Thermal Storage: Solar ICE

[@anthonyc362]

I've worked on some very large ice bank systems in commercial buildings but most of them around here (SF Bay Area California) have been abandoned and they are just using the chiller as a conventional system. I do have a very high end residential customer who has a working ice bank system and they use off peak power as you stated. We don't have high enthalpy here at night as the temp drops and we don't have high humidity so you can often run an airside economizer. The solar/ multi acqua is great for a residential off grid situation in the south or east coast where it's still hot and humid at night and you need AC to be comfortable to sleep. I never knew weather or humidity till I joined the Army as I was born in San Francisco. I remember when the AC broke in our barracks at Ft Jackson and I was soaked sweat and couldn't sleep a wink.

[@ThomasBomb45]

Why have they abandoned the ice storage??

[@ThomasBomb45]

Is it because of low cost electricity during the day when solar is cheap?

[@_Epictetus_]

Please keep us updated on this. This is amazing!

[@frankie2234]

This Old House did a story on this from a retired commercial hvac owner in S. Carolina for his gian 7,000 sq ft house. Also a huge solar panel setup. Your running with the big dogs :)).

[@PennsylvaniaPrepper]

When I want to daydream, I just come and watch your videos!

[@JodBronson]

LOL

[@yankey4]

BROTHER do a update on the PV hot water at your place. Would love to see how things are going. Lots of peeps are looking for me to help them with hot water. Love all you do for us brother. GOD BLESS!!

[@devongannes7767]

that's amazing!!! maybe one day it will be streamlined and refined as well as affordable for every person in these tough financial times.

[@dirtisbetterthandiamonds]

I am in love with this! I have so many ideas for our farm but I need (lots) more money first Lol

[@blaccdawg5562]

A system like that would be greatly beneficial here in the Caribbean after hurricanes... As long as the solar panels could be protected... Great Video...👍

[@bobleclair5665]

Blacc Dawg I flush mount my panels to the roof deck and cover them with half inch plus plexiglass

[@blaccdawg5562]

@@bobleclair5665 Well, sounds great as long as roofs stay on during a Hurricane... Since I mentioned I'm in the Caribbean...

[@bobleclair5665]

Blacc Dawg I’m a live aboard in Key West also a carpenter,,still tearing out and rebuilding

[@agritech802]

Could you use that for cooling milk or other foodstuffs on an industrial scale?

[@johnbeckman8916]

Super COOL! 😃 Exciting times in our crazy world.

[@S.C.A.M.B.E.R.]

One of the best video of ITES

[@monty671]

Can you give us an update on your chiller setup? What are the Pros and Cons? How many panels need to be added to ensure enough power is available for the complete chiller system? Thanks... Ron from SC

[@AntimatePcCustom]

how do you deal with the expansion of the ice? and what about isolation of the 2 tanks? seems a bit thin walled. very cool setup. and indeed very smart way to get most out of your aircon compressor.

[@Cobra365]

AntimatePcCustom those pex lines can flex easily. Wall thickness depends on what they insulate it with. This is a live experiment and they’re using commonly accessible/affordable materials. The technology is going to be a little pricey, but will pay itself off

[@mondomarshall7287]

Fantastic set up! Nice job

[@ChrisDIYerOklahoma]

So, no battery bank...direct solar panel power to the condenser and electronics?

[@Thermoelectric7]

It's likely a grid tie system, setup such to run the chiller when the system would otherwise be exporting to the grid.

[@Thermoelectric7]

@TheMatron'sMilitia Absolutely, however to run that off solar when they didn't mention any batteries and whatnot - implies it was a grid tie system. So this would still only work when the grid is there, even though it stores energy in the ice. The chiller would be setup to consume about the same amount of power the solar puts out.

[@Thermoelectric7]

It's still an odd way to do it, typically for ice building you'd do it at night when the ambient is cooler, as the chillers are more efficient. Plus, most of your demand for cooling is during the day, so the ice realistically only stores energy for cooling in the afternoons/night.

[@74p]

I am looking into adding this to my upcoming install. I don't understand why the ice doesn't break both the tank and the pex, what stops that from happening? I had thought of making the water container slightly tapered (widening towards the top), to ensure the expansion wouldn't break the walls. But for the pex or other tubing, I just don't know how it doesn't break, at least over time. I am not looking at solar PV to ice, but a solar thermal chiller. Sending the electricity back into the grid or using it for gadgets, lights, controls and such, and then using solar thermal as the bulk source of cooling and dehumidification. Thoughts?

[@SuperDave-vj9en]

I see all of this fancy equipment, and then I see plywood lids on the tanks that are disintegrating! WTF?

[@eDriver]

Everything pro electricity in any way is great! Everything which is pushing away the fossil power sources is just perfect!

[@technus102]

until your electricity is produced by fossil power and your building built by diesel engine equipement

[@yakut9876]

in my opinion, every thing does not need electricity and does not work by it is amazing !. also every thing does not need electronics is simple, reliable and amazing !

[@devinmanderson]

I need this type of a system so bad right now. PG&E practically owns me with 1k plus power Bill's. I'd love to work with you and multiaqua on putting together a system for my families dog kennel in California.

[@JodBronson]

WOW, that method is 100% there!

[@joebonsaipoland]

“This is cool stuff” no pun intended

[@BlueFlutterbies]

puns are ok too!

[@JodBronson]

Good puns! LOL

[@totherarf]

@@JodBronson Pew pew pew?

[@halasimov1362]

I see potential for this to run a walk in cooler/freazer off solar 24/7 with out much battery bank needed. If the solar could freeze this and also run your heat pump durring the day it could perhaps sustain your cooler/freazer all night.

[@kameljoe21]

Cooler maybe, Freezer no, Commercial walk in freezers are set at -10 to -40, How do I know, I have one... I have it set at -13 right now, The colder I go the more it cost. If I bought a newer style foam box and installed my drop in unit, I could either save half of what I spend keeping it cool or go to the max and spend the same. It adds about 25 dollars per month on to my bill. That is about 190 KW per month at about 6 KW per day. The compressor runs about 15mins every 1 hour cycle. We only get in to it a hand full of times per month.

[@TheAnantaSesa]

William Glaser; you didn't at all explain why this wouldn't work.

[@kameljoe21]

@@TheAnantaSesa The chiller and ice will not get cold enough to produce the coldness that you want, Walk in freezer and your home freeze are at 0F to -10F, Its hard to bring down the tempature to -10 if the water is only at 28F.

[@TheAnantaSesa]

William Glaser; so it’s easier to cool it down from 100º outside temperature? Still looks like the ice can reduce strain on the condenser coils as they work to produce -40ºF.

[@totherarf]

@@TheAnantaSesa It takes the same energy to freeze water from 0C to ice at 0C as it does to cool water from boiling to zero C ...... or so I am told ;0) Cooling Ice would take the same energy as cooling water so the only variable is if you actually need to freeze it or if you could lower the freezing point with additives!

[@FilAmGabe]

Very COOL idea :) 5ton for 6 hours is great. Can it be run on Dc 24v, 48v or 60v?

[@townsendliving9750]

I'm guessing he worked with the calmac company and got the system PV direct, looked like a DC motor in the bottom of the heat pump, if they havent done it yet you could bet hes working on it. Hes a big advocate for PV direct

[@kimmer6]

Pex doesn't seem to be a very good heat transfer material but its toughness is really suited to the stresses of freezing and thawing. The price is reasonable as well. If I win the Lotto I would be building projects like this all day.

[@benssolarandbattery]

Ahh Schletter! I have 2 jobs worth of their stuff left. Awesome looking system!

[@engineer775]

Wanna sell it?

[@benssolarandbattery]

@@engineer775 NO! Those 2 are already sold, posts are getting pounded next week. I will have leftover rail and mid clamps though if you're interested. Have you found a comparable replacement for Schletter?

[@engineer775]

@@benssolarandbattery PLP powerpeak.

[@chiefschillaxn1781]

how many hours does it have to run before it beats the grid at your kilowatt per hour cost.

[@bobleclair5665]

There’s a big market in the boating community for making ice,, buying bags of ice seems to be the common,,a small ice maker would be ideal for a boat

[@ConsultingjoeOnline]

Good idea. Let's do it!

[@Thermoelectric7]

Kinda defeats the purpose. You're either using the ice for keeping food cold, or for storing/transporting fish. If you're using it for food, you might as well use a fridge and skip the ice. For fish storage the quantity of water, time and energy required to make the ice is likely prohibitive on small vessels. Only really feasible on larger vessels.

[@bobleclair5665]

Still checking out small ice makers,,other than that,,I’m studying Peltiers,,just looking for something to keep my eggs and butter chilled,,I’m trying to keep everything running off my solar panels and one battery

[@ConsultingjoeOnline]

@@bobleclair5665 pelletier coolers suck. They are too weak or will draw too much. Mini fridge might just be the best

[@bobleclair5665]

Consulting joe,,I’ll agree,,but in Key West,,we have a free wall,so it’s not like paying for the Peltier parts and the sun is free,,and I’m not trying to make ice just cool a small kitchen cabinet box,milk,butter and eggs

[@BenjaminCronce]

I wonder how these systems will do with the advent of magnetocaloric heat pumps right around the corner. They have some truly crazy heat ranges where the hot and cold can be up to 95k(171f) difference. That's like one side being -21f and the other being 150f, and they're about 30-50% more efficient than vapor-compression heat pumps.

[@a.yashwanth]

So the chiller removes the heat from the water just like AC and heat the water using the heat generated?

[@garret1930]

A giant Peltier device, you have to put in energy to force it from one side to the other, the hot side will always get much hotter than the cold side gets cold. As soon as I saw this I was intrigued as to what they would do with the massive heat they generated by cooling the water.

[@suprememasteroftheuniverse]

This is stupid level inefficiency.

[@BenjaminCronce]

@@suprememasteroftheuniverse Heat pumps are about 300% efficient from our perspective. Every unit of energy in can move 3 units of energy. Heat pump whole-house electrical heating is actually break even operational costs to natural gas heating in the Midwest USA, and natural gas is at an all time low. It's actually a good idea. Instead of exhausting the heat, capture it and use it to warm your water. It's like a free water heater. But I am not convinced with storing solar as thermal unless it's purely excess power, which was not clear or I missed something.

[@captainobvious9188]

I live an hour east of Vegas and want to make a system that uses a heat pump to store heat in the cold months or store ice/cold in the hot months. For a few months of the year it doesn't drop below 95F at night, but then for a few months it hangs around freezing (but not far below because the earth never cools enough). Basically I want it to pump between hot and cold tanks and either pick up environment heat after the cold tank or give off excess heat after the hot tank. Domestic hot water would be year around, but otherwise heating from the hot tank during cold, and cooling from the cold tank during hot. The alternative is to build a large battery and use a traditional heat pump system, but I figure why not use the power when made pumping heat and store it?

[@michaeljames5936]

More than likely the system is explained in more detail in some other of your videos, as I had to do a lot of guessing as to the mechanics and efficiency of this system versus, using solar and battery to power regular air-conditioners. Any idea how long you could store the ice?

[@halasimov1362]

Interesting. I wonder how efficient this is compared to just running your heat pump of the Solar directly?

[@glasslinger]

Try that at night! :)

[@townsendliving9750]

This is a heat pump, with ICE as the battery

[@JodBronson]

@@glasslinger - 100% - Hahahahahahahahaha! LMFAO

[@Saint696Anger]

Really neat I watched the whole video

[@JodBronson]

LOL, OMG YOU ARE HERE!! LOL

[@Saint696Anger]

@@JodBronson 👋

[@JodBronson]

@@Saint696Anger - 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@larryteslaspacexboringlawr739]

thank you for educational video

[@ZOMBIEHEADSHOTKILLER]

very interesting, ive always wanted to some how save snow and ice from winter, to use for air conditioning, in pretty much the same way.

[@rnordquest]

I did a design that buried a large insulated tank. I used a heat exchanger, fan, and pump to send glycol down to freeze water for storage for the whole summer AC season. You're making ice anytime it's below 32°F.

[@mukhtargazali3497]

@@rnordquest i will love to see this insulated tank

[@barongerhardt]

I'm looking forward to a future full of solar ice roads.

[@jakegarrett8109]

Haha, but think of the energy saved through the lower friction! Also scientific fact, stopping wastes energy, so it’s a win-win! And without stops you get to work faster, I think you’re onto something revolutionary here.

[@jackkatogh]

Solar freaking iceways!

[@mohdsufiyuddinabdkadir8997]

Sir, I am building ice storage for my house AC i Malaysia. I have question, can we use normal AC our door unit to make ice? Ice tank will be underground, heavily insulated with foam polystyrene. Thanks for yor input.

[@jawwadsabir4620]

yes

[@thumperhunts6250]

Hi, ive watched your videos for a few years and love how you juggle things. I'm looking to build an atmospheric water generator off grid in low humidity areas

[@user-dr2pg8fk2i]

Why not use this as a heat pump and thermal storage in the winter?

[@chrisfrancis8446]

I want to add a ice system to my home but not too much info on it

[@120ohm]

Just picked up a large Levload Thermal Storage Ice Bank from the resale shop. Paid $50 figured it would make a great insulated water storage tank for the garden. Had no idea what it actually was, now I'm glad I didn't take the coils out. It has markings that read 90 Ton-hours... Anybody know what what the feasibility of hooking it into a residential home would be? approx 1800 square foot. I can build/modify/machine just about anything but I need to brush up on the basics of thermodynamics... Nothing else maybe it would make a great science project to heat/cool the future pole barn!

[@Cobra365]

It’s far from the ultimate paradox. You can’t have one without the other.

[@jhonrmarak1714]

Wow very nice 👍🇧🇩

[@ronlabe5487]

What kinda $$ and how much solar is needed?

[@AWildBard]

This is great, although I don't actually understand how it works or what it is doing. It's reducing energy requirements, saving money ... but how I don't exactly get

[@sleeptyper]

They use solar electricity to freeze water, which in turn is used to cool aircon when the Sun is unavailable - during night and very cloudy, dark days. The frozen water stores the free energy from the Sun, so the energy is not sold to grid and bought back when needed, because doing so would lead to financial losses.

[@gauvaindf]

pair with a "Canadian/Provençal well" you could reduce the size of ice storage or enlarge the cooled surface it reduces the difference in temperature between the air that comes in and the ice Probably more expensive to install than a VMC dual stream but Lowteck and free and it's useful when it's cold outside and the 3 together are possible

[@garret1930]

You could use this to also run a sauna at the same time.

[@MisterHolaMan]

electricity can be harvested from the temperature difference between day and night with an anti-solar panel, maybe this system could be incorporated somehow by making a temp differential

[@jonnychooch6624]

not idea atm at 25 milliwatts of power per square meter .

[@TheAnantaSesa]

Peltier module.

[@kussh100]

No tech specs given. Whats the efficiency of this setup? What is the output of the 2 solar panels? And the cost? The running cost of this experiment? The volume of the water cooled? The volume of water heated? And the basic schematic of this setup to explain to laymen whats happenning? Cost of the whole thing and return on investment in how many years?

[@gearhead1302]

Neat idea

[@JodBronson]

100%

[@Lesserthannone]

Ok, you got, me! Cool tech!

[@gianlazzarini]

Very cool

[@pieterbezuidenhout2741]

Would just love to get to know more of the system, where " cold " is collected from etc. Understandably heat from Solar panels is not my problem but is the " cold " somehow from heat exchanger or compressor as you mentioned Glycol being used ?

[@ancapftw9113]

I think they are probably using some type of evaporative cooling.

[@Thermoelectric7]

Solar panels make the electricity, which in turn runs the chiller featured in this video. The chiller takes heat from the cold tank and dumps it into the hot tank. Removing heat creates the "cold" and in turn the ice once enough heat is removed. If the hot tank gets too hot for the chiller to operate, it'll start dumping some of that heat into the air just like a normal air conditioner.

[@routtookc8064]

But, do you need cooling at night? This is better than running a DX coil to an AHU?

[@Thermoelectric7]

Probably not at night, however this would be good in the morning/afternoon when the sun isn't shining but you still need cooling. (imagine a west facing room just after the sun has gone down) This is when the demand in the grid gets wonky in places with high solar generation as there's these big peaks of demand once solar drops off. Efficiency wise, it's more efficient to run DX during the day while the sun is out, but if you're using a chilled water loop then it's easier just to stick to chilled water and bypass the ice until that afternoon peak.

[@routtookc8064]

@@Thermoelectric7 thanks for the insight !

[@thermionic1234567]

Why not put some piping behind the solar panels themselves for not only making hot water, but also cooling the panels?

[@engineer775]

Did you see that big green thermapex pipe under each solar array? That's what it's for.

[@thermionic1234567]

Engineer775 no, I didn’t. Glad to hear that!

[@joergreinicke5945]

@@engineer775 there are two hoses not connectee comming from the ground. Nothing behind the panels. A sepperate heat collector would be more effecient.

[@JodBronson]

Stop trying to reinvent the wheel! You all too late for that! LMFAO

[@obiecanobie919]

That will harvest heat from panels that can be stored in different storage tanks but not help the chiller operation since it strives on having similar temperatures in the storage tanks and spreading its temperature differential as chiller works is way on storing thermal energy ,if very hot water is needed than hot water from solar panel cooling can be heated more with the aid of another heat pump against the hot water from the chiller operation tank ,plenty hot water storage

[@LazyAcreshomestead]

I like to do something like that thanks for the info

[@JodBronson]

Right!

[@mattm5001]

How much does it cost ? It's not looking like your average family could ever afford that kind of set up. Maybe a medium to large company could. Thanks for the video.

[@MetroidChild]

Could work realy well for an appartment complex, as a big central heating and cooling plant to distribute for all tenants in a building.

[@kameljoe21]

This could be done on a small scale as well even for your own house. Provided you have the space for a large tank and a large enough array that can provide enough energy for you household use and the chiller. Pretty much all this is, is a chiller that during the day freezes water thru a glycol chilling loop in the ice and another loop that mixes the hot water from the reclaimed that goes in to you cooling unit. The hot water tank loop might also have a heat exchange that vents hot air outside, One could also add a domestic hot water loop in the hot tank for hot water. The system could also be reversed to provide heat in the winter and cold water in the winter as well. Other than that Depending on the size of your house one could very well use a direct solar AC unit, Which runs when the sun is out and has grid back up for night time use. Units likes these cost about 2k and need about 1000 watts with combined voltage up to 400vdc. Another cheap alternative is a solar direct evaporator cooler, These can be bought for around 500 dollars and only take 100w panel and run about 40w when running and pumping, They are about 1/5 the CFM of your large big box evaporator cooler Which also cost about the same or a bit more. The solar unit would cost you about 650 dollars including the unit, panel, wire and a stand. Big box cooler cost about 25 dollars for half day usage for a month, Using it for 6 months out of the year your return on investment will be in about 4 to 5 summers of using it. I am sure there are some better units out there and some more power full units. Yet a few summers of not paying extra for cooling is well worth it.

[@71kimg]

Is water the best option? Other liquids have much lower/higher freeze/boil points

[@spencerwilton5831]

Kim Graef it's not really about the temperature, it's about the heat energy required for phase change from ice to liquid, in water its very high. Plus water is available anywhere, non toxic and virtually free.

[@JodBronson]

WATER = FREE !!!

[@71kimg]

Spencer Wilton ok - i presume it’s also that the properties for water are well known - eg if I had a tank with 700 degree Celsius oil - I better know what I am doing - but then again ice do make storage more complicated.

[@bassam_salim]

I thought antifreeze would be better

[@scorpio6587]

That's rad.

[@TheNightwalker247]

one could possibly connect it to activ cooled pcm building panels.

[@jeanvincent4764]

Do you know the cost per kWh equivalent for the cold storage system, including everything you would not need on a standard chiller without cold storage?

[@jeanvincent4764]

The idea would be to compare this figure with the cost of energy storage in a chemical battery.

[@JodBronson]

@@jeanvincent4764 - Water is cheaper! Water is FREE... YES, filter out Rain Water!

[@jeanvincent4764]

@@JodBronson what is the cost of the equipment to contain ice, freeze it, the heat exchanger to recover cold, and additional cost of the air-water AC unit vs an air-air unit? This to evaluate the cost per kWh of cold storage using reasonable amortization.

[@JodBronson]

@@jeanvincent4764 - You forgot 1 problem... NIGHT TIME USAGE!

[@TheAnantaSesa]

Jordan Bronson; which is far less demanding, try again

[@volvo09]

Awesome!

[@routtookc8064]

LOLOLOL, who says to run ice storage at night ! Imma do it in the middle of the day !

[@Thermoelectric7]

It's more efficient to make ice at night, the hotter the air (or water) is you're dumping the heat to, the lower the efficiency of the process. They're sacrificing some efficiency for ease of storage.

[@farooqishaq6974]

The ice tank should be in the basement for more efficiency

[@YPllayer]

could you use a geothermal Heat Pump instead of the chiller unit?

[@joelhollingsworth1926]

That's what I want to know!

[@townsendliving9750]

I'd like to know the variables on this

[@markusfalk9459]

Unlikely. To put heat into the ground, yes. Cold - no. You would permafrost and ruin the hole for the geothermals.

[@Dr.AnonymousPro]

Why do they (still) have so many windows in that office, if all they do is shield them against heat and sunlight?

[@sinsilius]

There's winter...

[@suprememasteroftheuniverse]

@@sinsilius there's stupidity and inefficiency.

[@DylanBegazo]

This is genius.... And if you use 350 Watt Panels with a better Pure Sine Wave Inverter and a better MPPT charge controller, you could expand your system even further. I've never seen anyone do this before with a Heat Pump.... Tanks for inspiring me

[@WillPower311]

Awesome 👍!

[@thermionic1234567]

How about not mixing the hot and cold, but just increasing the air volume blown through the ice as it begins to melt?

[@townsendliving9750]

Not sure why they dont do this but condensation I'm sure is there worries

[@JodBronson]

Stop trying to reinvent the wheel! You all too late for that! LMFAO

[@ceefiveceefive]

Can one of these chillers be made to cool a space about 300 sqare feet?

[@kimmer6]

300 square feet is reasonably small. The expense of building a chiller for that space would be huge. It depends on your usage...is it a freezer? Office occupied 8 hours a day? A living space? There are motorhomers who installed really efficient split system air conditioner units that run off solar panels. I follow their posts on YT. Van and motorhome dwellers have been a good resource for information as they have already tested their systems and report the results.

[@ceefiveceefive]

@@kimmer6 Yes. It is for a 38 foot motorhome. My plan right now is an efficient minisplit. I was wondering if a smaller version of this was better. Looks like its not. Thanks!

[@JodBronson]

@@ceefiveceefive - It will be cheaper to use the Solar Panels for Fans or Small Air Conditioner since it's only 300 Sq ft.

[@obiecanobie919]

This is a excess energy storage solution for afterhours solar deprived times , given you have enough pv panels with suitable electronics, batteries ,two storage tanks ,heat pump /chiller equipment , you can have continuous hot water and air conditioning service , expensive probably more suitable for research non mobile operations

[@caocapphongtro2478]

How can contact with you

[@Alan_Hans__]

Using steel as a storage medium could increase the capacity without increasing the volume. At nearly 8 times the density of water it can store a lot of heat and it's thermal conductivity would more than make up for any waterproofing that you would need. The thermal expansion is nothing like water either.

[@spencerwilton5831]

Alan H the point is that changing water from ice to liquid takes a huge amount of energy, which in this case comes from the office as heat from the air handlers. Steel couldn't come close, you wouldn't be changing its state just warming and cooling it. Even as a heat storage medium steel is not great, a kilo of water requires / releases about eight times more heat energy per degree temperature change compared to steel.

[@Alan_Hans__]

It's been decades since I did thermodynamics at college but I still don't see how using water is realistically any different than adding steel to the equation. The unit in question was specified as 30 Tonne hrs. As weight is part of the equation then it makes sense that a greater weight would increase performance. Steel also has a much higher thermal conductivity than water and especially ice. I've been looking to see if I can find better info or something that says water is better than steel but all it led me to was kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z5y1d2ufmLGUaq8 Even www.engineersedge.com/materials/specific_heat_capacity_of_metals_13259.htm didn't help me. I also couldn't find anything at compares volume as steel would only need 1/8th the volume.

[@markusfalk9459]

@@Alan_Hans__ One question to answer is how stop the fins on your steel radiator/bank from breaking after so many heat/cold cycles. By this I mean the ice forming and pressing on your construction. A solid lump of steel isn't really easy to transport, thus a radiator or layer-construct would be needed. Lastly, capacity and ability to transfer heat is not the same. Perhaps a stone/gravel version would be better.

[@Phenomenons]

@@Alan_Hans__ ice can store 334 KJ/kg of energy as latent heat at 0 deg C. Why would you use steel instead of ice? Its a not logical. You can store cold energy in steel.

[@allegannews9256]

Would be nice if tank was vacuum lined tank to minimize heat gain into tank.

[@kimmer6]

That's expensive. I think in terms of garage built science project cheap. A 275 gallon cube shaped Tote bin can be sprayed on all surfaces with rigid urethane foam for hot water storage.

[@allegannews9256]

I work with cryogenics and vacuum insulated pipe and insulation’s. Not as expensive as you may think. It could use technology known as VIP vacuum insulated panels and still use cheep plastic tanks

[@kameljoe21]

@@allegannews9256 Would increase the efficiency of the unit! Vacuum insulated panels are suppose to be the highest r value insulation around per inch, Something like 100 R per inch.... Now I would not mind having a house with about 4 inches of this stuff... Ok that might be a little expensive... Last I look those panels were small size or custom made? Do they sell sheets of this stuff in say 4x8?

[@allegannews9256]

William Glaser yes they do make panels of all sizes and ability flex and wrap around tanks. I have used www.va-q-tec.com these are from Germany but their is also USA manufactures. i recall R50 in 1” thick. Issues with panels are puncture and heat above 80-100 C. Some people combine Vacuum panels with expanding foam sandwich to protect panels from damage. I have some amazing testing data when we used them.

[@jawwadsabir4620]

or you can place the tank where you actually need air conditioning.

[@f.n.schlub]

What about solar-powered atmospheric water condensation ?

[@f.n.schlub]

Underrated Inventions - AND homes. Billions of acre feet of water are diverted just to flush excrement.

[@townsendliving9750]

There is a company that does alot with atmospheric condensation. I think they have patents on it

[@f.n.schlub]

Town's End Living - perhaps, but AWC has been around since WWII. It's the efficient link with PV that's new ... and sorely needed.

[@townsendliving9750]

There literally a company that does it with solar. Out of Phoenix Arizona

[@f.n.schlub]

Town's End Living --- well don't just allude to it ... link

[@royamberg9177]

No end to the things that can be done

[@JodBronson]

100%

[@joepetreng471]

If you own land, you could wisely spend $20k setting up a refurbed small mobile home and cashflow $750/month after expenses. I'll take that over spending $60K to save $200/month.

[@jamest.5001]

I don't guess a peltier would come close to the effiency?

[@nerdy1701]

Unfortunately not. Even though both systems are a type of heat pump, peltier coolers are 1/15 as efficient as compression systems. And those are the good peltier coolers vs a run of the mill compression system.

[@rhiantaylor3446]

That's a great way to store the sun's energy, using the phase change between water and ice - far smaller than the equivalent energy storage as hot water storage or hydrogen.

[@rustyrebar9647]

Wouldn't an ammonia based system be more efficient? No need to convert sunlight to electricity and run a compressor.

[@nerdy1701]

Yes it most likely would be but ammonia systems are very expensive compared to compression systems. In a residential installation a compression system would be the cheapest option, once you get to industrial sizes ammonia systems become cheaper and more feasible.

[@kameljoe21]

@@nerdy1701 I have looked for ammonia ac unit and still have not found one, most systems only need a small pilot light to keep them running! They do make some pretty efficient fridges and freezers yet still no AC unit.... One could very well use wood gas to run all 3 of these units for a small investment. Wood gas can be compressed and used at a later date.

[@ancapftw9113]

This seems like it would be extremely inefficient. Couldn't those 4 solar panels just power the AC system for less energy?

[@michaelhardy8589]

Saltwater battery eco-friendly no maintenance

[@a.yashwanth]

Electricity is cheap at night so there is no need for storing the energy for night. You could directly use the power from solar panels during day. Then what is the point of storage which decreases efficiency?

[@TheAnantaSesa]

You could sell your power when it is expensive and import from the grid when it is cheap at night, you also benefit from the cooler evening increasing efficiency of cooling.

[@Spartyal]

If your thermal Ice can be introduced to the high temperature water flowing out of a solar evacuated tube collectors...would it not create steam which could be harvested to run a steam power engine?

[@obiecanobie919]

Not hot enough ,serious steam is only produced above 500 F ,heat harvesting for energy tech is still emerging

[@humantiger72]

I guess I'm the idiot here but I would love a little more explanation about the uses for that

[@kennethh5657]

It's a chiller. Typically used in industrial buildings for heat and cool. A chiller is much more efficient then a typical AC unit, especially in larger buildings. In a typical home AC, freon is pumped outside to exchange the heat and make it cold again, then the freon is pumped a short ways back into the house. In a chiller, antifreeze and water is cooled in large tanks and then is pumped to radiators throughout the building. The benefit of a chiller is the water runs in heavily insulated pipes and remains cold a lot further away from the heat exchanger then a typical freon unit would. In large commercial buildings, such as schools, you only need one or two large chillers to keep the building, or multiple buildings cool. I say cool, but chillers usually make hot water as well and the same system works to cool the building in the summer and heat in winter. A chiller setup is more expensive then a conventional AC unit per BTU, but a chiller is more efficient and requires less units as the space required for it to heat and cool get larger. Hope this makes sense.

[@suprememasteroftheuniverse]

One million dollars investment to cut half the power bill. That's stupid.

[@ForbiddTV]

Hey Scott, here's the freeze dried food taste test you were involved with as an evaluator: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jKKXoIx_i9uhrpI

[@Rad_B_OLand]

So if you can use propane in an RV to power a refrigerator why can’t you use sunlight in place of burning propane in the same way? Solar vacuum tubes get just as hot as the flame from propane does. I’m not an engineer but the concept in my mind seems to work. I just don’t know how to work out the details.

[@anasazirose]

Ya got 2 thumbs down... Your competitor and his wife.....🤣🤣🤣😂😃😃😁

[@alzen5040]

Just wondering... Could this be the solution to global warming?

[@rnordquest]

Collecting solar adds to heating whereas reflecting it back into space would be cooling.

[@Cobra365]

rnordquest is that supposed to be an answer? Because, they aren’t “collecting solar”

[@rnordquest]

@@Cobra365 What, you don't think a big black surface gets hot sitting in the sun all day? It collects roughly 800-1000W/sq meter. The energy stays here.

[@james10739]

So its using electricity from the solar to make the ice it sounded like some magic or something

[@jawwadsabir4620]

7.5 COP is unrealistic

[@timkelly6496]

Waste should be 120% off grid

[@engineer775]

?

[@CNCmachiningisfun]

119% maybe, but 120% is kinda pushing it!

[@chrisw1462]

Ultra-close plus handheld constant movement is... annoying. Back up already.

[@NOWUNITEDUPDATES]

Chris W just don’t watch.

[@haroldwestrich3312]

This seems like a "NOTHING BURGER". So you used electricity produced at about 25% efficiency. So you've missed out on about 75% of the power of the sun and then you enter that into your system that is ??% efficient. and then store it in tanks that are maintaining some % of the energy your storing. then you run the remaining percent into your building's cooling system that loses and uses even more energy. I don't see NEAR as much savings as an Ammonia system would put out. Ammonia ice makers are based on chemical energy storage and use more like 75% to 80% of the sun's power to do it with nominal amounts of PV electric input. Someone here said "This is amazing" I was thinking "This is an amazing moneymaker for the standard electric cooling system manufacturers who can now sell more equipment to do the same work ...... Just use that extra solar electricity to increase your AC units run time or run another unit on it.

[@honumoorea873]

A well designed building do not need air conditioning.... Do things properly at start.

[@cactusroadrunner5277]

The Indigenous Native American reservations need all scientific aid to live in desert.

[@richardj163]

Thermal battery

[@JodBronson]

100%

[@eDriver]

Everything pro electricity in any way is great! Everything which is pushing away the fossil power sources is just perfect!