lennon). What a limiting world that would be 😮

[@brianbergmusic5288]

My two cents: the more acoustic a physical instrument is, the less concerned you can be with sound design (unless you are doing some extreme sample mangling). However, the more sample mangling you do, the less the music is about the performance (an art by itself). The electric guitar is probably the closest instrument to being somewhere right in between a synthesizer and an orchestral instrument. The signal of an electric guitar can be filtered/subtracted, distorted beautifully, wah-wah funkiness, ambient with volume swells (almost like a synth pad in post rock like Jakob), and also played with so many variations on clean sounds (whether you use the single coils for bell like chimes, or the humbuckers for a warm jazz tone). The electric guitar is not quite the shapeshifter as a synth, although it is getting close (there even exist synth pedals for it that digitally make it sound like a basic synth tone). However, if a sound is distinctly a synth tone, then it is as complex and customizable as you make it. Sure there are a wealth of staple synth sounds: trance plucks, funky basses, sawtooth leads with mod-wheel vibrato, dirty electro square basses, supersaw pads, dubstep growls, the FM bell, the tb-303 acid line. if you only need these basic General-MIDI staples, then you might only need a rompler and not a synth. I've heard wonderful music made by keyboardists who use romplers, and no one cared that the tones could be lightly modified presets because it was about the arrangement and pianistic performance, not the sounds themselves. But on the other hand, if you are the kind of producer that writes EDM, then you are a connoisseur of (for instance) how many different kinds of TB-303 lines there are. You are such a connoisseur that one day you have a brilliant idea to write a TB-303 style line with a wavetable synth instead of the typical Roland knockoffs and you discover a neat variation. Yeah, its an acid-line, but it morphs into something different. You are a chef of a simple idea and the EDM world is better because of it. Therefore, it's all about the goals. Just remember that while creativity is often the strongest with limitations, there is also such a thing as raising the bar on specific genres.

[@JayM928]

@@brianbergmusic5288 Glad you brought up limitations and flexibility. The near infinite flexibility you have now with electronic music is a strength and a weakness. Same with limitations. They can hinder you or inspire you to be creative. I like how presets give me the best of both worlds. I can take them, modify them, or leave them and make my own. There’s no point in carrying a banner for one method or the other unless it just suits you better personally.

[@brianbergmusic5288]

@@JayM928 100%

[@indek]

Most instruments come with 1 preset.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Still looking the “Bongos Bonanza” setting on my upright piano

[@wrmusic8736]

not quite, it's just that you have to "complete" their tone with a bunch of pedals and that's where your "presets" go wild.

[@thomas.moerman]

Philosophical musing: is using a standard tuning stealing, or should we all design our own microtonal scales, given that melody and chord structure imo vastly outweigh sound design in a song's identity? It all becomes a bit absurd no? ;-) It's ok to use presets.

[@MusicZeroOne]

The only people who care, are on forums or in YT comments. The only people who don’t buy or listen to your music, are on forums or in YT comments.

[@alemanshinger1135]

what the synth on the first screen?

[@alemanshinger1135]

found it, its Sonic LAB Sequential Pro 3

[@delscoville]

Totally agree. This is the #1 reason I recently got a Sequential Pro 3 SE. Tweaking knobs and discovering new abd original sound, give me ideas. It inspires me. I do have V Collection. But having a real analog synth, there's things that happen that can't while in a canned sound atmosphere of a software synth. While V Collection plugins are really good, A real synth can do strange things like filter feedback creating subharmonics, etc.

[@Kmuggle]

How ... do you reverse engineer a patch?

[@TheHorseValse]

👏👏👏

[@quantumeseboy]

Hey, before I even watch, all music instruments apart from synths only have presets.

[@beatbuildersstudio]

I make music for TV and having presets let me work quickly. No one has ever said "hmmmm thats a preset Im not using your music" I do want make my own sounds though. It juat takea time

[@bricelory9534]

Btw, great video! ❤