The River that's not a River!

Big Thanks to Jen and Bryn. You can find their channels here:
/ jenonthemove and Bryn....
/ bryn2k
Today we are guided by Jen and Brynn as we try and find some of the stunning architecture the Elan Valley Aqueduct has left us. There are as ever a few questions along the way. Join us as we travel from the Elan Valley in Wales back towards Ludlow.
Music: Epidemicsound.com
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/ @pwhitewick
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#Elan #Exploring #aqueduct

[@pwhitewick]

Big Thanks to Jen and Bryn. Here is Jen's Channel: kzbin.info and here is Bryns kzbin.info

[@huwzebediahthomas9193]

Nice people,too. 🙂

[@JenOnTheMove]

Massive thankyou for having us both! It was a great day!

[@My_Op]

I'm curious about you and your channel so I'll subscribe 🙂

[@saraclayton-smithson5083]

Two of my favourite KZbin channels doing a collaboration…. Yay! Love it, thanks

[@gibbo9089]

Just finished watching the dangle way video!

[@JagoHazzard]

That's dam nice.

[@KravKernow]

Boo! Go stand in the corner and think about what you did.

[@KravKernow]

Also, could you do London New Water one day? The thing that runs from St Albans through Angel.

[@AaronOfMpls]

@@KravKernow Oh pipe down 🙂

[@whereinsussex]

Just going with the flow

[@stephenpegum9776]

@@whereinsussex Water you all on about ?!! 😱

[@panisvit7123]

Interested to see this. My great grandfather was the consulting engineer, retained by Birmingham Corporation. He went on to work for Manchester, working on the dams in the Peak District.

[@steveaskey]

Very interesting. You may also wish to take a look at the Thirlmere Aqueduct which brings Lake District water 96 miles to Manchester. There are a couple of spectacular bridges over the Rivers Lune and Ribble on its way.

[@Terry.W]

Great video ...and nice outfit Rebecca..

[@phillunn4691]

Another great video guys! Thank you, !

[@lewismassie]

It's so cool how there's so much of this infrastructure just out there in the countryside almost totally forgotten

[@huwzebediahthomas9193]

Really enjoyed this. We do love you English, maybe... Where's Boris the Stopcock? 🙂🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿💖⭐⭐👍

[@robertwedd1111]

Always wondered what the over ground structures of the elan aqueduct looked like. One bit of history was that in ww2 Barnes Wallis needed to try his theory of blowing up a dam with a bomb and was allowed to test his theory and blew up a dam that had been used to provide water for the steam engines whilst the Elan valley dams were being built. If from the visitors centre you walk up the left hand side of the lower dam you will eventually turn into a small valley and there today you can see the remains of the dam with huge concrete split and smashed by Wallis’s bomb.

[@malcolmwillis8699]

After Gibson's Dams Raid, Churchill was worried that the enemy would attack Elan as a reprisal. Huge numbers of balloons were deployed in the area.

[@arhythmicnick9929]

Great video and a fascinating structure. I don't think though that the city of Birmingham politely asked if they could flood a valley and have some lovely Welsh water, or that the people whose homes were destroyed to build the reservoir had much say in the matter!

[@YDysgwrAraf]

There’s an interesting book “The Elan Valley Clearance” that was published recently. It details what happened to the people of the Valley, and the hitherto unresearched devastating effect on the Welsh language in west Radnorshire.

[@jessjenkins]

Must admit I raised an eyebrow at “they approached the Welsh and said ‘can we have some of this beautiful water’”. I suppose that’s one way of putting it. Alas in reality it involved compulsory purchasing, evicting around 100 people from their homes with compensation only for their landlords and flooding of a school and church, destroying local communities. A similar thing happened in in the North for Liverpool from where the phrase “Cofiwch Dryweryn” emerged. The Welsh were never asked, the water and the ground it fell on were simply taken. Not to take anything away from your video, Paul, just thought it could do with a little more background info. As well as engineering marvels, these reservoirs are also monuments to the dark history and politics of the Welsh people as a whole.

[@huw3851]

That struck me as well. It's funny how tone deaf so many people are about this.

[@Simon_Nonymous]

And see also a lot of water schemes in Cumberland, Westmoreland, Yorkshire and more. Not a process that affected only the Welsh.

[@ChoppingtonOtter]

@@Simon_Nonymous Yep. Keilder dam in Northumberland in my own lifetime was the same with families forced to leave places they had lived for generations. Its not a nationalistic issue of Welsh, English or Scottish. Its about the greater good I'm afraid.

[@seiricerin]

Came here to say the same thing. That line made me so uneasy. While I really enjoy and appreciate the engineering that goes into projects like this, and find this a very interesting video - lovely to see Jen! - it's important to acknowledge the devastating effects they (I am not far from Tryweryn in the north) have had on the Welsh people and language.

[@silmarian]

Very similar things happened in the US, so many water projects were built without regard to the effect on local populations. Indigenous groups were especially devastated.

[@PoppinJay]

Some great engineering here, brilliant video as ever. Please ask Vicki Pipe to be your exploring companion. I know she's a busy lady but I also know KZbin is going to be a much duller place without her.

[@richardharrold9736]

What's happening to her to take her offline?

[@PoppinJay]

Geoff has announced that they're no longer together.

[@bishwatntl]

She no longer makes videos on Geoff Marshall's channels, but she writes for Modern Railways plus her museum and other work.

[@richardharrold9736]

@@PoppinJay just that she's no longer on the channel or they're divorcing?

[@AaronOfMpls]

@@richardharrold9736 It's on Geoff's "Community" tab. Sad news to hear, and well wishes to them both!

[@UKAbandonedMineExplores]

A lot of editing went into this one, as I know myself, that must have taken a while. Beautiful dam, outlets look almost medevil.

[@andyhill242]

I seem to remember that the aqueduct once sprung a massive leak which was only discovered when a farmer's tractor sunk when he drove into one of his fields, can't remember where it was but I think it was quite close to Birmingham.

[@michaelmiller641]

Fascinating!

[@robertcoleman4861]

There's a lot of history there thankyou cheers bob.

[@firesurfer]

I'm still fascinated by the Uks random inclusion of multiple vowels and consonants for no apparent reason in names and places.😇 Don't get me started about Welsh. or Geordie.

[@MrRadioactive159]

Glasgow has a similar system that transports water from Loch Katrine to the city. might be worth a look for potential content if in Scotland

[@patthewoodboy]

Theres "the New river" in Hertfordshire , it runs from near Hertford , to Stoke newington and uses the same principle, but its open and not in a pipe , its gradient is 1 in 1000 (off the top of my head)

[@henrybest4057]

It continues, sometimes in a pipe, to New River Head in Rosebery Avenue, Islington.

[@patthewoodboy]

@@henrybest4057 yep it does go into a pipe and Islington is its arrival

[@eggy77]

Nice to see the Clay Cross Company getting a mention, a bit of a surprise.

[@PA3456]

Always great to see you guys, sorry Paul but love Rebeca but great couple. 🙌🏻

[@bobsrailrelics]

The whole thing is an engineering marvel. The syphons are genius and the aquaduct in aquaducts are fantastic. The drone shots are supurb. Great video all 👍

[@Lichfeldian--Suttonian]

The Elan Valley Dams! I have been. They serve Birmingham and the environs: my childhood home! I didn't know about the aqueducts! Very impressive. Many thanks again.

[@downwardlymobile4957]

The river that's not a river - bit like the Thames at Thameshead.

[@andrewastill5567]

Please go to the other end of the pipeline at Frankley Birmingham as the scenery is spectacular and my old stomping ground. Plenty of archive pics of Frankley reservoir being built, some disused stations not too far from there as well.

[@ReubenAshwell]

Brilliant video and nice to see Jen and Bryn in this as well. :)

[@lastofthebrownies]

There must be some sort of KZbin community… seen Jen on Geoff Marshall, Lorna Jane and possibly G Loves Trains… even remember putting a comment on one of them suggesting she meet up with the Andover Legends that are you two, and so it happens…!!

[@R.-.]

Last time I visited the Elan valley I met the Lotus Elan owner's club driving in the other direction.

[@royjennison3916]

Rebecca looks hot in this one .

[@Sim0nTrains]

Totally agree with what you said yourself Paul and Jen.... Don't trust Wikipedia.... even know I do use it lol Really looking forward to watching this one and it didn't disappoint, love the banter in it and that is also a impressive damn they built as well. Awesome video and I also watch Jen's channel as well and can agree it worth subscribing to as well.

[@ValeriePallaoro]

It looks like 1) 10:05 always have a Jen with you and 2) 10:30 always have an ironically chuckling Rebecca with you, is the order of the day. Let these two women get a channel together and the whole internet will explode! Good luck with that, Paul. Note though, Wiki is a community based paedia. Get yourself a handle and update the pages you feel need correcting. It's a community thing. Love this one ever so much. "That's not a River ... This is a River!" hugs from Australia!!

[@robertward7449]

How about a video on the New River in Herts and N London, also not a river, originally gravity fed, 400 years old and still doing its job! (OK, with some modern pumps to help these days)

[@bostonrailfan2427]

Oxbow…as in the small crescent shaped lakes left behind as a river changes its routing due to silting and flooding issues? i wonder if the water pressure and current was enough to overcome gravity and help get the water higher than it would have been if it was a simple gravity aqueduct… and Jen earned a subscriber, i can’t help but respect her for bluntness and being a fellow coffee drinker 🤣

[@timofthomas]

Oxbow - yep many roads in Wales used to be twisty with some straights along which you could overtake the slow trucks and tractors of the day. Then someone in their wisdom decided to straighten them to up the average speed of all traffic on the road, and newer trucks and tractors that were a bit faster came along... so now the 'straighter roads' are long curves around which you cannot see to overtake safely, and you are stuck behind the (slightly) faster farm and haulage traffic for 20 miles instead of a few bends .....the oxbow roads are the old tight bends left behind, often as laybys, when the main road was re-routed.

[@bostonrailfan2427]

@@timofthomas i honestly thought it was because of a river but that makes sense on multiple levels, good to be right and wrong

[@TheGamingCucumber]

Yes it's possible that there was enough pressure or velocity of the water to push the water up to that height. It's part of Bernoulli's equation as heads if you are interested.

[@TheXeneco]

If you ever come up to North Yorkshire, see if you can find evidence of the Nidd Aqueduct. Similar, It’s mostly subterranean, but does emerge at a few points. Fully gravity powered from Scar House Reservoir to Bradford

[@kevinbrown4892]

Love the aerial shots. Nice to see things in their landscape and from a point of view we normally can't. Keep up your fascinating work.

[@carolinegray1711]

i have subscibed again now on my lap top

[@briankillner1818]

As I have been a resident of Birmingham for 40 of my almost 70 years I have been intrigued by where our water comes from. Your video explains a lot. Thank you. I was told that a few villages were destroyed as a result of the building of the dam. Can anyone supply more info on that?

[@davie941]

hello paul and rebecca , great interesting video , thank you for all the work you both put into these, well done and thank you guys

[@MrGreatplum]

I’m not normally one to be interested in water pipes, but this was a good one! Also excellent to see Jen visiting another channel (she pops up everywhere 😀)

[@stephenpegum9776]

Another fascinating video - cheers Paul & Rebecca. My only slight disappointment was there were no instances of Paul mangling the Welsh language !! 😎😱

[@pwhitewick]

Haha.... I've learnt my lessons

[@stephenpegum9776]

@@pwhitewick Well done butty bach !! 😎👍

[@colinlawford3137]

There is a park in Birmingham, Cannon Hill Park, that has a model of the route should you wish to see it. Visited it a few years ago now but it does come up on Google.

[@valabado7427]

It's a scale model landscape of the Elan Valley Reservoirs, Sculpted concrete, still there, gets renovated every thirty years or so, a small price to pay for borrowed rain.

[@briankillner1818]

As I have been a resident of Birmingham for 40 of my almost 70 years I have been intrigug

[@tokk3]

Hey Paul & Rebecca, somehow youtube decided your channel was perfect for me to start watching. And so I did. What a journey so far... Congratulations offering us better content than television in the past decade. Can I ask what you camera/mic setup is? I got a couple interesting areas nearby that could use some attention like you are doing.

[@huwzebediahthomas9193]

This is Marcher Norman Lords country - don't mention the wars, I did once but I think I got away with it - give back our stollen laaaahnd, etc.. 😎😁🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿

[@suzyqualcast6269]

Frrrrrrrom Butt's Quarry/Ashover, down the Amber Valley, t'Cross, anen on on on

[@huwzebediahthomas9193]

If you want to Google an interesting place for sale look up Ro-fawr farm, in The Tywi Valley, Carmarthenshire. Only a million quid, if you fancy being cut off by floods a couple of times a year - bring a boat. Built on a land island on the valley floor. Even has a flipping swimming pool, indoor, and the bluddy river is only twenty yards away?!?!?!? Oxbow lake nearby, one of the Tywi's ancient dead stop old meanders. Magical place. Great vibes from the geology there, ley lines like.

[@Nastyswimmer]

Not siphons, strictly - a siphon carries water above the level of the source by using the water descending the far side to suck water up the near side.

[@pwhitewick]

Yup, that's the thing that confused us the most on the day

[@whereinsussex]

An "inverted" syphon, basically the ultimate "pull" of the water falling beyond the dip sucks it up the other side of the valley

[@keithstudly6071]

Yes a siphon uses vacuum to draw the water through the pipe, like a straw. The water running to a lower height at the exit maintains the low pressure and keeps the siphon running. The only place I know of that uses a siphon in a water pipeline is a segment of the Los Angeles Aqueduct. Built in about 1912 they started the siphon by closing the inlet side of the pipeline and using a vacuum pump to evacuate the pipe till it was near collapse. They then opened the inlet valve and the vacuum sucked the water over the summit and started the flow.. A good trick if you can pull it off.

[@robinjones6999]

Absolutely marvellous film, and you have hooked up wth Jen which makes for a super historic, informative vid

[@randyrucker4346]

I'm a big fan but the operations of this aqueduct have me totally confused. Please do a follow-up to explain the physics shown.

[@tibsie]

Welsh people are still, to this day, very sore about this engineering project. It's an impressive feat of engineering but it came at a massive human cost.

[@Sarge084]

I could tell you quite a lot about the aqueduct where it passes through Worcestershire, but not in a post, too long and would need photographs and maps.

[@keithharris9556]

just watched this and have to say there are two pipes exposed crossing the river Rea down the road from Cleobury Mortimer at the top of a friends garden

[@HenrysAdventures]

Another very interesting video! Good to see Jen there to!

[@pwhitewick]

Many thanks!

[@Llanigraham53]

And at the start you were walking along an old railway line! And not very far from me!

[@Jimyjames73]

Very good - Lovely scenery - always look forward to your vids!!! 🙂🚂🚂🚂

[@adrianbaker5916]

3:30 - Notice the shadow of a big bird flying over?

[@andyhill242]

I share a terrible secret with Jen, I used to live in Birmingham too 😱

[@rogermorris6957]

Hi Paul thank you to you Rebecca, Jen and Bryn for a fascinating Vlog of the Eland Valley and the pipe line to Birmingham. Manchester as 4 pipes coming down from Thirlmere which is gravity feed the funny part was that when my dad visited the value stations they had to take the owe water it you next one cheers

[@simontay4851]

they had to take the owe water it you next one? huh? WTH does that mean.

[@AdamsWorlds]

That old bridge looks stunning. Lovely looking area might have to go have an explore.

[@Hairnicks]

As usual an utter joy to be with you on your adventures, loved his location and it's on the visit list!

[@korma9732]

Was there only last week

[@lesliehart]

Where was the damage caused by the bomb?

[@andyhill242]

Thanks!

[@RJSRdg]

A temporary railway was built to help in the construction of the Elan Valley dams. At one point the Vale of Rheidol proposed to take over the trackbed to extend their railway to Rhayader but nothing ever came of it.

[@simontay4851]

i wish they had done. im sure people would use it now.

[@simontay4851]

How far would they need to extend it.

[@andrewf9041]

9:16, where has this listed? "Cadoo?" Many thanks for your weekly vids!

[@JimGraham123]

'Cadw' is the historic environment service of the Welsh Government .

[@rdownmakeITbetter]

CADW - the welsh version of National Trust.

[@LeslieGilpinRailways]

@@rdownmakeITbetter Welsh English Heritage!

[@andrewf9041]

Ooo my bad, sorry if I ofended anyone, CADW, I'll check it out. Thanks all.

[@oneteaminbristolbcfc]

Any one want to address the elephant in the room? That viaduct isn’t a viaduct😂

[@pwhitewick]

Biiiig question

[@huwzebediahthomas9193]

I used to live in the Caterham Valley, in Surrey, in a place called, surprise surprise, Caterham. It has a river, trouble is, it's hundred yards underneath, in the chalk bed, underground going through it. They pump water out if it, in Kenley up the road from it, drinking water, and for bogs.

[@eyesofisabelofficial]

Coventry gets it's water supply from the River Severn at Strensham. It is pumped up Breedon Hill then gravity fed to covered reservoirs above Meriden. The process is repeated till it reaches Coventry where it is distributed around various pump houses such as Mount Nod, Coundon, and Whitley. Meanwhile here is a video about three Dams of the Elan Valley called "Dam Dam Dam (2014) kzbin.info/www/bejne/fIm8iayZhdR2bbM

[@huwzebediahthomas9193]

Elan Valley, been there many times, amazing engineering. Llyn Brianne too, water for Swansea. Up the Usk reservoir, good too. Good ones road over the hills from Sheffield to Stoke area, cascades of reservoirs. Llanelli too with it's Upper and Lower Lleidi reservoirs nearby. Llyn Llech Owain too, but that is a natural limestone lake, has a spring coming out of the geological limestone outcrop there.

[@TalesOfWar]

Jan and her bloody coffee! haha!

[@carolinegray1711]

good video

[@PA3456]

Jen must say very pretty ❤️

[@bostonrailfan2427]

she reminds me of the ladies of my family, same sarcastic and fun personality as them 🤣

[@Chris_Carini]

Amazing. I am always impressed by Roman aqua engineering ... the Victorians etc. obviously built upon that example. Great vlog, entertaining and informing.

[@lapiswake6583]

Awesome video again. I've been following Jen on twitter for ages, but only subscribed to her youtube about 2 months ago, don't know why it took me so long.

[@williamgrisenthwaite6557]

And of course, don't forget Lake Vyrnwy built by Liverpool Corporation from 1881.

[@shirleylynch7529]

Another fascinating journey. Lovely walk , weather and colours. Great explore and findings. Thank you.

[@jeremyedwards9301]

Very interesting video. My family has connections with water supplies in Birmingham (not the Corporation system but for industry). As you say, the Corporation needed to act quickly as with growing industry and population, the natural water supplies were inadequate. My Great Uncle and Father were involved, through a company called C. Isler and Co, in boring and servicing water supplies for the major industries in the city. The local water is 'hard' and good for brewing; the 'corporation water' from the Elan Valley was extremely 'soft'. There was more than enough local water for industry with local breweries like Ansells in the Aston area having 5 wells; companies like ICI/IMI and Courtaulds had several wells as did many other industrial sites. With the closure of the heavy industry, the wells were capped and the water table rose. My father was involved in a committee that was seeking to solve the issue that this has brought about. In the Aston and Witton areas, and around Spaghetti Junction, the water table is back to pre-industrial revolution levels and parts of the area now suffer from flooding in heavy rain as the local water courses cannot cope. Originally the 'corporation water' was extremely soft until the droughts in 1975 and 1976, when Severn Trent started adding water from the Severn at Stourport which has added a few salts that harden the water slightly. I live in Sutton Coldfield, which was a separate town until the 1974 local government re-organisation, our water is local well water supplied by the South Srtaffordshier Waterworks Company and is extremely 'hard'.

[@chasbodaniels1744]

Another wonderful exploration, thanks! I coincidentally had lunch today with a hydraulic engineer, who described for me the water system serving our medium-sized U.S. metro region. It too, pipes water from some distance over and under varied terrain, into a reservoir constructed in the 1930’s. He said the basin was home to a hundred or more Black folks, who were “induced” to leave their houses to make way for the inundation.

[@nigelh3253]

Great detective work guys! Also very high standard of production in the video which made this a really good watch.

[@grimpeursdusud1533]

excellent video I've visited the valley several times and knew about the Birmingham connection but never actually followed up how the water got to the city! presumably there is the same amount of water coming into the reservoirs as originally went down the river Elan, I wonder how much the river flow is affected by the project? I first went there on a wet day in March the whole face of the bottom dam was covered in white water cascading down! The project in the Mourne mountains in NI is also well worth a visit, as well as the huge wall they built to keep animals away from the water

[@DeneF]

My favourite one yet. Great physical efforts on our behalf. Many thanks.

[@JB-ek4yx]

The Elan valley is beautiful, I used to drive my delivery van up it 5 days a week, back before we had satellite tracking for my boss to spy on what route I was taking. It's not exactly the most direct route from Llandrindod to Aberystwyth! I used to spend half the time scanning the sky for red kites.

[@thewhiteroom23]

You can see the exposed pipes crossing the River Teme about a mile SSE of Leintwardine next to Graham's Cottage. There is also an outwash spout thing into the river along Downton Gorge between Graham's Cottage and Bringewood although the latter is on private land. There maybe pictures on geograph though.

[@kevinmoseley5803]

Ah! you missed showing us the remains of the dam that Barns Wallis blew up to test his idea of the bouncing bomb. not a mile from where you started the vid.

[@juliansadler6263]

Well welcome back not your usual Sunday thing. I wish I could travel around as you do . I used to be with Wellex Trains Wales and Borders and then Central Trains. All National Express and all gone now.

[@malcolmsmith6615]

Wow, a great feat of engineering by any standard! Unlike a railway or canal (which could tackle hills and rise above the elevations at each end), this clearly had to be very accurately surveyed and constructed to ensure it didn’t rise above the starting elevation. Not easy! And to drop only 50m over 73 miles means the average gradient (1in 2300) is so slight that I’m surprised the water wanted to move at all, especially taking into consideration that piped fluids experience friction losses! But, it obviously does work, against all the odds. I recon the building you saw was not a pump house but either an access point and/or the location of an isolating valve (big stop cock). Absolutely excellent and an interesting distraction from canals and railways (though I will always remain a tunnel lover of course).

[@andyhill242]

I am already subscribed to and a member of Jen's channel. I shall do similarly with Bryn's shortly!

[@RobertSmith-zv1xo]

It's a massive subject, really interresting and thus not enough time to cover it all. Don't worry I won't make you do the rest! 😉

[@sr6424]

Near to Ludlow it here are another two aqueducts in Mortimer Forest. The brickwork is incredible. Then towards Birmingham the pipeline appears many times. The ones I know are in the Wyre Forest and near Romsley near Bartley Green Reservoir where it ends. If you ever want to visit the latter you can visit the remains of Dowery Dell Viaduct on the former Longbridge Halesowen railway line.

[@lilchris26]

Yes we have a similar pipeline in Manchester from the Lake district has somebody pointed out. Amazing engineering these type of places. Thanks for the video enjoyable to watch.

[@adrianbaker5916]

So this is the video about the Birmingham Water Supply. Mentioned in one of your earlier videos about River Severn crossings.

[@manmeetsinghmahajan6183]

Amazing work 👏

[@richardkempton2172]

Excellent and informative, you have to show the aqueduct over the River Seven

[@simonbradshaw3708]

Thank you for another interesting video, something a little different for a change. There is something a little similar in the Pennines as AdvertureMe went and visited a tunnel that carries water.

[@Alan_Watkin]

another slightly off centre vid from you guys, but i like that, i never know quite what im gunna get, i also like the comedy these days, not to daft but ya make me smile, chuckle.... an thats great, many thanks for your efforts, ya doin good

[@royjacques5650]

Hi Rebecca is it still in use today i can remember learning about this in school very interesting history, roy

[@fritz46]

Coincidentally I bought the book "The Elan Valley Railway" about two weeks ago, so I immediately knew what you were talking about.

[@stinker1000000]

Great video. There is a point where the aquaduct crosses the severn valley railway. Its a good excuse for a trip on the SVR.👍

[@pwhitewick]

Oddly that's what inspired the video, just ran out of time to get there

[@robinwatling6538]

fantastic took the kids to the dam twenty years ago, happy days! thanks thourally enjoyed that one