The SEC is OUT on Florida State and Clemson; Likely Big Ten Bound | Brett McMurphy

Brett McMurphy tells Paul Finebaum that the SEC doesn't want Florida State and Clemson. He thinks it's more likely they wind up in the Big Ten. A warning sign to watch for Big 12 competitive survival.
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The college sports world has never been more wild (and I mean WILD) to follow. You’re always in the know on realignment and what it means for your team on the John Kurtz Show. This isn’t just a Power Two channel - we’ve got the Big 12, ACC, and Group of Five covered too. Realignment, games, rankings, stakes, smack talk…it’s all here.

[@dacokc]

@36:00 , transfer portal goes both ways though… you have kids leaving the Big12 for the SEC and BigTen… but you also have kids from the SEC and BigTen that will leave to go to the Big12 to get more playing time..

[@FloridaMan-em3gk]

FSU is 9 and 2 against LSU and not a single game has been in Tallahassee

[@chuckwest7045]

The 1990 game was in Tallahassee. LSU's the only SEC power that FSU has had success against on any kind of consistent basis. I also noticed that none of those games were in the 50's, 60's & early 70's when LSU had the superior program NOR were any of them played during the 2000's when LSU was a power while FSU was transitioning between Bowden and Fisher.

[@LoCoVANole]

@@chuckwest7045Come again? Have you forgotten the success FSU has had against UF for the last half century since Bowden took over? Need me to repeat them again? Also, as you well know, FSU has an all-time winning record against the backwoods SEC.

[@steveaustin3125]

63-3

[@cg3639]

Would rather be in the Big10 as a Clemson fan

[@LoCoVANole]

@@steveaustin3125 Trailer park conference.

[@davidbrown386]

If Clemson and FSU go Big 10, two things are obvious. 1: Both the Big 10 and SEC are shoring up weaknesses. Clemson and FSU fill a hole as they build a National Conference ( important for broadcasters and advertisers) and improve football. UNC & UVA when and if they join the SEC will improve hoops, Olympic Sports and academics. 2: There is one HUGE loser in this: Miami. If it turns out Clemson and FSU go to the Big 10, they will likely be kept out of a P-2 Conference.

[@tarheel7406]

The B1G has increasingly pressing demo concerns, which will likely result in sacrificing some athletic interests to address broader institutional problems. This is the only explanation I can see for any B1G interest in CLEMSON.

[@davidbrown386]

Tar Heel you are over thinking this. One reason the Big 10 wants Clemson ( besides being available and wanting a travel partner for FSU), is “Supply and Demand.” There are very few football schools that are not in the Big 10 or SEC come this football season. Clemson is one of the them. At the same time the Big 10 is shoring up a weakness. Makes perfect sense.

[@tarheel7406]

@@davidbrown386 You are underthinking this. From the perspective of the B1G, CLEMSON is: a) Low brand inertia b) Not a flagship c) Not AAU d) Located in a smaller state e) In a state in which the SEC has the flagship f) Has few synergies with existing B1G members g) Isn't a great to elite academic school h) Has no notable overall sports I have no reason to poo poo CLEMSON, as UNC is picked over it every time. I also think that CLEMSON is far more realistic than FSU and knows it will be more valuable in and synergistic with the SEC. That's why events (and some claims) indicate that CLEMSON has allied with UNC for a coattail to the SEC.

[@rogerwalker3409]

Tarheel, I know you and I have gone back and forth on this, but I do think you have many misconceptions when it comes to Clemson. A) the low brand inertia is not correct. They have a growing alumni base. They’ve been steadily growing the student body, and have a rapidly growing alumni base. Adding a Vet School, and possibly a law school will only increase that. B) Flagship is rather irrelevant in this situation. The University of South Carolina is, and always has been, Clemson, regardless if they bear the name. C) They are not AAU, but are working towards it and it’s a states university goal. If they got into the B1G, they would easily be granted AAU, though it’s not really a requirement anymore. Let’s also not mention that Clemson’s academics are far superior to Oregon, objectively, and Oregon is an AAU university. D) Fastest growing state in the nation, so there’s that. E) Again, an irrelevant point and an irrelevant university, both in regard to performance and academics. F) Won’t argue there, but that’s gone out the window with realignment. G) See C, not elite, but generally a top 20-25 public university. One thing that has hindered them is no vet school, no law school, and no medical school. Luckily, those issues are being addressed. H) No notable sports? A Top 15 all time program in wins, 3 national titles, 27 conference titles, 50 bowl games, 27 bowl wins, 6 CFP appearances, and 4 playoff wins. I’d say that’s a notable sport. 4 national titles in men’s soccer, including 2 of the last 3. 12 CWS appearances, including the #6 overall seed this year. I’d say they have plenty of notable sports, and are a top 15 ratings draw, which is what matters not the networks bankrolling this. Now, I agree with you that we fit better with the SEC, but as of now, there’s only 2 teams making themselves available, and UNC appears to have a civil war they need to settle before anything happens on that end. We shall see what happens when all is said and done.

[@tarheel7406]

@@rogerwalker3409 a) Low brand inertia is correct, at least historically. Professional analysts mentioned it before I had thought about the matter. It just means that CLEMSON's viewership and ability to get better channels and time slots varies greatly with the then level of football success. b) USCAR is the de facto flagship of the state. Period. c) It's clear to me that AAU is not in sync with CLEMSON's mission and/or culture. FSU has leveraged ACC membership to make huge improvements academically. CLEMSON is a founder and hasn't done same. d) UTAH is also growing very fast measured by percentage. The base total on which growth is built is also material. likely more so. e) That the SEC already has USCAR is very relevant. f) Synergies will matter to the B1G and should really matter to CLEMSON. g) I have to draw lines somewhere, and per my referenced source, CLEMSON is on the low end of "good", perhaps arguably "solid". It is clearly not "great" nor "elite" relative to all P4 schools. Admittedly a high standard, but CLEMSON is the 2nd worst academic member of the ACC (L'VILLE being the worst). h) "Notable overall sports" in this context is a totality, not a claim that CLEMSON isn't consistently competitive in any other specific sport. I measure this using the Altimore graph and Top 10 D-Cup finishes. On that graph, CLEMSON is a rough peer with CO, MICHST & TCU. CLEMSON has no Top-10 finishes in the D-Cup that I can find. For context, UNC has 24. I maintain that CLEMSON is allied with UNC for a coattail to the SEC; however, the level of political interference is unexpected. If the B1G is desperate enough to make a huge exception for CLEMSON, CLEMSON may decide not to risk waiting for the better SEC offer. Either is a reasonable choice to perhaps be judged later with hindsight.

[@MichaelMadden-g8q]

It doesn't matter what the SEC wants, their Boss ESPN will decide if they are willing to lose the viewership of the two leaders in the ACC. And with ESPN loosing so much the past year, how much more are they willing to lose!

[@tedharris8244]

Ya'll crack me up because the Noles and the Tigers are SEC bound.

[@toddwebb7521]

Well UNC and NC State are legally bound together with one another as is UVA and VTech, so the SEC may be looking to pick up those 4.

[@tarheel7406]

UNC and NCSTATE are not legally bound together. The VA schools seem to have gone dark, so not sure what's going on there. UVA may still be "never SEC", which seems foolish given where things are and the MARYLAND experience. I maintain that we are heading to ~24 each SEC and B1G. The SEC should secure its preferred +8 sooner rather than later. Leaving FSU to wither on a B1G island, perhaps: UVA VATECH UNC NCSTATE DUKE CLEMSON +2 among GATECH, MIAMI, KANSAS, ??? Maybe poach MARYLAND for the last arguably southern flagship.

[@dacokc]

Cal and ucla were also bound together.. Similarly so was Oklahoma and Oklahoma State, Oregon and Oregon State, Washington and Washington State..

[@chuckwest7045]

The SEC isn't adding all four of those schools. Not a chance.

[@dacokc]

@@Mr.rogers1969 similarly I could see UNC making a deal with NC State to break away from them..

[@tucanoguy4719]

Here comes the AFC and NFC. It’s going to turn into two super conferences at this point. It makes the most sense.

[@williamdiehl117]

Just a fact - Until the Big10 added USC, UCLA, Washington and Oregon the Big10 was contiguous. In fact back during the last major round of realignment over a decade ago being contiguous was an argument about potential future members you use to hear in Big10 Country along with AAU membership. Which is why you often heard about Kansas, Missouri on the western side, especially once Nebraska joined. On the eastern side, thats another reason Maryland and Rutgers made sense they kept the states where members were contiguous. The next "connecting states" would be Virginia and North Carolina. You don't hear that argument anymore, the one argument you do still hear talked a lot about, is AAU membership. Which is why as close as Florida State is they make sense and with Notre Dame gaining that last year is another argument for them. The biggest argument against Clemson is the non AAU membership and that they aren't anywhere close to it. North Carolina and Virginia both would be AAU and have huge research and endowments which are important in the Big10.

[@tarheel7406]

a) The PAC 4-bloc won't be surrounded by SEC competitors with more attractive schedules, a better recruiting footprint, and higher regional exposure. b) Not sure what's going on with UVA currently, but it and UNC rejected the B1G during that last realignment. Staying in the ACC is now no longer a viable option for the long-term, and I hope they both wisely pick the SEC for this likely final major realignment.

[@wadecockrill3646]

Thanks again John!

[@tysonas1]

FSU has 29 days to leave ACC in its dust. I’m all for a Super B1G Conference; (5) five team divisions and a three round playoff. The division winners plus next three. Which is incentive for all schools knowing there’s eight possible spots. Bottom 4 play at top four schools then the semi and final at neutral sites.

[@kelvindavidson262]

That is true what you said about Penn State however, Penn State could be any team in the big 12 😂

[@stevemoserify]

Except for the whole looking the other way for decades while staff fuck little kids thing

[@chrislieberman]

I think the ACC will ull it out with Utah, West, Virgi, and UCF Comng,

[@mklein818]

What does Clemson offer the B1G? Half of South Carolina? It's another Nebraska in the making - a non-AAU school in a small market that adds nothing when it's having a down year. FSU is a no-brainer and is headed to the AAU anyways. But Clemson? Naaah.

[@tomrippey5231]

I would rather have Miami in B1G than Clemson.

[@rogerwalker3409]

I’m sure you would like another pushover.

[@chrislieberman]

They need anymorwone but will take the CarolinS TO ADD A NEW region.

[@teeoff406]

I think Big Ten want Florida St, NC, Miami and Syracuse 🤔

[@gabeswitala2292]

Check out this clown boi. Talking smack on the bottom half of the big ten when in reality, bottom half sec vs bottom halfbig ten, big ten has a huge advantage in all-time head to head match ups. Its not even close and its quite embarrassing for the sec.

[@roris5882]

Iowa State is Iowa's little bro.

[@CouzsCornerSports]

Brett said SEC wants UNC & UVA.

[@tarheel7406]

As have most every major reporter and analyst since Day 1, many citing inside SEC/B1G sources. I didn't know about the high interest in UVA/UNC by both the SEC and B1G when this story started, but I adjusted my analysis accordingly. Why so many commentors refuse to understand and believe is a mystery to me.

[@dacokc]

@@tarheel7406 why expand to 18 though? 20 is a more clean number for pods or divisions..

[@tarheel7406]

@@dacokc a) Word is the SEC has a pro rata but limited to staggered +2 waves. b) My comment was limited to the top SEC priorities rather than a full target list. c) The SEC will likely go to 20, and I expect UNC/CLEMSON will be the first +2 to secure UNC. d) The SEC is then likely to stand pat until UVA is either secured or lost. I maintain that FSU is now of (or of no real) interest to the SEC. I also suspect that the B1G may stand pat holding 4 slots open for ND, UVA, UNC, and ND's demanded reasonable +1 until secured or lost. FSU may have to wait things out in the BIG12.

[@tedharris8244]

and neither one of those are even attempting to leave the ACC so where does that leave anyone?

[@tedharris8244]

@@tarheel7406 ESPN will slide both FSU and Clemson into the SEC...watch and see my friend because it will happen just like that.

[@troycothran8356]

Got news for the sec or better known one trick pony. Fsu and clemson prefer the big ten. Their fans prefer big ten.

[@equalizer1946]

Aint gonna happen...Neither of them fit the B1G profile,

[@ScottyDuke-kc7uc]

Fsu is a better program than LSU

[@stevekelly9509]

Idiocy at its best

[@cgiii2440]

LSU you are a Johnny come lately program you didn't exist as far as the college football world was concerned pre Nick coming there, sadly for you even relevancy hasn't changed your trajectory of asskickings you suffer at the hands of FSU check the all time record scrub 😮

[@GoHawgs1987]

​@cgiii2440 I hate defending LSU, but you have that completely backward. FSU is the Johnny-come-lately compared to LSU. FSU didn't even finish in the top 10 until 1979. LSU had already won a national title, had 11 top-10 finishes, and had a Heisman winner by then. FSU didn't even field a team from 1906 to 1946. Jesus, do some research before you just say shit.

[@cgiii2440]

@@GoHawgs1987 no prior to Nick Saban coming there when was the last time LSU won ANYTHING of relevance? Are we talking pre Vietnam war, pre Korean war? Hell do we gotta go back WWII ? I'll wait kinda like TA&M... 🤔 hell if we really want to get into ancient history didn't the Ivey League schools run the sport back in the day along with Syracuse? But see that is all irrelevant now, now isn't it?

[@GoHawgs1987]

@cgiii2440 Yeahhhhh, you're just wrong about all that. LSU was terrible in the 90s, but basically, any decade before that, they were equal to or better than FSU. They're pretty similar programs. Both have 3 national titles since the 90s. And dude, Saban was there like 20 years ago now, lol. Do you really think 1958 and 1898 are the same thing?

[@unc0mm0n2]

The b12 is garbage. And iowa beats the mess out of garbage isu. PSU would run the b12.

[@A1Googler]

You are long winded. GET TO THE POINT

[@heartbreak25]

Greg Flugar says HOLD MY BEER....

[@brett8078]

Why would FSU want to deal with espn and the sec after 2023? FSU will make more money in the big ten. Fox wants the big ten in Florida

[@tedharris8244]

Because there are much better match-ups in the SEC than the little 10 by a mile which means more eyes on the sets bringing in much more money to the networks. That's why ESPN will slide both FSU and Clemson into the SEC...watch and see my friend because it will happen just like that.

[@tremoore61]

Hey Brett, to the best of my knowledge, the Florida - FSU contract series hasn't been renewed past the 2022 expiration of the last contract. Since you want nothing to do with ESPN & the SEC, you should lobby for them to cancel that game! Truly step away and have nothing to do with ESPN & the SEC, we'll see if Miami would like to have that game. Since I haven't heard of a new extension, there's nothing that'll hold it up. Let's see what FSU's future looks like with nothing to do with us.

[@meditatingmunky3824]

SEC would actually prefer that Clemson and FSU go elsewhere. They cant have Texas coming in and beating the best teams in the conference and then have Clemson and FSU do the same thing. That will only prove how overrated the SEC has been.

[@opeydedon2279]

what?!

[@meditatingmunky3824]

@opeydedon2279 I didn't stutter. SEC is already afraid Texas and Oklahoma are going to cone in and run their conference. They don't want little ole Clemson and FSU doing the same thing so they are scared to bring them in.

[@jameschapman6825]

SEC becomes even more attractive because they've kept the regionality. BIG10 as an identity is getting watered down as they add more and more teams.

[@GregsDisneysadventures]

No B1G is becoming a national Conference coast to coast

[@GregsDisneysadventures]

SEC is getting more focused on basketball they have what they need for football And UNC and Virginia are 2 more SEC top targets

[@Shaunskee]

​@@GregsDisneysadventures no your wrong!!! The BIG 10 is adding every team they possibly can to get SEC respect!!! The only teams that matter in college football are in the SEC!!! The rest of you are wanta bees!!! The SEC doesn't need to expand any body that matters is already there!!!!

[@roris5882]

The B1G already expands from NYC, to Chicago, so LA and the West Coast. Soon they will conquer the entire map when they move into the SEC's backyard and add ND to put the SEC out of business for good.

[@George-Kliavkoff4Big12]

SEC wants to dominate in basketball as well. Bama and Tennessee had a nice run. UF has some hardware. South Carolina and LSU girls teams are perennial contenders and champions. So it makes sense to have UNC. Baseball and softball are also huge to the SEC. LSU, Texas, and Miss St are CWS regulars. Oklahoma softball... Enough said. But UF and Bama have formidable squads. UNC baseball is also pretty good.

[@tarheel7406]

From the SEC perspective, UNC (and to a lesser UVA) are the perfect expansion targets. They are both southern flagships that fill in some SEC weaknesses, namely academic reputation, basketball, and old money influence. The SEC appears to want to be the top athletic conference across the board while maintaining its geo-centric brand. UNC is a blue in overall sports, UVA a lite blue.

[@davidbrown386]

I agree with most of what you said ( especially about academics). However, UVA is not a “Lite Blue” they are on a Vanderbilt level in football. UNC is better but will be in the bottom half of the SEC in football.

[@tarheel7406]

@@davidbrown386 For the ~1000th time, the P2 consolidation will have a parity effect on football. UVA is a lite blue in overall athletics and basketball.

[@davidbrown386]

A “Lite Blue” would Washington Penn State or Tennessee. Not a Blue like Ohio St. Michigan Georgia or Texas: No one thinks UVA is more valuable then Washington Penn St or Tennessee.

[@George-Kliavkoff4Big12]

@@davidbrown386 well it's like being pregnant. You either are or or ain't. Can't be "lite pregos"

[@oldad3692]

FSU is B1G! Sooner is better! Go Noles!

[@chuckwest7045]

Have fun in Iowa and Minnesota.

[@oldad3692]

@@chuckwest7045 We will. I'm sure! Go Noles!

[@jerodjones1771]

Penn State doesn’t really lose to anyone other than Ohio State and Michigan. 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@jeremykeys2091]

And to Ole Miss 😂😂😂

[@jerodjones1771]

@@jeremykeys2091 I don’t count bowl games anymore. Not everyone plays

[@heartbreak25]

@@jeremykeys2091 I was at the Peach Bowl game. PSU pulled the remaining players who were declaring for the NFL draft in the second half. Look at the score before halftime and after halftime.

[@tucanoguy4719]

Pretty sure you can add Oregon to that list now 😊

[@hendo7945]

Y’all think they don’t want FSU or Clemson 😂 don’t let these media folks fool yall

[@tarheel7406]

CLEMSON and FSU are disposable to the SEC.

[@brett8078]

Sec took Texas after having Texas a&M. Yes bigger brand with texas. But FSU is a big brand. So i wouldnt say sankey wont grab another state of Florida school

[@Bananakin7]

FSU fan: get out of the ACC, I'm okay with any power conference only because I live in Utah, otherwise I wouldn't be too hyped about it.

[@scottcavanaugh9619]

It doesn’t matter what the SEC thinks about FSU/Clemson and the Big Ten etc. It only matters what ESPN thinks about this. And with the Big Ten and Big 12 becoming “national” leagues, ESPN is not going to want to double down more on the southeast.

[@HTHAMMACK1]

Big 12 is a joke and in no way comparable to the SEC. So stop.

[@tarheel7406]

a) Networks rent conferences while conferences buy expansions. b) "National" is a spin to distract away from being forced to abandon some branding and to dilute the value of rivalries.

[@troywest7045]

Double down? They couldn't even up the ante to add a 9th SEC conference game!

[@boweevil8390]

Networks aren’t going to look at realignment as in past years. Tv viewers don’t want to see Bama vs Wake Forest or Rutgers. But if viewers all over the country would tune into Clemson vs Bama or Georgia vs Florida State. It’s all about the quality of the games. Both Florida State and Clemson have huge stadiums that sell out. Nobody wants to watch Vandy get beat 70-0. Fans spend money on quality.

[@GOLDKW-bl4gp]

Pennsylvania, Michigan and Ohio is loaded with football players. Rest of the B1G schools need to recruit outside their state. Hard to get southern players to go to these cold weather schools. UM and OSU can pick off some elite athletes from the South and West Coast.

[@mustymartian8684]

Why would UNC and Kansas only join the SEC in basketball. That's a terrible comment bro.

[@tarheel7406]

"For" does not equate to "just in". I didn't hear the latter.

[@mustymartian8684]

​​@@tarheel7406, @ 15:22

[@tarheel7406]

@@mustymartian8684 Take basketball brands does not mean just take the basketball programs. Regardless, the SEC doesn't need to play that type of game.

[@mustymartian8684]

@@tarheel7406 I agree.

[@jamesrawson241]

If I’m Florida, I’m much prefer Florida State to be in the SEC with me then in the big 10 getting the same money and many more wins

[@jlamm2223443]

huh, the big 12 lost its name brands and didn't die, but he is sure the acc has no chance since FSU and Clemson want to leave.

[@janinebrittanica4314]

I mean, the Big 12 called up the best teams in the country that weren't already in the P5, and thatsbwhen the picking was fresh. That's the difference. The ACC already called up SMU. If multiple schools leave the ACC, who could the ACC call up that would match the big 12s haul in West Virginia, TCU, BYU, Houston, Cincinnati, and UCF? There's just not much left to pick from. USF, maybe Memphis, maybe Tulane? The Big 12 already got the best of the rest over the last 15 years.

[@jlamm2223443]

@@janinebrittanica4314 I think a lot depends on who gets invites to the big 2 and who wants to stay in the ACC and how the TV deals look. Suppose only FSU and Clemson get invites to the big 2, and the others decide to stay. Then I would back fill with Utah and West Virginia since such an ACC could probably pick on the Big 12. If Clemson, FSU, North Carolina, Virginia, Miami all get invites to the big 2 then the ACC is a lot like the Pac 12 was. Things look super dire as the Big 12 could do further damage. Then I might back fill with Washington State, Oregon State, USF, Tulane, Rice, San Diego State, Boise State, Memphis State and possibly more. We just have to see. Maybe the Big 12 and ACC merge at that point.

[@janinebrittanica4314]

@@jlamm2223443 I think the reality is that, if any four or more schools leave, the XII will be able to offer at least a bit more money wise to the schools that may be left available (Louisville, Pitt, Va Tech, NC State, Miami) than what the remaining ACC could, and I think Yormark could for sure sell them on a bball superleague, what w KU, AZ, Houston, Louisville, K-State, Pitt, Iowa State

[@michaelwall3393]

@@jlamm2223443no one from the Big12 is going to the ACC. With that said, the exit fees and everything else will probably keep the ACC together and get a revenue deal similar to the Big12 or a little less or more depending upon how much value in the remaining schools are and any additional schools filled in once the first 2-4 departures from the ACC happens. It’s University of Memphis or just Memphis by the way not Memphis State. Anyway the most likely fill ins that bring eyeballs and ratings along with winning and placate the academic snobbery of the ACC are: USF, Tulane, Rice, San Diego State, Washington State, Oregon State, Memphis, UCONN, CCU, JMU, Army, Navy, Air Force, Colorado State, Utah State, ODU, Liberty, App State, UAB, UNT, Tulsa, Temple, New Mexico, UTSA, FAU, Troy, Marshall, Buffalo, Toledo, and Ohio University. Not all of these schools are going to get picked up or chosen by the ACC or chosen by the Big12; should they want anyone to add value to their conference. But these are the most noteworthy schools and successful schools in both academics and athletics and value enhancing institutions just enough to garner attention and consideration. There are some other schools that have potential and fit the bill and criteria but will leave them off for multiple reasons.

[@tarheel7406]

@@janinebrittanica4314 a) The BIG12 likely backfilled with schools that the ACC wouldn't really want. Perhaps the 4Cs, hence the UTAH rumors. b) Tier 2 conferences don't need to be that large. 8-12 schools optimum. c) The BIG12 is viewed as the option of last resort.

[@Conundrum-cy5oe]

Pilot Truck Stop logo on K-State's football field, and Kurtz's scoreboard forehead; there's your Capital $$ infusion

[@kyllerkill]

You actually think the sec would take schools just so another conference doesn’t get them? That’s a huge sign of weakness. I don’t see the sec playing that game. That’s a more big 12 thing they’d need to do. The sec doesn’t.

[@geoffhill1197]

I don't know what you meant really if you're just looking about right now if you're looking FSU is done in their program since Bobby they're not just a nice program the one of the best programs in. the country. FSU also set an NCAA record for most consecutive Top 5 finishes in the AP football poll - receiving placement 14 years in a row, from 1987 to 2000. Longest streak of consecutive bowl games: 36 games from 1982-2017, though the NCAA doesn't recognize this because their 2006 Emerald Bowl win was vacated Most consecutive bowl game victories: 11 games from 1985-1996 Longest unbeaten streak: 13-0-1 record from 1982-1996 and this is just some of the records Awards and everything else they've done since they've been a program but it will take too long

[@GOLDKW-bl4gp]

Hard to get 4 & 5 star players to go to Lincoln Nebraska. Don't know what their NIL Collective looks like. When Tom Osbourne was there, he recruited the state of Florida really well. Different time and back then the Florida schools had a grip on the talent. Now every college is recruiting Florida.

[@brianmiller1977]

WVU almost joined the SEC a while back. SEC chose MIZZOU over WVU, but the rumor mill said it was very close and there was a lot of support for WVU in the SEC. 15th winningest football program, competitive basketball program, baseball on the climb, and #9 in Total Brand Value(Yes..... you saw that correct... #9... People always talk about WV being a small state, but yet its Brand value, fan engagement, streaming, etc many "value" metrics rank in the top 10, 20, 30, etc.) What people dont realize is how large WVU fanbases are in states like NC, VA, PA, TN, FL, DC, NJ, etc. The only negative is the state dont offer much in terms of P4 recruiting. Which has improved the last 5 years or so, but its never going to be great. Saban would lobby for it too. Its a far better culture fit than many others, but who knows what formula theyll use to make a decision(which metrics theyll most heavily weight in the decision process).

[@bigbuffguy9589]

The SEC has made very smart realignment decisions (okay, maybe not Missouri). Letting the Big Ten get both Florida State and Clemson strikes me as very stupid. It's honestly the kind of mistake I'd expect the Big Ten to make.

[@heartbreak25]

This is a reminder that Utah is 0-2 against Northwestern the last four years. Utha is 1-5 against the B1G the last 7 years. That's the betting favorite to win the Big 12.

[@jamiethornton6101]

From my SEC source. UNC, Virginia, Duke, and Kansas are the four schools the SEC will be focused on if Clemson and FSU go to the B1G. Three of those schools are exactly what the SEC loves. The large state flagship schools and all four are huge basketball schools. As we know, Sankey has been talking baskeball and expanding the tournament. Now obviously, if this did happen; it will take much longer to happen. But these are the four the SEC would be looking to focus on as future expansion members.

[@OldGuy2-m4c]

Take the hotbed of wokeness.

[@tarheel7406]

a) I don't buy CLEMSON to the B1G but rather UNC/CLEMSON to the SEC next wave. b) You've repeatedly stated that UVA has privately snubbed the SEC, though that doesn't mean efforts have stopped.

[@chuckwest7045]

Greg Sankey has never talked about basketball in regards to potential SEC expansion possibilities.

[@tarheel7406]

@@chuckwest7045 Maybe... My understanding is that the SEC's ambition is to be the best in all sports that it sponsors, while I read B1G fans claim that it no longer cares about men's basketball. I've also read that the SEC directed its members to focus on improving men's hoops, yet it has been the worst of the "P"s over the last ~10 years measured by the Final Four: Final Four Appearances, 1st Rd Wins, Nattys (per Wiki 2015-2024. 2020 N/A) ACC: 9-5-3 B12: 5-3-2 (Excludes OK; includes Houston) BIGEAST: 6-4-4 SEC: 5-0-0 (Includes OK) B1G: 7-3-0 (Includes Oregon & UCLA) Putting aside KANSAS and hoops..., UVA, UNC & DUKE all lift the SEC where it lacks, namely academic reputation, older money influence, and overall sports (number and historical).

[@opeydedon2279]

hi jamie, it will happen.

[@joshbazon2764]

The Big 10 is the most powerful overall academic and athletic institutions in the country, so I would expect them to go after Notre Dame, Florida State, North Carolina, Georgia Tech, Clemson, and Miami (FL). The Tallahassee Chamber of Commerce mentioned Florida State would make more money by joining the Big 10 versus the SEC since the AAU Research and TV contract with Fox Sports/BTN, NBC Sports, and CBS Sports.

[@tarheel7406]

The B1G has waned in top-level competitiveness and academic standing. It has likely reached its overall highwater mark (including media value).

[@doof1453]

Finally, someone that understands what adding more research schools means to B1G. Football and sports revenue is all well and good, but it’s peanuts next to the research budgets and research sharing B1G Presidents look at for BTAA. IDK about Clemson getting in at all, but both UNC and GT are top 15 research schools in the country.

[@tarheel7406]

@@doof1453 a) Grants are not pooled/shared at the conference level. b) IF the BTAA were that lucrative, it would have been replicated elsewhere. c) AAU is a branding/culture thing.

[@doof1453]

@tarheel7406 A) I know grants aren't shared but research is. B) Not necessarily. C) AAU is more to B1G than any other conference, so much so that there is alot of pressure by the other schools on Nebraska to regain status. With that in mind, it seems very unlikely any invitation would go to a non-AAU school. Yes, AAU is not a requirement, but B1G presidents want it anyway.

[@Shaunskee]

​@@doof1453It doesn't matter about AAU the BIG 10 is so desperate to be compared to the SEC in football strength they are willing to break all the rules!!! The SEC doesn't need to expand they already have all the power brands in football that matter! Everyone not in the SEC already are just left overs hoping!!!!

[@OldGuy2-m4c]

The coast to coast najor media market B1G will eventually dwarf the SEC will media market money. The B1G will become a rich man's conference. Money means champions. A regional conference will have to rely on regular season games with B1G major media markets teams to pull in money.

[@tarheel7406]

The west coast is a declining market for college football, hence the death of the PAC as even a Tier 2. The core B1G footprint has stagnant and aging populations. It appears that the B1G may only be able to get a few #2s in states that the SEC will increasingly dominate. The B1G has had a money advantage for a lon time, yet has been waning at the top-level competitively. It was #3 by that measure coming into this realignment. Most likely, the B1G will be the nostalgia conference while the SEC will be the currently winning conference.

[@Mr.Ed_Wayner]

Gonzaga only makes sense if B12 adds WSU & OSU.

[@danhauser3361]

Kansas and Virginia …do not add value to the SEC or the B10…but they do add States /Markets that neither has! Missouri ( KC market) conflicts for Kansas…so they may be limited in value to the SEC …but added value to compete with Nebraska/Iowa for the B10. But B10 is getting bloated and strung out….and if they ever want Kansas….they can wait things out…as can the SEC…who have no compelling needs! So the ACC is higher on the agenda…just because these lawsuits may provide opportunity sooner than later……a matter of timing and ESPN blessing !!

[@opeydedon2279]

@danhauser3361 look at the bleed over that kan has in the chicago market. its pretty unreal to say the least.

[@daviddejesus5376]

Rumors! That's a great album.

[@ronlowney4700]

UNC AND NOTRE DAME ARE NEXT! 🎯

[@roris5882]

B1G💰Bound

[@alabamatide8192]

CS!!! Jokes

[@deantaylor6919]

John, the Florida A.D. did not say he’s all right with it do you honestly believe that they’re just gonna sit there and say we’re fine we’re good whatever… They gonna fight this and hope they gain support from teams like South Carolina, Florida, Texas and other states they don’t want more teams in from their states.. Come on put your thinking cap on Bud .. but if it comes down to 3/4 vote, he has no choice but to unite but the SEC normally wants what is best for each other

[@Silentskip001]

Then why add Texas and A&M?

[@deantaylor6919]

@@Silentskip001 because Texas is Big enough for 2 Schools, plus you don’t turn Texas away.. that would like the Big 10 saying to Notre Dame, hey we don’t need you we got Indiana.. plus Purdue we really don’t need you. FSU is not the Irish,

[@user-zt8jb1bc7w]

FSU never said the sec was to difficult of a conference. If you are referring to the toungue-in-cheek statement that Bobby Bowden made several years ago then you are misinformed. FSU is72-71-6 against the sec. Facts apparently don’t matter in sec country.💯😂

[@chuckwest7045]

FSU is 58-73-7 vs the SEC all-time. Get the facts.

[@GoHawgs1987]

"They did want us, they did invite us to join the SEC. Everybody thought we would join. In fact, I thought we would but our administration - the president and others - wanted the ACC, which really was better for us. It would have been hard wading through that SEC. Too many good teams in there, boy. Oh, gosh. Oh, that would have been some great ball.”

[@GoHawgs1987]

"I felt, Paul, that it was too difficult to win through the SEC to win a national championship. I felt like our best route would be to go through the ACC and that did prove out to be correct. But, I don’t know if we could have made it through the SEC.”

[@GoHawgs1987]

I don't think your numbers are right. Against the current SEC? They have losing records against Alabama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, and Kentucky, and now Oklahoma. Are you including Georgia Tech and Tulane, etc. when they were in the SEC in the 50s? I only see them having winning records against A&M (4-0), South Carolina (16-3), MSU (7-2), LSU (9-2).

[@chuckwest7045]

@@GoHawgs1987 Most of the games against South Carolina came before the Gamecocks joined the SEC so those don't count. FSU has a losing record against the SEC all-time.

[@BarrettL1970]

SEC has the prestige but the B1G is coast to coast NY/NJ to LA and has already outflanked the SEC

[@tarheel7406]

What school has the B1G added (ever) in which the SEC had then moderate to high interest? Maybe some future interest in NEB and/or MARYLAND way down the road? Effectively locking down VA down to FL over to TX with the flagships should suffice for the SEC.

[@BarrettL1970]

@tarheel7406 it's in the name of the conferences... South Eastern Conference... that sort of pigeon holds you within the boundaries of the confederacy. Where as at this point the B1G has gone after the large market share regions. The SEC and B1G don't even have the same criteria. I would contend both conferences want UNC ... badly... I'm in B1G country... I don't see the urgency to add these 2 programs. Go to the Big 12. Thoes two really don't add to either conference.

[@Sjg61425]

We should acknowledge that big time sports is essentially minor league sports leagues for the NFL and NBA. What the universites should do is simply license their images and colors to teams that are essentially a professional league. The majority of the students are not at the university to achieve a degree. What really should happen is that the Stanford, Dukes, Northwestern,Tulane. Rice and Vanderbilts should do is form their own league. Make the players like teaching assistant. Free education and a real stipend like perhaps like a thousand dollars per month and play each other. I think you would find schools such as Johns Hopkins, University of Chicago and Washingto University,MO. might decide to play in such a league. They could play their schedule and then challenge the Ivy League Champion to a play off type game. Since the income of their graduates tend to be higher than normal advertisers would be willing to purchase TV ads and thus game would be broadcast.

[@cjon3006]

KU leaves, Syracuse has my vote (good bball, building in FB, NYC market, and UWV/Pitt/VT Rivals)

[@lewis2871]

It's WVU

[@michaelwall3393]

I would like Memphis instead.

[@davidbrown386]

Native New Yorker here. Syracuse is NOT in the NY TV Market. It is hundreds of miles away in Central NY. Only Rutgers and Army-West Point are. Believe it or not, U-Conn in the Hartford-New Haven TV Market is closer to the NY TV Market then Syracuse

[@cjon3006]

@@davidbrown386wild figured more NYers follow Cus over RU. Good to know

[@cjon3006]

@@lewis2871 And knowing's half the battle! -G.I.Joe

[@Qeduhh365]

The private equity v Capital is exactly the distinction without difference that private equity is laughing their asses off that you’re going for

[@rongrantga]

Good show. Take care of that back. Maybe back off on yard work and lifting for a while. Does your gym have a hot tub?

[@KennedyArpe-wk7tq]

Notre dame is a contiguous state as Indiana borders kentucky

[@tarheel7406]

A Catholic private school outside of the greater Southeast.

[@logsdon36]

The bottom half of B1G has been consistently bad, but watch out for Rutgers this year.

[@roris5882]

If the Big12 is successful using "private capital" to increase their revenue then why wouldn't the B1G and SEC programs also be using it to continue pricing out the Big12 programs? It's not like Yormark or the Big12 programs have a monopoly over successful ideas or their gimmicks to generate more revenue.

[@tarheel7406]

" It's not like Yormark or the Big12 programs have a monopoly over successful ideas or their gimmicks to generate more revenue." Yep, just like with the BTAA.

[@thetruth1446]

Told FSU fans the SEC would never take them, FSU had a chance 2 decades ago and said it was to hard of a conference 😂

[@Almighty5-ww1kl]

You SEC fool , you jus let Fox into your backyard and the Big 10 has more money than the SEC , expect a shift in power , SEC ego will be its downfall , you have gotten drunk off your power and that will be your demise in 5 years your going to wish you have taken FSU and Clemson

[@Almighty5-ww1kl]

SEC fool yall jus let Fox into your backyard and they have more money than ESPN , expect a shift in power , SEC has goiter drunk off all its power and now yall let Fox into your area and take the top brand , in 5 years you will see the mistake that you made not taking FSU / Clemson

[@stevekelly9509]

FSU would bring nothing to the sec

[@thetruth1446]

@@stevekelly9509 Nothing besides a extra payout split 🤣 Its gonna end up SEC vs Everyone else and SECs still gonna win

[@FloridaMan-em3gk]

@@stevekelly9509but they will bring a hellacious amount of juice to the B1G, along with Clemson letting the B1G plant two big flags in SEC country.

[@tarheel7406]

For the ~1000th time.., the SEC will gladly cede CLEMSON, FSU (and MIAMI) to secure UVA/UNC; however, as things stand and appear to me: a) I don't see B1G interest in low brand inertia, etc. CLEMSON. b) UNC has appeared to have agreed to package CLEMSON to the SEC. c) UVA appears to remain "never SEC". d) Political interference in North Carolina is higher than was expected.