The Problem with Super Mario Odyssey | Nintendrew

[@animatedgaymer619]

Screw off this is my favorite game of all time

[@chrange9714]

Calm down. He never said the game was bad, he's just talking about problems he had with it and listing ways to fix them. Odyssey is one of the best games ever made, but it's not perfect. No game is.

[@andrewherrera7735]

@@chrange9714 I wouldn't take it that far, it is like saying all of the despicable me movies are perfect classics (lol). It suffers in delivering a holistic vision and fills in the gaps with shallow themes. You need to play the classics like mario party or kirby 64 to know what if feels like for a game to have a strong vision.

[@chrange9714]

@@andrewherrera7735 I said Odyssey isn't perfect. What. The game did have a strong vision though, and they succeeded in delivering it.

[@mr.fearingtoon3549]

How does the pin of shame feel?

[@thanoscube8573]

Galaxy better

[@Charriii5]

I honestly love the acknowledgment that Odyssey is not a bad game at all, but that it's also not as perfect as a lot of us thought it was when it released. This video represents more what could've made an already great game, better.

[@MrJarckle7378]

I agree, Ive always said that no game is perfect and I honestly see that even in odyssey, It's one of my favorite games that I've ever played but it still has its negatives.(Btw I love your channel Charriii5.)

[@jjc4924]

I can agree to that.

[@chrange9714]

Nobody should've thought or think it's perfect. Nothing is or ever will be.

[@Nintendrew]

You're cool 😎👌

[@franklinbrooksstoppedcomme3267]

You sound like Chad James.

[@NathanielBandy]

Now that Bowser's Fury exists, I'm kind of fine with no hub world. Just make Breath of the Mario and I'll be happy Nintendo

[@carpenter_4lifee]

hey nathaniel

[@Difixed]

Breath of the Mario What would Mario's breath smell like though 😳

[@Photo0021]

An open world Mario game with a large map akin to BoTW would be amazing. It's what the Mario series deserves.

[@luigi-si3yh]

Hi 👋

[@maximumpink8487]

I've thought of a completely open world Mario game before, and the concept sounds amazing

[@TheLonelyGoomba]

Mario Odyssey is the near perfect game, until you unlock everything and the only moons left are the ones just hidden in annoying areas which take ages to find / need hints to find. Because of that the game almost always ends on a downer if you're going for 100%. The home stretch of completion is just the worst part of the game imo. In terms of the video, and the capture mechanic. I'm not sure I agree. If the game gave you complete freedom to capturing, it would risk being less defined. See, Balan Wonderworld. As it is, each area gives a challenge specifically designed around that capture. Which allows for more variety in the long run than broad level designs intended for every single ability to be used. I do think Galaxy is the better game though.

[@ChadWSmith]

I agree about the capture mechanic. I wouldn't mind *more* things to capture, (more humans in New Donk City, for sure, although, what would they give Mario that he doesn't already have from a game-play perspective? They are taller? Maybe their lack of super jump makes it like a Captain Toad level? I don't know).

[@ChadWSmith]

BTW - love your videos.

[@louiepikmin3184]

I was with you until that last sentence

[@pixelit7]

Sounds like Sonic Unleashed btw I love the game

[@jumponeverything]

The worst part of the completion process was the fact you had to grind for around 30000 coins to get 999 moons and all the costumes at launch and was only slightly alleviated by luigis balloon world. Other than that finding the last few moons wasn't too bad thanks to uncle amiibo and the hint toad, although it was still annoying at times

[@8BitGamerSM64]

If only there was a hub world, it could be an airport where you unlock gates to different kingdoms to fly to.

[@minignoux4566]

Like the one in mario kart

[@CosmicRemix3000]

And you have to fill a passport to get other places

[@UPTHERAWT]

That sounds awesome

[@checkit6894]

@@CosmicRemix3000 passports could be saves like in vacation sim and you would choose one at booting up

[@braydenleaderofthetirkins1143]

And you can buy new knickknacks, like a solar-powered hula Wario, and a Car sticker that says something like, "Delfino, Here we Go!" Or something cheap and funny like that. Perhaps even bigger things.

[@colingznetworkplus4618]

The ruined kingdom is so interesting aesthetically, I like how it looks different from everything else you’ve seen in a Mario game before, and the Dragon is cool too, but the Kingdom is so underdeveloped!

[@theshanaman7805]

Ya like the cloud kingdom looks like it would be short and is designed to look like an arena the ruined kingdom just feels unfinished

[@ieatkids4breakie682]

Ruined Kingdom could be expanded and Nintendo could have an excuse to be able to capture Boos

[@ENDI8089]

The true final bossfight is one of my biggest dissapointment

[@DMadHacks]

The problem is there's still no Odyssey 2

[@chrange9714]

Oh, it'll happen.

[@JakeRandall]

This is timely. I just streamed this last night and it was first time ever playing lmaoooo!

[@stareanddream]

I brought some of these points up in the past and I got BLASTED with hate online. I felt pretty bad back then, but I’m now very glad to see I’m not alone in thinking some small tweaks would make an Odyssey follow-up surpass everything prior. Thank you so very much for making this video.

[@leeartlee915]

You are not alone in that. I’ve had practically screaming fights with people online over some of my seemingly reasonable criticisms.

[@georgeparker6664]

I didn't think I would agree so much but I really do. I personally didn't think odyssey needed those things and it wasn't bothering me that they weren't there but now that you say it, those ideas would be pretty cool.

[@derrickschaefer7425]

i love the abbey road profile pic

[@georgeparker6664]

@@derrickschaefer7425 Cheers.

[@dngdnf4862]

@@georgeparker6664 abbey road picture,you're a man of Culture

[@georgeparker6664]

@@dngdnf4862 thank you very much

[@jjc4924]

It's still an good game regardless. It's just alot of stuff they added didn't need to be an thing.

[@hajilee4539]

My problem with Mario Odyssey is that the progression is somewhat broken. You *could* do the story and get a Multi Moon, or you could walk around the kingdom for 5 minutes and ground pound the floor a couple of times and get three moons that way. I suggest adding a new type of moon called "Moon Fragments". Instead of getting a full moon for minimal effort challenges you would get these fragments. Once you have enough of them, then it gives you a full moon. This would make all moons feel more important, and more like you earned them. Now doing the bosses would give you one moon, but doing tons of challenges around the world would also give you one moon. It's more balanced this way. Sadly Nintendo will never do this because the moon count would be lower, which is a massive selling point of the game. People would just think there is less content. Also stages changing are something I really miss. Odyssey kinda does this in a few spots but it never changes much. I think it would be cool to have the stages change slightly as you unlock more moons. The more moons you have the more developed for end game the stage can become, adding new challenges along the way. For instance what if the luncheon Kingdom was dried out when you first visit it, no lava bubbles in sight. But once you beat the Big Bird on top of the volcano, the soup pot tips over, spilling lava everywhere, adding the lava bubbles with some new challenges. This is more how I wish odyssey worked, the base game is still amazing and it's one of my favorite games of all time, but I wish it was more like this. Let me know what you guys think, would you want my style of Odyssey game? What would *you* change about Odyssey? Let me know in the reply's and have a great day!

[@pepearown4968]

Moon fragments already are in the game... multiple times.

[@RyanSonic]

@@pepearown4968 They're in the game, but they're closer to just one moon split in one local area. I think Hajilee means each Moon Fragment would be replace easier challenges like ground pounding in a certain spot, as opposed to you having to collect 5 in what's usually a closed off area. Story Moons could still be whole moons, along with platform challenges. That's what I got out of their message, at least.

[@bathawes]

Love the idea of stages changing! Tick tick clock on Mario 64 comes to mind :-)

[@Jdudec367]

That isn't really broken progress, it's more open progress and I honestly like that, you have options on what moons you can get. I find your ideas interesting, I think they should keep moons as is but improve upon them and cut out filler moons some more that just feel like padding, but have the Kingdoms themselves change more over time.

[@EllieMiller510]

Yeah I like the galaxy and 64 approach to the main collectibles (stars/moons) as differently than odyssey’s. They feel more substantial.

[@jjc4924]

To be honest; while I respect 64 for it's foundation of 3D collecthon and 3D in general, it has age very poorly. And it does get pretty repetitive along the way.

[@TrophyJourney]

With 120 stars, you always feel the urge to get them all. With 999, eventually you just say "screw it".

[@NoName-vb4pc]

@@TrophyJourney Of course since mario 64 is much shorter therefore completion is easier.

[@Cheet0Dorit0]

Can we agree that the Switch has a big amount of amazing Mario games? Edit: Please keep in mind that I never said it has ALL amazing Mario games, I’m aware that some games aren’t on the Switch

[@kungfukitty8835]

What about hotel Mario huh? That’s what’s missing.

[@Cheet0Dorit0]

@@kungfukitty8835 omg you’re right! I somehow forgot about that masterpiece 😓 my bad

[@Omelander]

What about the great Mario teaches typing 2

[@harrylane4]

What games does it not have? The land series, NSMB DS, 2 & wii... And galaxy 2 :'c

[@Omelander]

@@harrylane4 galaxy 2, and good sports games

[@hallowizer440]

I think it's a good thing that SMO doesn't have a hub world, because that means there's nowhere to send you after every moon, and it takes less time to get back into the action. If there was a hub world, nobody would ever visit it, so it would be a waste of resources.

[@riot9179]

That's exatly the reason why Moons have no value and are VERY BORING to collect. You find a moon here, another there, another on the corner. Hub World make difference

[@kirinichiban21]

In a KZbin landscape of sensationalised and polarised content, your balanced, well-articulated and friendly opinions are a breath of fresh air. Really enjoyed this and looking forward to more!

[@Hadeks_Marow]

Here's my BIGEST problem with Odyssey (that nobody talks about): World boarder. . . . or lack there of. Mario 64 and shun sine, they both had mountains or oceans or something that blocked your view from seeing where the edge of map was. With Odyssey, it just felt lazy where you could just walk down the street of new donk city and see. . . oop, yep, world is flat, walk another step and theres the abyss. Does it effect gameplay? No. Does it effect esthetics, map design, emersion and even world design? Absolutely. It just felt lazy. There is no other world for it where you can literally see the end of a baseplate. Every single map in odyssey is a floating island that's not supposed to be a floating island. . . and that just disgusts me. Especially when compared to how île delfino handled it's world boarders in shine. . . . and that's saying something cause that was on the gamecube. Meaning that they got worse, not better, over time with this topic. And that's just disappointing.

[@SupaSoups5o1]

This what was bothering you? Like really

[@ThatBluDude]

THANK YOU! I felt the same way about the moons. Personally I prefer a 3D platformer closer to Mario 64 or Banjo Kazooie. When you have literally HUNDREDS of moons it stops feeling like "Yay I got another moon!" and starts feeling like "Oh. Another moon. Throw it on the pile."

[@traviscunningham7062]

Same. Galaxy>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Odyssey

[@Kevintendo]

I never realized how NOT having a hub world/base bothers me 😂 BUT NOW I NEED ONE FOR ODYSSEY 2!!!!

[@Kevintendo]

@@lol-ih1tl true!!!! And that to me felt like one additional kingdom. Very nice 😎

[@theshanaman7805]

@@lol-ih1tl the problem with that is that the world would have to be massive in order to avoid loads of repetition

[@legoboy7107]

One thing that triggered me about all the praise when Odyssey came out was this: when Galaxy 2 released, people complained (and still do) about it basically ditching the hub world in favor of a NSMB-esque world map, and saying that it should have had a proper hub. And perhaps rightfully so, I think that's a valid complaint. But when Odyssey released I heard critics that criticized Galaxy 2 for that PRAISE Odyssey for doing the EXACT SAME THING as Galaxy 2 but on STEROIDS. I heard them say things like "the old outdated hubworld is gone" (yes they called it outdated) and whatnot, and I was like "Come on, you're praising Odyssey for doing the exact same thing you criticized Galaxy 2 for, but even worse. So what, the hub world formula is just magically outdated and old fashioned now but wasn't when Galaxy 2 released? Uh okay then, clearly you're just being a disingenuous sucker-up for Odyssey and Nintendo rather than legitimately critiquing things." Looking back at this, I don't remember which review I saw but I would not be surprised if it was IGN, this sounds like the most IGN thing ever haha.😂😂

[@theshanaman7805]

@@legoboy7107 ya and the hub in Mario galaxy 2 is bigger and has some hidden things to find with odyssey doesn’t have

[@jjc4924]

The Shanaman. At least Galaxy 2 was just as good as Galaxy 1 and it did some things new while still played like it's predecessor. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[@elijahdeshaw]

“What can I say, I’m stuck in the past” sometimes it’s the small jokes that make you wheeze.

[@elfiebranford9330]

To me, Odyssey was a game I could really enjoy as a quick playthrough, but NEVER a game you'd wanna 100% more than once. It has a lot of replay value in a selective sense; you can come back to it, but you never wanna start over or fully finish it. That's how I see it at least. My opinions are awful in general when it comes to games lol. Either way, I cannot help but praise the ambitious design and execution of Odyssey, though if I'm being completely honest, I could never see myself playing a sequel in the same style.

[@franklinbrooksstoppedcomme3267]

This comment is actually 1:1 to my exact feelings on Sonic Unleashed (both versions). Why there still has yet to be a Mario and Sonic crossover game for the mainline serieses, I may never completely understand.

[@legoboy7107]

I'd rather do chores than try to 100% Odyssey, I tried it and was NOT having fun at all. When it gets to that I think it's clear there's something wrong. Pretty much every thing in 64 and the Galaxies, and MOST of the stuff in Sunshine, I'd rather do than chores any day and love every moment of it (yes, even the blue coins for the most part), but trying to get everything in Odyssey? Heck no! I don't want to play "Run around for hours with little-to-no platforming trying to find random spots to ground pound Simulator" for hours and waste my life like that, thank you very much. Now playing Odyssey selectively where I'm not going for 100%, that's a pretty good time, though stumbling across a random easy moon when I wanted to find a harder one for the last one I need is kinda annoying, and not 100%-ing it always makes me feel unsatisfied, but when I try to 100% it I end up having a terrible time.

[@jaretco6423]

I'm on an same vote. When your playing the game normally and never bothered the 100%, it's an great time. But going for all 100% is an chore.

[@traviscunningham7062]

@@legoboy7107 tBH, I don’t like Mario 64 because it didn’t age well.

[@legoboy7107]

@@traviscunningham7062 I personally disagree (and as someone who didn't even know Mario 64 existed growing up so I have no nostalgia for it) but to each their own.

[@ReReCoil]

To put into perspective of how short the Cloud and Dark Kingdoms are, they are the equivalent of Boss Rooms compared to the full blown Dungeons that are the rest of the kingdoms in the game.

[@mr.fearingtoon3549]

The problem is that eventually it ends

[@MarcBarkyMarta]

“Course clearing” is a pretty good way to put the style of those games. I was thinking “arcade-derived” due to the emphasis on time limits (and arcade-style scoring), but that might only apply to the first SMB and the single screen arcade titles before that. The later course-clearing Mario games have a more long-playing feel with maps & progress saving, so labeling them arcade-like experiences would be inaccurate.

[@ZantZora]

But first, we need to talk about 11:59

[@Nintendrew]

LOL S-tier reference bro

[@gunnar.w]

Yessir

[@doraeguyakaneddie6586]

The only flaw about Super Mario odyssey is that it's such a big game...its a little intimidating to replay

[@JJGamezMC]

Yeah I’ve 100%ed it twice and I just don’t think I can do it again. It was so much fun both times but I don’t really have any motivation to do it again.

[@Squantle]

@@JJGamezMC if you 100% the game more than once, you’ll notice more “fluff” added on. There’s a lot of repeated missions and useless moons. That being said, it’s still my favourite 3D Mario.

[@javierquevedod.8240]

Kinda the same happen with me with the Super Mario Galaxies (I'm not saying I didn't like them, on the contrary), sometimes they just feel a little slow.

[@louiepikmin3184]

@@javierquevedod.8240 Exactly! Nobody talks about how slow they can feel

[@Stumpfization]

For over a year now i wanted to replay this as it is great in my memory. But as you said it's a little big. I always say "no not now, theres too much going on right now. I wouldn't be able to focus on it." but that's the opposite of what a Mario game should be, isn't it? But I'm really not trying to say that it is a bad game. It's still absolutely fantastic.

[@Luma_64]

Mario galaxy was literal perfection, I want 100% agree that the Galaxy level design is a hybrid. from the power-ups, to the structure, to the levels having some collectathon type design. Open world Mario isn't as challenging or platforming focused as linear Mario, Linear Mario isn't as collectathon and exploratory of as open Mario. For that Galaxy is the perfect hybrid

[@Nintendrew]

Completely agree!

[@jaretco6423]

Agreed. It's one of the reasons why I prefer linear style 3D Mario games ( Galaxy 1, Galaxy 2 & 3D World ) over the open ended/collecthon 3D Mario games ( 64, Sunshine & even Odyssey ).

[@makerviewr1cn356]

Before watching the video. My main issue with Mario Odyssey is the number of moons in the game, and their general placement. Compared to other 3D Mario's, 64, Sunshine, and the two Galaxy games, the moon counter far exceeds the main campaign of each of these titles. That is simply absurd, which is for exemplified on how trivial they are. Most moons are not placed in an area where they offer a good challenge to overcome, like the many nut moons in the wood kingdom. These side moons, just damper the thrill of collecting for me. I will admit the moon complaint is a common one, but is one I feel is very valid for a game that is good. Other than that, Mario Odyssey is a fun game. I particularly love buying the decorations for the Odyssey itself. It's just neat seeing the ship slowly getting more furniture over the course of the adventure.

[@HaxTheCharizard]

If they make a sequel, I need to see that big lightning dragon return... maybe even as an NPC or an ally!

[@bimper2213]

I would have loved a hub world in odyssey. Ya know in skylander giants the hub world is a big ship traveling the sky. Love the video.

[@RedHotSackboy]

I like to categorise the main series Mario games into: Linear 2D (Bros. Series, Land 1/2, World 1/2, New Series) Linear 3D (3D Land/World) Linear Adventure 3D (Galaxy 1/2) Open Adventure 3D (64, Sunshine, Odyssey)

[@maximumpink8487]

Phew! I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks that Odyssey wasn't the "perfect" mario game!

[@Acho360]

Search the crazii damon odyssey video

[@jacobjb]

I love Odyssey but 64 and Galaxy are definitely better.

[@maximumpink8487]

@@jacobjb to be honest, 64 hasn't aged well. I would put Odyssey higher than 64. But don't get me wrong, 64 is a great game

[@jjc4924]

I still prefer Odyssey & 64 over Sunshine.

[@jacobjb]

@@jjc4924 Same.

[@deanmoriarty6015]

i felt exactly the same about odyssey as you did- i couldn’t figure out any real flaws aside from “it just doesn’t feel totally right” mario’s moves, controls, and physics felt perfect. there was plenty of stuff to do. nothing wrong i could really put my finger on but i knew there was something bothering me. this video pretty much summed it all up. i love every addition/change you mentioned and i think would help it feel more mario while also continuing on that new unique path odyssey made

[@traviscunningham7062]

Do you prefer Galaxy?

[@deanmoriarty6015]

@@traviscunningham7062 i think i do tbh

[@traviscunningham7062]

@@deanmoriarty6015 love your Spider-Man pfp

[@thebackgroundguy9491]

While I think you give fair criticism, I have a few thoughts of my own. Firstly, I think having a smaller hub gives Odyssey two advantages. First, the game puts more emphasis on exploring the various kingdoms and by having a small hub, it pushes players to to go out sooner than if they had a larger hub to traverse through. Secondly, because the hub is so small, travel is more efficient since it takes much less time to move from one kingdom to another as the player doesn't have to travel from one part of the hub to the next. I think a larger hub works favorably in something like Galaxy since it contrasts with the limited explorability of the galaxies. Small levels, big hub. Big levels, small hub. Not to say that levels and hubs of the same size can't work, but I think there's a certain logic to it. Secondly, turning kingdoms into universes is a shift that seems kinda redundant and not just because Galaxy does this already. To me, it's replacing one thing with something else that basically serves the same essential purpose. On a side note, I prefer the kingdom approach in Odyssey since it allows us to learn more about the lands around the Mushroom Kingdom that isn't just snow and desert levels. Lastly, I think there's a significant contrast between collecting Power Moons in Odyssey and Korok seed in BotW. While BotW reuses several puzzles for its Korok seeds, Odyssey's puzzles and challenges are much more diverse. Admittedly, not every Power Moon is a blast to get, but I think there was at least a sufficient balance between quality and quantity.

[@Sillykids]

Personally, I really enjoy the small and tight feeling of the Odyssey, it's relaxing

[@cvanims]

Overall, this video comes off extremely biased, but you do throw in a few good points. I'm a big fan of Bowser's Fury, so seeing that model on a scale of Breath of the Wild's Hyrule would be my ideal Mario.

[@PhantomCookie]

I definitely agree with what you said about the stuff you said about the lack of a hub world and linearity of the game. I remember saying that I didn't want Odyssey 2 to be the next mainline Mario game despite it being in my top 3 of all time which meant I never understood why. Although now I'm pretty sure it's because the thing that bothered me about the game was the existence of the Odyssey which seemingly replaced the expansive hub worlds of past 3D Mario Games and instead gave us what was an almost completed linear world map of all of its kingdoms

[@duckygirl617]

Idea for the Hub world: For every kingdom you go to, you add a new part to the ship and by the end of the game you have a giant ship.

[@calereliya]

I actually didn't mind the Cappy mechanics as-is. But the moon spam is the reason this game is firmly in second-to-last place on my 3D Marios list. I can still tell you where every gate is in SMW, how to get every star in Mario 64, and which my favorite galaxies in Galaxy 1/2 are. But I wouldn't be able to tell you about more than probably 5 or 6 moons in Odyssey - there are just SO MANY OF THEM that nothing about it was memorable for me.

[@lordroy88]

Super Mario 3D World + Bowser’s Fury >>>>>>>>>>> Super Mario Odyssey. It’s not even close. Much better level design and music and pacing in the former

[@tyler_keeble]

I have always strongly disagreed with the point regarding there are too many moons. The small moons are essential in rewarding players for exploration and experimentation. Less moons leads to emptier environments giving players little reason to wander off the beaten path. Some of my fondest moments from Odyssey were from discovering a tiny nook on the outside of a kingdom with a moon attached to it, or performing a trick jump to find a moon in an unassuming location.

[@Diegoe64]

1:57 I don't really have too much of a problem with that, because for me most of the time I always have a huge blast collecting all the moons in the game. Sure sometimes the moons don't feel rewarding and sometimes I do feel overwhelmed by the amount that there are but like i said I always have fun and it's always satisfying to collect a moon. Speaking of which I'm actually 100% the game again for the 5th time (Yes I'm a maniac) and its still feels great to collect them and almost never get bored of doing it.

[@orangeyeez]

so this is why I'm not playing odyssey all that often. I wish odyssey got the dlc treatment like botw

[@_strayfer_]

Galaxy 2 will be hard to beat as the best imo Good thing they put my favorite Mario on the swi- O h . . .

[@jjc4924]

That still pisses me off. Why wasn't Galaxy 2 part of the collection?

[@theminecraft2516]

I feel like people say this is the best one because it’s the most ambitious one instead of being the most fun one

[@bluekirbyrocks]

It’s still the best open world Mario game 64 is overrated and only loved for the reason that it’s the first and sunshine it’s just never been a lot of people’s thing

[@GOLVEL]

The problem is... I'm addicted to your videos X-D and I need to sleep sometimes.

[@carltonwhyte8047]

To be able to capture every living thing would be too much. I already stray too much from completing objectives by messing around things I can capture and checking out suspicious areas with the hope of finding stray moons. I'm not saying odyssey is perfect, but give it a chance to be improved upon with a sequel.

[@SuperNicktendo]

Mario Galaxy didn't go over well at all when it first came out. People were craving a return form of Mario 64. Nice to see people now recognize its contribution to the Mario universe.

[@jjc4924]

Yeah. I agree.

[@indiejacob]

You hit the nail on the head. I think my biggest problem with Odyssey is that Cappy as a power-up is really under utilized. Instead of you gaining moves like a traditional power-up it actually restricts movement to whatever you've transformed into, which in my opinion, severely ruins the flow of the game. Odyssey is still awesome, but it's the 3D Mario game I've replayed the least because of this. Solid job man.

[@Nintendrew]

My thoughts exactly. Thanks for watching!

[@Nintendrew]

@@lol-ih1tl Ah, but powerups were not Galaxy's main mechanic. That title is held by planetary gravity/physics.

[@traviscunningham7062]

@@Nintendrew Galaxy’s power ups were also underutilized.

[@RealUlrichLeland]

I actually liked that odyssey didn't have a hub area and was all across one planet. It made Mario feel like he was a nomadic traveler on an adventure, which seems very fitting to his character. The airship more or less functions as the hub and it's nice that you can customise it and see your progress. That being said I really like your idea about having a mario game set across parallel universes. Maybe you could have some that are entirely 2d or even retro themed like they touched on in odyssey. Maybe one could be an entire world based around mario kart etc. That being said I don't think that would be objectively better, Mario Odyssey was just trying to be a different game to that with more emphasis about exploring different cultures and environments shared on the same world. Being across different universes would be a bit more disparate and wouldn't work for odyssey, you might for instance not get to see how someone from the sand kingdom felt when on Holliday in new donk city.

[@hungertylo5662]

Yeah I completely agree, the moons feels more like you’re collecting 1 up which is ironic because people complained about how long it took to collect each star in galaxy and 64

[@RobNoireGaming]

I like a lot of your ideas presented here - I agree that more captureable enemies with more use per enemy would be great! I think the game's biggest flaw is definitely the moons (which you covered). There really are just too many, and 75% are just so easy to get. As well, to get all 999 moons, you had to straight up buy some of them.... I think over 500 in a game of that type is just excessive. For me it's a 9/10 game, but the formula established definitely has potential for even better with tweaks.

[@Isasnotes]

Just got you in my reccomended after 2 years. Glad youre doing well man

[@dayofthedan]

Love this game, you made some great points for a sequel. I would love to see an expanded Nintendo universe nostalgia trip

[@MeneerEnMevrouwTrein]

The biggest problem I have with Mario Odyssey from the very beginning is that I miss something that every other Mario game has: The option to replay missions. When I finished Mario 64 and want to race Koopa the Quick again, I can do that by choosing the star in the menu. But If I want to replay the mission in the lost kindom where I lose cappy, I can't unless I start a new file.

[@benitosierrajr3958]

I agree with some of the problems of this game, as someone who collect ALL the moons, this game is not the Mario game I was looking, it's a great game, Pauline's appearance in this game, the New Donk Festival and Jump Up Superstar are the highlights for me, but for me, I'll always prefer Mario + Rabbids Kingdom Battle, it provides a much better and more fun experience.

[@timg2727]

On one hand, you make some valid points. On the other hand, I get really annoyed when people come up with gameplay mechanics in their own head and then get disappointed when the actual game doesn't match the version they created in their imaginations. This video gets pretty close to that territory in places.

[@Winnetou64]

I just recently played both Odyssey and Mario 64 for the first time. Dated camera controls and graphics aside Mario 64 triumphs over Odyssey in every way imaginable, in my opinion. Odyssey is not a bad game, but 64 is a phenomenal platformer with just the right amount of challenge, exploration and lineraity. Odyssey on the other hand feels way too easy, recycles too many bosses and puzzles and just doesn't feel as polished to me.

[@pepearown4968]

The bosses from 64 were awful, too. I don’t see how you mentioning them being bad in Odyssey proves you point about 64 being better.

[@traviscunningham7062]

But Mario 64 didn’t age well.

[@txbased1659]

The best Nintendo youtuber is back

[@rarepixel5194]

Dont get me wrong, I loved the open world feel of Odyssey, but I hope that it doesn’t outright replace the 64 & Sunshine formula. Where there are multiple big levels with smaller objectives or stars in those levels. Even if it means booting you out of the level.

[@jjc4924]

Rarepixel. My biggest problem with 64 & Sunshine design is that it gets repetitive and tedious with it's missions & levels and the physics of those 2 games have NOT age very well.

[@Shadowhero43]

I've been saying your points for years and people gave me the crazy look. As someone who played the old Banjo Kazpoid games, Oddyssey felt very underwhelming

[@angelozicarelli541]

They better fix all this for Mario Odyssey 2. One gripe I have is they should have gave Mario the ability to punch and kick enemies just like in Mario 64.

[@UltraPvnk]

I wish the worlds were more Mario-esque like the old school Mario cartoons. I agree about the Hub world. The Broodals are meh, would've preferred the Mario 3 Koopa children. Still one of my fav games ever though.

[@deez1883]

12:23 I’ve seen the Ridley fighter announcement trailer and I can say that’s not a good idea

[@gytech1]

An excellent opinion piece. As fun as it can at times, it's sometimes nice to see criticism that doesn't lead into a long rant where the person is yelling. You kept a nice, constructive analysis and never once took cheap shots at the game, and I think that helped to prove your points better. Keep up the amazing work!

[@gsrandomvidz]

Super Mario 3D World and Bowser’s Fury are my favorite 3D Mario games. The thing is, Nintendo just needs to port Super Mario 64 DS, Super Mario Galaxy 2, and Super Mario 3D Land to the Switch, then all 9 3D Mario platformers will be on one console.

[@franklinbrooksstoppedcomme3267]

No exaggeration, that concept for a "Super Mario Universe" game is straight-up downright genius. Please try to get in touch with someone who can help you pitch it to Big N for the next game, it'd be so much fun.

[@tommyscarz]

Great video! Always love seeing Nintendrew content. On one hand, I have always felt that Odyssey suffered from lack of a hub world. No qualms there. But the proliferation of Power Moons doesn't really bother me, and I actually think it's an ingenious mechanism to allow younger and/or lesser skilled players to complete the base game without hassle. Experienced players can burn through a large chunk of the moons no problem (and these "easy moons" somewhat artificially inflates the moon total, since a significant percentage are way easier than any given Korok seed in BotW), but then the real challenge comes in collecting the rest after you've hit 300 or so. It's a nice balance, IMO, but I can see why it bothers people.

[@steventechno]

Nice to know I’m not the only one who shares the sentiment feeling that the Galaxy games were better. My personal favorites are the Galaxy games, followed by SMW , then SM64. Odyssey is good, had some great concepts but it’s overall design holds it back. Galaxy on the other hand had it’s own concept and just went pedal to the metal with it. I did enjoy bowser’s fury quite a bit however, even if short lived.

[@owenmenning3878]

I'd say the post game can be the weakest part of game simply because there are a ton of moons, so naturally not all will be winners, but other than that I love this game, and I feel like especially over time it will be appreciated more and more.

[@astronautical9746]

Man, it’s been nearly 4 years since this game was released. Time flies...

[@metashade4218]

After playing the trainwreck that was the demo of Balan Wonderworld, I'd much rather 100% Odyssey again than to deal with that shit again.

[@jacobmartin5182]

Finally!! someone finally nails what I felt what it was missing.

[@JustDisc]

Odyssey was the best Mario game I ever played. Even bearing out Super Mario World.

[@Kalahee]

The more gameplay mechanics you add, the more time it takes, often becomes gimmicky, add bugs, and makes level designing an absolute nightmare. Cap'ing critters, who's existence is first weird, could be done with cap'able characters, but I think running same world in the skin of different characters and unlock different path when backtracking could be interesting (DK64?).

[@Mystemo]

Odyssey is great, but it's honestly my least favorite 3D Mario game. Like you said the abundance of moons made them way less special than the collectibles in previous games. I also felt that the levels where TOO big and open, it was almost a hassle to remember which parts of the levels you had already explored. My favorite 3D mario game is honestly 3D World, the levels are just so insanely well designed and not a single one of them feel the same despite the fact that there are tons of them. It's the perfect balance between 2D and 3D Mario games in my opinion.

[@jjc4924]

Mystemo. Even though not many people liked 3D World.

[@Mystemo]

@@jjc4924 I don't think it's fair to say people didn't like 3D World. I've seen very few people who outright dislike it even if most people do prefer the mission based 3D games.

[@jjc4924]

Mystemo. I know. But for me, it's just an NSMB games of 3D and while it may not be an problem and can work, it isn't what I was expected. There's an rom hack called 64 3D Land that plays something similar to 3D World, but with 64 engine. And IMO, it does it way better than 3D World. If 3D World was like that, I would've liked it more.

[@jjc4924]

But what's even weirder and I'm not making this up; is that some people considered 3D World to be the " black sheep " of 3D Mario games. More so than Sunshine.

[@danick00]

Odyssey is still my favorite 3d Mario game, i really hope Nintendo makes a sequel.

[@davidmolin8944]

Here's an idea: have a hub world but instead of jumping into paintings have it so it's like the comet observatory and when you choose a world to go to you use the odessy to go their sorta like a airport that you then return to the hub to go to a new world

[@bonytologna]

The problem with Mario odyssey is art direction. You can’t have a photo-realistic tyrannosaurus and yoshi in the same game and hope to keep consistency. Or a cartoony Mario and realistically proportioned humans. The realism of the wood kingdom but the low poly look of the lunch kingdom. It’s a good game but a stylistic mess.

[@overlordalfredo]

I like that you made a video about a more honest view on Odyssey. I have to say Odyssey is by no means a bad game, in in context with other Mario platforming games I wouldn't even put it on my top 5 list... I have put a good 2000 hours into Odyssey to completely 100% the games in all regards. I what bugs me the most is actually that cappy is too powerful in the game, because even though it is not necessary for a lot of the kingdoms to proceed, the game is just too much focused around that strange looking hat/ghost. Also as a result from this the controls are just very overloaded, which would be necessary. E.g. ZL and ZR buttons to the same but you need to use the Z Button for 5 other moves to pull off. *That is just bad design and makes the game unnecessarily janky!*

[@charliekahn4205]

Expanding on the idea, why not make Mario Universe even further expand on the trends Odyssey set? Instead of one big planter, you have at least three, with different locales, gravity, and inhabitants. Additionally, certain kingdoms should share borders so that they're not all just random floating islands.

[@tracker2010plays1]

when i first saw the reveal trailer i assumed that the metro kingdom would be the major hub and the rest of the kingdoms would be interconnected though various methods

[@PurpleColonel]

Not a single Mario game has had the right combination of controls, objectives, exploration and progression that 64 did for me. All of them lean too far into a certain direction for me

[@4beasty]

Add Bob-ombs, Thwomps, Whomps, Boos, and Bullies. Make them all capturable in odyssey 2 and i'll be happy

[@ellegaard_k]

(not joking)The only thing that Odyssey is missing is voice clips in cutscenes, like in Sunshine. For some reason, I really like that.

[@traviscunningham7062]

I don’t. I prefer the characters making noises like in Galaxies cutscenes.

[@Jordan3DS]

I think it's stupid for people to complain about those two Kingdoms when they're literally just meant to be boss worlds. They should be grateful that Nintendo modeled two entirely new areas just for boss fights rather than just having fights in the existing Kingdoms.

[@2muchvariety]

I’ve really been trying to come up with the reasons for why this isn’t my favorite Mario game, and you explained it perfectly. I agree with everything you said in this video. This game just has so much wasted potential, and I really wish they expanded more on the cappy mechanic and made each and every moon have a mini-puzzle or a fun way to collect it, there are just way too many moons that copy off each other. My favorite Mario game is Super Mario Galaxy 1, just like you! I love how every single star is fun to collect and has a lot of value. Mario Odyssey combined the linearity of traveling to different kingdoms in the exact same order (apart from a couple of instances where you can pick between two kingdoms to go to first) with the open-world aspect of each of the kingdoms and it did not work well at all in my opinion. Mario Galaxy 1 may be a linear game, but the creativity of the stars and the incredibly fun levels make up for it. All in all, I still think Mario Odyssey is amazing and definitely one of my favorite Mario games, I just wish they did more with it

[@jjc4924]

I agree.

[@2muchvariety]

Thanks for the heart Nintendrew, keep up the great content 👍

[@SupaSoups5o1]

I think you are trying so hard to make Super Mario Odyssey like Super Mario Galaxy and it is just not I enjoy the moon system more than Galaxy and sure there are flaws but odyssey is my favorite Mario game. I don’t know I just think you shouldn’t force odyssey to be like Galaxy

[@2muchvariety]

@@SupaSoups5o1 I just think the stars in Galaxy are so much more rewarding to get than the moons in Odyssey, since you can get so many moons by just groundpounding in the right spot or finding one out in the open. Galaxy's stars have a small mission tied to each one, and I much prefer that to hundreds of moons in Odyssey with a lot of them taking little to no effort to collect

[@SupaSoups5o1]

@@2muchvariety there are many moons In odyssey yeah but it makes you explore the kingdom more and you appreciate how much effort went into the kingdom

[@kimi1522]

Imagine something like lake lapcat, but it's an entire world. And there's some sort of fast-transportation where you can go extremely fast through the map so that transportation between countries isn't tedious. That'd be amazing.

[@Zolomight]

Yess I totally agree with u Nintendrew my man, Galaxy is still the best 3D Mario

[@traviscunningham7062]

Best soundtrack Best levels Best characters introduced Best mechanics Best story Best atmosphere Galaxy is a 10/10 perfect game.

[@sporghus7022]

The main reason that I love odyssey so much is because of the movement, so I like to just run around in the kingdoms even after i 100% the game.

[@connerw]

As someone who was not even aware of Odyssey in the months leading up to or after its release (I was in South America and did not have Internet access for a few years, missionary thing) I did not have any expectations placed on the game and thusly was not disappointed by being able to inhabit the body of every creature and whatnot. That said, it is weird that Nintendo would market it in a certain way and not deliver on that. I love Odyssey and I legitimately prefer it to Galaxy, but I can totally see where you’re coming from there. I think this video is a surprisingly measured review from someone obviously more passionate than I about the franchise, but one thing I absolutely positively agree with you on is the hub world thing. That’s the one thing I felt was majorly lacking in an otherwise stellar game. I do have all the moons in Odyssey and actually found the whole thing very fun (except the jump rope and volleyball- screw that crap,) but I understand that 1,000 moon collect-a-thons aren’t for everyone, but I do agree that more than a few of the moons felt like tacked on filler.

[@MrGoatYouTube]

I think the biggest problem with Odyssey is the scale. And no, I don't mean how big the game is, although that can be still considered a problem, I mean the bar it sets for future games. Odyssey was such a big game that added so much, that's is just like how are other games gonna top that? What other Mario game can go above Odyssey's bar? Will it go the Galaxy 2 route of not changing much, just adding way more? Idk, but what I've seen from Bowser's Fury, there's a good chance for a new bar to be set. Anyway, those were my thoughts. Share me yours.

[@WilsTube]

My problem with Odyssey: the co-op, missed opportunity to have Luigi be player 2, but i hope they include that in either a sequel or a whole new 3D Mario!

[@AustinD_YT]

I agree with this video completely, though I do wonder if maybe Super Mario Odyssey was impacted by the fact they were using it specifically to push the switch off store shelves. Because of that, they had to make sure the Switch could run it near flawlessly, and we know the switch isn't that strong of a beef boy given that even Breath of the wild can cause the system to lag in places like korok forest, even Pokemon Sword and shield i was told lagged for one of my friends when they completed the pokedex. Simply put, I think Nintendo puposefully restrained Mario Odyssey for the purpose of making the Switch look better than it was, and that the original developer intention was to have a super massive adventure where you could capture literally everything, and they just simply weren't allowed to.

[@adrienbrasseur8809]

I think this Mario game has to many ‘’boring’’ moon to have

[@theminecraft2516]

Too* moons*

[@yesidoskate]

dude thank you! i didn't find this game enjoyable in the slightest, the korok seed analogy was on point. I didn't feel rewarded in the slightest when i found those stupid moons

[@ScottTheWoz_]

Y'know when you title a video "The Problem With Super Mario Odyssey" I expected a REALLY BAD problem, still a good video though

[@bluekirbyrocks]

That’s basically the case for all of the This game that everybody liked and still likes a lot has this problem videos they never point out something that’s actually bad they just point out some stuff that are kinda OK

[@AlphaUru]

It [SMG] doesn't have an end game timer so you never feel rushed while doing so." Speedy Comets and some Purple Comets: *Allow us to introduce ourselves.*

[@Anonfaulty]

I hated the post game content for odyssey. It’s so boring once you get like 500 moons

[@traviscunningham7062]

The moons were meant for the Switch’s handheld mode in mind.

[@crokobos]

The worst crime Odysea pulled on us is the Classic Mario costume not having yellow skin in 2d sections.

[@Jordan3DS]

I dunno, it sort of feels like you're not really critiquing the game itself as much as you're saying "this is how I WANT the game to be". It feels like a lot of the points are saying things that aren't problems, and then offering solutions that would radically change how the entire game works. I remember the SnowmanGaming video on Donkey Kong 64 from a few years ago did the same thing. It'd be like me saying "Man, I don't like the Great Bay area in Majora's Mask, imagine if instead it was a giant volcano instead and designed exactly how I want it to be?"