The Rings of Power Sucks at Fantasy

[@Angrenost02]

- Write a small community of little quirky nomads. - Make them all about keeping to themselves and solidarity against the cold hard world. - Make them instantly abandon a whole family when they're unable to follow the group. Stellar writing indeed.

[@peterbryantorres7096]

I have been thinking what an awful awful group of hobbits-abandoning whole families for basically walking too slow-contrary to the character of Sam and Pippin and Merry - but especially Sam-who never abandoned Frodo-and these are supposed to be their ancestors?? It’s insane.

[@KarnageKollectibles]

Who wrote this shit? Do we have names? They should never write anything LOTR related ever again.

[@rule7254]

I mean... when you put it like THAT, it does kind of sound like religion 😅

[@goontheracoon]

casual hollywood circle jerk echo chamber.. they have no talent and never reads the source, and the few who do still try to make their mark on what's far beyond their capability, its like as if someone tried to improve on the Mona lisa by "making the painting more fit for a modern audience" and then proceed to rub shit at it.. they are shitty ppl full of ego, everything they touch gets stained by the absolute stink that these ppl call personal views, views only mirrored by others holding the same lucid take on reality.

[@johns1625]

Carry wagons completely full of nothing but lamps and moss and grass bundles and cute figs and acorns to put in their hair 😂😂

[@sirlionheart4614]

Have I watched a single second of Amazon Presents: The Rings of Power? No. Have I watched countless hours of content shitting on Amazon Presents: The Rings of Power? Yes.

[@edgelord-satire]

Greetings, O soul brother! I just cannot bring myself to actually go to Amazon Prime and play even one minute of this shitty slop. But the reviews from many KZbinrs are some kind of relief.

[@austinhess4967]

Hahahah omg I'm also a fellow soul brother! I'm with you my friends.

[@ivankadump2539]

This 👍

[@johnwolf2829]

They watch it so we don't have to.... which is why Dis-me's hired guns always accuse anyone that does not like it of mysogney, white supremacy and any other slur they can smear anyone with . The dumb basterds actually think that a few KZbinrs can convince millions of people to not watch something they are enjoying ... after the fact! Yes, they really are that stupid.

[@cosmicmuffin322]

I tried watching it (downloaded so Amazon doesn't get a cent of my money). It was just like the first season - as soon as it finished I couldn't remember what happened. It's like the most boring fever dream imaginable.

[@Janovich]

Boils down to: What's the point of doing a Lotr show if you're not even going to follow the lore. Its worse than fan fiction.

[@TheSuperappelflap]

Ive read a lot of fan fiction that was a lot better written

[@jakobwashington5878]

The movies don’t follow the lore perfectly and those are good. Also it doesn’t necessarily need to be super faithful to the source material to be a good show.

[@robertbryant4669]

@@jakobwashington5878 It's setting itself up as a prequel to LotR; and as it stands, several characters in the original book trilogy can't exist because their parents/grandparents were written out of this show. Arwen and her brothers can't exist because their mother, Celebrian, was removed from the story to make way for the stupid Sauron/Galadriel ship, which was extrapolated entirely from a single 80-second scene in the Jackson trilogy.

[@jakobwashington5878]

@@robertbryant4669 nothing you just said makes it a bad show. The show is based on the books. It’s not meant to be a direct copy of the story/lore in the books. It merely takes inspiration from them. I understand the confusion caused by certain changes to the story and characters but as long as those changes make sense within the show’s narrative, these things don’t make the show bad.

[@robertbryant4669]

@@jakobwashington5878 It's amusing watching you try to defend the indefensible. If your story is a prequel to another story, then you need to make sure that the events and characters of your story are consistent with the story that you're prequeling. Erasing Galadriel's granddaughter (and Elrond's daughter) from existence because her family gets in the way of a will they/won't they romance that shouldn't even be happening isn't just lore breaking, it's thoughtless. Imagine that someone were to make a prequel of Dune that was centered on Paul's mother, Lady Jessica; but instead of a Bene Gesserit sleeper agent that was sold to Duke Leto Atreides as a concubine, she was instead portrayed as a galaxy hopping freedom fighter hellbent on destroying the House Harkonnen, only to wind up in an enemies-to-lovers situation with the Baron. Whoever writes that scenario isn't just breaking Dune's lore, they are completely rewriting the story so that the events of Dune can't happen, and in doing so displaying a shocking lack of knowledge of how the universe of Dune even works. Rings of Power doesn't just fail as an adaptation; it fails as a prequel, because it's so completely rearranged the events and characters of the Second Age that events and characters of the Third Age can't even happen. And it doesn't help that the story that they're writing is garbage anyway.

[@markkettlewell7441]

Sauron was a powerful Maia who worked for Morgoth Bauglir in the First Age. He was cunning but s**t at fighting. He beguiled Celebrimbor (a grandson of Fëanor), by pretending to come from Valinor to teach crafting. He was beautiful to look upon yet this did not convince Galadriel (not the silly girl in ROP), Gil-Galad, Círdan or Elrond of his true provenance. He taught Celebrimbor the methods of creating magic rings, and Celebrimbor being a master craftsman let his desire for knowledge cloud his judgment. Annatar (Sauron) taught him many things and eventually together they created the Rings of Power for men and dwarves. Then Sauron left, to secretly create the One Ring in Orodruin. During that time Celebrimbor created the three Elven Rings. But as soon as they were used, the Elves became aware of Annatar (Sauron) and Sauron became aware of Celebrimbor’s creation. In rage Sauron led an army against Celebrimbor and the Gwaith I Mirdan. Celebrimbor hid the rings but he himself was captured, tortured and killed. This is what really happened according to JRR Tolkien. Amazon could have done much with this, but squandered it to tell a story that makes absolutely no sense. They could have, at the least, hired some decent actors. They failed at this too.

[@shredtalktv7546]

Beautifully said!

[@MrSimeonk]

here, hear.

[@mzaking]

@markkettlewell7441 7 seasons of crafting mentorship, 1 season of a battle ending in torture, it would never have worked. They wanted to fit other things into the series, which is why the timeline and, therefore, lore is out. I like the actors too.

[@tash4943]

​@@mzakingthey could have done a better job if they skipped the filler arcs of Grand Elf and the Hobbits, the Dwarves and some parts of Numenor. There are too many plotlines happening at once, that don't need to be a part of this story.

[@mzaking]

@tash4943 There wouldn't have been much of anything if they skipped all of what u said. I do kinda agree though. No gandalf and hobs.. Rest is pretty essential I would say. Will you be watching season 3?

[@esindirik4447]

They're money laundering. There's no other explanation for how much it sucks. A bunch of LOTR geeks could had come up with a much better storyline and cosplay.

[@ArtofManhood]

It's about Bezos giving creative direction because it's how he wants to spend his time and money, and Amazon reaching the threshold of new Prime subs in order to make money from selling products, which they did. They don't care about the story or the lore or the acting or the audience reactions etc.; all that matters is how the $250 million name affects the company's bottom line.

[@TheSuperappelflap]

Please explain how it makes sense that a company like Amazon needs to launder money, when all their revenue streams are legitimate. Is Jeff Bezos importing powder for the cartels or something?

[@owangejewice]

Yeah, I hear that accusation being leveled at Disney, too. I don't think they're laundering money. More like gambling in a casino I think. Bet it all on black because they can afford to lose many times. It's a long shot, but if it succeeds and Amazon makes money, then they look like they knew what they were doing all along.

[@esindirik4447]

@@owangejewice I was subscribed to Prime because I was rewatching the Sherlock series, but I immediately cancelled my subscription after this disaster without even giving them a single minute of watch time. It's just incomprehensible to me how they could actually end up making real money. It just doesn't compute.

[@NatsumeHaku]

If it would be so, there were not so many really good CGI. Seriously, graphics are technically incredible, albeit its completely liveless because of the lack of history behind it

[@justthinkingoutloud2538]

"The show's reliant on you knowing the lore, while simultaneously butchering it." Perfect encapsulation of the show. I have no idea who they wanted to please, but Tolkien fans are pissed and non-Tolkien-fans are confused, both assuming the other was the target audience.

[@scififantasygirl]

Perfect summation.

[@husman2007]

"Tolkien' fans are missed", most people that actually know Tolkien like this show: it's the trolls that know the basics and watched the PJ movies are the most vocal Karen's crying about "butchering" stuff they know very little about...

[@mzaking]

@husman2007 agree with the Karen's for sure. It's fashionable now to just whine about anything. These vids get clicks based on that and it snow balls. While idiots on a band wagon get money from it whilst giving people who are actually making something a bad name and maybe even getting something cancelled. It's a sad world where people are that easily influenced it clouds minds into not liking something.

[@misshielrodriguez7872]

​@@husman2007 I was a Tolkien fan before even watching the movies. For me, this show is bad, and it's worse knowing the source material.

[@GonzoTehGreat]

​@@husman2007You don't speak for most Tolkien fans, so keep your bogus claims to yourself. Those fans are active on social media, including KZbin, regarding their opinions of the show and for many of them, including myself, it's complete rubbish. I first read LotR and The Silmarillion as a teenager and watched Bakshi's (unfinished) animated adaptation before I saw PJ's movies. Both of them are far superior to this garbage. This show is an embarrassment to JRR Tolkien and his novels.

[@analogmusings9888]

a comment i read summarized the protagonist problem of the tolkien universe pretty good: the eldest beings in middle earth (like galadriel) are static. they are more a force of nature that shapes middle earth and have little room for character development. gandalf literally had to die to a balrog in order to advance his development. thats why tolkien followed mortal people. because they can change and grow and are influenced by / or struggle against the schemes and plans of arda's immortal forces. thats why galadriel is a very difficult choice to pull off as a protagonist.

[@johannjohann6523]

And all the characters from Tolkian's experience from serving in WW I and seeing the horrors of "war" firsthand. Anyone who ends up serving but then lives and survives coming back home when so many do not, it does 2 things to them: 1) Terrible "Guilt" that they lived and their buddies did not. It will be something they carry to their grave. 2) A profound belief the only way they did survive was due to God looking out for them even though they may have never been to church once in their life. Every person who survives war has a profound faith in God afterward. And are the people who have had a true "experience" of seeing the very best in people, and the very worse in people, and what they say should be listened to carefully and highly revered. You will find no more honest person than someone who makes it back from war. Even the soldiers, the bad guys, on the other side. They too will develop the exact same characteristics. It's universal. And how you know "it's the truth". Had Tolkien not been in WW I, I doubt he would have even written Lord of the Rings. And when he did, be so damn good. And that's why when heartless woke feminists with no experience in the world ruin something of high quality because of how they "feel" or are "offended" on baseless and false notions because Tolkien was a white guy and not a black woman, then it is they who become the biggest of Hypocrites. But their stupidity does not allow them to see this as their faults. And how they are just as, if not more bigoted than the people they point a finger at and call bigots. Which is limited to only "straight Republican white guys". I'm not sure if even gay Republican white guys get a pass with them. lol But their "agenda" and feelings come before the company's profits, shareholders, or customers. When is the last time you seen a piece of woke feminist art that was on the level with DaVinci or Michaelangelo? Which is why if you Woke, you go Broke. They are some of the most untalented yet selfish people on the planet.

[@nolanolivier6791]

'Middle-schoolers at a renaissance festival' has got to be the best description of the writing I have heard yet...

[@Elgsdyr]

This is what I wrote in my IMDb review back in September 2022: "This isn't entirely unlike an amateur theatre group performing this "lost" play by Shakespeare, which turns out to be written by someone's 16 year old cousin as a school project and generously financed by a very wealthy uncle."

[@Angrenost02]

I'm into LARPing and TTRPGs. The dialogue in RoP resembles a lot the way newbies roleplay: they overact and use really flowery language because they thinks it sounds like fantasy.

[@KTempestBradford]

My soul briefly left my body when the shipbuilding elf's first line out of the blue was "Perfection only exists in Valinor," and then when he shows up with the rings he goes, "Perfection exists outside of Valinor in these rings." Just... the audacity of this blatantly bad dialogue. Plus, when he said it the first time, it didn't even come out of a situation or conversation that didn't feel contrived and literally they're so he could make that response. Ugh.

[@TheLastSisyphus]

So good. haha.

[@TheSuperappelflap]

@@Angrenost02 The analogies they are using are just utter cringe. Every time they say something they have to follow it up with an awful analogy, like an edgy sixteen year old posting their first fanfiction on the internet.

[@gloverwilliams]

No matter how many times I try to figure out how this could’ve gone so wrong, I can’t puzzle it out. I’m afraid of thinking anyone could be so incompetent in their stewardship of such a beloved story. It feels more like malice.

[@Sue_Me_Too]

If I challenged you to write a new Terry Pratchett book, but you could ONLY reference the Wikipedia: how good of a job could you do?

[@richardjamesIII]

1000% It is no accident that almost all (and counting) of the great works of 20th Century fiction have been or are being brutalized and bastardized by bad faith actors with axes to grind.

[@GeraltofRivia22]

​@@Sue_Me_Too Rings of Power doesn't only fail at adapting Tolkien, but just at being a well written show in general. Lack of access to the source material rights doesn't preclude them from writing a good show.

[@Sue_Me_Too]

@@GeraltofRivia22 I'm not arguing against that point. However, I am proposing that the showrunners never read the actual source material. I might even suggest that they're contractually obliged to NOT read it.

[@mzaking]

​@the_inquisitive_inquisitor maybe it's just meant to be a prequel to the films? It's not Tolkien lore just get over that

[@BaconMountainMan]

Nicely done! I had a similar take on Galadriel; If the show runners really wanted an ultimate woman/girl-boss, they could have used the *literal* Galadriel -- who was 3,000 - 4,000 years old at this time, rather than turning her into a whiny 25 year-old young adult. I also loved how they took a literal demi-god (Sauron) and turned him into someone who could be easily killed by a dozen orcs. As you said, this show is a mess.

[@jurgenparkour9337]

Yeah but you are forgeting that those orc have families and orc babies so they are powered by that

[@ianfrye7900]

A whining, pouting, scowling adolescent is apparently current Hollywood’s idea of a strong woman, based on recent output. The modern leading lady must look disgusted at everyone she talks to and be prepared to say “I hate you dad!” At all times.

[@Keram-io8hv]

@@jurgenparkour9337 Until evil white Numenorans came and killed them?

[@JosephKelly-uj1zo]

I think the character is the actual actress's personality.

[@TheSuperappelflap]

@@JosephKelly-uj1zo She has a personality?

[@marenomorgan]

"The reader must approach Faerie with a willing suspension of disbelief. If a thing can be technologically controlled, it ceases to be magical.” - Tolkien, 1968. Looking at you, mithril and Mount Doom rube goldberg machine.

[@DanielArnett]

Looking at you Brandon Sanderson

[@jesperburns]

These people aren't fans so I wouldn't call this "fan fiction"

[@saj-manthesonicfan1893]

How about "Normie AU"?

[@mzaking]

@@jesperburns that's crazy mate. You can't know that unless you know all the people involved in getting this made. Do you?

[@jesperburns]

@@mzaking It's perfectly evident by how they butchered the characters and lore.

[@mzaking]

@@jesperburns so they thought they couldn't make a decent show based on following the lore. I could defo understand that. So they had to move things around. That's how it works. Not butchered imo. Just different.

[@mjodreaper8481]

@@mzaking Butchered to hell imo

[@markkettlewell7441]

There is a world of difference between blind luck (bad writing I.e., deus ex machina) or serendipity (something that builds in the narrative as a movement by a higher power (good writing I.e., Gollum loses the ring, Bilbo finds it, Frodo inherits it, but Gollum under Frodo’s curse destroys it). Tolkien defines this as Eucatastrophe. No one can willingly destroy the One, not even Sauron! It is destroyed by Gollum swearing on the Precious to serve the Master (Frodo), and then at Mount Doom Frodo tells Gollum as the Ringbearer, “if you ever touch me again, you shall be cast in the fires of Doom yourself”. Gollum does, the curse is fulfilled and the Ring is destroyed. Now that is good plot writing. This is why Tolkien is great and the ROP writers are no better than dumb and dumber.

[@BKPrice]

"Want to hear the most annoying sound in the world?" (Turns on an episode of Rings of Power.)

[@wewuzwolves4428]

To call Rings of Power a "bad adaptation" is putting it lightly

[@arisenomega]

You are right, Lee Pace would've been perfect to play Sauron/Annotar, as he is extremely handsome and has the kind of charisma you'd expect him to have in order to manipulate and charm the elves.

[@wavetactics13]

What kills me about this show the most (out of a lot) is the mithril retcon. Giving it vague mystic properties to give the rings a special power really doesn't work with the Lord of the Rings. Especially since Frodo spends most of that trilogy wearing about 50 times the amount of mithril that went into the three rings. Them just jumping on mithril because one of the elven rings was made with it (when it had nothing to do with magic and everything to do with the elves loving to work with a metal that would not rust/tarnish) is deeply aggravating.

[@dustypirate28]

People who write half-baked fan fictions need to stop becoming writers. Most modern fantasy writing feels like shitty D&D dungeon masters thinking they should be writers.

[@BKPrice]

Or, alternately, they need to hunker down and learn the craft. They're probably capable of becoming good writers, they just don't bother because everyone tells them they're special.

[@astrolillo]

@@BKPrice no they arent, they are very stupid

[@FFKonoko]

​@astrolillo yes. Unskilled writers should stop writing, no-one gets better over time, no-one makes mistakes while writing a ludicrously complicated story unless they are stupid, there's no such thing as executives asking for "known charcater as lead, plenty if action". 🙄 this is the worst take other than. "They made x bad on purpose"

[@bicunisa]

They turned Sauron into the biggest "I can change HIM" buffoon

[@nicolausteslaus]

From the creators of African Elves

[@peterk.rosenthal1417]

Having the Nazgul gals follow the hobbits the whole season only for them in the end to realise that oops, they have the wrong dude is fantastic writing.

[@noturmum7967]

You mean the dude who literally fell from the sky for all to see? Yeah I guess it is weird they would look into that.

[@mzaking]

@noturmum7967 people just wanna cry mate. No matter how much coming sense you come back with.

[@noturmum7967]

@@mzaking it's because their identities are too instantly tied to fictional property OR they are earning those bugu bucks from the KZbin grifters. Moist critical been doing it for years. You tell the mob what they already wanna here and your pockets will be filled for a while

[@dragonheart967]

​@@noturmum7967they didn't look into it, they presumed it was their dark lord, that would for some reason come from the heavens.

[@noturmum7967]

@@dragonheart967the second half of That comment is devoid of logic and literally adds nothing to the discussion. You may as well have said the grass was green in some scenes "They didn't look into it" not sure how them tracking down the stranger for so long wouldn't be considered looking into it.

[@Yattayatta]

Great video, the thing about fantasy is, the world building really needs to be rock solid, because it's already asking us to suspend disbelief for a lot of things. Every village needs to feel lived in, every detail about how the different races and relations would affect the world needs to be thought through. Sadly Amazon did no such thing, they sat right behind LotR in class, and tried copying their answers, but they got it all wrong.

[@kathleenhensley5951]

Very well done! Enjoyed your explanation of what is wrong and the description. Tokien's world building is masterful. He worked on it a lifetime and it shows... the tragedy is that men of lesser skills have broken it in their conceit and arrogance.

[@boosterbowone]

“Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin what good forces have invented or made.” -JRR Tolkien

[@FFKonoko]

They wanted to make money, the executives mandated known lead character, plenty of action. As even this review notes, there is a lot they got right in the broad strokes. People that cared wrote for this. That is a far greater tragedy than "they were bad people that did bad", there are genuine fans that tried hard, but due to how it works, due to other forces acting upon them, this is the result and they are reviled for it.

[@markkettlewell7441]

Lee Pace was brilliant as Thranduil.

[@TheSuperappelflap]

The only good part of the hobbit movies

[@asellandrofacchio7263]

​Come on man there are some great things about em, I give them a 6 overall cause they're watchable and mostly stick to the source material. The soundtrack by Howard shore is great, the actors are great, the first movie is good.@@TheSuperappelflap

[@TheSuperappelflap]

@@asellandrofacchio7263 Mostly stuck to the source material? They made up 2/3rds of the runtime to turn a couple hundred page book into three movies. Remember the dwarf/elf love triangle? Remember Gandalfs subplot going to Gundabad? Remember all the callbacks to LOTR which werent there in the book? Remember the guy in the dress doing a bad impression of Eric Idle (Monty Python) playing a woman? Remember Rhadagast with that sled pulled by rabbits??? Remember? Id say a 6/10 is a fair rating for it as a kids movie for ages idk 8-13, but saying it stuck to the source material? No it didnt. If they stuck to the book it wouldve been one 3 hour movie at most and it wouldve been a lot better. But WB wanted to milk it.

[@derletzteteebeutel6051]

​@@TheSuperappelflap The Hobbit movies would be great-fantastic even, if you remove almost half of the plot. Get rid of all the highly unrealistic over the top action scenes and unnessacary, drawn out chase scenes, remove certain characters completely or almost completely (Legolas, Tauriel, the Master of Laketown, Alfrid, etc.) and ignore unnecessary plots that were added just to stretch the story and ruin otherwise good characters like Thorin Oakenshield with his sudden insanity. Whenever The Hobbit trilogy remembers that it tells the story about the hobbit Bilbo Baggins they are at their best. Otherwise they got many elements right, like Golum, Smaug (minus the chase scene where he was reduced to a boring movie monster), Thranduil, Bilbo himself and all the dwarfs who got enough screentime (ignoring Kíli with his elf romance, of course). That's why I see the book edit of the trilogy as a worthy prequel to LOTR.

[@missAlice1990]

@@derletzteteebeutel6051 Legolas could've appeared as a cameo. He was Thranduil's son, it would've been natural for him to be there. He could've captured the dwarves, brought them to his father and that's all. Tauriel was unnecessary, Alfrid was cringy af. So yeah, throw half of the plot out but also, the tone should be different. The Hobbit is not another LOTR. It's a cute, lighthearted adventure story written mainly for kids. Trying to fit this story into a mold it clearly doesn't fit was a sure way to produce a flop.

[@NickLaslett]

I have watched a lot of these ROP dissection videos. I thought yours was one of the best. You capture the sad tragedy of what Amazon have done. You have to pity them, they are truly like Golem, they want the “precious” but don’t understand it and are destined to be destroyed by it.

[@neliaferreira9983]

It seems like none of this would have happened if not for Galadriel's teenage rage. She forced Sauron into his vilan role. Before she showed up, he was just chilling in the sea.

[@peterbryantorres7096]

Little Gal Galadriel strikes again

[@chasedribben6833]

Uhm no opening scene of season 2 obviously shows him preplanning everything he was never gonna be good Sauron😂

[@SondreoftheNorth]

⁠@@chasedribben6833not to defend ROP but you’re correct. He served morgoth after all. He was forever going to be “lord Sauron of Mordor”.

[@richardjamesIII]

LOTR was my introduction to fantasy novels. I read them around 11 years old. They propelled me into many MANY other fantasy works, as well as a huge number of sci-fi. I like to think I have an appreciation for the genre that goes a bit deeper than the average person. What is being done to masterful works like LOTR and Wheel of Time is a crime against art. These freaks are leaving s legacy of unearned hubris and disrespectful plagiarism.

[@Vodkaboy1979]

WoT is a disgrace. amazing books. so much promise for a decent tv show!

[@frankiepips]

That was the first unemotional appraisal of this apparent debacle I've heard and thanks for using logic to point out the obvious reasons it fails. I don't watch television but logic keeps me from it more than anything so cheers for pointing out the internal story disfunctions that make it bad. Don't stop I like your honesty without hate approach 10/10.

[@YT.WillArcher]

It’s actually a really good show

[@evarjantz222]

@@YT.WillArcher 😆

[@FFKonoko]

"Unemotional" 😂😂

[@uxbytim]

These shows are not being hated on for their diversity, they are being hated on because the writing and plot sucks ass!

[@Yattayatta]

The only times "diversity" is mentioned is when it doesn't make sense. We see a village in the middle of nowhere, there is a single woman of color, how does that happen in the middle ages? If it is in the port cities, that's fine! Especially when we go to Rhun in season 2, but for some insane reason they chose to cast white actors only in Rhun?!?! Make it make sense!

[@DogSerious]

Not Tolkien, not watching.

[@StepSisRUstuck]

I actually hate it for the diversity I read somewhere that elves are meant to be so white they almost glow so why the f are they now black 😂

[@KPhilipHH]

True, the link between the two is resentment that you managed to get YOUR end in with the diversity, but failed to give the basic quality of a passable story and experience.

[@nickmoranis2865]

@@uxbytim have you watched it? Have you played Fallout 3 or 4? I doubt it.

[@FPLCivilian]

very well explained without bias... great job. my biggest issue with the show is that if you take it out of the LOTR canon and isolated it as as stand alone series entirely... the show still doesn't hold its own. the plot is weak, very little world and character building and almost no world building. the Shanara series was better than this... (and that's saying something. lol)

[@britwww]

I tried so hard to defend this show during S1, man. If they lost even me, I don’t know who is watching this season. Thank you for this video!

[@scottporter4524]

Out of countless RoP KZbin reviews, this was by FAR the absolute best of them all. You brought to light so many issues that no one else did, and you totally nailed it. Pleeeeease do more, this is fantastic work. Subbed!

[@krisjustbegun9740]

I really appreciate that this is a good faith critique and analysis based on the original lore and storytelling & world building fundamentals rather than an excuse to dunk on bipoc actors or whine about the "woke agenda"

[@paxluporum4447]

Same.

[@theknightjester]

They know its outrageous that they met in the middle of the Ocean. The creators are laughing at fans of sincere writing that respects the source material.

[@MeepBottoms]

Because people are weird and don't like any moral ambiguity, so the fact that orcs might have families makes them uncomfortable. But that is a strange way to engage with art, IMO. Orcs can be evil and have families. Hell watch a movie like Zone Of Interest, only the most media-illiterate people were saying that movie glamorized the family in that. Plus you have the grifters who will use this as just another example of some woke mind virus causing Tolkien to roll in his grave, so they can get more views and make more money.Bruh... Tolkien said orcs have families why is it such a big deal to some pplOrcs had families. Their own culture. Language. It’s in the books

[@joshryantt]

Sometimes when I get the comments from people saying "Tolkien actually imagined his works as lore told from many different sources, so RoP is just another perspective" I feel like I'm being gaslit.

[@christianjacinto7042]

I'm pretty sure JRR Tolkien meant in universe. The LOTR trilogy exists in the story, it's the red book written by Bilbo and later Frodo.

[@FFKonoko]

Yeah, that isn't being gaslit. The idea that historical writers are not always accurate is what he meant. Just as bilbo missed out on the war bit in the hobbit, different books can focus on different perspectives. The idea that a particular person might portray the past events a certain, different, way, isn't insane or trying to convince you that you are insane. It's also not a perfect defence, since it's hard to see who would retell things this way.

[@joshryantt]

@@FFKonoko I hear you and agree but my brain refuses to accept the defense at all lol.

[@Mike_Genisys]

When only 37% of the audience finishes season one, they should've known they had a problem.

[@Warui88]

I can't believe the elves are going to storm Numenor and take all their jobs.

[@Koalavater]

*jerbs

[@GreatGreebo]

I wanted to like this series, I really did. The butchering of Tolkien’s lore is unforgivable. They took amazing, well written characters and stories and completely destroyed them…not to mention the TERRIBLE dialogue. It’s just *SAD*

[@JackChurchill101]

Me too... But from that first moment when Gil Galad says "to reward their bravery, these soldiers are going back to Valinor"... That's really not your decision, Gil....

[@TheFunkyCriminal]

Dude the amount of cringe idioms and analogies is so ridiculous. Like how do you honestly think that you can write Tolkien, better than Tolkien?

[@edgelord-satire]

The mind blowing thing is: For this kind of budget, they could have hired really skilled writers, directors and also the casting is soooo lame and terrible. Those showrunners are deluded on levels never thought possible.

[@asellandrofacchio7263]

​@@JackChurchill101"do you know why wood floats but stones don't?" 😂

[@jesperburns]

I also don't understand why the Elves speak the common tongue amongst each other, I thought we were meant to believe they speak Elvish, but they switch between them sometimes.

[@TheSolarium18]

This show really hurts me and makes my life experience and perception of humanity worse

[@ipercalisse579]

Turn to the books and the original films.. remember Tolkien words.. evil can't create but just corrupt the creation. These are dark times indeed, but a renassance is possible as the hearts of the pure and noble ones is still there. Fight, fight, fight..

[@dandyjandon4231]

I went back and watched lotr scenes.... some of the battles and scenes make my eyes watery not out of sadness but epicness and joy. Rings of power just made me angry.

[@aratheonfantasyworld1514]

Wouldn't Morgoth be the stand-in for Satan since he was the first fallen angel and the one to corrupt Sauron? And shout out to Uhtred of Bebbanburg, son of Uhtred, son of Uhtred, father of Uhtred!

[@ajourneythroughcinema1271]

I’ve gotten this comment a lot so to address it, Silmarillion was published posthumously and was originally passed up by publishers. JRR Tolkien would instead use it as a backbone for Lord of the Rings with a lot of Morgoth’s catholic parallels re-attributed to Sauron. Especially as Maiar were more similar to angels within middle earth. Making Sauron an almost literal fallen angel. But yes, Morgoth also had similarities to Satan. However, Tolkien saw the Silmarillion as his take on mythology for England. He had heavy ties to Christianity (especially with Eru) but drew inspiration from Greek, Egyptian, and Norse myth for the Valar. In some ways, Morgoth was also based on the catholic perception of pagan or old religion “wicked” gods- ones representing death, mischief, or malice.

[@sparkycjs]

"thank you Lord, I will name my son Uhtred!" "YOU WILL NOT!" "I will not!"

[@sunsin1592]

Sauron is not the stand-in for Satan; Morgoth/Melkor is. Sauron was Morgoth's lackey. And he was a sorcerer/shapeshifter, even a werewolf, in the Elder Days.

[@Buc82]

Yes, however, to be a sorcerer in a world of, ultimately, low magic doesn't mean you are a mere circus curiosity. Take it more like if in our world there'd be 10 people tops that can shape elements, affect minds that are thousands years old. You're a henchman of a guy who was present at the very Universe creation. More - YOU yourself were present there, 70 000 years ago.

[@hafabee]

Sauron might not be Satan but he's as close to Satan that there is in the 2nd and 3rd ages of Middle Earth; he's a demi-god of incredible evil who has caused much strife in the world through his various mechanizations, corruption and deceit. He's not just "a werewolf". He corrupted Numenor from the inside and brought about it's destruction. He made the rings and corrupted the nine human kings. He accelerated the fall of man and broke Saruman. For all intents he's Satan for the 2nd and 3rd ages of Middle Earth and during the story of The Lord of the Rings.

[@ipercalisse579]

But Maiar are anyway ultraterrestrial creature on earth like the Valarie, so yes comparing Sauron to a fallen angel is correct. A fallen God, would be even more accurate. Wizard is really not capturing his essence.

[@TocYounger]

​@@ipercalisse579I disagree with your characterization of Sauron as a god. I think that angel is much more apt, especially given the themes of creation and sub-creation that run through the Silmarillion. After all, any attempts to create something after their own designs, "...shall prove but mine [Eru Illuvatar's] instrument in the devising of things more wonderful, which he himself hath not imagined..." The maiar and valar are not permitted such acts of creation that one called God(s) must possess. Fwiw, I do agree that the terms "wizard" or "sorcerer" do not begin to encapsulate his power.

[@mistrkill]

​@@TocYoungeran angel or a demi-god seems more appropriate.

[@burningdeadman]

Seriously thank you for this. For showing every step of the way how misaligned and how terrible Amazon made this story.

[@TheLastSisyphus]

Describing the ROP as nothing more than fan fiction is so accurate. I'm relieved to see others feel the same.

[@AJ-HawksToxicFinger]

This show sounds like it was written in the freshman dorms by a handful of girls who saw Peter Jackson's movies as children.

[@OsloTime]

8:05 😂😂😂😂 Send a raven! Great video, I love your editing. I just finished your review and I wish the show runners would watch this and LEARN SOMETHING! I'm really looking forward to your future videos! 👏

[@ajourneythroughcinema1271]

Glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for watching!

[@Joe-rk9uy]

One does not quench thirst by drinking sea water.....perfect analogy for watching the show

[@better_dont]

The brother on the couch line as Sauron got me 😂.

[@gundamzing]

0:50 WBD still hold the rights to LotR and the Hobbit, and even the Silmarillon. What Amazon got were... the appendices at the end of Return of the King.

[@Dmanz67]

One of the main problems is that all of the actors are sooo 'Drama School'.

[@Stitchlii]

The way the Biggest Lord of Ring fan channels eat this garbage up is nuts. It doesn't seem sincere.

[@christianriddler5063]

They are payed, a lot of youtubers get payed by large corporations to promote their garbage.

[@marenomorgan]

Thank you for bringing up the lack of the immortality theme with Numenor. That is by far the most unforgivable sin in this series for me.

[@frogman9989]

The forced DEI really destroys the world building. GOT was great at showing the difference areas and diverse people without pandering. It made everything believable. Rings just seems like a downtown LA with magic and less homeless tents.

[@JamesR1986]

I'm half joking half serious. Yes, so much diversity. You have white people in the snow, white people in the desert, white people on the coast with lots of money, white people with dragons, white pirates, white people in the garden. And then black people on the edge of the world and barely involved the story.

[@frogman9989]

@JamesR1986 house of the dragon. Half of the main characters are black, and no one cares. That was a race swap, but it made sense and the writing is good. 90 percent of current shows pander to a diverse cast. But there needs to be a reason. Rings, The Witcher, Star Wars, every remake the last 8 years. Disney race swapps EVERYTHING. Hell, even Snow WHITE is brown. That's all fine, but have A POINT. Just shoving forced DEI for no reason is corny. And when the lore is based on cultures from England, Ireland, and Greece... kinda strange to have diverse elves and dwarfs.

[@MaxSoininen]

​@@JamesR1986maybe adapt african literature if you think people mainly being white is an issue. Not english literature.

[@LalaDepala_00]

​@@JamesR1986If I make a movie about a Chinese novel, I don't cast Swedish actors to "make it more relatable" for Europeans. That would be inconsiderate and rude. Didn't we all agree that race-swapping is bad when white Hollywood did it in the 40s and 50s? Then why is the other way around revolutionary?

[@JamesR1986]

@@LalaDepala_00 Game of Thrones is not historical fiction. Dragons and blood magics weren't an important part of the War of the Roses.

[@connortweedie2446]

Great video, you really highlighted all the points I've been scratching my head at since episode 1. The entire plot relying on the stupidity of every character is truly mind blowing.

[@mer_acle8101]

"As the Shining shows, you can butcher the source material and still make something great" Not the take I expected but dang, so glad to hear someone say that, I was so put off by the Shining bc I came straight from reading the book, but obv i know the filmmaking is top tier

[@serkanbiceren9263]

Actually Nenya is made from mithril. It was discovered at the first age by Durin the 1st and was mining at the second age. They also trade mithril items with elves but it was very rare and high valued..Also Durin's door scripted with an ink made by mithril called Moon Runes. Balrog woke up at 3rd age because dwarves digging those mountains so deep for more mithrill that is never enough for dwarves. And as a note, gimli never mined mithrill and used existed mithrill to fix gondors door.

[@sortedevaras]

As bad as this is, its still not the abomination that is Wheel of Time.

[@ajourneythroughcinema1271]

Agreed

[@Maccaboy1984]

Yes, the Wheel of Time ‘adaptation’ makes me physically sick. A book series I have loved and followed for decades; humiliated and disgraced.

[@Deluxedracula]

This show truly is terrible.

[@LotsOfRobotsINC]

I’m a huge fan of all things Middle Earth. The things that I don’t like about ROP is: Why is Galadriel rolling her ’Rs’ while saying everyone’s and no one else is? She is really good at rolling Rs? Gotta use it to show off her abilities?

[@chaotix7275]

eHRRRRRRegion

[@peterbryantorres7096]

Little Gal Galadriel ruined the whole thing for me from the start.

[@omarayyad3503]

+1

[@stellviahohenheim]

My gal galadriel!!

[@rubensoeteman]

Guyladriel

[@KatAdVictoriam]

Enjoyed this video. Subbed for your coverage of early cinema. I think the mix of current/past content is interesting! A lot of nasty comments and I hope they won't discourage you. Your thoughts are shared by so many.

[@kwadwomensa5930]

Hands down one of the best analyses of the Rings of Power on the internet right now!!

[@LalaDepala_00]

The "you are racist" - argument is so childish at this point. I am black, I am European and I love Tolkien. The Rings of Power is tragically bad. Black people/people of color are not helpless little children. Hollywood needs to stop injecting us into stories that do not involve us. It is so insulting. Like we are fragile souls that don't know history or reality. Yes, black people can exist in fantasy stories - and they do. Just not in Tolkien's stories (for the most part). If a man spends decades writing a book, you can at the very least respect the story.

[@andrewramirez3998]

The funny part is that forced diversity casting even as stupid as it is, wouldn’t be focused on if the show actually had good writing

[@TocYounger]

​@@andrewramirez3998 Yeah, as a brown man in Canada... I feel like the colpur of an actors skin literally doesn't matter. Pick the most skilled actor, regardless of colour. We focus on this point so hard with ROP because the writing is so bloody awful, that every little nuisance becomes a (justified) grievance.

[@felipemaaartins]

Yes, they did understood the original work. They just hate it and everything it stood for in all it's meaning, and wanted it to be something else entirely. This is the conclusion I got after all this years watching theses things unfold franchise after franchise. Like is the same case with Disney's Star Wars and other, is not a new game.

[@FFKonoko]

That's a sad conclusion to make. The real conclusion is companies want to make money. They sometimes have broad mandates, which make logical sense to them. "Having a known character is better, makes it more popular for fans". "Action and mystery is exciting". Those are pretty solid things to suggest. And yet this is the result, even with fans that know a lot about the show and are trying to get out something good. Star wars was, if anything, TOO similar to the original movies level at first, but then violently chewed away, because the company took the violent backlash and tried to course correct mid trilogy. Which obviously failed badly, because it stopped being a coherent trilogy. Lucas could get away with having a mish mash of movies where he is clearly making it up as he goes along, because he was starting the series and the fans were children, not adults with novels worth of wiki pages on everything. Tolkien could get away with a literal children's book having flaws, and it being a perspective book filled in the gaps. But none if this is in malice. The original things didn't stand for anything in particular other than being a good book, and groups of people got together, wanting to make something new, partly to make money, partly because they enjoyed the thing. Ghost writers and fan fiction writers have a tough job and even Tolkien and lucas couldn't follow up their best works successfully. yes, I think episode 1 is worse than episode 7, even if episode 9 is the absolute worst movie of them all.

[@BKPrice]

This is why realism is so important in fantasy: if you ignore it, you have a character hailing from a race known for their exceeding wisdom, who is older than the sun and moon, acting like a petulant pre-teen in the Second Age as if she's learned nothing in all that time.

[@LukeBobRobinson]

This is the best takedown of the show with actual reference to the lore. Bravo! Please make the series!

[@juliencarson2627]

I think the funniest part of this show isn’t that they bought the wrong rights knowingly it was that the estate wouldn’t sell them anything else and that it was the actual original trilogy they got it was the appendices and the hobbit. They literally can’t mention anything unless it was mentioned in those two things and instead of being smart about it and coming up with a thoughtful interesting original story set in middle earth they fucking wrote the worlds shittiest butchering

[@MrCroky123]

You should devote yourself to do more of these. Such an interesting take ! And it's very well produced. Kudos ! Keep it coming!

[@williamdiffin28]

Sauron says: 'Just because someone looks or sounds different, it doesn't mean they're not a nice person.'

[@n0vitski]

So sad to see a stuck up elf lady barging in and ruining Sauron's white boy summer, completely crushing his vibe, fr fr 😔

[@liamglynch]

I'm so glad i came across this! Thank you! This is a really great breakdown of the show's faults, and deserves more views, especially the point about the three rings. It's a fatal writing mistake. The only, (hopefully constructive!) criticism I can give is there are several moments of confusion and mispronunciation of names like Ar-Pharazon ("Al-Pharazon"), Arondir ("Elendir/Arondil") and Elendil ("Elendir"), Thranduil ("Thranduin"), Lindon ("Lindil"), which undermine the forensic arguments made. Every Rings of Power fan should be made to sit and watch this and be quizzed about it. Otherwise, this really is spot on. Very well done :) Thank you for the video!

[@bijibadness]

this video is pretty good. you're going to win a _whole_ lot of Subscribers on this one. congratulations, man. good stuff! keep it uppppp

[@AnthonyBerkshire]

The RoP Fans argue that PJ also changed lore and thats true but not in the extend like Amazon does. Instead of focusing on the main plot of the books like Numenor, their colonies and transition to evil, Elves, Celeborn and creation of the rings, Sauron deceptions, Dwarfs… BUT they focus on Adar besieging Eregion to fight Sauron with family friendly Orcs.

[@ipercalisse579]

PJ changed the lore like 1.. 2% ? And just to fit the movies

[@lmahu6627]

And the best part is that the entire last part was never in the lore. They just make things up as they go.

[@victoriam2683]

Great video! I thoroughly enjoyed every minute of it and hope you'll make more in this series.

[@Liftinglinguist]

Great stuff; the simple format, arguments, and use of humor without the usual overdose of sarcasm works really well (most channels dealing with this subject rely on it). Subbed!

[@anthonywarren3656]

You absolutely nailed it.

[@thenightowl3433]

RoP can be used as a textbook example of how not to write a story, or adapt one.

[@jamesbee3087]

I hate that posers have co-oped Tolkien for their modern audience.

[@Looneyboy]

I hope you don’t have to reupload this fantastic video

[@ajourneythroughcinema1271]

Nah. There were some editing errors and I thought about it. But I’m leaving it alone! Sent and delivered!

[@BlueTangerine-xx4vk]

What happens when Americans try to adapt a book wrote by an Englishman...

[@GeraltofRivia22]

Rings of Power failing to be a well written, well made show irrespective of the lore butchering is the best case scenario. At least this way no one takes it seriously and it doesn't do any damage to Tolkien's work.

[@Whatchalookinattt]

They had billions of dollars to make a series but had no money to buy the rights to the source of the 2nd age? Like what is this…

[@benmiles00]

Great video. Nicely done. It is a abomination to the legacy of Professor Tolkien. I am stunned they didn't learn from their stupid mistakes in season one and are just steam rolling ahead with two. #RespectForTolkien.

[@yamibakura8597]

I really hope you make another of these, but doing a full dissection of the abomination that dares to call itself 'The Wheel of Time' would be a true feast.

[@colbunkmust]

I know it's a bit off topic to the main thesis of the video, but Tolkien didn't intend on Sauron being Satan, that was Morgoth's/Melkor's role. Sauron was just his lackey that took the reins when Morgoth was cast into the void. Morgoth was Valar, Sauron was only Maiar. Best compared as minor god to demigod or archangel to angel. Sauron like the Balrogs were lesser angels that followed Morgoth when he fell from the light.

[@hafabee]

@hafabee 0 seconds ago Sauron might not be Satan but he's as close to Satan that there is in the 2nd and 3rd ages of Middle Earth; he's a demi-god of incredible evil who has caused much strife in the world through his various mechanizations, corruption and deceit. He corrupted Numenor from the inside and brought about it's destruction. He made the rings and corrupted the nine human kings. He accelerated the fall of man and broke Saruman. For all intents he's Satan for the 2nd and 3rd ages of Middle Earth and during the story of The Lord of the Rings.

[@timothypearson2972]

Just reading all the comments calling out this awful show make me feel so much better. The majority of people still know what's good and what's awful. Just not the writers and the majority of those working on the show.

[@UncensoredScion]

I completely forgot about the cow

[@edwinryan2052]

I feel that the story is all fiction regardless of sticking yo the source material. Having said that, I disagree that this was a bad take of the source material

[@alexneff]

You shouldn't call galadriel a cow

[@Golami224]

@@edwinryan2052 what

[@esquilax5563]

So did the writers

[@Ohnonono123]

​@@edwinryan2052You don't know the source material, you're too illiterate to read it.

[@early-tv]

Great videos, underrated channel!

[@TheSpoovy]

In episode 1 the elf king guy is disbanding his armies and sending them all back to valinor, so sure is he that Sauron is gone forever and violence will never be needed again. Two episodes later he's fretting about "this darkness will cover this land" or something, like all his race will be wiped out, despite the fact that, from his point of view, nothing has changed. The only way he could have known that orcs are roaming about and sauron was still alive was if he was watching the fucking program himself.

[@belliott538]

Even if I were to accept Amazon’s RoP as it’s own Standalone Story and take it at Face Value… The show as a Whole Sucks. With Sixth Grade Writing, Third Rate Acting, Abysmal Wardrobe Design and On & On… The Show on its own Merits is Plain Shite. Liked & Subbed.

[@infocus]

Outstanding work here! Thank you!

[@niefali]

Before this I wondered how Disney SW, one of the biggest, wealthiest and most experiences companies in the world failed to do something basic as planning out a single vision for Star Wars 7-9. And now we see the same from Amazone, multiple times actually with Wheel of Time and RoP and its mind boggeling. No amount of money can save your from incompetence.

[@CinnamonGrrlErin1]

I'll stick with Peter Jackson, Ralph Bakshi, and Rankin-Bass.

[@ajourneythroughcinema1271]

All good choices.

[@CinnamonGrrlErin1]

​@ajourneythroughcinema1271 maybe it's just my personal nitpickery, but I think fantasy was better when it had more of a hippie flavor to it, like "Frodo Lives!" or Bo Hansson's LOTR album. There's no whimsy in modern fantasy.

[@nickbangr]

the BBC radio play for me

[@poeticdork6661]

This was a really amazing video and take. You are really likeable as a host and expert on this stuff! This video is one of my favorite analyses of "The Rings of Power", and I enjoyed that you praised the show when you actually liked it, that you cut the Galadriel's actress slack, but that you were so specific and simply down-to-the-facts. Highly engaging stuff and to your point at the end of the video, I would look out for more.

[@theexplorer1476]

This show was the reason i got into the lore of lord of the rings, because the whole time i was watching it i was like "what the shit is happening" and i only managed to watch 3 episodes, i knew the rest of it from videos like yours.

[@TurinStark5]

They don’t have to make the storyline app. The appendices are very clear on dates and events. The Lotr and the Hobbit have references about the first and second ages. Which is why Beren, Turin etc can be mentioned

[@SamyRajoo]

One of the best overall reviews, critiques n discussions about the ‘series’.. gud job..

[@NickLaslett]

Just read all the comments, think you hit a nerve with your observations. The show really is unbelievably bad.

[@feuersalamander7271]

Very good summary of the inconsistencies, errors and lorechanging of the show. Fun and interesting to watch.

[@likefahrenheit]

Most if not all the characters in this show were dishonest, sarcastic, selfish, or straight up unkind (except this version of Gandalf who is egregiously naive and dumb as a toddler). In short, none of them are endearing. Compared to each member of the fellowship where they were friends having each others backs - the difference is night and day.

[@samm5111]

This is by far the best actual analysis of the writing by leaps and bounds. Minimal antagonism, good explanation of the schism between lore and show, excellent critiques and ideas for rewrites. Banger of a video