The New Class War author: How the PMC ruined everything

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

I love that the conversation is slowly shifting from race to class.

[@keysersoze8648]

Aaron that's because the Democrats and MSM are now slowly losing that bogus argument, so their switching it to class warfare instead of race. The Democrats, Rinos, and MSM, who are now totally one in the same, strategy is the same as it's always been, divide and conquer. There must be division in the country for Democrats, Rinos, and MSM, to continue to rule, over people like you and me.

[@tiny_toilet]

@@keysersoze8648 What? No. The last thing the Establishment wants is attention on class and the wealth gap. To deny that sounds like a conservative take that's equally as ignorant as denying the pseudo-"woke" centrist Dems' obsession with identity politics.

[@TheEvolver311]

@@keysersoze8648 you forgot to include the GOP and Fox is MSM and play the same identity politics game they just play the white majority side of it.

[@yfna1]

@@keysersoze8648 And you are proposing an equally divisive position. " The Democrats, Rinos, and MSM, who are now totally one in the same" I know those good GOP politicians they are just the best and never play class warfare, or race baiting, nope, no sir, never, not once....

[@brandonshaw27]

keyser soze because trump doesn’t use the divide and conquer strategy.

[@nikhilsengupta]

Everyday Rising makes a playlist - and everyday that playlist is in the wrong order

[@YwTrM]

Lol this needs more upvotes

[@GreyRock100]

Blame management

[@goatsuckervonsasquatch644]

I don't mind it

[@papillon93280]

go vite for trump

[@darinsingleton3553]

I totally hear you, and it used to drive me a bit nuts. The solution takes an extra step: Click on "The Hill" logo under the title, and that will take you to the top of their page that has the correct roll out for that day's video segments.

[@chetzmom65]

He seems to think this a Neoliberal problem, NOT a Conservative or NeoCon problem. No one is talking about making all the rich people poor, that's a stupid argument. It's about reducing economic inequality.

[@MichaelJordan-xp3yb]

he and sagaar sound like Blue Labour advocates

[@ianhesford]

Just what I was thinking.

[@stevecatanzaro2392]

It's both. Nobody's more entitled than neoliberals. Neocons are murderous crud.

[@dukedematteo1995]

You should care about making poor people wealthier, not making rich people poorer...

[@Lambda_Ovine]

It is a neoliberal problem as well though.

[@d34dmantwoguns]

The "roving cavaliers of credit" as Marx called them are hard at work.

[@Revolution-tl5wo]

I disagree that the "working class" is defined by degreed credentials. I have many people in my circle working for $15 an hour with Masters' Degrees. Conversely, you can get into pharma sales w/ a H.S. diploma and make $300,000 a year selling cancer drugs.

[@matts8708]

Degrees are basically products now. They don't guarantee access anymore, and their ability to improve access has diminished considerably over the years and in many cases keep people from making money, starting families, and starting entrepreneurial ventures due to high student loan payments.

[@ethangburke]

And which is more likely to Donald? The credentialed $15/he or successful sales rep w/ hs degree? I think it’s murky but he’s got a good point buried in there

[@ShinyZETER]

I agree. Working class should be exactly what it says on the tin. People with nothing to trade in the market for a living but their labor.

[@reinux]

Also, most extreme example, Bill Gates has no degree.

[@MonMalthias]

@@reinux But he did have capital, both from his parents, coming from a family with a larger than median income, and also social capital, connections that he developed during his short stint in college as well as with other software companies that he used to build Microsoft's reputation until that fateful contract with IBM. In that sense, I believe that Lind's analysis is a little incomplete. It is not education that provides upward mobility, or even extreme wealth concentration as with Bill Gates. Instead, it is connections and capital. Education used to be one of the ways to get connections, but now it is no longer the case that being highly educated will necessarily get you the social capital to break into the upper strata of society.

[@RaysDad]

Populism will stem the tide of neoliberalism, and that's what I care about in the short-term. Whether or not populism is the ultimate approach to end all others is an academic question that can be debated at our leisure.

[@austintrousdale2397]

Ray's Dad Any system can be exploited by bad actors. MSM has increasingly traded journalistic integrity for ratings and clicks. Voters have to take more responsibility for becoming informed not inflamed. Polarization serves those who benefit from the divide discussed in this segment and many others streamed on Rising.

[@antediluvianatheist5262]

@@austintrousdale2397 That's capitalism for you.

[@sohandesai4055]

Exactly, the important thing to remember is populism should be short term solution. Populism in the long run is a bad idea.

[@cjohnson3836]

@@sohandesai4055 This is nonsense. The author is simply hand waving. When he talks of mobilization of the working class through numerical strength, i.e. unionization, he is literally talking about populism-mobilization of the lower classes to win through their numerical strength. His notion of "consensus democracy", at least as he described here, is little more than campfire kumbaya. Yes, everyone just go get along and things will be magically better.

[@Michael_Paul585]

Populism stemmed the tide of neoliberalism in Weimar Germany and also in Italy around the same time. Just saying.

[@Monkeybongoes]

Calling someone earning $200K/yr "rich" is misguided. There are people getting more than that monthly in "unearned income" (money made off money). They are the true enemy of working people.

[@Ms_Kymm]

I think he meant, to a 'WHOLE LOT' of us working people, that is rich! I lot of us work hard our whole lives in labor & don't come anywhere near $200k/yr

[@1monki]

The issue isn't that someone has a few extra bucks. The issue is with people gaining enough wealth to warp government to their benefit and against the democratic will. We end up with an economy and legal system which is benevolent to the rich and ruthless to the poor.

[@Newton14alan]

@@Ms_Kymm ---Damn right. Hell, with 200 grand, I could pay off my house...and then go out , and buy a second home! If you're bringing home $200,000 a year, you're doing just fine.

[@Newton14alan]

@@1monki --- We're not going to "end up" that way...We're already THERE. We might "end up" getting WORSE, but that's another story.

[@1monki]

@@Newton14alan I didn't say "going to" or "will". I wasn't talking about the future.

[@HarySTruman]

The division of class through educational credentials seems incredibly flawed. There are plenty of highly educated people that would be considered working class.

[@IshtarNike]

I actually thought he was going there at first...I was disappointed.

[@ivandafoe5451]

@Eugene Stoner Apparently you couldn't.

[@danielsilk4610]

@Eugene Stoner Leftist here. You're not wrong.

[@fuuuursure]

@Eugene Stoner wait so you don't like charlatans with goals of gaining power, enriching themselves at the expense of the people they claim to represent, and a cult of personality surrounding them? you must really hate trump then.

[@erikjarandson5458]

Yes and no. If you consider education to be a form of capital, they'll be more "failed capitalists" than working class. When it comes to values, they also tend to be very different, and have higher representation in circles of power. He should possibly have chosen a different term, or specified more, but it's not an unimportant distinction he's making.

[@hcpalmer]

This guy is just advocating for cosmetic change around the edges...not interested!

[@laurier3348]

Because he's white.

[@markbrownner6565]

he provides some good observations but may bot have good answers..what's your solution??

[@laurier3348]

@@markbrownner6565 Both to the Gulag.

[@fuzzyplasmacat6357]

"The premise is: people in democracies are naturally divided into groups" Wrong, the premise for your entire book is wrong. People in democracies are ARTIFICIALLY divided into groups by the various powers that control their lives.

[@AuntAgatha0fullmoon]

Fuzzy PlasmaCat thank you!! I was waiting for someone to realize this!!

[@persebra]

I think you have artificial and naturally divided groups, not one or the other. I have read a Lind book before, and I think his ideas can be complex- its better to read the book before making a judgement one way or the other.

[@Diatonic5th]

"Faith traditions to be brought together on different *GOVERNMENT* boards". WRONG! I had a felling that this author's perfectly polished speech was hiding something... and this is it.

[@user-uy6uc5ey5q]

agree. When he states at 6.25 that working class people "on both sides of the atlantic" attend traditional churches, can see his agenda which is divorced from the facts. Walk into a Church of England service in Britain and numbers are tiny and lean very heavily middle class (which in UK means comfortably well off). Britain has a regular church attendance of only 10% www.theguardian.com/world/2018/nov/14/attendance-church-of-england-sunday-services-falls-again www.compassionuk.org/02-million-people-attending-church-regularly/ whereas people who say there no God is 39% faithsurvey.co.uk/uk-christianity.html I lived over 20 yrs ago in northern England in a city which had deindustrialised and traveled a bit visiting Churches and cathedrals (I'm an atheist but like old architecture) all over the country and numbers in former working class areas churches was much lower than in wealthier parts. This included lots of closed churchers. Since I've left I had lived the US till a few years ago and there's higher attendance in places like California's Bay area than in England. Britain is very secular, more so in lower income communities outside recent immigrants (and even those are seeing declines). Trying to claim this as not so and link it back to US situation shows the author has hypothesis he pushing devoid of facts.

[@JesseDylanMusic]

I think you're having a knee-jerk reaction. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.; is part of the faith tradition. We can have that without having "faith traditions" like the white fundamentalist fascist Christian doomsday cults we have right now in the US.

[@scdingundaroo]

He was also talking about the past how _traditionally_ mainstream churches represented an opportunity for working class people to express allegence and demonstrate power-by-numbers in cultural matters. In the same way that trade unions _traditionally_ fulfilled the same role in industrial relations. However _today_ both institutions have broken down. Culture is dominated by a technocratic, paternalistic “woke” identity movement that is promulgated through media (both mass and social). Economic opportunity is being squeezed by the failure of the manufacturing sector and increased competition for entry level service work. Mainstream churches haven’t offered a way forward for their traditional membership against both of these issues and so their churches are empty. People have given up their religious affiliations or sought new experiences of belonging in these fundamentalist “prosperity gospel” churches (that interestingly do have a message for people who are economically disadvantaged) So what he is saying fits in well with the idea that working class people have abandoned the church.

[@tjmul3381]

Simon Davis, Well said, sir. Whereas, the decline of the power of labor unions has been purposely enabled by the disciplines of the “free market” through both cultural propaganda and political corruption. There is a factor that I would add to the decline of the Mainstream Churches. That is the slow, but steady, rise in the number of people who no longer believe in the existence of a supernatural, most commonly paternalistic, deity (or deities). As rational thought and scientific discoveries have replaced the role and accomplishments traditionally attributed to these beings, so has the authority of the officials of these faiths diminished along with the commonly accepted practices of unquestioned acceptance of fealty to one’s “superior being” and that being’s “anointed” leaders. The corresponding erosion of aristocratic authority, “divinely ordained”, has also left exposed the fallacy of obscene wealth being the result of favoritism from said “god(s)”. This has brought into question the morality of so few having so much while so many have so little. The return of the popularity and power of labor unions will realign industrial relations. Yet, I wonder what will replace the social power that religious affiliations once had?

[@girlwhomustnotbenamed4139]

@@JesseDylanMusic Still, no matter what faith traditions he is talking about, once he thinks religious representatives should be on government boards, it's a hard no. That's how theocracies work, no point in trying to explain it away.

[@AQuietNight]

Many problems we have today were created by people who have degrees from Harvard. Considering the results, a degree from Harvard can not be worth too much.

[@chasquiswashingbeez8427]

You assume the problems "we" face are problems for people going to Harvard. They're not.

[@chasquiswashingbeez8427]

@Eugene Stoner Ah yes, Marx, Engels, Kropotkin, Gramscii, Parenti, Liebknicht, Luxembourg, Sanders, AOC, Chomsky... All leftist luminaries that went to Harvard. I nut in shame.

[@njm3211]

Brings to mind McNamara and all the brilliance he brought to the war in Vietnam.

[@AQuietNight]

@@chasquiswashingbeez8427 Harvard is just one example and it is considered by many as the blue plate special of a university education. But I will revise and extend my remarks: Virtually all colleges produced the duds we call intelligence. Better?

[@AQuietNight]

@@njm3211 McNamara did admit he got things wrong. One must credit him for that. Many never admit to the error.

[@trusarmor4957]

Remember when scholars said black people had smaller brains and were happiest when singing and dancing in the fields? better watch those scholarly analysis

[@joeows6537]

Until Campaign Finance is addressed, as well as Gerrymandering, voter suppression and re-districting, nothing can be changed within our Political system. Other than an article V, move to amend the Constitution to remove Citizens United, Taxpayer funded elections would eliminate most of this problem and ease the transition towards Democracy again.

[@Gkuljian]

This is a must watch video if you're looking for solutions. Gravel is way above the discussion on this. We need a systemic change. None of our changes are actually systemic aside from what he is proposing. It was removed from the Constitution in 1779. "Mike Gravel on Bernie Sanders, Julian Assange, and the Future of Progressivism"

[@TheEvolver311]

You are exonerating the electorate which bought into the free trade supply side economics agenda that has brought our country to its current condition. Newt Gingrich realigned the Republican electoral strategy to a strictly oppositional position exactly because he recognized that with the Third Way Democrats there is no economic argument to have they both service the wealthy corporate ruling class with the only disagreements coming at which corporate powers should receive subsidies over others.

[@joeows6537]

@@Gkuljian I traveled the U.S. in the Occupy Wall Street WikiV, so I am partial to Assange, Manning as well as Snowden. Without a free media as well as whistle blowers, who will keep the establishment honest? As far as the "Establishment"... I would Indict the entire system. The next Prez is gonna have a lot on their plate, Bernie Sanders and millions of volunteers are on standby as we speak, ready to hit the ground running on day one! #OccupyAllStreets (Yep, good interview!)

[@Gkuljian]

@@joeows6537 Until we have a people's legislature, even people like Bernie or Tulsi will be stymied by even a Democratic Congress. We have to be the ones enacting laws. I am so energized by Gravel. And I've been feeling hopeless, battling the ignorant trolls on these live stream chats. We're goofing around if we think even ranked choice voting will help. Great idea, but not systemic.

[@joeows6537]

@@Gkuljian Bernie has 5 million volunteers, ready to get to work on day one of Sanders Presidency. When the people lead, the leaders will follow.... bet on that! I like Gravel, he opposed Goldwater back in the day, and giving someone like Goldwater a bleedin ulcer is a good man in my book!

[@pitchforksarecoming]

Unions often don't follow their own policies/processes! There's a need for legislation there to protect the members against hostile takeovers by beholden managers/leaders.

[@davidbates3057]

This is my concern with unions too. I think an organised workforce that has power is important. But the problem with unions as they are is that they've not evolved with the times. Those who get into power within them being beholden to big business is a huge issue. But so is the massive discrepancy in their striking power dependant on what industry they're in. And the very nature of membership fees encourages exclusion for those on low wages who are arguably the people who need union representation the most.

[@crosstraffic187]

@@davidbates3057 Perhaps unions should be nationalised, that way a strike shuts down the whole country, giving them much more power.

[@sanwalyousaf]

This is why l think cooperative models of companies are the next phase of union organizing

[@markromine5103]

This inherent weakness of unions is too rarely discussed. Planning how to maintain and protect them is just as important as creating them.

[@originalBongoCat]

The weakness of unions is a result of a disloyal leadership buying into bourgeois politics, playing by capitalist rules, organizing their membership along management-approved craft lines, limiting their actions to the confines of the capitalist state, so that we now have a reduction of union protected jobs and industries and a growth of the "right-to-work (really, corporate right-to-exploit)" to states. This is what we get for the fake unity of labor/management schemes. If unions thoroughly purged their leadership of these sellout misleaders, we could end the wars with a general strike for peace.

[@TCt83067695]

Can we get Anand on the show to explain his disagreement pls? #RisingQs

[@AuntAgatha0fullmoon]

TCt83067695 exactly!! His article actually had some great points!

[@ongoinglife]

Yeah, PLEASE invite people like Anand Giridharadas ( author of "winners take all" book) or Dr. Cornel West !

[@sdpell8487]

@@ongoinglife AND Thomas Frank (rumored to be writing a book on the history of populism)!

[@rawprawn8198]

You might need to get him to actually read the book first, tho.

[@skonther0ck]

Religious leaders on government boards? Did he really say that? Why so many references to religion? I don’t have faith haha in this guy at all.

[@rodrigoodonsalcedocisneros9266]

Religious is an institution that draws the lower working class. He is talking from a scholar P.O.V. the religious institutions actually play an important role in many countries be it african, asian or european. There's no denying it. Personally, i despise religion but I can see where does his comments come from. In any case, it is just one of many possible institutions that can solidify the working class power, the other nicer ones are unions and political groups.

[@Aeyekay0]

Micheal brooks would love this. He should get him on his show or majority report.

[@Bluebelle51]

or just get Thomas Frank who wrote this same book many years ago it's called "Listen Liberal"

[@TheEvolver311]

@@Bluebelle51 the real issue with "Liberals" is that they accepted the economics of the conservatives 40 years ago. Its why Newt Gingrich realigned the GOP's electoral strategy to one of strictly oppositional to Democrats on social issues, he correctly assessed that with the Democratic ruling elites their is no economic argument to have. Terrible for the health of electoral politics as it solidified the "us vs them" nature of the 2 parties but good for winning elections. But it has rendered them incapable of even shared victory they could have easily came out and claimed ideological victory with the passing of the ACA but because of their electoral strategy of simply being the party eternally opposed to the Democratic party they allowed themselves to be played in a realpolitik maneuver by Obama who simply presented their own policy proposal as his own leaving them with no choice but to have no response other than holding their metaphorical dicks in their hand. Even now the GOP hasn't altered their economic agenda. Still supply side tax cuts for the wealthy standard of living cuts for the rest of us.

[@Bluebelle51]

@@TheEvolver311 that's the point of Thomas Franks's book is that the DLC and the Third Way democrats ditched their base to align with Newt Gingrich's economics which is why I bring up his book, and I think everyone should read it

[@TheEvolver311]

@@Bluebelle51 it actually began with Carter he was a supply side economically Reagan kept his economic appointees for most of his presidency. He simply wasn't a "dove" like Carter. It just wasn't until Gingrich that the GOP ruling elites figured out how to change their electoral strategy.

[@1monki]

@@Bluebelle51 Or read Chris Hedges _Death of the Liberal Class,_ tho it goes back a bit further and also talks about the branding and marketing of American politics beginning around WWI and then into the Cold War.

[@daveindezmenez]

You really have Thomas Frank on the show.

[@loulasher]

I think this guy is wrong about populism but he helps pull away the veneer of Dem vs Repub and expose the class warfare that has been waged against the majority of us for longer than I've been alive by people who have hired both parties as mercenaries.

[@NotAPacifist825]

This guy is just wrong on so many things

[@marlonbryanmunoznunez3179]

@Eugene Stoner Those are not the only two options nimwit, there are multiple ways to apply criticism about society as you should know. Previous comment just underlines something that is very obvious: conservatives tend to be wrong about everything.

[@kevinschmidt2210]

How is he wrong? Your comment, as it stands, is just so useless.

[@NotAPacifist825]

@@kevinschmidt2210 you're right. i was venting and too tired to elaborate.

[@NotAPacifist825]

@Eugene Stoner you know nothing about me. but all can see your obsession with Stalinist Russia, which is, obviously, irrelevant.

[@theebonymaw]

minorities are siding with the managerial class in cities because conditions are getting better?? NO! if that's even true, i'd be more willing to believe it's a direct result of economic anxiety and propoganda on behalf of that same managerial class telling them that submitting to our current worker heirarchy is the best way up the economic ladder - which itself implies the notion that what little economic mobility they have will be lost if they challenge the status quo.

[@MotorcyclesandMopars]

Degrees definitely do not equal class anymore. People with master’s degrees like me (and my wife) that have a mortgage worth of student debt and can’t find jobs that would pay that debt off means we are poor and highly educated. Most young Gen X and Gen Y are in this situation. That is also why people in this situation are Bernie supporters not Warren or Pete supporters.

[@JulianPerez-zv6os]

You're absolutely correct, Bernie was the candidate of the downwardly mobile middle class person too. That's why Liz Warren, the candidate of middle class young people who "made it," got no traction.

[@djcopie]

Michael Lind just took the words right outa my mouth! I find on most issues things are rarely ever 'one-sided', and therefore we as a society should be trying to fing common-ground with each other, rather than forever pointing out each others' flaws.

[@HansLemurson]

1:58 "Educational credentials are the real basis of access to organizational power..." ...You DO know what century this is, right? How much organizational power has college debt bought the millenials?

[@kkay3784]

It seems Worker owned co-ops would certainly resolve a lot of problems.

[@Lambda_Ovine]

"...why there's a place for members of different faith traditions to be brought together on government boards." Wait... did he say that religious organizations should have institutional power?

[@LabGoats]

To say education is more of a factor than money/wealth when it comes to societal power is in accurate to say the least.

[@rams3955]

@Eugene Stoner Ya but the fact is there are still alot of people in this country who are "working class" or work menial low paying jobs with college degrees.

[@rams3955]

@Eugene Stoner ok Ben Shapiro talking point.1 having a system where people study what they are interested in instead of whatever pays best leads to a happier society and doesn't lead to an over abundance of a handful of degrees I mean how many business and accounting degrees are scholls pumping out these days. 2 ur talking about a very small like 1% of the population. What about degrees in fields that are important that don't pay well like humanities for jobs like social work or teaching? Like by having a universal system that includes all schooling art humanities stem vocations instead of forcing less than upper class ppl to basically take massive amounts of debt for degrees for fields they ultimately don't want to work in you see shit like the current environment of depression lack of purpose drug abuse etc etc.

[@beastmastre]

This guy's just here to muddy the waters.

[@stormstruck]

I recognize this guy...he was interviewed for the BBC documentary 'The Power of Nightmares'.

[@TCt83067695]

Sounds...delightful?

[@end3rzl33t]

Now that was an awesome docu series by adam curtis! Shame the social media one he did later tanked

[@LightWeaver]

I came into this video thinking I was going to enjoy an analysis on the current state of the class war and was severely disappointed.

[@thescopedogable]

try Richard Wolff he is always good

[@overbeb]

It's interesting in that he has some things right, that unions can be a force for good for working people and that the PMC has taken over so many institutions due to the rot of any organized labor power, but has some in my view very misguided views about religion and it's role in government.

[@LightWeaver]

@@thescopedogable I love Prof. Wolff, he has a way of explaining things so that they're very easily understood.

[@masonainsworth]

Excellent guest and conversation ! ! ! And, excellent final point: coexistence for mutual benefit, not the annihilation/control of the other. Change header to explain PMC = Professional Managerial Class

[@daveindezmenez]

False equivalency on the "populism" definition.

[@J3unG]

I can't figure out what this guy's trying to say. WTF?

[@1monki]

It strikes me as an old-school conservative communal goods argument. A call for morality to be part of the government and economy, as opposed to the Randian approach of the modern GOP. Morality as defined by conservative Christianity. I haven't read his book, it just sounds like something I've heard before.

[@chuckwilliams6261]

55 billionaires dropped out of college, 9 billionaires didn't graduate high school. School teachers are working class today. This guy is just wrong; wealth, not education, is a better metric of class.

[@emanimal728]

You are only thinking in terms of income levels. There are plenty of other class identities that have tremendous effect. People are multifaceted and fit into many demographic frames. You may think it all comes down to income, but the mindset of the PMC affects what happens, and they tend to identify upwards rather than having solidarity downwards.

[@chuckwilliams6261]

@@emanimal728 Wealth, not income. Plenty of people sympathize or identify with a class to which they don't belong. The world is full of "temporarily embarrassed millionaires." You are correct that people, and not just the PMC, tend to identify upwards. Identifying with a class is not belonging to a class; a homeless guy may feel he is a temporarily embarrassed billionaire, that and a million dollars will get him into the country club. While US Senator Bernie Sanders identifies with the working class, he has managed to position himself among the ruling elite.

[@emanimal728]

@@chuckwilliams6261 Which is why they would call him a class traitor like FDR. But Sanders worked his way up from the lower classes. He did not have inherited wealth. Those with inherited wealth are another class even among the wealthy. I used the hear the term nouveau riche thrown around. There are many classes with class interests. Some selfishly try to maintain their privileges or wished for privileges while others strive toward a utopian egalitarianism.

[@joenoah456]

You both are a perfect example of what he was talking about, having differences but being able to exist peacefully and respectfully!! It's definitely what we need.

[@7DaltonDoms7]

Holy shit this guy is extremely accurate on his analysis and his proscription is frankly impressively Rawlsian. Probably gonna buy this book after seeing this.

[@Skylarking00]

I say, bring out the Yellow Vests!

[@michaelnewell1969]

"Peaceful co-existence is the goal, not the annihilation of the other team," sounds fantastic in theory, albeit unrealistic with the modern right-wingers threatening with armed revolt if "glorious leader" is actually held accountable for his actions.

[@JohnAllenRoyce]

It's what rightwingers always say when they're losing. The pathetic trump rind doesn't realize its mammon-daddy has unplugged them.

[@garyvlahos635]

😂 This comment didn’t age too well . Portland says “Hi” 👋

[@JulianPerez-zv6os]

@@garyvlahos635 Working class people SHOULD rally and arm and antifa are heroes.

[@mgpalardy]

Hey guys, love the show! I have been selecting the Rising playlist every morning at 10:30 ET so I can watch the show in order and not miss a clip. However, as of last week, they are no longer in order! Can you please fix this? It's very disorienting.

[@anneleagram8693]

Educational attainment is not a real measure of class identity. Are you telling me that Kylie Jenner is working class? Class identity depends on real material conditions like social environment, access to power, income bracket, and race. For this guy to reduce class to a superfluous measure like how many diplomas you have is inane.

[@petersepall2590]

Power sharing is the basis of democracy and those who do not want to share have to be forced to do so.

[@luggagecombo12345]

Professional degrees don't open doors to anywhere unless you were born into the elite circle.

[@shadesonsurfer]

This guy has some massive insights and I agree with him that populism needs to be mediated, but I don't think he's squaring with the precarious situation a lot of the PMC is in (at least in this segment) and how this is fuel for the neoliberal backlash against universal social programs which the mobilized masses would be fighting for. I'm not a huge Tom Wolfe fan, but there's this character in I think "A Man in Full" bank manager making 6 figures, but one wrong step and he loses it all. Since the PMC traditionally has repressed and denied their class consciousness, this creates a lot of bad faith, anxiety, and inability to square with themselves possibly needing a social safety net.

[@selalewis9189]

Well said 👏🏾

[@end3rzl33t]

His PMC argument seems a bit flimsy. Yes, majority of the PMC have degrees, but all those with degrees aren't in the PMC. The value of degrees, stats on social mobility and PMC career opportunities for all should matter more.

[@badgerattoadhall]

They have degrees (so do I) but they have them from a set of universities. Someone from the university of North Dakota does not not get you into PMC.

[@joellee9368]

You folks are doing a great job!!! So glad to have found you. #bernieorbust Love the honesty and non partisan reporting of the truth by both of you.

[@nonewherelistens1906]

Andrew Yang's positions have more of a chance to bring the sides together than any other candidate. Even his slogan, Not Left, Not Right, but Forward calls to this appeal. People need to pay more attention to this guy.

[@ph0ib0s1]

Excellent line of questioning, excellent guest. Love your show.

[@winger468]

Atrophied or subverted?

[@2010COpall]

Wow, what a great interview. Mr. Lind takes a big-picture approach to the class issues that divide us. And so well spoken. Great questions Krystal and Saagar.

[@Aizeebee]

Smart dude. True intellectuals seem hard to come by in the news these days

[@OofieDooples]

@impatience1 yea I'm honestly surprised someone fell for his nonsense.

[@DarrylWThomas]

Good guest commentary. Approved!

[@Max_Doubt]

Even if it's for the working class, keep religion out of Govt..

[@overbeb]

Yeah, I'm all for having outreach for political campaigns to different faith communities, but religious review boards for education, yeah.... no.

[@FakeSchrodingersCat]

There already was a word for the managerial class, it is the Bourgeoisie.

[@universalsoldier2293]

I'm either tired or totally overwhelmed, but this interview went right over my head.

[@SagaciousNJ]

he's explicitly against a radical effort to democritize power. He wants a newly reformed status quo that makes a tiny concession to people's needs in exchange for reorienting society in a way that just "happens" to concentrate the majority of power into the hands of upper middle class white dudes like himself.

[@mickeywood3012]

If the infrastructure can't respond it will just become frustrating.

[@garysmith7760]

Working class is just that - people work and are paid for their labor to sustain their livelihood. Corporate American government (both sides) have been complicit in damaging a working class due to atrocious pro-corporate legislations on peoples' backs and eventually throwing millions of citizens in the gutter.

[@IOFrimpong]

This is hit and miss but mostly okay.

[@rzawistowski33]

Still a lot better than the Hillary guy on yesterday

[@rodrigoodonsalcedocisneros9266]

I do agree 100% on his analisys. Pretty solid and tackles every single issue in a coherent way. This great divide was brought by identity politics in the first place. Had these b.s. never been fed, people would still debate issues but from a more centered position and not in an aggresive way

[@MasterDirox]

Good stuff Michael Lind was a very interesting guest.

[@peacewillow]

whoa there!! white working class are by no means "consolidating" around republicans. and those who do vote republican do so for religious reasons, specifically abortion. not everything is about racism.

[@girlwhomustnotbenamed4139]

It started out as something interesting and then he said religious leaders should be on government boards doing oversight. Wow. From a person analysing what governmental structures don't work, he sure is suspiciously keen on theocracies.

[@maxrobespierre9176]

Do we really have to coexist in one system? Is it true that at least one side isn't evil? I don't think either of these two questions can be dismissed so off-handedly by the author.

[@AbtinX]

Neoliberal apologist get the hell out of here, it's the people's time

[@tandrew7175]

Anand is right. This is now a consumer culture, and a rich plumber is welcome among the managerial elite.

[@mitchellkrouth5083]

I disagree you do not need academia stamp of approval. You can be self-reliant with the right incentive and write positive energy around you which is critical. College education is overrated and should be be rated because of academia‘s failure to adapt

[@davidhutchinson5233]

Germany is a great example to follow. Workers and union leaders sit on the Board of Directors of large companies....that is a way forward.

[@darinsingleton3553]

Whether or not I agree with his ultimate conclusions, it's good to hear a wide breadth of ideas. Acknowledging the centrality of promoting unions as a core strength for working people is essential. And, he seems to agree with that principle.

[@gemmabindra]

Question for your graphics team. What in the world is that random thumbnail for this video?!

[@JesseDylanMusic]

I liked this guy. He has a lot of good points.

[@beyondschool]

Good discussion.

[@Murmurrr]

“Aytrophied”

[@loulasher]

Aye! I heard that too.

[@stevenm732]

Very interesting analysis by the gentleman. Not sure how I feel about it yet but Im intrigued with how he outlined a relationship between unions churches and local government parties. Might have to read his book.

[@originalBongoCat]

The reformist view is that the only thing workers have is their great numbers, and that they will vote in great numbers for "favorable" bourgeois politicians. The revolutionist view is that workers have only their collective LABOR POWER, the ability to stop production, and that they will strike in the interests of workers' economic and political gain.

[@ng-marc]

💯 Great segment! Thank you #RestoreFDRCapitalism

[@jonathanwood1976]

Listen, Liberal by Thomas Frank and We've Got People by Ryan Grim dovetail nicely with this line of thought. BOTH highly recommended!

[@hazchemel]

thanks team, very interesting .... "peaceful co-existence is the goal, not annihilation of the other team"; and valuing the social and political contributions of trades unions, of which I haven't heard except through family

[@markbrownner6565]

recent article in the atlantic..'the new aristocracy' describes this as well saying that the 1% owns 20% of wealth..the 9% owns 60%....leaving 20% for the bottom 90%...so yes indeed there is professional managerial class that has an interest in maintaining the current system as they enjoy the bulk of the assets......

[@michaelmcmillian5129]

Virginia's new Governor Northam ran on the promise of bringing Unions (and thus better wages for many blue collar workers) to the state. After the election, he immediately said "No Unions" (in response to his donors) instead focusing on "taking away guns". Virginia's gun homicide numbers are similar to NYC's and half of Chicago's, concentrated almost exclusively in Northern VA, Richmond, Norfolk and smaller "urban" areas (which are not policed). Will be interesting to see if Northam has energized his opponents' bases by breaking his promises.

[@dankokovacevic]

Finally someone is correctly using term "populism" (it was always a "dead end", derogatory term), pluralism should be used as a correct term! Populism was always something you can hear in your local bar, on the market, people correctly point out the problems but they do not have the answers how to solve them! After WW2 and huge recession populism rose in Germany and both Hitler and communists were trying to to ride that "wave", Hitler was backed by big money and he succeeded and the first thing he did was starting persecuting communists!

[@pitchforksarecoming]

for the greedy and corrupt!

[@billykuan]

One big problem those that have all the power are not anchored anywhere they move at will not to be effected exvept capture.

[@gevdarg]

I don't know much about this guy, but I like anyone who uses the word "liar" as intended. LOL!

[@tamhas]

Oh my. Thee are so many people in working class jobs with degress

[@jankarlelenzano6591]

I agree with him. Leaderless populism is chaotic. Look at the occupy movement. Populism with a leader is temporary. See Bolivia after their leader abandoned them. The people need to have an institution that will represent them whether it is a union, an employee owned corporation, or a political party.

[@sheilawest1720]

Am I the only one who as no idea what "PMC" means?

[@austintrousdale2397]

Sheila West Professional Managerial Class

[@REGNUM_DEI_33]

there are people who suppress any shift of real power to the people. the problem is greed and the fear of the rich of having less if the poor have enough to live

[@alisonmcrae1281]

I started working about 2 yrs before Reagan was elected. My job followed the path of Reagan's "vision".

[@RandyNelson10]

...does he not know they are both populists?

[@TheEvolver311]

I'm sure he knows and I'm glade he didn't tailor his argument to please them.

[@ClownCarCoup]

or does he not care?

[@RandyNelson10]

TheEvolver311 fair point

[@raystaar]

Interesting, however his closing argument smacks of incrementalism.

[@meurtri9312]

very interesting. i don't know his work well but he seems truthful when he says he's trying to be scholarly in his approach.

[@rzawistowski33]

Yeah, he seems to just spelling out the past with actual class facts.

[@markromine5103]

His analysis seems fairly accurate. However, his proposed solutions include some troubling coded language.

[@seancurtin5609]

if you want something in this world we need to destroy our enemies, they have been doing it to us for 40 years

[@DoggieFosters]

It seems his diagnosis, as far as it goes, is largely true. However, his analysis, at least here, doesn't seem to fully address the mechanism of fighting the enormous concentrated power in the top 10%. I would like to understand better his conception 9f populism vs. his idea of whatever he called it. It strikes me that perhaps this man would not consider Sanders a true populist. Which, looked at a certain way, I could defend. Sanders has an economic agenda and wants to put power in the hands of the 90% and has gained popular support for his agenda. Perhaps that is distinct from a hollow populism that this man thinks is Populism? I'd like to see him and Thomas Frank have a long discussion.

[@WorldTurningPodcast]

FeatherStep I agree. he didn’t define populism or wasn’t pushed to

[@dameinoferrall2400]

I'm gonna say that I agree with many of his points. The goal of Bernie's revolution is not to overthrow the ruling class, we're not Bolshevkiks. The ultimate goal is to re-balance the system so that it's more equitable and harmonious than it currently is. It won't be perfect, it never can be perfect, but it can be closer to perfect than it is now. We were there from the late 40's to the late 70's. Western Europe and Northern Europe was as well, and though they are less so today are still closer than us. Nobody is saying there shouldn't be rich people. There will always be rich people and there will always be poor people, but a strong, vibrant and very large middle class is what balances all of this out. There shouldn't be billionaires all over the place, hoarding wealth and stashing it away where it does no good. Think of all the problems that could be solved if this enormous wealth, that is presently in the hands of but a small portion of the nation, were circulating constantly throughout our economy, instead of just sitting in offshore bank accounts doing nothing. Bernie's revolution, our revolution, is really just a way to bring us back to where we once were. The reason it has to be so "far left" (though by European standards it's just true left or even center left), is to swing the pendulum back toward this direction, so that we can sit down at the bargaining table and get a more equitable deal. I don't honestly believe that we're going to accomplish all of Bernie's polices, but I'd be happy if we could get a few of them through: end U.S. military imperialism and adventurism, reverse Citizens United (get Big Money out of politics), raise the minimum wage OR bring back labor unions so that we can negotiate for better more reasonable compensation for ourselves, and M4A. If we can get everything pass, e.g. The Green New Deal, cancelling college debt, improving rights for transgendered Americans, strengthening our gun laws etc.., then great, I'm all for it. But we don't need to accomplish all of this for our revolution to be successful. However, we do need to accomplish some of it, that much is certain!

[@greenhill004]

I don't know what they hell they are talking about half he time, but I do like how he just goes 'He's a liar'.

[@sevilnatas]

A great book about the rise of the artificial PMC class is "The Puritan Gift: Reclaiming the American Dream Amidst Global Financial Chaos". It describes the rise of the american business school and its creation of the "Professional Manager" and their involvement in the downfall of america's economic engines. Interesting progressive economic read.

[@marcblanc3432]

If a plumber who makes 200k is a working-class person who is rich, then is a graduate student who makes

[@marcblanc3432]

And at the risk of agreeing with the NYT, perhaps it is a bit outdated. We have a whole generation of college-educated Americans who live in a state of virtual indentured servitude because of student loans

[@slice1208]

What we have is one political party that wants to keep people poor , and the other that wants to take your freedoms .

[@ethangburke]

I agreed and disagreed w/ different characterizations, but this was a good conversation

[@danstewart2770]

Private sector unions* are a necessary counterbalance to the huge government subsidy that is the limited liability characteristic of artificial corporate entities, which conveys the otherwise unattainable ability to raise massive concentrations of capital and thereby creating an unnatural asymmetry of bargaining power between management and labor. (* This argument specifically excludes public sector unions.)

[@johncullinan6720]

Just because the college kids went to school a couple more years then the workers who built the place they work in ,don`t mean anything. it just means they do something different. don`t mean they`re worth more.........