Too expensive? Should you buy a Kramer knife?

[@BertchCustomKnives]

I am a knife maker and I forge damascus blades so I know you're correct. The damascus does have texture to the blade because it has to be etched in an acid to show the pattern. One steel will etch more than the other and then after sanded the pattern is revealed but it does leave some texture to the blade.

[@stevew3978]

I mostly agree with your assessment at 10:57. I also have a Kramer Damascus. Mine is a 10" Kramer Damascus chef knife. It's a very poorly performing knife. To clarify your point, it's not the Damascus texture that's preventing your Damascus utility knife from slicing through food. Rather the heavy chemical etching used to produce the dull gray areas on the Damascus pattern gave those gray areas a very high surface friction that does not glide through food. For example, cutting a whole turnip or whole rutabaga in half with the Kramer Damascus blade is downright dangerous because it would require a great deal of force to force the blade through the hard vegetables.

[@dcyennie]

I've been using Victorinox knives forever. Inexpensive, easy to sharpen, solid non-slip handles

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

I have a couple of those too. American's Test Kitchen always seems to like them as well. They work fine but I also like something a little fancier/high end too!

[@C69hJc4]

Also good to have these around as beaters, but they go dull super fast.

[@morehn]

Which are "these" that you're referring to? ​@@C69hJc4

[@ralphmelish2735]

I'm a long time fan of carbon steel knives. They are sharper and look nicer once the patina starts developing. They do take a bit more time to learn to sharpen, and require some oil. But it is not that much work. Great video!

[@jonthewolf93]

hi scott! love your videos! i got my fav pan, a debuyer carbon steel, after watching your videos. imo, the kramers are very nice but overpriced compared to carbon steel japanese brands. i saw in the comments that you're interested in getting one! my unsolicited advice is first: stay away from western-catered shun or miyabi. instead have a look at a brand like Hitohira who carry different blacksmiths or nigara hamono. for a chef's knife, go for a guyto 220-240 mm in blue 2 or super blue, usually about 63-64 hardness and good value. if you want smaller and use a pushcut technique, skip the nakiri or santoku and go for a bunka 180mm, a straight profile with a good point for dexterous work. the best is to go in person to a specialty store to see what feels good and get guidance but if not, you can do a lot of research online. btw dont be intimidated by sharpening, it's not that hard and you can get by with just one 1000 grit stone. sorry for the long comment but wanted to share from what i have learned from getting into this 4-5 years ago. you are going to love it btw :)

[@posterestantejames]

I have the same Stainless Kramer Euroline in the standard 8" and a carbon steel Wusthof 9" (Anniversary)...both have their place. Both are far far better than the Dexter-Russell knives that the restaurant provided, and I love the stainless Kramer especially when I have guests who don't know how to care for carbon steel. When it's just me, I reach for the Wusthof every time.

[@kcb5150]

I'm an antique Sabatier carbon guy. I deal with the general softness and the most annoying bolsters of all time because I love the balance and slicing profile.

[@twatmunro]

I've owned my carbon steel Sabatier since 1977. It's a bit misshapen, because I had no idea how to sharpen for most of the last fifty years, but it still works beautifully and I can get it laser sharp (now I know how to use a whetstone instead of a drag through carbide abomination).

[@hijackn2890]

I think you nailed the trade offs between the stainless and carbon steel. I prefer the experience of cutting with carbon but you can’t beat the convenience of stainless. The only solution I’ve found is to have way too many of both styles. Cheers!

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

Cheers right back! And no matter what my wife says, you can never have too much great kitchen gear. I hear people talk about only needing three knives... BAH! I need at least 50!

[@anthonygm85]

I like the full bolster knives, feels good and gives a nice control feel for me, I like carbon steel sharpens up so easy and stainless is nice also

[@TedInATL]

I have owned the 8 inch SS Kramer Chef's knife for a while now. I appreciate the curved blade profile for eliminating the accordion effect on vegetables and meat w/o having to manipulate the angle too much.

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

In the video I showed cutting those carrot sticks with the 6"... it really struck me how much difference there was between cutting with a six and an eight. Much more dramatic than the difference between and eight and a ten.

[@garbledstoic]

While it was fun ogling those sharp beauties as shiny objects of culinary desire, I probably won't buy any of them. The German steel blades I have are already thirty years old and then some. Still workhorses every bit as good as when I bought them. But your video just reminded me that I should break out the Tormek for their twice yearly sharpening. Where did I put those bandaids? There will be blood. Love the show.

[@da900smoove1]

I lucked up and was at a Zwilling outlet store and there was a Kramer Stainless 8in Chef Knife on Clearance (DEMO 1.0 Model) for $100... Needless to say it left with me as it was the only one in the clearance bin of Zwilling & Miyabi. Then around Xmas i found the 6in Stainless for $100 on Cutlery and More on closeout. Then after Xmas sale I found a 6in Miyabi Fusion Morimoto edition for $120

[@marcpodolski3366]

The one in Westchester county... Scarsdale I think?

[@ve2166]

Agreed with the BK 10 inch Carbon Steel. I went through the same thoughts, still grabbing my 8 inch. I also have the BK Damascus Nakiri and don’t use that much.

[@richardweeks1481]

Over the years I've tried many different knifes. IMHO for quality and price hard to beat Victorinox.

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

I like those too and I have a couple of them, mostly because ATK recommended them. I still like having some higher-end stuff too, but for functionality, they seem to work fine.

[@DeRobez]

Great review, beautiful knives, even more beautiful watch 👍

[@russellfrancis813]

The Kramer Carbon 1.0 requires linseed oil on the handle, for sure. Not a bad idea to occasionally put some on the blade as well.

[@NickBR57]

And certainly not a good idea to leave it wet in a sink overnight. You can't complain at rivets and wood dimensions if you treat high end natural materials like plastic

[@jonathanselzer706]

Love your channel. I missed your post about Debuyer's black friday sale. How often do they have sales. Which one is the best? I want to get a carbon steel pan. I do not have any luck finding them in the restaurant supply shops near me ,in the northern end ,of the NYC metropolitan area.

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

Hi Jonathan. Usually the big sale they have is around Black Friday/Cyber Monday, but they do have others throughout the year. I dont know for sure, but I'd bet there will be a New Year's or President's Day sale. Currently they have a free gift with purchase, but whether that's good or not depends on what the gift is (I think they change it each week) and whatever pan you are looking for. If you have the cash, the Mineral B Professional is the carbon steel I like the most, behind that is the regular Mineral B. It's an affiliate link, but here is a link to the Pros if you want to check them outL debuyer-usa.com/collections/carbon-steel?sca_ref=404835.2T2gLdk0je

[@rainman3628]

Hey Scott. I just caught your video here and am wondering if you’d part with your 10” Kramer carbon steel 1.0? I personally like the 1st series of these knives better than the 2.0 versions. Thanks in advance

[@joshrheault4321]

Any thoughts on Rada knives? My wife loves hers but hates having to sharpen them so often.

[@aquaphoenixx]

Congrats on the Le Creuset Black on Black Dutch Oven! Do you think it is a bad idea to make a comparison between the Black Ename Le Creuset and a Staub? I bought my first Staub after 8 Le Creuset pieces and I have cooked 3 times in it so not enough to have made a thorough comparison. But your review will be helpful to others

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

I will do a video on the black Le Creuset! It has a good wife-story built in... maybe in the next Pancast.

[@aquaphoenixx]

​@@UncleScottsKitchen Looking forward to it!

[@TL....]

i don't think the zwilling knives have anything to do with bob, aside from zwilling paying bob to be able to put his name on the product i own a bob kramer forged knife from the 90s that belonged to my father and it is literally the best knife i have ever come across

[@thorwaldjohanson2526]

I think he designed those knives together with zwilling. He definitely seems to be involved.

[@roospike]

I own the Bob Kramer 8" Damascus chefs knife as well as the 7" Meiji Santoku , the Damascus handle has the drawbacks with a raised rivets and the shrinking handle and don't actually use it on a regular basis but the Meiji is a fantastic overall all around knife and I can't believe it's not the most popular one of the group. The Meiji 7" santoku is basically exactly the same as the 8" Chef Meiji except the very tip finishing at a different angle, . I've used the stainless and the carbon steel versions and I didn't have much desire to add them to the collection after already owning the Damascus and Meiji models I just stayed with these two models.

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

What blade material is the Meiji? I might need to add that one next. Do you find any difference between the Damascus and the other blades as far as food sticking or cutting smoothness?

[@roospike]

@@UncleScottsKitchen * The potent core of FC61 fine carbide stainless steel is protected by 100 layers of nickel and stainless steel. * Hand-honed Honbazuke blade boasts scalpel-like sharpness; 61 Rockwell Hardness with 9 to 12° angle on each side

[@roospike]

@@UncleScottsKitchen The Damascus model has a slight drag if your looking for it but believe most of drag is because the width of the blade. Imho The stainless Damascus model is acid etched textured surface ( like sandblasted feel ) to where the Meiji Damascus is more laser etched style smooth surface.

[@cis6mod]

it has been about 3 years that 8” BK licensed Damascus chef's knife joined my kitchen collection. I was really curious how it performs but I finally found that I prefer Japanese-style laser thin knife over thick and heavy knife like BK. Definitely there are personal preferences between them. Still it is in my kitchen, I let my guests to use it instead of more delicate and care-needed Japanese knives. Currently I am thinking to perchase Steelport knife. Made in Oregon, made from American-sourced materials. 🤔

[@okashyadatenshi3725]

the steel port knives are amazing truely the best knife next to my kramers, but they are a absolutel pill to sharpen, i m sending mine off to a proffessional sharpening service.

[@thorwaldjohanson2526]

You could have the Kramer knive thinned by a professional sharpener.

[@cis6mod]

@@thorwaldjohanson2526 I don’t think I would do. I just went to buy custom knives with better HT, better steel, 0.003~0.005” BTE, and better fit and finish.

[@cis6mod]

@@okashyadatenshi3725 I got a Steel Port knife from my friend as a gift. Thinner and harder than Kramer. 52100 is pretty easy to sharpen in my stone set. I have diamond waterstones.

[@thorwaldjohanson2526]

@@cis6mod well 52100 is not a better steel than FC61. Slightly lower edge retention and toughness, while not being stainless. Of course with 65HRC the edge retention will be better than FC61, but the toughness will be significantly lower. But especially the blade geometry is an argument. I just seems very hard to find good makers that use stainless.

[@caravann26]

Did any of your blades come slightly bent ? Mine did .pissed off my first big boy knife came in bent I called Kramer and actually spoke to bobs wife she said it's normal ,told me to put a towel down and gently bend it back! She stayed on the phone and talked me down off the cliff .and my knife has remained straight to this day .she said it's normal to happen after the heat treatment. And BTW kale is the devils lawn clippings!!

[@michaeleber4752]

Over the years, and losing Japanese knives to simple kitchen accidents that happen all the time, I favor the German steel and German knives. I had a pair of Japanese knives made with American steel but they no longer make/sell them. I look at the $250 Kramer for Zwilling and still cannot justify the cost. Instead for my set of knives I am leaning towards the Messermeister Oliva Elite chef knife.

[@jefflawson7468]

I love your stove my dream stove😃👍

[@hildegerdhaugen7864]

I would have bought the Euroline 8" or 10" chefs knife but it was never available in Europe.

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

You might be able to get them through Amazon... I got some De Buyer stuff one time from the British Amazon site.

[@aquaphoenixx]

You are not wrong on the Damascus. There was a youtuber (Ricky) that tested 2 Kramers Damascus and Non Damascus (I forgot if it was the carbon steel or stainless steel version) and he said the Damascus finish was sticking a bit more on foods initially. I think you need to regularly use the knife and the knife will become better. And the Damascus is aesthetic but bear in mind that it is 100 layers of steel for this knife. The knife has SG2 Steel in the middle and 50 layers of Damascus on each side so you have one cutting steel and 100 decorative layers of steel. The Damascus is not only decorative. It helps with the sturdiness of the knife as well.

[@twatmunro]

Those are some gorgeous knives. I think they're overpriced, but they're fantastic knives. I use Japanese knives myself. Combination of blacksmith made knives and factory knives, but they're all Japanese (and all carbon steel). I think the most expensive was still half the price of a Kramer 10" Great review though, Scott.

[@thomaswipf7986]

Try Glestain with scallops. I love my gyuto and santoku over wusthof classic ikon.

[@thomaswipf7986]

food falls off glestain. speeds up work for real. kzbin.info/www/bejne/bZ-3c3iYgrZ1fbM

[@philipp594]

Damascus is not the blade material. It’s a name for the forge welded outside layer of the San Mai construction. The core should be a harder / powdered steel. I think VG10 in this case. Btw this is not real damascus. Real damascus is wootz steel from damascus. But thank you for the video this has been very insightful. I‘ve always thought about picking up the 10“ SS as a beater.

[@timivers8823]

Sharpening the carbon is super easy. Strop it once every month.

[@jonny9884]

Dude, curl your thumb back ! Man, you had my heart stopping a few times there with your cuts ! Please, please look into going for an even more claw like position for your thumb as well. And, I'm looking into getting the Damascus petty, utility knife you're using here. Great to see it on KZbin, and thanks for showing us all the knives you have there !

[@EmeraldCoastChefs]

I would happily pay 3k for a knife made by Bob, but the Zwilling production knives with his name on them are overpriced, especially compared to other production options, including other Brands owned by Zwilling like Myabi.

[@frednovaes5888]

Bob Kramer 8” carbon steel, the 10” is next.

[@knifesharpeningnorway]

A shibata kotetsu outperform thoose knives by a good bit 🙂

[@friedmule5403]

May I please ask you about diminishing return? You can get great-ish knifes for half the money and fantastic knifes for 2 x the price of the 6-inch Kramer. Is it a value for the money, or is it a more luxury item? Or would a bit more money give even better?

[@thorwaldjohanson2526]

If you want a great knife that gets the work done, get the victorinox. There are definitely diminishing returns in terms of performance, HOWEVER, how something feels and looks can have a big impact on your enjoyment when using it. So if you enjoy cooking and do it a lot, having nice blades, pots etc make it more enjoyable.

[@friedmule5403]

@@thorwaldjohanson2526 Thank you so much for your reply, I have bought 2 x Kramer, and they do in fact, as you say, add a lot of enjoyment to the cutting, but I will also get some of Victorinox knifes, because it's a genuine workhorse for the task that may be harder on the knifes. Do you have any suggestions for knifes for the harder tasks?

[@thorwaldjohanson2526]

@@friedmule5403 if you do lots of deboning, you might want to get the victorinox boning knife. If you want something that feels nicer for your workhorse knife, I'd go with a German knife like zwilling (the German, not the Japanese series) , wusthof or Messer Meister. I prefer a bolster and full tang. It gives more heft and a more solid grip for those rougher tasks.

[@friedmule5403]

@@thorwaldjohanson2526 Thank you so much!! I am thinking of getting some workhorses, and a deboning knife is definitely on my list. The Kramer is very nice, but I do not dare to use them on hard tasks, as going through bones, splitting and chopping hard items. The prices are not that important, but the ability to be sharpened easily and be a lightsaber for hard tasks is my main goal for these extra knifes.

[@kiltedcripple]

If I were in he economic bracket to afford a Kramer, I'd want a real Kramer, not the Henckles licensed Kramers. That said, I'm not, but I am a huge knife nerd. From my modest experience, I wouldn't pay less than 30 for a knife, or more a than 100. There's too much good steel in that range to worry about the "better than good" stuff over 100... but I have paid less than 30 looking for a diamond in the rough, and been rewarded and burned in equal measure. My first real knife was a CCK cai dao I got left by a family member. It took me years to really appreciate what I had, to learn how to use that knife correctly, but since then, I've bought two other Chinese slicing cleavers, one at 15 bucks, one at 30, and they punch WAY over their weight class. My 30 dollar Mercer is my preferred go to, but I recently tried a 15 dollar Bladesmith cai dao, and it's very good for a cheap knife. And it's huge, bought for when I'm dispatching large produce. The knife in my home growing up, that I learned to cook with, was a 12 dollar Old Hickory butcher knife, and several years ago I bought one of my own as a tribute to my dad. It's not a bad knife, even at 20, but it's not an amazing knife. We got two knife blocks at our wedding, one Kuhn Ricon, one Henckles, and of those, the Henckles are differently better knives. They edge they take simply requires less maintenance, but as in diligent with my honing, that's not why I prefer the Henckles. The grips of the Kuhn Ricon are cheap plastic, and too small for my hands as well. My wife likes them, supposedly, but I catch her using the Henckles knives, and a KitchenAid santuko she bought years ago on sale, more often than the KRs she refuses to let me sell. I've bought a couple Dexter Russell knives, from their Duo Glide line, just because I like the look of them, and they're great knives, again, punch way over their weight class. These have Santoprene grips and are by far my favorite knives to hold. The grip is perfect in size and texture, even rhythm in chopping fat to render lard, your won't get slippy on Santoprene. And I bought a hype cheep Chinese 1095 knives. You know thec ones, the kind sold by 15 different companies which all look exactly alike on Amazon because one dirty makes them and just stamps gem with different brand logos. These hold a great edge, better than the Old Hickory that also uses 1095 carbon, but carbon steel is prone to rust, unless you know how to force a patina. I wrap the knife blade in paper towel and soak those in vinegar, leave the knife for about 20 to 30 minutes (not longer or you'll get rust) then remove the paper towel, wash thoroughly, and voila, no more rust. Well, not entirely true, it can still rust, but you have to intentionally screw it up, if you hand wash the knife and put it up, you don't even have to hand dry, the patina protects, without oiling. Make sure once the paper towels are soaked, press them against the blade flats to get full contact. This kind of knife isn't amazingly durable, so don't abuse them and believe the hype that you should/could double them as bushcraft knives, or cook outdoors in Albania with green in ASMR videos, but for normal kitchen use, they're absolutely worth the money. But to the knife uninitiated, just hone your knives. After you wash, as you're putting them away, hone the knife. And then I stone sharpen twice a year, at July 4th, and the week before Christmas, but I give every time I put one away. And those knives are laser accurate all the time, ready to go, able to slice to the best of their ability. Even cheapish steel can take and hold an edge if you regularly hone your knives.

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

Great post! Lots of great info. Those "real" Kramers can be close to $10,000 sometimes, so I'm not in that bracket, but I can swing a couple hundred from time to time for a piece of kitchen gear I really like. I think some sort of Japanese knife will be next. I will try your trick on the patina and see what happens.

[@garbledstoic]

Thanks for that history. My best knives are also Henckels, and I can attest to their long-term durability and stress-free maintenance. I also am on the twice yearly sharpening schedule and always hone the blade on a metal rod before use. Great advice. All of my serrated blades are Victorinox. I replace them when dull. It doesn't make sense to me to buy fancier serrated steel, as they are a pain in the arse to sharpen and really don't cut any better than beater blades. Like a Teflon coated Demeyere fry pan, they won't last as long as your regret when you need to buy another.

[@kevincris2589]

Hey uncle scott. Any chance you can do an honest review of the smithey carbon steel wolk? There are literally no actual videos of this wok being used by regular peeps.

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

I'll check on it and see. If it's nine zillion dollars, maybe not!

[@GamerNxUSN]

@@UncleScottsKitchen well it's smithy, so......yes lol.

[@kevincris2589]

@@UncleScottsKitchen its about the same cost of a large all clad copper core skillet.

[@donmcvey4879]

Hard pass on Kramer knives. IMO, overpriced. Even Zwilling has figured this out since they are discounting them significantly on their web site. Take a look at multi-layer Japanese knives, either machine or hand forged. Better steel, thinner, sharper.

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

I think a Japanese knife will be my next one. Not sure on santoku vs. nakiri styles yet.

[@somechessguy]

@@UncleScottsKitchen Nakiri is a little more niche due to how flat the blade is, very good knife for veggies though. Japanese knives are typically thinner than most western style knives, and with a nakiri that thinness will let you really fly through most veggies very fast due to the flat profile. May not be ideal for tougher squash or larger produce, but for general work they are killer. Santokus are also fine, much closer to the western style. I guess it comes down to whether you want to try shapes that are different, or whether you want to stay closer to the western style you are familiar with. If you want something like a nakiri, but a bit more robust, you can also try Chinese slicers or cleavers (both similar shape to each other, with cleavers much thicker and able to handle bones). If you want any brand or steel recommendations, I'd be more than happy to pass on what I know.

[@jefflawson7468]

My knife is are wusthof

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

I have the Classic Ikon 8" chef's knife... great knife!

[@MarkusSugarhill]

I love your video, but I cannot watch you cutting onions :D thats an accident prone to happen!

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

I still have most of my fingers!

[@MarkusSugarhill]

@@UncleScottsKitchen never change a running system!

[@louizivkovic1752]

Seres ga bas

[@superseries7007]

Rivets. I'm out.

[@morganmg]

You overpaid for these.

[@waktosha7378]

What did you pay for that 6 inch knife?

[@UncleScottsKitchen]

$120... good catch! I should have had that in the video!