The Terror - Sir John Ross Warns Franklin

[@mehmeh9663]

There will be nothing. You hear? Nothing lives there. Nothing grows. You’ll eat your shoes again... You’ll eat worse... Amazing lines!!! And great to see reference to Franklin’s previous ‘coppermine expedition’ - which was just as incredible as his final one. Would be great for the film makers to make a film out of that as well.

[@MrChickennugget360]

what is great about this scene is how it Mirrors Blanky's and FitzJames scene much later on where Blanky talks about what REALLY happened on Sir John Ross's expedition.

[@meganjohnson2265]

I think Hickey was based on Michel Terohaute, a crew member on the Coppermine expedition. He would disappear for periods with other members and return solo only with meat from game he'd apparently hunted. He claimed the crew had been killed in the excursion by the animals... When in fact they were probably eating human meat Terohaute had harvested. This was the theory of Fleming, who researched journals/diaries kept by Richardson who executed him (for cannibalism).

[@docwolf1561]

​@@meganjohnson2265would love to have a long conversation about lost expeditions under the auroras with you...❤❤

[@michaelamend3637]

He was looking out for him. Trying to get him to see that it’s not a game. There is nothing.

[@3DSDF]

He could immediately tell that John wasn’t taking it seriously when John had looked confused about a rescue plan.

[@Pat4ever.]

There is the sea, the open sea

[@thenumbah1birdman]

Some things: 1. "Van Demien's Land" refers to Sir John's 6 year stint as governor of Tasmania. John was well-liked by Tasmania's residents, setting up education centers and such for the populace, but he rubbed certain political interests the wrong way and his immediate subordinate, John Montagu, managed to convince Sir John's superiors in England to recall him by having multiple journalists and other associates slander him. The people of Tasmania gave him a hero's farewell, massing at the docks to wave him goodbye as he sailed off. Regardless of the truth of the matter it shattered Franklin's reputation. 2. " Sir John Ross' Poor captaining" refers to the time Sir John Ross got to the entrance of the northwest passage, saw clouds, MISTOOK THEM FOR MOUNTAINS, marked them down, and sailed home declaring there was no passage. IT may also refer to the Fury Beach incident, where John Ross's ship HMS Fury ran aground when icelocked, forcing him and his men to walk out on foot until rescued by whalers. I really do find it odd they chose someone like John Ross for this scene and not the more respected William Parry or the confrontational George Back. John Ross was Franklin's good friend in reality, and it something like this happened in real life it would probably have been far more respectful and casual-especially given that, aside from their friendship, Franklin had better success at mapping the missing bits of the passage by land than Ross did at sea. 3. "Jane's psycho-smile": Jane Franklin was very assertive and socially smart, and while Franklin himself was considered quite bright he was very socially awkward, leaving Jane to do the talking. Jane was very keen to further their name and status in society and she saw the passage as the key to it. 4. "Eat your boots" refers to Franklin's first expedition by land in the 1820's. Left underprepared by the admiralty, inexperienced and naiive with the area and the people, and having to kowtow with various different rivals native tribes and fur companies, Franklin soon found himself starving and short 11 men, forcing him to eat his boots. Some other members may have committed cannibalism. Learning from this Franklin returned properly prepared in 1825 and completed a very successful overland expedition to map parts of the passage by.

[@springyslinky2190]

Pfft, look at this history nerd. NEEERRRD.

[@victoriadiesattheend.8478]

Thank you for explaining all this to people. Though I and I'm sure a lot of other Franklin obsessed expedition people (like yourself 😊) remember these facts well, a lot of the audience has no idea and you gave a lot of needed backstory!

[@nikosgreek352]

Mistook them for mountains.....ahahahahahahahaha

[@131alexa]

Re no. 2, "mistook them for mountains" - It's been suggested that Ross might have been seeing a mirage (Fata Morgana)

[@thenumbah1birdman]

@@GLARebel That doesn't necessarily mean they have to carry it over into the show verbatim. The show diverges from the book in a great many ways.

[@bananabrooks3836]

I loved it, the soundtrack, the bleak darkness, the low suns 'dogs' mistyness, fabulous atmospherics.

[@FS-my4wv]

One of my favorite scenes of an incredible series. There is an underlying sense of dread that is perfectly maintained throughout.

[@alejandroalonsom9065]

"...and a hundred and thirty-four starved men will turn devil against you, starting with the ones you hold closest" Chills

[@leraw99]

I'd like to think that Sir John Ross understands that his expedition not ending in complete catastrophe was an absolute miracle, if they hadn't somehow stumbled upon a shipwreck with supplies they would surely have done everything he said, maybe they already had before that. He knows the odds of John's ships getting icelocked are high, and he knows the odds of a similar rescue is astronomically low. He's almost desperately telling John to be prepared, that going into it with the same attitude that Ross originally had, and which he sees in John, is tantamount to suicide, but John has experience from a previous expedition. He knows that things can go bad, but he survived it once. That was a land expedition, though, and I reckon there's a big difference between walking across land and being icelocked in a gigantic pack of ice - no land for things to grow on, for animals to graze. Only white as far as the eye can see, drifting on the sea to god knows where. Also, take note on the colour grading. Sir John's memories of him and his wife, and of his encounter with Sir John Ross, are vibrant and bright, but when it cuts back to reality it's dark and muted - a bleak colour palette for a bleak reality.

[@mattavery7581]

This scene really demonstrates how naive Franklin was. He brushes Ross off thinking he's playing politics but he doesn't realise that he's actually trying to give him sound advice from personal experience.

[@3DSDF]

And that dude was 100% correct. We even see the first sign when one of the men tries to eat his boot.

[@connormclernon26]

His wife is the reason that people thought the expedition DIDN'T resort to cannibalism for the longest time.

[@helenhoward5346]

Well she was trying to preserve her husband's reputation. Can you blame her? Victorian Britain couldn't handle such measures of desperation.

[@victoriadiesattheend.8478]

Really she irritates me on multiple levels, Lady Jane. And I mean the real one. Her husband turned out to have died LONG BEFORE anyone in the expedition need have resorted to cannibalism. So her crusade to discredit John Rae (the man who made the effort to get to know the Inuit people and brought back their testimony), including using Charles Dickens to criticize and attack him, rubs me the wrong way and proves that for an intelligent woman she wasn't very practical.

[@KingKhanate1997]

Funny how it would appear in hindsight she didn’t need to preserve it anyway. I’m fairly certain Franklin died of unknown causes before the crew walked out and resorted to eating each other.

[@Noblebird02]

@@KingKhanate1997 yet Crozier who probably was the captain who made the march decision; Has the better reputation in the 21st century than Franklin

[@MrChickennugget360]

@@victoriadiesattheend.8478 she would not know that John Franklin had died until McClintock found the Victory point message. in the late 1850s

[@michaelr3583]

I love the eery music of this scene. "You'll eat your shoes again, you'll eat worse.😱 Crazy foreshadowing

[@hekt0r252]

YES! Was looking all over for this clip

[@scarletcrusade77]

Blackfish escaped the siege at river run and joined the admiralty

[@RadeonX0X]

Along with his no-good nephew and Mance.

[@JustABoringAsianGuy]

Season 8 is sad, but good memories still with us.

[@markperalta7722]

Holy shit is that blackfish 😯😯😯

[@theoveranalyzingcinephile983]

@@markperalta7722 Yup, and Edmure and Mance are here too in case you missed them.

[@markperalta7722]

@@theoveranalyzingcinephile983 no i knew Franklin and fitzjames are mance and edmure but did not catch that ross was blackfish maybe because he looks so clean here 😁😁😁

[@Meetthekiller7]

Even if this particular scene/Sir John Ross' presence in London at the time is historically inaccurate (Having learned from the History Buffs video that he was apparently in Norway as British Consul), I still adore this scene and Ross' presence in the show overall: he, like Crozier, serves as an excellent foil to Franklin's naïveté/over-optimism/unbound imperialism, someone who really gets just how deadly the arctic wastelands can be.

[@hebanker3372]

He may had visited London for a few days.It's not like he was stranded in Norway.

[@redcardinalist]

@@hebanker3372Fair point

[@alerojas2952]

​@@hebanker3372may have, uncouth toad.

[@joshuak5958]

Rasping, spooky bastard... They should've had him command the expedition. He'd have glowered at the Tuunbaq, and it would have wimpered off.

[@benogurok5175]

His voice, Crozier's acid look and Blanky's laugh combined, would have driven any living and non-living creature away in seconds.

[@paulmartinez594]

The music is so beautiful, but it remains a midterm to this day

[@johnnumber1]

Finally found the clip, thanks.

[@KingKhanate1997]

Even knowing how things turn out in the end, here I can’t help but feel bad for Sir John. He seemed a good man, and decent in my opinion but a combination of his admittedly spotty leadership and simple shitty luck (like his governorship in Tasmania) have evidently haunted him and his career. This expedition is his final chance at redemption, to clear his name and retire gracefully as the man who discovered the fabled Northwest Passage. He is *so* desperate to have a lasting, positive legacy. Damn shame how things turned out…

[@wwallace0071]

Very well Spoken my friend

[@Captain-Axeman]

Sir John Ross was absolutely right.

[@zil1832]

That was fictional.

[@rbnzo25]

I wonder why he was right

[@wanghiskhan7345]

I'm listening to the audiobook now, he goes into even more detail about making Sir John feel so stupid for no safety plan and John is so bullish about saying he doesn't need one

[@gyrozeppeli8940]

When someone from my tropical country asks about what it's like studying in Canada

[@131alexa]

1:05 "that monkey is female" - traditionally considered unlucky on board ship. Similarly later one of the sailors says that the presence of a girl on a boat is "spooky"

[@simon5045]

Who thought naming ships Terror and Erebus(personification of darkness in Greek mythology) was a good idea.

[@131alexa]

@@simon5045 They were Royal Navy bomb vessels - the names were supposed to strike fear into the hearts of the enemy!

[@skullsaintdead]

I was enthralled by S1, then disappointed and quit 2 episodes into S2, but I long for a Terror S3 based on Australia (Terra Nullius). Ideally, either the Burke and Willis failed expedition or the horrific Batavia shipwreck, off WA's coast. The Franklin expedition was indeed milder in comparison to Batavia, even in this somewhat fictionalised version. To think what men will do when they believe there are no consequences for their actions, against women and children too. Horrific. Most of the Batavia now sits in the WA Shipwreck Museum in Freo, well worth a look.

[@benogurok5175]

About Burke expedition: one of the Franklin's crew, Gibson, had a relative who died on that jorney.

[@levil7324]

Isn't there just 1 season? 10 episodes 1 season?

[@skullsaintdead]

@@levil7324 There are two seasons of The Terror but the 1st season (episodes 1-10) is the only one that deals with the Franklin Expedition. The 2nd season is not anywhere near as good, it's about the internment camps for the Japanese living in the US during WWII. While an admirable decision, to highlight the historical blight on the US from these camps, it just doesn't work (it's all jump scares, poor acting, writing, there's nothing deep or meaningful there, just using the good name of The Terror to sell a sub-par TV show, making it into S2).

[@3digitsonthebac156]

im pretty sure that was another guy, Alfred Gibson, who didnt go on the Burke WIlls expedition but did vanish out in the desert, the gibson desert is named after him@@benogurok5175

[@WQuantrill]

“Sir John Ross never knew how close he came.” It sounds like Sir John Ross is acutely aware of how close he came 😂

[@chriscoogan3585]

I think you are right, but im not so sure if Sir John Ross understands WHY he came so close.

[@tazindayanslothrop68]

I honestly love this scene. There are tens of thousands of better scenes in cinema history and yet....this one stays with me. The music is perfect. I've never been THAT far north, bout 900 miles south... I honestly can't believe the horror that faced these sailors realizing there was no way forward and no quick way back..

[@Adski975]

Completely and totally agree. Many scenes in cinema stick out to me, this is one of them. This whole series was just so beautifully constructed, shot, directed and acted. The early episodes were filled with eerie scenes like this. Later on, the scenes became more 'terror-oriented', if you will. Not that there was anything wrong with the later episodes, I just really liked the early episodes' feel of impending doom and the feeling of dread in the air making everyone act aloof. Eerie is just the word to describe these scenes. Ever since I've watched this series some 1 or 2 months ago I've been intrigued by the story of the Franklin expedition. The mystery of it all coupled with the Victorian setting just puts the cherry ontop. An era full of such eccentrism and horror perfect for horror. Man, I love old mysteries since the age of them make them more mysterious and creepy. Truly a great scene!

[@redcardinalist]

This for me sums up the series, it's jhust very disturbing overall. It sticks in the memory

[@franklinmint7394]

Great TV series 👏 wish it went longer

[@michaelr3583]

I know, especially since we know the expedition survived atleast another 2 years before the last 4 survivors disappered to walk south

[@BlauRFasan]

Brynden Tully lecturing the King Beyond the Wall on the harshness of the North, preposterous !

[@mariuszmiroslaw2290]

or Mace leaves Riverrun to join the Night Watch in 276 AC 😅

[@geraldtong4414]

Everyone fears the Black Fish including Cesar and Jaime Lannister.

[@victoriadiesattheend.8478]

O Death/Where is thy sting -Peglar Papers, recovered from the Franklin Expedition,1845.

[@massgeneral9873]

behind every great man...

[@truth__hurts]

I wish we’d gotten a series that had the same level of production and cast without involving CGI polar bears. Seeing Sir John mutinied by his own crew and murdered would’ve been way more impactful than getting killed off early by an off screen magical polar bear.

[@Naberius359]

I struggled with this also, given that the show deals with real events. But I think the Tuunbaq makes it seem like the crew triumphed over **something.** Imagine how bleak the show would have been if it was done straight. Plus, the Inuit add a lot to the story.

[@truth__hurts]

@@Naberius359 I understand why the Tunnbaaq was implemented. However, I think it would've been better if they'd played it up as a figment of the crew's imagination having gone mad from lead poisoning and the cold. If there were multitude of eerie creatures and things moving around in the mist and dark, with the crew going absolute bananas. That much I can guess happened to a degree, but a terribly noticable CGI polar bear killing off half the characters suspended the realness of the show.

[@RichardTaylor1800]

I've seen this take before, and I hate it. The Tuunbaq is basically why the novel was written in the first place--it's a horror story, not simply an imaginative retelling of the deaths of those men. It's also an excellent metaphor for the biggest theme in both the show and the book, representing the hostility of a desolate land toward naive and foolhardy explorers (men so confident in their technology and empire that they only rarely deigned to learn from the indigenous population). Think about Hickey's death without the Tuunbaq: instead of being a man with delusions of godhood who thinks he can tame a violent spirit beast you would prefer if he, what, got mauled by a regular polar bear? That'd take all the poetry out of that scene. If Franklin died to mutiny then the character dynamics would have to be completely changed--the narrative would have to portray him as a simple martinet, rather than a well-rounded, intelligent figure, and Crozier and Fitzjames would presumably need to be in on the mutiny, which would throw off the whole development of those characters. And if they weren't in on it, and somehow put down the mutiny afterward, well you're on well-trod territory there, rather than anything new and interesting. As far as the other thing you said, in which Tuunbaq is just a figment of their imagination--that idea is lazy and unsatisfying. Takes something unknowable and unsettling and turns it into an outdated and frankly boring conception of mental illness. No. Tuunbaq is not just a "magical polar bear," it is central to the story, to the characters, and to the meaning of the whole thing. This weird anti-speculative fiction perception is irritating and adds nothing. It insists on rehashing old ideas rather than taking risks to tell more compelling stories.

[@Naberius359]

@@RichardTaylor1800 Wow. Well said.

[@basketball7515]

@@RichardTaylor1800 period

[@TimaScribbles]

An old sailors' superstition is that it's bad luck to have a woman on board a ship. I was wondering if maybe that's why Sir John seems uneasy when the monkey is revealed, and remarks that it's a female.

[@nikosgreek352]

I suspect this superstition was created based on several (now forgotten by all) occasions where women were brought aboard and it resulted in numerous deaths, crimes and mutinies. Not because women are "unlucky" but because putting females on a ship full of sex starved men who might be away from land for years at a time is just asking for....something. Rape, murders between rivals for her affections, mutinies because the captain/officers keep the women to themselves, perhaps even something as prosaic as accidents happening when the seamen were trying to impress the women. Stereotypes like this do not appear in the void. They are usually created through the circulation of numerous anecdotes over many generations in many different lands. Over time the original incidents are forgotten but the knowledge that this or that is a "bad idea" remains.

[@melodybaoin1425]

​@@nikosgreek352 late to the party but true. Even the non-superstitious sailors say it's not a good idea to bring a girl to a ship. Most women who works in the marine industry is likely to stay in the office. Not out of prejudice mind you but safety. Especially if the ships will be sailing six to many months a year.

[@nikosgreek352]

@@melodybaoin1425 Its probably for the best. The laws of human nature dont change. Why take pointless risks?

[@michaelr3583]

@nikosgreek352 Great synopsis. I always fugured likewise ​

[@Freaknovitch]

I have a hard time describing Franklin's face in the dining room. He looks almost sick with anxiety

[@kaidiekaidie1825]

This TV show might have some of the best lighting and colour grading I have seen it is amazing. Only Roger Deakins is Better.

[@braxxian]

I am a Tasmanian and our state is littered with buildings that carry the names of Jane and Sir John Franklin. He was a well regarded governor who sadly fell foul of political backstabbing. As for the passage, Franklin was 59 when the expedition started and really to old to be captaining such a voyage and had practically no sea experience in the arctic. He was hardly the admiralty’s first choice.

[@nikosgreek352]

I like to imagine the Tuunbaq as Franklin's pet tasmanian devil.

[@Veryrary]

Any idea of the soundtrack ?

[@doomer66]

Anyone know the title of the music during this scene? (If its been released at all)

[@GhANeC]

But the king beyond the wall doesn’t listen to a black fish, does he…

[@mariuszmiroslaw2290]

Literally Blackfish meets Mance ''I'm dissapointed''

[@Vercingetorix.Fantasia]

This show had no need being any bit about science fiction . Damn. Still great

[@carterjones8126]

Reality can often be more horrifying than fiction. If these sailors who survived the Arctic for 3 year's, resorted to the worst taboo of all, cannibalism, in the end; then it makes you wonder what would've happened to lesser men?

[@sirjohnfranklingaming]

You know what, John Ross? Nobody asked for your opinion.

[@cannon26ify]

Sir John should have listened to the Blackfish on this one.

[@LeoArenales18]

We do not kneel

[@silviamonte4512]

❤🐒

[@EL20078]

What rescue plan could he have had???

[@scarletcrusade77]

Sending a rescue party to the presumed location if they didn't hear back from them in X amount of years? Perhaps both ships men make the journey South to Canadian mainland as suggested by Crozier? There's lots that can be made

[@wanghiskhan7345]

Book goes a lot more indepth to this need - just shows that men may tend to prioritize glory

[@itsmylife2624]

Cairns marking their way

[@mikelemonsmasher9946]

Me talking to my ex girlfriends new boyfriend