The TRUTH About Home Assistant [Vs SmartThings]

[@manicmods]

Needed to get this one off my chest! I'm probably going to anger a few Home Assistant users, but hoping we can laugh at our falls together. Let me know what you think! 😅

[@Frem_Kra]

Nope - one of the more healthy sane comments i have seen especially considering current shape of HA.

[@martinrocket1436]

Not a Home Assistant user yet. I'm going to set it up now.

[@patrickd9551]

No not really, but I would like to say the biggest truth about different home automation solutions is the amount of privacy and flexibility you are willing to give up. Yes, money is the easy one, less work means more investment. That's only fair in my opinion. You either invest time or money, easy tradeoff. But there is more to consider. But privacy specifically is rare. I do not want to be reliant on external services and give away my data to companies that have less then stellar opinions about user privacy. I don't want to be dependent on my internet connection either. And thus far the best option I have found is Home Assistant in that regard. Flexibility is objective, but there are many options outside of the "simple automation goals", so I won't cover those. And the final cherry: Support. There have been many semi-smart products over the years that were reliant on the cloud that either closed down their API eco system (forcing their own cloud platform), raising prices and out right bricking products by not supporting them anymore (the 400 dollar baby monitor comes to mind). Brandon Jackson might also have a word of two to say on the support part :) That's why I use products that are fully localized or even self-built like my ESPhome light switches that even don't depend on HA for their primary function. But if you are willing to trade that, you just do you. On a personal level I'm more then willing to invest my time if that means I can be free. It also offers me the opportunity to teach my sons practical life skills like building things and programming. My six year old the other day soldered his first resistors on a PCB. Couldn't be more proud 🤩

[@alexruffell]

7 yrs with ST and I quit because it was becoming an increasingly walled garden. I quit 2 or 3 years ago so just before ST became a bit more "local". It was slow, frustratingly cloud dependent, and extremely limited in what it could do without external tools such as Actiontiles and Webcore (both cloud based). HA is indeed harder to learn but what you portray as drawbacks is actually what I love most of HA! I can build my home automation as I want it and not have to bend to Samsung's design / will. As for automations, I use Node Red within HA and the possibilities are endless and super powerful. I have more than 300 "things" (zwave, zigbee, wifi, esphome, Unifi gear, voice assistants, applications, etc) integrated which was, and maybe still is, unthinkable with ST (not much for the quantity but the variety of "things"). ST was primarily designed for small ecosystems, at the time they said their average user had 15 devices, and their application was definitely geared towards low numbers of devices. In HA I have about 50 dashboards and I don't need the cloud for them to work which I don't believe is the case with Actiontiles. I am not saying ST is bad... it is surely an easier solution for those who are not technically inclined or don't want to invest time in their system to get exactly what they want (again... not what ST wants or allows...). Last... I love that I can run HA on whatever hardware I want, and that I can replace the radios (zigbee, zwave, thread, etc) as new technologies emerge. Try that with ST... you are stuck to their glacial hardware and software development pace. HA might break every so often (there is room for improvement) but development is lightning fast. Love it! Your video hit on a number of good points but it is also skewed significantly from your perspective (sounds like you want an easier, lower maintenance, more basic option) so I would not call it "The TRUTH".

[@manicmods]

Read every word, and appreciate them Alex. 300 is a good collection of devices! I have over 100, and that's just in a 1800 sq. foot house, so I can relate to them adding up quick. I definitely miss webcore, and will be pivoting to my Hubitat C8 (getting dusty on the shelf) in the next year. A lot of the breakage in HA comes from lack of real partnership with manufacturers. I think ST and HA will continue to find a middle ground, but don't feel HA will ever be any type of official solution until manufacturers take it seriously and provide more APIs. Protocols continue to change and break the more sophisticated integrations we work hard for. I don't mind putting in the work, but I don't like redoing work. Even as a hobby, I found it exhausting.

[@alexruffell]

@@manicmods In my experience with HA (~3 years now) the things that break are due to the fast pace of development and the fact that the incredible number of integrations are provided by contributors that then have to update their contributions to work with the updated core. If one doesn't chase the latest version hanging back a few versions it may be possible to reduce this issue but the few times it happened to me, it was fixed within a week or less. Samsung may have more leverage with manufacturers for "official" integrations but what I was able to integrate exploded in number moving to HA from ST... but I get your point, and agree that manufacturers will be more cooperative as userbase grows.

[@devinhedge]

@@alexruffell It just occurred to me that HA is and isn't using a decent microservices API. Generally there should always be 3 versions of an API, the last version in production, the current version in production, and the beta version in production (with feature toggles/switches). Then the plug-ins wouldn't break, but have time to evolve a little more slowly. Maybe that exists now. I just keep up as that isn't my day job. Because that isn't my day job, I really respect a respectful treatment of the volatile nature of HA vs ST vs. Hubitat. Great video @manicmods

[@alistairtravels]

I been using HA for a few years now started on an rpi3->odroid->vm. For me the best part is to be able to integrate a lot of devices by making my own(esphome). Also integrated my solar system(solark) to my pool(pump, lights, waterfalls). I have been able to make devices for my garage opener, fridge, pool, led strips, washer, drier, hyperion, etc. I also run frigate with AI monitoring for 9 cameras. With the vm running on a Proxmox server with full daily backups. For me the best automations are being able to do climate control depending on my solar system battery status, even turning everything off if the power goes out depending on the SOC.

[@manicmods]

My favorite part of automations are the home made devices! Give me a soldering gun and some zigbee relays, and I am a happy man 🙂 Your setup sounds super sweet!

[@8760-x8z]

I moved from ST after 5 years of use to HA several months ago. If I had to compare the experience between the two, I would say this. I never got to a point of feeling like I had a stable configuration with Smartthings. I felt I was constantly chasing after problems because of cloud issues, ST upgrades and work around’s to get what I was going after which was a stable environment that also passed the wife factor. Setting up HA was certainly more difficult and I was constantly accessing HA user sites and KZbin for help. Thankfully the answers were there and I quickly created the stable environment I was chasing with ST. Now the only reason I play with my HA environment is to look on creating improvements or adding additional devices. More importantly, it just plain works which checks off the wife factor In the end, I find HA to be a much better environment than ST and worth the initial time investment. I’m running an RP 4 with external SSD and have not experienced any lag whatsoever. It’s actually quicker in response compared to cloud based ST. ST may be the best choice for you but I feel HA is nowhere near the bad choice as you describe.

[@manicmods]

Appreciate this input, the external SSD is critical w/ Rpi. Resetting a house of devices for environment change is brutal! I originally had HomeSeer HS3 before I adopted Hubitat then HA. I moved to ST since I was about to abandon Smart Home all together. ST has been very good to me. Device compatibility is more limited, but I have never seen any notable lag, cloud or local. These days, it's instant even with using ST app which technically uses cloud. Automations have gotten a lot more powerful, but yes, I still end up implementing work arounds I'd probably not have to tackle w/ HA. I've given this video a lot of thought, and tbh I tend to agree with your last statement. Everything always seemed worse case scenario so that's how my video came out. Sorry if it felt a bit too salty 😬

[@icebread9335]

I can relate to the stability issue. but I've never played with st, instead with Philips hue. the dependence to the cloud broke my smart home a bunch of times, updates where a huge problem, so much in fact that it completely wiped my setup 2 times, and I had to start again from the beginning. I hope no one experienced something similar with st, but the possibility is there that something like this could happen everyday. in contrast to home assistant.

[@cloudripper4926]

As a HA user, it's great to see a channel showing capabilities of other systems, and these are fair criticisms of HA. I originally tried SmartThings many years ago because I wanted something that "just works", but switched to HA b/c what I wanted to work it couldn't do. I expect ST has improved vastly since I tried it. I know HA has and I almost never touch yaml now. I still prefer to not invest time in home control and want it to "just work", which is why I also do not sink time in my dashboard. I do have a slight sense of fomo when viewing those others, but I never access my dash anyway because I subscribe to the theory "if you need a dashboard to use your smart home, it's not smart, you just moved the on/off button." gl with the channel!

[@manicmods]

Appreciate ur comment! ST has definitely improved over the years. Their commitment to local control kept me there until recently moving to Hubitat. I'm much happier as it's between ST and HA in terms of complexities and compatibility. I definitely hear u regarding dashboards. That's where I totally screwed my instance up. And yes, my video was a bit salty as a result. I was going for a Peter Griffin Grind my Gears and came off a bit pretentious. But it's all apart of the journey. Thank you for being a part of it!

[@Rafael4]

As someone who used home assistant, then stopped because it was too hard and it would break all the time, I can say this is not what is happening anymore, it does take a bit of time to learn but it's getting easier every with update. I have a few non-basic automations and didn't use yaml on any of them, they were all created through the UI. The only cases you have to use YAML or Jinja is for things that no other platform are able to do, so I believe it is reasonable that it's a bit harder to set up. That being said, Home Assistant is a project still being developed, breaking changes are part of it, and recently they've changed their rules for deprecating things so when they do release breaking changes you have a long time to change before they actually break

[@manicmods]

This is all great news. The beginning of video was very real for me, as I know it's only a matter of time before I try again. I thought I'd be bulletproof last round since I used ST as many do to integrate devices. But next iteration will definitely be like my first, no ST and everything centralized in HA. ST has treated me so well otherwise I would have switched already 😅

[@devinhedge]

The last couple major releases have been interesting because they have added variables and such from the HACS community as core soft device types and such so the amount of hacking YAML and Jinja is getting smaller and smaller.

[@Saturn2888]

I can totally relate. I've spent most of the last few weeks doing Home Assistant and trying to get it just right. There are so many things to learn, and it's hard to find information on how to do things. I guess everyone just uses everyone else's automations, but I want something that works for me.

[@Saturn2888]

@@ingulari3977 I use Home Assistant. I'm creating scripts with fields to reduce repetition and have kinda gotten a setup that I can reuse when needed. I hope this'll be simpler in the future.

[@uSlackr]

So you wrote your last automation in HA, when? Seems as though you are talking about HA from a few years back. And you seem to think in depth documentation is a bad thing. That Zigbee document includes config info plus in-depth content new users will not likely need. Seriously, spending a day with HA puts you in no place to review the current state vs something 4 years ago. Grow your channel with positive content. There are legitimate challenges with HA and the first 6 minutes of the video found none of them.

[@manicmods]

Hi Greg! Scripting is largely unchanged w/ exception of library growth. If you're referring to GUI, I specify improvement vs 4 yrs ago. In depth documentation isn't a bad thing- I write it for a living. What's unfortunate is requiring such extensive effort for simple tasks. First 6m discloses pain from my own and other experiences. Also highest level vulnerability possible, unique to HA. Agreed, there are other legitimate challenges. Plenty of positivity in my channel; thanks for watching!

[@uSlackr]

@@manicmods Scripting is largely unchanged, but the need for it is greatly diminished with the strength of the updated automation UI. You are making it sound harder than it is.

[@uSlackr]

@@manicmods As for the vulnerability - it was handled quickly and correctly once it became known. While you mentioned the 2 security staffers at ST, you didn't mention the 24 paid staffers at nabu casa working on HA full-time. All of HA is open source so others can hunt for bugs.

[@Frem_Kra]

Not much changed from 4 years and that is visible. And "security" of HA is also seriously questionable.

[@MattKurkowski]

​@@Frem_Kra a ton has changed. I'm constantly having to remove things from my configuration.yaml because it's now built into the program. The only code I ever write is from custom things that are usually extra and not required.

[@Saturn2888]

What's interesting about this video is that all the time I've spent with Home Assistant is less time I needed to spend writing my own solution. Not saying you're wrong. If you're a regular dude and start with Home Assistant, it will suck away your life. On the other hand, I don't have time to write my own code to do what Home Assistant does, but that's exactly what I was doing for years until I found out about this incredible project! All I was handling were buttons, lights, and wall outlets; not even motion sensors. Home Assistant opened up the world for me! Sounds like any Hub platform could've offered the same though. A month ago, a Linux update made my whole software stop working after an hour. Instead of debugging all that, I finally switched to something else. Phew! It's actually a load off my hands to learn Home Assistant, and it's much quicker to learn than writing a bunch of code myself. On the other hand, I have to learn it, and that takes time. And you _still_ have to go into YAML files sometimes, especially for Blueprints, one of the most important features you'd wanna write and debug yourself.

[@jamesmcmahonii8433]

There's a certain type of community that uses Home Assistant. It's similar to the Apple community. Never. I enjoy live.

[@RetiredParatrooper]

I abandoned Home Assistant because it's a labyrinth inside of a rabbit hole. User guides provide too many options and of the additional apps, excuse me, integrations, or is it services, VS, JSON, YAML, Docker, Debian..... wait, where was I and why do I have 5 browsers open with 25 tabs each, and why......

[@manicmods]

I will never break even from my investments of time in HA relative to time saved from automations. But I do think HA is making progress, at least that's what many are reporting 🤞. Thanks for watching!

[@bluestek]

Definitely love hate relationship with HA, but I couldn't go back to anything else. I code for my day job and having full control of my home is just amazing! That said yaml sucks and I hate working with it. I really want a node based ui/automation editor (and yes I use node red, but node red is more of a node event system then node coding system.) like unreal for home automation. Still I took a few days and programed a custom integration for my vacuum that works with its map and man is it amazing to have! I do have to agree through unless you want to take the deep dive stick with something that will look good out of the box.

[@manicmods]

Dude the integrations are other worldly. Since I posted this video, KZbin is just flaunting me with more everyday 😆 Kudos to you for leveraging your skillsets, it's definitely the ideal scenario as you probably breeze thru stuff that takes me days to wrap my head around. Thanks for watching!

[@andybrice2711]

YAML is great for data serialization. But yeah, the way its used in Home Assistant still feels utterly unintuitive to me, and I'm fairly good at computer programming.

[@MAMDAVEM]

I've been a HA user for over 5 years now and what you say is true. HA is being actively developed and you have to stay on-board and update every month or things will stop working and when you do update I find that things stop working. The more you go into the rabbit hole the deeper it gets. I really enjoy by HA hobby but sometimes it is very frustrating, if it was not for the fact I'm retired and can largely choose what I spend my time on, I don't think I would have enough time to feed my addiction.

[@manicmods]

It's enjoyable until it's not 😅 I'd definitely be tinkering more with it if I had the time. Appreciate ya!

[@headerahelix]

I use HA and you're honestly not wrong. I use Samsung devices but have barely ever used Smartthings. If it can be done locally it honestly removes my need for HA.

[@johnelliott9823]

I use ha for integration I use node red for 100% of my automation and dashboarding Also I use a mini pc as opposed to a pi I just do patches now my setup just works But to do my thing it helps to understand the tech involved (python, yaml, docker, Linux, node, react, html, CSS, JavaScript, various network protocols). Then it's straightforward, but these areas of knowledge represent some sweat equity, I was lucky enough to have worked in IT using most of that stuff and reading tech manuals is a familiar process. For an absolute beginner it's like a college course but with no tutors. However if you do have that comfort level HA is great! If you grock dynamic DNS you don't have to pay Nabu Casa but I do anyway because I can

[@drumboy256]

Thank you, you just saved me a 500+ hour rabbit hole.

[@manicmods]

Appreciate ya! I've made the switch to Hubitat, and loving it so far. I find it right between HA and ST in terms of complexity and compatibility. Still love ST and my content will not ignore it. I switched right when they were implementing their 3d maps 🤕

[@basedbuddha777]

As a licensed electrician as well as Network+ professional who tries to upcycle waste-stream electronics utilizing open source solutions with clients, I gotta say that this is definitely true in a lot of cases. However, the tech is always improving and having a professional to install and support these sorts of things as the market asks for them is really the focus of why HA is so important. I can't install ring devices, SPAN panels, Caseta switches/bridges, and a whole host of other solutions without the help of HA.... or at all in some cases. We NEED community driven projects with easy access to feature requests and/or the ability to create a fix OURSELVES.

[@PeterMoriarty_]

Enjoy this video, thank you. I’m fairly new to the HA platform and have certainly noticed it getting complicated quite quickly 😊

[@manicmods]

Appreciate ya! The beginning was very real for me, I'm constantly drawn back but trying to resist lately 😅

[@SteveBays]

You worked your butt off for this video - thank you! I’m officially sticking with ST for now. Appreciate you

[@manicmods]

Appreciate you and feedback!

[@FlorianGT396]

I changed from FHEM to Homeassistant. I started not with the manual mode, where i have to configure everything with the configuration.yml. I do this the easy way in the Web-UI. I dont share your opinion. Yes, there is some that needs improvement, but thats the same at all products this area.

[@terryharrigan6324]

Interesting. I expect you are quite accurate. And here I am, just ordered a Home Assistant Yellow and a long time user of SmartThings. While I admit, I might just be in a year, where you are now, my situation is a bit different. I'm retired and looking for something to keep my mind active.

[@joerirotthier5409]

I'm a former Hubitat user myself and I switched to home assistant 2 years ago. I would have done the same if I were on smartthings. You're not wrong, it takes a while longer to get into the .yaml vibe opposed to the out of the box gui modes of the other systems. Although HA is catching up. For me the reason to change is hardware reliability. For smartthings and hubitat I'd have to have a spare hub lying around the house in case of a HW failure, or face a lot of downtime due to unavailability or delivery or... In case of home assistant, I can be up and running on a VM in an hour or 2 while I wait for my new dedicated hardware to arrive. For me that is the most important thing.

[@manicmods]

Thanks Joe! My ST hub popped after ~8 years of service, months after this video. I moved to Hubitat and have been meaning to cover the migration. I found out that KZbin is hard with a full-time job 😅 Been wondering if this video is becoming too dated. It was a bit devicive but I liked the conversation it was starting. But wdy think, time to retire it?

[@joerirotthier5409]

@@manicmods Nah, if you're happy with your ecosystem, keep using it! I'm not against things, I'm usually for other things more. Everyone will have there preferences so it's good we get the choice 😁

[@AndyZich]

I couldn't agree more that HA is a slippery slope. I've spent far more time working on the smart home than I've received back. At this point I will never recover my sunk time. Luckily I thoroughly enjoy the challenge. I do need to find a way to be more disciplined with how I spend my time as we can't make more of it. I don't want to ever feel like I didn't do much of what I wanted to do in life but had an awesome smart home.

[@asdkjh4370]

Exactly - its funny but in the ned its the DYI project and not very safe. And developers approach is questionable.

[@4Arcana]

So, I get the point, but here's a thought: I just went to HA in March after a decade on Vera. Vera was bought by Ezlo, which abandoned my hardware and froze my software. At the same time, my Radio Thermostat was abandoned on the cloud and I was forced to replace it. In the past I had used DarkSky as a weather API, but then Apple bought it and killed the API. In considering Hubitat, Home Assistant, and SmartThings, my chief factor was, will the platform be sold or abandoned and will I have to move again? Can I run it on anything I want? Only HA gave me the feeling that it would be around forever and I could run it on anything I wanted. I know this is arguable, but that is where I got to. Was it tough to get going? Well, 10 minutes to get a VM up and running (on an existing Windows NUC that has a bunch of other stuff already on it). If it was longer than that then Hubitat was plan B, and then SmartThings was plan C. A steep learning curve to get Z-Wave (30 existing devices) working that was really unrelated to HA itself. That part was indeed hard. What I LOVE about HA is that you can start with zero code (you really can), and gradually learn templates and that will solve 95% of everything by itself. Putting templates in automations keeps most of the (and/or/if/not/else) in a nice UI, and then just the templates could be considered "code like." My configuration.yaml is quite short, and I can't see how you can corrupt it if you simply check validity in Developers Tools before restarting. I think I have one If/else in "code" that I could eliminate now that I know more. It kind of feels like you went back to HA with the same approaches you used years ago when it was primitive. Coming to the current version from Vera was a breath of fresh air and a whole lotta fun. Except for Z-Wave. But by the way, I loved your approach in this video - fun and funny and it even incorporated your family. Original. Great job.

[@manicmods]

I love your citical thinking, and agree there is no guarantee of any service lasting forever. That's the real beauty of open-source, in addition to hardware flexibility as you mentioned. I've worked w/ VMs forever and that's defintely the easiest hurdle. I had to edit the config to enable the UI automations in last months testing. In respect to me nuking the file, that was adding a custom dashboard. There were no steps in the tutorial to check validity, sounds like best practice I was not introduced to or skipped over. I'm happy you found good ground with HA, especially with Vera abondoning you. And I really appreciate your last statement because I've definitely had regrets about this video. I intended a light-hearted 'no thank you', but believe I came off a bit salty. Appreciate ya!

[@dcshoeman2k4]

Good video. I just setup HA on a NUC last weekend and am slowly in the process of converting over from SmartThings. Smartthings was nice, and is what got me into home automation, but with 200+ devices and 200+ automations, I've simply outgrown it. Simple automations I could churn out and test in a few minutes on ST have me scouring the internet for answers. What's even more frustrating, is finding a post/video, only to see it's 2.5 years old and irrelevant because the integration/addon is deprecated. That being said, I have done some stuff that works natively in HA that would require me to use janky virtual switches with Alexa in ST. You made some controversial statements that will piss some people off, so now I'll have a go. Dashboards are stupid. The whole point of "home automation" is just that. Automation. If you're doing it right you don't need a dashboard to monitor and manually turn shit on and off because it all does it on its own. I don't need to know the temperature of 19 different spots of my house or the current status of the 79 Hue bulbs I have. I don't want to have to push a button to start a bedtime routine when I can automate that with a pressure sensor in my bed. I think most people that obsess over dashboards do it to show it off to others more than for an actual practical purpose. That being said, monitoring cameras in a dashboard is useful, so there's that.

[@manicmods]

Thanks for being here! SFFs and NUCs are where it's at for HA. I have an older Lenovo M93 and it makes a great little server. I have 186 devices in ST and will be hitting that 200 limit soon. Some users report they are well beyond without issue. Others say they have less devices but more than 50 edge drivers, and seeing server errors or memory issues. If I get closer to threshold I could remove some abandoned devices I keep in a room "orphanage". But I think I will intentionally press the limit instead to see what happens 😅 Finding old solutions is frustrating but that applies to all research for sure. Lord knows we used to be able to do a lot more w/ ST Groovy. HA's advanced search can help on that front sometimes. I have a few virtual switches I use as bridges or binary memory. Like you mentioned to cross a platform, or to "remember" a devices state, etc. I hear you on Dashboards. The worse case for them is controlling devices you could not ohterwise. The house fan I added is a good example as it uses a smartswitch in my attic. So I do rely predominately on my panel and is not ideal, but so far has worked out without me having to go into attic to turn on. I could add pass the control on to another scene controller or dummy switch but like the passcode so kiddos don't turn it on. I appreciate your input. I really didn't want to offend any HA users for noted reasons, and you put me at ease a bit 🙂

[@alexruffell]

@@manicmods You just reminded me that the last straw for me that ended my 7 years with ST was hitting the 200 device limit and the $#%#$%#$%@ 20 room limit (hopefully ST saw 'the light' in these past 2 or 3 years since I quit). The app was so limited (maybe still is) in how you could organize your devices that I had to resort to using "Rooms" as a way to group devices. For example all my safety devices (leak sensors, door sensors, etc) were in one room. In HA I have around 50 views and there are no limitations on what you put where so my dashboards are exactly like I want them, not what ST thinks is suitable.

[@davidr521]

Thanks for the video. IMHO, what you note as downsides with HA are some of its major benefits. Can you spend way too much time on these things? Absolutely. That said, I've created a platform that works great for my needs, and have spent _maybe_ 25% of what I would've spent on a "vertical" platform like ST. The heterogeneity of HA is, in my experience, one of its greatest strengths.

[@manicmods]

I greatly respect and appreciate this response!

[@GarNelson1]

I've got a STv3 hub, but I have a new Hubitat hub on the way. I did look at Home Assistant, but I quickly came to a similar conclusion -- even as a retired guy, I don't have enough time in the day to learn, and maintain Home Assistant. I'm hoping Hubitat will have fewer annoyances than Smartthings, and have a shallower learning curve than Home Assistant. We'll see in a few months.

[@slabriprock5329]

As a certified Old Person, I chuckled at the phrase Smart Home "NEEDS". Cue the "Back in my day" speech LOL.

[@onlinevideos8464]

So basically HA is like a PC whilst SmartThings is like a console, not as good and has limits but more convenient and user friendly. Don't use either myself currently though.

[@manicmods]

I'd say that's a pretty solid analogy, as much as I hate to admit it! Thanks for watching 🙂

[@onlinevideos8464]

@@manicmods np, ive wanted to setup and get into Home Assistant but the shortage of pi's that is still going on is still causing issues with pricing.

[@HATipsByLarry]

It's really simple for me i started out with X10 devices (look it up if you haven't heard of them) then a Wink hub, then a smartthings hub, then a hubitat hub, then finally switched to home assistant 3 years ago and never looked back, why, because each one of those previous hubs died within 2 years of getting it. I will never get another proprietary hub, it's that simple. I started with HA running on a raspberry pi 4, then a old laptop i had lying around, and now its on a home lab server running in a VM, have never lost any of the configs as i have HA back itself up to the cloud every couple of days. It does have something of a learning curve but i'd never use anything else.

[@M93BQzz]

My friend can i talk to you ?

[@HATipsByLarry]

@@M93BQzz anytime 😀

[@manicmods]

Sorry to hear so many hubs died on you!

[@HATipsByLarry]

@@manicmods Thanks, this was over the course of over 12 years. But it taught me a valuable lesson. Never buy anything that you can't get from at least 3 other sources. This way your not left holding the bag as the old saying goes.

[@M93BQzz]

@@HATipsByLarry if you could please give me any social media account that i could reach out to you I would appreciate that.

[@jkeltonga]

I came here to see if HA is better than ST. I have been a ST user since JAN 2023. Samsung has made vast improvements in their UI and the hub runs without a hitch (99% uptime). The ONLY reason I am even looking at HA is because there is a sensor that only works with HA. However, with time I suspect it will become available to ST as well. Unfortunately, the video and conflicting comments are making this decision even more challenging. Maybe I will just set up an HA to see what it can/cannot do and decide for myself. The issues you mention in your video is something that happens to everyone who gets interested in something. Having to write YAML is not a deal-breaker for me, so I don't put much weight on your dislike of it. Coding is really the only way to fine-tune something in the digital world (someone has to do it), and most UIs do not have enough parameters to meet everyone's needs.

[@rogerhuston8287]

I've been using Smartthings for years, but only scratched the surface. It is a basic setup, but my main gripe is I can't interact with my system when the internet is down. I'll look at your Samsung videos.

[@Jacob-bc6tq]

Oh thank you I just got lost in the deepest of rabbit holes where everyone and their mom praises home assistant. I have no idea what "code" even is but you saved me

[@manicmods]

Thanks for watching! If you're looking for more options, but want to avoid a large hole, Hubitat has been super good to me in last few months. I hope to cover my transition this summer 🤞

[@ldarbonnemagic]

Great video. My ST v2 (2015) lost a lot of functionality over the last year, so I finally decided to replace it. While looking at the options, I came to three same conclusion about HA. I could do it, might even find the challenge fun, but based on everything I've seen it would be a huge time sink, and required fixes during updates. I decided to try HE, and boy Ami glad I did. The C8 has fantastic upgraded radios and external antennas, so connectivity is extremely reliable. Even to a battery operated Z-Wave motion sensor in a metal mailbox out at the street. An easy "Created Virtual Device" button on the Add Device page. The simple rules engine and Rules Machine can run all of my automations, especially when integrated with Alexa (to integrate with Ring). I automate everything so I don't use a dashboard. HE does have dashboards, but not as 'pretty' as you can get with a lot of time and yaml code in HA, or using other options. If that's what you want, the best recommendation I've seen is to use HE for connectivity with its superior radios and for the easier Rule Machine, then use the built-in HA integration to build the dashboards.

[@manicmods]

Thanks for watching, Larry! I am very interested in the C8, and will likely migrate in the next year. It's great to see both ST and HE step up to the plate, as they have a lot to gain and a lot to lose depending on their attention to areas you've mentioned. But the Hubitat will likely remain a sweet spot between ease of use and functionality, so you did well! I'm glad you got everything integrated- I've also had a mail sensor in mailbox! Z-Wave extenders are great for ensuring extra range. Appreciate the feedback on the antennas, it's interesting more hubs do not offer them. The best use case for my dashboards are batteries- I get notifications from ST, but like to replace them more systematically. It's also my go to for changing my ad-hoc modes, predominately from my office tablet when I am working from home. I don't think many spend time creating and leveraging modes, so will be building best practices in to a future automation video with them.

[@ldarbonnemagic]

Another "feature" of the HE C8 is that I can power it with a portable power bank (like you use to charge your cell phone) to move it next to a device for inclusion/exclusion. I did use a Z-Wave Extender for the mailbox with ST, and while it's still there (it also switches outdoor holiday lights), it didn't need it with HE. That was the first device I tried with HE to test it's range. Yes, I do have HE send me app notifications and email when a battery runs low. So far, I've mainly used a dashboard to verify automations when configuring them (show device status for trigger, rule and output device). I just watched your great video about SharpTools! That does look great for building a dashboard. Thanks!

[@rodneycrosslin4405]

I'm way down that rabbit hole....I run Smartthings V3 hub with a Home assistant Raspberry pi and a Habitat hub ...then I have my Lutron hub and yolink hub and...dear god I haven't seen the sun in years.

[@manicmods]

😂 It's easy to slip into, at least rewarding! Thanks for watching!

[@mayonemedia1998]

Fascinating stuff!! Love the content, 11:18 had me rolling 😂 Can’t wait for some wrx vids!

[@manicmods]

Thanks cuz! WRX definitely needs a spotlight soon 😁

[@gozirraizroose]

Thanks for the video about HA. I am in the "other" camp - I switched from SmartThings to Home Assistant because of the unreliability (for me) of SmartThings. It was literally down more than up, and I had (at the time) maybe 10 devices. I agree that editing yaml sucks - but recent builds are moving more and more into the UI. I've built two other HA setups (for friends) and honestly the only problems I've had were devices that quit responding - a power cycle has fixed all those (so far, knock on wood, saving me a trip over to try to repair). I haven't looked back. I have a gen 1 Smart Things hub in a box somewhere and am happy with my zigbee & zwave combo USB stick with HA (it just worked). With any system, some things work better than others, but I'm sticking with what works for me. And it looks like you're sticking with what works for you too. Cheers!

[@manicmods]

Appreciate ya! Funny I've been using ST for a good 8 years, and things were always solid. Until this month. Which makes me realllly regret this video 😅

[@WillemGoosen]

Well, being that Home Assistant is as vast as it is people tend to focus on what they are good at when starting in home assistant. Coders will tend to focus on coding. For others the dashboard must be pretty and flashy. System guys will absolutely make sure the hardware is just perfect and so on. When I started out, I decided to keep it simple and not integrate something I absolutely do not need. In fact, I even try and keep to one brand on the devices, not entirely possible but still I do not go bonkers here either. Where possible I only use home assistants’ automations. An absolute must be backups. Before each major update I do a VM export and the rest of the time I do backups to Google drive. If you make it complex it will be complex and spending five hours figuring something out, document it because if six months later you need to redo it, it will probably be 5 hours again. Above all enjoy.

[@manicmods]

Well said, Willem- appreciate your input! Streamlining device brands makes a world of difference, and I try to do the same 🙂

[@toney.vecchio]

Haha great video, the vignettes at the start and your close lines were very funny and well done. You earned this subscriber, +1

[@manicmods]

Appreciate feedback and you!

[@jkk1337]

As a developer and enthusiast i dont mind these points, but have to agree when it comes to normal users

[@martinsVcm]

Problem is smartthings for me do not have several features due to region block.... It has less things for Brazil than for USA. It also does not detect all tuya devices I have, wyze cameras and broadlink ir blasters.

[@manicmods]

Sorry to hear that!

[@tormodnicholasmortontorger205]

I went from ST to Homey some years back, was the best experience ever. Now? Just going for running HA side by side with Homey and hope I will get the best of both worlds. But have to say, HA is powerful but even more frustrating and hard to even learn the most basic stuff. Things that took 10 minutes in ST takes 2 in Homey and 30 minutes in HA at this point 😂

[@manicmods]

Homey has a lot going for it! They've been writing me to review a free hub but I've just moved to Hubitat and can't look back. And while I'd like to review anyway, it's a bit too much for me to take on right now. I can definitely relate to ST taking more time to implement work arounds! Thanks for watching 🙂

[@tormodnicholasmortontorger205]

@@manicmods you should try it. Off all the platforms I think this might be the not user friendly and most intuitive. But it has it's downsides, hence me adding HA. Would be interesting to hear your take on it, I find it strange how Homey seems to go under the radar from so many of you top KZbinrs

[@madisonm2878]

Potential idea! ActionTiles vs SharpTools! Which is the most POWERFUL dashboard!

[@andybrice2711]

I love Home Assistant's mission. And I think I'll be sticking with it. But they'd do well to take onboard this criticism. When you're a developer who's built an entire operating system, It's easy to lose sight of what constitutes "simple". The `configuration.yaml` thing seems to be a sticking point. I think Home Assistant really needs a cleaner way to break up configuration into smaller modular files, which can be reloaded without restarting the entire system. I coded my own Home Assistant integration last week. Getting it working was surprisingly simple. But enabling it to update without a full restart was like trying to head-butt my way through a brick wall.

[@robert.wigley]

"The `configuration.yaml` thing seems to be a sticking point. I think Home Assistant really needs a cleaner way to break up configuration into smaller modular files, which can be reloaded without restarting the entire system." You have been able to split your configuration.yaml into multiple files for years and you can reload almost everything separately without restarting the system.

[@andybrice2711]

​@@robert.wigley But you can only reload those smaller config files if the integration supports it. And implementing that support in a custom component is unduly complex, and not well-documented.

[@robert.wigley]

@@andybrice2711 This is not correct.

[@andybrice2711]

​@@robert.wigley Are you sure? How is it supposed to work? I was developing my own integration recently, and after several days trying to implement config reloading in numerous ways, I eventually admitted defeat and gave up. I can't find that part of the API documented anywhere.

[@symonchester]

Love Smartthings but the thing that drives me nuts is the broken geolocation tracking from the ST app, I've had support looking into it for ages but they still haven't fixed it... That's the main reason I've been looking into HA

[@George-bb9yi]

For me the key issue is this: do you buy in to cloud management or not? If you want local management and independence from vendor lock-in; then Home Assistant or Hubitat are arguably the only real options (I run both).

[@manicmods]

Truth. I'm OK with the cloud configuration as long as devices run local like ST. I've just started leveraging Hubitat again and the local management is a nice feature. I've lived at same place for 4 years, and have only lost internet once and it was with power.

[@George-bb9yi]

@@manicmods I prefer to lock down IoT devices, but for someone who just wants a few lights, that is overkill. Cheap IoT devices are full flaws, very hackable, and nobody maintains firmware on these things. Ironically, 'security' devices like cameras are the worst offenders!

[@rolltidehero]

Thanks for this. I lost my voice-box to a rare cancer a couple years ago so I also am more interested in dashboards rather than voice assistants (obviously.) Is there anything that you would recommend in particular? Computing power isn't an issue as I have 4 HP DL360 G9s, Unifi Dream Machine SE, a few Unifi cameras, some Govee lighting that I just bought but haven't installed. I also have Proxmox installed on a local server, as well as a remote server. Unraid is installed on one of the other servers, Proxmox Backup Server on one, and then Windows Server 2022 Data Center Edition on the other. It's the one that I use the least... not really at all. Is the Govee lighting good for these? I got the H601A 6-Inch Recessed RGBWW Lights on Black Friday. I got 12 of them. But if there is another brand that is more compatible and similarly priced, then I would like to return them so I'm not starting off my Smart Home with incompatible stuff. BTW I believe your channel is going to grow very fast because you are informative and funny 😂

[@manicmods]

Sorry to hear and happy to help ya. With experiences you have, you may find HA right for you. This video was intended to be a comical warning to novice users. Admittedly it was bit salty instead of comical. If the video resonates with you however, you should definitely consider Hubitat. I've just moved my fleet of 120+ devices and found the process painless. All my intergrations and automations have improved, and they also offer a local dashboard and compatible w Action Tiles as well. I've been meaning to cover this transition at a high level but time is not my strong suit. Check out Hubitat and Homie, and let us know if you have any lasting questions or concerns. Thanks for watching!!!

[@stevemeng7401]

I have had a smartthings hub for 4 years and Home assistant for almost 3. I like the HA setup "Because" it is a challenge. For me, its the trip, not the destination. They are both frustrating in their own ways.

[@manicmods]

With full respect and appreciation, if you like the challenge you should go all in with HA. SmartThings becomes a crutch in HA, it's much easier to add devices but none of the automation is local because of the cloud connector. Since so much is local in ST, I suppose you can also keep your critical automations there.

[@scottmcclenahan6681]

Damn, wish I had found this video before wasting money in HA! Lol thanks

[@manicmods]

I feel ya, I intended to mean time is money.

[@jonwest8766]

The home assistant chat in the beginning was hilarious. But the scrolling long documentation is not representing HA properly. I have HA with z-wave and zigbee devices. Never once did I read a page of documentation nor yaml file to set them up. What script(s) were so hard in HA? Did you even try the UI for your desired automation? Without examples, it feels like you didnt really try. Just found truthful but not giving full context to the HA gripes from yesteryears.

[@manicmods]

Thanks, Jon! Without documentation, I would definitely not be able to do anything outside of setting up the initial VM. And to be clear nothing wrong with KBs and forums but I found myself needing them for the simplest stuff. Someone had mentioned they had never opened their yaml config to write automations. I find this conflicting because it's the first thing you have to do to enable the UI automation feature needed to make such a statement. Nothing hard, just very time consuming. If you are using the UI for automations, that process is easy but limited like any other UI. It's just a hornet's nest to me 😅

[@esdrassouza3291]

@@manicmods 3 years using HA. All automations done via UI. The statement said about not able to create an automation with a door sensor and lights are not real. Claiming it is hard just because reading is part of it, I believe the problem is not with the KBs but the lack of interest to read. Instead of VM you could also have chosen an easier path. But, better hammer something before even really trying it. Sorry, but the video feels like a joke. With total respect to your awesome work get to get the video done.

[@Frem_Kra]

@@esdrassouza3291 HA? With lack of staiblity ? with constant breaking changes and updatest which destabilizing system? With developers questionable approch and forum politics and not to mention monstrous security issues and complete lack of responsibility? That platform can make you fill like "tinkerer "and that you more in "control" but is this really the case considering above? HA had YEARS for improvement and development and not much have been done. I have left that sect and I'm strongly recommending alternatives - paid or free. And regarding video it's one of the sane ever made. HA cost lots and lots of time and this is something which people can't afford.

[@owenjohnson5030]

I keep trying to use home assistant. I’m a software developer with decades of experience and yet this just keeps defeating me.

[@manicmods]

I'd still be trying if it were not for cumulative experiences!

[@fuzzer6907]

I can't read the HA guides while you are scrolling so fast. /s

[@gt-simdriver6716]

Holy hell I just went through this again!!! Yes again. I lost my holiday weekend. I had it working, with snmp wan monitors and everything. Then something went wrong. Three days lost! I just can’t anymore. This is my third shot. They are out!

[@manicmods]

RIP ⏰ I made the switch from ST to Hubitat, and want to cover the move soon. It's still proving to be a great in between! Thanks for watching, and sorry for trouble!

[@seanmcdonald656]

like the video. I did start with SmartThings but 3 months in i got board and wnet to HA. Node Red for the win. Click drag drop.

[@erbartlett]

Is there a list of which devices work locally with something like smartthings? I'm currently using google home, and thinking about moving to homekit or something else for more local options

[@TheManyNations]

Mostly good video but I think it's kind of crazy to fearmonger over learning a markdown language. Neopets was for kids and it had them using html and css. Computers have existed for the past 3 generations or so. I think learning markdown (any markdown) should be viewed as a fundamental of tech literacy, and that we should not push people away from that based on some perceived level of technicality. I have one entry in my configuration.yaml that is longer than 4 lines long, and it was a copy/paste. "traversing nabu casa....." it's a toggle switch.

[@asdkjh4370]

There is much more problems with HA than just learning markdown language.

[@scottswf238]

Thanks for the video. What hardware do you use for your ductwork automation?

[@manicmods]

Thanks! I use Keen Smart Vents, incredibly reliable and battery efficient.

[@aeroflack]

Home automations are suppose to simplify your life period. I got your point and you're right. Thanks for sharing you got a new follower.

[@manicmods]

Thanks, glad to have you Alonso!

[@ivorieweatherspoon8842]

Love the video. This was months ago we need new videos from you

[@manicmods]

Working on it!

[@gnospanker]

I made the switch from ST to HA over about a year period running both in parallel. The whole Edge Driver program was the final straw. It was so mismanaged, with very limited information about how to actually upgrade them. Also, shutting down the IDE (or threatening to, I see you have it in this video so maybe that never happened). I never liked the "new app" vs. the old app. In the new app, you could go to a device and there would be no list of what automations were using this device, crazy! The one thing that really bugged me about Smartthings was the lack of configuration via browser/PC. After a while all of the automations got too cumbersome to try and manage via a phone or tablet app. With HA, the ability to see automations and other things on a big screen (or two big screens at the same time) has allowed me to get more detailed and better manage automations. ST did come out with a Windows app but it was very limited compared to the mobile app. Overall ST was great. It got me in to all of this and I ran my 2015 hub for 6 years. Eventually I unpaired all of my Zwave switches and paired them directly to HA which has been more reliable. Running HA on Raspberry Pi with SSD. Thanks for the video, looking forward to more videos from you!

[@manicmods]

Thanks for watching, Justin! They recently re-added the automation summary / reference back to devices, but it only applies to routines. I too was super disturbed by this. And still am a bit since they do not include the Smart Lighting app. I think ST is trying to push everything to Routines, but there are some things Smart Lighting app does better still. Samsung's new Beta now covers adding devices and (adding/editing) routines / SmartApps via web. I am going to drop link below as it's not that well advertised. The Windows app, as you indicated, still needs to catch up to their new web UI. You've got the right idea re-pairing all devices to HA, it's really the only way to go. Appreciate you being here 😀 my.smartthings.com/

[@AyrtonRicardo]

As a maniac Samsung eco system user I would say this is valid criticism, however I absolutely did not see a fair view over HA because all that was said here I did using ONLY A SINGLE ANDROID PHONE that I got 7 years ago and Im running Ubuntu in less than 5 hours setup including linuxes upgrades and so far 0 touch to yaml automations. I even added a nice good night and welcome home messages via alexa. Regardless of all that, I would like to see a in depth Smartthings vs HA fair comparison, including the best of what both can do and the cons of each. Samsung ST was my previous usage and veeeeeeeeery limited to me. Btw, I'm running my HA in my loved Note 5 xD Samsung user in all my electronics since longer than I should.

[@manicmods]

Valid criticism from you as well, thank you so much for taking the time to reply w your positive experience! You touch on what I wanted this video to be. I expected my old environment to need overhaul, which is why I rebuilt. In the same month I was crushed by new, very familiar, experiences, and let this rip. I've since thought heavily about removing video but it's creating good conversation so I've left for now. I'm not sure if I will ever return to HA as I'm using HE currently and very happy. I appreciate you being here, sorry for delay as I catch up on all comments!

[@henryanderson369]

I want to thank you for your advice on actiontiles I hope you would do more on actiontiles and update not like for 5year ago thanks so much

[@manicmods]

Thank you! Let me know if you are looking to see something particular 🙂

[@henryanderson369]

@manicmods They are one thing how video on to put cameras feed on your panel using actiontiles that be great Thanks me and couple of guys watching your channel

[@EsotericArctos]

I think over-complicating automations is one of the worst things people do. It makes them more prone to failure, and most of that complication is not even needed. Home Assistant Yellow supports Thread and Zigbee (and in turn Matter) out of the box, so just be aware of that. I know Z-Wave needs to be added, but it really is not hard. In fact, it is as simple as plug in the z-wave dongle and Home Assistant just detects the stick. You don't need to do the over complicated stuff now. Smartthings is good. If you want an out of the box all in one and no fiddling, Smartthings is the way to go. IF you have a little time to tinker, Home Assistant is worth going. I don't really agree with needing to edit YAML. I use Home Assistant and the GUI does support a lot of if then else. There are trigger identities, and al ot of other features that are all accessible via GUI. The bad thing about Home Assistant is finding the information to use these features. You can do a lot of complex stuff from the GUI, if you know how to use trigger ID's, if then else in the GUI and a lot of other things. Now I have waffled all above and it is too long for anyone to read it, I would 100% recommend Smartthings for most people that only want to close a curtain or turn on a light with a motion sensor.

[@manicmods]

I could not agree more! It's easy to get carried away, and lose track of purpose and time. I'll always be a tinkerer with all things, and will always prefer working with hands so I think I was a bit biased in this video. We all tinker differently. Every time I tried to do something simple in HA though, it backfired. As far as YAML, I found I needed it for anything that I 'needed' HA for. Some have called me out for being able to create automations in UI. I understand this can be done, but I had to still add the module via configuration file during last months trials. I nuked this file entirely somehow trying to add a real dashboard. I tried to restore, but quickly determined it would be faster to rebuild. That's when I really stepped back and asked myself what I was doing it for. I read every word, appreciate you and respect your input Brendan! I do an incredibly lot with SmartThings that transcends my smart lighting and blinds. My home theater, HVAC smart vents, smart locks and dashboards are some of my favorite. As time goes on, there are more and more integrations available. I'm currently wondering if I will have trouble at the proposed 200 device limit by ST, or the 232 device limit of z-wave devices. This raises questions to my own addiction!

[@JohnMayfield-NS]

When I saw windows and VM I thought oh no.... :D Had nothing but bad luck with that. Edit to add: Yaml? That's so rarely used now, don't think I've really touched it in 2 years (other than to remove things that got integrated into the UI). I know this vid is 7 months old, but...

[@hackr78]

Samsung … no thank you

[@matthewprince6157]

Is it possible to set up a calendar with chore lists on them for different users of the home?

[@manicmods]

Hey Matthew! You can accomplish this within ActionTiles or SharpTools using an iFrame tile. I've used Google Calendar for this. I suggest checking out article below, then playing with the noted Customize option in Google's settings to filter on what you need. Google will give you an array of options, as well as a iFrame link. Then simply add that link to My Shortcuts in ActionTiles, or a Custom Tile using URL in SharpTools. Let me know which solution you are more interested in, and I can perhaps build a video around it. I should also mention that SharpTools also supports iCal. Thank you for your support 🙂 support.google.com/calendar/answer/41207?hl=en

[@matthewprince6157]

@@manicmods I guess sharptools since its the free-ish option. Does Smarthings only work with samsung? that's what they show on their website.

[@JMKDTA]

This hits the nail on the head for me. Started with HA but now im moving to ST for the ease of use and it just working when I want it to!

[@manicmods]

Thanks, Jon! It's a great time to be a ST user as Samsung is taking notes from more sophisticated systems. I've bought the Hubitat C8 recently while on sale, and may migrate to it during my winter hibernation. It's a great hub falling somewhere between HA and ST. But everything works so well in ST, I just don't have good cause just yet! Appreciate you being here 🙂

[@innovativehomeautomationto7112]

I used S T for about three years and just got flustered with it and moved to Home Assistant. I’ve now been with Home Assistant for four years and there’s no going back for me.

[@henryanderson369]

Can smartthings run local devices like Zigbee devices or a other hub like Hubitat Thanks please let me know

[@manicmods]

Zigbee and Z-Wave devices run local; thanks for watching!

[@CorbinBlack]

As a HA I can confirm the constant automation fomo. The UI has gotten so much better in the past year. I think part of what is shocking for new users is how much it can expose to you from your smart home. Many devices have features that are obscured by other apps or not as useful by themselves. I have some pretty complex automations that I use and haven't touched yaml. Nabu Casa is working hard to minimize the need for YAML, you can see it in the better UI. Also I like it because the open source community brings a ton of value to the platform. I was able to get consistent controls for RGB lightbulbs from different brands in HA which is great for in home user experience. Your criticisms are valid of HA. I can't readily recommend it to everyone as a home automation platform. I look forward to seeing what walls you hit with ST, see if HA has an answer to it. Also if it's a meaningful limitation.

[@manicmods]

Appreciate you! I'm finding the same with Hubitat in terms of better unifying a wider scope of device properties. It's still not HA for better and worse, but I'm finding it to be a sweet spot. Devices like my Keen vents and Konnected panels were concerns. They work better, and like in HA, my Konnected panel is now local which I didn't even think was possible. Thank you for your comment, many invitations back into dark side in here 😅

[@rfischer1984]

I use hubitat for more robust rules and configuration. But it doesn't always support everything. "aqara". It works, then it doesn't. Aqara now supports matter and so does hubitat. But of course aqaras matter doesn't work. Just shows the hub. No child devices. Hubitat says they are working on adding matter bridge support, but when? I know I could stick with what I know works. But where is the fun with that? So now I use Alexa routines for my aqara devices for now. My wife always wonders where I'm disappearing too.

[@manicmods]

I've also switched to Hubitat and loving it. Like my YT channel, I don't matter yet 😅 everything is already local and Matter had (w ST) just wasted my time in trials from Aquara to Switchbot. I bought Aquara presence and it doesn't even work reliably in their own app. I'm at a loss on that front until I have more time. LMAO at disappearing, I think that resonates w all of us! Thanks for watching!

[@kloakovalimonada]

I'm not interested in any inevitable rugpulls from proprietary commercial systems.

[@My-noname]

HA can absolutely be a rabbit hole if you don't set any boundaries but that's not a very good reason to choose anything lesser. It would be like choosing to use Windows. It's crap but it's standardized crap so I don't need to make any decisions.

[@Mudrucker2112]

Can’t find the local device video mentioned at 6:32

[@manicmods]

5:02 sorry for delay, going back thru all my unread comments and appreciate you!

[@gomalibusurf6098]

Great video. You actually show animated examples of your opinions. You never said not to try HA or HUB, just advised of a few hurdles. I wanted to try HA and HUB, but held off for the exact reasons you mention. The deep hole, and deciding if its worth it in the end for the individual user. I found your information on STs future interesting. Luckily started with ST and Zwave devices to test out my entry into the smarthome devices. Added Alexa, which has come a long way with ST updates. Love your family included in the monologue. I thought she said COKE...👀 🤣

[@manicmods]

LMAO, no Coke talk at the family table unless it's cola! Thanks for watching, and feedback!

[@louisviciedo]

I personally enjoy integrating several devices from various eco systems onto one platform. I also enjoy solving problems, saving time, money etc. through creative and complex automations that only HAS can afford. The feeling when you finally conquer an automation that had you perplexed previously is amazing! I migrated from ST 2 years ago. the learning curve initially is steep but well worth it IMO. Occasionally stuff breaks and you want to pull your hair out or pound a hole in the wall, still worth it though...

[@manicmods]

Thanks for watching, Louis! It's can definitely be enjoyable and rewarding with as many highs as lows. I think in another few years, most platforms will allow some insane automations OOB. I'd really like to see Zigbee or Z-wave define a better framework for device drivers to help on this front. IP device automation will probably never be simple, but integrations can be a blessing here. Appreciate ya 🙂

[@polarisflyer]

Thank you so much for providing such a thoughtful review of Home Assistant! Your honesty and transparency earned you another subscriber!!! Kudos!

[@manicmods]

Appreciate ya!

[@hogwelder505]

I quit using Smartthings when google bought Smartthings out. I also stopped using Nest because Google was watching everything and kept sending me messages.

[@manicmods]

Thanks for being here HW! I switched from Alexa to nest for va over a year ago and thought I'd like it a lot more than I do. Google and ST are close partners, for better or worse 😅, but ST was never but out. Unless you know something I don't!

[@JohnHollenbeckTech]

@@manicmods Smarting's was bought by Samsung many years ago. I believe it started as a Kickstarter project. Maybe that's where the confusion was.

[@Micko.1]

Cmon home assistant is great

[@rolling_marbles]

Respectfully disagree on the automations point. Complex automations can be done in node Red with a drag and drop interface. Actually, a lot of things have been moved out of the scary yaml. I agree that there’s a learning curve to Home Assistant, but it’s not for the casual user, Apple, Google, and Amazon have the casual user automation market handled. Also, I completely disagree that cloud is paramount to automation. I implemented Home Assistant so I could avoid the cloud and keep my devices in a walled garden of safety. Lastly, I’m in IT infrastructure and can tell you open source community code is not a negative, but closed source closed code requires a lot of trust, in this case a lot of trust in Samsung. With that, if you don’t have the time or desire, and have the supported devices then yes, SmartThings would possibly be a good fit, but like everything, there’s use cases for everything. Personally, I hardly spend any time on configuring Home Assistant and it’s rock solid running on an old laptop or on a VM, not a Raspberry Pi.

[@asdkjh4370]

NODE Red is not HA. And hopefully that will be splitted soon.

[@EthanShalev]

8:50 the stock video of sand blowing over money is using Israeli Shekels. Seeing how I'm in Tel Aviv, I was surprised to catch that. Wondering where this stock video came from. Also, this entire video was useful as a cautionary tale as I start my smart-home journey.

[@manicmods]

Wow nice catch! I use Envato Elements for B Roll like that which is where it came from. Thanks for watching!

[@josephdoseph3118]

Z-wave was really easy to install and integrate

[@Brightspirit10]

Thank you for your honesty. I was strongly considering home assistant but, as I researched how to do simple tasks, I opted out as it looked like a second job.

[@manicmods]

Appreciate ya!

[@chris-kr7gf]

I find HA a bit fragile and not user friendly. They need to bake in some basic setup and allow techies ability to change things. I don't want to waste my time trying to set up a darn home or constantly have to manage it. Just bad approach and not sustainable.

[@bramvanloy7160]

What peasantry is this? The time Bullcrap. Don’t use HA nor ST and flick the lights manually. This will save you time.

[@manicmods]

Truth! I keep this principal close to mind when automating. I try to keep it simple.

[@donsfromnz6515]

See you back in HA when your devices become paper weights or your automation requirements outgrow your current platform. You should also check out templates cos you don't know what you don't know, and templates make it so you don't need to know.

[@manicmods]

Not until I get a Roomba 😅

[@magnus33john]

Wow this is a spectacular level of BS nonsense. First of not all smart things devices run locally and those that do require the use of Samsung proprietary drivers, meaning if they stop supporting it , change it or block certain functions your out of luck. This whole ceiling excuse is just that a excuse for not admitting the truth which is the problem is you and not some piece of software. Its just software and it doesn't make you doing anything so the reason for obsessive behavior is a obsessive person, not some some code. Making automation, ZigBee and zee wave have been simple and easy for ages now in home assistant and though you can config in yaml its not done often now unless you adding something with very little support outside its developer. The bug that allowed potential opening of doors did exist in home assistant there no denying that but he aparently didn't bother looking at smart things. In 2018 alone smart things had 20 such vulnerabilities and the list for them even now is frightingly long. If smart things works for you that great but stop trying to make excuses for yourself and blame some software instead. If you can't walk away from tweaking with something to be with family or you cant set realistic goals unless your artificially limited that a fault in you not some ones and zeros 🙄. Home assistant not for everyone, nor is smart things, Hubitat or any of the other alternatives but you need to look in the mirror. If this was fact based comparing advantages, features, flaws and disadvantages it would have been taken seriously but thats not what you did. Maybe next time compare actually facts rather then blame a software for your own issues as it looks more professional and a lot less cringe.

[@manicmods]

Whoa, a lot to unpack here. I'll try to touch on each comment since you took the time to write... 1) If it was BS, you’re accusing me of fabricating the forum reports backing up each experience. 2) I never said all ST devices run locally although most do... 3) Local support is not limited to the use of “proprietary Samsung drivers”. Zoos, Minoston and HomeSeer are examples of product manufacturers that equip us with official local drivers. 4) I mention you can automate in UI. You enable this by editing YAML. This was still true when I released this video. I don’t suggest creating HA environment to automate in UI. These users would definitely be better off with ST or HE. 5) HA vulnerability had CVSS score 10. As mentioned, ST not a walled garden but nothing that severe. I’d check official vulnerability websites if you want the real facts. 6) The “excuses for myself” almost led me to more internal dialogue, I wish you wouldn’t do that! 7) I can absolutely walk away from HA, as encouraged in this video 😉 I’ve definitely reflected on this video a bit. It was supposed to be satirical > salty. With that said, it’s loaded with facts and comparisons. The good news is denial is first stage of accepting (the truth hurts.)

[@magnus33john]

@@manicmods A honest review talks about it strengths and weaknesses which you did none of. You talk about a security hole which home assistant did indeed have and neglect to mention smart things which your pushing has more holes in its security then the Titanic. You talk about how smart things is all local which it isn't with only 70% of the devices being local and the other 30% will never be fully local. You talk about how you go down the rabat hole and it takes time away from other things along with realistic ceilings. Its just software and if someone can't stop and go do other things then its a issue with the person. This is a one sided opinion piece of your personal views and has very little actually Truth in it. You want to compare them that's fine but be honest in that comparison with the strengths and weakness for both. After that if you want to give your personal opinion on why smart things works for you that's fine because you gave them the info to decide for themselves. This video on the other hand is nothing more then a opinion piece and makes it look like your getting paid by smart things to push what they want.

[@manicmods]

These points all sound familiar ^ This was an honest review of my onboarding into Home Assistant. And yes, with my experience , you get an opinion. As a HA community member, I tried to make it entertaining as so many can relate. All your other points are your own opinion🤷

[@slapcitykustomz1658]

Goodness Bro Take A Breath

[@manicmods]

🤣🤣🤣

[@patrikulus]

If you consider constant tweaking in smart home as something bad, then why do you have YT channel about this topic? There is some true about the things you said, but the short answer is that HA is for power users, and SmartThings, Google Home, Alexa, Homekit etc. is for basic users. You can do much more with HA, but of course it will require more effort. What I don't agree is that you need to do all the things in yaml. Yeah, it was like that, about 5 years ago ;) Now you can configure helpers, groups, automations all with the UI.

[@manicmods]

I LOVE tweaking solutions, not regularly patching them. With that said, it's legitimately impressive that the devs are able to keep up with changing APIs. But it's the time between and unintended consequences of updates that led me to ST. This vid was more salty than I intended. I'd still be dabbling in HA if it were not for having a family now TBH, though I don't ever think I'd feel good about the return on time invested. I appreciate your comment 🙂

[@asdkjh4370]

Its not only about tweaking - its about safety simplicity and ethic. And these are HA problems + huge time waste.

[@luixmod1]

I think I can say the same about HomeKit vs homeassistant.

[@troutt1744]

I dumped ST after a car crashed into a internet box and left my house useless. Once you get a template figured out for your dashboard wall but the phone as well nothing beats it. I use my phone the most when interacting with the house ST can't even come close to touching it. Best of all though it always works when the internet is down. Even pulling into my property my network will pick me up and get to work without any internet.

[@manicmods]

ST was impressively local before I left it. Just like HA (but more in ST) some integrations you're forced to use cloud, but mine was limited to Konnected. I'm running Hubitat now and everything I have local- Konnected, Harmony, Govee, Hue, Ecobee, Denon, and other AV, and over 100 switches and sensors. HA will never stop teasing me, I know video seemed salty but it's still an interest. But I seem to found good balance now. Appreciate you watching! I'll be doing some more automation stuff soon. I've thought about removing this video but I think it's creating good conversation. Appreciate ya!

[@MrRoma70]

You lost me, don't believe yours to be a fair judgment. By the way, I use and love my HA, 165 + devices, not a gig but all the documentations provided make life much easier, in saying that Community also its a plus to me, plenty help out there.

[@onfiya]

Disappointing bias review. Self-described script kiddie host lacks skill then blames the systems.

[@manicmods]

Never called this a review, but it is a factual comparison between two solutions. And experience + comparison often includes a bias. Thanks for confirming script kiddies need not apply 👍

[@onfiya]

​@@manicmods I think it's hard to factually compare solutions when you're unable to delve into one of them. It is akin to comparing two cars but you were unable to start one of them, so came to the conclusion it's bad for driving, despite it being user error. Yes, HA requires various domain knowledge, and thus is likely not for people lacking time to self educate on the topics. I don't think it's fair to claim this is a factual comparison.

[@Qosmio1955]

Honestly, the trouble you appeared to have with HA just makes me think that you may just be shit at it. I'm hopeless at coding but I find yaml easy enough to figure out and I don't even bother with HA automations - Node Red is too easy. HA has been rock solid for me, to the point where I use it to monitor and manage my off-grid power system. I think that I would find the mundanity of ST excruciating. The day I stop wanting to know what's going on under the hood and opt for "plug and play, no thinking required" is the day you can plonk me in a hole and cover me with 6' of dirt.

[@manicmods]

You say you're hopeless at coding and suggest burying you when you stop wanting to know what's under the hood? Where's the shovel? I'm just kidding, glad your experience is positive!

[@renaulth2009]

This guy gets it.

[@manicmods]

Appreciate ya, Renault!

[@madisonm2878]

Minty video 🤌the humor was on point!

[@manicmods]

Thanks, Madison!

[@CNCPRINTBLOGSPOT]

ive made the same expirience....

[@fuzzysteve]

somewhat misleading. Setting up zigbee with home assistant takes: pick a zigbee stick. Skyconnect from home assistant works. plug it into your home assistant box install it the integration for it. (it's like 2 clicks) Add zigbee devices (you hit add device, then put the device into pairing mode. Smart things can't teally be any different there.) for wifi things, they tend to just show up. As for yaml, the vast majority of things don't need you to touch it. It's only the more unusual things which do. if you've corrupted your config, then that's your mistake. messing around in yaml when you should just be using the gui for it. And if it's really an issue, you didn't check the config before reloading it. is it _as_ easy? probably not. But it's not significantly harder, and it gives you far far more options.

[@manicmods]

A bit satirical and overdramatic, maybe, but misleading is subjective. Skyconnect is brutally terrible. Sonoff equally problematic. This is why so many HA users actually use a ST or other hub to bridge the gap which defeats purpose of HA in IMO. Definitely not alone here, but I'm glad some find it so easy. The zigbee documentation I captured was HA's guide to combat the complexities. Surely the community does not have a 2 click experience since that guide exists. As far as YAML goes, if you are not using it, you may as well use Alexa. I don't mean to sound salty, and I really do appreciate your comment and positive experience!

[@fuzzysteve]

@@manicmods "may as well use alexa" except alexa doesn't allow for local control. And you can still build pretty complex automations without touching yaml. These days, there really isn't much which you can't do through the gui, where you need to dip into the yaml. Especially not anything basic. Sure, command line stuff, but I most people aren't using that. As for burtally terrible, that's really not been my experience.

[@asdkjh4370]

No its not - plenty of problems with many integrations.

[@JayMason6]

You prob did yourself a favor. 2023.6 broke my ambient weather and avid integrations. community support bit was on point forums either echo or cry chamber

[@manicmods]

Sorry to hear that! Thanks for watching Jay ⚙️

[@im_sanso]

You can create automation without using yaml

[@HATipsByLarry]

I agree, i make some very advanced automations and just use HA's GUI for those. Only time i ever use yaml is for templates and even those can be created inside the GUI in the current version of HA.

[@badisbouchama1801]

nah , smartthings is samsung's and samsung is not yours.

[@asdkjh4370]

HA even more

[@amandioreal2293]

Great vídeo. I'm an Electronic Engineer and professionally I work as IoT Engineer. For smart home I have designed my own system. So, my own server, backend, services, frontend, security.

[@manicmods]

Thanks for watching! You've got the perfect skillets for home automation. I love tinkering, but I'm no engineer 🙃

[@amandioreal2293]

@@manicmods but you have the mind set. Keep it simple. If is hard to do is because something is not been done in the correct way. This is why I think that HA is great for hobby not so great for Real Home Automations.

[@asdkjh4370]

That is what people do in many places. HA is still dodgy issue.

[@asdkjh4370]

Exactly - its even opposite. @@amandioreal2293