The world's most heavily debated footprints

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The most important archaeological sites in the entire world, definitely in America.
Source of National Park Footage
www.nps.gov/whsa/learn/nature...
Academic sources mentioned in my video:
www.science.org/doi/10.1126/s...
www.cambridge.org/core/journa...
www.science.org/doi/10.1126/s...
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[@StefanMilo]

Get 50% off your first month of KiwiCo at www.kiwico.com/stefan with code STEFAN

[@jholt03]

Hopefully this confirmation of a much earlier peopling of the Americas will put the overkill hypothesis to bed once and for all. For most archeologists that leaves only climate change as the explanation for the extinction of the megafauna, an explanation I find overly vague and unconvincing. These magnificent beasts of the Americas had survived countless different climate regimens ever changing over tens of millions of years. Why should this latest transition from cold to warm be any different? I could accept the added pressure of human predation as a possible explanation for the loss of perhaps one or two species that were particularly vulnerable to these new human hunting methods, but not the 50 some odd megafauna species that seem to have disappeared between roughly ten and twenty thousand years ago. For me it's the theory of multiple impacts, over thousands of years by pieces of a disintegrating comet that seems most convincing. The evidence for this flurry of impacts is accumulating and continues to grow stronger. I think it's only a matter of time before it becomes the most widely accepted explanation for the extinction of the megafauna. I'd like to see a video containing your thoughts on this topic Stefan, including a review of Antonio Zamora's research on the subject.

[@DisOcean8]

you did this "dad reach" thing in your sponsor. Where you keep talking while you are straining to reach something. Iconic dad move. Reminded me of my own.

[@chinchinovskypole]

Stefan you are simply the best!!!!!!!

[@bensabelhaus7288]

Thank you once again! This is a great sponsor. Wish I had it earlier for my kiddo. I see they have 10-12 as well so I'm signing him up. He's autistic and this will be perfect. Edit: And of course it's a 5 and up set he wants lol His mother is in veterinary and it's his special interest lol

[@redriver6541]

An absolutely fantastic video Stefan. The peopling of North America is one of my favorite things to study. I hunt Paleo artifacts from several sites in my area of Western Kentucky. I love this.

[@chacochicken]

I'm a Southwestern archaeologist and I've worked on several paleolithic sites on the East Coast and SW. A couple of things to keep in mind. 1st: sample size, we simply do not have a large enough sample size of ancient genetics. Finding very early paleolithic sites in the Americas is analogous to a needle in a haystack. How many people lived in North America say 20k years ago? Now try and find where they stayed for a few weeks at a time. Calculating paleolithic demographics is fraught with peril, 2nd: One of the best likely migration routes is coastal and unfortunately the coastline of Pleistocene Western North America is now on average at least a few miles out to sea in the Pacific. Tech advances plus the adoption of the multifield approach as the norm (chemistry, geology, paleobotany, electron microsopy etc etc.) is going to keep pushing us back further in time. I'm firmly in the Pre-Clovis camp. It's always struck me as strange at how much current humans underestimate ancient ones when we're the same being

[@DIREWOLFx75]

"It's always struck me as strange at how much current humans underestimate ancient ones when we're the same being" Indeed! Ever since i was a child, i always kept noting that and just thought it was absurdly stupid. The interesting part now is that, now that the previous "cannot be possible" cutoff has been PROVEN to be false, what other potential finds becomes viable? Including possible finds that have previously been discarded because "everyone knows"... "One of the best likely migration routes is coastal and unfortunately the coastline of Pleistocene Western North America is now on average at least a few miles out to sea in the Pacific." Aye, even more interesting though, now that we know the migration did not have to rely on the previously mostly assumed timeperiod and route, how much further back in time do we have to look for potential routes? White sands wasn't exactly in the backyard of the coastline, so even a highly mobile population would have taken time to reach there. And if the people were NOT highly mobile, which the tracks themselves suggests, ie, people on foot only and no apparent transport methods, completely unknown lands, meaning they wont just go between start and goal points, but also that they would have to focus on survival first, exploration second. Dozens of years most likely. Yes, it would be possible much faster by tracking prey animals, but that feels unlikely in a brand new environment. Unless it was a very organised migration, which then instead would suggest a lot more developed population than most people would probably allow to be possible. And so on and so on. Basically, this gives LOTS of very interesting questions.

[@noosphericaltarzan]

Would not most of those sites be underwater if these people migrated primarily along coastlines?

[@TheEudaemonicPlague]

​@@noosphericaltarzan D'oh! Read the comment again--that's the point being made.

[@chacochicken]

@@noosphericaltarzan Yes, that's what I meant. The most likely location for Pre-Clovis sites is currently beneath the Pacific Ocean. There are others but finding them is extremely difficult. I'd guess at this moment most sites have been discovered by accident by regular people than by scouting archaeologists and by a significant margin.

[@TheEudaemonicPlague]

This comment made choosing this video worthwhile, even if I don't watch it...which I will. Ever since I first heard about the Clovis finds half a century ago, I've been convinced that, eventually, evidence far older would come to surface. My thought was that the Clovis points were sophisticated enough, and different enough, that there had to have been many years of work before that design was settled on, which meant there should be intermediate designs...somewhere, but probably in North America. I think you could call that a reasonable guess...though it was more hope than guess. When evidence that points further back in time came along, it pleased me greatly. It's so frustrating that the site likely to show evidence of the earliest humans in North America are so inaccessible--and largely destroyed.

[@joes6108]

The footprints of the mother putting down the child still gives me goosebumps every time. It's crazy to think of how lonely that desert is now and those people were walking along a lake shore.

[@Pellkot]

I find it more scary seeing a place my dad took me to hang around and now its just ruined by drug dealers.

[@MaryAnnNytowl]

​@@Pellkotthey wouldn't be there were it not for many, many different reasons all jumbled together. From demand for the drugs, refusal of governments to legalize or at least decriminalize them, the generational imprisonment of a large segment of society making it difficult for the next generation to improve, the incredible level of underfunding for those school districts that then can't help the kids succeed, to so many other things, that's why those dealers are there. Don't like them there? Work to improve things in the area.

[@domh1928]

Do you know where that video is? I have not been able to find it.

[@joes6108]

@@domh1928 I think it was on Nova pbs

[@domh1928]

@@joes6108 Thank you

[@TacticusPrime]

The thing about genetics is that lineages can go extinct or dwindle to such a level that they can't be recovered from feasible sample sizes. We actually can't just assume that merged populations will hold on to all the evidence of the earliest lineages. It's perfectly possible for a later migration population to supplant the genetic evidence of the other group.

[@the_Kurgan]

Well, that seems reasonable, but they trace lineages back 70 thousand years. They find traces of Neanderthal DNA in modern humans.

[@TacticusPrime]

@@the_Kurgan They find specific preserved sequences. There's no law that requires such to occur. It's a matter of chance and natural selection. Neanderthal genes apparently helped some people's immune systems and those stuck around. That certainly wasn't guaranteed to happen.

[@-Hari-03]

i was just thinking this might be a possibility, glad to see im not going insane

[@-Hari-03]

@@the_Kurgan yes, the DNA that managed to hold on for that long. just because there is SOME DNA that can remain in the gene pool that long does NOT mean that ALL DNA can/will remian in the gene pool for that long

[@the_Kurgan]

@harrykelsall9401 Not all will remain? OK . However, there is mitochondrial as well as Y chromosome DNA. At least one of those from an ancestral group would have to be present in their descendants. It is entirely possible that they haven't tested enough modern people. It could well be present in a small percentage. But zero is zero.

[@Pipsqwak]

Maybe there were multiple waves of migration into the Americas, with long or short gaps in between waves depending on oscillations in the climate, the extent of ice, and whether they came from Siberia by land bridge or by a sea route along the coasts - and how many came at any one time, and how successful each group was in producing offspring who survived in the new environment. The genetic haplogroups that survive today may just happen to be those that produced more surviving offspring, while other haplogroups have died out or became much more rare. Many of the haplogroups from more than 15,000 - 18,000 years ago may have left too few descendants and died out; entire lineages may have vanished during the last glacial maximum about 12,000 years ago when the climate became much more severe. The few survivors may have been genetically outcompeted by later waves of migration. We need to find more actual human skeletal remains from earlier dates and recover more ancient DNA to be sure. DNA from such ancient times will be very difficult to find unless preserved deep in a northern cave or permafrost - warm or very wet climates do not typically preserve DNA for very long. I don't know why multiple migrations could not be the cause of the younger haplogroups in the Americas - we know for a fact that today's Europeans mostly descend from Neolithic, Copper, and Bronze Age farmers from the Near East, not the ancient Mesolithic and Paleolithic inhabitants of Europe. Waves of migrations have made truly ancient MtDNA and yDNA haplogroups very rare in Europe today. They are mostly found among far northern Scandinavian and Eurasian peoples who live in areas where farming could not take over and foraging remained a successful lifestyle.

[@digdug1577]

Very well said thank you I agree.

[@turkeytrac1]

Spot on.

[@MrBottlecapBill]

They like to make it sound like it's a monumental discovery. IT's really not.......in fact it's pretty well expected in my opinion and doesn't change the story of the peopling of the Americas at all. IT just changes the dates and shows that science is a process........you're more likely to be wrong than you are to be correct about any ancient pre-history.

[@Arkantos117]

Those PIE really did a number on the neolithic Europeans.

[@MendTheWorld]

I cannot critique your reasoning regarding the genetic evidence, but do try to incorporate into your time line that the last glacial maximum was approximately 22,000 years ago, not 12,000. This is when continental glaciers began retreating and sea levels began to rise. The 12,000 B.P. date you may be referring to represents the transition to the Holocene (or Recent) by which time the continental glaciers had largely retreated from their maximum extent, and global climates began to more closely resemble the climates of the past few thousand years (during which time H. sapiens has flourished, especially since the advent of agriculture and cities), leading eventually to the transition to the Anthropocene, when human civilization has begun to have the greatest impact on the climate, flora & fauna, and landforms. It's funny to think that for a geologist, such as myself, _all_ of these dates seem like yesterday, whereas they seem very ancient in the context of anthropology!

[@AncientAmericas]

Great episode! I've actually been doing research on this same topic and I just wanted to provide you with the citation you needed. The idea about a standstill south of the ice is mentioned on the first page in the article "Current evidence allows multiple models for the peopling of the Americas" by Potter et al. in 2018. Good read for anyone who wants to read up on genetics-based migration models.

[@ianfitzpatrick2230]

Growing up in the Great Basin we learn that most of the entire area used to be massive body of water with other large bodies of water nearby. Considering the dating of the spirit wizard cave remains and the footprints in white sands, natives would have absolutely been around when large amounts of fauna were there to provide resources.

[@donwayne1357]

Now, just hold on a minute there.

[@chuckbarney3945]

Stefan, I work for the US government in public affairs - If they released the footage, being the federal government, you can use it. No law suit pending! It's always nice to get attribution, too, but even that isn't necessary. They just get a bit upset when people take footage, slap a government seal on it they aren't authorized to use (trademark), and represent it as a new product from the government, when in actuality it's a re-edited piece.

[@Seven-Planets-Sci-Fi-Tuber]

4:33 Not only is it amazing that a footprint can last thousands (and more) of years, but look at that little ridge at the edge of the heel of the human print where the foot pushed back a bit of sand. This little crest looks so thin, so frail and yet it is 20K years old. That's Double-Plus Amazing.

[@jeil5676]

There must have been some chemical change, I would think, to keep the layers so distinct and hold such detail. Like a localized catastrophic event or huge storms or something to lay a different layer of silt down or w/e. Some deposit on top that came from elsewhere or was out of the ordinary.

[@rosegeaber7533]

I remember in the 1980s seeing a flat stone with human foot prints in it lying outside a relative’s house in Lebanon,Ohio. I would love to see that again and find out more about it!

[@geraldmiller5260]

I lived in Lebanon, OH and now live near White Sands. Do you still have the rock?

[@rosegeaber7533]

I never had the rock. My relatives did and they have since moved as far as I know.

[@elram2649]

Oh wow! Some of my relatives live in a town surrounded by two rivers turning into one. They have direct access to the shoreline within their property and over the decades they've found ancient stone head statues and pottery buried by time within their lot, they range from soccerball to basketball size. Some of the heads look Native American while others look European. They keep them lined-up within their backyard exposed to the elements (sun and rain). I told my mother to let them know to protect them in a shed instead. She'll be traveling there in the near future - hopefully she gets to go there and convey my concern. She's brought back photos before and dude, they look amazing. I so want to see them in person! It'd be cool if they were officially protected as well by the government or a reputable institution but I'm also concerned (depending on what else they might find), that they'd end up covering it up if it doesn't fit their narrative (because it doesn't). I don't want them to disappear it. What I've seen could be paradigm-shifting for world history. For me, it simply confirmed my worldview in regards to the spread of mankind around the Earth. Mankind did spread around in tribal groups (including those of different physical appearance and pigmentation), et al... a good mix of DNA availability. Language is what made up their tribes - it's what unified them, not so much their appearance; that was only second place. They were different tribes of the same human race. Some mixed with others, some other tribes perhaps not as much. Over time, the stronger and more available physical traits (including appearance, height, pigmentation) get defined and established through the dominant DNA genepool that comes with simply who's procreating the most and the health quality of the group and the environment's conditions. I can't share more info (like location) for obvious reasons and so, I'll end it here. Just know that what I've written in regards to said physical findings of said objects is true. You may choose to consider my interpretations (if you'd like) as you please and at your discretion. 🤓👍

[@rosegeaber7533]

@@elram2649I am interested in history but not as articulate as you. All I can say is the print on the flat stone, if I remember correctly, was small like a child and maybe even an adult sized one next to it?! I can’t remember for sure but it was amazing to me.

[@deepg7084]

​@@elram2649makes one wonder how much of our human history has been lost forever due to the selfish nature of collectors.

[@Afraaz]

I'm going to New Mexico in January, now I know exactly what to explore while I'm there. Thanks

[@davelcx1958]

Hey Afraaz -- According to a NOVA documentary about the White Sands footprints, the archeological sites are off limits to non-researchers which makes sense since the prints are so sensitive to natural and man made erosion.

[@jaythewolf]

I hope you enjoyed it. I was there a few years back for a few months and the most amazing thing is the rainy season. One day it's desert and the next day the whole place turns green and colorful for a few weeks. Absolutely beautiful

[@animalmother556x45]

…I think being at an old site, like, say a cave with human art…and saying “woah, a human touched this and drew this”…is WAY different that seeing actual barefoot prints of a human child right next to an adult that was interacting with their child. From 20,000 years ago. I can’t explain why, but that has such a spiritual quality and connection to the past. A human mother that undoubtedly was quite young herself, and who had undoubtedly lost children in their infancy already…was perhaps interacting with her first child that lived long enough to learn to walk and play…a human mother that cared and loved that child just as hard as we love our own 20,000 years later. Crazy.

[@kelliepatrick519]

Yes, it makes me very emotional, too. Every.Single.Time.

[@lilykatmoon4508]

Wow! This is mind blowing. When I was studying anthropology in the late 80s/early 90s for my BA, the Clovis culture was about as far back as most “respectable” anthropologists would consider for the peopling of the Americas. I remember one professor poo-poohing the idea that people could have been here earlier than that. Since finding intact human remains with date able DNA is more difficult the further back you go, it seems plausible to me that we just don’t have a big enough data pool to make more accurate statements about the genetic ancestry of modern Native Americans. What a fascinating video. Thanks for bringing the issue to our attention. Take care.

[@elizabethford7263]

Same!

[@cathjj840]

Even if no human bones were found at the site, there is a mamouth skeleton in Florida with a man made point stuck in its bone that was dated to 14,000 years ago. Of course, no evidence of which human population was responsible., tho' i believe the point was of a recognized cultural type.

[@JannickBahl]

most of youtube seems to scream these days. i'm so glad for your content! always great to learn something from someone who is honest and pts in the work.

[@TooLooze]

And he doesn't superimpose his face over half the frame the whole time.

[@johntomasini3916]

And not the overbearing dramatic noise we hearing impaired just can't stand. Thanks Stefan, always enjoy your video's.

[@HumanityKilledArt]

they're mine, sorry.

[@AllredGL]

No they’re not

[@reyray7184]

​@@AllredGL nO thEYrE nOt!

[@tedgunderson67]

Do better

[@user-ws1fs8re1u]

We're not angry, we're just disappointed. 😔

[@Yeast85]

You are telling fibs I bet. No way they’re yours

[@OscarEqualsLove]

I’m so glad you’ve got sponsors. I stumbled on this channel near when it began, and I’ve been watching all along. You deserve to have a much larger audience and have no doubt that you will - just a matter of time.

[@SupahTrunks7]

I think a big problem with trying to find genetic evidence of these people in indigenous populations is that the diseases that devastated their populations may have hugely skewed the data by wiping out the groups with the clearest connections. we would really want to be looking at pre-contact DNA if possible

[@usernamesrlamo]

A big problem is non cooperation of many American Indian tribes in genetic testing of remains. They fear being told they were not the first inhabitants and/or their claims to land and heritage may be incorrect.

[@tboned70]

​@@usernamesrlamothat fear is probably incorrect,......the fear of being poisoned is more relatable,.......we pretty much know the Native Americans are that, Native,....

[@kdugg]

Doesn’t take long for genetics to be washed away either. You only inherit 50 percent from each parent… me for instance, I have traceable family from not all that long ago who were black. But I have nothing but white dna from all of the most recent ancestors being white, By my generation all African dna has been lost.

[@garyindiana2127]

bro u don't know what ur talking about leave us alone as if actual evidence or ur own laws would ever stop yt people from genociding@@usernamesrlamo

[@alisav8394]

Another great video Stefan! I love how you unravel a whole story in just 16 minutes. It's detailed and backed up by research papers (love how you showed different articles when talking about aquatic plant dating) yet easy to understand. Keep on making more!

[@sovietarchaeomancer]

Great work as always. Bluefish Caves in Yukon, Canada is an interesting site when it comes ot the Beringian standstill hypothesis. I've a professor at my university that worked there multiple times. It's always interesting to see new evidence pushing back the first known occupations in the americas.

[@malcontender6319]

Commie.

[@hsmd4533]

I thought this was about bigfoot.

[@davelangford2439]

"dont hbomberguy me" really made me laugh!

[@evasartorius9528]

Thank you so much Steven I have been a fan of yours for years, and you and your channels growth is amazing. Happy New year and greater discoveries.

[@Snarge22]

Thanks for your efforts Stefan! As always, this is an interesting topic.

[@veronicaelenaholley9969]

Thank you Stefan, for always making such insightful and educational videos! You've really helped me get a better grasp of pre-history

[@electra424]

Thank you Stefan for creating such wonderfully educational content, and thank you for donating part of your hard earned sponsorship $$ to such a worthy cause. As an archaeology major who dropped out of college I cannot thank you enough for keeping me up to date on all the fascinating stuff going on in the field. You are the real deal, dude. Keep up the great work

[@Avogadros_number]

Why’d you drop out? Not being judge mental, just curious, I know life calls and has its own path for all of us.

[@electra424]

@@Avogadros_number I couldn't complete the necessary credits for my degree within four years for mental health reasons and I couldn't keep going after that for financial reasons... I always said I was going to go back but the older I get the less value I see in holding an actual degree. I got an excellent education and that was the end goal

[@davidhollenshead4892]

@@electra424 Perhaps you could use the ADA to convince the University to let you complete those credits. I had to transfer before the ADA because the University of Michigan wouldn't accommodate me because a drunk driver cost me my health while I was a student there, so I finished at Evergreen State College...

[@ieatgauffres4432]

another incredible and passionating video, thank you Stefan for the great work everytime! Can't wait for the next one!

[@M1412B]

You’re a good man, Stefan. Thanks for all these wonderful videos!

[@donwayne1357]

Well, have you heard anything about it?

[@SHADOWBEAR82763]

Big YES to your query at 14:50... they would not have stayed in northern climes (Beringia) any longer than necessary, always moving southward, towards the warmth of the sun, then they had to acclimate to their new surroundings, seeing what they had to work with in a new environment.

[@lorinewman6501]

I read a lot of different science and history articles, but I enjoy how you tell and delve into each subject and tell us what YOU think about them. So much to still discover! Thanks for all your content!!! Oh! And I went to White Sands National Park this past Spring! Sure wish we could go to the area where the prints are, but still amazing!

[@bustavonnutz]

These dates were only contentious or surprising to those that have ruined peoples' careers or slandered other academics who had the nerve to assert that their 12k year-old Bering Straight hypothesis could possibly be incorrect. From Pre-Clovis finds to ruins in the Amazon, it's been abundantly clear for decades that Humans have been in the Americas for tens of thousands of years, but the hubris/bias of modern Anthropologists has actively stifled legitimate research all over the planet.

[@polyphase4425]

Agreed! The old dinosaur Anthropologists make a great deal of assumptions, which is contrary to how I was taught to be a good scientist.

[@jackd1582]

​@@polyphase4425to yo yo yo 🤔

[@polyphase4425]

@@jackd1582 Yo! Aho! 🤘🏼🖖😎

[@elenapic6859]

Have you made a video with more info on the chiquihuite cave? I'd love to see a focus on that! As well as some discussion like this!

[@GraniteChief369]

Many times the way information is presented is as important as the info itself. You do a great job.

[@wardchapman5669]

Really good video. I just wanted to let you know that the mammoth footprints are from Columbian Mammoths. Woolly Mammoths didn’t go that far south.

[@moonknight4053]

Do you think mammoths walked alongside humans almost like humans could ride them? Or is that a fairytale?

[@wardchapman5669]

@@moonknight4053 it is not completely impossible. But as of right now, there isn’t any archaeological or paleontological evidence that I know of that suggests people rode mammoths.

[@federicogiana7430]

@@moonknight4053 Several species of Mammoths walked alongside archaic and modern humans. The evidence is overwhelming, I don't think there's a single scholar who despite that. Actually, Mammoths were a typical prey of our ancient humans, who most likely had a hand the their ultimate extinction. As per riding, I seriously doubt that, since the whole idea of riding or even taming animals came much later (possible exception: dogs, but dogs are a special case and maybe they self-domesticated).

[@moonknight4053]

@@wardchapman5669 Man that’ll be pretty cool though aye, btw, how far do u think native Americans date back?

[@wardchapman5669]

@@moonknight4053 I don’t know. They could end up finding sites even older than this one.

[@OkieDokieSmokie]

They have castings of the creatures so detailed that they can see print on their skin, and can track individuals over the years through their scars that literally heal.

[@kyleinnes4963]

I swear you’re one of the only channels where i actually watch the sponsorship ad, it doesn’t feel scripted or fake, good job man

[@baphhhzzz]

Discovered your channel today, I'm hooked. Great work

[@jtdub-wanders]

My hypothesis is that the genetics are correct and that white sands footprints are correct. People were likely entering the Americas at 15-18k years ago, however there were populations of people who were already here. They likely entered the Americas through the bearing land bridge or even arrived by boat in South America’s pacific coast.

[@TheRst2001]

I forget the exact dates but the extinction data graphs on Google etc for large animals in the americas is quite compelling and matches a mass wave of human migration around 16k say . There is also a blip before that date from memory which also matches 20 to 30k . Humans are excellent at wiping out other human populations in very short time , from violence and new diseases .

[@85jacob85]

You're a champ Stefan. Your videos are great.

[@daniverson5860]

Love it love it love it. Great work once again Stefan. YoobTube and the rest of the internets are so much better for having your stuff on it. It literally makes my day whenever I see a new Stefan Milo video has been uploaded. I gotta think you have some pretty lucky kids.

[@hollyodii5969]

Excellent and thought provoking video. I hope we find so much more!

[@jrocks1971]

Stefan - I think this has to be my favorite KZbin channel of all time - and I am a KZbin veteran from the very beginning. I love your vibe - and the information is so fascinating. Keep up the good work!

[@chrisj.1608]

I think your first hypothesis is the correct one I've noticed the disturbing trend when it comes to archeology that they're not willing to bend on the established timeline and as you pointed out in your video here they've had three independent tests that have confirmed the footprints are 21 to 23000 years old and you still have an archaeologist who is like well we don't know if they're really that old

[@gobgoerrsarah]

A lot of science is really talking about the data and saying what it indicates, rather than coming to a factual conclusion. Data can be interpreted it many different ways. You have to put together many pieces of data to really get most scientists to agree on something

[@Just.A.T-Rex]

Because we dont

[@hedgehog3180]

Even if the dating is solid it would be unscientific to accept these findings uncritically. You need to ask questions like how those humans could have gotten there and what wider implications this has. The benefit of the established timeline is that all of those questions have already been answered.

[@taistelusammakko5088]

Where is all the critical thinking? Why should we just accept something as a fact immidiately? Who knows what we will find in something liike 100 years

[@stefthorman8548]

​@@taistelusammakko5088"why should we accept new stuff, although we're outdated, the new stuff will be outdated later on as well" that's what you essentially said

[@DIREWOLFx75]

Well, this IS a lovely find. I had already essentially decided that the older finds were for real and that the early migration to Americas came considerably earlier than previously considered possible, but seeing evidence of it, is just glorious. It's going to be hilarious to drop this on people who have so far claimed that migration was impossible before the melting.

[@DIREWOLFx75]

@ConontheBinarian Absolutely. The question is how realistic it is and if so to what extent and also whether the possibility of it being realistic at all will be admitted. How much of a -whatever floats well enough to be useful- were people capable of building 30 thousand years ago? Canoes and rafts capable of coastal travel, almost certainly yes.

[@cathjj840]

Wasn't there a relatively long warm(ish) period just beforthe last glacial maximum. I'm also partisan of seafaring as a likely means of migration. After all, isn't that how the aboriginal Australians got tp their continent 50,000 years ago. ? And although much later, how other SE Asian populations made it to the very distant, isolated and theretofore unknown Pacific islands and not using any technology from culturally advanced civilizations?

[@DIREWOLFx75]

@@cathjj840 "After all, isn't that how the aboriginal Australians got tp their continent 50,000 years ago." Well, kinda? At the time, due to the lower water levels, you had Sundaland and Sahul. Sahul was Australia+New Guinea as a single landmass, MUCH larger than modern Australia, while Sundaland is the Malayas plus Java, Borneo, Sumatra. And there may have been outright landbridges between the two. But even if not, the distance over open water needed to be travelled anywhere was extremely limited. So, on the one hand, it does prove the capability, but OTOH, it was very minimal. "And although much later, how other SE Asian populations made it to the very distant, isolated and theretofore unknown Pacific islands and not using any technology from culturally advanced civilizations?" I think you seriously need to correct yourself there, because the Oceania cultures were VERY advanced in some ways. They just had some ironic drawbacks that longterm worked against them. Mostly the easy availability of some foodstuff, like breadfruit. It made basic survival so easy that while it allowed the extremely rapid creation of advanced civilisations, it also greatly reduced their longterm investment into developing further in many areas. Still though, the things they DID develop, like the Polynesian navigators, even with what little has survived to today, the skill shown is utterly amazing. Just very sad that old Polynesian maps were so completely dismissed until recently, for the stupid reason that us advanced people simply didn't understand how they were drawn. Instead of being drawn as direct geographical representations, they were instead drawn based on traveltime, like a drastically more advanced variation on how such travelmaps were used in ancient Rome.

[@cathjj840]

@@DIREWOLFx75 Without going into the details, I was in fact basing my inferences on the very things you brought up. I'm glad you cared to share your explanations and further pertinent information, as I'm sure many people who not aware of such could take these suggestions to be mere idle speculation.

[@timstorey7915]

Stefan, great video! Maybe it’s just me, but your videos the last 6 to 12 months have been increasingly awesome! Keep up the great work!

[@PortlandLife]

Another fascinating video, Thanks Stefan!!

[@DanielleGlick]

You do such a great job of explaining these finds. I especially love how you put a relatable human story into the archeological discoveries.

[@maxcombest2602]

Will always enjoy your work Stefan. Just fantastic to watch your channel grow over the years.

[@alex1967max]

I really looked forward to your content . Keep up the great work .

[@dahemac]

I had been hoping you would cover this for ages.

[@levifowler7933]

I think the must pronounced difference between the likes of Hancock and the common archeologist is how they approach a site. Hancock doesn't even do archeology, but he comes in looking to find fragments of evidence that he can run with while ignoring the bulk of what's found. Real archeologists are thrilled to see things that confound their previous theories, like White Sands. A true archeologist has love of growing knowledge, no matter who is proven wrong. People like Hancock love their own ideas and refuse all evidence against them.

[@loke6664]

I think the real difference is that Hancock first made a theory and is looking to prove it. A real archaeologist look at the site first and then make a theory that fit what he or she found there. The funny thing is that Hancock rants about archaeologists being biased when it's really him that is. Archaeologists or to be more exact, antiquarians used to be like that too once. It was really Flinders Petri's ideas about strata and how to dig a site that changed a lot of that. But if you go to a site and only want to prove whatever theory you have and ignore anything that points to something else then you usually find yourself right. However, that isn't science. Look on all the evidence from the any site, try to understand the different layers and their date and all the artifacts found there, then you can make a call what was going on.

[@johns1625]

I firmly believe that if Hancock had a Southern USA accent and did not wear glasses nobody would have ever listened to a word he said about anything.

[@loke6664]

@@johns1625 No, he is charismatic, I don't think there is any doubt about that. Sadly, being charismatic is way more effective to get people believing you then to be competent (just look on any politician).

[@Arkantos117]

Rent free.

[@user-uo2pc8ng3b]

@@johns1625 I think that goes for about anyone with a strong southern accent. I think what you said can just be boiled down to the notion that his charisma does all the heavy lifting in his career. This could probably be further boiled down to "the man's a grifter"

[@cheddarbeansoup]

Something to learn yet calm the mind. You're truly my favorite creator.

[@simonward-horner7605]

Thanks, Stefan. A truly fascinating site, incredible discoveries!

[@wolfgangthiele2785]

I have been waiting for this one. Thanks!

[@KevinLarsson42]

Huge thanks for making these videos, it's always a joy to watch them. So much of native indians history and culture has been lost to us from the passage of time but also as a byproduct of colonisation, the only right thing to do is to get to the bottom of these mysteries.

[@spiffyg4939]

Stefan, I have nothing to add to the debate. I just want to say I absolutely love these videos. They peak my imagination. I find my mind drifting back to them again and again, always wondering where we humans started and how we arrived at this current state. Keep exploring and rewarding us with your fascinating insights.

[@eldorado5319]

Thanks Stefan, awesome video 👍

[@tarna1243]

Just rewatched the nova episode about the white sands footprints the other day so this was a great coincidence :D loved the video Stephan

[@nursemom101casteel7]

That's not a coincidence. Your phone was listening and the algorithm picked up that you were interested in it and voila.

[@luckyblockyoshi]

@@nursemom101casteel7it absolutely is a coincidence that Stefan happened to upload this video right after he watched that documentary..

[@NastySasquatch]

The bit that gets me is no one ever really wants to just listen to what natives say. Even though the pnw is a perfect example of blowing off the native stories to find out they were 100% spot on, even if they had mythology infused. Modern natives claim to have come here and found existing populations they they lived with fought with and merged with. And those populations still exist in the oldest clans carrying down stories from before those people came. But no one wants to believe.

[@lanmarknetworking3034]

Most Woodland Natives say they came from holes in the ground... you shouldn't EVER form pre-existing biases if you can avoid it TBH..

[@sergioromanomunoz8155]

The thing about this is that we need evidence. Science is not about belief, is about evidence. If there was such a population that merged with the ancestors of native americans, there should be traces on their DNA of that population. This doesn't automatically rule out the possibility, not at all. Maybe we haven't found those genetic traces, maybe that population went extinct with little to no mix with the newcomers, maybe it was another species altogether but there's no evidence. To put this point on perspective, there is clear evidence of at least two, maybe more, waves of immigration into the Americas from Siberia, where there's still populations that are the most closely related to native americans. Of course, myths and legends are a guide, we have several sites all over the world, from America to Europe and everywhere in between, that has their own version of a story called "The Cosmic Hunt" that could have been originated back to 40,000+ years ago. The same happens with the myth of the Great Flood, that apparently originated when the seas flooded Southeast Asia turning that land into isolated islands and spreading the myth well into America and Australia. But we need evidence.

[@sharpienate]

"100% spot on" and "mythology infused" are directly contradictory. All descriptive claims about nature and history should be substantiated with empirical evidence. Period.

[@raykinney9907]

I think that quite a few of us 'pinkish folk' are fascinated with the paleo history realities that are a huge puzzle to try to figure out, mistake after mistake, but slowly clarifying the past with evidence through scientific method. But, at the same time, many of us are VERY interested in what traces of these same past events are reflected though the oral histories of current peoples! These lines of evidence are NOT mutually exclusive, but two very valid modes of seeking evidence, converging toward deeper understanding of paleo reality. IMHO

[@julianshepherd2038]

Archeology is about evidence not stories.

[@kamilakennedy2686]

Thank you for this incredible information and documentation. Brilliant.

[@elihinze3161]

Your videos never fail to delight!

[@Ghost2743]

The REASONABLE picture is that the Amerindian arrival in Alaska was more like 30kya and the genetic gap is from the great time, distanceS, and the LGM ramping up post 28kya. We have the sites, it's the archaeologists who are stuck in the mud.

[@MossyMozart]

Many of the costal sites that could provide information are now under water.

[@kivadacosta]

I went to White Sands in winter 2021, the same time as Texas' grid collapse nightmare. It was something like 30 degrees and the tips of dunes were accented with snow -- even cooler, digging anywhere revealed a layer of snow just underneath. Also, hi Stefan :) small edit/context: I've lived in Monterey and San Jose my whole life so idk if that's just how snow works w sand in general lol

[@MARGATEorcMAULER]

Very cool episode Stefan, thanks 👍

[@markbarber7839]

Thanks for the video. As always it's good to keep an open mind

[@eyetrollin710]

Last week my sister had to go for genetic testing because she has a very aggressive cancer and she really shouldn't because we don't have it in our jeans but anyway they said wow you're a true mix of everything which I've always known but what was interesting is they said she has three markers for ghost populations, I wasn't there so I didn't get to question exactly what they meant but they did tell her that normally if anyone does have any you know it's one marker and that's definitely not for all of the population. Now I know why I'm so obsessed with these topics

[@krono5el]

Its just crazy to think anything of ancient American origin survived these last 400 years, that's a miracle in its own right.

[@BlueSky16161616]

Great work Stefan. I visited atapuerca this summer. And I just finished masters in history. Your vids have hooked me. Keep up good work.

[@jwilsss]

Thank you so much for these videos

[@dariustiapula]

Sorry guys. I was taking a leak outside the time machine. Damn things should have a bathroom.😅

[@SergiuSalcau00]

Ce ma

[@swfcocs1]

Ah comedy gold😅

[@DaVultureTTG]

Bro you had a whole lake 😂

[@federicogiana7430]

You shouldn't let your kids pester the giant sloths. Those can have quite a temper, trust me...

[@robertwilliams450]

Well the tardis has a dining room, lounge and a bedroom but no bathroom

[@Pouncer9000]

Hang on.. 8:24 if aquatic plants are pulling old carbon isotopes out of the mud wouldn't that lead to a higher concentration of C14, which in turn would make them appear _younger_ that what really are? Edit: Oh I get it now: plants in this day are pulling C14 from sediments and thus ancient remnants, in turn making them look older. But... plants back in the day could've pulled C14 from even older sediment and again thrown the proportions...

[@KitAlda]

Exactly. Which is why it was tentative that the date was correct. But since the other dating methods agreed with the radio carbon date, it turned out that these plants didn't pull older carbon, at least not in any significant amount.

[@andybreckenridge4461]

Not old carbon from sediments, but from dissolved CO2 in water. Submerged aquatic plants get their CO2 from water, not the atmosphere. CO2 in the water can be from the air, but it can also be from limestone (made of calcium-carbon-oxygen), that dissolves - and limestone has no carbon 14, which produces dissolved CO2 with no carbon 14.

[@dukedorian6817]

Great job as always 🎉❤

[@tomg3903]

Thanks for another awesome video, you never fail to amaze

[@ancientyoke]

Hahaha I love it, to picture little hunter gatherer children playing and running about as the family track a ground sloth is so heart warming.

[@Mr._Fit_Atheist]

This is a side interest of mine, being an atheist and interested in human origins... you do a great job of delivering the various points of view. Thank you.

[@jaynovella5291]

Tell your daughters they did a nice job! Thank you for the content and kudos on the great background. It really highlights the effectiveness of the camo pattern on the rifle.

[@dukeon]

Great video Stefan!

[@mattstevenson1334]

Stefan is always here for us with the latest in Paleo archeological gossip!!

[@tothelighthouse9843]

Indigenous people have been telling us for decades that their ancestors were here long before science has acknowledged. Science didn't listen to the oral histories Indigenous people shared, of course. But it's nice to see science is finally acknowledging the truth of what Indigenous ppl have been saying the whole time.

[@jamesherrington5606]

Thank you for posting this. I’d love ❤️ to hear your thoughts. I have so many questions.

[@margeryk000]

Thanks for another great video!

[@HydroMaester]

A couple of things to remember about scientist. 1. We like to argue about things, and 2. We really love to argue about the tiny details! I tend to agree with your 3rd possibility, we are right, but are coming to the wrong conclusions, due to lack of additional evidence. The two approaches will at some point converge to an almost the same answer, but you will always have some discrepancy due to what the methods are measuring.

[@LimeyLassen]

In science, finding out you were wrong can be more fun than being right sometimes.

[@eljanrimsa5843]

@@LimeyLassen It would be no fun to find out that humans did not arrive prior to 15,000 years ago. Everybody wants to believe the older dates, but it's difficult to understand which dates are supported by good evidence and which are speculative interpretations of isolated data points.

[@raykinney9907]

Yes, and it is NOT science unless you are always trying desperately to Prove yourself wrong! IMHO@@LimeyLassen

[@elleoat]

Love the impact of Hbomberguy's video has spread so fast across the KZbin people are all referencing it lol. Loved this video btw

[@liannetoop1785]

Those footprints give me goosebumps, the science is beautiful & mind-blowing! I have been watching everything you produce since 2020 (went back to watch older ones) how things change 😂 just ❤ the content 😊

[@allanfahrenhorst-jones6118]

Another great video. Keep up the good work. 👍❤️😇

[@FacesintheStone]

Always here for a Stefan upload. Thank you 🙏

[@FacesintheStone]

5:03 it’s not unique - you can see the people from the ancient past if you study the stones and learn and believe that every single rock that is laying around was brought to their present location by a human- rocks are photo albums- there’s no geological explanation that every single one is carryable by a human being and surprisingly up until now, I haven’t heard a lot of people talking about this.

[@FacesintheStone]

8:20 did you know that as an American citizen, you are not able to carbon date anything within the United States? Have you ever tried it? Not many people have but I have. I used to think everyone was just some kind of weird conspiracy theorist until I saw it for myself. Germany has accepted it and does tours through their megalithic statues, which looks just like the statues that are in New England😅 a.k.a. the United States

[@jonmars9559]

There will have to be more discoveries to draw better conclusions. The genetic relationship between Native American populations and ancestral populations in Siberia suggest a connection at around 23 to 24 thousand years ago. Dating at White Sands is within that range but barely. Also, White Sands is deep within the interior which suggesting there was sufficient time to travel there. That tightens the time frame even more but still remains possible. When it comes to the Beringia Standstill Hypothesis, there is also the possibility that there was a window of opportunity that allowed for migration routes to the Americas 24,000 years ago that closed up leaving some in the Americas and some trapped in Beringia. Having the same basic genetic makeup, two separate migrations into the Americas thousands of years apart would be hard to differentiate through genetic studies alone. What would be ideal is the discovery of 23,000 year old bone with recoverable genetic material. Wishful thinking? Yeah probably but that would answer a number of nagging questions.

[@ninaalceraz-gc4vh]

Exciting video, thanks.

[@grantbartley483]

Stefan, I like your content so much I liked the video even before I watched it.

[@woodygilson3465]

When I heard about the results of the recent test results confirming the initial dating, I knew to be watching for my subscriber notification any day now. Now to actually watch it. 😆 Edit: Yep, good stuff. The dating difference between genetics and the footprints is a real head scratcher. You'll let us know how that shakes out, won't you? ☺

[@hbomberguy]

👀

[@BairyHalls757]

👁️

[@LuxisAlukard]

Wow, that's some next level documentary you have here!

[@troelsandersen9654]

Thank you Stefan. Every time your videos pop up, its´Christmas!

[@merefinl6914]

Genuinely curious about how these footprints get exposed and discovered. The team mentioned that they appear and disappear quite quickly, so what allows them to be preserved for so long? Are they covered by sediment which reveals them after erosion? I'm not familiar with the process!

[@jamesonpace726]

Under water, then under sand, in this case....

[@jakasmalakas]

​@jamesonpace726 Yeah, but how are they cleanly exposed? That doesn't answer the question at all.

[@thecurrentmoment]

​@@jakasmalakasprobably wind eroding the different layers of rock, and because new sediment settles as a layer over the top of the footprint depression (which is probably compacted so slightly harder) there is a slight separation between the layers, so one layer would wear off quicker, leaving the footprint outline. Something like that

[@merefinl6914]

@@thecurrentmoment That would explain why it's important that the site is both a former lake and very windy. Thanks for teaching me something!

[@boofriggityhoo]

I think it's pretty clear that there were multiple phases of migration. We say "Native Americans" like they're one group, but they're not. South Americans are quite distinct looking from North Americans, and even just in North America, Native American tribes from further north clearly aren't entirely of the same genetic makeup as say, a Navajo native. It's very likely that those prints were absolutely left by Native Americans, but ones that made their way further south and not the ones currently in the area.

[@chrisboogerd3031]

I’m loaded as hell. But I still come back to your video I love your work. There are many history channels but this one is the best. Even though I can’t make sense of any of it right now I probably be watchijf again tomorrow. Jkeep it up Stefan you mean a lot to me and I’m certain to many more people.

[@LTV_inc]

Beautiful minds, exceptional work. Thank you! 😊

[@stevenkies802]

As for the genetic evidence, we should consider that there is a huge bottleneck in the modern population. European colonization led to a huge die off. Perhaps the surviving population's divergence dates back to 15000 years by chance, but the larger precolonial population had an earlier date of divergence.

[@peterg9729]

That's not a bottleneck. You have tribes still living which ware 3,000 miles apart with not a jot of interbreeding for over 10,000 years. Which causes problems for the idea that the Baringian bottleneck took place in North America, which as our host states is a very large place. You would have a massive wave of immigration which spread out over two continents, then almost all died out before a small remnant spread out all over again. And all in a very short space of time.

[@stevenkies802]

@@peterg9729 A large propoerion of the precolonial native american population was wiped out by disease, colonial warfare and repressive policies. It would be imposible for any population to not experience a loss of genetic diversity under those circumstances.

[@tehbonehead]

@@stevenkies802 not a significant number of modern tribes were completely wiped out. Large quantities of each tribe were wiped out, but not enough that the tribe's unique genetic data was lost.

[@FindTheFun]

Wow, mammoth tracks next to human footprints. Imagine being the archeologist to discover THAT!

[@stingylizard]

Good stuff! If ya'll get a chance,visit the Gault site in Texas. Plus,a site just down the road from Gault. The Horn Shelter,outside of Waco. All pre-Clovis,apparently

[@rayvanwayenburg998]

I just want to say I really enjoy your videos. I have no expertise in archeology but it’s like you say - it’s human to be curious.