The ROVER ALVIS GTS "GLADYS" - The Lost Masterpiece

[@tomdrives]

Just a note I forgot to add, the prototype is a P6 ‘2000S’ with the standard 2 litre unit found in its donor car. The Alvis GTS was rumoured to use the same technology as the BS.

[@declanbrady5172]

When I was a kid doing my paper round Gateacre Liverpool, one of the houses had a beautiful mint condition Alvis that he had restored lovingly over a many years. It was his pride and joy. My paper round used to take 40 minutes, but after talking to the owner and literally drooling over the car, it was taking almost 2 hours. The owner was delighted that a young lad preferred his classic to Ferraris and Lamborghinis! The car was full concourse and looked like it had just rolled off the production line. It had polished chrome everywhere, even in the engine bay. It was done tastefully and beautifully like on a Rolls-Royce but better. Even today 37 years later I still think of it as the most beautiful car in the world.

[@tomdrives]

It sounds like it made an impression

[@declanbrady5172]

@@tomdrives Definitely. I still think about it all these years later. 2nd favourite car is the SD1

[@jmfitzpatrick1731]

Thanks Tom for another of your engaging presentations. We should remember that while Alvis ceased producing civilian vehicles, it had a successful military vehicle business, which evolved into becoming a division of BAE Systems - yet another example of a BLMC constituent having ongoing and sustained success.

[@thatcheapguy525]

thanks Tom for another great insight into some more "if onlys" and "what could have beens". Gladys is a fine looking car and along with the P6 showed the clear directional change of Rover-Alvis from making cars for the working gentry into sports saloons. it always saddens me how the once world dominant British automotive industry collapsed in such a relatively short period. so often the workers strikes and management incompetence are seen as the cause yet throughout the industry there was an inherent complacency, lack of foresight and lack of urgency akind to dry-rot.

[@numberstation]

Great video. As soon as I saw Gladys I thought of the Opel Rekord C Coupé, a very beautiful car.

[@stephenkelly2823]

Where the hell do u get ur Info??. I pride myself on my car knowledge and yet I've never heard of the Alvis/Rover. Bravo Sir. Looking forward to your new series. I'm a sucker for British car history.

[@simonhodgetts6530]

I know the Alvis restoration and new car build specialist in Kenilworth - they make stunning cars. I worked on a care home new build next door, and would often see a beautiful Alvis coupe go out for a test drive.

[@tomdrives]

Still there?

[@simonhodgetts6530]

@@tomdrivestheir website is still up, and it appears they are still making Alvis cars

[@Wil-nh5kz]

​​@@tomdrivesYes. He is describing Red Triangle's site in Common Lane, Kenilworth.

[@tlongie6055]

I was going to comment about the show room being in Kenilworth. My hometown 😊

[@simonhodgetts6530]

@@tomdrivesyou need to film a visit! I’m sure the engineers there all still smoke pipes!

[@paulelverstone8677]

TBF you could put that Rover V8 into anything and it would be a performer. The Alvis models re-imagined would be a beautiful thing to see on the road...

[@Schlipperschlopper]

Biggest mistake they never replaced the unreliable Jaguar V12 with an enlarged Rover V8!

[@GSimpsonOAM]

@@Schlipperschlopper Indeed. There was the P76 engine available in the early 70's

[@Schlipperschlopper]

@@GSimpsonOAM They should have installed the P76 engine in all Jags and Triumph Stags. The V12 Jag engine is a big pain in your a... it eats valves and drops valve seats when driven hard.

[@GSimpsonOAM]

@@Schlipperschlopper There is a local Stag that has a P76 engine fitted. Works well and a good fit.

[@Lobo-ih3bh]

They fitted a rover V8 to a landcrab in Australia as a testbed. Mental.

[@jonathanj8303]

This is honestly the first I've heard of Gladys being mid-engined? My understanding was always that it was front engine, rear wheel drive, based around a heavily modified P6 base unit. And the rear of the car has none of the air intakes and vents you'd expect if it was mid engined. That way 'Gladys' could be the luxury GT for touring/cruising, fast but tuned for ride comfort, and the mid-engined P6BS/P9 (however it was badged) would be an out'n'out sports car, and they wouldn't canibalise each other's sales. If you can get a look under the bonnet of the real thing, obviously that would be proof one way or the other. Allegedly, Gladys started out life as a P6 2000S, fitted with the TC engine, and still had that when it was in David Bache's ownership.

[@tomdrives]

It was proposed to be mid engined the prototype im not sure about but it does make sense that it could be front engined

[@jonathanj8303]

@@tomdrives Why would they build a front engined prototype for a mid engined project? They'd learn nothing useful, and even the basic proportions of the car would have to be completely different. Both Gladys and the P6BS were prototyped in 1966, it seems much more logical that they were different, parallel projects - P6BS was the Rover engineering department testing the waters to see what kind of sports car was possible with the V8 (and which might later have been badged Alvis if it had survived), and Gladys was the styling/marketing department's take on "what can we do next with Alvis, given the tools we've got?).

[@pashakdescilly7517]

I had always assumed that Gladys was a coupe body on a P6 base, never heard of the mid-engine layout being associated with it. When this channel did a video on lost Rover prototypes, I looked for information on Gladys and found nothing.

[@tomdrives]

@@jonathanj8303I agree with you there Jonathan, looked into it a lot myself but could never find a definite answer to whether or not it was proposed to be. It’s an odd one I cannot find anything else about Gladys, the four very knowledgeable people I asked said it was proposed to be mid engined originally but they decided to go with a platform share in the end.

[@tomdrives]

@@pashakdescilly7517 I found nothing either, I had to trawl through article after article and do the usual “phone a friend” got some information but not enough to say anything concrete, it’s sad really it’s such an amazing car. Even if in any case the four people I spoke to and (one post I read) were wrong on a car with little to no information published online, this video and its comments section might serve as a collective dumping ground for information if that makes sense.

[@Jamessshortlife]

Great work mate, keep it up

[@tomdrives]

Thanks Stewart glad you enjoyed and will do

[@danieleregoli812]

Fab video ❤. I love the GTS, however I think it was based on the regular P6 running gear.

[@tomdrives]

Correct, the prototype was based on a 2000

[@danieleregoli812]

@@tomdrives The GTS and the Graber Coupe P6 are things of pure beauty.

[@StephenAllcroft]

@@danieleregoli812 There was also a Zagato coupe.

[@danieleregoli812]

@@StephenAllcroft True, but not my favourite... Too squared off for me

[@gerry5134]

Some movie clips from 'The man who haunted himself ' I didn't know that Rover had acquired Alvis.. That was new to me ! Well I never ! 😮

[@BanjoLuke1]

I'd never heard of the GTS. What a bizarre unicorn of a car. Fascinating, but almost certain not to have thrived on the market place.

[@paulshubsachs4460]

I agree!....a scaled-down TD/TF might have had a better prospect.

[@vincentl.9469]

@@paulshubsachs4460 Gladys...what an iconic name for a car !

[@bgarston]

Great video, thank you. I am too young to have even known about Alvis. What great looking cars. Does anyone else think there is an air of Mercedes in the designs of some of their cars?

[@rongyt1136]

Gladys the prototype was NOT named by Dave Bache it was named after Gordon Bashford’s wife Gladys. I knew them as Uncle Gordon and Auntie Gladys as my father Joe Brown worked as number two to Gordon for many years. Gordon and Gladys had no children of their own and my brother and I were a sort of substitute. I am now 75 but I remember all the details very well, especially the P6BS which I examined in detail with my father pulling bits apart at the Gaydon motor museum. That was on the 25th anniversary celebration of the Range Rover.

[@tomdrives]

I didn’t know that and what I read says different but that sounds more plausible with your experience as well. Can I use this information in my pinned comment?

[@douglasthompson296]

Tom, the Alvis Gladys in a direct head on shot bears a strong likeness to the Ford Taurus 2.0m 2ltr (year early 80's?) Oblong headlights with headlights grill and radiator grill coming to a slight upsweep on the flanks. Sacrilege I mentioned a Ford 😎 Also the Rover P4(?) with the Cyclops eye looked good as that turbine prototype. Cheers DougT

[@GLxGL]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, or the man with the seeing eye dog in the case of Gladys. Under tyred, awkward hip line, horrendous front end styling. She’s definitely not a looker, but engineering wise it’s interesting.

[@kevinmoffatt]

Agreed, very clumsy. The Alvis TE was a beauty though.

[@gryfandjane]

Fascinating history, although always with the realization that a number of historic marques would die off before it was all over. As an MG owner in the US, my interest has lain mostly with MG, but it’s sad to see how deeply the Leyland debacle affected other brands as well. There was no happy ending. 😢

[@ianstewartorr8455]

Very interesting thanks I liked Rodger Moore as James Bond greetings from Scotland 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧

[@tomdrives]

Thanks, a lost movie not shown anymore sadly.

[@johnbrereton5229]

Me too, I don't think Roger Moore made any bad films, a great actor.

[@ianstewartorr8455]

@@johnbrereton5229 yes

[@scotttait2197]

Scotland wrong flag ya diddy 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

[@alancobbin]

Thanks Tom 👍😉💪

[@lesliesmith9155]

T s r 2 all over again I was there heart in my mouth I made do with a 68 2000 p6 nice car (but) time please gentle men rest in peace Britain 😢😢😢😢😢😢❤

[@tomanderson6335]

First I've ever heard of the Alvis GTS. Quite a looker and some really clever packaging; room for four humans (which can't be said for most 2+2s) and, presumably, two decent-sized boots.

[@bentullett6068]

Never knew about this car. Its such a beautiful looking car. Very similar design to some of the fast back coupe muscle cars in the USA.

[@chrisperyagh]

2:32 - That P7 with hydropneumatic suspension is something I've always imagined (to really make it a British DS) but never actually seen until now!

[@jmfitzpatrick1731]

The design of P6 was inspired by Citroen DS: the skeletal structure with non-load bearing external sheet metal was the same. Also, earlier P6 design proposals incorporated a similar “aerodynamic” frontal design.

[@StephenAllcroft]

@@jmfitzpatrick1731 T4 (as shown here) has the remnants of that original style.

[@peterstudley1804]

One of my favourite films the , man that haunted himself, 1970 with Roger Moore, and a gorgeous lamboughini iselero ,as well as 2 rover p5bs a 69 and 70 .

[@paulbennell3313]

I reckon the P6BS would've been a world-beater given the chance. P9 looked even better. Now we'll never know.

[@StephenAllcroft]

Who would have bought a three-seat mid engined car? Matra-Simca Bagheera didn't set the world alight, neither did the Martra-Talbot Bagheera. On the other hand lets look at early seventies mid engined V8s. Ferrari GTC4? Mondial? Neither favourites of the tifosi. Merak?

[@alanblanes2876]

What amazing reporting!!!

[@darrensmith6999]

Another great video. Thank You (:

[@tomdrives]

Thanks Darren, glad you enjoyed it

[@adriandeb2710]

Great video Tom

[@tomdrives]

Thanks Adrian

[@michaeljohnson1006]

I think it was at Gaydon the P6 gas turbine one.

[@nigelcharlton-wright1747]

Love the inserts from the classic '70's film "The Man Who Haunted Himself" staring Roger Moore before he ruined James Bond. Great upload.

[@tomdrives]

Thanks Nigel, it’s a good film, sadly not shown anymore.

[@adamweston4152]

It's a good movie, I remember the first time I watched it..I was a 15yr old kid and I watched it with my parents we had a Chinese takeaway, one of those moments you always remember.

[@simonhodgetts6530]

Oh I wouldn’t say he ruined James Bond (typed whilst using a Roger Moore voice)

[@simonhodgetts6530]

Oh I wouldn’t say he ruined James Bond (typed whilst using a Roger Moore voice)

[@ivanfernyhough3851]

Ruined james bond,yeah rite lol,he was the best bond ever fullstop.

[@Schlipperschlopper]

Why did they not replace the Jaguar XJ Platform with a more reliable Rover V8 platform?

[@ivanfernyhough3851]

Because the xj was much better.allways has bin.i like rover but theyre no match for jaguar,especially the xj6 or 12

[@gafrers]

Love the looks of the P6 BS

[@tomdrives]

I do as well, has a charm to it.

[@dieselfan7406]

I don't, I think it's hideous! To me the bodywork seems to follow strange lines, almost as if they've had a look round for older parts to recycle, stuck them on the car and hoped for the best. I had a V8 Rover in London in the 70s - you were never late! Went like the clappers but OH! the fuel consumption....

[@paulie-Gualtieri.]

I politely disgrace this car looks more like a badly put-together kit car. My dad had an Alvis Three Litre TF21 that was a beautiful looking car, I genuinely can't warm to this design.

[@tomdrives]

The issue is with this car, it has nothing on any of the original Alvis models.

[@jamesprince4991]

Completely agree, it's the usual Bache 'too much fuss and tubby proportions' mess.

[@alsped8695]

What happened to the prototype 5-cylinder engine you mentioned?

[@settertwo]

Gaydon Museum exhibit ?

[@jamiefly]

I once owned the 893 rd MK1 Range-Rover off the production line, reversed it quite hard into a concrete lamppost so it was sold at a fair price to nice guy who was intending to do a full nut n bold restoration.... He understood it to have some significance to the Rover history but wouldn't tell me what.. loved it but took the money and drove off in a Fiesta 950 van. .. 😅

[@DavidSmith-gx5mu]

I know it's not typical but can you do a video on the cx-75 plz?

[@terryjacob8169]

Looks a real styling lash-up. Did they buy a Ford Taunus 17M grille from a German Ford dealer ?

[@Nick-Emery]

I have to know where you got that BL jacket from in the back ground? I need one!!!

[@tomdrives]

I travelled far and wide Nick, it’s an original from the ST catalogue. Found it online and no questions asked payed what they were asking which was quite reasonable. I believe there is someone who does replicas of the other jacket style they have so I’ll drop you a link as a reply if I find it

[@Nick-Emery]

@@tomdrives ahh that’s mega. Good for you for managing to get hold of it ☺️

[@StephenAllcroft]

Alvis did not close in 1967. they just stopped making cars. The Scorpion and Scimitar light tank family were a massive success.

[@adampowell5376]

I think it is a pity that Rover never developed a 5 cylinder engine because 5 cylinder engines were very successful for Audi and Mercedes.

[@tomdrives]

I think the issue was the lack of maturity in fuel injection as a technology.

[@StephenAllcroft]

@@tomdrives In the books I've read about experimental Rovers, the attempts to carburate P7 were abortive.

[@timjohnson67]

I'd never heard of Gladys and I think I know about and love cars! So thank you so much for this video, I am now a subscriber. One point however, and this is not a personal criticism, but your voiceover needs working on to make it easier and more relaxed to listen to. You need to sound as though you are actually speaking to us in conversation rather than bullet points and headlines. Thanks again and best wishes from Ellan Vannin/the Isle of Man.

[@The-Rectifier]

The P6S mid engine proto, looks similar to a certain.... Matra 530..... 😊

[@richardball3585]

The Alvis GTS looks like it would do better with the traditional layout with the (V8) engine in the front. The rear haunches could be a better shape and there would be no problem with engine cooling

[@TrevorBuick]

Everybody asks what went wrong with BL/Rover etc.. but what went absolutely right was the 3.5v8 👍

[@davidpeters6536]

I'd love to know who people blame for the demise of the UK car industry: Was it the Unions, the bad management or the politicians? Up to the failure of the Comet the plane industry were way ahead in the 50s, so is there a car equivalent, like the backward step of the Marina for instance, that spelled the end?

[@tomdrives]

You can’t mentioned the Comet here, it’s too much of a missed opportunity but to be honest with you it isn’t compatible. The Comet failed thanks to its early string of failures (square windows) and Boeings lobbying/power over governments of the world. But the Comet contributed something of incomparable value to aviation, the concept of metal fatigue and as a result safety.

[@kevinmoffatt]

@@tomdrives Yeah, and we gave Boeing all the data accumulated during the investigation following the disasters so that they could avoid repetition.

[@gc7820]

The trouble is Alvis styling was already looking dated - although handsome the Gladys looked like a car designed in the 50s for the 60s not a car designed in the 60s going forward into the 70s. The mid engine rover P6 however looked modern.

[@chrishenniker5944]

Dated? It looks like a contemporary Chevy Nova or Opel Kadett to me. Actually, I quite like Gladys for that reason.

[@19892CV]

P6BS is lovely

[@RalphRalefeta]

MG has come back,will it be so with Rover?Datsun is also back why can't Rover

[@tomdrives]

Rover clashes directly with Land Rover

[@RalphRalefeta]

@@tomdrives I'm not a fan of SUV's,but now I have a full collection of Rover 75,V8,2LITER DIESEL,1.8 turbo petrol and V6 MGZT

[@FinPurcell1]

You stated two choices where you clearly meant two options!

[@paulillingworth1242]

I often think, if bloody Leyland kept their hopeless mitts off Rover I think Rover would be a big leading contender today and probably fending off VW of which VW today reminds me of a modern day BL but marginally better then BL were.

[@scotttait2197]

Love the side and front styling hate the front end , just doesn't do it for me

[@eurouc]

It looks really awkward. Certainly the mid-engine had significant impact on the proportions, however the rear end looks way too long and poopie. Not a winner.

[@gogogeedus]

I think they would have done a lot better if they saved their R and D money and just made a coupe version of the P6B.

[@1258-Eckhart]

Why does Gladys sit on such spindly wheels? It looks like a modern car on a 1930's chassis.

[@jerrybailey5797]

The Alvis GTS is a pretty looking fast back, what a shame British Leyland screwed over another company. If only Rover and Triumph stayed independent aswell instead of getting swollowed up by the leyland monster. Things could quite different for tge British motor industry now

[@a11csc]

i think it was too little too late Tom

[@tomdrives]

I think so for Alvis sadly, it’s a shame.

[@nicksmpsn6546]

I watch a lot of your videos, and enjoy them. However, a wee bit of feedback. Slow down and stop being so shouty. Keep up the good work.

[@Bicyclehub]

The back of the Rover looks like a Dodge Charger. The 1960s one that is.

[@garypoulton7311]

To be honest, I dont think was much of a looker. The Triumph Lynx on the other hand...

[@connclissmann6514]

What if...

[@robertharris7027]

The Alvis gran tourer coupés and convertibles were stunning cars. But calling the GTS "the lost masterpiece" ... no. There is no perspective from which this fat cat looks beautiful. Very good indeed that it was never produced.

[@andrewwmacfadyen6958]

That is one ugly car. Little known fact Mike Parkes Ferrari F1 driver and engineer and one of the creators of the Hillman Imp was son of the Alvis managing director

[@paulqueripel3493]

That front end looks a bit (a lot) like something that would have come from one of the communist block manufacturers.

[@19892CV]

The Alvis looks disproportionate, a bit like an uglier Bond Equipe

[@ronaldderooij1774]

Beautiful cars? Well, I respectfully disagree.

[@tomdrives]

I respectfully disagree with you respectfully disagreeing ;)

[@rafthejaf8789]

I can't really be described as a good looking car. It looks awkward and nerdy like it was designed by a committee, one made up from two different companies. oh wait a minute....

[@bruzagroves3651]

A beautiful coupe? Ugliest thing I've seen.

[@ThirtyYearstoolate]

You repeat yourself, much to often.

[@tomdrives]

I think sadly, that lone comment might be an individual experience. Unless you are referring to scene setting and storytelling, if that’s the case I’d probably check out TikTok that’s a bit more what you’re after.

[@bollinvalleyrailway]

This is just so wrong, your P6 history is wrong, your p7 history is wrong and you have missed key information that if you read a book you could make a much more factually correct video.

[@tomdrives]

Can you explain more?

[@19892CV]

Do you have to be so rude?

[@tomdrives]

@@19892CV 13 days later and no evidence provided by him still.

[@bollinvalleyrailway]

@@tomdrives yes, please read up on all of this from James Taylors books on the P6. The t 4 was an off shoot from the pr department and was the 10th base unit made, the p7 was a 6 cylinder development and later a mule for other developments. Gladys in the motor museum, is a 200s that was rebuilt with the styling from David bashe, nothing to do with the V8 as the 2000s was the prototype from the twin carb P6, the 2000tc. That's only too simple but please talk to James Taylor and the two P6 clubs as we need the right knowledge out there and it's really interesting. Fair play on the production but people in the past have just made a complete mess of it.

[@bollinvalleyrailway]

@@19892CV I'm not being rude, I have pointed out what happened wrong and suggested a solution. That's constructive criticism.