Tiny Pack Hang Glider (TPHG) | Test Flights

[@gregsaracino3252]

Great video, Eric, and great work, Florian! It clearly needs work but it's exciting to see a new product being developed and encouraging to see someone tackling the portability problem. Keep us posted!

[@AvishalomShalit]

"if you are looking for perfect safety, you will do well to sit on a fence and watch the birds; but if you really wish to learn, you must mount a machine and become acquainted with its tricks by actual trial.” - Wilbur Wright it is worthwhile to note that these words inspired his brother Orville Wright to take that first flight, while he was sitting on a fence, watching.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Exactly. You have to start somewhere.

[@methaman5594]

I would like to point you towards the developments happening at Avian HGs. A team of several aerospace engineers and doctors have been at work developing a radically new wing for several years now. Flight tests are expected soon this year. Watch this space.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Tim and I know one another already and have corresponded a few times. We have reciprocal links to each other's websites and I know about Avian Hang Gliders. But thank you for trying to establish that communication and sharing that knowledge.

[@الدعوةالىالله-خ8م]

@@HangGlidingFlightSchool 🔴 What Is Islam? 🔴 Islam is not just another religion. 🔵 It is the same message preached by Moses, Jesus and Abraham. 🔴 Islam literally means ‘submission to God’ and it teaches us to have a direct relationship with God. 🔵 It reminds us that since God created us, no one should be worshipped except God alone. 🔴 It also teaches that God is nothing like a human being or like anything that we can imagine. 🌍 The concept of God is summarized in the Quran as: 📖 { “Say, He is God, the One. God, the Absolute. He does not give birth, nor was He born, and there is nothing like Him.”} (Quran 112:1-4) 📚 🔴 Becoming a Muslim is not turning your back to Jesus. 🔵 Rather it’s going back to the original teachings of Jesus and obeying him.

[@nikita.gazarov]

Great to see the prototype in detail. Improving portability would be a great boon to hang gliding. Mad respect to Florian, and I hope he perseveres with V2!

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Agreed. Thanks for the polite comment and showing your support.

[@olsonspeed]

A TPHG has eluded designers for decades, it is a very difficult engineering challenge. The Whitney/Eddie Paul Portawing looked to be as minimalist as structuraly posible. I hope this colaboration of veteran pilots can acheive their goals.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

True. Extremely difficult to engineer something with adequate strength and rigidity, plus the ability to compact into a small size.

[@savagemako17]

There was a hang glider type device out of Europe some 10 to 15 years ago. It was self inflating. It was called the Woopy fly and/or the woopy jump. It was far simpler than this. Much lighter. Much easier to manage and was fun just to fly off a small hill and glide to the bottom. The whole thing only weighed a handful of pounds. It should have been a HUGE hit, but then disappeared. There are a bunch of videos here on KZbin showing it being used by skiers and on a video from Japan that it was used as a pure hang glider. This thing could have changed flying for MANY people. Oh well!!

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

The aircraft you mention is called the "Kalbermatten Woopy" invented by Swiss hang glider pilot Laurent de Kalbermatten. It never went into production but a number of prototypes were made.

[@savagemako17]

@@HangGlidingFlightSchool This thing looked too good to be true. I still go back and watch the videos of these machines. Any idea why it never made it "off the ground"? It seems like this would have been a HUGE seller.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

@@savagemako17 I agree, it looks very cool and quite promising. Laurent de Kalbermatten also made the first commercial paraglider, so he clearly knows a thing or two about airfoils. I have no idea why the Woopy didn't get produced.

[@savagemako17]

@@HangGlidingFlightSchool Thank you for the reply and info. It looks like Mr. Kalbermatten has moved on and is now working with inflatable sails for boats. What a shame. I would have pursued the woopy jump right to the end.

[@sebcam9498]

⁠@@savagemako17I’ve got an old magazine exposing this wing. Mr Kalbermatten wanted to build a glider as safe to fly as possible. By design, it can’t be stalled, because the AoA adjusts itself automatically. But it is at the expense of performance and manoeuvrability. If I understand well, speed range is quite limited, and tight spirals out of option. Catching thermals with is not documented, from what I know, as a matter of fact. It has even been motorized, to get a very simple to manage ultralight. But still with the aforementioned limitations. The Woopy jump, being a smaller version of the Woopy fly, is getting a better exposure now while being a very accessible type of speed riding, with ski, on slopes. I wish too that a further development would have brought us an inflatable glider, with performances of modern hang gliders

[@kenmcconnell4148]

Some interesting innovations, i can see the Spaneron is causing a big problem preventing the essential billow in fact its deforming it the opposite direction not helped by no luff lines that’s why The trailing edge is shaking badly as the airflow is separating detached airflow in a critical area even at high AoA - fit luff lines & a floating telescopic collapsable cross tube to enable roll/yaw control

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

All the pilots present reached the same conclusions.

[@ericoschmitt]

Or instead go bowsprit, which will be lighter than both solutions and no cross tube to worry about!

[@estrelladelfree]

Si esto se mejora, la comunidad del ala delta va a REVIVIR, ya que es uno de los inconvenientes que ocupe mucho espacio. Felicidades!! 🔥🤙🏻

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Yes, the size is cumbersome and hopefully this kind of technology will help.

[@nickcaci7238]

I enjoyed the old timer stars and their enthusiastic support more. Perhaps they May remember the Whitney’s Porta-Wing by, Whitney’s Enterprise from LA California, back around 73,74. Very portable, lightweight, fast setup and flew OK. Wings like these are great for one time escape flights from the Federally’s down in Bolivia.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Yes, we are lucky to have some of the originators flying with us. I have seen other pilots boast about flying with people who have 3-digit USHGA numbers and I just keep my mouth shut. 😂

[@scoooterbob2321]

This was great to see. It was also good to see Andy as he was my instructor in 1989ish. I haven't flown in CA since '91'

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Very cool. Yes, Andy is a great instructor.

[@johnedwards3786]

Such a brilliant set of videos The best web site I have ever seen on Hang gliders Thank you so much for providing so much valuable information

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

What a nice thing to say. Thanks so much. I'm glad you appreciate the project and find it useful.

[@someguydino6770]

thank you, thank you, very, very much for NOT mentioning paragliding! also; sorry; no disrespect to Florian; but the ultra lightweight and short pack hang glider was designed and manufacturered many, many years ago by Finsterwalder and they STILL sell gliders!

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Fisterwalder is mentioned twice in the video.

[@ericoschmitt]

I think by "tiny" they mean 1,5 meter, while the smaller Finsterwalders are 1,85m (Lightfex and Airfex) while for most people the 16sqm Perfex and Funfex pack down to 1,95m. I own a Funfex and it is great! However if someone manages to make something even smaller, lighter, quicker to setup from short pack, great! Most of the time I keep it in long pack anyway, along with the other gliders on garage racks. It's an amazing wing even if you use it only as a 'conventional' hang glider.

[@llueveagustodetos]

I am very happy to see that research into hang gliding is still going on. Research has been stopped for many years, only implementing small things. The Finsterwalder wing is almost perfect (and very safe) the only improvement would be to shorten the short package by 50 cm. Your wing makes me happy because the package is very short but it has too much flutter (not only on the trailing edge) everything is very loose and it still seems very unsafe. Keep up the good work, keep improving and thanks again for trying to solve the only problem of this sport: Logistics.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

So many people keep making good comments about the Finsterwalder, it really makes me want one.

[@ericoschmitt]

@@HangGlidingFlightSchool They are great! Glide above 10, good speed, a joy to handle and land, flare is easy! Worth buying.

[@Hangglide]

Thank you for sharing the TPHG test flight! I enjoyed the whole video, awesome content!

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

You are very welcome. Glad you enjoyed it.

[@jerrysanders9101]

Love it- necessity is the mother of invention- let’s fly 🎉

[@behrouzmovahed7525]

Thank you so much for sharing this amazing video 🙏🏻👌❤️

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Thank you for leaving a kind and respectful comment.

[@youtubemademecreateanewcha6965]

Very nice I hope your hang glider becomes popular and safe to fly.

[@brettwoodard167]

Looks promising, great video!

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Thank you. I agree, it's a good start.

[@sergelamarche]

I agree with the idea of a more practical hang glider. I recall how my old Gemini was practical and fast to set up. I was thinking the Ram-Air would be a mid-ground between paraglider and hang glider. A hang glider packable into a backpack would be great. Inflatable battens, maybe.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

There are a lot of potential approaches.

[@ericoschmitt]

What I heard from people who flew the RamAir was the performance sucked as soon as you pulled speed. Maybe the concept was badly implemented, I think with today's knowledge about modern paragliders, a ram air undersurface could be made to work very well.

[@timward4301]

Velcro is what was used to secure battens in the 70s.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Interesting. Didn't know that.

[@timward4301]

@@HangGlidingFlightSchool Yep. We stopped doing that because Velcro either stops sticking together or wears through. Strings are easier to replace.

[@cosmowerkstapes]

the woopy-wing, woopy jump and woopy fly are decent inflatable gliders. haven't flown one yet but they are youtubed and seem to fly well.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

The aircraft you mention is called the "Kalbermatten Woopy" invented by Swiss hang glider pilot Laurent de Kalbermatten, who also made the first commercial paraglider.

[@cosmowerkstapes]

@@HangGlidingFlightSchool sounds like you have been doing your research! 😉😉

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

@@cosmowerkstapes Well, I have to do my research. I wouldn't have a very good educational project if I wasn't trying to learn a lot myself. Right? 🙂

[@cosmowerkstapes]

@@HangGlidingFlightSchool that's pretty much it. always something more to learn.😉😉

[@cluelessbeekeeping1322]

It needs either a 'leech line' or in short, a small line (strong string) in the trailing edge. This will keep the trailing edge from flapping. Small batons will also help, but it looks like you really need to slightly modify the sail cut.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Pretty much all of that is said in the video, but thanks for reiterating important ideas.

[@zopilotegalaz1128]

Nice,great start.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Indeed it's a good beginning.

[@michaelbohlander6711]

Looking forward to the V2

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Yes, me too! This is a great start.

[@jakobb598]

Great work! We need more like Florian in the sport!

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Absolutely. His enthusiasm and ambition is wonderful.

[@sibylvane75]

As old school rc flyer all of this is a dream day

[@mezonspb]

Такие эксперементы очень важны, потому что они наглядно доказывают, что все лучшее уже было сделано раньше, до того времени, как мир начал "сходить с ума".

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

There is always room for improvement.

[@66DMJC]

There's a guy Neil Kinnear if you can find him built successful short pack hang gliders in the 80s. At that time he was teaching in a S London school in UK. Some of his a/c were used in practical flying and Science lessons as part of their education

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

I'm sure Florian will appreciate the that.

[@0bm31770]

I have an old Colver variometer. Is Frank Colver the designer and manufacturer?

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

That is correct. Frank Colver invented, built and sold the very first hang glider variometer. Great guy. He is active on the US Hawks forums, if you would like to reach out to him.

[@ericoschmitt]

I hope he can fix the aerodynamics while still achieving the weight and packing goals. It looks quite obvious that the battens should extend all the way to trailing edge, not sure why he made them shorter. Maybe batten length concern due to packing, but then the Finsterwalders have battens that can split. That cross bar solution obviously didn't work, and the lightest possible solution would be a bowsprit design, although at this low nose angle it may be a challenge. The middle span of the sail has the trailling edge too low, so there's no washout on the glider. Maybe even a negative average washout, so the glider is, besides stiff from the crossbar, also unstable. The front part of the sail looks too stretched. All those things can be fixed with sail cut, longer battens, and a different crossbar solution. If the result is still very light and short packable, then it will be great!

[@albionbowers9391]

The inability to turn is not surprising. Flexwing hang gliders require the sail billow to “move” from one side to the other to turn. By introducing the rigid “battens” spanwise prevents the differential billow to turn.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Yes, that was what all the pilots in attendance concluded.

[@andrewanderson3472]

I wonder would inflatable full length battens help , they have tents now with inflatable poles that are able to handle extreme winds

[@permawatt7773]

Bonjour , bravo pour cette recherche . Le velcro pour fixer les lattes au bord de fuit a déja été utilisé par La Mouette sur l'Atlas et le X-ray en 1978-1980, ce n'est donc pas nouveau . Les lattes doivent aller jusqu'au bord de fuite , avec un peu de reflex pour donner de la stabilité au profil . Il a existé des ailes pliable en 2,5m (Windfex de Finsterwalder); Bref je pense que plutot que de re-inventer "l'eau chaude" , ne serait il pas plus efficace de partir sur des bases connues et testées pour faire une tiny-delta ??bonne continuation pour le V2 . Benoit PERMAFLY France

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Yes, and the La Mouette Atlas is the first true "modern glider" so the sport owes a lot of gratitude to Jean-Marc and Gérard Thevenot. Many pilots died on the unstable gliders which were created before the French contributed the La Mouette Atlas design.

[@andymccann2716]

A very exciting video, probably more of a flug tag glider though

[@TheCraigy83]

it looks stronger then it needs to be / too heavy ,

[@atheistcomments]

Proof of concept. 👍

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Yep. Just the beginning.

[@atheistcomments]

@raymondo162 It's a prototype.

[@lohikarhu734]

The days of "Low and Slow" magazine, the "Conduit Condor"...

[@onkcuf]

9:42 it's a play at your own risk situation.

[@SkidzFPV]

Im curious as to why he had to travel all the way to the United States to get someone to test fly it. There’s a huge free flight community in Switzerland, are we just the only “cowboys” willing to take on something like this? Or is there liability reasons that he could not get the test flights done at home?

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Florian doesn't have a KZbin account, but he saw your question and he emailed me: "My travel to LA was booked before the glider has been finished and because of the weather (zero wind) I couldn't do any kind of test flight at home before coming in LA."

[@KeithMilton-rl1mg]

The glider still needs refinement. Its not ready yet but i suspect soon.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Yes, this particular version isn't ready, but it's an excellent beginning.

[@flightjunkie808]

Look up the Woopy Fly or Woopy Jump wing.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

The aircraft you mention is called the "Kalbermatten Woopy" invented by Swiss hang glider pilot Laurent de Kalbermatten. It never went into production but a number of prototypes were made. Laurent de Kalbermatten also made the first commercial paraglider.

[@googleyoutubechannel8554]

Welcome to ye olde Piratey Hang Gliding Flight School!! where we teach yee about Lam-in-arrrrggh! flow!!

[@ВикторПрокопюк-ъ1н]

Нехватает Аэродинамики, но в целом, хорошо! 😊

[@gliderrider]

I haven’t flown since 2005. Still, you never get it out of your blood.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

You should come back. I took a 22 year hiatus and returned.

[@SeeBird686]

I get the feeling It'll be a while before anyone wants to cliff launch it. Some work to do,,,

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Yeah, I don't think a cliff launch would be adviseable. 😆

[@tomthompson7400]

why under 5 feet ,,, under eight or nine would suit most cars / estates , if it made building the glidr easier ,,, but this has to be a major step forwards ,, well done to all on the team.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

I believe Florian is attempting to make a pack which will be allowed as a carry-on when traveling on an airplane. That is why he is striving for something so tiny.

[@tomthompson7400]

@@HangGlidingFlightSchool lol easy jet will love him ,,,,

[@ericoschmitt]

@@HangGlidingFlightSchool Most airlines carry packages up to 3 meters, which means the Bautek Astir is a great glider to travel by plane with. The Finsterwalders under 2 meters are already enough too. 5ft or 1,5m~ seems to be an arbitrary number IMO, not sure if making the glider 40cm shorter than current Finsterwalders is so important. Now, making it lighter and faster to assemble without sacrificing performance would be good.

[@christophergagliano2051]

That glider needs reflex in the sail, That's pretty obvious

[@Cysiu106]

Lotnia została opatentowana w latach 80 od tego czasu zmienia się tylko: materiały,technologia,reszta jest dopracowana w ostatnich 20 latach.Prostota konstrukcji jest naprawdę do podziwu i nie ulegnie poważnym zmianom.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

I see you fly trikes/microlights in Poland. That's very cool. Hang gliders have existed much longer than the 1980's and their designs have been refined for much more than 20 years. Check out my other video on how hang gliding began and the history of the sport.

[@ericoschmitt]

Then you must check what Tim Swait, designer of Avian Hang Gliders is working on. That will be a BIG change, and is happening now in 2025. I believe his glider will come out way ahead of all other existing designs, and other manufacturers will have to reinvent themselves to catch up.

[@goodwaterhikes]

If Florian can perfect his TPHG design I'm sure many more people would join the sport. 👍👍😎☮

[@flierbill]

Erika!

[@simonforbes2453]

Something that doesn't work in theory, won't work in practice.

[@HangGlidingFlightSchool]

Depends on the competence of the person judging the theory.

[@ericoschmitt]

Proof of concept models are a thing you know. Now he can make a second version fixing the problems while keeping the short pack and light weight.

[@simonforbes2453]

​@@ericoschmitt You're right, proof of concept models are a thing, but in this case he built a glider without several design features which are absolutely required to make it turn and prevent it from stalling etc and none of which particularly conflict with the design mission to create a short pack hanglider. This makes no sense. Anyone with basic knowledge of aviation design could have told him that his design would not fly would not turn and would be prone to spin and lockout. All issues which have been designed out of hangliders 30 years ago. He has demonstrated the need for concepts which have already been proven by others, but he hasn't proven his concept, that he can make a short pack 5ft glider which can take the loads of flight, so it has really achieved nothing, and at high cost. I'm not saying that what he wants to do cannot be done, just that this hasn't really moved him closer to doing it. I would say he's a person who is good at making things but not competent to design an aircraft. A lot of qualified people have evolved hangliders from being death-traps to being very 'fit for purpose' and efficient machines - it is possible that everyone has missed a way to make a glider pack up small with no compromises on safety or performance - but considering how much this guy seems to have missed about hanglider design, it's a stretch.

[@ParaMotoparts]

I don’t know but this glider looks horrible from design and aerodynamics. All the Finsterwalder Fexes Look 100% better. Even 1980s Gliders look more evolved.

[@VTSifuSteve]

Agreed. However I applaud all efforts to make an easy, lightweight, and quick to assemble short-pack glider. For weight and ease of assembly nothing beats the rogallo I had back in '75. On the downside it had the glide ratio of a flat rock and serious safety problems.

[@charliemotakpochop]

I still fly my 89 FF from time to time. It's a great glider to bring along for long, multi-month trips, safely stored under a bed in the car. :)

[@ericoschmitt]

@@charliemotakpochop I own and regularly fly a 1992 Funfex, flew it twice this week plus lent to a friend who also loved it! They are a joy. Of course I also own other gliders.

[@ericoschmitt]

You gotta apreciate the weight and short pack solutions. If he can solve the other issues then we could get something really nice, like an WW Alpha but instead of 23kg and no short pack, could be super light and tiny pack.