The Shadow of the Tower - Episode 12

[@roksanazofiamaek2299]

I had just realized that Christopher Neame/ Warwick also played Kaiser Wilhelm in "Edward the Seventh" from 1975. Wow, what a metamorphosis !!!

[@mhart62]

Yes! I agree. He is an exceptional actor.

[@cleo8332]

he also played Mark Antony in The Cleopatra's another 70/80s show.

[@reneedaughter]

Wasn't he in Licensed to Kill??

[@mswinslow2396]

I just made that connection. Hell of an actor !!!

[@dominiqueheptinstall401]

I think he was also in Secret Army

[@annamcuthbert3993]

Christopher Neame who plays Warwick is a great actor , also great as The Kaiser Wilhelm II in Edward VII tv series . I liked both of his portrayals

[@morbius109]

He also played the witch hunter Henry Snelling in the fourth episode of the second series of By The Sword Divided. He gave a very powerful performance there, as well.

[@louthegiantcookie]

"Our son is a harsh little Prince!" You don't know the half of it...

[@MrsTudor1]

There was no "extermination" of the Yorkists. Many of the surviving Plantagenets, like Margaret Pole for instance, were married into Lancasttrian families. Catherine of York married into the Lancastrian Courtenays. There was a lot of "Yorkist" executions during the reign of Henry VIII, however, that was to do with Papal conspiracies, not their lineage. By same token, there were Plantagenets at the Elizabethan Court. Ricardians have a big axe of their own to grind.

[@ryancarroll4852]

In fact Lord Huntington, a Yorkist, was one of the people considered to succeed Elizabeth I when she was (they thought) dying of Smallpox. Next in line by law was Catherine Grey but she had proved herself not to have much brain power and was in the tower, so a man with sons was very attractive.

[@stefanhernold345]

As a matter of fact, even the *regicides* of 1649 - the 59 commissioners who sat in judgement of King Charles I. and at length signed his death warrant - had at least one person of Plantaganet blood in their ranks. If I may quote from the man`s Wikipedia entry... >> *Sir John Bourchier* or Bourcher (c. 1595 - August 1660) was an English landowner and Puritan radical, who supported the Parliamentarian cause during the Wars of the Three Kingdoms. A regicide who voted for the Execution of Charles I in January 1649, he died in August 1660 awaiting trial following the Stuart Restoration. (...) Bourchier was a great-grandson of Margaret Pole, 8th Countess of Salisbury who had been beheaded by order of King Henry VIII.

[@JEarlofessex]

@ 9:11 Henry asks his mother: "Who will I marry mother?" Ah, how about 6 wives?

[@LadyOfBroadway333]

You will get your brother's old wife first, darling.

[@deborahmerkerson1145]

@LadyOfBroadway333 “You will get your brother’s old wife first, darling, if your father decides not to marry her.”

[@brendonmcmorrow3886]

Thank you for uploading this. A series which I knew nothing about until recently and find pretty accurate in historical terms. James Maxwell is outstanding and brings Henry VII to life in a way I have never seen before. The budgets were obviously limited as evidenced by the exclusive reliance on sets. It's a dark affair overall but that fits the tone of the reign which lacked joy (albeit with the notable high point of Arthur's wedding).

[@bretdouglas9407]

What a sad episode. Everyone wants to rule the stupid world. And look what always happens

[@MissusTudor]

The fact that so many of them were kept on in his court and used in his policy of merging the two warring houses. Even De la Pole was employed by Henry VII, and it wasn't Henry VII's fault that De La Pole continued to betray him.

[@mhart62]

The actor who played Warwick played a vampire in Dracula AD 1972, I think was the title. He was great.

[@anja1627]

Imagine what history would have been like had Arthur lived and reigned as king.

[@marcokite]

yup, we might still be Catholic now

[@leanie9660]

@@marcokite unlikely.....the world was waking up

[@rosemaryallen2128]

What grieves me keenly is the loss of some of the finest ecclesiastical architecture in Europe. AND Henry Vlll wasted all his stolen gains! Not to mention the creation of a beggar class of vulnerable people who had been cared for by the church, imperfect though that had been.

[@michaelrupp9288]

@@leanie9660 France? Spain? Ireland? Western Europe was mostly catholic holdouts. Even Scotland only converted because the Vatican kept siding with the English in their wars.

[@stefanhernold345]

Imagine what history would have been like if Prince Henry (1594-1612) had survived and reigned as a king

[@dejaporter7338]

The Earl of Warwick should have never been murdered my heart Breaks at the thought how tragic.. 😪😢💔

[@MrsTudor1]

The Earl of Warwick wasn't murdered. He was executed after escaping the Tower of London alongside Warbweck.

[@reneedaughter]

@@MrsTudor1 He was set up. The Earl of Warwick limited mental ability to put it mildly.

[@gm2407]

He was never free to live a life, always a captive. Had his father not rebelled against Edward IV it would have been a different life and less chance of a Bosworth field happening. Main differences between Yorkist and Lancastrians is Henry VI Uncles secured his inheritance, George rebelled against his brother and Richard III killed his nephews. Warrick surviving to Henry VII is only possible due to George being attained.

[@bardotte5757]

Thank you so much for uploading The Shadow of the Tower. I did not know of this show until today and was so excited to find it, I have been watching it all day. Such a shame the BBC blocked episodes 9 10 & 11 but, I am grateful to have watched it all. PS: I have just bought the full DVD set from Amazon. Wonderful ! I will now get to watch the blocked episodes. Thank you Tudor Lady 🌹

[@Concreteowl]

It’s a shame that the three episodes were blocked. Such a sad episode.

[@kiwifruit27]

They are on KZbin, just search the title of the series and the episodes you want to watch

[@EM-lz9kg]

Following King Richard's death on 22 August 1485, Warwick, only ten years old, was kept as a prisoner in the Tower of London by Henry VII acting as his ward. His claim to the throne, albeit tarnished, remained a potential threat to Henry, particularly after the appearance of the pretender Lambert Simnel in 1487. In 1490, he was confirmed in his title of Earl of Warwick despite his father's attainder (his claim to the earldom of Warwick being through his mother). But he remained a prisoner until 1499, when he became involved (willingly or unwillingly) in a plot to escape with Perkin Warbeck.

[@gm2407]

Tragic as a life for Warrick. Nothing he could do about it as he was never in control of his destiny, always his rivals prisoner before he was aware of it. Edward IV, Richard III and Henry VII.

[@MissusTudor]

Empson and Dudley had both broken the law and were guilty of embezzlement. There were no further executions until the Duke of Buckingham. Yes, Henry was involved in a lot of executions over his 30+ year reign, but keep it in perspective. It was a turbulent time in a totally different era to our own.

[@ryancarroll4852]

We do the same today just not killing them, it's politics. A new Prime Minister takes over things change. An Irish PM from the same party as his predessor once sacked most of the cabinet, guys around decades, cos the public was sick of them.

[@juanitarichards1074]

They weren't actually embezzlers, just carrying out their orders from Henry Vll, which made them unpopular with the people. Henry Vlll had them executed to gain popularity for himself. As he did many times in the future. The seeds of his ruthlessness were there from childhood. Where a Borgia used poison the Tudors used the law.......

[@juanitarichards1074]

Those poor boys in the Tower, pawns of others ambition. I remember later after Prince Arthur died Katherine of Aragon felt the marriage had been cursed because of the blood sacrifice made for it.

[@lilymarinovic1644]

No the idea that Katherine of Aragon thought her marriage to Henry was cursed was rubbish concocted probably by Philippa Gregory. Why would she fight so hard to stay married to Henry if she thought the marriage was not solid? He was more than happy to let her retire to.a nunnery.

[@juanitarichards1074]

@@lilymarinovic1644 She still wanted the marriage to last no matter her private thoughts. This has nothing to do with Phillipa Gregory whom I don't read in any case. But Katherine did confide to her ladies that to bring about her marriage cost innocent lives. Her parents wouldn't send her from Spain until all rivals and false claimants to the throne were wiped out for good. She may have believed the Princes in the Tower were murdered to this end whether true or not it was being rumoured at the time. Henry Vll had no choice but to execute pretenders to the throne if he wanted Katherine as a bride for his son Arthur.....Just as later Queen Mary had to execute the pretenders to he throne if she wanted to marry Prince Philip. His father wouldn't send him either until she had executed Jane Grey and her husband and father,

[@friendlyghost3293]

This is a great production. I have heard historians claim that Henry the VII was good for the economy and the peasant class but not the nobles. While he isn't the flashiest of the English monarchs, he knew to keep the nobles uneasy, meanwhile the merchant class prospered. His son would then promote peasants, who had benefited from improved access to opportunities, to positions of authority. Any thoughts out there?

[@gregorysmith2548]

You are exactly right. After the wars of the roses, a lot of the noble class was wiped out or financially ruined. The Tudor age was the end of the Medieval age and the beginning of the modern age.

[@johnpolitis9060]

@@gregorysmith2548 At least, Henry VII died as a Roman Catholic. He was the last Roman Catholic monarch. The other last Roman Catholic monarch was Mary Tudor I.

[@finch45lear]

He certainly was willing to defy the pope when it came to the wool trade and mining alum.

[@alecblunden8615]

​@@johnpolitis9060The definition of the Greek word Katholicos was set by the 380 Edict of Theodosius, Cunctos populos, as those affirming that the reality of God is the three hypostasis, Father, Son and Spirit. The definition of Aquinas is una substantia tres personae The Oxford Latin Dictionary defines "personae as the masks worn by actors ie they reject the Nicene formula to follow the pagan teaching of Plato and Aristotle. It was not until Hobbes that the reality of the individual was recognised in the West.Consequently, Henry Vii and Bloody Mary were the last non- catholic rulers of England etc, while the Latin rite is, by definition, and as declared by Cunctos populos have been heretics since the first few centuries of the Christian era.

[@gm2407]

Henry VII was probably unique in his methodology of rule to that point for England. He set the pattern of rule which came tumbling down when Charles I ruled with a less knowledgeable hand on the motivations of people. As for promoting peasants, the crown sought two things, educated men and men who owed their position to the crown only. Increase in secular education accross the Tudor period is a trend that began in the 15th century and was accelerated by the reformation. So you could say it was beneficial to the peasants and the crown at the expense of the nobility. It might even be the only good legacy of Henry VI when he provided patronage for educatuon.

[@Azdaja13]

Cleymonde's like "Save me from this fool, my brain is melting..." xD

[@wilfordfraser6347]

Good Lord this episode actually made me cry. Really cry.

[@anja1627]

Mary Tudor's missing and I think at this time baby Edmund was already born.

[@seltaeb9691]

Similar quality BBC 70s period dramas here on KZbin is 'The Devil's Crown' & the civil war (British!) 'By the Sword Divided', both highly recommended.

[@peasblossom1973]

It seems like all Henry Tudor did during his entire reign was run around in absolute paranoia rooting out 'traitors', 'subverters', 'pretenders', etc., and executing them.

[@TheKeyser94]

+peasblossom1973 That wouldn't happen if he had an actual claim, his claim was so weak that even the pretender to his throne have more stronger claim than him, and he seems to be fake.

[@brontewcat]

+peasblossom1973. Given that Henry had to deal with men who pretended they were the rightful king , but he initially spared their lives it is a little hard to see how he acted with paranoia. He had good reason to worry. His son, grandson and granddaughter Mary executed traitors much more quickly and with fewer pangs of conscious. It is unlikely he would have executed Warbeck and Warwick, had not their most Catholic Majesties of Spain not insisted on it.

[@marcokite]

well said

[@leanie9660]

Yes...this series tries to make him look like a brilliant tactician. First time I've ever heard this suggested of him

[@12from121]

Interesting take on some murky events in history. I feel sorry for the Earl of Warwick he never had a life because he had such a strong claim to the throne. I wonder what Edward III and his children would of made of the Wars of the Roses?

[@gm2407]

I imagine the irony would not be lost on them after setting the pattern of waring with their own cousins in France. Difference is Edward III did not execute John II of France or David II of Scotland.

[@PaulvonOberstein]

Shame we didn't get a good BBC series on the Edward III/Charles V phase of the Hundred Years War. Tuchman's book could have been the basis for a good script with Coucy as the main character.

[@MusicalTheatre1011]

I can never understand how Elizabeth turned her back on him and let him suffer in the tower all those years and eventually be executed. She was his cousin and had been raised with him.

[@May-vf4mh]

MusicalTheatre1011 She had to protect her own children and her husband. She and Henry has a very loving and affectionate relationship. Trying to interfere on behalf of her cousin would put her own children at risk. They were trying to dethrone her husband and if that happened she and their children would most likely have been killed too.

[@loonalovegood25]

Everyone on earth would protect their children over a cousin.

[@MusicalTheatre1011]

@@loonalovegood25 Before she had children.

[@MusicalTheatre1011]

@@May-vf4mh Before she had children

[@loonalovegood25]

@@MusicalTheatre1011 Her first kid was born 8 months after her wedding.

[@EM-lz9kg]

. It was thought at the time that Warwick was executed in response to pressure from Ferdinand II of Aragon and Isabella I of Castile, whose daughter, Catherine of Aragon, was to marry Henry's heir, Arthur. Catherine was said to feel very guilty about Warwick's death, and believed that her trials in later life were punishment for it.

[@peterwindhorst5775]

in other words this episode should be called 'entrapment.'

[@loonalovegood25]

Oh Elizabeth if only you knew what a harsh little prince your son would be.

[@empressuchiha5370]

Why didnt elizabeth try to get him out? Instead she let him rot and get executed

[@EM-lz9kg]

Henry vii was faithful to his wife & did not have mistresses, he was openly tearful at Arthur’s death & his wife .

[@EM-lz9kg]

Sadly Earl of Warwick didn’t have the bravest of natures as he had spent majority of his life in the tower

[@MyriamRichardsdotter]

It's interesting how much importance succession and genetic/blood inheritance had back then, even when it wasn't scientifically possible to PROVE paternity. It seems as if it was always possible for some distant cousin could challenge a monarch's claim to the throne, and there would always be some people who were willing to rally behind the claimant.

[@12from121]

Richardians are the 16th century version of holocaust denial. Now with Phillipa blowing their trumpet Richard gets more innocent by the day.

[@idontgiveafaboutyou]

12from121 poor comparison

[@tomjohnson6810]

Warwick's only sister Margaret later became Countess of Salisbury , but she also fell foul of the Tudor's being executed by Henry VIII in 1541 when she was 67 years old. It was mainly because she was a proud descendant of Richard Duke of York and she had produced 4 sons who were loyal catholics and thorns in the side of Henry's plans to divorce his 1st wife and turn England away from Rome.

[@margarettaft2944]

Margaret Countess of Salisbury was the daughter

[@jocelynhamilton7624]

@@margarettaft2944​​⁠There might be a comment that’s been erased to which you’re offering a reply, but, as it stands you seem to be correcting a comment which is perfectly correct, and so I’ll attempt to clarify, less people be confused. Margaret de la Pole (née Plantagenet) was the daughter of George Plantagenet (titled as the Duke of Clarence), brother of both Edward Plantagenet, (titled Edward IV), and Richard Plantagenet (titled Richard III), and therefor a granddaughter of the elder Richard Plantagenet (titled the Duke of York).

[@kaybee6618]

I was able to watch the entire series no problem for 2 years now i can only watch some episodes 8-12 it skips over saying its blocked but all the other episodes play normal. Samething happened to the David Starkey episodes of The bbc version of Monarchy series that I adored for years now foes the same thing blocked now. And the bbc six wives of Henry viii all are unavailable now on KZbin and Netflix.... Why all of a sudden after allowing us to watch their great shows on there royal history do the care about the copyright issues now? Their mostly from the 70's all but David Starkey series.... Makes me sad...

[@saradecapua3264]

I couldn't get episode 9.

[@LB-gz3ke]

I can't get 9, 10, 11 because of copyright issues.

[@dickyboyryw]

Regarding his stammer, i believe the suggestion is that he developed it due to the highly stressfull nature of his situation. But tragic. HVII did, at least, keep him alive for many years after Bosworth.

[@marcokite]

let's remember that HVII murdered an innocent simple young man. Tudor was an upstart and murderer.

[@leanie9660]

Henry's "kindness" in delaying the execution of Edward probably had more to do with "fear of repercussions" than a good nature

[@AmethystEyes]

They had zippers in the back of the dresses (In the white Queen) ! That says it all! haha

[@kaibroeking9968]

The way the character of warden of the Tower, Digby, is written sends a chill down my spine: In the Stanley-episode, he was only a cynic, but still a joker. In this one, the character has become a stone-cold tool of his masters.

[@JonathanFeil]

Reeminds me historically a bit of the eexecution of Mary Queen of Scots. Today we'd call it entrapment. And eliminating Warwick not so much for what he'd done but for the symbol he was to the enemies of the Tudor dynasty. It's also a lesson in how little the King could command in assuring a dynasty -- of three male heirs to the monarchy, only Henry VIII lived to adulthood and progeny. His brother Arthur, featured in this episode, succumbed at 15 to "sweating sickness" -- a distinctly English disease which we still don't fully understand medically. King Edward VI died at 15. probably of tuberculosis. And Queen's Mary and Elizabeth died without heirs. England didn't then suffer another battle of dynastic succession like the Wars of the Roses, but a Civil War and a later mainly bloodless parliamentary coup aginast James II that changed the political structure of the country permanently, through its impact on the power of Parliament to govern.

[@Timelord2001]

I'm trying to understand why exactly 3 episodes of this series, numbers 9, 10, and 11, are blocked because of "copyright" reasons, when we can see the first 8 and the last 2 just fine. It's from 1971; who still needs to monetize it at all? But especially just those 3 episodes? Seems absurd to me.

[@chibuzorokonkwo7039]

There will be no forgiveness for these men that deceived and betrayed Warwick. So unfair

[@robertmoroney3461]

Beware jailhouse informants.

[@bs0u31c3]

Hello Mrs Tudor, episodes 9, 10 and 11 have been blocked in the country I am in, however the other episodes are playing without any problem. Please can you fix it? I am enjoying this series,thanks for the uploads.

[@jardon8636]

2 companion books, with this fantastic series.. the red prince by helen clark... & the beaufourts by nathen amin... the common ancestor, the red prince or john of gaunt-born in ghent,,... son of edward III ... house of lancaster, the beaufourt dynasty,, the spanish & portuguese royal families, a queen of portgual, a queen of norway, denmark, a duchess of burgundy...2 queens of scotland, a archduchess of austria... the house of york ancestor was joan countess of westmorland nee beaufourt--neville so catherine of aragon, catarina d aragon.... from spain, was a distant cousin to countess of richmond magaret beaufort, king henry VII & king henry VIII tudor queen eleanor of aquitaine , also queen consort of france & england and duchess of aquitaine, daughter leonor or eleanor of castille... queen consort of castille... married to king alfonso VIII.. leonor grandaughter of empress matilda lady catherine gordon, the wife of PERKIN WARBEK... her story needs its own series, a book etc...

[@EM-lz9kg]

Earl of Warwick did have disabilities due to being kept in confinement for so long . Being the son of Edward’s brother he became a poor pawn after Richard 111 died . They make out Richard 111 to be a tyrant he wasn’t , that was propaganda to ensure the Tudor line was cemented . Shakespeare was commissioned by Elizabeth 1st so he had to present Richard 111 as this deformed Machiavellian monster . Now he’s body has been discovered he wasn’t a hunchback at all & was tall like Edward

[@jocelynhamilton7624]

While I cannot comment on the height of Richard III, I must assure you in spite of the fact that the degree to to which one might have scoliosis has no effect whatsoever on whether or not one might also be evil, that Richard Plantagenet (titled Richard III) did indeed suffer from scoliosis. That said, while William Shakespeare did indeed write a terribly conceived historical play about Richard Plantagenet which squired a disturbing degree of popularity, the misdeeds of Richard Plantagenet and their exploitation and occasional exaggeration precede Shakespeare’s lifetime by several decades. One of the more well known early anti-York, pro-Tudor historians was Thomas More, but I imagine there might be many more such biased historians on whose works Shakespeare likely drew.

[@EM-lz9kg]

Warwick should of ask for a direct interview with Henry Tudor & been exiled as Henry had in Burgundy. It weighed on Catherine of Aragon his death . I’m not religious yet maybe due to this , Catherine went through so much hardship first after Arthur died & was herself 7 years like a prisoner broke in England & then the reformation & cast aside by Henry viii

[@EM-lz9kg]

Earl of Warwick’s father had a terrible death , he attempted to throw his brother off his thrown Edward . George Plantagenet, duke of Clarence, (born Oct. 21, 1449, Dublin-died Feb. 18, 1478, London), English nobleman who engaged in several major conspiracies against his brother King Edward IV (ruled 1461-70 and 1471-83).

[@MrsTudor1]

Just ask Edward III.

Too many heirs can be a problem?

[@graphiquejack]

yes... ask Henry II

[@KenyanBunnie]

Where can I watch Episodes 9, 10, 11?????!!

[@D_Marrenalv]

Exactly!

[@joanhuffman2166]

I think this episode has been labeled number 12, but it is an earlier episode

[@joannrizkowski5985]

Why can't I watch episodes 9, 10, or 11? :(

[@MrsTudor1]

Geoblocked by KZbin, sadly. I will try to reupload, but I'm worried about my channel getting nuked for copyright infringement.

[@EM-lz9kg]

Can anyone put episode 9/10/11 up pls

[@lexigrimhaive]

Does anyone else know where to watch episodes 9 thru 11? They’re blocked in my country :(

[@D_Marrenalv]

Can't find them here in the US either.

[@lindsaygrieve4384]

Just curious... why did they block eps 9-11 ?

[@theminx386]

This episode is no 10 not 12.

[@Invisibleplqnetsmusic]

Edward V died when he was twelve under order of Richard III

[@MissusTudor]

I didn't make it past the first episode. Utter cack.

[@leanie9660]

Eh ? This is the 12th episode. Did you spend your precious moments making silly comments on all of these episodes ?

[@idontgiveafaboutyou]

So many Richard lll haters in the comments when he’s not even on this show, just mentioned😂😂same with the Yorkists

[@Dryadkal]

Were the two princes not murdered in the tower together under Richard the 3? Who is this Warbeck stuttering youth then?

[@MrsTudor1]

Warbeck's just a pretender.

[@Dryadkal]

@@MrsTudor1 yes I know one of them was, but the poor anxious young man who was so afraid and dependant on his jailor, I didn't know who he was, but I read on wiki he was a distant cousin and not one of the two princes. Still a sad story. Thanks for uploading the series, first time I saw them and I loved it!

[@TheStellabystarlite]

He was Clarence’s son, (Richard iii brother)! Everyone used to refer to him as poor stupid Clarence. When his brother Edward was king , he made him so upset (treasonous acts) that he had Clarence executed by drowning him in marmsy wine. The boy is the Earl of Warwick.