This Saturn Sky Redline Engine Was MOMENTS FROM DISASTER

This 2007 Saturn Sky Redline has made it over 150,000 miles without any real issues. But after we pulled the failed turbo off we decided to continue replacing all the common failure parts on the LNF engine. What we found was the scariest possible outcome, the engine was could have skipped time and failed at any moment.
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Common Questions:
What motorcycle do I ride? A few. Ducati 1198, Honda Goldwing, Honda Grom, Honda Ruckus
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Where can I keep up with you off the bike?
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Do you go to school? College, for 2 classes.
Why do you ride so dangerously? What do mean? I was doing 25.
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#SaturnSky #SaturnRedline #BigTurbo

[@JimFlanagan4206]

There was a company called Mallett that did LS swaps on these and the Pontiac Solstice. Kind of a baby Corvette. They were insane!

[@VanisleNSX]

I like this Saturn content. They made some unique cars to say the least.

[@mmllmmll22]

@@waynepantry7023 it's Opel GT

[@aaron71]

@@mmllmmll22 The Sky and Solstice are 100% GM; the Kappa platform. Made right in Delaware USA!

[@maples328]

Yes, especially at the very beginning & end on the brand. If GM hadn’t chopped their legs out after the 3rd year of Saturn, who knows what cool 😎 stuff they could have achieved. They were being shown up by their little brother, lol 😂

[@ufartface]

what happened to the roger penske deal?

[@maples328]

@@ufartface The novel bid to create a car company that didn't build cars fell apart when Penske Automotive Group Inc. PAG -1.51% failed to secure a related agreement to have France's Renault SA RNO -1.53% supply autos for dealers (Wall Street Journal) 📰

[@ka24det]

"Moments from disaster" is 100% accurate. So many different disasters averted.

[@suckerio]

Going to sleep at 2am has it’s advantages. Can always count on JR posting a good vid

[@Rmasters33]

With a DI engine, you might want to do a valve cleaning. The backside of the intakes don't get fuel sprayed and cleaned and can get a lot of gunk restricting flow.

[@coolissimo69]

Glad to watch you again Gabe, what a lucky guy, all those issues in the motor, and nothing to broken.

[@carlgruver695]

Wow that is a first to see a engine run with that much broken timing parts i call that a miracle

[@jeesmith99]

The early and often squad checkin in. Keep on keeping on.

[@cl7510]

A lot of John’s videos are uploaded right around the time I clock out at work. Get to watch them while unwinding once I get home.

[@WatchJRGo]

Always early! 🍻

[@Mike_Atwell]

A big thanks to you guys for these vids. I was waiting for you to do this. Had a feeling it was gonna need timing chains and guides. Water pump "while you're in there" too.

[@dustingreen6210]

Love watch your content, great to see you making video again or maybe it wasn’t coming up on my feed. Keep up the great work!!!!👍

[@DBB-KE5DUO]

you and Gabe play off each other so well in these videos… how many years have you known each other?

[@AnthonyMShadows]

They say they aren't brothers, but I think someone's parents have some explaining to do 😂

[@tedharveyiii5194]

Agreed. Content with Gabe is usually pretty interesting. He must be a mechanic in the military or something along that lines.

[@derekgardin1512]

@@tedharveyiii5194 considering he asked JR what he thought the wear on the cams looked like, I'd say he isn't a mechanic.

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

@@derekgardin1512 it was a moment for commentary, not consultation. That said, you are correct. I was not a mechanic in the Army. 🍻😉👍🏼

[@derekgardin1512]

@@Gabe-ABNCW3 all good. I didn't mean anything bad by it, I chose not to need a mechanic as much as I love cars because I figured I could make more doing something else and keeping the car thing as a hobby, which I did.

[@davevan9150]

Common issue with gm ecotec motors. Chain tensioner slack, more wear on the plastic chain guides. There is also a bolt for the guide that can fail. A slight rattling noise on startup is the indicator you need a timing set.

[@wesley00042]

Yup. This was an issue through I think '07 but GM only warrantied it through '03. My '04 Ion had the tensioner break at 180k.

[@sailorloki]

There is an aftermarket bolt to get rid of that weak spot of the timing system.

[@smokeshackmerica2722]

Glad your back Gabe

[@mr_jake.y8348]

You the man JR. Love you channel keep up the good work.

[@wonkster1970]

Great job JR and Gabe! 👍

[@31dknight]

Great video from JR.

[@brucesabatoni3410]

Thanks man this is great to have for working on my Solstice!

[@dj_paultuk7052]

The engine looks familiar to me as a Saab guy, and sure enough its the same Ecotec as used in the very last 9-5's and also GM Insignia's over here in europe. So there were turbo variants from the factory.

[@rpavlik1]

This was turbo from the factory too. Just smaller turbo.

[@PaulE7932]

The A20NFT used in this Saturn is indeed the same one as in the 2011 9-5 as well as Insignia/Regal. The B-W K04 turbos in these are certainly not long-lived, both due to the usual bearing failures in B-W turbos and the exhaust housings cracking on them. The balance chain tensioner/guide is a common fail point on the Ecotec--I've replaced a few on Saab 9-3s; an inexpensive and relatively easy job there. Even good oil hygiene isn't going to make the intake side timing chain guides in the VVT-equipped Ecotecs last any longer, sadly. I shudder to say this, but this same job on the NG 9-5 is a whole lot easier, as there's so much room in the engine bay.

[@Raindrops4891]

not sure why im up late enough to catch this one fresh but im glad lolol

[@jhager214]

Great content. I love these kinds of repairs. I mean, this is a car I could afford, and I could do this in the garage! Can’t wait to hear it making boost again!

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

🍻😉👍🏼

[@beermaker411]

I really like the time lapse music you use in your videos.

[@Mike_Atwell]

This is exactly the service my Redline needs as well. Lots of timing chain slap. It's at 190k currently on the stock chains. Been running a maxpeedingrods turbo for the last 15k

[@MassiveTrackHunter]

Don't wait dude! So many saabs have died from folks letting that timing chain snap and take out the timing chain. Mine was slapping and eating into the timing tensioner ram, throwing metal bits into the oil, which could overload the filter cause oil filter bypass valve to send it directly into the pump and bearings. Worth the time to fix it now. Good luck!

[@Mike_Atwell]

@@MassiveTrackHunter indeed. I've got a few other cars I drive, so the Sky is not getting driven much at the moment. I definitely need to do this sooner than later

[@MassiveTrackHunter]

@@Mike_Atwell congrats on owning one. I have been eyeing them since they came out. Very cool lines.

[@Mike_Atwell]

@@MassiveTrackHunter bought the cheapest one available 2 years ago. Perfect spec. Silver with red interior. Redline with every option including magnaflow exhaust and illuminated windscreen. LED lighting swap, and always garaged. 5k, but had 180k miles. So it's due.

[@MassiveTrackHunter]

@@Mike_Atwell definitely worth the investment. Sounds like a beauty!

[@colyngautreaux1078]

Been watching you since you worked of gabes garage , good to see Hes still around

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

🍻😉👍🏼

[@skunkworks9-3]

Ecotecs are known to snap the front guide for the timing chain and break the tensioner guide for the balance shafts. Dorman makes a upper bolt fix for the front guide because it's known to back out from vibration. I've changed a couple chains on Saab LK9 engines which is a turbo version of the supercharged lsj engine found in the 05-07 Cobalt SS.

[@craiggotgame]

Great, now I’ve got that song in my head. I’m going to have to listen to that album on the way to work…

[@robbusheay4258]

lol......thats how I did my Sister's Mazda Miata timing chain.......2 vise grips......lol......a 92' and still running great !!!! Hey JR.......someday you, Josh, Gabe should have a sit down and talk about how-when -where you all met.........I think we all would enjoy that !!!

[@cppctek]

Those turbos that style fail often in my experience. Check the waste gate for too much flap. Many of them get stuck open or closed. And many have intermittent issues

[@cutehumor]

John Ross, Nice product placement for Motul shirt and Motul oil bottles in the background!

[@shannonwittman950]

Gentlemen, thanks! I really appreciate this content. I'm thinking seriously of buying a Solstice (naturally aspirated) and it's good to know this is generally a durable 4 cyl.engine if shown some TLC. When changing the water pump & thermo I can see it's a better idea to get into the whole timing chain area to inspect the plastic guides, tensioner, etc. I've heard the aftermarket water pumps have the weep hole facing toward the fender (instead of the GM part -- it faces the engine block). Makes inspection easy with the car on a lift during, say, an oil change.

[@camaromodschannel]

the exhaust is on the outside cams. Good Job..

[@Danger-Dave]

Not gonna lie even though my 07 redline only has 42k on it, it's your Vlog & the 15 year age of the plastic guides and known water pump failures that has me considering this same re-build in the near future. Gabe, while you're in there I'd pull the intake manifold and do a cleaning on the backside of the valves. I used some DI carbon cleaner & small soft brass wire wheel's and a drill cause even with only 42k on my LNF they were built up badly. I then added an AEM water meth kit to help keep them clean. The LNF is an amassing 4 banger and holds the currant 1/4 mile record in Carl Brunet's 08 Pontiac G8 GXP.

[@carportchronicles1943]

The "Door Gunner" shirt is awesome!

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

🍻😉👍🏼

[@plantedinpr886]

Great video JR. :-)

[@Palmlets]

Good to see Gabe back, hope we get to see the OG Opel again someday

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

I hope to have it on the ground this year!

[@jimschafer9196]

That was amazing and a wonder that the timing set did not blow and total out the engine, one could say saved in the nick of time.

[@MassiveTrackHunter]

That balance chain tensioner endcap with the spring was supposed to stay in permanently. If you look at the rod stocking out the other end, it used to be much longer and smooth on the end. The chain has been slapping that hydraulic push rod and eating it down to the nub, and the hammering on that rod is what busted the crimped spring retaining endcap loose on the other end. Betting that nub has a nice set of chain-shaped grinds on the end. Glad the engine survived.

[@MassiveTrackHunter]

Soooo much better that trying to work on that engine in a transverse car!! Really makes me want to grab a Redline!

[@steveluken3180]

Fun thought. A JR/Gabe revival series. Could probably be it's own channel, really. Just you guys finding the forgotten gems and getting them on the road again. 🍻

[@tedharveyiii5194]

I bet the collaboration would do well and help Gabe as well. Both are quirky with each other like they've been soul friends forever...good vibes for sure.

[@AW28]

Check the Pan and oil pick up for debris. Had this happen on a non-turbo Ecotec, and the guide debris plugged the pick up.

[@tpiguy]

The first broken white piece is the balance shaft chain tensioner shoe. Not the primary (timing) chain. The balance shaft tensioner failed and the back of it is blows out causing oil pressure to drop.

[@Fontanamotorsport]

balance shaft/water pump tensioner arm, very common, i do them all the time... always noticable because the balance shafts will go out of phase for sure... ive found this on cars around 50k miles and on....

[@bengriffin8905]

You know it will be a quality machine when Gabe's involved.

[@fahrfromrunnin]

I'm Betting that either 1) bits of something went through to the turbo and shelled it, OR the wonky oil pressure due to the tensioner being not complete blew out the oil seals, most likely the second option.

[@Usernamegoeshere84]

Oily exhaust is good. Gotta lubricate the muffler bearings!

[@markweissenbach196]

But Gabe’s shirt game is strong the last couple days

[@Parknest]

Looks like Gabe has dodged a massive bullet with all those broken guides. He was extremely lucky it didn't jump time.

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

No doubt!

[@Billys3D]

I'm still amazed there hasn't been a recall on the GM Ecotec engines. soooo many TSB's for oil consumption issues and for early timing chain guide failures causing engine failure.

[@anthonynelson2005]

Imagine if this car was built with a Caddy and bow tie badge on it, I bet they’d still be in production. The Saturn and Pontiac brand caused this under-rated car to die.

[@_Bonez12]

I think GM was really unsure if typical “chebby” customers would be appalled by a 4 cylinder sports car. Camaro/Corvette or nothing basically.

[@anthonynelson2005]

@@_Bonez12 imagine doing a RWD EV with the motors in the rear and putting it in this body. Pretty impractical but would be a trip.

[@brianeighties4481]

It was also an opel gt

[@brianbird3756]

Funny you say that. This engine, or a variant of it, was used in a cobalt and the rear diff was used in the first gen cts-v.

[@rpavlik1]

@@brianbird3756 I mean, they used the (non-turbo version of) the ecotec in everything from around that time...

[@adambauer3352]

Just had this done last spring on my 2012 Buick Regal GS 2.0 LHU motor. 72k miles and had a broken guide.

[@jerrylittle7797]

Love that wiring harness...guess it makes it a challenge for the pros....

[@jean-marcandjoshua-petsjournal]

Gabe! The dream team is together. Hope you can save her.

[@tony_25or6to4]

I've never had a floor cleaning pad that worn. I usually change them when they're smooth, but still have their thickness.

[@GenMaster124]

Just a thought …would oil pouring out the broken timing chain tensioner, cause low oil pressure to the turbo bearing ?

[@KMFDM781]

I doubt it...but I don't think it's impossible. Turbos don't need a lot of oil pressure to get properly lubricated. In fact, some turbos need restrictors in the oil line or it's too much and will blow past the seals.

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

@@KMFDM781 This!👍🏼

[@RCnAZ-y3z]

I'm with you. I think the broekn tensoner and turbo failure are related. Both are related to oiling system and oil pressure.

[@MichaelB-cs6ke]

Jr vid coming in clutch 💪 Didn’t all 2.4 Ecotecs have issues with oil consumption?

[@mmllmmll22]

I think this is 2.0 Turbo And Yes. It's with GM 4 cylinders in EU - they are prone to eat oil with same speed as petrol. (Opel /Vauxhall mostly )

[@rpavlik1]

Really? I thought it was just the original ("real" 😉) Saturn engines in the S series that drink thick fuel as well as thin. Didn't realize the more generic engine they replaced those with also had oil consumption problems.

[@peoriavideosltd6822]

I have a 2.4 in a Cobalt and it uses almost no oil at 260K miles.

[@adamlee333]

I'm glad I waited before commenting... well done...

[@adamlee333]

I'll stick to Miata all the same....

[@badmonkey3669]

You need to drop the oil pan and inspect the oil pump pickup screen, take it from me I just changed a 5.4 engine for a guy that 109,000 miles because the screen clogged up and locked the motor up because of almost the same issue and he drove it till it locked up from oil starvation from timing plastic

[@305sergio]

I thought that the piece they used the magnet to get out @13:20 was the tensioner pin, which was missing in the floor “broken pieces” compilation shot. If they didn’t pull it out before, it’s def still in there in the oil pan.

[@ravennexusmh]

I was thinking thr camlock tool was working but the crank was going past the due to the broken guide between the intake and the crank that was shortening the distance between them allowing the crank to go further then tdc

[@MassiveTrackHunter]

Those cams are not the typical gray GM color. That gold tone is exactly the same as the cams that are in the Saabs I have torn down in the past. The cobalt NA cams are silver gray. Betting you have the same grind as the 2007-11 NG9-3, which breathe really well for up to a st5 tune.

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

Sweet!😁👍🏼

[@stephendee7839]

I guarantee that you have bits of guide stuck in the oil pump pickup. You will want to replace all the chains and guides as well as the oil pump.

[@kevinschlossser7858]

do a balance shaft delete. You can get the plugs needed for the balance shafts and eliminate the balance shaft timing chain all together. It will actually cost about the same to eliminate the balance shafts, chain, guides, tensioner and the water pump. You will need weld the shaft hole on the water pump closed but not a big deal to do. An electric water pump will need to be installed as a replacement. This is on my list of things to do this summer for my Solstice.

[@Misterfairweather]

I'm only upvoting for floor scrubber content. Giving the people what we want.

[@TheBarberShopScott]

Floor scrubber content is pretty awesome!

[@unclejoe6811]

It's the Long Black guide that always is the start of trouble on these if you preemptively change that guide it prevents the failure of the other guides and possibly jumping time

[@unclejoe6811]

The straight long black guide opposite the tensioners and water pump side of the engine

[@esiebert7625]

That harbor freight stool you have in the background has been recalled as safety hazard as the welds that hold the seat on will fail. Mine broke after a month while sitting on it.

[@haberbo]

if the tensioner piston was out, could it possibly not make enough oil pressure for the turbo?

[@julias-shed]

Lucky escape there 😮

[@axxisblack]

I have the same engine in my Saab 93, it's a nightmare to work on. Korean and Japanese engine on the other hand very intuitive

[@ExtraFungus]

My 2.2 na ecotec is at 240k, I think I'm hearing timing chain slap, it's the original chain. So it's parked and I may check/change the guides and chains one day if I don't just scrap it.

[@stupersyn1]

I changed my timing chain, guides, tensioners, etc - around 160k. It cured the slapping, and no more worry about it skipping time and running into the interference valves.

[@ExtraFungus]

@@stupersyn1 I'm only apprehensive because I'm not 100% sure it's timing chain slap and it's a high mileage car. I got my money out of it, it was a $450 copart purchase.

[@unstablebobgable]

If I could work on the Saturn Sky Redline with Gabes and Watch JR Goes I would drink the shot of whiskey and the cold Bartle Skeets and pack up the Hash Pipe with Rocky and get all schmoked up

[@pedromatajr8725]

Nice you got a Camera guy!

[@rpavlik1]

Ooh that's scary. Makes me wonder what "timing chain slap" sounds like, is there like a database of concerning car noises? I know lifter noise and wheel bearings, and "whole in exhaust" plus "missing/failed bolt/rivet in heat shield"...

[@brainwells6634]

General Motors see you in 150,000 miles for your next failure

[@MrWoodyBalto]

I heard that you won't buy or build a work bench because you can't drive the floor cleaner over one.

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

This checks out…

[@WatchJRGo]

You heard right… I need a bench cleaning robot 😁

[@greathornedowl3644]

Today's Special Guest Star Gabriel, welcome back among the mobile. Thinking Gabe should look into an MR2 or Lotus (Toyota engine)

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

🍻😁👍🏼

[@jasonreichter3973]

That timing chain, guides, tensioners is so familiar to the 4.0 L nissan Xterra engine I just did that job on. I replaced it all. I wish these engineers would get away from these timing chains with plastic guides and tensioners. And the Xterra has the water pump behind the front cover also, just like that one. Very similar in design. Except for two banks of cylinders.

[@terencesoutham4262]

Is it possible the oil pressure is lost at the chain tension ?

[@RCnAZ-y3z]

My thoughts as ex dealer and manufacturer technician are this is Highly likely the turbo and tensioner failures are related. They're both oil system or oil pressure related. You guys may want to investigate this further before buttoning up the job.

[@toddgiaro7657]

I’ve been watching Watchjrgo, Hoovie, 100percentjake and Elliot for a few years now and what’s in the water in Wichita? Nobody ages at all! I need to move there before I have to many more birthdays!

[@kerrylewis2581]

Gabe, Are you happy the turbo let loose, or were you planning on replacing the timing components anyway?

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

We were going to do it anyway. Mileage and the slight timing chain slap said it was time to do it. The turbo going was coincidental.

[@plus790]

Re: not being able to get it to align...could the cam chain have stretched?

[@chynaman04]

Broke out with the random Ja Rule performance🤣🤣…. Haven’t heard that song since high school

[@dantediss1]

That looks like the tensioner to 90% of 2007 Mini Cooper S's on the Road Today hahaha

[@toolzshed]

Hope there aren't any broken guide pieces in there 😲

[@jimmccormick6091]

I must admit, I am from a different time. I learned on engines that were much, much, much simpler than today's to hear JR say with a straight face "simplest engine in the world!" A) make me feel like the village idiot, and B) Makes me have a good deal more respect for how smrt JR is..... SMART! Doh!

[@kevinschlossser7858]

Make sure you put a new balancer bolt in. DO NOT reuse the old one. It is a torque to yield bolt and the threads stretch once it is tightened up.

[@Melanie16040]

Seems like no one else has suggested this. But it's possible for an engine to keep running if timing has only jumped one tooth... And what you're describing with the cam tool not fitting. Certainly sounds to me like timing that had jumped a tooth.

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

We considered that as well. We found however, that the tool was a poorly made copy and the clocking on the fingers aren’t in the correct location.

[@jimbranham3281]

When are we going to see some content on the Opel GT?

[@dadteaches]

Twice now in the past couple of years, I do the timing and not swap out the oil pump, and in less than a year, the oil pump starts failing...just swap it while it's all apart :)

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

Good call

[@ernieleithes6545]

Did you by chance turn the engine backwards that would explain the tensioner popping out as the chain went slack ,dont think that was running like that when it came in.

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

As I’ve looked further into this, it seems, surprisingly, it’s not that uncommon of an issue.

[@DISOPtv]

I want one of Gabe's shirts!

[@simonilett998]

I think I see the main reason for the common broken timing chain tensioner issues...It's written clearly on the upper plastic engine cover👍🤣

[@johnarroyo8059]

Check the turbo mine. Was leaking and I spun a bearing on my 2007 red line with 1011k miles time to rebuild the problem with these cars is the turbo ware to quick

[@johnarroyo8059]

Replace the crack pulley fluid damper upgrade

[@GeoTrashPanda]

LNF=kicking ass and chew bubblegum but damn I'm all out gum! I love my LNF in my SS!

[@toddjones9715]

This that engine design from Saturn or an original GM. It's impressive to have an engine not grenade it self when the plastic fails. BMW looking at you.

[@SteveBassen]

Chain stretch causing the TDC misalignment with the cam lock tool?

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

No, it’s the tool. Unfortunately, in spite of all efforts to avoid it, we ended up with a poorly made copy of an expensive tool. No matter how we tried it just never aligned correctly.

[@alexisdp]

Got to love a ecowreck

[@Jeckler]

If the cam sprockets won't take the lock when the crank is straight up, that sure sounds like it jumped time to me.

[@nicolashoyt5341]

JR I challenge you to remove a Honda Crank Bolt with that Milwaukee, my 1/2" Snap On air barely did it eventually with the special heavy weight socket, the HF Earthquake electric 1/2" couldn't do it. Curious if the Milwaukee would hold up to it's hype in that scenario.

[@WatchJRGo]

It doesn’t, you have to have those flywheel sockets 💯

[@tedharveyiii5194]

Tensioner could be the reason for the weird compression issue and leak down results..?

[@plus790]

Now any time I see a valve cover come off I want them to use that anti-sludge stuff on it.

[@razfellow]

Bonus points for all the 90s music references. Gabe -- How was the availability and prices for all the replacement parts for the Sky?

[@Gabe-ABNCW3]

Parts were pretty easy to find this time. 😀👍🏼

[@razfellow]

@@Gabe-ABNCW3 I was a little overwhelmed by the disassembly. Sucks it broke with 1k miles or so.