The Sad Reality About Learning Code On Your Own | Rant | Chris Sean Talks

[@chaseintech]

Can't believe that article. Let me just leave this quote here: "I am a great believer in luck, and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it." - Thomas Jefferson

[@williampan29]

"Just because a quote is said by someone famous doesn't make it true" -Bill Clinton

[@chaseintech]

@@williampan29 Totally agree, but that doesn't really apply to the quote I shared. In other words, he's actually making fun of the concept of "luck" by saying it just takes hard work to get "lucky" in the view of others. Unless you think the idea of someone working hard (like Chris does and potentially you) is false, but that wouldn't make much sense.

[@williampan29]

@chaseintech if hard work is more important, then explain why is there "rentier economy"? en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rentier_capitalism

[@azuth20]

@@williampan29 "Rentier economy" doesn't mean lack of hard work, just because you're not doing physical labor, those two concepts aren't mutually exclusive. Yes, people make money from capital gains for example, that doesn't mean they got lucky and picked the correct asset to invest in. A lot of time and energy and research is done to get to that point. If it was easy everyone one with a little bit of money would be in the market right now making money.

[@neverstop6088]

@@williampan29 You're right bro, you will never do anything significant or successful with your life because you're not lucky, give up.. But for anybody else reading this. Become a hard worker and determinated consistency is key and never stop chasing your goals I wish you luck :)

[@jerzeywolf76]

So feeling this video! Thanks Chris! I have been trying to learn code off and on for the past 10 years. Now I am determined at 47 years of age and going to coding boot camp.

[@mazlanhalim9141]

Same age and similar situation as me, all the best bro :D

[@gabrielfono844]

I wanna be honest It is not easy When I first watched your videos in 2019 , I taught I will be lucky enough to get a job in six months when teaching myself but it didn’t happen. It took me two years to get a job as self taught.I studied a lot . I applied for jobs each day. I consistently call company and told them I wanted to be hired but no one give me opportunity. I stopped everything for weeks but then get back to it because I didn’t want to give up everything I have sacrificed. I woke up one morning , applied at Booz Allen hamilton , go to the interview process and got hired as full stack engineer. I have been working for 6 months now. This journey is not easy even for people with a Cs degree . You gotta keep push it Thanks Chris Sean for your motivation on KZbin.

[@techmentormaria]

If you're watching this as a new dev: don't give up! I've been an engineer for more than 13 years now and I am self taught as well. It's SO WORTH I T if you stick to it.

[@DanA-st2ed]

let me take a guess that you have a degree in a different field?

[@techmentormaria]

@@DanA-st2ed I studied Computer Science.

[@DanA-st2ed]

@@techmentormaria I only asked because you said you were self taught.

[@stormcaster6322]

@@techmentormaria so did you study compci or are you self taught? You're contradicting yourself

[@techmentormaria]

@@stormcaster6322 both. I learned coding via teaching myself at 13 but then went to University at 19 to study CompSci.

[@jovanchavira2530]

Felt this. I became a truck driver after 2 years with learning code. I realized myself I wasn’t consistent and fully disciplined .. i was looking at the dollar signs to be able to provide for my wife and kids… now as a truck driver I’m finding more time to get back to training myself with code, and loving the ability to learn to create things that can help me. I’ll eventually apply again, but for now I’m loving to learn and getting myself disciplined with the technical stuff. I hope she gets in somewhere that can provide her a financial uplift and she gets the spark to get back to tech

[@JordanShackelford]

It's 10% luck, 20% skill, 15% concentrated power of will, 5% pleasure, 50% pain, and 100% reason to remember the name

[@chrisseantalks]

I LOVE THIS SONG lol - fort minor

[@Ty-uy6bf]

You made numerous videos telling us this is gonna be a industry hard to get into, told us the obstacles we’re gonna face, even in your early videos we saw the pressure get to you but you kept GOING!! People don’t realize how much bullsh*t you overcame, from Homelessness being in debt, but one thing who made you was the HUNGER, for a better life.

[@chrisseantalks]

Ty I seriously love you. This comment seriously made my day and these last few days have definitely been rough. Thank you < 3

[@timelord1253]

Chris, I have been watching you since your first (few days) on KZbin. It has taken me a lot longer than many to get a job, but I never gave up. I keep listening to your videos, being inspired, I still have a screenshot of a few messages you sent me many years ago when you were at your old job. I did get my job (after a lot of stop and go) and it wasn't until I decided to finally take that leap. So thank you for being there in many ways (some you might not even realize). Keep up these amazing inspirational videos Chris, thank you.

[@danielordonez1643]

How long did it take you to land a job once you started applying?

[@Rainlynn42590]

I am starting my second year of learning coding on my own and man it is so hard. I don't think I have ever studied this much, going back and forth between two different coding camps and trying to absorb as much info as I can from friends and co-workers. I have a pretty good grasp on HTML and CSS, I got like 6 certs, but still I have to keep learning and keep updating what I know to make pace with the changes in libraries and languages. But I love it, and I knew in Jan 2022 that if I couldn't make it a month studying then it wasn't going to work. It truly isn't for everyone, it is extremely hard, and you absolutely need to have dedication and consistency to make it.

[@brentwitten3237]

Luck=when hard work and opportunity come together. Not sure who said it, but I've found it to be true in life. Let people know what you're doing and be able to do it.

[@trentdavis1768]

I think it was MJ DeMarco, but i'm not sure..

[@HumbleStature]

I’m dyslexic too and really do love coding. It’s really inspiring to me that you can still do it to spite that because I believe I will be able to do it too!

[@DuneNobleman]

Chris, there are so many devs out there on youtube now talking the talk but you walk the walk. Have so much more respect for you after listening. You really come thru genuine and I can really appreciate it.

[@Ty-uy6bf]

Hey brother, Im a electrician been around people in the tech industry. People my age (23) love to complain and make excuses for themselves, which is the reason I like to watch you content. You don’t make excuses you keep your work flow consistent well teaching the youth how to get into the industry. There gonna be cry baby pointing fingers. A lot of people who are serious about career their will move and sleep in a car a for couple of months. People really want to be in this industry some just want it to be easy with handouts 🤷🏽‍♂️🤷🏽‍♂️

[@donsolokhalifa6828]

Luck is when preparedness meets opportunity. The advice I have is just do your part of being prepared then wait for your opportunity. Don't give up. You'll make it💙.

[@hristopavlov298]

Luck doesn't always have to be that

[@timothylee6143]

Bro... I freakin agree 1000000% with everything you said. I wouldn't be a developer today without the grind I did. I know I may not be as smart as others so I had to put in 13-15 hours a day of studying to get a job that others might say that was "lucky". No, it was definitely the hard work and preparation I did to land my first job.

[@BobbyBundlez]

13-15 hours sounds so brutally not worth it for any job. That’s just ridiculous man….

[@anontar6316]

You had no job then...9 hours for job ... 13-15 hours to learn... that means 24 hous of work... yeah i don't think so

[@TheSoulCrisis]

@@anontar6316 Yeah only way that is possible is not working at all, they do that at bootcamps.

[@segovia1495]

Chris, I share your same thoughts. I joined a bootcamp beginning of this year it was a part time course and during the course I become friends with a guy that was a QA team lead at the company I am currently a jr full stack software dev at for the past 6 months. I got hired on as an intern. During the internship I had to relearn everything I was taught, the tools being used was different the code was different. I asked a lot of questions I befriended a lot of the devs that ultimately decided to hire me on knowing full well I was new. What they did see was the effort I was putting in to learn the effort I was putting in to get to know them genuinely. My journey was not easy and I’m still learning on the job everyday. I have fun with what I’m learning, there are days I spend hours on how to write a method to do what I need to do then I ask myself how much better I can make that. Although I do feel lucky I also realized I manifested my own luck with the effort I have put into me achieving where I am now. I started my bootcamp in February finish in May and started my internship in June and got hired on full time in August. I was taught react, ruby, JavaScript postgresQL and now I use VueJs, JavaScript, Golang, some php, tailwind. Although I had a quick road to becoming a dev I never measured my skills to anyone else. For those struggling out there, it’s possible. Put yourself out there learn how to fail because that is when you grow the most. And when you finally make it, you’ll be farther ahead than you think.

[@210Gal]

Thank you! You’re right. I’m at where I’m at in life because I never quit on myself and made employers love. Yes some luck but more work than anything to get ahead. Much love to you

[@chrisseantalks]

< 3

[@CHAS-fw4qm]

I watched a lot of your videos before I started my front end coding journey. I had it engraved in my mind that there would be days where I want to give up. There would be days where I think I’m not good enough and honestly its only been 3 months and that thought has came across my mind at-least 2-3 times and that my friend is when I think of you and everyone else in this comment section. I’ve learned to give myself grace on this new journey. The amount of doors that will open if I just don’t quit is what keeps me going. You’re literally going to feel every emotion on this journey but just don’t quit. My hope is that this reaches someone in time. Enjoy the process, challenge yourself, be well & keep going🚀

[@ayokotimilehin8140]

Hello chris, am Chris by name from Nigeria and I love hearing u talks and motivation on dev. I have been leaning font end dev for about six month and I have been facing a lot of challenges and one thing that always keeps me going is saying to my self that if Chris sean can do it I can do it even maybe better regardless d time it takes me. I have seen lot of videos on youtube talking about learning how to code in 3 month i don't know how true that is. I started to learn code just for me to understand code like my native language and that has been helping me a lot to use little coding experience to crate great project I don't even imaging I will ever be able to build with my little time of learning how to code. Thanks Chris for ur supports.

[@camUK77]

Hey man, I just wanted to let you know that you inspire me greatly to develop my skills in coding. I’m currently learning HTML & CSS. Then I’m going to move on to JavaScript & React Framework. I’m self-teaching, so it’s harder to know where to start, but you’re helping me a lot, along with other engineer’s. If you can give me any further advice I would appreciate it more than you could fathom, thanks man.

[@boratsagdiyev522]

I can relate to her, everyday I feel like quitting but I can't afford to. I'm in 7-8 months learning front end and I still can't remember most of what I've learned. I wish her the best tho, not everyone gets to be a winner in life. It's survival of the fittest.

[@sixstanger00]

Yeah, I have to disagree with Chris on this. The woman in the article is *_correct._* While Chris may not think "luck" and "location" played a role, the both certainly did. For one, I can't believe he has the audacity to claim luck doesn't play a role when he has no degree, attended a boot camp, and almost immediately landed a job at *_Entrepreneur Magazine._* That is beyond atypical; most aspiring devs bust their asses learning to code hoping to land a spot at a major corporation like that, but never do. We're living in the digital age and the web dev market is viciously competitive...which brings me to location. Employers want to hire someone they think will be a good fit for the position with minimal headache. You know what's a major headache? Having to relocate someone across the country or work around them having a 2 hr commute everyday. Chris has always lived on the west coast, and tech jobs have never been scarce there. But where I live - the south-central US - large swathes of rural countryside stand between larger cities that are at a minimum, 150-200 miles apart. No company in Memphis, TN is going to hire someone living in a rural Alabama town when they could just hire someone living in MEMPHIS. I've lived my whole life in the rural southern US, and my hobby of mountain biking has taken me across four different states down here. One thing I've learned: there are no "rich people" in rural towns. You only see beautiful, $500k homes in the few major cities that dot the landscape down here --- because all of the wealth and opportunity has been concentrated into those areas. Do you have to work hard to be a coder? Absolutely. You have to study hard, too. I did all that. I put in applications daily. I went to college. I spent over six months on Codecademy. I've had two responses so far -- one from Albuquerque, NM, and the other from Mobile, AL. Both decided not to move forward with me after they found out I'd have to relocate. LOCATION MATTERS.

[@TheSoulCrisis]

She can win in other areas of life though, coding isn't for everyone and this rough, fiercely competitive job market isn't for everyone either. Location and timing matter a lot.......especially with most companies not going remote anymore, they are giving people a harder time over location now.

[@nyhustler208]

Taught myself how to code from Oct 2016 until I got my job in Nov 2017... I quit my job in Jan 2017 and told myself I'm going to focus on getting into tech no matter the cost. Now I'm a full stack developer with .net/c# as my specialty since Nov 2017. What I did was, I applied all over the US ( I was super open to living anywhere just to get my 1st job). I lived in GA at the time and that's where most of my family lives and I got my first job in Arkansas... Because of this sacrifice, I can get a job anywhere and I am now a Tech lead for my current company. Just because I sacrificed time and my willingness to move anywhere just to get that 1st job.

[@izamalcadosa2951]

To be honest, in some countries, being self-taught in anything without a degree or experience, you will not get a job! I have friends that live in Canada and in Western Europe, and getting a Dev, Software Engineering or Network Engineer job over there is very hard because they value the degree and or the experience, and they look down on people that are "self-taught" as being a wanna be Dev, Software Engineer or Network Engineer, because you don't have the formal training and experience they want from a candidate! In the U.S., it's also very hard to get a job in any tech area being self-taught because there's no track record or formal schooling to back up what you learned on your own! For instance, I worked at Google as a Software Engineer! You will not get a job there being self-taught! You need a degree, preferably in Computer Science from a big time university, with a big time Computer Science program, because you will be competing with top-notch talent to get into any of the FAANGS. I have never met a self-taught Software Engineer at Apple, Inc., Samsung Electronics and Google. My last Software Engineering job was at Nvidia and only met one guy there that was self-taught and he was considered a mediocre Engineer at best.

[@joaquin67]

It's tough, for sure. I went through computer engineering in school (also had a depressive episode much like yours and OP) and had a couple of semi-dev jobs after graduating in December 2017 but it was not as helpful as I thought it would be in obtaining a full-fledged software developer job. It wasn't until 2021 (after pandemic related hurdles) that it's a whole other game to network/market/prepare yourself to land an actual software developer job. Applied to 200 jobs in 2021, landed many interviews but landed no jobs, and realized it's best to not go at it in a "shotgun" approach. Learned a lot in interviewing though. Currently a web designer and working on building a couple of frontend projects before going at it again since that's what interests me the most

[@nebnoida5376]

I learned on my own, i believe i can make almost everything i see on other apps/games except for the art parts and AIs in terms of quality. I never asked for jobs, i just put out my apps and make a living.

[@kentechies8846]

I am from Calgary, Alberta, Canada. So she from Canada too? it not much different than the US. She is 30 something years old, she can move to Vancouver, Toronto, Calgary, and other smaller tech cities. If she really want to make it work she have to believe she can do it and keep learning in tech. For her depression, it because she compared herself to other. "Comparison is a theif of joy". Never compare to anyone, everyone live differently. Chris, you are a hard working person and never gave up and so you created your own lucks. Everybody want to be somebody but they don't realized......they can't be another chris sean, mark z, bill gates, etc. Even for myself at 40 yo, i am just learning HTML, CSS and soon JS, it so hard tbh, and yes i want to land a job ASAP too. even if it just a starting 30k/year. I would do it for the experiences. It may take me 5 jobs and 10 years too to get to 180k but it ok. it the journey to get there. Anyway, Chris, you can't help and please everyone but I am glad you are wanting to reach out to your viewer and do your best to help. Just remember this, talking to us.....babying us will not help us grow either, we are competing with so many *laid off* dev too! and yes softskill.....it a personality trait. Not everyone can learn it over the weekend, it take years to build and seconds to destroy it.

[@izamalcadosa2951]

It be best to go to school and learn software engineering that way! It's way, way, way harder to learn on your own doing anything!! As for me, I learned from a mentor and at school over 2 years!! I originally started out with a degree in Finance and Paralegal Studies! You do forget everything or almost everything you learn in tech after a year, if you haven't used it! It sucks! I've been in tech for 8 years, started out as a Hardware Engineer, then a Network Engineer, and now a Software Engineer over the past 2 years! It's definitely not easy to learn anything in tech, if you have never done it before, and if you have stopped using a tech for more than a year, you will forget how to use it, as I said early!

[@MichaelEmbers]

I’m going in three years game dev and programming and I’m just starting to run, don’t give up!

[@remix2die4]

Coding is not easy. I started self-learning in 2015 but it took me like 5 years to get that ah-ah moment. I still have a long way to go. I am focusing on Angular. Those companies ask a lot even for junior developers but I never gave up, even after being fired. I seem to have a knack for CSS, the languauge everyone hates, somehow I solve a lot a CSS problems. I think it's my specialty but I need to add Angular to make myself employable. Don't give up and keep it up !

[@osmanbajraktarevic833]

How long did it take to land first job

[@alexpanta7342]

@@osmanbajraktarevic833 if you wonder about the time means you are not willing to put in the work. It can be 2 months or 2 years. Don’t think about « when » but « how » am going to be enough

[@JungKimrecruiter]

Chris, you're spot on with soft skills which come in the form of but is not limited to the following: -Communication -Self-Motivation -Leadership -Responsibility/Conscientiousness -Teamwork -Problem-Solving -Decisiveness -Ability to Work Under Pressure

[@janine8413]

thank you for being very honest in all your videos. I am a emergency dept nurse enrolled in a coding bootcamp at the moment. The amount of brain power required for coding is nothing like I have experienced before and to be honest i find it more difficult than nursing (maybe because i don't have a background in coding and it is all fresh to me). You are absolutely right about having consistency and discipline. It is a struggle however i will not give up. Been watching your videos and they inspire me not to give up. Thank you!

[@KohenChia]

Don't give up. Tech is also a broad field even if we're just talking about programming. Find something you truly, absolutely like, and work at it. Imagine the joy of building something and showing it to your friends. That will certainly propel you. It's true that luck is required, but the best thing about tech being so accessible (vs. something like finance) is that you MAKE your own luck. Keep nurturing the love, the curiosity, the passion, and jobs will come.

[@dontgetsalt2045]

Just wanted to say thank you Chris that that grit you speak of can be applied to anything in life. Been watching your videos since 2019. I was one of the biggest stoners imaginable. I got in to BSN program in 2020 applied that same grit you did to get into code and I nearly have straight A’s at a top BSN program in my state. I have to put in 3x the amount of time then other students but your videos from that past really helped set an example of great work ethic. Keep inspiring bro.

[@doug2bitemore]

Luck requires that you make yourself available to opportunity. If you don’t put yourself out there then luck won’t have a chance to find you.

[@DM-pg4iv]

I too was lucky. I got a job a month after my bootcamp. I was learning to code by myself for a little over a year before the bootcamp. Luck has a lot to do with it but drive and consistency is key too.

[@NinTheLost]

Which bootcamp? And do you think free bootcamps are worth it?

[@ArtofBen]

Starting my first programming job (c++ programmer) tomorrow. I have been learning for almost two years. Every single day... I think I might have missed 2days. I for sure was very lucky as this was the first job I applied to. I guess its being ready to take advantage of the opportunity when it presents itself. I am eager to see what the industry is actually like and I am stoked to learn more and more. I just really hope I will be able to keep up with the demands and perform well. I guess I am in a really privileged position as I was atleast given a chance to get into the industry. (There was a crazy amount of technical interviews) .

[@damaroro]

dude, I am self taught programmer and a switch career warrior, I learn code in udemy ( colt steele course) , freecodecamp, codecademy, coursera for about 1 YEARS, I learn that shit while I'm working full time monday to friday ( as a staff admin ), after 1 year I had 2 big portofolio ( blog from scratch, full stack airbnb clone ) and then I apply for backend dev job ( more than 50 jobs I apply ), and thanks god there are 1 company who accept me to work as backend dev, lesson learned is there are no such thing like a plain luck, luck is when preparation ( work hard and pray hard , honestly I PRAY A LOT) meet opportunity, but there is one thing you need to make sure before you dive to programming world, and that is Logical thinking, I may not succeed to switch career if I doesn't have that logical thinking

[@LimaFoxtrot_98]

It's all about the full package. Do you have a CS degree? Are you personable? Is your resume/portfolio squared away? Are you sending out enough resumes? Do you have work experience in tech (even help desk)? Are you grinding data structures?

[@techmentormaria]

Often it's about what you did with your knowledge -- you can have 5 fancy degrees or have done amazing bootcamps, that doesn't mean you're a good engineer. You still need to learn from others who have been in the industry for a long time and have made their mistakes and build your own side projects to make it happen.

[@kotokarrera]

It feels like a joke haha. She said that location matters haha. I'm living in Cuba. I can't even have Mastercard, Visa, Paypal, and so on... Even though I've landed jobs with salaries similar to Southeastern Europe without a degree being only 20 years old. It's not perfect but it is more than enough for me to make a living and make some savings for my future plans. If I were living in Canada, dear God, I'll be making much more money. Nonetheless, I don't think I'm special or something, I just dared to learn English after my 18s and a valuable skill like coding. It takes time and I'm not yet as good as I want to be, but it's a journey not a walk in the park.

[@andrewanderson7912]

While Tech skills are important, the ability to network and connect with people is almost as important, in some cases moreso. Tech skills can be learned such as long as there's a base in skill. Perseverance is very important and realizing you may need to take steps in getting where you want to be. Your journey is yours alone. Don't ever give up regardless of the next man/woman is able to do. Keep the content coming Chris! Edit: I hate it for that person who is hurting with depression. If possible get the support and encouragement needed. Bless up

[@ademoladavid8102]

The only luck I would say you had was the market wasn't as competitive back then, Right now it's almost impossible for an absolute beginner to land a job in 3 Months because the bar is so high even for Juniors as everyone and there pets are learning coding nowadays.

[@flicky2461]

second paragraph gave it away. It's like telling people that they will fail because I failed and gave up not knowing that failure is part of the process.

[@PerfectSense77]

She is right about luck and location playing a big part. If she wasn't willing or able to relocate then that'd make things a lot harder. If you're trying to crack into an industry being willing to relocate opens up your opportunities x1000 rather than just relying on the limited options in your city.

[@isaack7457]

Took 9 month boot camp and got a job 1 month before graduation. My first job started at 70k. I think the biggest edge I had was my likability not so my technical ability as a junior dev … got my second job 6 months after increased my pay substantially.. don’t compare yourself to others and focus on yourself is the advice I would give.

[@marieortiz4892]

You worked hard Chris and correct don't compare. I stumble in studying but, it's up to me God willing I will Be my Best and encourage others to Believe in themselves. God is with you Chris keep going ✌️

[@motleyassortment5512]

She needs to keep practicing and keep applying until she finds the right company who will give her a chance. Maybe it's not right company for you to join or right time to get the job you are seeking. Timing is everything. Applying to a job in a different state, not just the state you currently reside in, relocate if you have to. I heard , some people apply to 200 or more jobs before they get a tech software job. The key is to never give up on your dream eventhough you get no response from the majority of the companies you apply to. Eventually one company will come along and offer you the job, stay positive. Positive attitude attracts opportunities. No negative, downer thinking or attitude drives away any job opportunities that might come your way.

[@J2LProductions]

Dude, it took me 3 years to land my first job as a self taught back end engineer!

[@chums307]

Hey I'm actually taking this path myself. Learning python and leaning towards back end work. Any suggestions as far as projects for that kind of work?

[@knockedgoose4206]

It makes me sad that so many people agree with that post. It's littered with insecure messages and the premise of it is really bad advice. If she stuck with it, its likely she would have found a job.

[@shaybailey45]

I can understand how this person feels. It's happen to me, I gave up once, but while yes I can't compare my self to you or others it does give me hope. It's all about me, how I do how I talk, how I work with others, how well I am told to change what I worked hard on. It might have some to do with my current manager, because he does want to see me move on from being a phone monkey wasting my abilities. Don't let your self forget you're still an inspiration because every video I have seen from you has been motivational, because you are honest about it. You are straight that it's hard, it's not easy and it takes work. Most of all, I can 👏not 👏give 👏up. It's also good to know I am not the only one sneaking in doing coding while at work, LOL. Props doing 10+ of learning code while working a full time job taking phone calls, and also living pay check to pay check. Massive debt. For anyone watching this who wants to take the same path. Do not give up, dont think you cant. You can do anything you put your mind and heart towards

[@vulpixelful]

I get what OP was saying. I came in as a self-taught developer but I also happened to live in a city where a company had a paid apprenticeship. She was doing projects, but it does take someone giving you a chance to break in, and you can only control that so much. I agree that consistency matters, but it's tough to keep the momentum up without external validation. And Canada is probably less open to self-taught developers than the US. I'm on a panel of interviewers at my current company and we pass on _competent_ devs if there's a lack of consensus of on a "strong yes" for them. So the rejection is not personal! It also doesn't have to be the end.

[@molahi5779]

What are the biggest reasons there isn't a "strong yes" from the panel members?

[@AnnorCode]

Everything about this video is fire! You already know how much you’ve impacted my life man. Love you fam. ❤

[@matth4784]

How can it be luck? They think companies just reach out to us and say hey wanna be a software engineer with no prior knowledge? I’m a self taught too. Took me 3 years to claw my way in but I’m in

[@Ortiane]

Realistically to pay bills (like rent, internet, utilities, phone, food) where for 1 person or a family, if you can't get a position in even 1 year or even half a year then you shouldn't start that endeavor. Especially if you're expecting to start a career. These luxuries only exist for people (like the "junior developer" that made it in 4+ years) who don't have to manage being an adult. The truth is, not only is it very difficult to get a start in software without a degree, it's incredibly difficult to get one with a degree... You have to grind out hours on algorithms, force out "projects", and go through weeks to months of interviews for tens if not hundreds of companies all while trying to prove you're better than all the other candidates on their list. Then after getting in, you'll learn what burnout is and why the turnover rate at all the tech companies are so high.

[@KiiddKash]

salute bro! just found out about your content recently and been binge watching 😂 content is great a truly inspiring. i live in Canada myself and also been on this coding journey on and off since 2018 and i will say if you live in a big city like i do there is opportunity. yea on indeed they will say a degree is required 90% of time but apply any ways because if you have the skills they are looking for they will hire you. i feel they just say required as a protocol thing but i personally know i few self taught developers who are doing well but like you said definitely not easy. even myself have contemplated quitting but something keeps bringing me back and videos like yours truly give me perspective and i appreciate that! i know this is the long game and it’s definitely worth it

[@lazdxzlove]

Thank for all the awesome inspire video, can’t agree more with you with 10 percent luck and 90 percent freaking hard work and I also went to depression for learn new skill and code and self doubt a lot . U inspired me to never give up and pursuing something great in my next chapter in my life , I’m still in this journey with the everyone and just let everyone know you are not alone .

[@codenbyte9207]

Wow thank you for dissecting this with so much compassion.

[@marvhan888]

hey there, to the writer of this article, you have my sympathy. I deeply feel for you. I hope you can re-consider about giving up Coding. You have invested so much of your time. A little bit more before you touch the finish line and cliche as it is - you are set for life. Just like those soldiers stuck in Omaha beach, the only way to move is forward, no other choice.

[@aisonjackmendoza7709]

I really needed this boost. thank you so much.

[@spoonreev8246]

One thing I can definitely affirm about Software Engineering is that you have to be adept in Mathematics for the long run. I have seen many people trying this profession and fall off on the way as things get tough. Software Engineering is an ongoing learning and thinking process, and mathematics helps you to have the right mindset and spot patterns in many problems one encounters on the job.

[@awwtergirl7040]

Thing is some people are very very slow learners and slow in everything else. I am VERY slow at learning. I have been studying Programming, Networking, Hardware for DECADES but I'm not a professional at any these things. Just a hobbyist. To become a professional you need to really focus yourself and I never have. I'm a girl of all trades and can do a lot of things but not at professional levels. For some people it might never be career but a pass time like it is for me. There's also the factor of Depression. This is a big one. It's a honest to goodness disability for many and makes it impossible to be employed. If YOU don't believe in yourself it's impossible to convince an employer to believe in you. I have zero confidence in myself while others are full of it. I've watched as confident (but not all the bright) men talk their way into better positions and fake it till they make it. It's amazing to see just how far someone can go on hot air and guile.

[@reeeygun]

super inspiring boss! I will definitely support you. almost wanting you to be my leader haha

[@MrCmp2390]

I graduated with a degree in IT, concentrated in networking. I just want people to know there is so much more to “tech” than being a software engineer.

[@eduardolongoria3744]

I gave up after 4 months but for health reasons lol. My high cholesterol and adhd didn’t let me sit down and focus. But now I’m back at it after losing some weight and taking some meds. We have the same bd btw lol- nov 26

[@chrisseantalks]

YOU GO TTHIS! Happy belated bday :)

[@kentechies8846]

You can always get one of those stand up desk with a push of a button.

[@TelusJadetester]

One thing people don't understand is that they emphasize a particular trait too much and assume that's a sole reason for the causation. It's too bad that not much research has been put in on determining what makes people get hired and what doesn't but I also feel if that was made public the data would be incredibly messy and random to point out big reasons why. One thing that I find that holds true is just simply trying something different as the saying goes: "Insanity is trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different result". I know many people who transitioned careers even at a late stage of their life and having to do that made a world of difference.

[@liquidsnake6879]

I don't believe they didn't get any offers for years, they either never looked properly and expected it to just land on their lap or they rejected offers that they felt were beneath them, a lot of the motivation for most people is money, they expect massive salaries and when someone shows up offering you something similar to what you might make waiting tables people refuse. My first few jobs barely paid above jobs that don't require any special training. I stuck with it because i enjoyed the work i was doing and that provided it's own value for me, in time it paid off but i was happy either way. I think this is good actually to weed out the people who are coming into it just because they think it's an easy way to make a lot of money, because it's not, that's all false propaganda from recruiters and others desperately trying to increase the amount of leads they have for jobs. Most jobs you won't be paid more than you might in construction or other such jobs, don't enter tech if your goal is big bucks cause you're highly unlikely to get them. All that said i think that recruiter propaganda also set up false expectations in people that this sector is constantly hiring people for tons of money, it's not really true, most of it is start ups that hire and lay-off people by the hundreds it's very volatile. And as of late i'm noticing a LOT of new people entering the market, more i feel, than the industry really needs and so wages are slowly stagnating as supply of coders equals and starts to surpass the demand, this will also make it harder for people to get in now compared to how it was a few years ago. Another major difference is the economy is on it's a** now, this directly impacts the availability of venture capital which most tech start-ups relied upon to operate at all, less venture capital means less risky startups, which means a lot less entry-level jobs available as everyone rushes to get a job in the big corporations The more new coders, the lower the wages companies can offer to new joiners and the more demanding they can get in terms of formal education, it's somewhat of a natural response to the massive influx of people coming from all kinds of bootcamps and "women in coding" style initiatives over the last few years Also a lot of these aforementioned bootcamps and initiatives have direct links to big companies that automatically grant entry-level spots that would otherwise be on the market to graduates of said bootcamps , this wasn't as much of a factor a few years ago as it is nowadays

[@CarlosPerez-kv8vp]

Don't give up! I'm also a self-taught dev, and it took me about 8 months. It was A LOT of hard work, but in the end, the stars aligned, and I got my first role as a full-stack dev. If anyone wants to add some open-source experience, I recommend looking at Hack for LA.

[@ronaldsuarez6389]

How do you recommend someone get started ?

[@blahgurl]

I relate to this person writing this post more than anyone in this comment section will ever know. Luck is a bigger part than most of you will like to admit. Giving up sometimes is the best thing for some people's mental health. Where is the compassion for this lady? The post she wrote, in my opinion, was very brave. Self-taught development community can be so toxic sometimes. It's okay to choose your mental health over a potential career.

[@ArisAris-fs1ip]

Man... I studied for 1 year full stack Javascript and now I go to 2nd round interviews for Mid-Senior roles. You have to love it, otherwise even if you study for 10 years you will remain bad at it.

[@ryanquinn1257]

Luck is where skill meets opportunity. Without opportunity you won’t make it, but also you can make your own opportunities. Then once that opportunity happens OR is made/earned then you need the skill to get through.

[@TruckerDudeBrent]

I'm currently a trucker trying to learn to code every free moment I get my laptop is out and I'm practicing. I want so badly to get a job without a degree, I work 12-16 hrs per day and only get a 10 hr break. Very discouraging to see the requirements for tech jobs rn

[@howardbonds5106]

First of all there are other jobs in IT that just developer. In fact its the hardest way to make money. Not sure why that isnt discussed. Its almost sad listening to all the hard luck stories...

[@techmentormaria]

It's not the hardest way to make money if you enjoy coding!

[@pullrequest1481]

Idk who said this "be the person you want to see in this world!!!" Chris should've said that. Love you man... 🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻

[@adrianbornea]

Respect 🤝🏻 First KZbinr who says the truth, that coding is hard. But it also gives you a lot of satisfaction if you stick with it.

[@techmentormaria]

Coding is freaking difficult (see my most recent video)

[@minnainglin8679]

Back in 2020 I was trying to learn coding because I wanted to become app developer. I bought a band new Mac book pro that cost $2500. I quit before I even started learning. I watch a few KZbin video and I already quit. I make so much excuse on why I couldn’t learn coding. Because I have work that day or this and that whatever the reason may be. I was only motivated for a while. At the end of the day there nobody to blame but myself. I just turn 27 this December. I already feel like I’m too old to learn anything. 😢

[@NinTheLost]

Hell no wtf? You have so much time man, 27 is still mad young. You can get yourself going in a few years and you’ll thank yourself later when you see the checks coming in..

[@passportbro904]

I've been learning for 7 months and giving up is NOT AN OPTION, im gonna start projects any time now, proper ones, and get a job by the 12 month mark. Mark my words. P.s. I pay a tutor who im now friends with and his a senior developer, I have 2 hour a day lessons with him.

[@kemlsg4826]

you know what's shocking about everything you said? it doesn't only apply to coding but to everything (other careers and life in general).

[@Drakkarius]

I get what she is feeling, trying to accomplish something while working hard and not getting results is hard. Honestly i quit watching your videos because I felt you were way too positive, but came back because your recent videos you talk more about the cons and bad stuff of being in tech, self taught etc.. To me that seems more real. I also think that youtube influencers have been fking up people minds with expectations, not saying you, but there are others youtubers that give false expectations just to get more views. Hope she gets better.

[@chrisseantalks]

It is sad to be honest. I noticed that about myself so I decided to rebrand myself and focus more on the realities of working in tech while still talking about the best parts about working in it.

[@m8rix99]

I lost my job as QA automation tester back in August of this year 😢. I’m attending the bootcamp for backend engineering which started in late October. Looking for a QA job and study at the same time is very difficult. I’m building my knowledge of backend really slowly and the bootcamp only ends in March. I can relate to this video since every rejection or a ghosting by a recruiter brings my confidence down 😮

[@tonydataiga]

To be honest, she kind of has a point. Not that it's impossible to get into tech, but that there are so many youtube videos and bootcamp ads making it seem like you can get a job in tech in just a few months and that does skew a lot of people's expectations.

[@darelbvcr687]

I got my 1st job as a feontend react dev a year ago after 10 months of hustle, self taught no CS degree no bootcamp. Its doable but i was learning my ass pff for 10 hours a day. Now year later i am backend developer, completely new field, i am still learning....

[@liam1902]

I think that's the thing though. People want an easy way to get a job so they think just going to a Bootcamp is going to get them a job. It was that way some years back when every company was borrowing money for free and then hiring like crazy to keep up with a lot of customers using their services/product due to COVID, lockdown, WFH, etc. Just like how you did, they need to grind and make connections to get a good job cause it's not going to get handed to them whether they have a college degree, bootcamp cert, no degree/certs, or whatever. Not every person is going to get a job. Some will get it, some will take a long time to finally get one, some will never get one, some others will quit along the journey, etc.

[@RPT155]

Im currently in a boot camp. Tbh I don’t think I’m going to be able to get the certificate since I kind of joined very impulsively without any previous experience but I refuse to give up. Even if I don’t get certified I’m still going to keep doing it.

[@Fullrusher]

I'm not gonna lie , I can relate to this lady, I was gearing up to quit last night after hearing about this new crt tech that can code for the user by being spoken to , and the fact that I've been trying to learn to code on and off for a year with no results , but hearing this also let me know how I got here, why I'm having this problem... The work , I haven't don't the work , I have no plan or constant direction and I'm in tutorial purgatory... I've done many jobs before and even a business so I don't mind failing but I've always wanted to get into teach and I ran my mouth about doing it all the time then quitting ... Not this time , I can't be a loser and better yet I won't. I'll do what I need to to make this happen. Advice is welcome

[@RandomShowerThoughts]

Self taught and went from Junior dev to senior in about 2 years. I think you have to be very passionate about what you’re learning

[@NinTheLost]

Web?

[@RandomShowerThoughts]

@@NinTheLost yeah backend, I did sre work and backend web development

[@mannyboul3523]

I feel like every time I watch your videos about learning to code, there’s always a new sponsored website you recommend

[@chrisseantalks]

The two places I genuinely recommend to learn above all else is ZTM, freeCodeCamp for self teaching and coding dojo for for bootcamps. For backend: boot.dev

[@BobbyBundlez]

Her comments make me sad and I’m feeling that now. I work as a front end dev making very little tbh and do freelance websites but actually getting into real app dev seems like a whole other monster that I might not be capable of. I’m not gonna give up but idk…. The interview game has changed a lot in the past two years. Noticeably since I got my first job

[@pinkdiscomosh2766]

Nope! Blaming luck is an excuse my friend. I lived in a more rural area of my state where there were zero tech jobs. In order to get my foot into the industry, I moved out of state to a big city and landed my first dev job. When I started to learn code, my social life tanked, my full time job suffered, my wife was alone at home while I spent many long days and nights after work and on weekends sitting at a starbucks learning code because I didn't have wifi at home. I did not land my career because I got lucky, I landed my career because it's all I wanted and I gave a lot to make it happen. Today, I make multiple six figures as a full stack engineer working remotely. I'm sure this person put in a ton of effort, but until you're willing to up root and rock your entire life to make your dreams happen, don't expect the greatest results.

[@Alexander-il9yx]

In the United States, it is also the same issue. "You will only get a chance with employers if you have a college or university degree." The problem is that there are a billion people out there in the world and employers want the small percentage who has everything: A diploma, experience, a lot of soft and hard skills, someone who they can trust, and who looks like a person who can be part of the team. The same thing is with people who are complaining that it is hard to get into romantic relationships. Instead of relying on an employer for money find a way to make money by yourself, or else you won't last under capitalism.

[@GavinDaGrey]

I don't know why people think skipping the degree is some sort of a shortcut; when in reality, you're choosing the harder route. Not only that, if the degree takes a minimum of 4 years to complete, how is she upset that she didn't get a job before committing a minimum of 4 years?

[@jamiewalker6296]

I see a lot of videos boasting about learning JS in 2 weeks, learn python tormorrow, learn X language in a unrealistic little amount of time and I think that sets false expectations. People feel bad seeing all this unrealistic time frames then seeing them selves a year or more later still struggling.

[@UziTekk]

Hey Chris great video as usual, I watched until the end. I can say as a someone who's also self taught out of Toronto, I am struggling to get interviews. I won't go as far to say it's because I'm in Toronto or just unlucky, but it is a grind I don't plan on quitting. Lastly if she doesn't contact you I love a chance to speak to you and pick your brain for bit. Again great video, always appreciate the incite!! :)

[@gustavoh.5329]

Nice to see another self taught person that's doing it in Canada. I'm learning how to code on my own in Vancouver. It won't be easy, but we'll do it. Let's get in touch, dude.

[@valemarkrotoni]

Thanks for this, Chris. I recently got laid off from my job, which is a timely inspiration and pushes me to never Give up and do the right thing. Asking for your permission to make a short snippet for this one and to post it to my LinkedIn to promote this podcast 🙂

[@loloioi]

I ended up taking a year before getting my first job as a full stack right out of university. i wasn't able to find a job right out of university despite having experience in fullstack, IT and devops. It really does take a lot of time, effort, consistency and self teaching to get to where you are at. I can definitely guarantee you that a lot of CS majors coming out of university don't know how to code for jack shit. I've been in group projects with some of these people and some of their code is garbo. Even then, some social skills that some cs majors have are just terrible... I agree that luck doesn't play that big of a role but it does matter during situations where candidates are equally good at what they do. For example, I interviewed 20+ candidates and 5 of them were solid and were almost equal in skillset and experience. The candidate we ended up going with just seemed better to work with than the rest; situation like that is just luck. They all were great candidates and all seemed great to work with. If I could, I would've hired all 5. My team and I knew conciously that those other 4 candidates we didnt pick would be able to find another job. You just have to keep grinding and keep going. If you don't know why you didnt get the job, it's always okay to ask why you weren't picked. Most of the time it's like "oh we found a better candidate" or it's a "timing" thing. In that case, yea it's just luck. I know coders who are leagues better than people I know currently in the big companies but just didnt get the opportunity to get in.

[@aradicaldude]

Asking someone to wait beyond a year and now four years plus to land a tech job in a skill set that is supposedly not common and requires a skill set that is hands on and must be practiced in order to retain is a tall order in deed. However, I have no idea if this woman was being proactive in trying to earn a job instead of just shot gunning Indeed, and I don't want to assume she was "lazy.'

[@passportbro904]

I've been wanting to say this for months, take no offence anyone, but I love watching people fail at coding on KZbin videos and when they cry and say its so hard, I say yes, 1 job more open for me lol. Im 7 months into my learning, and yes its hard, but nothing im not gonna overcome within the next 3 months, then gonna applying for jobs, my goal is to have a job by the 12th month of learning 😊

[@JRay2113]

it's one part luck and another part preparation. can't win the lotto if you don't first buy the ticket.

[@dannysong5645]

1) She didn't say "pure" luck, she did say luck is a factor 2) Video is a bit long for me (tuned out around 10min), but I like the positive message

[@rileystewart3170]

I paused & read the post & I don’t think she meant to come for Chris or devalue what he has done. Everyone successful has a bit of luck, that doesn’t mean they didn’t work hard or didn’t deserve it, but not everyone who works hard will be successful. Yes, you increase your chances the better you get, but you still need an opportunity. Anyway, I get why he was a bit offended, but she didn’t seem like she was blaming him for being misleading, but just warning people not to go into it with expectations like she did.

[@HawaiianForgeStudios]

Yea, no, I hate coding with a passion, didn't help that I went to college originally for that and changed my major after 2 semesters because of the bullshit. I rather fix things as an IT Technican than build shit that will break consistently unless I 100% know what I am doing.

[@tomtom7955]

its not always what you know but who you know